#tl meta

[kateeorg]

"Your son misses you"

You know what, it's annoying me that some people are reading Dottie's line as a toxic guilt trip for Ted. That they think it's coming from this shortsighted, passive-aggressive place, because they want Ted to stay in Richmond so badly. It's a valid reading, I'll grant you. There's evidence for it.

But I have another reading I'd like to offer that I haven't seen yet. See, when I hear those words, I can't help but think:

How often did Dottie think these same words about her late husband?

How many times did she want to scream at him: Your son misses you! I miss you! How could you leave him?! And me?!

She sees her son, who has always put others before himself (not unlike herself, not unlike her husband), go through this divorce, hears about his panic attacks from the news, sees her son pulling away, sees her grandson traveling back and forth between continents just to see his father -- what picture does that paint for her? She probably doesn't even know the full story of the divorce the way we, the audience, do.

So, what is she left with?

A son who may or may not be going down the same route as his dad. Or at the very least, who is distancing himself in ways perhaps similar to what Papa Lasso did before his death.

So, after traveling across the ocean, staying with Austrailians, getting to know Ted's Richmond friends, ages of beating around the bush (because that is the way they've always done thing and she doesn't know another way), and getting cursed at by her son for her failure to be direct with her feelings, she tells Ted the thing she came to say, the thing wishes she could tell his dad:

Your son misses you.

Because maybe, she thinks, if she'd been able to tell her husband that, if he had truly understood how much he was valued and needed, he wouldn't have done what he did. He wouldn't have kept them at a distance and struggled and bottled everything up until it exploded. And her son wouldn't have come home to find him dead.

#ted lasso #tl meta #tl spoilers #dottie lasso #papa lasso #henry lasso #tw suicide

[rockinhamburger]

What exactly is empathy?

Back with more Nate meta - shocker! At a basic level, empathy is about widening our perspective to understand where someone is coming from. It doesn’t mean actions taken are acceptable or justified, but it’s an exercise in looking for insight and extending compassion. One thing I’ve noticed can go missing in analysis of Nate’s choices is the limited POV he has throughout the show. People are quick to judge him for his reasoning in the latter half of S2 without recognizing that he’s missing crucial insights, often because he is not in the scene which would provide it. I want to highlight a few examples that I think show this limited POV and, hopefully, indicate where he deserves some grace.

Of course, a straightforward example of this is the picture Nate gave to Ted for Christmas. Nate couldn’t help but notice it’s not hanging in Ted’s office, and that became emblematic to Nate of the abandonment he was feeling. We the viewers know that Ted has the picture on his bedroom dresser next to his picture of Henry. Nate doesn’t know this; he has a limited POV, so in my view it’s a lot kinder and more empathetic to give him grace on that one. But what tends to happen is that a detail like that gets sublimated into justification to continue criticizing Nate. For instance, instead of feeling sorry for Nate, feeling compassion for his limited perspective in that moment, the thinking becomes judgemental and defensive: Why should Ted display it in his office? Ted doesn’t owe Nate that. Nate needs to get over himself.

People tend to be similarly hard on Nate for the moment in 2x11 when he says, “There we go. Give Ted another idea he’ll take all the credit for.” We have a wider perspective than Nate does. We know that Ted doesn’t take the credit; in fact, Ted credited Nate for his decoy play back in 1x03. It’s a great moment that shows us Ted’s integrity - he doesn’t take the credit for that, even when Trent Crimm is audibly horrified that Ted would entrust such a thing to the kit man. It adds to our growing love for Ted as a character.

But crucially, Nate doesn’t hear a lick of it. Nate is yards away kicking dog shit off the field. His POV is limited in the scene, so he entirely misses that lovely moment of Ted giving him the credit. We’re also privy to the article Trent writes at the end of the episode, and he doesn’t mention in there that Nate came up with the play. Why would Nate have any idea that Ted gives him the credit?

“That’s the job, son,” Roy says to Nate. Putting aside that they’re roughly the same age, so it’s more than a little condescending, this comment from Roy doesn’t address the void Nate’s feeling of validation and approval from Ted. In 2x12, Nate says, “And I... I worked my ass off, trying to get your attention back. To prove myself to you. To make you like me again.” I wish people would take these words at face value instead of using them to continue justifying uncharitable readings of Nate’s behaviour. I wish more people would put themselves in Nate’s shoes and imagine for a moment what it felt like to be in the sunlight of Ted’s kind, supportive attention in S1 only to feel like he’d done something to lose it. Imagine wondering what you did wrong to lose the attention and care of the kindest, sweetest man you’ve had the fortune of meeting. Nate is feeling Ted’s absence so keenly by the time he lets it all out in 2x12. He feels invisible and occasionally even outright replaced. Ted laughs at the idea of him being a big dog, and god, that has to sting so much, and then he brings Roy in as coach. People are quick to gloss over this moment, but it’s a crucial one for understanding how twisted up Nate is starting to feel. If he truly thinks Ted doesn’t like him anymore, then imagine what it felt like for him to be the subject of Ted’s laughter and for Ted to subsequently bring in someone he wouldn’t laugh at? And in the episodes following, Ted’s giving Roy the attention Nate craves as the wins pile up, and to top it off, those wins are largely attributed to the Roy Kent Effect.

Ted isn’t there for Nate’s big moment of glory in 2x06. We know why he wasn’t because we got a lot of Ted’s backstory. Nate didn’t. He has no idea what Ted’s going through. One big takeaway from the show is that we don’t know what the people in our lives are going through, and that’s another reason to be kind and empathetic to each other. So yes maybe Nate should have been able to connect some of the dots, particularly once Ted confessed he’d had a panic attack. Maybe he could have given Ted some grace, but clearly Nate was going through some of his own toxic stuff that made him miss a few things, just like Ted. And really, it’s not like people are giving Nate grace given what we know of his struggles. Nate doesn’t realize the extent of Ted’s mental health struggles because Ted doesn’t let him in on it, just like Ted doesn’t realized the extent of Nate’s feelings of abandonment.

One moment I find so brilliant for highlighting just how much Nate wanted specifically Ted’s validation and approval (to make you like me again) is the fact that Roy gives Nate credit and validation for his big win. He tells Rebecca the win was all Nate (but, crucially, Nate isn’t in the room for that) and then afterward he says, “Oy, Nate, great fucking work today.” I think to Nate it feels more like getting validation from a friend or brother. It’s the kind of thing we like to imagine will make a difference and build us up, but usually it doesn’t quite do the trick, not when it isn’t coming from the person we most want it from - in Nate’s case, Ted, and on a deeper level, his father.

In 1x07, when Ted is at one of his lowest points in the series, he lashes out at Nate. We know why he did. We understand that he has to sign his divorce papers, to essentially quit his marriage, which kicks up a bunch of his emotional triggers around quitting due to feeling like his father abandoned him. We also know he’d been drinking. So, we give Ted plenty of grace in that moment because we have the full picture. Nate doesn’t. Of course, Ted apologizes for treating Nate like that the next time he sees him and Nate forgives him instantly. It’s a lovely moment that again showcases what a thoughtful character Ted is, that he can earnestly apologize. But it’s also a lovely moment that shows Nate’s capacity for understanding and forgiveness when he’s been wronged.

As has been discussed a lot since the end of S2 aired, this conversation outside the locker room in 1x07 is the last time Ted and Nate have a one-on-one conversation before the scene in 2x12. I think it’s easy to overlook this turning point in their relationship and to think that everything’s been patched up in the apology, but the damage from that moment in front of Ted’s hotel room is substantial. I did everything I could to make you like me again. I can’t help feeling like Nate looks back on that night in Liverpool and feels that was the moment everything changed, the moment the attention started to shift, when Ted stopped liking him.

I wish more people would extend to Nate the same compassion we gave Ted following his angry outburst at Nate in 1x07. We all make meaning from the limited perspective we have. Nate was lacking important insight throughout much of S1 and S2, and that was compounded by feelings of inadequacy and abandonment. And I think when it comes down to it, Ted knows exactly how that feels. Empathy widens perspective. Ted’s not going to bask in schadenfreude; he’s going to extend empathy and compassion because he gets where Nate is coming from. He won’t take his pain out on Nate, even though Nate did that to him, and if we admire Ted’s capacity for forgiveness and understanding, this is the test of our own.

I hope fandom can rise to the occasion in S3.

#nathan shelley #ted lasso #tl meta #fandom double standards for nate as a poc plays a significant role here #it's not the purview of this meta but i should make that clear

[terresdebrume]

Possible unpopular opinion but as much as I wouldn't have minded the toerag being in prison, rehab fits the themes of the show much better and picking something else (such as death) would have undermined the point

ETA: To clarify, I am not saying that Tartt Sr needs to be allowed back in Jamie's life because fuck that thought in the nostril. I personally hate the word 'forgive' because my experience is that it's often used in what I perceive to be the Christian/Catholic version of the word, in which you're meant to then love and welcome the person you've forgiven, which fuck that

But, Ted Lasso's core thesis from the get go is that everyone can decide to do better, and I think it's important to have a moment that says "Yes, even the most horrible person you can think of can make better choices" because the alternative is to accept Georgie's statement that people like James never change, in which case what's the point of having rehabs and programs meant to get abusers to stop abusing?

My main regret with this point is not that is exists at all OR that it takes a restorative rather than punitive approach to Tartt Sr, but that it isn't given enough time to make it properly clear that just because James decides to do better doesn't mean he's ever entitled to doing better where his son can see

(okay and also i would want more time to look into what it means for Jamie to reach out to someone who did that to him, and how he deals with that in away that keeps him safe)

ETA 2: the TL DR is I have more problems with Jamie's side of this storyline which imo has fairly icky implications, but I'm not bothered by James'side

#Jamie Tartt #Ted Lasso #Spoiler #James Tartt #10n #30n #50n #meta #tl meta #my meta

[batnsons]

okay, catching up on Ted Lasso season 3, I’m midway through 3x5 rn. Thoughts on the season so far (spoilers and LOTS of thoughts under the cut!

Sassy's right, Ted is indeed a mess and I love him so so much and I want to give him all the hugs. (I'm also mad at her for the way she handled that but I'm not surprised, we've known she's like that from day one.) I wish this man would realize that it’s okay to be hurt by things, that he’s allowed to be upset when people hurt him, and he’s allowed to defend himself. But I also greatly appreciate that he’s always trying to take the high road. Him telling Michelle he was upset with her was soooo important and I’m so so proud. We had the beginnings of another panic attack, early on, after he found out and then it was cut off by Zava, but I wish we'd gotten more of a follow up on that. Cause there had to have been some aftermath to that. Also, I've been on the Ted is Jamie's Dad wagon since almost day one and this season is giving me SO MUCH. I hope we get to see so much more of them.

JAMIE!! My sweet Angel Boy. He’s emulating Ted so much this season and it kills me. It’s so so precious. He’s growing so much, and he’s trying so hard, and he’s just!! He’s doing so good! I do wish they would address his trauma responses, though. He’s clearly still having them and I wish they would talk about it. I’m not a fan of the way they’ve had Roy be so aggressive to him without any repercussions, when Jamie is clearly reacting with trauma responses. I’m not sure if that’s a writing point or if Phil is just doing that himself but I would really like to see it addressed. (@altschmerzes and I have talked about this a lot, they’ve got their own posts on the subject too that I really enjoy.) I am, however, delighted at the way Roy has taken Jamie under his wing. He’s been the only one to notice so far that Jamie is upset about Zava (and for good reason!) And I love that.

SPEAKING OF ZAVA. I DESPISE THIS MAN. First off, he’s just WEIRD. But second, he’s a nightmare!! And Jamie’s the only one who sees it! His speech about Zava being a diva and unpleasant was really delightful. (“And I weren’t being’ Ironic, I were neon’ hypocritical”. Have I mentioned I adore Jamie?? HES BECOME SELF AWARE!) Anyway. He’s got manipulative abilities not quite up to Rupert’s standards but, they’re still pretty bad.

And now on the topic of Rupert: this fucking PRICK. He’s manipulating the hell outta Nate and it’s making me mad. He’s gaslighting him, and essentially “love bombing” him every time Nate seems to be showing remorse or regret. And it’s so interesting because you know this is exactly what he must have done to Rebecca, and is probably now doing to Bex (although she seems like she’s well aware of his tendencies and is hitting back in her own way. Those digs about him being old?? Yeah. I hope we get to see Bex and Rebecca bonding later, I want to see Rebecca helping Bex out.) He’s an absolutely brilliant manipulator and I realllly hope we see him get what’s coming to him. And I love that Nate is showing distaste for his “activities” with the assistant.

And now for Nate. I went into this season absolutely hating him (not as much as much as Rupert, but close), and now? Now I just feel bad for him. And I love that we still see bits of the old Nate coming through. He really is just being absolutely played and manipulated and his ego and pride are the only things in his way now. He’s too proud to let himself admit that he’s been wrong, especially in front of Rupert. He’s in too deep and he’s floundering and he’s only got Ted as a lifeline but he’s very nearly burned that in his lust for power and prestige. But he so desperately wants it, you can see it. I really do hope we get a redemption arc, honestly. Never thought I’d say that. But we are now seeing the crest of that wave, so to speak, where we saw Jamie at the beginning of the series. And Jamie was able to claw his way out, so shouldn’t Nate now be able to as well?? It’s really really interesting, the way we’ve seen their stories parallel each other. What we’ve seen from Nate here is what we didn’t see with Jamie: the rise of the ego and pride as a survival mechanism. So here’s hoping we get to see Nate being pulled from that riptide just like Jamie is. But he’s gotta make the decision to reach for that lifeline himself. I really hope he does.

As for everything else: I feel like Rebecca is floundering, trying to cling desperately to this idea that she has to be more successful than Rupert in order to prove to him she doesn’t need him. But she’s missing the reality that the only person she needs to prove anything to is herself. I’m so interested to see where the rest of her growth takes her. Trent I’m delighted to see more of, I love that he’s hanging around the club now. He’s so fun and a lovely outside perspective for them all. Colin has got one hell of an interesting storyline happening on the sidelines, and I’m so so curious to see where this goes. I love that Trent was given the same missing piece of information that we were given as an audience, it makes for a really interesting audience stand-in, seeing him react to the things Colin says and does knowing what we all know now as well. Makes for some really interesting storytelling. I’m a little, not sad per se but… bummed? at how little Sam content we’ve gotten so far but I think that’s remedied later so I’m not too worried about it right now. Beard and Ted are delightful as always, I’m always so thrilled by their comfortable relationship, they’re like two sides of the same coin that function so so well together. Platonic soulmates, honestly. And then there’s Michelle. I’m so mad at her. But I’m even more mad at the therapist. I’m sorry, that man’s license should be taken away. And I’m glad they straight up had someone say it was unethical out loud but I really hope they bring it up more. Because it’s so so wrong and so unethical it’s unbelievable. Michelle is less at fault for this than the therapist, for sure, but I’m still mad at her for all of it. And I’m so glad Ted told her he was upset. Because regardless of who she’s dating, Ted absolutely should’ve been consulted before she introduced a new partner to their son. Like, that shit’s not okay. At all. Add in that he was their couple’s therapist?? (Which brings into question all sorts of other things, mind you.) Nah that’s messed up and I’m so angry about it.

Tldr: so far I’m ultimately very happy with this season, the character arcs are hurting me and also giving me so much joy. Rupert is a prick as always, and Ted and Jamie are my boys.

#rey rambles #ted lasso spoilers #tl meta #ted lasso meta #tls3 #ted lasso #jamie tartt #nathan shelley #colin hughes #rebecca welton #roy kent #rey's endless list of favorite characters

[joycrispy]

One thing I love about Crowley --never stated, but consistently shown-- is that he is, at heart, an engineer.

I have a few different things to say about that. Let's unpack them.

As the Unnamed Angel, we see his designs for the Pillars of Creation are millions of pages long, comprised of cramped text, footnotes, diagrams, schematics, etc. It's very...Renaissance polymath, in the way it implies a particular intersection of artist and inventor.

Also: in the naked romanticism with which he views his stars.

We already knew he made stars, but in s2 we learn that he did NOT sculpt each of them by hand. He designed a nebula ("a star factory," he says) that will form several thousand young stars and proto-planets, and all --aside from getting the 'factory' running-- without him lifting a finger. We also learn that these young stars and proto-planets stand in contrast to those made by other angels, which are going to come 'pre-aged.'

...I'm reminded of Hastur and Ligur's approach to temptations. Damning one human soul at a time, devoting singular attention to it over the course of years or decades, and how that stands in contrast to Crowley's reliance on, quote, 'knock-on effects.'

Ligur: It's not exactly...craftsmanship. Crowley: Head office don't seem to mind. They love me down there.

Hm.

I'm also reminded of the M25.

The M25 may not be as grand as a nebula (sentences you only say in GOmens fandom...), but LIKE his nebula it's an intricate, self-sustaining engine that does Crowley's work for him, many times over. Again.

That's some pretty neat characterization --and so is the indication towards Crowley's disinterest in victimizing anyone tempting individual people. It takes a considerable amount of planning and effort (and creeping about in wellies), but in accordance with his design the M25 generates a constant stream of low-grade evil on a gigantic scale.

Cumulatively gigantic, that is. Individually? Negligible.

But no other demon understands human nature well enough to parse that one million ticked-off motorists are not, in any meaningful way, actually equivalent to one dictator, or one mass-murderer, or even one little influential regressive. That's the trick of it. Crowley gets Hell's approval (which he NEEDS to survive, and to maintain the degree of freedom he's eked out for himself), and at the same time ensures that any actual ~Evil Influence~ is spread nice and thin.

It's some clever machinery. And he knows it, too:

The Unnamed Angel and Crowley are both proud of their ideas.

(musings on professional pride, Leonardo da Vinci, the crank handle, and 'the point to which Crowley loves Aziraphale' under the cut)

In the 1970's Crowley gives a presentation on the M25, projector and all, to a room full of increasingly impatient demons. Maybe the presentation was work-ordered; the 'can I hear a WAHOO?' definitely wasn't.

Before the Beginning, the Unnamed Angel can barely contain his excitement about his nebula. Aziraphale manages a baffled-but-polite, "....That's nice... :)"

11 years ago, Hastur and Ligur want to 'tell the deeds of the day,' and Crowley smiles to himself because (according to the script-book) he knows he has 'the best one.'

(Naturally, his 'deed' has nothing to do with tempting anybody, and everything to do with setting up a human-powered Rube-Goldberg machine of petty annoyance. Oodles of 'Evil' generated; very little harm done.)

Hastur and Ligur don't get it, of course. That's also consistent.

Nobody ever knows what the hell he's talking about.

It didn't make it on-screen, but, in both the novel AND the script-book, Crowley was friends with Leonardo da Vinci. The quintessential Renaissance polymath. That's where he got his drawing of the Mona Lisa --they're getting very drunk together, and Crowley picks up the 'most beautiful' of the preliminary sketches. He wants to buy it. Leonardo agrees almost off-the-cuff, very casual, because they're friends, and because he has bigger fish to fry than haggling over a doodle:

He goes, "Now, explain this helicopter thingie again, will you?" Because he's an engineer, too.

(It is 1519 at the latest, in this scene. Why the FUCK would Crowley know about helicopters, and be able to explain them, comprehensively, to Leonardo da Vinci?

...Well. I choose to believe he got bored one day and worked it out. Look, if you know how to build a nebula, you can probably handle aerodynamics. And anyway, I think it's telling that this is his idea of shooting the shit. 'A drunken mind speaks a sober heart,' and all. He probably babbled about Aziraphale long enough to make poor Leo sick)

Apart from Aziraphale, Leonardo da Vinci is the only person Crowley has any keepsakes or mementos of.

Think about that, though. Aziraphale's bookshop is bursting with letters, paintings, busts, and personalized signatures memorializing all the humans he's known and befriended over 6000 years (indeed: Aziraphale has living human friends up and down Whickber Street. He's part of a community).

Crowley doesn't have any of that. It's just the stone albatross from the Church (for pining), the infamous gay sex statue (for spicy pining), the houseplants (for roleplaying his deepest trauma over and over, as one does), and this one piece of artwork, inscribed, "To my friend Anthony from your friend Leo da V."

To me, at least, that suggests a level of attachment that seems to be rare for Crowley.

...Maybe he liked having someone to talk shop with? Someone who was interested? Someone engaged enough to ask questions when they didn't immediately understand?

...Anyway.

There's also the matter of the crank handle.

This thing:

This is one of the subtler changes from the book. In the book, Crowley knows Satan is coming and, desperate, arms himself with a tire iron. It's the best he can do. He's not Aziraphale; he wasn't made to wield a flaming sword.

The show, IMO, improves on this considerably. Now he, like Aziraphale, gets to face annihilation with what he was made for in his hand. And it's not a weapon, not even an improvised one like the tire iron.

He made stars with it.

[both gifs by @fuckyeahgoodomens]

If you Google 'crank handle,' you'll get variations on this:

Crank handles have been around for centuries. Consisting of a mechanical arm that's connected to a perpendicular rotating shaft, they are designed to convert circular motion into rotary or reciprocating motion.

Which is to say they're one of the 'simple machines,' like a lever or a pulley; the bread and butter of engineering. You'll also get a list of uses for a crank handle, archaic and modern. Among them: cranking up the engine of an old-fashioned car... say, a 1933 Bentley. That's what Crowley has been using his for, lately. But he's had it since he was an angel and he's still, it seems, very capable of it's angelic applications.

Stopping time. For instance.

(This is conjecture on my part, but, I like to imagine that Crowley has the ability to stop time for the same reason I can --and should-- unplug my computer before I perform maintenance on it. Time and Space are a matched set, after all, and in his designs in particular, one feeds into the other.)

I know everyone has already said this, but: I REALLY LIKE that when he needs to channel the heights of his power, he does so not with a weapon but with a tool. Practically with a little handheld metaphor for ingenuity. One from long-lost days when he made beautiful things.

(And he loved it. Still loves it --he incorporated that metaphor into the Bentley, didn't he?)

Let Aziraphale rock up to the apocalypse with a weapon: he has his own compelling thematic reasons to do exactly that. Crowley's story is different, and fighting isn't the only way to express defiance. And if you've been condemned as a demon and assumed to be destructive by your very nature, what better way than this?

He made stars. They didn't manage to take that from him.

Neither Crowley nor Aziraphale are fighters, really --they have no intention of fighting in any war. They'll annoy everyone until there's no war to fight in, for a start. But between the two, if one must be, then that one is Aziraphale. Principality of the Earth, Guardian of the Eastern Gate, Wielder of the Flaming Sword... all that stuff. Even if he'd prefer not to, it's very clear that Aziraphale can rise to the occasion, if he must.

Crowley was never that kind of angel. He wasn't a Principality. He doesn't have a sword.

...And yet.

It's Crowley who protects. He's the one who paces, who stands guard, who circles Aziraphale and glares out at the world, just daring anyone else to come near.

In light of everything else I've said here, I think that's interesting.

Obviously part of it is that Aziraphale enjoys it and, you know, good for him. He's living his best life, no doubt no doubt no doubt. But what about Crowley? What's driving that behavior, really?

Have you heard the phrase, 'loved to the point of invention'? Well, what if 'the point of invention' was where you started? What if where you end up involves glaring out at the world, just daring anyone else to come near? What is that, in relation to the bright-eyed thing you used to be?

What do we name the point to which Crowley loves Aziraphale?

...Thinking about how an excitable angel with three million pages of star design he wants to tell you all about...becomes a guard dog. Is all.

#good omens #ineffable husbands #aziracrow #Crowley #Aziraphale #good omens 2 #good omens meta #unfortunately I do not have trains of thought #only long meandering strolls of thought #sorry about it #anyway tl;dr Crowley is a nerd #also I have a strange emotional attachment to the idea of 1500's Crowley... #...facedown in a pile of Mona Lisa sketches; drunkenly info-dumping about Aziraphale #and Da Vinci is just like. 'Ahhhh mio amico Antonio. You fucking simp.'

[zungumi]

btw, i really hope people enjoyed my terrible め組 joke in HOT EYES, because that's absolutely the entire reason i subbed this show at all

#for a non zuka translation of this song god only knows what i'd go with #'one of those eye tribe girls' if i didn't have to make sense and 'one of those girls whose eyes really pop' if i did? #tl meta #yes i HAVE listened to the koda kumi version 1000 times this year

[egophiliac]

Hi it's just to let you know that the official romanization of Revaan's name is Raverne ! Also they have romanized Baul's name to Baur !

Twst coming back at us again with the least expected romanization! thank you everybody (oh god my inbox) (no it's great, I literally asked for this and the reactions have been INCREDIBLE, thank you all!)

I do like Raverne though, I think it's got a nice fancy sound to it! (I had kinda suspected it was going to be an R instead of an L, so the fact that it's SO close to Laverne except for that is hilarious to me personally.) and Dragoneye Duke is honestly probably the best translation for his title, I wasn't envying the localizers that one. :') Baur instead of Baul I was NOT expecting, but in retrospect I think his name's supposed to be a reference to the Bauru crocodile, so that actually makes way more sense!

someone else also said Meleanor has become Maleanor, which is the REALLY weird one to me, because I was so surprised it was written as Mel instead of Mal in the first place?! oh god no I can't decide which one I like better. 😭 (I wonder if they might change it to Mal...they have made romanization changes before) (like I remember House of Distraction being corrected to House of Destruction in Playful Land) (I did check and she's still Mel for now, but I dunno, they might Mal her up and some point and save me from having to make a decision about which one to use) (HECK I CAN'T DECIDE)

uhhhh thank you for letting me ramble about anime names, let's just say MONOGRAMMED SWEATERS FOR EVERYONE

#twisted wonderland #twisted wonderland spoilers #twisted wonderland episode 7 spoilers #twisted wonderland book 7 spoilers #twisted wonderland episode 7 part 4 spoilers #twisted wonderland book 7 part 4 spoilers #mel is so cute but mal fits with the rest of the draconias better #eng version no you were supposed to save me not make things MORE confusing #anyway raverne huh #that uh. that sure feels like it's supposed to evoke raven doesn't it. #what does it mean WHAT DOES IT MEAN #hold on i'm going to flail around embarrassingly about anime character theories now #(okay first a disclaimer: i do think we need to sit down as a fandom at some point) #(and have a discussion about exactly what is actual canon versus meta speculation versus jokes) #(because i think there has been. some confusion. over that re:crowley and raverne specifically) #(but i do feel justified in being like THEY ARE PROBABLY CONNECTED SOMEHOW RIGHT?! right now) #like i really don't think it's as simple as crowley being raverne but with memory loss or something #(and if they pull that on us i'm going to need an EXTREMELY good explanation to go with it to justify that) #they've gone out of their way several times now to make a point about them acting and sounding different and it feels very intentional to m #(and once again: i super 100% absolutely do not believe that lilia wouldn't recognize him with the top half of his face covered) #i just think the contradictions are a lot stronger than the connections right now but there ARE some connections and i'm 👀ing at them #to be fair the connections are mostly meta like crowley being diablo/raverne being evocative of raven #also the general 'raverne mysteriously disappeared and apparently had distinctive eyes' thing #versus 'crowley's past is unknown and he never shows his eyes' #(i will argue that crowley DOES seem to have some kind of canon connection to briar valley) #(since he is clearly some sort of fae and the masks are a briar valley thing) #and that is kinda it right now isn't it #okay hold on i had to delete some tags because i used too many (thanks tumblr for letting me know and not just vanishing them OH WAIT) #so tl;dr: i'm in the 'crowley is connected to raverne somehow but it's more complicated than just him being in disguise' camp personally #but that will probably change as we get more info and also don't take this as an anti-speculation thing because i love theories HOORAY

[theerurishipper]

I feel like people really underestimate the importance of Dick being the first Robin. Like, reverse Robin AUs are interesting and such, but I just hope people realize that in the context of canon, they would never work. The reason Batman and Robin ever works is because the first Robin was Dick Grayson specifically. Because Bruce would never have taken in any child if Dick's tragedy hadn't specifically happened to mirror his own experience. Dick Grayson was the only one Bruce truly saw himself in first, because the fundamental event that defines them is the same. And he sees the opportunity to help someone the way he was never helped, to make sure that Dick didn't go down the dark path he did. So, my point here is that the only one Bruce actually made the choice to take in, the only one who could kickstart it all, is Dick Grayson, because he is the only one with whom Bruce could immediately empathize and connect with.

This never happened with any other Robin. He took in Jason because he missed Dick, he took in Tim because Tim forced himself into the role, he took in Steph because he was trying to make Tim come back to being Robin, and Dick made Damian Robin. Of course, he loved all of them, and they all have their unique relationships with Bruce that are very important and inform their characters, and he does need them too. But he specifically formed this connection with Dick that made Dick the only person he ever considered taking in. It took a very specific set of circumstances in Dick's backstory that made Bruce commit an impulse adoption that just isn't really present in any other Robin's story. And the reason Jason or Tim or Steph or Damian or anyone else whom Bruce has taken under his wing even got that chance is because of the work Dick Grayson put into Bruce Wayne.

Before Dick, Bruce was reckless and didn't care at all about himself, to the point of almost being borderline suicidal. He was more brutal, more violent, etc. The reason all this changed, is because of Dick Grayson specifically. He was the one with whom Bruce opened up, with whom Bruce was forced to grow up, to take responsibility and learn to take care of both Dick and himself. Dick, to Bruce was the one who brought "color to their [his and Alfred's] monochrome lives." Dick Grayson's specific brand of happiness and joy changed Bruce for the better. Dick gave Bruce hope. This is true for other Robins too, but only because they followed the precedent that Dick Grayson set, only because they slid into his role (they have their own interesting relationships with Bruce, but this specifically is from Dick that other Robins carried on. A legacy, if you will). Dick Grayson turned Bruce into the kind of man who would become a serial adopter.

Without his influence, without his precedent, there would be no Batfamily, because Bruce would never have gotten to the point where he would be able or willing to take in someone else and care for them properly (It took living through his trauma again to get him to take Dick in lmao). Hell, there would be no Batman because Bruce would have gotten himself killed a long time ago if Dick hadn't helped him learn self-care. Dick knows Bruce best, because he understands him on a fundamentally deeper level than anyone else in the world. And he's the only one who can make Bruce open up at his rawest, most downtrodden state. He is the only one who can give Bruce at his lowest that kind of hope. There is no Robin without Dick Grayson. It's literally a tribute to his parents, using their colors and the name his mother called him. He created that identity as a symbol of hope. He helped Bruce become the kind of man who could and would let other people that he had to care for into his life. Without Dick Grayson, you can simply forget about any other Robin or the Batfamily as a concept even existing.

#DC #DCU #DC Comics #Bruce Wayne #Batman #Dick Grayson #Jason Todd #Tim Drake #Stephanie Brown #Damian Wayne #Nightwing #Red Hood #Red Robin #Spoiler #Robin #The Batman 2022 #Robin I #My meta #Meta #TL;DR Dick Grayson is the only one who is emotionally intelligent enough to be an emotional crutch to pull Bruce Wayne out of the darkness #And without him Bruce never would have taken in anyone else #This post is mainly about The Batman 2022 btw #I see a lot of people asking for Robin but they want Jason to be the first Robin for some reason #And that's interesting but Bruce doesn't need just a Robin. He needs Dick specifically #That's what's best for his character progression and it makes the most sense from a thematic perspective too #But that's for another post

[ineffably-human]

We're going to scream about Nandermo all week, but right now I need to talk about Baron Afanas. Because the Baron's arc, so to speak, always felt like a big part of the series DNA for me - and oh fuck did this episode deliver on why.

I think we can agree: in the show, vampire society is fucked up, right?

Vampires on their own have plenty to deal with that can make them crazy. They have to live by killing. They lose everyone from their old lives. They have to find new reasons to keep going on, forever, so shit can get decadent really fast.

But holy shit, what that's turned into in vampire society? Where you actively put cruelty over mercy, and violence over solving your problems? Death cults and scam artists roam free, but if someone has depression the best thing to do is ignore them. Someone can get their mind wiped or be locked up for centuries, and that's just what you do to your species.

--

So: the Baron's arrival is the first conflict of the whole show. The joke is about an ancient powerful creature of pants-shitting terror, vs three lesser vampires who just want to live their lives and not get murdered for being too lazy to conquer humanity. There's a lot of talk about how to please him: do you keep to the old ways, or pick up some new traditions? Decorate with flayed skin, or with glitter? And the Baron says: who cares, you're all soft and useless. All that matters is getting more control over this world, until people are cattle and we have no reason to hide anymore.

But later he confesses: that shit stopped mattering ages ago. He's not even real nobility, he's literally impotent, and he talks about doing horrible things because he doesn't know what else to say. He's angry and half-crazy from boredom. And admitting that, owning those feelings, means suddenly he has three new friends and a whole new world of things to enjoy.

There's the Baron the rest of the vampire world knows, but for one night we see the ancient, unknowable terror was just a guy. Maybe he's always been just some guy.

That fun puts him in a vulnerable position, and he's killed by the most unwitting vampire slayer in fiction. But Baron Afanas is changed. He sucks dirt for a year and still comes out of it with a new lightness and joy to him. He saves the Sire, another ancient terrifying monster everyone was eager to kill or send away. They adopt the hellhound. They get cozy and give advice. They make popsicle stick houses and go on walks. They live.

And that seemed like the end of the story until last night - when the Baron suddenly felt like the butt of a joke everyone knew but him. Spurred on by someone else who feels lonely and ignored, the Baron felt vulnerable. And he snapped back to how he lived for centuries.

'What the hell are you all doing, enjoying yourselves? We're supposed to be unhappy. We're supposed to live centuries of unhappiness, bringing pain to everyone in our path, and we're definitely not supposed to cheer up our friend who's sad.'

--

Nobody liked the Baron before Guillermo killed him, not even other powerful vampires we meet; they saw the Baron as a crazy far beyond their own crazy. But this is also how vampire society values you. It's how they measure Nandor's worth when they think he's dead, too: how old and powerful you are, how much you've been able to conquer and kill.

Vampire pods are both cliquish and aren't expected to last in the first place. If someone dies, you literally paint them out of your lives and forget. Everything we see discourages feelings, sincerity, or even basic companionship. The only way to earn respect is to be cruel. The more cruel you are, the more powerful you are. The more powerful you are, the more feared you are - the lonelier you are, the crazier you are. It's practically designed to create the Baron, or worse.

But new vampires don't behave that way. And the vampires we follow in the show don't behave that way - because they have each other, because they've been encouraged to have each other, often by Guillermo. (Holy shit, Nadja saying maybe she'd be fine dying, and Nandor immediately asking if she's okay? Nothing changes in this house, except everything does. They're not going to almost lose one of their own ever again.)

The vampires in the heart of vampire culture never seem happy to be like this. It doesn't have to be like this.

--

The Baron doesn't become a tyrannical monster for long. Because he never actually was one - and because he spends two evenings and a fireball to the face, watching Nandor and Nadja fight for Guillermo. Watching them plead and cling and defy, seeing Guillermo's earnest feelings in spite of his bloodline and the mistakes he's made. Seeing Nandor's perfect trust, and then his grief, the way he insists that Guillermo was never 'just' anything. The Baron can't find real fulfillment in hurting someone (because that ship sailed ages ago). He can't deride them for caring, because he's cared for a long time now.

And when the Baron admits that's who he is, when he says it out loud, he only gains more in his life. He finds new depth in the happiness he'd felt for a while now, because he's admitted and allowed himself to be happy. And now he has the children he's always wanted. Living together, the Baron and the Sire are still ancient and powerful - and they're also family, finding real joy together in a world that was ready to dispose of them.

"I suppose with the right company, it can be beautiful, this eternal existence."

--

There's an inherent selfishness to being a vampire, taking from someone else in order to live. But there doesn't have to be inherent cruelty, or lack of love.

They're all ready to admit they care. The Staten vampires have all cared for Guillermo or each other in their own ways this season. And Guillermo doesn't lack for flaws, but loving his monster family has never been one of them. (When he and Nandor work their shit out, they're gonna be insufferable.)

Now they just have to let the Guide in. Because she's absolutely starved for love, and vampires get pretty fucked up when they're on their own.

#fandom: wwdits #what we do in the shadows #wwdits #i am a meta gremlin #baron afanas #tl;dr i am a sucker for choosing love #especially when the world around you says it's stupid or you're not allowed #but love was always in you so it happens anyway

[whinlatter]

What’s something about Ron Weasley as a character that you think is underrated?

That Ron is really, really funny, and that his sense of humour isn't a sign of immaturity or gratuitous comic relief for the reader's sake, but an absolutely essential part of what both Harry and Hermione value in Ron as a character as an antidote to their own tendencies (moodiness and seriousness/anxiousness, respectively). Ron makes bad days bearable to get through for the people around him. I think people mistake Ron making jokes for a lack of emotional awareness, but I actually think it’s the opposite. By the series end Ron is literally the most emotionally well-adjusted of the central canon characters. That line about Peeves’ poem right at the end of DH when the war is won (“Really gives a feeling for the scope and tragedy of the thing, doesn't it?”) is a) brilliant and b) such a great manifesto for how Ron’s outlook on the world — not humour as emotional avoidance, but humour that sits within all the grief and pain and suffering, and makes it that bit more bearable. So yeah Ron Weasley’s love for chuckles is Important and Overlooked and I will keep saying it til I am blue in the face

#TL;DR yes movie!ron is dumb flippant comic relief but book!ron uses humour to meet people’s emotional needs #including hermione’s but especially harry’s #ron weasley #loml #meta #romione

[krakensdottir]

Also something really important I want to point out about Aziraphale's religious trauma.

It's often framed as him being directly abused by Heaven, generally emotionally. And while I don't doubt he's been belittled at points - probably not by Gabriel, the iconic exemplar of the Toxic Positivity boss, but we know how Michael and Uriel etc. can be - it also seems like he's received quite a lot of praise and has generally managed to pull off the appearance of being A Good Angel, or at least a satisfactory one. I don't think, and this is controversial, but I don't think Heaven was usually overtly hard on him.

Because that's not how this kind of cult mentality usually operates. Instead, it teaches you to abuse yourself. Your overseers don't have to directly hurt or insult you if you're so ingrained with fear of failure by the culture you were brought up in that you constantly question yourself as not good enough.

It's not as... satisfying, I guess? As an external abuser being the main issue. But it's a lot more real. At least to me, because I suffered so much anxiety over being 'good' when I was a kid, and it wasn't from direct abuse. It was absorbed from the culture I was surrounded by. I picked it up by osmosis from society at large, and it tormented me. I worried, I doubted, there was a time I literally feared going to Hell. And I wasn't raised strongly religious. My mother certainly treated me as a Good Kid, and never gave even the suggestion that I wasn't. But I felt that way anyway. And it tore me apart. Because internalizing that shit makes it so much harder to fight.

And to be clear at this point, I am not saying Heaven isn't abusive. I just think the nature of its abuse is more subtle and insidious than it's often given credit for. And - this is even harder to accept, but it's true, and it's important - it's not just abusive to Az. All the angels are victims of it. Yes, even Gabriel. The moment he, one of the most powerful forces in Heaven, steps out of line, we see that no one is exempt. Never even mind Muriel, who is literally on the lowest rung of the Heavenly ladder and has probably never been told they're worth anything beyond being, you know, an angel, so at least you're better than humans and demons.

It's a contrast with Crowley, who has long since accepted most (not all, there are definitely some deep issues remaining, but they're nothing like Aziraphale's) of his internal doubts and struggles. His fears are almost entirely external. He doesn't beat himself up if he fucks up. He doesn't have to. There are people happy to beat him up for him. So when things go really bad for him, his instinct is to run. To get out of the way of harm as much as possible.

The fact that Aziraphale is harder on himself than anyone else could be is a vital part of his character. He self-punishes. He self-criticizes. He feels awful every time he breaks the rules in the slightest, even though he isn't usually caught at it. Crowley can find some safety in solitude if he keeps his wits sharp and his head down. Aziraphale can't, because he carries Heaven's conditioning with him at all times. He doesn't need oversight, it doesn't take external threats to keep him in line. You don't need direct threats when literally everyone in your celestial workplace has seen firsthand the consequences of rebellion.

I don't know if I'm making sense here. Again, this is informed by personal experience and I can't claim to be unbiased. But I see so much internalization with Aziraphale. He literally can't even accept praise without being nervous as hell, and I don't think it's fear of punishment or ridicule that's his primary motivation. He simply cannot ever be good enough for himself.

That's how they get you.

Anyway, I think it's why his reaction to disaster is the opposite to Crowley's, why he feels he has to turn and face it and somehow avert the horror (or, alternatively, find some way to reconcile it in his head and accept it - because let's be real, that's often what happens) rather than get himself away. He's less afraid of failing his superiors than he is of failing himself. And God, who is, objectively, the biggest abuser in the entire story.

#go s2 spoilers #good omens meta #aziraphale #this internalized stuff hurts so much #and it's SO much harder to shake than other forms of trauma #breaking free from heaven isn't just not easy - it's impossible until he finally accepts that HE isn't a failure for not fixing everything #and that's the part of him that crowley can't wrap his head around #tl;dr heaven's culture is abusive to all its angels and they manifest it in different ways #and aziraphale takes it harder than any other we've seen

[mikaikaika]

Dude at this point it really feels like qTubbo is doomed by the narrative Greek mythology Cassandra style. qTubbo goes into anything and everything he does with an idea in his head and full faith in himself in wanting to execute it and even though he makes mistakes, he learns from them and always ends up producing the result way better than he imagined in his head.

However, much like how the populace did not believe in Cassandra and her words - I feel like no one at this point even wants to give qTubbo a benefit of the doubt. The moment they see him working on something (be it his hole or now the newly found parenting), people immediately go off their first perceptions and just accept it as fact that qTubbo is doing a bad job and is set to fail and then through these conceived notions they themselves begin being a catalyst to the doom they pictured .

Everyone on the server says to Tubbo's face how Sunny is spoiled and how she's got Tubbo wrapped around her finger to the extent she wouldn't listen to him ever but we also have to understand this is a person who's barely stepped into adulthood himself and thrusting him a child is obviously a big responsibility. As someone who is still navigating and figuring out the world around him, it is obvious it'd take Tubbo a little time to figure out being a parent as well. It will take time and he will make mistakes but he will figure it out along the way. It's really disheartening to see the islanders just straight up diminish Tubbo when it hasn't even been a proper week to all of this.

All in all, qTubbo is already undermined a lot on the server cause he is viewed as reckless and impulsive because he's the youngest and his inputs are often ignored without even an addressal of their relevance or importance. He is never given that benefit of doubt or margin of the error and instead everyone just directly assumes the worst of him. So picturing him going down a slippery slope of self-esteem issues and as a result overcompensate as a method of gaining respect and even love would not be a far reaching conclusion. But it just seems oh so disheartening especially knowing how much potential he holds and the output he delivers when he actually does have unbridled faith in himself.

#AHHHHHHHH #He has half the world on his shoulders and the rest infront of him standing with pitchforks #Tl;DR LETHIMCOOK #I CAN WRITE ESSAYS #That's my boy #qsmp #Tubbo #Meta #Analysis #Sunny #Mika mumbles #qTubbo

[rockinhamburger]

You know, I'm starting to think fandom way overblows the extent to which some of Nate's early actions are "red flags". Like, yeah, calling a woman a shrew is rude and a bit questionable, but if I thought my boss were about to fire me when I'm doing a good job and am not even close to being a financial problem, leaving me no choice but to consider it personal, you bet I'd not be sweet and forgiving about it!

Anon, I think you're dead on about Nate's understandable reaction to the reasonable conclusion he drew that he'd been unceremoniously fired. Ted was in on the prank they were pulling on Nate, pretending he had no idea what was happening, so from Nate's POV they're on the same side of confusion. But Nate did come in hot immediately even with him: "Ted, what the fuck's going on?"

Obviously calling Rebecca a shrew isn't nice, but I think this is one of those instances where Nate is being held to a standard other characters wouldn't be if they were in his shoes. I feel like we can cut him some slack when he thought he was being fired. (Also, let's be honest here, people will identify calling a woman a shrew as a red flag, but not even consider the red flag that is publicly pranking a person of colour by making him think he's been fired before revealing it's actually a promotion. That's pretty lousy workplace behaviour from the white people in power. What we consider red flags is dependent on society and culture and individual experience, and I think it's important to keep intersectionality in mind when examining marginalized characters' words and actions.)

Nate thought he was being fired - not just fired, but replaced before he was even informed. That whole prank is a really bad look; the more you think about it, the worse it is. By the way, I highly recommend this fantastic fic which depicts that moment in a way that is powerfully perspective-altering: Like a Crow by TwelveLeagues.

One quick thing I want to mention because I do feel it's relevant. Nate calls Rebecca a shrew, which is quite literally a Shakespearian insult from The Taming of the Shrew. I think it is worth highlighting that Nate doesn't use some modern sexist insult against Rebecca. I think that's worth noting because yes, calling a woman a shrew is not kind, but I think it says more about Nate's fear and anxiety than it suggests a sexist worldview, or a more sexist worldview than most of the other characters in the show. That moment when Nate lashes out is indicative of his fear and insecurity about losing his job (which we've already seen hints of prior to this). It's also clear that he acts rashly when he feels threatened (something he's been in this workplace quite a bit). But this is also one of the early moments in which we see that Nate's more than the meek kit man; he's got some fight in him. He is not going to just meekly accept that he's been publicly sacked and replaced. He's going to say something. In other words, Nate contains multitudes. He's more than a villain, and he's more than a bunch of red flags.

#ted lasso #nathan shelley #ask box #fic rec #tl meta #this got long #it was supposed to be one paragraph

[terresdebrume]

Still expanding on the idea that Ted Lasso has been saying "everyone can do better" from the get go and showing Tartt Sr in rehab is a part of that, you know where the biggest failure is?

The Sam vs. Edwin Akufo storyline. Not only does Akufo remain (so far) the only character who remains unable and unwilling to change, so far Sam's storyline has just been 'take it and stay quiet'...and from the last time he interacted with Akufo, the implication seems to be that he will continue to do that while...what, Akufo ruins every professional move he ever makes?

Sam right now is in a very similar position as Rebecca and Jamie were, except worse because from what we've seen no one even seems to think there's an issue there, which means nothing will change, which is extremely fucked up in my opinion.

Frankly, I don't particularly expect the last episode to make that better, mostly because so far Akufo's entire existence has been treated as a joke since his first poopoo breakdown. And don't get me wrong, it is ridiculous, but it's also horrifying in its implications for Sam and his future, and I really really wish the writers had done a better job with it.

#Ted Lasso #Edwin Akufo #Sam Obisanya #my meta #tl meta #meta #Spoiler #Also because Edwin Akufo should not be excluded from the statement that anyone can make better choices #10n #20n

[self-spaghettification]

The Mystery of Aaravos The Banter Lodge

So, recently an account called "The Banter Lodge" has popped up. April 30th, to be precise. You've seen it. I've seen it. We've all seen it. On Twitter, posting various images in the TDP official style.

A few nights ago, it debuted on Tumblr as well. "Coming May 2024" all of the promotional images and the website itself say.

Who is this account? Is it fan made, is it official? It's May, when exactly in "May 2024" is it coming?

Well, me and a few friends took some time to try to piece the mystery together, and so -- while it may still be 'coming', only dropping hints, I am here to tell you what I know now!

History

Website Code ( I love computer programming so I took the time to dive into that!)

Purpose

A. History

Who's Running the Banter Lodge?

To know that, first we need to delve into the history of the Twitter account.

Despite these images and site debuting less than a month ago, the account itself was founded way back in 2022, and originally called @BantherLodge, with an H, as it is in the show.

@BantherLodge is no longer available, and while it initially did not seem to be connected to The Banter Lodge, there are several interactions linked to the current one, Banter Lodge without an H.

In fact, here is the same tweets linked to the current (banter) account version.

Now we've established that @'BantherLodge' and @'BanterLodge' the same account with a changed name and identity, here is the most important past interaction:

@‘bantherlodge’ is mentioned here, and they are on this call. that said, WHO IS REALLY BEHIND BANTER LODGE? well based off the tweet, it seems that it’s 6 members of the cast and then 2 guests, @‘thebantherlodge’ and @‘ladytheebug’. But don’t take my word for it. Here, more confirmation:

Another person in the call happened to tweet about it too, this time with labels.

Now let’s take a closer look at these two guests. Sara @‘ladytheebug’ seems to be the one on the right, and by process of elimination, on the left is ‘bantherlodge’. aka:

Max….

Max the Mystery! ‘Sara’ and ‘Max’ isn’t really enough information to know more along with no connection to other socials so it’s hard to pin down who they are or what connections to previous fandom projects or creative projects in general they might have. However, they are still connected.

Besides the partially deleted various back and forths between these two accounts, this tweet about the Bait screensaver in the background is additional confirmation that this is @‘bantherlodge’ and @‘ladytheebug’: (note use of word ‘our’)

FURTHERMORE:

Said TV embodies this duo: A person who loves Bait (evident from so many of their tweets) and a person who loves the Banther Lodge…

Reminds you of something, doesn’t it?

“but hold on, just because there’s all these coincidences doesn’t mean the account could be passed on to someone else to run this.” Ok, but one last thing. If that was the case, why would they still be following Sara? In fact, it’s the Only person that they’re following besides TDPO?

(and their following has even been recently updated within the last few days as before then it didn’t include Eugene and Boone.) So, in conclusion,

Max of @‘BantherLodge’, and possibly Sara, (with or without TDPO but I’ll get to that later) almost certainly are the people behind the curtain of this Banter Lodge mystery.

Now, about said mystery… what exactly is the trail building up to?

well, to find out more about that, let’s glean what we can from the website.

B. Website Secrets

The website itself is very simple- A background, the image of the Banter House, and some text saying "Coming May 2024." But, beneath the deceptively simple surface, there was more to be found.

On May 1st Caprinae got this from the page. She also tweeted about it, after which the site changed to remove much of the css, including the part about the episodes and subscribe button. I was pretty excited about this as someone with a few years of coding experience, I wanted to mess around in VSC and see what I could find out.

After formatting the code the most noticeable thing is this right?

And when I make an element for it to apply to (since all that code is just formatting for stuff on the page like the title, images, etc, in this case- an audio bar) + adding in an image and an audio file:

We get this

AUDIO and an image. It looks exactly like a podcast episode. It turns out there’s actually a bunch of code for formatting that’s not used in elements in the site (elements that exist: the title or image), but it’s there, so I made some elements it would apply to. technically, it’s supposed to have a parchment paper background too, but I just chose some colors that you could see the text on.

Doing so, we get this!

(Here’s a video version.)

Plus, Original Code and Modified Code if you’re curious

Anyway, so the site (at least at the stage the code was taken from) doesn’t appear to be finished and there was no Java script written (or at least, linked) but there is definitely the makings for a website for a podcast— some sort of nav bar with the episodes, on an episode page, the image and audio, and then a subscribe link at the bottom!

C. Purpose

Time to speculate on the real identity and purpose of the Banter Lodge. So far, we know it used to be called the Banther Lodge. We know it seems to be run by [insert here.] We know it is almost certainly a podcast of some sort. But what, and why?

Here are some possibilites:

1.Official Content to Tide Over Fans Til S6 As we know, to calm the frustration of fans at Netflix/TDP for the delay of S6, the creators have been putting out content every day for the fans to puzzle over and figure out the season six titles.

Based on the current schedule, it’s set to end on May 13.—although it could be ending either May 13 or May 14 (depending when they do the last hint) after these drop, there will likely be a lull in TDP content, which would be the perfect time for the Banter Lodge to launch.

+ The Banter Lodge teaser campaign has already been perfectly timed for when a bunch of fans would be online on Twitter checking in for clues to begin with.

If this is official content, it would doubly make sense—it’d be timed perfectly to tie the fans over until the actual season six campaign starts (ie, trailer). Considering these two fans also somehow got to have a private panel with the cast, it’s not impossible that they’d be working with TDP on this content, additionally the teaser images put out this far have been somewhat reminiscent of TDP official content—ie, Callum’s lodge notebook->Callum’s sketchbook, Refractions->Reflections, Dear Callum letter from Rayla, design style, etc.

However, there is one big reason I don’t think this is the case: it’s a little too sloppy. For example, if they wanted it to be completely anonymous and unclear what was happening, the tweet mentioning @‘BantherLodge’ in the panel would have been deleted and there wouldn’t have been any hints in the code. Of course, these could still just be honest mistakes. However, it also seems like it is building off of the current world in a more derivative, fan-content fashion, not necessarily adding new material the way TDP Official tends to. It’s copying the official style,—but almost too much if that makes sense.

Like altering a shot from the show for a teaser.

x

Don’t get me wrong. I love the way that they’re building off the world, I’m excited to see where it leads, but for whatever reason, to me, it just doesn’t seem official.

So assuming it’s made by fans, what kind of podcast is it? Second possibility—

2. Fan Made Talk Show

This seems like the most obvious conclusion, considering that The Banter House is a play on a location in TDP, and the word banter, which is synonymous with talking, but specifically back and forth, genial interactions.

Maybe it’s dedicated to analyzing the show or a particular aspect,—maybe centric to the lodge, crystals, Bait and Stella—maybe even interviewing cast/crew!

Well, to get a better idea of what niche it might be filling, let’s take a look at what TDP podcasts are already out there.

Hot Brown Morning Potion Podcast [2019-2023] Hosted by Tamika "Kuno" Williams and Hailey from Cartoon Universe. This podcast [is] full of answering fan questions, interviews, theories and all kinds of discussions on everything Dragon Prince.

News from the Breach [2020-2024] Your hosts Ceilidh and Yana are watching The Dragon Prince from start to finish. Each season of the podcast covers one “Book” (or season) of the Netflix series The Dragon Prince. In each episode we discuss two chapters of the series, except for the season finales.

Calm Chaos Club [2023] Join Kevlar and Lou each week as they discuss topics about animation, design, and all things related to The Dragon Prince on Netflix! With special guests brought on for unique topics and insights into the creative process, these bite-sized episodes will ensure you can get your TDP fix in anywhere and anytime.

There’s no harm in another talk show but as there are a few out there already (and for other reasons) I personally think this is not necessarily the niche the banter Lodge is going to fill. I mean, I do think that it’s still possible I mean, it could be centric to particular aspect around the lodge as mentioned.

However, there’s a possibility that excites me a lot more, that I’m hoping for the most….

3.Fan Made Audio Drama in the Saga Setting I have personally always been a huge fan of audio drama podcasts (TMA,TPP,WTNV) and if there was a dragon Prince audio drama podcast, I think I would just die on the spot honestly from joy. I also think it’s most likely because all of the clues so far have been very story/worldbuilding oriented, as well as writings from familiar characters’ perspectives. It seems as though a story is being crafted here, and I am all for it.

Y’know what? While we’re here on the topic of storytelling podcasts, we might as well throw in D&D/TTRPG or even Tales of Xadia as a possibility because yeah sure. Why not? I mean, tabletop role-play games also involve a lot of talking so it would fit the banter theme. Who knows.

That's all! What do you think? Any other thoughts, additions or other speculation? Feel free to add on!

Thanks to @bycaprinae for Twitter screenshots, html, and general inspiration, and to @parroset for other help with the website part and general support!

#tl;dr all evidence points to it being a fanmade podcast! Possibly launching May 15th! #CS Major core; #One of those things where I’m like. Should I post this #Well #I value…I promise the people freedom of information and so freedom of information is what they’re gonna get #This actually helped me learn/remember a lot of web design stuff haha #Yay #the dragon prince #tdp speculation #sort of #tdp meta

[fantastic-nonsense]

Thanks for your reply. And, yeah, I definitely agree that Robin is first and foremost Dick’s legacy, and that he chose Damian as his Robin for important reasons that he expresses to Tim later. And, his blessings to both Jason and Tim previously were also extremely important. But, I was thinking about it more in terms of how the transition was handled. I know that Jason and Dick, despite popular belief, had a decent relationship when he was Robin, but Dick didn’t react well initially because he had been completely blindsided by the news, nor had he given his consent. I thought that Alfred was sort of repeating Bruce’s mistakes here, so Tim might have been blindsided by it as well (not that I think he would’ve given his consent either way at that point). You saying that it was a crisis decision on Alfred’s part puts it in perspective though, and it makes sense since Alfred’s generally more sensitive than Bruce. I do think, though, that seeing Damian in a Robin suit (with Alfred’s blessing) would have probably made Tim realise that there was a real possibility that Damian could be Robin.

[referencing this response on how the transition from Tim to Damian as Robin was handled]

I think two things can be true: Tim would be blindsided and hurt by Dick's decision to make Damian Robin regardless of the circumstances, but it was particularly tough for him given the situation that it occurred in (the issue you're talking about and I mostly discussed in my original response), and it was the obvious decision to make based on where all three of those characters were in their character arcs.

Tim during the BFTC/early Reborn era honestly needs to be viewed in the context of him clearly being ready to take the same steps Dick took at his age to become an independent vigilante but wanting to cling to Robin because it was the only sense of stability he had in an incredibly unstable period of his life. Tim had been operating semi-independently for years and had just spent the entirety of Battle for the Cowl telling Dick that if he wouldn't put on the cowl Tim would do it himself…and then he actually did put on the cowl to go fight Jason. It's not like Tim wasn't signaling that he had moved beyond Robin's role as Batman's non-independent protege.

And Dick could see that, especially since Tim had already been the Robin to his Batman once, back in Prodigal. He genuinely meant it when he called Tim his "equal" in Red Robin #1, and I think that's important to understand where both of them are coming from.

Ultimately Tim's problems with Robin "being taken away from him" were not Dick's problems, and Tim's hostility and hurt comes from a fundamentally different place than Dick's did. Dick voluntarily gave up being Robin to become Nightwing, and the rocky transition from Dick to Jason was less about the mantle and more about Dick's personal insecurity about his place in the family and Bruce giving Jason Robin without his permission. Tim's place in the family was very solid during BftC and his RR #1 freakout was mostly about the perception that Dick was taking away his sole source of mental/life stability and choosing Damian (a potential hostile) over Tim to watch his back and keep him alive.

Dick's issues were about insecurity in the face of a father apparently replacing him with a new son and a new partner in his absence. Tim's issues were about feeling unmoored in the face of yet another loved one dying, his civilian life going up in flames (again) and being pushed out of a tenuous stability back into instability, and the percieved lack of trust in his ability to properly fill the role he was already occupying.

So honestly I think Tim's feelings on that transition need to be viewed as an entirely separate thing from how well or poorly the transition itself was handled, because I genuinely believe that Tim's reaction only was what it canonically was due to the unique intersections of events going on in Tim's personal life. Dick could have (and should have) handled the transition with more delicacy, but Tim was always going to react badly because of how hard he had been leaning on the mask to give him a sense of normalcy and balance. That's not really something Dick or Damian (or Alfred) could control, even though the transition itself was rockier than it could have been on their ends and poorly handled out-of universe.

#tl;dr everyone makes messy but understandable choices during that era and that's why it's interesting! #dc comics #tim drake #tim drake meta #dick grayson #dick grayson meta #damian wayne #long post #asks