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sunlit-haruka · 5 months

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Ranking all of the Milgram Birthday Outfits on a scale of 1/10 because it's 3AM over here and I have to do school things at 6 (Inspired by this video) ↓

Already off to an incredibly strong start, because as we know, Haruka is perfect and can do no wrong. Dog? Little sister? Who's that? Sounds like a myth honesty. Alright, jokes and Haruka bias aside, very nice ! Relatively plain all things considered, but that's quite fitting for Haruka (I mean, have you seen how this kid dresses normally? I'm somewhat surprised that he didn't go for a full white look. Wonder if Muu helped him out when choosing his pieces) I also love the color blue, so bonus points for that. (shut up I know I just said I would ignore biases) Overall, I give Haruka Sakurai a 8/10 !! Lookin' good, buddy ! ↓

Yuno looks so pretty and the outfit is SO cute !! I love the frilliness of the shirt, the pleated skirt is really cute and in general I love the shades of pink chosen for this outfit, and those SHOEEEES girl where did you get those give me name and address. I honestly have no complaints at all I give Yuno Kashiki a 10/10 !! Absolutely gorgeous girl !! (Also it's unfortunate we're only ranking the outfits and not the cakes, because the decision to give Yuno a fucking staircase cake was genius) ↓

...Mannn, I wish I could say I liked this outfit so badly. The outfit itself is alright, if a bit basic, and Fuuta looks very handsome ! But I can't help but feel like black would've been a better choice for him than dark brown. And Fuuta...my guy...WHY those shoes? I could've maybe forgiven the outfit colors if you didn't decide to pair them with shiny gold...sneakers? What the hell even are those? Get better shoes, man. Overall, I'm giving Fuuta Kajiyama a 4/10. I like the outfit it'self (minus the shoes), but the coloring brings it down a lot for me. ↓

Christ, no wonder Muu got model deals ! Look at this queen right here !! She looks absolutely gorgeous, the dress is beautiful and I love the Beauty And The Beast inspiration. The earrings being inspired by an hourglass is a very cool detail, and the heels look great as well ! I genuinely don't think I have any faults with this one Muu Kusunoki gets a 10/10 ! Nice job dressing to impress ! ↓

One chance Mr. Kirisaki, one cha-- Ahem. As I was saying, Shidou looks amazing in this outfit !! I'm usually not a fan of there being so much white on it's own (I sound like a certain horror fanatic, sheesh.) But Shidou reallly rocks it, and the purple accents are very nice in comparison !! I also really like the shoes for some reason. Shidou is being added to the list also consisting of Muu and Yuno where I need to see who their shoemaker is For Shidou Kirisaki, I give a 9/10 !! Very pretty man. ↓

Mahiru looks very pretty here ! I love the poofy hair accessory, and the birdcage earrings are a very nice touch. That being said however...the dress is a bit too plain for me. I cannot help but feel like something is missing here that would make the overall outfit look way better. A sash maybe? Despite that though, Mahiru Shiina gets a 6/10 !! Looking ready for a date ! ↓

Ooooh...Kazui stans forgive me, but I'm pretty indifferent to this outfit. It's not bad mind you ! Kazui looks very handsome in it, and I like the blue chosen for his tie. But it's the same problem with Mahiru where I feel like it's a bit too plain and could've used something more, like a pattern on his vest or pants. Also though his shoes aren't the atrocity that is Fuuta's, I feel like a black or even a dark blue akin to Haruka would've looked a lot better in comparison to the rest of his outfit. Kazui Mukuhara is granted a 5/10. Not the best, not the worst. Sorry old man. ↓

AHHH SHE LOOKS SO CUTE !! It's like if the frilliness from Yuno's outfit was upped to twenty ! Amane's dress is adorable and looks very comfortable as well, I want a bigger sized version for myself. I also really like her big bow, as well as the blue shoes. But most importantly, Amane seems to be genuinely happy wearing it, and as a fandom, Amane's happienss takes priority. Amane Momose, you'll be getting a 9/10 from me ! Good on ya, kid ! ↓

Ahhh, he's so cute ! Look at how polite he looks ! The blazer is nice, and also blue. Blue bias. And the boots absolutely fucking SLAY. The way his hair is styled looks very nice as well ! I also think this is the closest we have gotten to official art of Mikoto smiling genuinely, and I personally think we need more. And more. And more. Mikoto Kayano gets a 10/10 !! Very cute boy ! ↓

Ma'am, I politely and respectfully ask you to break my neck mercilessly-- Ahem. As I was saying. KOTOKO LOOKS FUCKING AMAZING !! The undershirt oh my god the FUCKING UNDERSHIRT !! Absolutely adore it so much. The colors are all very pleasing to the eye, the skirt is very cute, and the heels look cool as hell !! But Kotoko also looks cool as hell in anything, so is this really fair? Kotoko Yuzuriha has obtained a 10/10 ! Absolutely gorgeous.

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snakes-and-fluff · 14 days

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I only saw this illustration now, and the first thing I see people saying is that it looks like a funeral and that the way they hold their flowers might pertain to how they feel about their victim. This makes sense but is also horrifying if we break it down:

Yuno, Mahiru and Shidou are carefully holding it in both hands. Yuno is cradling it like a small child (ouch) while Mahiru and Shidou are holding it close to their chest. Like you would a lover.

Take the above into consideration and the fact that Kazui is not only holding it with one hand, but looks like he's ready to toss it hurt a lot more. Sure, he didn't love Hinako, but I was still under the impression that he cared for her.

Speaking of tossing, Amane's has already dropped and is lying on the floor behind her, implying she has no more respect for her victim. Which makes sense both from the horrible abuser angle and the "went-back-on-your-beliefs" angle.

Haruka also looks ready to drop his, holding it upside-down with some petals already having fallen from it. I've never really thought about how Haruka viewed his victim before and this isn't really giving me a good read on it either, but I do find it immensely interesting.

Kotoko is holding hers the lowest but doesn't seem intent on dropping it. She hates her victim, of course, but doesn't want to let go of that hatred. Of that anger. She'll remember him, even just to remember what "real evil" looks like.

Mikoto is grasping it with both hands in what I can best describe a "normal" way. Like a corporate funeral you have to attend but didn't know the person so you're just trying to be polite. After all, he didn't know who he killed, so how is he supposed to have an opinion on them?

Muu is a strange one. She's holding it behind her back but doesn't seem about to discard it like Amane did. And with her pose it makes her look like a nervous teen about to confess her love. Maybe she did hold some romantic feelings for Rei after all.

Fuuta's is tossed over his shoulder; only holding it with one hand but that hand is holding tight. He's also the only one holding it at face-level. I think he feels a closeness with his victim that the others do not; a similarity in their situation.

Also, sidenote: once again the boys were robbed and just get uniform suits where the girls get to get different outfits (I have the same problem with the birthday arts). Also what is Es wearing? That doesn't look modern to me and looking up "traditional Japanese funeral wear" doesn't get me anything that looks like that. So if somebody knows, please tell me! kani-miso has informed me it is a Buddhist monk outfit; thanks so much!

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moibakadesu · 2 months

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I have been rotating one of Haruka's lines from the earphone collab in my brain for a while now, because it stood out to me as very important.

And that would be the line in which he apologizes to Amane in a very distressed and tearful voice.

So, Yamanaka had mentioned that these lines are important to canon or "critical to uncover the secrets of the prisoners", which is also why I think they made sure that they are not hidden behind a paywall, you can read up on all of them on the website of the collab.

And I think this line gives us hints for things to come in t3.

//cw for the topics of suicide and Milgram-typical violence

Alright, so let's assume that the restrictions of the guilty prisoners don't work the way we imagine. For context, I always assumed that they are not physically bound (after all they still have to eat, use the bathroom etc), but it's more of a emotional barrier that keeps them from inflicting violence or defending themselves. But we never got a confirmation on that, this is just what I combined by observation, but it might as well just be that they consider the longer straps (and in some cases sleeves) as restriction, which is ... well, that is not something that is stopping someone with the intent to kill, that is for sure.

So I would say we are all terribly aware about Haruka's threat of suicide. But I think his plan might have changed a bit, he had a long time to ruminate about it after all. And he clearly does not want to die (AKAA even has the lyrics "I don't want to die" translated as "Don't wipe me out", but we are all aware how scuffed the translation for that song is). His conversation with Kotoko on her birthday already made me rise an eyebrow. My first assumption was that he is planning a murder-suicide with Muu, in a way to safe her both from being scared in Milgram and from being alone when he is gone.

But what if he came up with a third option? An option that would show he is serious without destroying the time with his mother. (I still think Muu won't want to hang out with him anymore in t3, but that is beside the question here.) Our blue boy once stated that "he can kill anything that is smaller and weaker than him", and who fits that description the most in the prison and also has a bit of an overlap with his presumed victim? Amane.

An important detail is, that Amane is a prisoner that Haruka had no interaction with whatsoever. He does mention her, in his t1 VD explaining that he is not good with children of her age and in the t2 VD that he apparently does not have problems with her anymore. Still, he seemed to (understandably) always keep his distance from her.

So why of all things does he get a line in this collab addressing her directly? It doesn't feel like a "sorry I'm not interacting with you" kinda line, it's very pained, you can feel the tears in his voice there.

And this lead me to think that Haruka will attempt to attack Amane, which ... oh boy, it will be all kinds of messy. We know Amane is armed, even with the overwhelming strength disadvantage she could easily stab him with her scissors in a death-struggle. Not to mention the conflicts that will bring among the prisoners (I don't even want to think about how that could sour how Fuuta thinks about Haruka tremendously).

And it would be a very interesting turn story wise, instead of going the way too obvious and telegraphed path of Haruka attempting to kill himself and Amane planning an attack on Shidou etc.

It would also be a very mean and ironic way to repeat Haruka's misery (I am crying), getting abandoned by Es/us and very possible his second mother Muu and trying to change things by taking the life of a young girl.

#moi rambles #a lot #the possibilities how this match of 4D chess will go are endless but this line REALLY stood out to me #milgram #haruka sakurai #sakurai haruka #amane momose #momose amane #milgram theory #I want the best for my sweet boy but the canon looks grim

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cycle-hit · 14 days

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wait why is lucky believed to be her victim /gen

this post by ryuseiired is very good! please go read it

kotokos t2 music video, notably, is also the only one who extends past her t1 mv "murder" (with mikoto as an exception- because i genuinely have no idea what to make of his t2 mv in terms of murder) to a curious amount- with an interesting focus on lucky. all of the other prisoner's t2 mvs are focused on what happened before/what caused the murder- if lucky was her victim, then this would make kotokos t2 mv align with the rest of the prisoners' t2 mvs.

kotoko, fascinatingly, is also the only prisoner thats been to court for her "murder"- at least that we know of. if milgrams purpose is to judge criminals outside the judicial court of law- is that not redundant? why have none of the other prisoners already been to court? why would kotoko be an outlier to this? unless, of course, kotoko isnt, and her actual "murder" is lucky, who she hasn't been to court for.

kotoko also just parallels or mirrors a lot of the prisoners who have "child murder" on their hands. haruka. shidou. fuuta kajiyama. mikoto in a way not because of his victim but because "john" has the motifs of someone who's been "newly born"- and soon he will "disappear". this argument has less substance though because kotoko literally parallels or mirrors every single prisoner in milgram in some way or another. you could even argue she mirrors yuno- both yuno and kotoko have come to hate a different "side" of themselves. and yuno. uhhhh. well. she doesnt have that baby anymore. heart <3

theres also the new anniversary art!

if kotokos victim was the man she killed- why is she holding the bouquet, which is meant to represent the prisoners victims in some way or another- hidden by her side? should it not be closer to how amanes is to show complete MALICE disrespect? should it not be on the ground beneath her feet if its the criminal she murdered whom she so despises? kotoko is still holding it carelessly, its petals are still going to shed or the flowers will fall- but shes still holding it. she still cares for the bouquet in some capacity. just not as properly as she should. its also worth noting that while haruka's and amane's bouquets have shed, kotoko's still hasnt despite her holding it like that. knives ( @tmasckotoko) also pointed out the absolutely devastating concept of lucky and kotoko "holding hands" bc it slightly looks like thats what she could be doing with the bouquet symbolism. maybe kotoko doesnt even notice shes holding the bouquet dangerously- to mirror her inattentiveness to what leaving lucky behind would do in the end.

youll see people arguing that kotoko DIRECTLY murdered lucky too- which i just completely disagree with. not only does it get rid of one of the main supporting arguments of kotokos murder being "indirect", but kotoko just. wouldnt? do that? her entire thing in harrow is saving children or avenging their deaths. why would she directly kill lucky. in milgram kotoko isnt even capable of hurting a child despite how much she insists she is- she fails to beat up amane post trial 1, and now she's made a deal with haruka to hurt neither him nor muu. (funnily enough though, haruka possibly IS going to indirectly die bc of her encouragement of his plan. MUCH LIKE SOMEONE ELSE YOU KNEW, KOTOKO, WHO WAS DEFINED AS "WEAK" AND ALSO WAS STILL A MINOR?). you can argue that she tried to punch es back in mikotos t1 vd i guess, but she did that with the prior knowledge that itd likely be stopped before it would ever reach them. she also warned es, albeit not very um. succinctly. i just. cant see kotoko hurting lucky directly in any capacity.

oh yeah! theres also the story of jacques roulet- which is the clothing brand that kotoko wears. jacques roulet was a werewolf who was sent to a "madhouse" for eating a child. 👍

#HOPE I COVERED MOST OF THE “LUCKY IS KOTOKOS TRUE VICTIM” THEORY BASES. ANYONE WHO SEES THIS CAN FEEL FREE TO ADD ON #my brain ran out of juice i dont know anything but the word “also”#milgram #kotoko yuzuriha #lucky milgram #milgram analysis #milgram theory #asks #main tagged wooo!!! i feel ive said a lot here

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good-beanswrites · 4 months

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Remembering how Futa said in one timeline that there’s no way a woman could beat a man in a fight and got his ass beat. Can you do a crackfic of the girls beating him up for that?

Ahahaha thank you for the request!! This was really fun to write omg -- and well deserved, there was no need for all that in the timeline convo 😤 He was too busy thinking of leverages and forms he failed to consider the fury of a woman scorned..... may he rest in peace......

Fuuta didn’t even know what he did to earn himself an ass-beating.

“Oh, you know what you did,” Yuno said. She closed the cell door behind her.

Whatever it was, it had managed to anger every woman on the premises. He thought it took a lot to get girls riled up this much – something like cheating on them or calling them names, you know? But without a single action on his part, he found himself facing Yuno, Muu, and Amane. All three had a fire in their eyes that Fuuta was not liking the look of.

Mahiru had pointed him to his cell, saying Es was looking for him there. She spoke strangely as she did it, and waited awkwardly outside as he went in, but everyone around here was a little odd. How was he supposed to distinguish when people were being murderer-in-a-supernatural-prison weird from setting-a-trap-to-corner-him-in-his-cell weird?

He waved his palms in front of him. “Listen, listen! Let’s just talk, okay? Let’s slow down.”

Muu cracked her knuckles.

Amane began rolling up her sleeves in perfect creases. “You have doubted our abilities. We will make you a believer.”

Fuuta took a few steps back. His voice came out loud and frantic. “What are you talking about? If you’re looking to pick a fight, you better think twice, because I’m not gonna hit a girl or anything.”

“Oh, good!” Yuno’s voice was as bubbly as always as the three closed in. “That will make our job a lot easier.”

He felt his back hit the wall. “I mean it, let’s just talk about this for a sec! Hey!”

Mikoto’s voice came from outside the cell.

“Mappi? What’s going on in there?”

“Yes!” Fuuta called, “Mikoto! Help! They’re gonna kill me in here!”

“Oh, no need to worry~ The girls are just teaching him a little lesson about not saying awful things.”

“Isn’t this going a bit too far…? What did he even say?”

“Nothing! Come on, get me the fuck outta here!”

“I believe his exact words were, ‘there’s no way a girl could win in a fight against a man.’”

Fuuta paled. He did say that, didn't he...

“Oh crap. Yeah, that’d do it. Carry on.”

“Wha–? Mikoto!”

He gaped at the three in front of him.

He remembered a hero in a video game who had faced off against an unbeatable foe; a glorious knight who came to understand that he could never conquer the world-razing dragon before him. After giving his all, and seeing his fate was sealed, the hero had no choice. In a manly show of valor, he’d lifted his chin, closed his eyes, and accepted his impending, gory death.

Yuno's gaze was cold as she raised her arms. Muu had a hungry look in her eyes. Amane clenched her fists, her posture perfect.

It wasn’t a dragon, but Fuuta would argue this was a good deal more dangerous. He lifted his chin and squeezed his eyes shut.

“Get ‘em, girls!”

—

Kotoko approached just as the other girls filed out of Fuuta’s cell. They had giddy looks on their faces. They giggled and whispered in a huddle as they walked around the panopticon.

“Wow, Muu!”

“Haha, I didn’t know you had it in you!”

“That felt amazing…”

Kotoko didn’t know what kind of game they were all playing in there, but Fuuta was in for a big surprise now. The fun was over. Today was the day she acted out her responsibilities as Es’ fang. Today was the day she delivered justice.

She swung the cell door open. Her eyebrows shot up.

Her head whipped around to take a look at the girls, still complementing one another and laughing lightly.

Hell, her work here was already done.

#milgram #yuno kashiki #fuuta kajiyama #muu kusunoki #mahiru shiina #amane momose #mikoto kayano #kotoko yuzuriha #and then he dieded 😔 -- sad!#fuuta stumbles out of shidous cell a few hours later wearing the 'im sorry women' hat #as much as i tried i couldnt picture mappi throwing any punches but shed love to help!!#the girls go to john afterwards to say 'hey youre right beating the shit out of someone really does feel like it solved all my problems'#i originally had kotoko as part of the main group but she actually agrees with him in the timeline convo #so i dont think shed be as angry in the moment - though she supports the others 100%#LMAO thank you this was so funny 😂😂😂#i was so so silly finishing up work and stuff and constantly plotting ways to beat up my fave #drabbles

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milgramprojectfan · 3 months

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Things I expect to see/want to see in the third trial MVs (lmk if we already know any of these)

Haruka- Literally everything. We need After Pain levels of concrete evidence. We don’t know who the victim even is!! Like both of his MVs are all just vibes and breadcrumbs!

Yuno- Ngl I think she’s good overall, like we know most of the stuff we need to. Maybe we could see why she decided to become a sugar baby, or I saw a theory she threw herself down some stairs as a DIY abortion, so smth like that.

Fuuta- I want to see what the girl did that Fuuta felt he needed to bring justice to. Not that it’d change my verdict, I’m just curious. I also saw a theory that someone was impersonating Fuuta and like doxxed the girl and stuff, so maybe we’ll see that.

Muu- I really want to see what Rei’s deal is. Like I feel like her and Muu’s relationship is a lot deeper than it first seems. Also I expect to see why Muu’s friends switched up on her, cuz I feel like that’s one of the main mysteries with her. (

Shidou- I kinda just want confirmation on whether or not he actually stole organs, cuz like people keep saying it’s confirmed but it’s not 100%. Also what happened to his kids? Why do we see them in Triage and not Throw Down? Are they dead? Also were his wife and kids in a car crash, and that’s what the call in Triage was? I feel like Shidou’s MV are like Haruka’s where they say a lot but also nothing at all

Mahiru- I feel like Mahiru’s story is pretty wrapped up nicely, like Yuno’s. I think maybe we’ll see her boyfriend be confirmed as codependent too, since I’m like 99% sure he was.

Kazui- I honestly just want to see him confirmed as gay. Like we all know he is, but I want to hear the words “I’m gay” come out of Kazui’s mouth. Other than that, I expect to see some more backstory with Hinako (the wife).

Amane- I expect to see more around Amane’s murder , because we assume it’s her mom but it could be someone else. Also we don’t know how she did it, like we see her in her marching get up with a bloody staff, but I doubt she was actually dressed like that irl.

Mikoto- Mikoto’s kinda boring imo, so i want to see how Mikoto was the one who killed that man and John is covering for him. I don’t expect this to happen, but it’d be a unique twist. I expect to see the circumstances surrounding the death, but idk what that’d be.

Kotoko- ok her new MV just came out so I’m kinda don’t know what to expect, but maybe like see what happened to that girl (Lucky I think?). Someone on here said smth like “What if Lucky died and that’s Kotoko’s crime for being in Milgram because she focused too much on punishing perpetrators and not protecting victims”. So yeah.

#milgram #the milgram project #kotoko yuzuriha #amane momose #kazui mukuhara #mahiru shiina #mikoto kayano #muu kusunoki #fuuta kajiyama #haruka sakurai #shidou kirisaki #yuno kashiki #predictions

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vividstardustrevolution · 6 months

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Fun fact: Futa is *not* the canon system character in MILGRAM!

...Neither is Yuno...

[Text Transcription: "Let's just do it, please smile?"]

...Haruka's not either...

[Text Transcription: "My loneliness was desired"]

...nope, not Shidou either...

Amane isn't canonically a system either, but I definitely understand the people who think she might be or headcanon her as such, especially after "The Purge March".

[Text Transcription 1: "It's the beginning of a most wonderful day"]

[Text Transcription 2: "With pure, unsullied body and soul,"]

No, Kazui's not the canon system either.

[Text Transcription: "All these memories and you Only if I could erase them"]

Where, then...?

Ah, I found him!

Hi Mikoto!

[Text Transcription 1: "It's like what's wrong isn't wrong"]

[Text Transcription 2: "I'm already the fake one"]

...but y'know, it is kinda funny that at least 7/10 of the MILGRAM prisoners have two versions of themselves on screen interacting with each other (I don't remember Muu, Mahiru, or Kotoko having scenes like that, but let me know if I'm wrong, and Kotoko still has Deep Cover coming, too), and yet only one of them is a canon system. Yes, you can explain Haruka and Amane's as self-abuse and dissociation, Futa's, Shidou's, and Kazui's as dissociation, and Yuno as compartmentalizing herself and how she acts around different people, but still.

It's interesting how it's only seemingly portrayed negatively with Mikoto, too, although to be fair, Haruka and Amane both hurt the other versions of themselves in their interactions (Haruka looks down on and pushes and chokes the younger version of himself, and Amane looks down on herself and sends herself into the water), but...still, that feels different from Mikoto's case. Maybe it's because in the cases of 010203050708, we know that the other them they're interacting with is still them, but in Mikoto's case, we don't know that. Haruka, Yuno, Futa, Shidou, Kazui, and Amane's "other selves" aren't treated as evil (or, if they are, it's not to the same extent that we see Mikoto's alter (or alters, if you're one of the people who believes in one of the Trikoto theories out there) treated as evil and inhuman).

Now, I do think that you can argue in good faith that part of why Mikoto's DID gets demonized so hard in MeMe is because Mikoto is slowly coming to the realization that he's a system and has some internalized ableism to deal with regarding that (because internalized ableism isn't uncommon regardless of the disorder involved; it's not true for every system that there's internalized ableism, but it makes sense for Mikoto "I'm just a normal guy; what do you mean I'm a murderer?" Kayano). However, I don't think that completely explains the demonization that Mikoto deals with. We see it with his interactions with Kotoko. That interrogation answer where Shidou says, "Since Mikoto became 'like that,' the smoking group stopped really interacting," shows that Shidou seems to be uncomfortable with Mikoto now that his DID has been outed. The fact that Haruka is the only person who willingly interacted with Mikoto since trial two started (the only other person Mikoto has interacted with is Kotoko, and he was the one who approached her because similar to him, everyone is avoiding the fuck out of Kotoko) shows that most people are avoiding Mikoto. (Granted, Mikoto was kind of an ass to Futa and Amane, and Mahiru was busy not fucking dying, but what about the rest of the group?) In fact, the fact that the characters are treating Mikoto (who, while kind of a jerk, has not physically attacked anyone as far as we know and only fought Kotoko in self-defense) the same way they're treating Kotoko (who literally attacked three people, damaged Futa's eye with her baton, nearly killed Mahiru, attacked Mikoto, and is generally an asshole (/affectionate) and has been an asshole to all but two people in the cast) is telling me that the majority of the cast sees him the same way they see her - threatening and dangerous - and it's likely that he's seen as dangerous mostly because of his DID. Even Haruka, who literally threatened to kill himself, has been checked on by two people - Futa and Muu.

...Does that seem fucked up to anyone else - that the characters seen as "dangerous," and especially Mikoto, who is being treated as a danger mostly because of his DID, are isolated and not being interacted with or checked on by most of the cast (because we all know damn well that Kotoko has not interacted with anyone since trial two started other than to chastize Kazui and tell Mikoto his existence is a crime)?

...I dunno where I'm going with this. I'm just...kinda just dumping my thoughts out and seeing where it goes.

#milgram #choking #haruka sakurai #mikoto kayano #kotoko yuzuriha #fuuta kajiyama #amane momose #shidou kirisaki #kazui mukuhara #yuno kashiki #milgram analysis #Honestly it's more me rambling than anything else.#Anyway I will stop now and go attempt to catch up on schoolwork like a responsible law student.#I do want to hear people's thoughts though.#MILGRAM ableism #CW choking #threatened suicide #CW suicide threat #(Not my suicide threat Haruka's suicide threat)

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doctorbunny · 9 months

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So I thought it'd be silly and detract from this post to talk about fandom underneath it But I've been looking for a way to talk about this and I think this is as good a start as any.

I keep seeing a lot of people confused as to why Kazui, assuming he is a gay/aro/other closet LGBT man would want to 'decieve' Hinako by lying to her about being in romantic love with her and marrying her

It makes sense, if you're young and from the right area, you might not know a lot of history, its certainly not taught in schools. For example, to many people 'gay panic' is a cute trope, wherein a person struggles with their newly discovered identity and not a legal defence people used to excuse the beating and murder of gay people

Kazui is 39 years old. He would've turned 40 in August 2020, meaning he was born in 1980

When the comic above about Bert and Ernie getting a civil union (not even marraige yet) was made in 2003, he would've been 23.

By the time gay marraige was legalised in the US, it was 2015, Kazui would've been 35 (and despite Kazui being Japanese, because other countries like to copy America, the US legalising gay marraige was absolutely celebrated by LGBT people worldwide)

(here's a section of Our Dreams At Dusk a manga that began publication months before the legalisation of gay marraige in the US showing just two states legalising gay marraige as being news worthy to LGBT people in Japan) The first Asian country to legalise gay marraige was Taiwan in 2019 Japan is expected to be the second... but they're taking their time

Gender identity and sexual orientation are also not nationally protected civil rights, meaning protection from discrimination depends on the prefecture you live in.

And this is without getting into darker subjects like higher self harm/suicide rates or violent crimes against LGBT people

I don't want to be doom and gloom, many people are becoming more aware and accepting of LGBT people. But Kazui had every reason to wish to remain closeted

For all people talk about a 'divorce stigma' I believe it is silly to have expected a gay man in the 2000's, when many people even in the states thought gay marraige was unattainable in their lifetime, to have considered that when he got married to someone in an attempt to conform to society Especially because most difficulty to remarry after divorce comes from views surrounding custody laws and adoption. A lot of people don't want to get in a relationship with someone who already has children since they don't view them as their own on account of being blood related. This is probably why Fuuta's mother left Fuuta and his sister with their father. It's very notable that Milgram lampshades how by Kazui's age he was 'expected' to have children but didn't. We don't know Hinako's opinion on having children, but its possible Kazui intentionally didn't have any with her for this reason (despite feeling melancholy he could've had a child Muu's age by now)

Shidou had children (the eldest of which he likely sired while still being in medical school), Mahiru was still in university and thinking about planning a family, Amane notes that her mother gave birth to her when she was Mahiru's age. (TLs from Rochisama)

These aren't malicious feelings imo. This is Kazui noticing a coworker he likes is romantically interested in him and taking a chance on her in the hopes that playing a role as a straight man will make him into one. (unfortunately the suit doesn't fit) There is a Japanese saying of 出る杭は打たれる 'the nail that sticks out gets hammered in' suggesting it is better to not stand out (interestingly, the below lyric is the same in Japanese and English but in French its more like 'I can't take it anymore, I'm different')

It's also worth noting that gay people getting into heterosexual relationships even outside of Japan, used to be Extremely Common. Like my mother has a co-worker who did it

In addition, Yokohama is one of the more expensive places to live in Japan. Mixed with his expensive looking wedding and the traditonal dress of the family at his wedding. It's very likely he comes from a wealthy (conservative) background which would contribute to pressures

I'm rambling a little, i'm quite tired. But I don't want people to think this means they Have to vote Kazui innocent. I don't know your theories. Maybe you think he's straight or sexuality is entirely irrelavent to his crime or you think he's gay but you just want to vote him guilty for some other reason. Any reason is allowed (although non-milgram fans trying to use him as a luck shrine has to be pretty weird)

I just think that when you judge Kazui as a gay man who 'lied' to a straight woman, you need to look at the context it happened in and the many real people who still exist in marraiges like that. Beware whomst you call deceptive or manipulative in a world were heterosexuals feel entitled to your immediate coming out.

#kazui mukuhara #milgram #ミルグラム #milgram theory #well not really but it took ages to write #you will be amazed how homophobic the 2000's and before were #stuff moved so quickly after the US legalised gay marraige

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amugoffandoms · 9 months

Note

Ahahaha i am making you talk about how the voting will affect kazui and yuno~~~

🔫😄

omg there's a gun im being threatened to talk about this oh no it's definitely not like I was planning on doing this anyway because I'm UNWELL ABOUT THEM AT 1 AM

ANYWAYS DRUMROLL FOLKS WATCHING IN THE AUDIENCE, IT'S TIME FOR MUG'S 1 AM MILGRAM THOUGHTS!!!

How Voting Will Affect the Liars

Similarities

From the get-go, we already know they're pretty similar. They have references to a cat in their t2 MVs (A flash of a cat silhouette in Tear Drop and Cat. [And also the Dove eating])

We also have Yuno confirming this in her interrogation questions.

Which prisoner is the most like you? Kazui is the only option.

The two of them are also related to theater.

Yuno mentions in one of her interrogation questions that she's a part of a theater club and half takes place at a theater.

Observant Pair

Yuno is able to point out lies while having a conversation. (See her catching Kazui lying about his type and Mikoto's smiling.) She's also pretty observant with all the relationships with the prisoners (Haruka & Muu, Shidou & Amane).

I'd say Kazui is also observant. I recall a timeline conversation he had with Fuuta about attacking a guard. He mentioned that the guard could have a gun or other weapons, which is why you would have to be careful when making decisions.

Now, here's where I get a little more assumptions and stuff and less concrete similarities, but I'm doing it because I love these characters a lot so it's okay!

They both have bad self-esteem/ issues.

Yuno's aren't especially prevalent in any of her voice dramas/songs, but just note that I'd feel like being told you're some little girl when you want to be thought as of yourself would be seriously bad for your mental health.

And, also, looking at current timeline conversations, she's been asking a lot if it was worth it to be born which haha girl you need therapy.

She does mention she wouldn't mind living her life over again, which sure, doesn't sound indicative of any problems, but considering how terrible it is to be dealing with people almost dying everyday and hearing people pretend you are lesser than who you are, pretending you are some little girl, I'd say it's pretty sound reasoning for some issues.

Kazui had a little, uh, how to call it, breakdown-ish over him lying his entire life.

E: In short – between love and hate, [I would say] I hate you. Remember that. K: … I get that. E: Huh? K: I despise myself for lying, too. Being a liar, you see – it’s painful. E: Heh. Then just– K: So I’ve tried to change! I’ve tried to change. I have tried to stop lying to myself and others! E: … K: I’ve confided in others. I’ve tried to be myself! I’ve tried to just be the way I was born! E: …Hey, Kazui– K: It’s not my lies that killed her. She’s dead because I stopped lying to her! If I had just kept lying- She wouldn’t have died…! E: Kazui… K: I can’t live unless I lie. That’s how I was born… I’m pathetic, aren’t I?

[Source]

You can also take a look at a single interrogation question and see how terrible he's doing.

Do you like yourself? I can't really say I do.

So, wowee they seriously need some therapy (sorry I'm trying to be lighthearted I'm still think about kazui's votes BAHAHSHDH also these two being my favorite characters of milgram is not a good sign for myself)

They would rather they never committed the murder.

If you could turn back time, would you commit the same murder once again? I'd make sure that I won't have to commit it. That's it.

Do you regret your "murder"? I do regret it. I should have kept lying.

(Voice Drama)

K: It’s not my lies that killed her. She’s dead because I stopped lying to her! If I had just kept lying- She wouldn’t have died…!

Love and Like

Now, this one is sort of hard to determine on Kazui's side, but they do seem to make some sort of clear distinction between love and Like.

Difference between like and love? Isn't liking a state, and loving a feeling?

Cat MV

Maybe, perhaps… or… could it come true… like It’s for the sake of true love, who wouldn’t lie for that? . . .

Hey, so what if I said I liked-liked you, what would you do?

Kazui mentions true love (so, let's say romantic in this sense!) and I'll use liked-liked as just crushing.

Kazui says he lied (to protect his wife) because of true love. He mentions he likes someone because he was wondering about it.

Now, Kazui as a liar is pretty obvious. He mentions he's a liar, continue lying until you find the king of the masquerade, and shown as a magician (known for tricking and lying). He basically says he's lied for others.

Lying

(please enjoy silly minigram)

Yuno has lied as well. Not in MILGRAM, of course. She has no reason to lie. I'd say moreso on the side of her work. She's lied to her clients about who she is because she wanted to satisfy her client. She dresses up (hey, is this a half reference why is there changing costumes in this /j) for each of her clients and lies to them just to satisfy them for the money.

Someone mentioned in a post I reblogged a while back that they both lied to satisfy others and that's what they did.

This same post was when I begin to realize how Kazui's voting will severely affect Yuno.

Voting

So, this is the part of the post you've all be waiting for.

The Voting.

Now, luckily for Yuno, she's innocent! Haha, woo!!

We'll talk more about that later.

Kazui's voting is interesting to say the least! (Please don't look at my last posts to see how crazy I went please vote him innocent anyways)

To me, Kazui's vote feels like would you forgive a liar who has come clean, who has begun to show their true self to you?

Kazui is beginning to reveal himself to us, to show the person underneath the lies, the costumes, and the masquerade masks.

He's trying to be honest again! For the first time since his wife's death, he's trying to show the truth and let Es reveal him for who he is: a liar, a liar who is trying to be their true self.

Now, let's reflect on Yuno for a moment.

Let's recall one of the main objections to Yuno's voting last round. She didn't like being voted innocent because of how much they tried to justify her actions and act like she's such a poor, innocent girl who only did it because she's never felt love. She couldn't believe she was voted innocent because of that! Because of lies she had made up for her clients. (Shove that, in Kazui's words lol)

She wants Es to judge not because she's pitiful but because they believe it is a correct judgment to decide. To use logic instead of half-baked opinions on herself.

She wants Es to see her true self, someone who isn't pitiful, someone who did it because she wanted to.

See the line of connection?

They both want Es to see them for who they are, not for their lies.

Now, reflecting on the current voting, let's look at Yuno.

Even after her telling us/Es not to pity her, apparently some people still acted like she was an innocent girl. And even then, we all sort of chalked her up as abortion girlboss (GUYS please she's so much more than that head in hands places hand on wall) AND, hey, I'm not saying I'm immune to this, my reaction to her was pretty much the same. I'd vote her innocent no matter the reason (I love her character or that her murder is forgivable to me, even with the pregnancy entrapment theory)

But, she's more than that. She's more than a single action she's done.

But, somehow we missed that while we voted and made our decision.

We decided she was just a single action she's done made from her lies. She was trying to make sure we'd see her as herself, not a single thing we did.

And we didn't! We voted her innocent because she's a pitiable girl who has done nothing wrong.

So, wowed, strike one for us, Failure to Vote for One's True Self.

We voted for a single part about her and disregarded everything else because it was easy.

We didn't let her show us for who she is.

Now, Kazui time!

I've already mentioned previously that Kazui wants to show his true self to us, so I won't regurgitate stuff you already know.

Now, I feel like it's sort of clear that people don't care too much about that. More on the fact that he could have stopped at any time. (He wanted to tell the truth on his terms. Divorce is also a pretty bad look on you in Japan so I've heard.) He wanted to protect his wife, okay, cool cool.

He still wants Es to reveal his true self. (And, judging from the guilty verdicts, I don't think that'll work, that'll just make them worse in the long run.)

Also, quick tangent: This sounds familiar. Why does this voting seem like we've done this before as if we wanted to reveal their true self as if we wanted to show them their sins.. anywho

And, by giving Kazui a guilty verdict, we're only further proving that we don't give a damn about wanting to know about his true self, only that he lied to his wife, disregarding any of his own feelings related to the matter. We don't care about him wanting to be hinest.

We're proving we don't care about his true self, only his actions.

So, now it's strike two! Failure to Allow Someone to their True Self.

So, yeah, isn't that fun? We failed to vote for someone's true self and failed to let them even be that.

So, why do I think Kazui's voting will affect Yuno?

Well, they're pretty similar, we know that.

They both are liars who have lied to satisfy others in a sense.

Kazui's voting is to see if we can allow someone to be their true self and be honest about themselves. He was beginning to do that when he took off his ring.

Kazui getting voted guilty means that we don't really care about their true self and their feelings, only their actions matter. None of their circumstances matter. (Hey, reduction of punishment by extenuating circumstances? What in the world, how did you get in here I thought that was only a Yuno thing)

Yuno is trying to show that she wants to be seen as her true self and we're forcing this man to continue lying.

So, guess what? Yuno probably won't show her true self if we're failing to even let someone be honest and vote based on their true self.

Yuno wants to be seen for who she is. And, it seems like we have an odd aversion to that.

So, Yuno will never find the warmth that will allow her to be true, to be herself. Hey, maybe she could die trying to be herself, who knows?

All we know is that we're deciding if someone's true self is worth seeing.

Judging by the current votes and what our judgments are based upon, Yuno will never be able to be herself. We have decided that it's not worth seeing anyway.

#I apologize if this is so confusing it's literally 2 am ad i finished typing this up #i am unwell abojt these two #places hand on wl #thanm you for asking me to talk about this though i am unwrel.abojt them #mug theorizes #milgram #mukuhara kazui #kazui mukuhara #kashiki yuno #yuno kashiki

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pardi-real · 3 months

Text

Honeymoon Knight / Chapter 2 - Memories of Velis

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[Water City Velis]

~ Later ~

In front of us, there's a white sandy beach and... a crystal-clear sea stretching out. The pleasant sea breeze and the sound of waves seemed to welcome us.

Muu: "Wow! The sea really is cool and feels great!"

Lucas: "Fufu, Muu, it looks like you're having a blast."

> "He seems to have a lot of fun at the beach"

Watching Muu play in the sea from the shade of the trees are me and the butlers from the third floor.

Lamli: "Buu looks like he's having a good time... I wanna go into the sea too..."

Nac: "Lamli, you've said that just a while ago. Give it up already. Even though we're taking the turn to rest in Velis... in case of an emergency, we must join immediately."

Lamli: "I know that without you telling me! You're such a pain... Besides… we need to be on standby for emergencies, but... in this heat... Wearing these clothes while waiting is... It's just weird!"

Lucas: "I agree with Lamli on that... It's an order from above, so we can't do much about it. It's only June, so the temperature isn't that high, but... Velis does have strong sunlight."

> "Lamli, are you okay?"

Lamli: "Thanks for worrying! My lord! I'm fine for now since I'm using a parasol!"

Trudge… trudge… trudge… *marching on sand*

Muu: "Ehehe… Everyone, I'm back!"

> "Welcome back, Muu."

Muu: “...Sneeze!”

Lucas: "Oops... Was the water a bit cold?"

Nac: "It would be a problem if you caught a cold. Muu, please use this towel. After drying yourself, let's brush your fur with this brush. And this outfit that Flure made... Let's put it on elegantly.”

Muu: “Yes, Mr. Nac!"

Rustle… rustle…

Muu: "Phew~...! Thank you very much!"

Nac: "Yes! You're done changing."

> "You're well-prepared, Nac"

Nac: "Fufu, as a butler, I'm always prepared. I equip myself for diverse situations to ensure a prompt response. This level of readiness is simply part of my role as your butler."

Lamli: "I get what he's saying, but... Nac's way of saying it is annoying."

Nac: "Did you say something, Lamli?"

Lucas: "Alright, both of you. Stop, stop. We have a whole day to spend freely with the lord... Is it okay to spoil it with such a trivial argument?"

Lamli: "Ugh... well..."

Lucas: "We can freely act in Velis only for today. Tomorrow, we'll depart for a different city and have to return to escorting nobles. So, I think we should cherish this time. How about you two?"

Nac: "That's right. It's as Mr. Lucas said. My lord, excuse our rudeness."

Lamli: "I'm sorry, my lord.”

> “It's fine” > “Don't mind it”

Lamli: "My lord! Today, we're going to make sure you have a great time! Let's create the best memories together!"

> “Okay�� > "Looking forward to it"

Lucas: "Well then, my lord. Let's stroll through the streets of Velis."

And so, we left the sea behind and headed towards the city.

[Water City Velis, East Area]

After walking for a while, we found ourselves in the eastern area of Velis. Velis is divided into four areas, and the east is known for having many restaurants and places to eat.

Muu: "We've been to this place before, right, my lord?"

> "Yes, indeed"

Lucas: "Come to think of it... The last time we came to Velis was last summer. We were assigned to guard the festival... The three of us on the third floor were in charge of this eastern area."

Nac: "It brings back memories. It's almost a year since that request."

Lamli: "Seriously... time flies. Especially since the lord arrived… The days seem to pass by incredibly quickly."

Nac: "Indeed. I feel the same way. The time spent with the lord is intense, and full of happiness, …. Fufu… probably because there's always a sense of new excitement and discovery with them."

> "Do you think so?"

Nac: "Yes... I'm sure the other butlers share this sentiment as well."

Lucas: "Fufu... Yeah, that's right."

> "Thank you. I feel the same way too"

Lamli: "But really! Thank you for giving us such happy and fulfilling days!"

Muu: "Fufufu ♪ The relationship between us butlers and the lord is really good! I suddenly wondered, though... Is the relationship between other nobles and their butlers like this too?"

Lucas: "Hmm, I doubt it. Our relationship with the lord is quite a unique case."

> (That's true...) > “I see”

Lucas: "During last year's June Bride, we even took wedding photos together. Well, I was the one who suggested it, though."

> “Yeah that happened” > "Normally, butlers don't take wedding photos with their lord, right?"

Lamli: "That photo session… was so much fun. I'd like to do it again~"

Nac: "Fufu... looking back... We've done various things with the lord. For example, here in Velis... We made an original tropical juice for the lord."

Muu: "I remember! It was a large glass of juice, right?"

Nac: "Yes. It was prepared with the concept of 'Something suitable for the lord who has a heart as vast as the sea'."

> "How nostalgic"

Lamli: "And then...! We also gazed at the stars with the lord! Lying on the beach at night… We spent the best night looking up at the Velis night sky!"

Lucas: “We took turns lying down between the three of us… We lay next to the lord, looking up at the stars. I actually planned to offer a lap pillow to the lord… but the lord was nervous and refused.”

> "Of course I would be nervous hearing such an offer…!"

Muu: "A lap pillow for the lord... That's not something you'd see in the relationships between other lords and butlers…"

Nac: "Not zero, but I'd say it's almost none."

Lamli: "Stop talking about what other butlers do, Buu! We are who we are. Don't worry about unnecessary things; we just need to focus on making our lord happy!"

Muu: "It looks like Mr. Lamli and the others are also having fun, though..."

Lamli: “E-errr..."

Nac: "Muu makes sharp remarks from time to time, doesn't he?"

Lucas: “Fufu... But you see, Muu... We're not forcing the lord to do any of it. Surely, a kind and open-minded lord like them… wants to bring us joy… By creating enjoyable moments that just skirt the boundaries of our roles as butlers… I believe that's what they're aiming for. Right, my lord?

> (Answering this question feels a bit embarrassing...)

I quietly nodded, feeling a bit nervous.

Muu: "I see! Fufufu. The relationship between the lord and the butlers is really good! It's so wonderful!"

Lucas: "Giving lap pillows for the lord..."

Nac: "Hm? Did you say something, Mr. Lucas?"

Lucas: "Uh-uh, it's nothing. Now then, my lord. While reminiscing about these nostalgic memories… Shall we walk a bit more through the city?"

> “Yes” > "Let's do that"

And so… we continued to explore the city of Velis while sharing memories.

note: I forgot it's called Venice in English. Could've written it as Velice. Idk if there is any official English spelling for the places, so please let me know if there is.

And just to clarify, the "Uh-uh" is not a stutter. It's like the negative version of "Uh-huh".

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#*aknk #Honeymoon knight

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weather-cluddy · 11 months

Text

Man, today's question really reminded of how little interest Shidou seems to have in Amane as a person. He says he's frustrated that he doesn't have the time to "do something" about her, but even when she approached him, he didn't even try to reason with her or comfort her.

She tries to warn him that he's committing an unforgivable sin that will damn everybody, he's just like "Now, what could you be talking abooout? Anyways, just stop worrying about it and help me, okay?". And when she insists, his reply is "Ok, wow, you're so spoiled. Your parents must've been real soft on you until now, but that's not gonna fly with me, alright? I'm a responsible adult, I'm going to ignore you no matter how much of a brat you are"

He just dismissed Amane's very obvious mental breakdown as a mere temper tantrum, presuming that Amane doesn't truly care about anything she's espousing and that she's just trying to test boundaries. May I also point out how Shidou makes zero mention of Amane in his voice drama, either as a threat or as somebody who, like Fuuta and Mahiru, is in a precarious mental state?

And that casts a really different light on what "having the other adults deal with Amane" is supposed to mean. Is it really about making her more able to cope with the situation? Or just getting her out of the way? If it's about helping her, why does it matter so much that the adults do it?

Say, Muu and Haruka are in the best physical and mental shape out of everybody, and they have plenty of free time. Since Haruka says they're "sticking close" to Shidou, why doesn't he take a moment to suggest they should try to spend a little time with her, make her feel a bit better? Even if they can't convince her to change her mind, it'd at least useful to know in more detail what she's planning, right? After all, Shidou is willing to put his utmost ideal (dying to atone for his sins) on hold for the sake of the injured prisoners. Surely he must be very concerned about anything that could threaten their care, right?

Even if you take is as meaning "Well, the adults have the duty to care for the younger ones, so everyone under eighteen is exempt for responsibility", it's kind of really weird to put all the responsibility on three people having their own mental and physical breakdowns (Mahiru, Mikoto and Fuuta), one guy who said re:Amane that "we can't worry about that now" and "We'll just wait until the situation changes" last time Shidou spoke to him, and who's carrying the weight of being the only line of defense against Kotoko (Kazui) and one woman who's already taking mental care of Mahiru and also doesn't seem to want to have anything to do with anyone else (Yuno). Does a few years of age really give you that much more capability, such that it outweighs everything else going on?

So the fact that Shidou takes the trouble of specifying that an adult ought to help Amane really sounds like he's, at best, blinded by ideology. Only adults can help Amane because only adults are capable of taking meaningful action on anything, and only they have real ideological commitments that can beat a child's silly whims. At worst, Shidou is annoyed that Amane is threatening his worldview of "adults act, children obey", so he wants somebody to step in and bring her back into line. Of course, that person has to be an adult if they're to truly reinforce his perspective instead of opening a different kind of hole into it.

And this is hardly the first time he dismisses a child's thoughts on the basis of their age. In Molech, when Es tells him to treat them with respect as the warden, Shidou's answer is essentially "But we DO have a big age difference, so everything else is irrelevant. Let me pat your head to show how much I pity you, total stranger who's already annoyed at me for being condescending". At this point, either Shidou is being deliberately obnoxious or he's so thoroughly drunk his own kool-aid that it doesn't even register on the shallowest level when a kid tells him not to do something. Kids just go agoo-goo until they hit eighteen, yeah? No need to listen to their babbling.

And it's not just Shidou treating Es as both warden and child, he doesn't seem to have any respect for their ability to form their own opinion as a warden either. He literally goes "Hey, why go through the trouble of actually looking at evidence? Just take me at my word, way easier and faster". Even though by this point it's also obvious how much pride Es takes on being the guard and carrying out Milgram's mission, and that they don't necessarily trust Shidou. Again, either mockery or a frightful failure of basic pattern-recognition when the pattern doesn't match what Shidou expects from a child.

And to tie this back to Shidou's "my heart goes out to you" comment, sure, he's so concerned about any mental toll being the warden might take on Es… But he's still insisting on being murdered by them. Why? Surely Shidou of all people would know that murder can be hard on the killer. And if he wanted to die so badly, surely he can wait until Milgram is over and kill himself then, right? No need to make it Es' responsibility.

One of his last lines in the VD is "I feel sorry that you had to be given this role. And, I truly apologise for being so insistent about sentencing me to death as well… But, you’re perfect. You’ll give me the ending I’m most suited for." So apparently the thing is that being murdered by a child, specifically, would be very satisfying to Shidou, and Es' pain is secondary to that.

Kinda undermines all that talk about how tragic the situation is, doesn't it? In one of the app conversations, we see him being overwhelmed by sadness while grading Amane's homework, and he says "If everything about MILGRAM is true… why did a child like you have to become a murderer? Just imagining what sort of circumstances must have led to that, it makes me so sad…". But apparently his sadness isn't so strong that it'll stop him from setting up that sort of circumstances.

The only way this makes sense to me if it's he's subsumed Es' choices into his own so utterly that he can't imagine anybody, not even Es, could possibly hold them responsible if they did kill Shidou. It was simply suicide with Es acting as a tool for it, no more guilty than a bullet. I'm sure you can see how utterly dismissive this is of Es' autonomy.

TL;DR: I'm sure Shidou loves the idea of children, but so far he's been severely lacking in empathy for actual children when they deviate from his concept of how they ought to be or when their wellbeing comes in conflict with his ideals.

#The Minigram comic about Shidou trying to make Amane break her dietary vows also makes his priorities look highly questionable #but Minigram is not really canon so I'm willing to give it a pass. I don't think the app version of events is all that bad on its own.#Anyways this is why I hate it every time somebody goes “Shidou should adopt Amane!”#Not only does that utterly ignore Amane's thoughts in favor of “Well she'll change her mind once she sees how nice life is outside her cult #But also Shidou has shown zero interest or ability to actually help or understand Amane in any way #Also I should clarify that I don't think Haruka+Muu or even Shidou could cleanly solve eveything with Amane if they just tried #but Shidou's total lack of trying really rankles all the same.#milgram #long post

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1moremilgram-enjoyer · 5 months

Text

Deep Cover and YONAH spoilers!

First impressions time! (Looking at this translation for Deep Cover, this one for YONAH). Btw I actually haven't listened to Deep Cover yet because it's not out in my time-zone rip.

Add plagiarism to the list of crimes committed by Milgram prisoners lol. I actually love the Undercover callback it's fantastic! And the diss track? Eminem got nothing on wolf girl over here.

But this does raise the question of how much she actually knows about the murders. Like, she talks about very specific things such as Shidou being a "priceless stealer", so she has to know something. I saw someone bring up she may have been spying on all the interrogations, and I have to assume that's the case because how else would that happen.

I'm really interested in the fact Kotoko seems to want everyone to be Unforgiven, though.

Which one do you pick? I want unforgiven

And the fact at the end she lists all the T1 innos and insults them, as if she wants them to be Unforgiven too. Like, I get it, she enjoys feeling like she's dealing out justice, but what. I hope the MV clarifies a bit more because right now she just sounds unhinged. Which is fun! I like characters who are just unrepentantly evil. But I get the feeling there's something more going on. We already know some of her motivations from HARROW, but you have to wonder if they've evolved in some way during her time in Milgram.

Speaking of the MV, my prediction is not only that the other prisoners are gonna be there, which I have to assume will happen-

(Please show Amane as a monster please show Amane as a monster please show Amane as a monster)

-Ehem. Apologies. I don't know what possessed me there for a moment.

You wanna know the wildest prediction I have for the MV? (Which is most likely going to be wrong don't get too excited) It think every prisoner's crime will be related to one of the crimes we saw in HARROW, and perhaps others we'll get introduced to in Deep Cover.

Shidou: “UNDER” Unsalvagable Priceless stealer.

Probably the guy that stole a bunch of luxury bikes, since it fits the idea of stealing from a lot of people.

Kazui: “UNDER” I stay hidden, fake prosperity and greed.

Either Mikio Oshii (the guy from the alleway), who pretended to be a bank employee to steal money, or the "It's me" scammers, who called people, pretended to be a family member and asked for money.

Fuuta: You’re being a jerk. You’re being a jerk.

Either the "It's me" scams, or the guy who took upskirt photos, because they're connected to phones.

Haruka: “UNDER” It’s a stupid dependency. Muu: “UNDER” Unchanging. A spinning queen’s game. Mahiru: I still like you though, still like you, it’s difficult.

One of these would be the paper bag robbery done by two people. I don't know about this one, but I think it kinda works.

Mikoto: I really don’t remember, I really don’t, it’s so bad.

It could be the guy who took upskirt photos since he said he did it because of stress from work, but knowing Kotoko, I wouldn't be surprised if she connects him and John to the serial killer in the white hoodie. She does not like them.

I'm not sure about the rest of them. Again, that's just a silly prediction, I'm not expecting it to happen, I'm just putting it out there because if it does happen I will feel like a God lol.

About YONAH, I'm slightly disappointed we didn't get much about Kotoko herself, but it's still really good! I think it's fun that she sorta encouraged Es to Forgive at the end of TASK and now she's like "yo your weak-ass needs to stop forgiving people."

But I do want to say, I'm surprised at the amount of people who are shocked Kotoko wanted to attack Amane. Like, we even had that one timeline conversation when she said she wouldn't treat Amane differently just because she's a child. I thought we had an universal understanding that the only reason Amane wasn't attacked is because of the Kazui ceasefire and John's time-wasting fight (and out of universe, because we can't have a character dying in T1). I guess I was wrong though. Anyways, Worst Girl enjoyers are rejoicing right now. Not gonna lie, this is making me like Kotoko more and more by the second. I don't know what that says about me.

Anyways, what do you think Kotoko's percentage will look like on the day the voting opens? Not her verdict since... well. Like, I was always expecting her to Guilty sweep, but what we have so far doesn't really help her. I would not be surprised if she ends up easily beating Muu as the widest Guilty margin. Hell, do you think it can beat Shidou as the most decisive verdict in general? I think it's unlikely, since Shidou got nearly 82% inno this trial which is insane. But honestly, unless Deep Cover MV does some insane leg-work, Kotoko might get more than 82% Guilty. I think it'd be funny.

Not like I'm gonna stop it. Sorry inno truthers, I highly respect your commitment to wolf girl and fully respect the decision, but I feel like Not Forgiving her this trial would be for the best. Still, I'm open to having my mind change when the MV drops. Take care!

#milgram #kotoko yuzuhira #deep cover spoilers #yonah spoilers #milgram spoilers #kotoko yuzuhira spoilers

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purgemarchlockdown · 5 months

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Hm...thinking about the Narrative Order in which everyone is introduced in Milgram. This is very speculative, I'm just considering how everything unfolded and how everyone builds off each other.

01- Starting with Haruka Just Makes Sense, his story is quite similar to a lot of common sympathetic murderers in fiction. A troubled kid in an abusive household who murdered animals. It's a good baseline for introducing the audience into Milgram and helps the conflict feel a lot simpler than it actually is. Haruka is Easy to Forgive, he's pitiful and shy. He won't hurt anyone else.

02- Continuing to Yuno also makes sense. Yuno's story is vague enough that it's easy to interpret as sadder than it actually is. Making it easier to sympathize (project) onto her. Plus Yuno as a character is charming and likable.

But Yuno also challenges the audience in her VD a bit:

"That’s right. You know those people who just wanna convince themselves, so they intrude in other people’s affairs even though it’s not their place—I despise them."

It's an easy forgiven but we're already alluding to some greater themes here.

03- Fuuta is a Great Choice to insert after these two. After two more-or-less easy forgiven prisoners, we have a guy whose rude, ill-tempered, and unwilling to admit fault for his behavior. It really makes sense that Fuuta would get a not forgiven verdict since he comes after two of the most sympathetic characters in T1. But he also challenges the audience even more since Fuuta is parallel to them and introduces some more fun themes about justice and righteousness.

04- And it makes even more sense that Muu got forgiven because she just came after ill-Tempered Mcgee here! Fuuta is set up to fail and Muu is set up to win in a way. Muu is pitiful, shy and similar to Haruka. And since she's coming right after Fuuta, those traits contrast with him. Even though there's a lot of hints in both her VD and her MV to Muu's more manipulative and callous behavior.

05- While everyone else's stories seemed (Highlight: Seemed) straightforward. Shidou's is vague, confusing and is alluding to him killing A Lot of people. Yet Shidou is affable and "kind" in the VD and seems grief-stricken and remorseful in Throw Down. I would joke about how Shidou is divided like this and how he's 05 but I don't know how to set that up. My point is he basically introduces more ambiguity and confusion to what Seemed to be a simple job before him.

06- Mahiru is interesting since people more or less ran based off a interpretation that had very little proof outside of Psychogram. I'd imagine that her placement in the lineup is to continue the increasing ambiguity in the character's stories and the dissonance between the personality and the actions they committed. Mahiru is so sweet and lovesick and her MV reflects that, yet we know Something Happened under all of this sweet fluff. We just don't know exactly What and Ai nan desu yo doesn't really make it Clear. And Mahiru seems so nice...she wouldn't of hurt him for no reason, would she?

07- Then Kazui comes in and makes things Even Worse. This job being simple? Completely throw that idea out of the window. What the hell happened in Half? What's going on with the lady? Did he cheat on his wife? Did he not? It doesn't seem like her directly murdered his wife what's up with that? You know he's lying, he told you in the VD so what is he lying About? Is he actually as tired and resigned as her presents himself in his VD? Is he scheming? You Don't Know and Es Does Not Know.

08- Amane's MV isn't really ambiguous, its highly symbolic yes, but it's easy to put together (Mostly) what's going on. Compared to Throw Down or Half. But her verdict is probably one of the farthest from simple in the series. Amane seemingly has the same stock sympathetic murderers backstory that Haruka does. An troubled kid in an abusive household. But since Amane personality is not traditionally sympathetic and her motives seem more threatening and dangerous, she's more easy to punish than Haruka is. But also...you'll be punishing an abused child. It's not easy.

09-010: these two are being put together for one reason: They Seem Simple. MeMe leans so Hard into the serial killer and evil alter idea and Harrow leans so Hard into the vigilante for justice idea that they Feel Simple. Mikoto jumps Es, Kotoko helps out Es. After Shidou, Mahiru, Kazui and Especially Amane. Having two characters whose stories seem Simple is reliving. Mikoto is Obviously like that and Kotoko is Obviously Like this. It's easy, it's real easy. Comforting even.

And then T2 starts and Everything goes to Shit as you realize that NO everyone is way more complicated than you initially thought and your all Fucked.

#im just thinking about it #milgram thoughts #cw child abuse #mentioned

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seariii · 4 months

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Seeing a few people hating on Kotoko, and seeing their reasonings makes me think...

How some take others actions without much care about what is behind it, or even when they see what is behind the action, it's just on a superficial level...

I guess it really translates to what my friend said about "to everyone else it's OBVIOUS that your action makes you an asshole, but you yourself don't see it, and no one cares to explain it to you"... I'm not justifying her words or actions in any way, it's just...

In real life we act a certain way, and we see mean people who we dislike for a reason or another... 2 years ago, I had to work with someone who was a total asshole. Everyone hated him, except his girlfriend, who was my friend. She went on and on about how he was a sweetheart and so nice to her... He ended up cheating on her and hurting her deeply, she ended up hating him just like everyone else, despite everyone's warnings...

There are people who by my standards I'd consider "bad" which is a subjective term... I still don't believe Kotoko is a bad person, but I believe she has done terrible things... Encouraging Haruka like that, is almost like Muu not doing anything to stop him... I don't think he has "a higher chance of doing it" because of her words, I believe he had already decided and the moment he talked to her about it it was just to further set it in stone

She believes Haruka is a sinner so punishment shall be brought

Just like Amane did to her mother

Just like Fuuta did to that highschooler

Just like Kotoko herself did to that serial killer

... and just like Kotoko did to the guilty prisoners

She is cleaning the world in her own eyes... After tsumi pointed out to me how radicalization mirrors (or is basically a variant of) cult indoctrination, I can't stop thinking about even more parallels about Amane and Kotoko....

someone said how Kotoko is basically a window of the future of Amane if she isn't helped, and I can see it even more clearly now...

I don't know, I wish there was something that could be done - she says, as if these were real people and not fictional characters on a story

#milgram thoughts #i dont wanna main tag this #also im sorry its my savior complex acting up milgram does that to me #'i have to do something' sit down girl and chill you don't *have to* do anything #sorry i'm just rambling #im not even sure what i was trying to say

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angyo · 4 months

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It's funny there seems to be people who think that Muu is a makima-esque master manipulator based on the information we have. Bro have you see her trying to manipulate? Her most effective move is just crying but half the time that one just feels unintentional. When it's up to her to actually use her charisma she blunders so hard. Sure she can read people very well, but her best attempt at getting her way when someone isn't laying down for her is to just say the information she has as if just saying it is how it goes.

Sure cliques are gonna be filled with blunt passive aggressive assholes, but she also doesn't seem to distinguish friend from foe and cliques don't generally like when people can't play the mind games. It may be me projecting a bit, but she seems to picture relationships as a little bit TOO transactional, her sheer inflexibility feels a bit autistic. She's got a script and she freaks out when people go off of it.

No fucking way she got those friends through sheer charisma, I'm betting they were all just sucking up to the rich kid for cash. Meaning that whatever dirt rei had on her, it managed to turn people who had already decided to put up with the rich girl. I'm leaning toward at least some of it being gay shit, like even if muu doesn't realize it she pedestalizes rei a lot for someone who thinks their revenge was justified.

But if it was just rei giving proof of muu liking girls I'd think the bullying would be more directly homophobic, so she probably had a few kinds of dirt on her.

She also seems dangerously out of touch with her emotions, while also being out of touch with other people's. People say her mvs are just straightforward but they seem to be affected by her inner turmoil she doesn't wanna think about. It's hard to verbalize but the words she says often contrast the video. In after pain she has a lot more doubt, while still not accepting any fault she thinks about it despite the info we get being the bullying she endured. Then in inmf, she sounds so sure of everything while also imagining herself as an insect and her victim as normal. She is not as confident as she tries to seem

Really she just seems like a teen who's been allowed or even encouraged to stay emotionally immature getting herself into something she can't escape. Yeah she did all that mean shit, but she also got sucked into the cycle. She shouldn't have killed rei but she was clearly losing it. Murder wasn't justified but things happen in the heat of the moment, especially if you're completely emotionally unstable and in denial of it. She wasn't lying about having a clique but she also wasn't lying about feeling suicidal.

She and haruka are perfectly matched to bring out the worst in each other. Unfortunately for her ratings, she's got an offensive mental illness. probably one of those where it's like "bad person disorder: you are a terrible shitty person and it will never change. Also you're banned from 30 countries now :)". Which is also unfortunate for haruka since he's got self loathing issues, and while audiences handle those a little better it's not enough to overpower hating a self aggrandizing girl.

Hope someone stops him. For character development i think it'd be cool for muu to panic and do it, but idk if she's aware enough of her emotions to realize she'd miss him. Tbh also worried if they're gonna use haruka as a red herring, he's acting off enough to attract attention but muu also has a history of suicidality.

Prisoners not in the know are already getting suspicious of haruka, which best case means they catch him in time. If the writers wanna be cruel it also means muu can just decide to kill herself split second if the decision hurts enough and no one will suspect her

#angyo

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