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thoughts-on-bangtan · 3 years

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Memories of 2020 - Initial asks and a small discussion

*cracks knuckles* Here we go.

If any of you have spent any amount of time today on any ARMY sns platform, I’m sure you’ve seen the mess which, as seasoned ARMY, I can tell you was the exact same mess we see...every single time. I can’t particularly say I’m surprised by any of it, especially when watching the entire process, as in the first clips hitting the TL and then the rest slowly following suit like a flood building steadily as the hours went by.

From anon: be ready for insecure vminies 😂

I’m pleased to report it wasn’t actually as bad as I expected, though now that I’m typing this I probably jinxed my own luck and the flood of asks will come soon enough, but maybe not. I’m holding on to the latter.

Based on the cycle in which these things happen every time, as in that the first clips that hit the ARMY spaces are Xkook ones, followed by vmin and other ships, and lastly more OT7 content, I expected our asks to go haywire after that clip, you know which one I mean. But we’ve only gotten two (?) about it, kind of, so I guess most people understood that it was just for laughs and nothing serious that anyone would have to get insecure over.

From anon: Sigh. This is my first memories of bts as army and i'm already tired of how all of twitter seems to be about 1 j*/k*ok moment now. There were so many j*n/kook m*ments and hugs and a sweet h*pe/k*ok backhug moment and a good number of vmin moments including slow dancing so why is the focus always on that one ship?

Here’s the thing, maybe my TLs are just well curated, I don’t know, but on mine no one really focused on that moment? Even non-shipper OT7s just briefly had a chuckle and then moved along to other things, awww’ed at vmin moments, there was lots and lots of talk about J*nk*ok being super cute and there being so much content when it comes to their interactions, there was a lot of chatter about basically every duo and OT7 moment. I know ship specific spaces went nuts, Xkookers butting heads like their lives depend on it, but outside of them?

“All of twt” is an exaggeration and I know, believe me I do, that Xkookers have the ability to make it seem like everyone just cares about their moments because they themselves (the shippers) are loud and seemingly everywhere, but when you look past them, that isn’t the case. Shippers have a tendency to generalize, especially those who follow a lot of their fellow shippers, but when you step outside of shipper spaces, things look very differently.

Like anon said, though I’d like to preface this by saying that I haven’t seen the entirety of Memories of 2020 so I can only go by what I have seen though I’d say I’ve seen nearly everything that was posted on twt or at least as much as I could find (including Xkook things), there were a lot, and I mean a lot, of amazing moments between basically all the members, regardless of who your favorite duo might be, I’m sure there was something for you there. Even those who are supposedly a rarity. And even as vminnies, this time around we had a feast with so many amazing vmin moments, some funny ones, some random ones, some super cute ones, whatever you want, there is something there for you to find. And the same can be said about so many other duos, we even got Yoongi and Hobi FaceTiming each other, and Yoongi saying they look like a couple while looking at the pictures Hobi chose for the coffee truck he sent to Yoongi’s Daechwita MV filming set.

There’s one discussion I’d like to get out of the way below the cut, but after that I will have another post very, very soon in which I want us to just have some fun and look at vmin, namjin and the other moments because there is just so much to find. And this is just day one of people having the DVDs, these discussion will continue for a while because, like I mentioned before, Memories are a treasure trove for OT7 content and fun stuff, and there’s more than eleven hours worth of it to be watched, discovered and discussed.

But, okay, let’s get into that moment since anons wanted to talk about it and know my thoughts on it, so let’s do just that. And yes, other anon from a while ago, I remember you once mentioning how I shouldn’t talk about other ships and shouldn’t “debunk” them and their moments, though I’d hardly call this debunking, but as I said many times since our first post, I’m ARMY before I am a vminnie and namjinist, and our blog is called thoughts on Bangtan and, as far as I’m aware, both JK and Jimin are part of Bangtan, so I don’t see a reason why I can’t show my perspective on it and also voice my grievances with shippers when it comes to that moment. And, before anyone comes into our asks to yell at me for being toxic/problematic or only doing this to make my ship look better or whatever, no, that isn’t the point, like at all.

“Debunking” moments makes literally no difference whatsoever in the grand scheme of things and doesn’t affect reality, all I am doing is having a chat just like everyone else. I’m not even asking you to agree with me, you’re more than welcome not to, I can’t and won’t stop you. Also, just so you know, my initial reaction was just to laugh amused by it, no hard feelings, so I’m not the bad guy.

That being said...the Xkook moment.

Here’s the thing, when it first surfaced many hours ago, the moment itself was cut down to show just the moment of Jimin leaning close to JK and JK leaning back and turning his head away so his cheek faced Jimin...and cut, some even cutting off the video before JK turned his head. That’s it. People, as in shippers, freaked out, and everyone else had a good laugh and moved along to other things, even vminnies were joking about it and everything. I saw none of my fellow vminnies getting angry or insecure about it. Then, as time went by, someone else posted that scene but this time also showing the things leading up to it, so putting it into context instead of removing it. With the context suddenly the whole thing looked and felt completely differently since moments prior Jimin was pretending to stab JK with the pointy end of his mic and then acted as though to check if he was d*ad, as in the end of the scene. Turns out it was just for giggles and not some grand romantic moment in a room full of people and a camera close to their faces.

By that time, of course, those who cared most about that moment had long decided what meaning this holds and didn’t care once context was shown. Gifs and art had already been created, the yelling was loud, and the fights between Xkookers were reaching levels of toxicity I hadn’t seen in a while, which was disgusting and fucked up the say the least. But, the thing is, I don’t think the moment itself was the issue. In context and as rational ARMY you know it was just Jimin playing around with JK as they usually do, things we’ve also seen other members do in similar (though not quite like this) fashion, and after eight years since debut and nine of knowing each other, this isn’t shocking or new in any way. No, the issue were Xkookers and the way they treated this moment, some even going as far as taking screenshots and editing them to make it seem like they were about to kiss, as in they changed the placements of their heads to fit their narrative, as well as others making gifs where they play the moment backwards (leaving out the part where JK leans his head away and to the side) and thus they created their own version of the moment which was different from what had actually happened.

That is my biggest issue with this whole thing. The blatant manipulation of moments to create narratives that don’t match reality, twisting them and using them in stupid pointless fights. But imagine vminnies were to do any of that, all hell would break loose and we’d be attacked without mercy because how dare, and yet they don’t follow their own “logic” and “rules”. It’s more than okay to find any and all moments cute, we all do, to make jokes and whatnot, but twisting context, manipulating it and basically creating your own version of it goes too far.

Take what we are given as what it is, instead of what you want it to be.

So, now that that’s done, please fellow vminnies and ARMYs, don’t be insecure or let people ruin your mood and fun over it. It’s not worth it. Instead let’s check out and have a talk about some of the fun vmin and OT7 moments we got, along with other ones, including my reply to another anon when it comes to namjin. Of course what I will mention in the post (HERE) is basically just the tip of the iceberg since tumblr has a limit on pictures and everything, so just know there is so much more still left to see than just that.

Before I’ll go, for those who still feel a little insecure/doubtful/whatever else, while I was working on this post and the other one, another anon sent in this well timed vmin ask:

From anon: I have to say this as a Vmin supporter. Whatever is going on with Vmin we can rest assure what they is special/untouchable. They graduated HS & college together, going for Bachelors together. Jimin-ah I like you the most. I want to live with my lovely Taehyung for the rest if my life. Their future is together, friends/soulmates or more they said it. I won’t tear down other members closeness (good for them) their bonds don’t erase Vmins. I’m just happy with the moments Vmin allow us to see.

#answered ask

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rantceratops · 7 years

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Coldhearted

I fucking love this episode. With like, the white hot intensity of a thousand suns. Because the animation is fucking flawless and the snow looks beautiful and Wally is 100% amazing! This may in fact be my favorite episode, certainly within my top 5 fav episodes if I had to rate them. PREPARE YOUR ANUS FOR LOTS OF IMAGES BECAUSE 500% OF MY APPRECIATION FOR THIS EPISODE IS ALL THE ANIMATION PORN.

SNOW!

Oh so clever, Greg and co., hiding the first number on Wally’s alarm clock so that is simply reads “16″ on his 16th birthday in a show where the number 16 is a constant theme. I’M ON TO YOU.

You ever notice how Wally has a poster of a female with really long blonde hair on his bedroom wall? Like we all know he’s just being a horndog teenaged boy, but like... GOT A THING FOR LONG BLONDE HAIR OR SOMETHING, WALLY?

Things confirming Wally is a huge nerd: lots of dorky looking action figures, a model rocket ship, a Flash poster, a microscope and lots and lots of books (probably of the science variety... and comics, no doubt), poster of some boxer dude, a poster for some horror movie called Day of Dark, and a piece of art I’ve seen on Jerome K. Moore’s deviantart of Wally, Barry, and Jay in their Flash get-ups. How cute! Also a poster or something that just looks like a pair of shoes on someone’s feet??? Idk about that one, it’s pretty dark. (I would take screenshots but sadly blu-ray format prevents me from doing so, and I don’t already have one saved in my extensive library of screens)

Look at this cutie weirdo singing to himself and doing a little dance in bed

HOW THE FUCK DO THEY AFFORD TO FEED HIS ASS?

“You want surprise just watch Miss Martian’s expression when I collect my birthday kiss!” (keep making yourself think that Megan is the one you really want to kiss, Wally. Like, for real.)

Wally, I don’t want to alarm you, but your dad is definitely Amon from Legend of Korra!

Damn, Mary sure is good, turning on the TV at the exact moment that Iris got to Wally’s birthday wish in her broadcast.

“Spisak Jr. High” And a nice shout out to the voice of our very own Wally West, Mr. Jason Spisak! <3

“Sure would be a shame if I missed my own--” “Surprise!”

“Say Whaaaaaaaat, oh you guys, you shouldn’t have!” What a fucking little shit.

A little shit with the best facial expressions though, amiright?

Okay. Time to stop being silly for a moment as we approach the part that many people have a problem with. This is the part where I crack my knuckles and have a differing opinion than most.

So here we have Wally’s birthday party, and him hinting around that he wants a birthday kiss from Miss M. It’s obvious that’s what he’s wheedling for, anyone with a pair of eyes can see that. And Artemis, who happens to have a pair of perfectly functioning eyes (arguably better than most, considering some of the amazeballs shots she’s made) happens to be standing right next to the little duo as the first exchange happens.

Artemis gets understandably annoyed and, of course, jealous. That’s her crush (that she’s been trying to forget about, but that’s been a huge no-go because it turns out the crush of her crush is dating her fallback crush… this is getting confusing). Trying to get a kiss from another girl. Of course she’s jealous.

I fucking would be, too. It’s a completely natural reaction. Artemis would never, ever admit it even over her dead body, but she wishes she was the one he was wanting a kiss from so bad.

Anyway, even Miss M guesses what he wants, and she decides to give him a kiss on the forehead because she’s his friend and nothing more. Artemis gets some obvious satisfaction from this. Is it petty? Well, yeah, but who ever said jealousy wasn’t petty? We’ve all been in that kind of position, be it with a crush or something else entirely, where something happens that ruins something for someone else and you just can’t help but feel completely fucking smug/happy about it even though you know you’re being an awful person for doing so.

Artemis is glad he gets denied because it means he’s not kissing a girl that isn’t her, and perhaps to another end, she’s smug about it because that means he’s getting denied his crush in the same way she was denied her fallback crush. Like, she knows Megan and Conner are a thing, and she already lost any chance at forgetting Wally via Conner, and now Wally is blatantly being denied his crush on Megan, so Artemis is basically taking huge, huge petty pleasure in him basically getting denied the same thing as her. They both have crushes on two people that are already in a relationship together, and if Artemis has to wake up and smell the coffee about it, then Wally is going to, too.

Is our girl Artemis being petty? Hell yes she is! And that just makes me love her more, because she’s a multi-faceted human being with emotions. Is she reacting in a bad way to said emotions? Yes! But this is all sort of in the same vein that Wally and Artemis meet each other in, where Wally’s bad reaction leads to a bad reaction on Artemis’s part, and then the two of them suffer the belligerent relationship that they do all season because of it. Artemis and Wally are both very raw people.

FUN TIME BREAK: “I know this is all very new and intimidating, but I promise you, someday, you’ll get used to watching Wally eat.”

So majestic!

Back to for serious: Artemis walks up to Dick and Zee and is like “Think we should tell him?”

Look at that devious face, my god Artemis you amazing spiteful thing, you!

“He is the only one who doesn’t know.” “Then, please, allow me.”

Artemis wants to burst his bubble the same way hers was burst. It is, without a doubt, 100% petty and horrible and born of jealousy, I’m not denying that. But it does NOT make me want to throw Artemis under the bus or act like she’s a horrible gargoyle or that she’s a bitch or what the fuck ever. It just makes me more interested in her motivations for this moment, it just makes me want to understand every catalyst that leads to this moment, the frustration. In Secrets, Artemis was mad and angry and mildly hurt because Conner is taken, Wally doesn’t want her, and now she’s stuck with her stupid feelings for a guy that she thinks is unobtainable, and I can understand how said feelings creeping back so unbidden into one’s mind with no other place to channel them would drive them to be spiteful about it when the opportunity arises.

I also just want to remind everyone that Wally and Artemis are 15 year old teenagers (well, 16 in Wally’s case as of this episode, but still). They are teenagers with charged emotions about fucking everything, especially when it comes to matters of the heart. They are not the mature adults they grow into slowly over the five year gap. They’re mature for teenagers in a lot of aspects, sure, with the kind of jobs they have they have to be. But they are still young and learning how to deal with certain kinds of emotions and situations. So to an extent some leniency needs to be given when they act like this. I’m not saying to entirely excuse it, rather just understand it and why and what have you.

Anyway, by the time Coldhearted rolls around, Artemis has been stuck with her Wally feelings again for however long the gap is between Secrets and Coldhearted, and she’s had enough of seeing Wally pine after unobtainable Megan in the same way she was pining over unobtainable Conner. So she’s like, fuck it, I’m telling him.

And she does. With much obvious pleasure.

And on his birthday, no less. That seems to be the major act of heinousness that people can’t seem to get past when it comes to this scene in particular, is that it was on Wally’s birthday. His celebratory 16th birthday where everything should be happy fun time and all that jazz. It’s really hard for me to be bothered about it being on his birthday when it’s so obvious that Wally’s not even all that shocked or hurt about finding out. In fact, I’m convinced that both Artemis and Wally subconsciously knew that Megan and Conner were not interested in them/were taken long before they were actually privy to open evidence of it. They were just fooling themselves because they’re too afraid of owning up to the ways they feel for each other. In both cases, Conner and Megan were fallback/distraction crushes, and never anything more.

Wally literally does not fucking care after expressing his dejected “Oh maaaaan!” after Artemis informs him of the lovebirds. That’s it. That is literally it. Not once in the time we are privy to Wally’s innermost thoughts does he mention anything about Megan and Conner, or even Artemis. His concerns are all for the big League/Team team-up and later on for Perdita. Wally only had something that he subconsciously knew all along confirmed to him, and it fucking sucked, but that’s it. For the rest of the episode and every episode after, Wally has already moved on.

In fact, by Insecurity he has sufficiently matured from the events of Coldhearted and finally decides to “man up” for lack of a better phrase, and actually accept and try pursuing his feelings for Artemis. Pursue them in a real way, not in the exaggerated, ego-driven flirting way that he does with Megan. But in a very real, I’m-really-really-interested-in-this-girl kind of way; the fallback, safe distraction of Megan has been removed, allowing Wally to focus on how he really feels for Artemis.

In fact, I’ll just let Greg’s Spitfire rant speak for me on this one, as he puts it the best:

“Plus, let’s not forget the double-whammy of “Failsafe” and “Disordered”. Here we reveal just how intensely Wally feels for Artemis, and just how much interest each has in the other. The trick is that neither is prepared to take a risk. Rejection from Superboy (such as it was) is nothing compared to the fear Artemis has over being rejected by Wally.

Wally meanwhile is afraid to admit his strong feelings for Artemis, so maintains focus on the safer Miss Martian. Artemis does the same toward Superboy. Both then have to be disabused of the nothing that their crushes are viable. I tend to think that deep down, the revelation about Conner and M’gann’s relationship was less of a shock to each than it seemed. They didn’t want to admit to themselves what they were probably sensing deep down. One reason for Artemis’s extreme reaction to the knowledge, I think, is that she was trying SO hard to think that Superboy was a possibility BECAUSE Wally clearly seemed NOT to be, and so she wanted to having something she could use to push Wally out of her mind.

So in “Coldhearted”, Wally learns some big lessons. Miss Martian is out of the picture-- and that helps to clear his mind. But mostly, he matures solidly in the episode. Now he’s ready to behave differently. [...]”

Part of this is going to wind up leading me into a rant that’s better saved for when I get to Insecurity, though, so I’ll just go ahead and wrap this up.

Basically, I agree that Artemis was being petty and spiteful. She was jealous, I expect nothing less from her. But that just makes her a more amazing character, because truly amazing characters are not flawless, they are human beings with many different emotions and many different reactions and ways of dealing with things. They do not always respond to things in the “right” way.

I’m also inclined to say that someone needed to pull Wally’s head out of his ass at some point regardless, btw. Artemis, in being spiteful, also did him a favor. Not with any kind of just intentions, perhaps, but… anyway.

Long story short: I like this moment, it doesn’t both me, it just makes me enjoy Artemis’s character even more, and it certainly doesn’t warrant her being demonized or thrown under a bus. Nobody is perfect, Artemis is not perfect.

Moving on. I know the vast majority of you will disagree with my assessments, but whatever, let’s both just move on because you won’t change my mind and I obviously won’t change yours.

Leave it to Batman to really crash a party, AMIRIGHT?

“Can’t the Watchtower just blast them out of the sky or something?” “What’s a Watchtower?” *DEEP SIGH FROM BATMAN* Goddamnit Wally you can’t just go around saying shit like that you little shit.

Oh my god they’re all a bunch of little dorks, all excited about a Team/League team-up.

Have I mentioned how much I love their polar stealth and wish it had popped up in more than just two episodes? Like, they’re all so adorable!

“Now that’s a birthday wish come true!”

“Uuuuh, Batman? I think youuuu skipped…” “Kid Flash.”

“A girl in Seattle is in desperate need of a heart transplant.”

Oh Wally, Wally, get your priorities straight, dude. :( That’s what I love about this episode though, he grows up in so many ways and it’s really nice to see him have such a major shift in what his real priorities in life are.

“Who is this girl!?” “Does it matter?” (I almost wrote a fanfic once in which it was an AU, where Artemis was the girl that needed the heart transplant and Wally was delivering it to her. I still wouldn’t mind visiting the idea, I never really did get it quite off the ground but it has potential)

“Speedy delivery boy, at your service…”

Ugh, Wally. It’s like… such a burden to him at first. He’s so much more upset about missing out on the League-Team team up that he files this mission away in his mind as a chore, an errand run, something on the side that he’s being forced into and it’s going to make him miss out on all the fun on his birthday. It’s sad to see him think that way, but by the end of it, it’s a very proud moment to see him having realized that delivering that heart was the best thing he’d done that day, the best way he could have spent his birthday, something he can feel proud of. I FUCKING LOVE WALLY AND I LOVE THIS EPISODE, OKAY?

(Also just pointing out that Wally’s reacting way more negatively to delivering this heart than he remotely acted to finding out M’gann was taken. JUST SAYING. And that if Artemis is at fault for telling Wally about M’gann on his B-day, Wally is at fault for reacting so horribly about delivering a heart to someone that’s dying. They’re both only human though, and I love seeing them both like this. I’m just using this to reinforce my points)

MMM that snow! So beautiful! I remembered before this episode aired I had been desperately hoping there would be a YJ episode with either heavy snow or rain in at least a decent chunk of episode. For no other reason than I love snow and rain weather effects and how they can be used to really set up a scene. (not to mention one of my favorite episodes of Teen Titans, “Haunted”, took place almost entirely in a heavy rainfall setting, and I digged it)

So Wally runs from literally one end of the country to the other in what, under four hours?

Don’t expect half of this rewatch post to literally just be me posting screenshots for their beauty.

He’s so fucking nonchalant about the fact that he LITERALLY has someone’s life strapped to his back. Oh, Wally, my son. *sigh*

“As crystal, babe.” “Then go.” “Guess asking for her number’s pointless...” Oh yes, this is a guy who has clearly just had his romantic feelings completely crushed and shattered. He’ll be mourning for months! MONTHS I TELL YOU. ARTEMIS YOU MONSTER.

“Do you see him!?” “Nope.” “Did you see him!?” “Nnnope.” LOL

“I’m at max speed now, but if I really push it, I can dump this load, save the girl, and still get in on the action!” Oh my god, Wally... DUMP THIS LOAD? LIKE IT’S GARBAGE? I love him so much but UGH. WALLY PLEASE.

And the infamous scene where Kaldur steps on his king’s shoulders to get up in the air for an attack, lmao

Chicken Whizee’s sound like the most disgusting thing ever. Like, literally all I can think of is something gross milkshake with bits of chicken in it or something. *shudders*

Also, Wally, you cannot fucking pay for food with A HUMAN HEART, GOOD LORD.

South Dakota! Been there, seen that.

Go away, Vandal! (man Vandal is legit a scary ass villain in this cartoon, like damn. It scares me when he grabs Wally and shit, like, he could probably break him like a twig and it disturbs me)

Can we just appreciate the actual shock waves from Wally slamming into Vandal at maximum speed?

Wally’s such a fierce fucking fighter when he gets the chance. That’s why I love this episode so damn much (among other reasons). We REALLY get the chance to see Wally at his rawest when it comes to fighting and his speed, like he just lets loose with no holds barred when it comes to Vandal. Speedsters are goddamn dangerous and I LOVE it. (I also love Wally using himself as a human cannonball).

“Go, get out of here! I’ll handle Vandal!” “You’ll “handle” me?” “Little hero, do you really think you have what it takes to survive Vandal Savage?”

Put my baby down you piece of shit!

Wally literally stared death in the face and said, “NOT TODAY!”

Look at him fucking fight! Goddamn it’s so amazing! (also where did your Flash symbol go in that last one, Wally??)

And like, I don’t have a fucking screenshot or gif of it but Vandal punches him and he goes flying backwards and catches himself in a one armed handstand and lands on his feet. HOW FUCKING COOL IS THAT?

“When I heard authorities were (?) off this highway for a speedster, I assumed I’d be confronting Flash himself-- He and I are due for a reckoning.”

God, I’ll never stop being curious about what must have happened between Vandal and Flash to make Vandy say that... color me forever intrigued.

Wolf looks fucking demonic when he bites those wires on that auto-turret, omg.

“Kind of bashing my head into a brick wall here, need a new approach.” I REALLY wish I could make a million gifs of this fight, tbh. I don’t have any screens for some of this shit, nor other gifs saved and it’s a damn shame.

“Dude, you are so running on fumes right now. Battle didn’t help with that, either. But forget the hunger, forget the freezing temp, forget the wind chill! Just go, go!” Atta boy, Wally! Getting those priorities straight!

I honestly always love hearing Zee cast spells, it sounds so cool.

Wally reeeeally needs to work on his brakes.

Now prepare for some cute/sad Wally spam:

Oh man, though... could you imagine if Wally really had legit been twelve minutes off because of that fight, and Queen Perdita had actually died? He would NEVER forgive himself for that. That would eat him the fuck up for like... the rest of his life. Holy shit.

“Twelve minutes... the fight took fifteen...” Oh my god I can’t, he’s so crushed. :(

You can tell he’s so fucking drained throughout this last scene.

Look at him, crawling on the ground to try and get away. He’s NOT going to let that little girl die!

I like how this time Wally is able to power through and punch Vertigo in the face, whereas back in Revelations he couldn’t quite make it and Vertigo just knocks him away.

WALLY DOESNT HAVE TIME FOR THESE AUTOMATED DOORS.

“It’s called, YOU’RE BUSTED, JERKFACE!”

WALLY ILU NEVER STOP BEING SO AWESOME.

Awwwww, Perdita, you had Wally forever at “Souvenir.” <3 I just love headcanoning that they maintain a friendship for like, ever after this. So fucking sweet!

“The sword was cool, but, this just seemed like the right souvenir for the mission.” Hey, this totally echoes what Wally says to Artemis at the end of the Insecurity mission. “Keep the sai. This is the right souvenir for the mission.” Ouch. But more on that when I get to Insecurity)

“The man who finally figured out that the sweetest birthday present a lucky stiff like me could ever get, was seeing that little girl smile.”

LEAVE ME, LEAVE ME WALLY KILLS ME AT THE END OF THIS EPISODE I NEED TO CRY. I LOVE SEEING MY BABIES GROW UP.

#ranty rewatches young justice

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writingwithinwriting · 6 years

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Honest, soft spoken knicker-untwisting: I should probably say something about this whole Hollie McNish debacle, because I can.

youtube

(Hollie McNish, disagreeing with me.)

I have always maintained that some of the best insights you can hear in any field often comes from the person two-weeks into their endeavours rather than a person who has been doing it twenty years.

This is also horrible, horrible advice and there is a reason I run a blog and not a full-blown literary journal. But then again, I have only been doing this for a year... Thus, I present to you my nicest hat I have to be trampled in the ring: here’s what I have to say about this whole PN Review debate...

If you have our ear to the ground on the poetry scene, someone said something not at all positive towards the current state of spoken word poetry. The piece is loudly proclaiming how it feels and I am not going to say what they are saying is totally invalid, I know I am a humble peasant in all of this. It is well worth a read. You can read Hollie McNish’s response here and, what I think is the most succinct defence out there, Melanie Branton’s well-written retort here. This isn’t a reply, it is a report from how things look from my point of view.

I hope not to prove that spoken word at large is indeed academic, or needs to be more technical or artful, or that the what reaches people fore-mostly is necessarily the best of what is out there. I think everything is fine, knickers simply need to be untwisted in this situation. Instead, I put forward that there is a reason that people are being reached by the poetry of this ilk, and it isn’t because we’re all beginning to drag our poetic knuckles as we frollick in delirious circles over the plug-hole of impending illiteracy blinded by our own conveniences.

I could use words like spiteful or vicious about the review, but I think the review knows that it is spiteful, and it is happy with its life choices. Watts doesn’t jive with spoken word as a genre and has mistakenly decided to attack it as a whole.

“What good is a flourishing poetry market... less appreciative of nuance, less able to engage with ideas, more indignant about the things that annoy us, and more resentful of others who appear to be different from us?”

I could write an entire piece around this statement which seems to misunderstand the fundamentals of the contemporary spoken word altogether but other poets have said it better and will continue to say it better than I can. But I will instead focus on what Watts missed.

She doesn’t deserve to be attacked for expressing her frustration and opinion in a genre that can often be an echo chamber of ideas. I welcome her voice as an outsider to spoken word. I read some of her work and it’s perceptive and has a lot of effort put into it, her voice deserves to be heard, she makes many good points but draws few good conclusions in my opinion.

I can’t even say I am neck-breathingly familiar with the work of Rupi Kaur or Hollie McNish or even Kate Tempest, of whom I consider myself a fan, who are all dragged into this piece. I decided to catch up on the work of Kaur and McNish for the sakes of this post, discovering I rather liked what I read and listened to. I won’t distract from my point by going out of my way to expand on my feelings. What I can say is that I am very familiar with the criticisms at hand here.

Mostly because Lindsay Ellis beat me to the punch with what was going to be one of my main points...

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This came out after I had finished my first draft of this bloody blog post and I had to redo it all over again. I was going to talk about my unquestioning love of Jupiter Ascending and everything.

Ellis says it better than I ever could: this isn’t anything new, people just don’t like women. Even women don’t like women-y things. Our presence does not imply success. I’m not a woman myself, but I am easily mistaken for one all the time so I understand the resentment people have for when a medium is invaded by the feminine youth of today. People love to shake their fists at teenage girls; harbingers of degeneration in everything they touch with their grubby, right-swipey, manicured fingers.

Thankfully, I can ramble on more than just that aspect of why I think the review isn’t anything to be worried about. This isn’t a totally gendered issue, there are many facets to this and from what I can see it is a generational issue in many regards. Watts isn’t exactly middle-aged, but I know plenty of people who could be safely counted as millennials who dislike the technology that defines us as a generation and the possibilities that come with it.

Social media allows us to show too much our lives to other people, it ruins the magic. Social media lets us show the best bits of our lives, its all false. Social media lets everyone have a platform regardless of quality, everyone has a blog these days. etc etc. Which brings me back to the review: Watts makes a few logical leaps in the piece which seemingly amount to ‘this ideal of honesty before technique has come to the forefront of these popular pieces of work no one can take them seriously anymore and they are the knell of the populist take over.’

I don’t want to attack Watts when I say perhaps she believes there is a throng of seraphic artistic thinkers whose opinions are the only ones we should care about thereby making her statement non-contradictory. Maybe in a few years time I will no longer be a sparkly-eyed amateur and agree. For now, I personally think that spoken word heading into the mainstream is a sign that it is being taken more seriously, not less. As well as a sign that more people are engaging rather than mindlessly teething over it.

I think Watts has inadvertently proven that things are going rather well for spoken word; the piece brought up a defence hot on its heels and sparked rich debate, and must have been relevant enough to publish in the first place. Which is why I’m not angry, its why I don’t think McNish is all that bothered in her response. The review misunderstands how people take part in poetry these days. You can’t maintain that “the reader is dead” and also say the consumer has taken over; readers are consumers.

People read and listen to Kaur’s work, they make hundreds of choices a day, they listen to Elliott Smith on their turntables whilst they eat toast with almond butter, or play Drake on repeat on their iPhones on the way to work as they shove a meal deal into their face. They might own tote bags, they might own tote bags and constantly forget to use them. They may or may not use groupons or own houseplants. You can’t just call the people consumers when things don’t go your way.

These are people, teenage girls on Instagram are people, many of whom care about things like caesuras and others who just feel resonant with the work of people they find in their every day lives. Maybe they are both.

I’m sorry not everyone knows where their local independent bookseller is and regularly listens to BBC radio shows on the latest publications but I don’t believe correlation is causation. Kaur and her colleagues across the social media spectrum are not discouraging engagement beyond their own works.

The internet just happens to be where young people live and I mean that literally. Online is where our friends are, where we watch our favourite vloggers, where we listen to our podcasts about shrimp and not, say, something useful. We aren’t always doing something ethical and studious, I’m afraid, and neither are you. I think poetry should embrace being a part of people’s lives when they aren’t wanting to feel smart.

Something I’d like to propose, however, is that you can listen to podcasts concerning jokes about shrimp that and know where your independent bookseller is in your city. The internet is another home, so I am going to allow myself to appreciate the poetry I find closest to home.

I don’t know what to suggest about poetry outside the internet and spoken word, it is where I choose to engage with it, as a reader and consumer, thus I cannot say let it wither away and die nor can I list ways to engage us further in strictly paper publications. This is a false dichotomy.

I think it is pithy for anyone to complain when you don’t think a surge in interest in your passion is being done properly. I think it is ludicrous to say that short, clipped insta-poetry is akin to Orwellian Newspeak and “celebrating amateurism and ignorance...” All in all, it’s a bit mean-spirited and not all opening the floor to the people the attack is aimed at.

And the targets are not just McNish, although it was addressed personally in some regards, they are the people who brought McNish and others to prominence. Which brings us back to the Millenials and our self-created habitat of knee-jerk reactions, instant gratification and social media platforms that singlehandedly allowed Donald Trump to happen. We, the club-footed careless Godzillas crushing the old without thought, to make way for our new world order.

T.R. Darling’s work is a good example of something beautiful and lichenous that would not survive in its entirety outside of the ecosystem to which it has adapted. I wouldn’t call one screenshot of T.R. Darling’s work on Twitter a whole representation of what they do, I highly recommend scrolling through the muttering cavernous archives of Quiet Pine Trees yourself.

But in an interview on Wordpress Darling brought up something that I thought applied very well to the situation at hand, as a fellow peddler of literary internet snippets they had something to say on the nature of their work:

“Being brief isn’t enough. You can boil down a story to a sentence or two, but often you need context.“

It’s almost as if there’s a skill to this. Much like a haiku isn’t just about syllables but grounding in place and time, one of the online microfiction’s essential tools is the fact it is cut off by Twitter character count. Even Darling will admit their failures often curtail to not following through with the setting they’ve placed their work in.

McNish is more than honesty. They are more than just an outpouring of what they feel, and if Watts can’t see that then it shows they are not seeing past the vehicles that have brought the work to a book’s pages. Rupi Kaur is more than soft-spoken delicately typed Instagram posts. Kate Tempest is more than blasting the tories on youtube. They are more than just what we perceive their draw to be, they are more than their audience, and the audience is more than that.

As I was watching McNish’s piece ‘Embarrassed’ and searching for devices to make some sort of argument against a professional poetry reviewer that her work is just as well crafted as anybody else, left me realising that what cannot translate to the page are the breaths held and spaces left open for thought and reply. As well as the fact my scrutiny was a fool’s endeavour.

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Maybe McNish doesn’t want to do a finely tweaked disembodied personification of her feelings on breastfeeding in public because she wants people to reply and that would impede the voice she has created. I have absolutely no doubt that someone who shows as much intelligence and depth in their observations and work could do something adequately complicated to please us.

In my head, as I listened to Embarrassed and other poems, I felt myself start conversations in the pauses she left. Not just mmmms and yeahhhs, but actual interjections directed at the poet. And this is part of the medium, in finger clicks, in retweets and reblogs, there must be room to reply.

And it is not just about accessibility or the fact it says something you can tutt about my generation’s need to butt in with their opinions at all hours of the day. I think this could be what people are finding nuance in, I think there is an art to this. It isn’t just the legion drawling consumers with their apps and scant free time, but the people who buy poetry books and go to open mic nights.

This is why people care. And I believe that is the goal in all of this, not in how many gold stars we get in using devices for devices sakes (or for the sakes of halting the rise of fascism, as the article implicates as the social media generations fault... somehow...) but communication and engagement.

I think the aforementioned authors have hit upon this better than almost anyone before them, and whilst I might be a scraggly infant on the scene, I do believe I care. And that is why I decided to write this, not because I necessarily had the most nuanced, experienced contribution but because I could.

#hollie mcnish #kate tempest #rupi kaur #t r darling #quiet pine trees #spoken word #performance poetry #poetry #poem

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