#anti hiruzen sarutobi

[abattre]

It's funny that we see Konoha get absolutely wrecked like 2 times in the series and no other villages take advantage of that defensive weakness to start a 4th war. Kiri literally had a civil war and even that didn't blow up into an international conflict. Like, realistically, if the Uchiha coup actually happened Konoha would've been fine. The clan wasn't even trying to take over the village, they just wanted to put pressure on Konoha's leadership to stop persecuting them and maybe stop the fucking segregation and surveillance. So like,,, other than some internal restructuring there wouldn't have been much damage done to the village as an entity and the populace would've been largely unaffected. If the Uchiha did decide to kill anyone, they'd probably just target the council members and the village would've been better off anyway because Danzo and his lackeys were doing some truly wack ass shit behind closed doors.

All that to say,,, the idea that Itachi ‘saved the village’ by agreeing to the genocide of his clan is so stupid. Like Danzo probably knew that he and the rest of the council would be the only ones in any actual trouble when the Uchiha finally got sick of their treatment in the village, and he was so scared shitless of the clan his only resolution was to eliminate them entirely to save his ass from the consequences of his own actions. The only people who were ever in any real danger from the Uchiha were the people in power who were directly perpetuating their oppression and subjugation. Plus, I mean if another village did attack Konoha while this was going on, the Uchiha were by far the strongest clan there anyway; people used to literally just run away from them so they wouldn't have to fight against the Sharingan like they would've defended the place fine it's unlikely another war would've broken out from that.

#i feel like kishimoto wrote himself into a hole trying to justify what happened the the uchiha clan and it just doesn't hold up #anyway #anti konoha #anti danzo shimura #anti hiruzen sarutobi #uchiha clan #pro uchiha #itachi uchiha

[leportraitducadavre]

My interpretation of Itachi's character is fairly contrasting with yours. I pose my arguments against your analysis. I hope I would get a lead unto having an unbiased opinion.

Itachi's position in here between was a rock and a hard place. Having witnessed horrors of wars he chose to the stop war. It wasn't the best decision but even still he accomplished many things.

A new Forth Great Ninja war was prevented. Uchihas plan wasn't to reform the government it was to take control of them. Their desires were clearly reflected in their demands. While half of them was about freedom, the rest was only to control village. This, along with Obito's plan for revenge and war, will definitely start a war.

Madara, with the pact, was foiled for more than seven years long enough for the strong Shinobis like Naruto and Sasuke to grow up and defeat him.

Sasuke's life was saved. Itachi would go at all lengths to protect his brother. Afterall, its only obvious he would be over-protective of Sasuke since both loved each other a lot(as siblings).

The Uchiha's reputation were saved. Imagine what would have happened to the Uchihas after the war. The people were already suspicious of the Uchihas and now we will have never ending persecution and would be branded as traitors, doesn't matter if the coup won or lost. The coup wasn't about reforming anyway.

People in the village got to be safe too.

And despite all these he still regretted a lot enough that he wanted the person he adored the most to kill him. Also, no one here is trying to justify his action. A justification and a reason has a clear distinction. Just because there was a reason it doesn't make the acts were justified. He himself acknowledged that. The writer didn't try to justify nor did Itachi himself. People like, Hashirama and Naruto, appreciated the role he played and praised him as a Shinobi.(being seen as a villan while protecting the people isn't easy, btw). They weren't justifying or glorifying his actions in any instance.

He wasn't an absolute nationalist. He he was an idealist. His motivations most cases(especially while making big decisions)were to 'not beget war' and 'maintain peace'. Doesn't matter if Uchihas managed to control the village it still starts war, death, destruction and countless losses which is exactly what Itachi hated from when he was 4. He also wanted to reform the village by becoming a Hokage. He wanted to wiped out the entire ninja system since ninjas were the ones who were used as a weapon for the Diamoyo start constant wars. The Leaf was sort of obnoxious in the time of Tobirama and Hiruzen's regime. But even still, the Hokages were good and passionate and also the people were innocent.

A new Forth Great Ninja war was prevented. Uchihas plan wasn't to reform the government it was to take control of them. Their desires were clearly reflected in their demands. While half of them was about freedom, the rest was only to control village. This, along with Obito's plan for revenge and war, will definitely start a war.

How do you even know it was prevented? Shisui stating that hidden villages will take advantage of Konoha’s civil war to invade was just a fear that was actually constantly proven wrong throughout the series; when Suna invaded and Konoha was destroyed (forcing it to send their most powerful shinobi out of the village to collect money) no other village took advantage of the situation, not even Kumo or Iwa, two of the big five that were not struggling politically or militarily as Suna, Kiri and Konoha were. Kumogakure even tried to kidnap Hinata while in the middle of signing a peace treaty, yet they did nothing against the Hyüga clan nor the village during one of their most vulnerable state.

Furthermore, you mean to tell me that a civil war (I am using that notion generously because Konoha is a military state with a non-civilian population, specifically trained for combat) destabilizes the military and economic power of a city, yet the complete disappearance overnight of one of the village's founding and most powerful clans does nothing to its structure? Other villages wouldn’t see the absence of Sharingan-wielders as an enticing opportunity to strike? Do you mean to tell me that a village was left without police to control it overnight (and their job is considered super important by detractors), yet the city did not succumb to chaos?

Their desires were clearly reflected in their demands.

What were their demands? Enlighten me.

While half of them was about freedom, the rest was only to control village.

Where do you get this information from? There’s nothing of the sort stated in the manga.

This, along with Obito's plan for revenge and war, will definitely start a war.

Obito’s plan needed the annihilation of the Sharingan-wielders as he didn’t want anyone capable of obtaining the Mangekyou to jeopardize his plan to control the ten-tails, Itachi killing the Uchiha literally allowed Obito to start the war!! 

Madara, with the pact, was foiled for more than seven years long enough for the strong Shinobis like Naruto and Sasuke to grow up and defeat him.

… what? This doesn’t make any sense and has nothing to do with Itachi… you mean to tell me that Itachi killing his clan made Sasuke as powerful as he is? Because Sasuke has always been powerful and has always been Indra’s transmigrant, and as I’ve said, Obito wouldn’t have been able to initiate the war (or at least would’ve been incredibly difficult for him) with the Uchiha clan still alive!

Sasuke's life was saved. Itachi would go at all lengths to protect his brother. Afterall, its only obvious he would be over-protective of Sasuke since both loved each other a lot(as siblings).

An eight-year-old was tortured mentally by his brother through Tsukuyomi by watching his clan and parents get killed over and over again, was left to live alone in a compound destroyed by his brother’s actions, having to clean his parents’ own blood and fend for himself –but at least he’s alive… the circumstances and solitude in which he grew is abysmal, traumatic, negligent and inhumane, but we don’t care as much about children’s safety as we do children being just alive.

There were other children in that compound, children that knew nothing of and participated not in the coup to which Itachi didn’t extend the same kindness he did his brother.

The Uchiha's reputation were saved. Imagine what would have happened to the Uchihas after the war. The people were already suspicious of the Uchihas and now we will have never ending persecution and would be branded as traitors, doesn't matter if the coup won or lost. The coup wasn't about reforming anyway.

What “reputation”? The Uchiha were always constructed under a negative light within Tobirama’s system, you lot keep saying they were saved from being seen as detractors when there’s not a single panel that states they were planning to change the system as a whole (rather take down the current government, which is not the same).

Furthermore, to think that they cared about the rest of the population's mindset regarding them is so incredibly simplistic I have to laugh at it –they’re the strongest clan in the village, without Uchiha, there’d have been no village in the first place, and they were already aware of the unfavorable perspective in which they were regarded by others, nothing in itself would’ve changed.

The Uchiha being seen as loyal to the village helped no one but the current system as it is, as they’re seen as a government without opposition, it wasn’t about maintaining the Uchiha’s honor, but keeping the fragile credit of the structure and those in power -if Uchiha died in their own terms, then other clans will know about the clan’s discomfort with the current mindset, and those that feel uncomfortable with it might find a group that validates such sentiments:

Kakashi admits to being uncomfortable with the way he's viewed by the system, he even uses plural when referring to ninja ("we ninja") -meaning there's a communal uneasiness with the whole situation.

The fact that the government silenced detractors (Uchiha) by killing them will only deepen further the general shinobi population's discomfort, which is why is imperative to silence the truth.

[On another note, why do you keep using "honor" as an excuse to execute an entire compound of people? The entire clan was decimated and the whole "honor" of the family rested as another responsibility Sasuke had to endure all by himself thanks to "Itachi's love" -they were left with no honor as Sasuke was forced to restore it! Furthermore, they're all dead! What is "honor" gonna do for them? For the massacred innocents at least? They did nothing wrong and were killed regardless, their honorable nature wasn't even being questioned!]

People in the village got to be safe too.

Safe of what? When was it stated they were going to fight against those who weren’t in power? The problem is they rebelling against those they deem their oppressors but not the government refusing to renounce their power in order to keep the “population they hold so dear” safe? They are both willing to kill innocents (so I guess some people in the village weren’t safe, but in your book, they don’t matter as much), and use the rest of the military population to strike against Uchiha (which is also, never actually stated!). The idea of a “within war” was never confirmed as the Uchiha had no chance to strike, no one is to say they weren’t trying to take power through force yet quietly, no one is to know what was their actual plan as that was never brought to light!

The Uchiha are wrong for wanting to take the power but the government isn't wrong for wanting to keep it, the Uchiha are wrong for their methods to seek authority but not the government for defending the status quo. Uchiha having power would mean annihilation, somehow, despite them being against just their oppressors, not Konoha as a whole; while the government seeks to protect the village despite massacring an entire and most important portion of their militia and one of the founders' clans.

And despite all these he still regretted a lot enough that he wanted the person he adored the most to kill him. 

He regretted nothing, he wanted Sasuke to kill him in order to both give him an objective and to distract him from finding out Konoha’s involvement in the Uchiha Massacre, shouldering the entire responsibility of their demisse.

Also, no one here is trying to justify his action. 

But you are, you wrote point after point why he had to kill his clan.

A justification and a reason has a clear distinction.

What distinction? You need to expand on the notions you think are relevant to you own argument. 

Just because there was a reason it doesn't make the acts were justified. He himself acknowledged that. The writer didn't try to justify nor did Itachi himself. People like, Hashirama and Naruto, appreciated the role he played and praised him as a Shinobi.(being seen as a villan while protecting the people isn't easy, btw). They weren't justifying or glorifying his actions in any instance.

What are you even writing? I’m being honest with that question, claiming to have a reason to kill his clan is used as a justification for his actions! I can’t believe I have to explain that to you. He never said he had no justification (their coup was treated as such over and over, everyone took advantage of them wanting to coup in order to both order the massacre and carry it out!!).

How on earth can you write “People like Hashirama and Naruto appreciated the role he played and praised him as a shinobi but they never justified him”, so are they praising him or not? Them positively reinforcing Itachi and praising him for “his sacrifice” (you see, not only he is perceived as a villain, he is a villain, he killed an entire kin -again, innocents included, in order to maintain specific people in power) is justifying his actions under the notion of the “greater good for the village”. 

He wasn't an absolute nationalist.

He did everything for Konoha! He even claimed himself to be “Itachi of the Leaf!” What are you even talking about?

He he was an idealist. His motivations most cases(especially while making big decisions)were to 'not beget war' and 'maintain peace'. 

Yet his actions concluded in Obito being able to control the Ten Tails with almost no real opposition as the only other Sharingan-wielder was Sasuke.

Doesn't matter if Uchihas managed to control the village it still starts war, death, destruction and countless losses which is exactly what Itachi hated from when he was 4. 

How do you know? Do you have an entirely new manga written by Kishimoto about what would’ve happened had the Uchiha taken over the village? Itachi hated Uchiha since he was four because they brought “war, death and destruction” but not Konoha that actually provoked such wars, deaths, and destruction, what an intelligent boy! 

You have to be a troll because, man, “unbiased opinion” my ass. Also, did you just come to my blog with arguments coming from Itachi Shinden? The story not written by Kishimoto?

He also wanted to reform the village by becoming a Hokage. He wanted to wiped out the entire ninja system since ninjas were the ones who were used as a weapon for the Diamoyo start constant wars. 

Funny, under Hiruzen’s regime he would’ve never become Hokage, furthermore, when did he even hinted to want to become Hokage?? Never in the entire manga. Also, the Daimyo did little to nothing when it came to wars, those were all the Kage’s responsibilities! Dear Lord, did you at least read Team 10’s Arc? Asuma’s background literally explains how the Shugonin Jūnishi fought each other because six of them wanted the entire military power of the Land of Fire to be managed by the Daimyo alone while the rest, Asuma included, defended the Hokage’s existence. 

The Leaf was sort of obnoxious in the time of Tobirama and Hiruzen's regime. But even still, the Hokages were good and passionate and also the people were innocent.

Which people were innocent? The children and non-Sharingan wielders that knew nothing of the coup and were massacred regardless? How can you write “the Hokages were good” while they literally ordered the mass killing of people they swore to protect? How can you use “obnoxious” and “good” to describe the same two people?!

Gosh, the fact that you lot (Itachi stans) don’t comprehend that his involvement in the massacre of his own people alongside the protagonist’s endorsement of state-sanctioned genocide, makes the annihilation of an entire portion of a village a plausible option to handle internal disagreements is disastrous.

Committing genocide against the village’s own people sets a dangerous precedent where future governments can see and use such slaughter as a conceivable, even necessary, tool at their disposal whenever they feel threatened, making any clan vulnerable to the decisions of its government and guaranteeing the silence of possible detractors or even the censorship of constructive criticism of the political, military, economic and cultural system.

Jesus.

#anti itachi #anti itachi uchiha #anti tobirama #anti hiruzen #anti hiruzen sarutobi #anti tobirama senju #anti konoha #anti shinobi system #anti naruto #anti naruto uzumaki #anti kakashi hatake #anti hashirama #anti hashirama senju #anti tsunade #anti tsunade senju #pro uchiha #pro sasuke uchiha #pro uchiha clan

[mayora97]

Hot take: the real reason the 3rd hokage teamed up Naruto, Sasuke and Kakashi is so Sasuke would master his sharingan and take control of Kurama.

There was never any expectation for Naruto to control the nine tails chakra, or they would have spent some time training or preparing him before Naruto (by sheer coincidence and through his own insistance, cause his teacher was prioritizing Sasuke) stumbled onto Jiraiya.

- Naruto only finding out he's a Jinchuriki by complete accident, cause the Hokage forbade anyone to tell him

- Naruto finding out in a totally unforseen event by his father that Kurama being placed in him was supposed to make him a hero, and not as a curse or punishment like he was always lead to believe

Naruto was only ever meant to be the vessel. Should he lose the reigns on Kurama or not cooperate with the leaf, then Sasuke can just take over.

Kakashi was the only one who could teach Sasuke how to use the sharingan, which is why he was specifically assigned to this team.

Even hotter take: Itachi explicitly instructed Sasuke to kill his best friend in order to activate the mangekyou sharingan and face him. Which would have inevitably been one of Sasuke's teammates, as this boy was left with nothing else.

The third hokage (Danzo and the elders by proxy, cause the old man can't make a decision by himself clearly) definitely knows this. He definitely knows how the sharingan works and how it elevates through extreme emotion, more often by killing a loved one.

Naruto was set up like a pig for slaughter. If it wasn't for Sasuke himself refusing to follow in his brother's footsteps and removing himself from the influence of the leaf village, that would have been the path we ended up facing. If it wasn't for Jiraiya, Naruto would never have begun to access his or Kurama's chakra and just ended up swallowed up by it when he inevitably and unknowingly lost control like with Haku. If it wasn't for Tsunade banging on desks and vouching for Naruto, he would've been locked inside the leaf out of 'protection' from the Akatsuki. If it wasn't for Naruto proving his worth and proving himself indispensible it absolutely would've been Danzo taking over Sasuke's place in controling the nine-tails as soon as his eyes opened.

#naruto meta #naruto #naruto uzumaki #anti konoha #anti hiruzen sarutobi #sasuke uchiha #kakashi hatake #jirayia #tsunade #anti danzo #itachi uchiha

[the-real-sasuke-uchiha]

All hokages are scum. But those who enable genocides and neglect orphans are worse than scum.

#anti Hiruzen Sarutobi #anti Sarutobi #anti Third Hokage #anti Hokages #anti Konoha

[atossofthedice]

Sorry for not posting yesterday I had to go dance on Hiruzen and Danzo’s graves and highfive Sasuke a few times

#pro sasuke #anti hiruzen sarutobi #anti danzo

[mazzikns]

Hiruzen raising Naruto

#naruto #naruto fandom #naruto fanart #uzumaki naruto #naruto uzumaki #naruto art #naruto memes #hiruzen sarutobi #hiruzen #anti hiruzen #anime art #anime #uzumaki naruto fanart

[sannin-three]

#hiruzen sarutobi #danzo shimura #hirudan #naruto shippuden #i hate them both but them as a weird toxic couple is also so funny #anti danzo #anti hiruzen #not really but also yeah lol

[vulpisnocturna]

You are the Hokage. You see this 5yr old orphan crying. Do you:

A) Give him proper housing, food, enough money to live comfortably and a proper caregiver

B) Teach him how to do his taxes properly (he always gets it wrong!!! so annoying!)

C) Give him 20£ a month and make him rely on the kindness of some random villager (it will be hard to find one who doesn’t hate his guts!). Alternatively, watch him eat spoiled food and 99p pot noodles

Commission me or buy my art on Ko-fi ☕️

#my art #pls do not repost #may or may not be a diss #i’m learning how to colour i think!! #i actually like this #naruto #naruto art #naruto fanart #uzumaki naruto #naruto uzumaki #anti hiruzen #hiruzen sarutobi #naruto uzumaki fanart #art #illustration

[adhdnojutsu]

"Do you possess the Will of Fire, Itachi?"

I think it's more like the Will of Fire possessed him, but...

#naruto #itachi #naruto fanart #naruto shippuden #itachi uchiha #itachi naruto #itachi fanart #naruto art #uchiha itachi #hiruzen sarutobi #anti hiruzen #third hokage #will of fire #anti konoha

[axleboost]

Naruto Fanfiction | Life Without Kurama, Chapter 6

Hiruzen Sarutobi, A.K.A. "The Professor" is in the mix! The plot thickens...

Click the link to find out more.

#naruto #naruto fanfiction #fandom #fanfic #ao3 fanfic #archive of our own #narutoverse #kurama #konohagakure #writing #ficlet #fic ref #my fic #fic rec #au #naruto au #axleboost #ff.net #fanfiction.net #fic writing #life without kurama #lwk #nart #nartposting #naruto uzumaki #hiruzen sarutobi #sarutobi clan #hiruzen #anti hiruzen #hokage

[mdr-reikas]

Hiruzen naming his grandchild Konohamaru is glossed over way too much. Like. Fucking, really? You're naming your ONLY grandchild after THE VILLAGE YOU LEAD. Thas crazy imagine going to your new job and Joe Bidens grandson is there and his name is AMERICA. WHAT.

#fuck Joe Biden btw #i just needed an example #naruto #hiruzen #hiruzen sarutobi #konohamaru #anti hiruzen #anti konoha #fucking weirdo

[abattre]

Can anyone become the Hokage outside of, like, blatant nepotism? Like the Konoha council just gets to decide who the next Kage is and the rest of the village has no say, there's no voting. The only requirement is apparently being strong, and yet the students or relatives of former Hokage's are the only ones ever considered for the position. Also, why does being able to kill the most people out of everyone mean they are qualified to be a politician and also the most powerful person ever because that reads as,,, very plainly a bad idea. Even outside of the megalomaniac complex that comes out of having that sort of physical power,,, just logistically no sane person wants someone comfortable with mass murder running their country. Literally every Hokage in OG/Shippuden has killed like dozens of people at the very least and doesn't seem very concerned or apologetic about any of that.

Do they even have the education to make them competent at lawmaking and running a country? Tsunade fucked off to drink and gamble for like twenty years, Minato thought putting a traumatised kid who watched his best friends die into black ops assassination work was somehow a sensible idea, and Hiruzen let Danzo do the most fucked up shit ever and apparently just didn't comprehend the concept of wellfare. Tobirama had the brains I guess but he was also very racist and thought human experimentation was an okay thing to be doing to people so I think an ethics course should have been a requirement at least maybe.

#does no one have a problem with the omnipotent politician geting to just pick the next one out of his fav mini-me's #who is vetting this wtf #anti konoha #anti danzo shimura #anti hiruzen sarutobi #anti tobirama senju

[leportraitducadavre]

Why are the Uchiha considered a non-oppressed group? Naruto's fandom, specifically pro-Konoha readers, tend to claim that neither Sasuke nor his family was actually oppressed nor discriminated against prior to their killing; furthermore, some tend to state that it's for this supposed reason that the massacre was justified, as not only they perceived no injustice when presented with evidence of their treatment at the hands of those in positions of power (who should've had guaranteed their survival at the very minimum, as that was the reason for the village's creation), but also consider their plan to coup a consequence of their "traitorous" nature; a disservice after everything "Konoha did for them".

Some other fans, not much smarter than the first group, are willing to admit some of the discrimination they suffered; but they are reluctant to see such conduct as a learned animosity, labeling it as a "modern occurrence" (when speaking of Hiruzen's timeframe). According to them, the Uchiha had just begun to be discriminated against, so their reaction was disproportionate; apparently, it's mandatory to wait for such bigotry to be repeated for a few generations before considering it a systematic occurrence rather than an isolated event.

Genocide doesn't happen in a vacuum, it's not an option that is plausibly considered if not after years or decades of cultural and political repression and degradation. It's the growth of a slow but consistent process of dehumanization, to the point where those taught under such a regime of thought truly consider their life, rights, and opinions far more valuable and important than those they degrade.

Arresting or even killing the clan members that actually wanted to coup would've been far more understandable had those in power seen Uchiha humane enough for their lives to be considered, to matter; yet the elders quickly saw mass murder as an enticing option, sending one of the kin they wanted to exterminate to do their dirty job so they wouldn't lose "one of their own" and still look pristine.

They were able to do so and still see themselves as agents of peace because they were taught that they were on the right side of history, as the story was told from their perspective; the handwriting of their mentor shines dark and spotless on the parchments of their national library.

And, as for them, there were no real losses that day, their life continued. And those responsible for the death of dozens kept smiling, kept walking amongst the classmates of the children they sent to murder, telling them to fight for their memory, to give meaning to the pain by growing.

The fandom still believes that their death was requited, necessary, and fair; putting the blame of the genocide at most upon two sets of shoulders (Danzo, Hiruzen) instead of (at least) six (Tobirama, Danzo, Hiruzen, Koharu, Homura and Itachi), because they truly think that such an idea can be created out of thin air and it's not the consequence of an oppressive system that it's constantly demoting a specific group's value; because they truly think that the Council is acting on their own volition and isn't abiding the structure set by those before them. To them, four men and a woman created and taught themselves their own moral, social, and cultural parameters for this specific portion of the story before renouncing them and subscribing once again to their teachers (who somehow are painted as ~agents of peace~).

But alas, let's dissect some of their arguments, perhaps like this some of their brilliance shall illuminate us:

Their doujutsu and overall pride as a clan. The Sharingan is probably the most powerful doujutsu inside the Narutoverse (slightly less so than the Rinnegan but that needs the Sharingan as a base to develop), which for them translates into their clan having a “natural advantage” over others during a battle; thus, if they are so strong, how come they are oppressed? For them, that’s a contradiction because they can only phantom oppression if it’s visible, as in physical: literal submission through physical strength. Yet the Sharingan is canonically expressed to be a rare outcome inside the family, a rarity that just a few members of the clan possessed, so it’s a “natural advantage” that not many Uchiha have nor had at the time of their murder. But the tale hasn't finished, because there's a recurrent joke amongst these antis, for "how come the Sharingan is so powerful yet they were whipped by Itachi in just one night!", they shout, hyena laughter amidst their group; yet they don't talk further as not to attract detractors with quick wit, as they don't take into account (can't take into account) not only the prior point but also Obito’s participation -who was in charge of killing the strongest members of the clan but Fugaku (the later who decided not to fight), and without minding the context in itself as Itachi sneaked into clan members' homes and killed them when their back was turned, as he took advantage of the trust they bestowed upon him.

They were the ones who were “entrusted” by Tobirama to make Konoha’s citizens respect the law -summarizing, they were “given” the Police Force. In this specific regard, the police force inside the Narutoverse is directly compared (and therefore, read) to its real-life counterpart, yet: a- The Uchiha’s job was to be carried inside a military state, most of the citizens inside Konoha have tools at their disposal to either evade or fight back the Uchiha's "authority". It's difficult for them to read such phrases for it shatters their self-insertion; how come Naruto isn't about my self-perceived value inside the country I inhabit? b- The Police Force’s power, influence, and control were directly limited by the Hokage, they couldn’t arrest ANBU members (meaning those who were, one in charge of spying on them, and two a big portion of Konoha’s forces). c- Uchiha couldn’t aspire to be something else but members of the police. The only ones who could work outside that specific force were those individuals that abandoned their identities as clan members and swore allegiance to Konoha. Only Itachi (the perpetrator), Shisui, and Kagami (who were luckily dead before the events of the UCM transpired) were shown outside such a limited sphere. No other clan was shown to need such extreme measures to work in their chosen field. The fact that the prison was constructed to be inside their compound prior to them being moved to the outskirts of the city isn’t enough for them to understand that this specific job was forced upon Uchiha. "It's easier for them to keep an eye on the prisoners," they claim, clicking their tongues, yet won't see what it politically entails, for Uchiha members can never detach themselves from their duty, as it was physically adhered to their lands. "It's a duty they could thrive on," they vomit, and they did, yet no one sees -because it all happens inside their own compound. Not a single clan is shown to “have one specific job” inside Konoha but the Uchiha. d- Nevermind the very real and canonic impact that such work has amongst Konoha citizens, as the lesser members of Konoha's militia grow resentful of those that "control" them; in addition, such position also prevents the Uchiha from properly integrating amongst the general population, as they can't commune completely with those they need to keep tabs on. Was the Police Force ever rebuilt after the UCM? ANBU forces were quick to absorb their duties after the Kyuubi attack, decreasing at a much faster speed their position inside the place they built. The Police Force was dismantled and forgotten after the massacre, further proving the real irrelevance of such duty and the actual hidden purpose in its creation. e- How come the Uchiha "monopolized" a force that was literally and canonically given to them? How did they take over and denied anyone else's presence inside that structure when not only did they not create it but the prison was built by the government itself inside their compound? Someone with fewer brain cells than them will think that it's Konoha's government the one limiting the nature of the members that had to forcefully take care of that task, as clan compounds have restrictions on who can enter; but not them -oh no, ah, the wisdom of these people amazes me...

Their members’ popularity. Specifically, Sasuke and Itachi. What they say while fidgeting in their seats is simple: "how come Itachi (prior to the massacre) and Sasuke (after) were so praised by non-Uchiha if they were discriminated against"? And, ah, we could've finally reached enlightenment; yet their worldview is irrevocably simplistic, as systematic oppression doesn’t always translate into direct discrimination at the hands of other citizens. The Uchiha clan was moved to the outskirts of the city without any other family raising any eyebrows, they don’t have to be spitted on by other shinobi for them to be oppressed, that’s limiting the notion of discrimination/oppression to a single factor -the physical one, without minding the others. To explain it in lesser terms, as we must crouch down to speak to them to be on their level, saying that the Uchiha weren’t discriminated against due to lack of physical aggression, and I guess a genocide isn’t enough aggression for some, it’s like saying a man is a misogynist only if he slaps a woman. That way, monetary, social, cultural, and political domination are left out of the discussion, therefore, it’s limiting sexism to individuals’ actions rather than seeing the system these men were raised on and that it built their resolve to, finally, physically attack a woman. Uchiha were the only ones whose value was tied to their biological nature -no other families inside Konoha found as many restrictions as they did (might I remind you that there was a clan that happily enslaved their members and no one seemed to care?), their biology was enough reason to keep them both away of positions of power (meaning that the laws/decisions that influenced their lifestyle were made for them without a single Uchiha consultant), and restricting their movements inside their village. And I know many of these antis will claim “oh, but name one of the other noble clans (but the Nara’s, of course) that are actually in a place inside the Council, none of them were!” And you see, they miss the point by a mile, because the issue isn’t only the Uchiha not having incidence nor right to (at least) vote inside a village they founded, but specifically them being denied such presence under the premise of a biological predisposition that they have no control of. No other clan, whether they are or not at this point in time inside the Council, is denied a future position under those premises, they either can’t achieve it due to their lack of connections (Minato Namikaze, member of a non-noble clan was made Hokage due to his relationship with Jiraiya) or having not enough rank to participate (Morino Ibiki, also from a clan not specifically important, is the Head of the T&I Department).

#tw: strong language #anti konoha #anti shinobi system #anti naruto #anti naruto uzumaki #anti danzo #anti danzo shimura #anti hiruzen #anti hiruzen sarutobi #anti itachi #anti itachi uchiha #anti tobirama #anti tobirama senju #anti tobirama fandom #pro uchiha #pro uchiha clan #sasuke #sasuke uchiha #fugaku uchiha #uchiha #uchiha clan #meta #anti will of fire #anti curse of hatred #anti wof #anti coh

[konowhoregakure]

I know you all hate him but he’s my friend.

#I hate him. #I hate danzo. #naruto #naruto shippuden #naruto memes #naruto shitposting #hiruzen sarutobi #danzo shimura #anti danzo #but not anti hiruzen i mean only a little bit

[the-real-sasuke-uchiha]

Sasuke what do you think of Hiruzen Sarutobi?

I saw this ask when you sent it, Anon, and I have been since thinking on how to answer in a way that won’t bore you to death. Because I could write enough to fill a thesis.

Sarutobi is either as fascist and hypocrite as his predecessor, but hiding his hate for the Uchiha behind that mask of an adorable and kind grandpa, or he is the most useless and incompetent Hokage to ever exist in Konoha. I am quite inclined towards the first option.

Sarutobi routinely consulted Danzo and the two council decrepits and completely gave in to their opinions. He heard their racist remarks about the Uchiha and just accepted them without question. He heard Danzo advocating for a genocide, and all he got was a childish scolding. He of course enabled Danzo and let him do as he pleased, right up to the very night of the massacre. And then played angry and surprised, but still let him go with a short detention as a punishment for annihilating a clan. Remember all those anbu designated to spy on my clan and obviously released from that duty after the massacre? Well, clearly Sarutobi couldn’t even assign one of them to have an eye on Danzo, because he was totally free to desecrate the corpses of my loved ones, tear off their eyes and go to Orochimaru to get that disgusting arm surgically attached.

So, one of your subordinates conspired against a clan on your back, ordered almost all its members to be assassinated without your permission or knowledge, and then he was free to go and do business with an traitor that was allegedly plotting against you and the government of Konoha. Sarutobi is not a genius but he couldn’t be so stupid. The only explanation is that, maybe he didn’t know exactly what Dazo was doing, but he certainly didn’t care in the slightest.

He got the Hokage position in a moment where the Uchiha were already segregated from the village, forced into a specific career and excluded from any position of influence or power. This was as a result of Tobirama’s policies, however, Sarutobi did nothing to revert that. You don’t do this based on ignorance, you only do this if you agree with your predecessor. He obviously inherited the hateful and racist ideals from his master. And, in fact, he goes all “will of fire” the first chance he gets.

He heard Danzo’s worries about the unrest of the Uchiha, he heard his suggestion to kill “even the innocent children” and did nothing about that. Nothing to stop Danzo, nothing to approach the Uchiha or alleviate their oppression. He had so many chances it is incredible he did absolutely nothing. “They are my comrades in arms, I want to use dialogue to solve this”, he said, probably just trying to look reasonable in front of Itachi, to keep the good-guy façade so Itachi would think “see, it is my clan’s fault, the Hokage seems so open and fair”. But he did shit. What other thing had him busy that day that was more important than moving his ass and go immediately talk to the Uchiha to prevent a tragedy? Weren't they so scared of war? What the hell were they doing to prevent it except violating every possible civil right of the Uchiha?

You know, even if we play stupid and assume that it is true, that he was just weak and incapable, that he really knew nothing about Danzo’s intrigues, what would be your logical course of action after you learn about it? Because I would not have allowed Danzo to see the light again. I would not have sent Itachi to join Akatsuki or put a bounty in his head. I would not have allowed a child to grow in despair, manipulated by lies and unfairly hating his only living relative. I would have exposed the truth, I would have held Danzo responsible. I don’t know, I would have behaved as a fair leader for once, as if the people I am in charge of are human beings with rights and feelings.

And these are only my thoughts about his involvement in my clan’s genocide. I won’t even start talking about his mighty speech in the chunin exams, telling children to go kill each other for the enjoyment of powerful feudal lords because, apparently, they would start a war if they are denied of that pleasure. Or about the orphans left abandoned. Or about how he allowed the barbaric practices in the Hyuga clan and how he consented Hizashi Hyuga sacrificing his life to protect his enslaver brother.

You know, Anon, my parents admired this guy’s father so much they named me after him. They fought in the war for him. I mourned in his funeral when I didn’t yet know the truth. I feel so betrayed and so stupid.

#anon #ask #anti Konoha #anti Hiruzen Sarutobi #pro Uchiha #pro Uchiha clan #Orochimaru you are also shit but thank you for killing him

[nubelo]

Only good fucking thing the third hokage ever did was be nice to Iruka those two times everything else boo get off the stage old man 🖕🏽

#Thx for letting Iruka and Naruto bond over the fact that they're both orphans cause of your lame ass #naruto #iruka umino #naruto uzumaki #third hokage #hiruzen sarutobi #anti hiruzen