#pentarchy

[beautifulterriblequeen]

Hello!! This is kind of a stupid question but do you understand who the Moonshadow assassins kill and why? At first I assumed it was just human rulers/generals from all kingdoms but when Viren was talking about how they were a threat in season 2 the other rulers didn’t seem to think it was as big of an emergency and I was a little confused. I hope you have a great day!!

I actually love questions like this! There's some nuance in the answer, and also some uncertainty, but I'll share my take for ya:

The Moonshadow assassins don't seem to pick their own targets, they accept assignments from the Dragon Throne. The full nature of that relationship hasn't been explained in any detail, so it's a tricky, complicated area of lore for the moment.

Basically, we don't have any information on how the Dragon Throne chooses the targets it passes on to the Moonshadow assassins for taking, aside from the one that happened just before the show's plot began, with Zubeia sending Runaan and his team to kill Harrow and Ezran. All we know is that these targets are supposed to be so threatening to Xadia that the world would be better off if they were no longer in it.

It's not impossible to imagine Avizandum telling his assassins to take out someone who didn't actually deserve it. It's relatively easy actually, knowing how he liked to stomp on humans, and how long he lived. It's probably happened. The only question is: how often? (angst)

I would guess - because again, we don't really know this for sure yet - that Avizandum generally chose actual threats, or people who could easily become threats in a war. But when you're a long-lived dragon, maybe you see different patterns in the mortal lives and cultures of humans. And Runaan and all the assassins before him wouldn't live long enough to recognize those patterns themselves, so they probably had to accept their targets out of either trust or duty. (more angst)

Some of them would definitely be military type targets: generals; shining young hero types with a chip on their shoulder; stealthy human assassins; dark mages if they dared risk it; and etc.

But a dragon might see strange harmless patterns beginning to form and decide to nip them in the bud before they led to anything truly threatening: a craftsman who just had a design breakthrough with a prototype ballista; a baker who just invented hardtack that could keep an army on the move for weeks; an armorer who just made a much safer design; a clever miner who found a rare and valuable source of iron.

People like that aren't dangerous on their own. But the knowledge they might share among the humans during a long drawn-out war with Xadia could be devastating in a decade or five. A dragon who already doesn't like humans would probably have no trouble sending his best assassin to snipe unsuspecting ordinary people like that.

We're still not sure if assassins must take an assignment, or if it's just dishonorable or something not to take it. But Runaan's a pretty regimented guy, and he's not fond of humans either. Between his trust issues and his protective instincts, I don't think he'd look too hard at his assignments these days even if he had a choice - he'd believe he was doing the right thing for his people, and then he'd stop thinking and go shoot someone.

I think sometimes Runaan definitely was doing the right thing by killing someone. But it's impossible to say which missions were and which weren't the right thing. Life is way too complicated for clear-cut answers like that.

Okay, onward!

The other part of this answer is about the Pentarchy itself. I think their hesitance to commit right away, and the reason Aanya got so much time to smack Viren with her sass, happened partly because Viren lives in a border realm like she does, and the other three rulers have a nice safe buffer between them and the brunt of the war efforts.

Basically, Del Bar, Neolandia, and Evenere don't have any skin in the border game.

They don't have big standing armies, and the only threats they deal with are small incursions - either assassins from other human realms or occasionally Moonshadow assassins.

Which is the topic at hand! But when Viren tries to convince Harrow to do the switching spell in S1, he claims that Moonshadow elves are an unstoppable force. Almost a force of nature, kind of vibe. If they come for you, you're just gonna die about it. Harrow even agrees with him! It's common knowledge how deadly the Moonshadow assassins are. And that's what happened despite all of Viren's plans - he still lost his king because Moonshadow assassins are scary good at their job.

So it's plausible that the other rulers didn't see any point in committing resources to an unsolvable issue - if Moonshadow assassins were coming for them, then they'd die. Why risk anyone else? Anyone in the assassins' way would die too. (Which they did in Katolis)

Another option is that Viren has been wrong before, and the other royals did commit resources to deal with the threat he claimed was coming, only to have time and money and forces wasted. If Viren had brought them costly mistakes, they could've been hedging their bets this time around.

There's a funnier possibility though: maybe they just didn't like Viren. People in power sometimes say polite things to an underling or a petitioner, and then have no intention of ever following through with it. They might've all been blowing smoke here, telling Viren "oh yeah sure if we're all in, let's totally do war, bro" and absolutely never meaning it even a little bit because they simply did not like the messenger.

Which is mean. But: royals.

tldr:

there's a few things affecting the Pentarchy scene all at once. We don't know all the factors involved yet, and the Pentarchy probably doesn't either. But at the end of the day the Pentarchy chose to hesitate, and that left Viren on his own.

#asks #thanks for the ask! #tdp #tdp meta #viren #pentarchy #politics in xadia

[tales-and-creatures-of-xadia]

Queens of Duren, Queen Aanya concept art

#the dragon prince #tdp #art book #concept art #Queen Neyha #Queen Annika #Queen Aanya #Duren #Lesbian #Lesbian queens #interracial #pentarchy

[deadpopes]

This is a fascinating and extremely well-done feature on the Coptic Orthodox Church of Alexandria, one of the five main episcopal sees of Justinian’s pentarchy and the only ecclesiastical jurisdiction other than Rome that is led by a Pope rather than a Patriarch.  

#History #Religious History #Religion #Coptic Orthodox Church #Copts #Coptic Church #Coptic Pope #Coptic Orthodox Church of Alexandria #Pentarchy #Egypt #Egyptian History #Arab News

[raayllum]

One thing I noted watching The Dragon Prince is that the intro splits the same continent in half with the elves/humans so they started with the same amount of magical animals/plants each. There’s still some magical animals the human side but their presence is far, far reduced comparatively so do you think that’s specifically because of dark magic harvesting leading to more “normal” to our eyes species dominating?

I’m fairly surprised there isn’t a visibly established livestock industry’s for magic animals too (that way say your lunar moths can be renewably hatched each year, or a sheep population equivalent kept etc).

You seem very immersed in much of the lore so thought it’d be fun to at least pose as a query.

I think there's a few different things here to consider (that we'll probably never get a definitive answer on) but this is my best guess + what we do know about how dark magic operates:

Both regular animals and magical creatures can be used for dark magic. We know this because we've seen human blood be used in a couple of spells, Claudia puts grasshopper goop in Soren's mouth (2x08), and then later uses the deer in its entirety to undo Soren's paralysis.

That said, it does seem that magical creatures are more potent and preferred for dark magic spells. This makes sense - while you can use the life essence of anyone/anything for dark magic, creatures with magic inside them (any arcanum) are inevitably going to have more to "squeeze out" than a non magical creature would.

With that in mind, I think canon gives us a few answers and subtextual clues.

The most important one is something Viren refers to 2x05 (which has haunted me ever since), in which he cites that, "After centuries of fighting amongst ourselves, the five human kingdoms finally found balance, an era of peace." The Book 2 novelization gives a little more information about this period on conflict, explaining that "The first summit of the Pentarchy had been held centuries ago, and it had brought an end to the Mage Wars and created the modern order of the human kingdoms" (Ch17).

We don't know, of course, if this is precisely the same period of time. Maybe by helping to imprison Aaravos (and presumably disposing of the last king of Katolis), the Orphan Queen likewise helped put an end to the mage wars. Maybe she only came on the scene centuries after the mage wars! Who knows. "Held centuries ago" could mean three, which matches up with the Orphan Queen / Aaravos imprisonment timeline (and no more mister startouch elf preying on mages) or it could go back closer to 700-800 years. We'll just have to wait and see if we ever get more details!

Regardless, the Mage Wars and the fact they were likely fuelled by dark magic, since it was humans fighting amongst themselves, might answer why we see so few (known) magical creatures in the Human Kingdoms other than maybe glow toads: mages went after the most potent magical ingredients during the fighting, and reduced those numbers to virtually nonexistent or extinct.

I would imagine before the Mage Wars / even before Xadia split, maybe, more magical creatures were held and domesticated as livestalk. (Elves certainly do keep some animals as pets, such as Janai's flying hot cat, though I'd expect something like a Moonstrider to maybe have evolved as a sort of hunting companion.) However, humans on the eastern side and elves on the western side were likely forced to abandon any farms / communities they had in regards to animal care when the Exile / Schism happened. Information and resources might've been lost, as animals on one side of the continent were likely different compared to others, although some humans (who already lived in the west) and some elves (who already lived in the east) wouldn't have had to have moved.

That said, I think the simplest and shortest answer is just that there's not a lot of mages within TDP's world. For each group of people, we see a lot more warriors or diplomats than mages and they don't seem to regularly be employed in the military of kingdom we've seen, Sunfire or Pentarchy troops or otherwise. We can also guess that in the Pentarchy due to the specificity of the ingredients needed, sometimes, that Katolis by virtue of being closest to the Border would be primed to have the most dark mages and dark mage traffic / travellers (although I've HC'd that Evenere due to its isolation has a fair bit of lingering magic more than say Del Bar or Duren). But due to the amount of knowledge and ingredients required to seemingly do most dark magic spells, as well as the toll it takes on the body, I think it makes sense that most people wouldn't have the interest, access, or ability to pursue that kind of path when there's plenty of others that are less gruelling / easier

Magic is everywhere, and small pieces of magic (like Ruthari's moon opals) are everywhere, but outside of the specific skillsets of each primal (Moonshadow illusion spells and forgery, maybe cooking, forgery and healing for Sunfire elves) it doesn't seem like magic is something they readily depend on for food or livestock in their day to day lives. And if that's not the case for the majority in Xadia (only used in times of crisis, etc), I can see that need plummeting in the Human Kingdoms simply because it takes a lot more time/energy to maintain than might be necessarily utilized because of the low demand

This was all long winded speculation and hopefully mostly coherent. If you're interested in more deep dive worldbuilding thoughts I'd really recommend some of @kradogsrats stuff as it's great and a lot more eloquent / all encompassing tbh

#worldbuilding #dark magic #headcanons #darkwinganimus #tdp #the dragon prince #requests #analysis series #analysis #it's hard cause something like a banther COULD be a magical creature we just don't Know #and the giant fish clearly is (hi ocean arcanum) #i think the pentarchy has a much more consistent black market for dark magic parts #moving through katolis to the rest but again #more narrow and underground > built into society #tag ramble

[kradogsrats]

thinking nonstop about this pentarchy equivalent of a UN peacekeeper tbh

where did he come from? how did he get there? what does he do every day? would he part an old man from his walking stick?

#like someone sat down and designed this guy's uniform and that's insane to me #given how little we know about how the pentarchy actually like... functions #kind of want a whole squad with one from each of the kingdoms now #brought together to solve some kind of situation and having all kinds of shenanigans while bonding into a tight-knit found family #except then obviously one would have to betray them all #and the other four go on a quest for vengeance while dodging the authorities since they're now outlaws for some reason #look it's a genre okay

[wheretwofacesmeet]

#the dragon prince #breaking the seal episode #lord viren #dark mage #katolian #Summit of the Pentarchy #Allhaven Hill

[behind-xemnas]

I am kind of wondering if that whole thing about sacrificing Sir Sparklepuff for Viren to stay alive was some kind of test.

Viren has been very adamant about doing anything for his family, the show writers stated multiple times that Viren's core theme is sacrifice as in he would sacrifice anything FOR his family (like potentially killing someone for the dark magic he had to perfom to save Soren's life as well as disfiguring himself with said spell)

And I am pretty sure that Aaravos is aware of that.

So him referring to Sir Sparklepuff as Viren's child and telling him at the same time he has to sacrifice him for his own sake... it's just not something Viren would do. It pretty much goes against his core principles.

And for Aaravos, I feel like, it is similar in some way. So far we can only piece together his past via very small snippets and tidbits we learned through short storys as well as side materials such as the texts in the books etc, but we do know that Aaravos was banished from heaven (or where ever star touch elves live) and it seemed to have happened when he was young, we also know that later he was imprisoned for his crimes and that they were revealed by the orphan queen, a human. So first he was betrayed by his own kin and later he was betrayed by the humans who he apperantly helped by gifting them dark magic etc. He also has that whole speech to Viren about loyalty and friendship and love after the summit of the pentarchy.

To me it feels like that the one thing Aaravos just can't stand is betrayel and sacrificing your own family for personal gain is betrayel.

So I am wondering if the thing with Sir Sparklepuff was a test, to see if Viren would be capable of such betrayel.

Also because I can't imagine Viren actually dying and if this was indeed a test and Viren passed it know it would explain him surviving. As in "You actually killed our child to survive? I won't make your resurrection permanent" but he didn't so now he will or whatever

#lord viren #tdp viren #aaravos #the dragon prince #tdp #viravos #tdp spoilers #spoilers #sir sparklepuff #viren

[self-spaghettification]

aaravos & claudia analysis ™

The new S6 promotional art has to mean something for Aaravos’s connection to Claudia Season 6. There’s the connection with the short story Ripples of course and Aaravos’s manipulation of mages, but now I am wondering if Claudia will be preyed on by Aaravos after he gets out - using her loss, anger at herself and the world for her loss and being unable to save her dad - and he’ll channel it into making her a weapon against Xadia, maybe even the tragic main villain.

Taking it a step further, maybe he expected and respected Viren’s decision to die in the first place because he knew it would make Claudia spiral further and he offered to bring him back in the first place so that Claudia would 1. set in motion the steps toward his freedom and 2. trust Aaravos (and his rhetoric…) and 3. have a taste of his power to change things, which will undeniably be tempting.

I feel like Claudia and Aaravos’s outlooks have aligned in the past (ie: Claudia saying “Impassible is just another form of passible” and Aaravos saying “Yesss”) and Aaravos has had his eye on her for a long time, back to Aaravos saying “Well done. She will be a valuable asset”, having Viren lie to his kids so she wouldn’t leave Viren, and all the way back to Claudia saying it felt like the mirror put her on notice too.

Aaravos using her as a weapon against Xadia would parallel how he used Viren’s grief after Harrow’s death and anger at the Pentarchy to set Viren on a path to conquer Xadia. Viren, with reason but also spite, took Callum’s voice taunting him for being a nepo-baby, killed Avizandum, and coined Runaan. Aaravos encouraged Viren to kill the leaders of the four other countries and to kill the guards hunting him in the castle of Katolis. In comparison, Claudia has, unprovoked, almost killed a dragon just for hell of it and taunted Rayla with her parents just to not give them back (even knowing what it’s like to have a parental figure taken away.) Terry was the only thing stopping her. Terry was talking her down both times. Terry is no longer in the picture. (for Claudia, currently at least.) Who knows what she’ll do with that lack of checking and Aaravos egging her on.

She repeats rhetoric that humans deserve revenge for being treated by trash and that dragons and elves should be afraid of her, a fire that Aaravos’s guidance will only fan further. Her rhetoric has been undoubtedly shaped by both Viren’s and Aaravos’s actions, spite, and other reasoning.

carrying the same prejudices and likes as her father, “Look dad, I’m following in your footsteps!” + “Aaravos can change things!” to Soren. + the fever dream metaphor that Claudia goes dangerously further than Viren, stops listening to him, (foreshadowing for future conversations where Viren and Soren plead with Claudia to stop) and gets swallowed up in something she could never predict, something much larger than herself.

Endgame? Well. Claudia has a lot of parallels to Ziard, and we see how that ended… also, that’s a scene in S3. So if S6 does parallel S3… well. It doesn’t end well for her.

(Repeated water motifs)

Claudia currently feels like she’s lost everything. Her mom, her brother, her strength… she prided herself on that but she wasn’t strong enough to beat the Dragang and so she wasn’t strong enough to save her dad. She believes she’ll keep losing and so she cuts herself off from Terry to avoid losing that too.

Key: She is in her darkest place thus far, similar to Viren when he had lost everything and was desperate enough to make a blood pact with a strange elf in the mirror. And what if, once again, that strange elf was there to help the most desperate? If Claudia is made to believe she’s strong enough again, with the aid of a little magic, if she’s given that validation and care again, she can do anything. It would parallel the Reflections story ‘Lost Child’:

If she’s strong enough, and her faith is restored, no one will ever leave her again. They’ll come to understand.

Again it was how she was taught. “I’ll do anything for our family, Dad. Whatever it takes, however dangerous, however vile.” and it’s going to lead to her shaping into a more vindictive villain and to her doom.

#aaravos #claudia #tdp meta #tdp s6 spoilers #self spaghettification #claudia & aaravos #tdp analysis #starlight

[parroset]

Parallels: Miyana and Aaravos in relation to their mages

So I’ve been thinking of Miyana recently (and of course I’m always thinking of Aaravos), and I wanted to point out a few similarities I’ve noticed between these two. Specifically, in their relationships with Karim and Viren, respectively.

First of all, arc 1 Viren and Karim have many notable parallels, which I’ve seen multiple people discuss already. To summarize, both are mages who are a brother figure to royalty and want to “reclaim” land that was taken from them. Both are driven (at least partially) by a desire for political power to “restore” their nation in some way. And they are both willing to take drastic action to get there, including a possible war. They both represent the cycle and show how it continues. They also share some similar plot points. They both argue/fight with the monarch, which causes their relationship with said sibling figure to fracture. They then have a very important meeting of some kind in which they could gain power (summit of the pentarchy and the six horns) but fail to. And at the end of season 5, Karim gains an army, similar to Viren in season 3 (more on this one later).

So where do Miyana and Aaravos fit into this? Both fulfill a similar role in allowing their mages to actually have a chance to succeed. Karim, so far, has been failing hilariously at every single goal he has attempted. Like, the man has not had a single success. Not even half a success. It’s sad. But, again, at the end of season 5, Miyana returns to him with a full army and reaffirms her loyalty to him. Karim can finally see some hope for his goals to be realized.

Likewise, Viren is failing pretty badly in season 2 until Aaravos steps in. I personally do not think he would have been able to escalate the situation as much as he did if not for Aaravos. He did break serious laws, and was imprisoned for his crimes. Aaravos is the reason he got out, kept Claudia by his side, rose to power, managed to bring an army into Xadia, and fortified said army. Without Aaravos, Viren’s “bright future for humanity” probably would have remained a distant dream. And this brings us to our first main parallel:

Both Miyana and Aaravos provide an army in some way to their mages.

While Viren technically had an army already, Aaravos helped him fortify it so that he had a decent shot at winning. He ACTUALLY allowed Viren hope for his dreams to be realized. Miyana brought a real army, which allows Karim some hope for his dreams to be realized.

They also both used some form of betrayal (disguising Viren as a prisoner, pretending to be loyal to Janai) to help their mages acquire a sun seed in accompaniment with said army. These physical embodiments of power make it even remotely possible for the mages to have some sort of chance at achieving their goals.

Miyana and Aaravos also, at some point, both affirm their loyalty to the mage they are working with, and continue to prove it through their actions.

I think these quotes are very similar in terms of intention. Both Viren and Karim are initially worried that Aaravos and Miyana betrayed them, but Aaravos and Miyana not only affirm their loyalty, but continue to act upon that by actively helping their mages succeed. And Viren and Karim accept this fairly easily, because let’s be honest, they don’t have many other options.

Also, I just find it interesting that we have these two scenes which are very similar in framing, with Miyana taking the exact (physical) place of Aaravos. Viren and Karim both cut their hands with a knife and use their blood in some form of ritual. While Aaravos is encouraging this, Miyana is very much against it.

As a bonus, the staffs are on the same side of the room lol

Of course, these don’t necessarily mean anything, but I do think that it’s possible that Miyana will play a similar role to Aaravos, in terms of guiding Karim. If there’s any chance for this poor man to make it, it’s her.

#the dragon prince #aaravos #viren #karim #miyana #my analysis #parallels #relationships #miyana is karim's guiding star #yes the intentions differ greatly but I do think the similarities are notable #character analysis

[konmaao3]

The armies of all of the Pentarchy were gathered at the Battle of the Storm Spire.

... all the Pentarchy?

I guess the Independent Isles were just chilling that whole time, huh?

#the dragon prince #meanwhile the Pawprint Isles: boop!

[tales-and-creatures-of-xadia]

Human Kingdom Flags/Emblems

#the dragon prince #tdp #art book #art #emblem #human kingdoms #katolis #duren #neolandia #del bar #evenere #pentarchy

[kazisgirlfriend]

Viren, TDP, and Narcissism

The Dragon Prince has never shied away from depicting mental health issues.

First we had trauma as manifested by magic.

Then we had anxiety as manifested by magic.

Then we had a look at PTSD and depression in Through the Moon.

Which got me thinking, what sort of other mental health issues has TDP been portraying all this time?

Then it sorta hit me, after re-reading one of the show's novels and @jelzorz's rather brilliant fic here (seriously, go check it out), that the show had been exploring a mental disorder that is extremely popular as a character trait, but rarely discussed in fiction - narcissism.

Narcissism (or Narcissistic Personality Disorder) is one of the more common personality disorders, so it's kind of surprising that it is so widely misunderstood. Usually, people don't seem to have a lot of interest in narcissists outside of demonizing them, and in shows they often make great antagonists (or even fun protagonists) without exploring this inner psyche much more beyond that. So it's natural that narcissism is also explored in TDP as well.

If the title wasn't a dead giveaway, what I'm trying to say is Lord Viren is a narcissist.

I should probably preface this with a couple things. First, I'm not saying that Viren is a psychopath. Psychopaths don't really care what other people think of them, while narcissists are constantly preoccupied with how other people see them. Narcissists deeply crave validation and respect from others to feed their egos and self-worth. Narcissists also don't have a problem telling right from wrong; quite the opposite, in some ways narcissists are not only able to tell right from wrong, they for the most part want to do right because of their desire to be liked or at least as seen as important.

Viren doesn't qualify as a psychopath, but in re-reading his POV and rewatching key scenes from the show, Viren quite easily meets the official definition of a narcissist. His desire for recognition, even and especially in high-stress situations, reaches alarming levels. His love for his children is genuine but it's clear he sees them mainly as an extension of himself.

More importantly, of the nine signs of narcissistic personality disorder, Viren meets a,uh, breathtaking number of them. Namely all of them.

A grandiose sense of self-importance

Viren kept his gaze steady. It seemed the other rulers had not doubted his lie. They accepted at face value not only that Ezran was alive, but that Viren had been made regent. And why wouldn’t they accept it? In a more rational world, it would be true, and the council would have entrusted me with the leadership of Katolis.

Book 2: Sky - Chapter 17 "Summit at the Pentarchy"

Preoccupation with fantasies of unlimited power, influence, or success 

For once, can't these imbeciles treat me appropriately? Maybe when I save them all from Xadia I'll be greeted with greater respect. "I suppose 'Welcome Lord Viren' would have been too much to ask," Viren said.

Book 2: Sky - Chapter 17 "Summit at the Pentarchy"

A belief that they are special and can only be around people who are important or special

They all want to meet with you. They think of you as the leader of Katolis. Viren could barely wait for the meeting. These leaders had only seen him on the sidelines. But he knew all about them.

Book 2: Sky - Chapter 17 "Summit at the Pentarchy"

A need for excessive admiration

Was he really ready to give his life for thousands of regular citizens? People he didn't know and would never meet? But on the other hand, he would be remembered forever as a hero. "I can help," Viren said to Harrow.

Book 2: Sky - Chapter 19 "Heart of the Titan"

A sense of entitlement

Viren’s face went white with rage. He’d come here with the best of intentions, prepared to give his life, and the king was too stubborn to even listen. He curled one lip up. “Oh, are you sure you wouldn’t prefer ‘Your Royal Highness’? Or ‘Your Esteemed Inimitable Majesty’ perhaps?” Harrow didn’t deserve the loyalty Viren had been prepared to offer.

Book 2: Sky - Chapter 9 "Viren's sacrifice"

Taking advantage of others to achieve their own ends

A lack of empathy

“Ohhhh. Yes, who wouldn’t have a problem with dark magic?” Viren sneered. “It’s clever, it’s brilliant, it’s practical. You are too stubborn to make use of the tools that are available to you. It will save your life, just as it has saved the lives of countless others.” “It’s a shortcut,” King Harrow snapped back. “We may not pay now, but we will pay the blood price eventually.” “Now you’re starting to sound like her,” Viren said with a smirk.

Book 1: Sky - Chapter 5 "The Letter and the Serpent"

Envious of others or believe that others are envious of them

Arrogance of otherwise haughty behavior

Viren laughed derisively. Such a question could only come from an ignoramus. He looked at the other council members and shook his head, trying to bring them into his confidence.

Book 2: Sky - Chapter 2 "The Breach"

Viren's narcissism drives his central flaws. His hunger for personal recognition eclipses his concern for collective welfare, even when Katolis faces catastrophe. His children become conduits projecting his ambitious legacy rather than cherished loves unto themselves.

However, unlike most shows, TDP doesn't use Viren's narcissism to demonize him. Instead, the show threads the needle by making Viren both villainous and sympathetic as a result of narcissism, since it's both the reason he does awful things but also his shield from the perception of vulnerability and worthlessness.

It's important to remember that narcissists are not only capable of self-loathing, it is often a key part of their condition. That grandiose sense of important mentioned earlier is often a thin veneer hiding feelings of shame, self-doubt, and self-hatred. Obsessive self-loathing is a form of narcissism.

But the show lays bare these vulnerabilities, letting us see his internal struggles to do right constantly brush against his emotional needs that never seem to be met. He walks right up to the line of doing something noble...

...and then shirks at the last minute.

However, just because Narcissistic Personality Disorder is a chronic, lifelong condition doesn't mean that narcissists are incapable of change. And indeed, Viren hits a breakthrough in the most recent season.

One element of narcissism is that they love extremely conditionally, and see their loved ones (particularly their children) as an extension of themselves. Indeed, Viren does "love" his children in this way, particularly Claudia, who he sees as people he can mold into his own image. Unfortunately, for Claudia, this seems to have Gone Horribly Right.

But in the end, Viren recognizes his own behavior and breaks out of it. He sees how pushing Claudia to be like him - to be an extension of himself - has brought her to ruin.

While it's fun to watch characters who are blind to their own faults and lack of self awareness, it is equally rewarding watching Viren reach this moment of clarity. Most narcissists are oblivious to the harm they cause others (since hurtful behavior is just collateral damage to having their emotional needs met), but Viren now realizes the harm he has caused Claudia. Witnessing Claudia’s self-destruction, his conscience awakens to recognize his culpability for exploiting her for his own ego.

Treating her downfall as his personal failing is a real breakthrough for him. Which is why it makes sense that, once Viren reaches this level of awareness, taking a principled, noble stance against his own personal interests quickly follows.

Anyway, those are just my takes on this deep, complex character. If you made it this far, thank you for reading!

#tdp #viren #claudia #soren #callum #ezran #dark magic #aaravos

[juice-thief-frog]

Hypothesis: Rejecting Dark Magic Could Save Viren's Life? Season 5-6 Theory!

This theory/speculation/thought experiment won't leave me alone so I'm gonna officially shout it out into the world!

There's a chance that Viren could maybe have unfucked saved himself.

We're all wondering - did Viren survive season 5? Has he kicked the bucket for good this time? Or is he like that cockroach you just can't get rid of?

I have some unfortunate (or maybe fortunate) news! Viren could definitely be alive!

And it's about dark magic, power, and fever dreams!

Those dark magic dreams Viren had all season had to mean something more! A push for Claudia to go full baddie? Yeah, most likely. We've all seen the Season 6 teaser.

But what if those fever dreams meant something... more?

What if it leads up to more than just Viren's ultimate end?

tl;dr - What if by rejecting dark magic, Viren unknowingly saved his own life? AKA: I dive into Viren's mind, and try to decipher his character arc a teeny bit.

Let's goooooo-

I have little evidence to back up this 'what if'. But I have something, however small.

So, to start this off:

"Tomorrow, the sun will rise, and you will not."

At first this sounds pretty clear - and it might still be! Viren could be sleepin' with the Xadian fishes. But when has Aaravos ever been perfectly clear? Mr 'I Swallowed Her' speaks in riddles and rhymes, and does he even know what the fuck he's talking about? (of course he knows, he's Aaravos, what am I thinking-)

One alternative take on this cryptic little message could be that the old Viren can't come to the phone right now. Because he's dead.

Viren rejected dark magic for the first time ever! He finally sees what Harrow has been seeing all along - dark magic twists you, twists everything around you, into corruption. We can see this with the corrupted Banthers - and Viren's face.

The sun will rise, and the old Viren will be dead.

But perhaps in his place will come a new man - one with a new goal, a new purpose, new motivations. In writing-terms, this means Viren will basically be a whole new character.

Characters are defined by their goals and motivations.

Since the beginning, Viren's goal has been somewhat the same (a bright future for humanity by using dark magic and overthrowing Xadia). But things have changed for Viren, especially during Seasons 4-5. Viren is completely powerless for the first time since Arc One.

Lord Viren has always been a character defined by his power. Even without using dark magic, he can still influence others to bend to his will.

Example image: Lord Viren threatening the young Crowmaster to summon the Pentarchy.

Lord Viren also takes Gren off the mission to find the missing princes, effortlessly placing Soren and Claudia in charge seconds after Amaya left. Viren convinced Soren to go and kill the princes on this mission.

Whenever his power and authority is threatened, Viren keeps pushing forward. Like the dark mage he was, Lord Viren keeps pushing until he gets the desired outcome. Soren said it best:

So, the truth is, someone who wants you to do horrible things, and convinces you that they're good, that's a villain. My dad... is a villain. And he's only gonna get more powerful, and the more powerful he gets, the more people will listen to him, and believe him, and follow him.

Meeting Aaravos is a pivotal moment in Viren's further pursuit of more power. Aaravos promises Viren more power and influence than ever before. Aaravos guides Viren to send the smoke assassins after the other kingdoms to motivate them by fear. Aaravos brings out the worst in Viren by targeting this fatal weakness.

Ultimately, Aaravos guides Viren to further pursue his hunger for more power. Viren convinced Claudia that Soren misunderstood the assignment of 'kill the princes' (dick move, Viren).

Then they march into Xadia, and take down the Sunfire Kingdom. And Aaravos takes Viren to the top of the Storm Spire to capture every essence of magic from baby Zym.

Power, power, and more power. Take a sip of water every time I write 'power', honestly.

So Viren falls to his death, and Claudia brings him back 2 years later. The fourth season begins, and Viren is already different. He is powerless. He isn't even wearing his High Mage attire, instead he's in bloodied and dirty prisoner clothes.

He's travelling with an elf, and he doesn't have his staff. He realises he doesn't even want his staff anymore. He's suddenly horribly afraid of heights, and is obviously frustrated about how he's losing power over everything.

His own mind and body are warring against him. He's going to die in 30 days, and he's experiencing panic attacks. Viren is falling apart worse than his tattered clothes.

And after he finally uses dark magic? He ends up passing out, and missing out on his last few days alive. Instead he's thrust into visions for days on end. Interesting to note that Callum didn't suffer from his own visions as long as Viren did. (perhaps because Viren does indeed have a long history of dark magic?)

These visions take Viren into his past, makes him look at everything in a new way. He sees the harm he caused, sees every scar he left on the world. In his pursuit of power, he ripped everything he loved apart. Including his own children. Soren hates him, and Claudia is diving deeper and further than Viren had ever gone.

It is the vision of Claudia that seems to shake Viren the most. To see what corrupted path he has laid out for his children horrifies him. To see Claudia follow this path so eagerly puts the final nail in the coffin.

No dark magic, never again.

Viren is done with dark magic, and he's done with Aaravos. He's done with his pursuit of power. He's ready to be free.

Interesting to note is that his past self is the one reaching out and holding on here. Reconnecting with his roots, his oldest beliefs.

--

At the end of the season, Viren is the most powerless he has ever been.

Laying under the stars, he cannot even find comfort in their shine. They remind him of Aaravos, and of all the mistakes Lord Viren has made. He certainly doesn't feel free.

He's chosen not to kill The Being, he's chosen to align himself with his roots. His roots as a young man dreaming of things far bigger than himself. He turns his eyes away from the stars, no longer reaching for them. Instead he closes his eyes, and awaits death's embrace.

What happens next?

Well, maybe the rejection of his old life leads him to find a new path. Maybe rejecting the call of dark magic puts him out of Aaravos' reach, and he can finally become someone better.

But I guess we won't know for certain until Season 6. So pls share your own thoughts and observations! I'd love to see what you all come up with!

#viren #dragon prince #these theories are just pouring outta me #where are they even coming from??? #anyway i hope you enjoy my 2am ramblings #i wrote this during a power outage #sweating profusely #because it's so hot #despite the fact that it's literally raining outside #but summer rain can do that #anyway #viren might survive! #or maybe not #it really depends on what the writers decide #but i think he's alive #i don't think the writers will end his life so tragically #doesn't seem to align with the overall hopeful tone of the dragon prince #i might add onto this #but for now #PLEASE tell me your thoughts! #thanks for reading my garbage!! #tdp #the dragon prince #theory #dragon prince theory #dragon prince meta #dragons #princes #and mages #and high mages

[raayllum]

I forget if I’ve ever fully elaborated on my “in show, humans almost always Thematically have the moral high ground because, although they are marked by dark magic, they are also always the ones Introducing the idea of Breaking the Cycle to elves” thoughts here on tumblr rather than discord, but re: the show’s themes of solidarity against group fear mongering (Viren) or cold isolationism (Xadia)

It’s perfectly on brand to me that the humans, likewise, are the ones wanting to solve and fix problems together, whether in their interpersonal and political relationships, such as the main cast or in the cases like the Queens of Duren coming to Katolis at all

whereas Xadia, either out of love or hatred, insist on pruning the tree / sticking to their own, etc.

and it’s a worldview divide that is also most reflected in the humans who are most like the Xadians they despise 

and I just think it’s Neato

#tdp #tdp meta #mini meta #analysis series #arc 1 #arc 2 #the gang's all here #the cycle #the pentarchy #xadia #analysis #the dragon prince #aka i think posting one last meta before bed helps me sleep lmao #also very nervous about that shot in 4x04 now with the trio almost set up like Dominoes but post for another day maybe #misc

[kradogsrats]

time for another installment of "passages that are being cut from the fic I'm working on but I don't want to have vanish into the ether":

"What did the king want?" he asked. Kpp’Ar glanced at him, then sighed. “The king has forced himself into a difficult position. The conflict he insists on stoking at the border is becoming unpopular—the kingdom tires of sending its sons and daughters to fight for his pride, only for them to never return. “So he has seized upon a creative solution, one that could present a show of force sufficient to cow Xadia, but also reduce the loss of soldiers’ lives to appease his own people. He chases a dream of weapons of unprecedented devastation—siege engines joined with dark magic such that they will level entire armies. That is what he wishes me to produce for him.” Viren shivered. “Have you built something like that before?” “I have. A prototype—the only one of its kind.” “Did it work?” “Not in the way I hoped it would.” Kpp’Ar sighed again. “It was a long time ago. I’ve since learned that some dreams are better left unpursued.”

#kradogsfic #main problem here is that is about 50% too many words for kpp'ar to use in one sitting lmao #but yeah ha ha i was not kidding about the pentarchy geneva conventions

[mandaloriandragontrainer]

callum is traveling with rayla to another country in the pentarchy for an important meeting for peace blatant racism towards rayla is shown, and he just walks out, he gives them a very harsh peace of his mind and walks out, “I don’t want peace with these [bleep]”

“Callum, ya can’t throw away ev’rythin’ ya worked for here for mah sake—”

“Rayla, if they don’t accept you, then I won’t have anything to do with them.”

#callum’s a decent diplomat #until rayla is involved #the dragon prince #callum #rayla #rayllum #answered asks #ok12857