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midorihiyori · 2 months

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wow! hi! no worries i actually do appreciate this as it gives me an opportunity to clear up the misconceptions you had with my post because i feel like you have misinterpreted my intent here. I'm not going to get into every little thing you added to this post because i do think it gets nitpicky but you have good points! i could have said a lot more in my original post because i did stop writing early due to getting burnt out and i didn't want to anymore but i can make up for it nooow.

ok here we go again

I would like to highlight this bit: i genuinely don't see how this post disproves the view that 'soushin is a toxic ship' so i wrote a response to OP's points. I did not once say this post was to disprove that soushin is toxic. Most of this post is them saying "that doesn't mean it's healthy though," I know, I didn't say it was. I view it as a pretty toxic pairing myself, the two characters are morally grey in the plot of a death game, I'd argue most of the relationships in this media are considered toxic. but you don't really see people harassing others over loving shin and kanna's sibling dynamic despite shin's blatant exploitation of kanna during the death game but i digress!! The anon was asking how i believe that soushin is not 'proship' or abusive. I made my points to defend against the claim of it being proship because often times people will use this term to describe the ship in order to justify harassment against those who enjoy it or label it as 'problematic' creating the (mostly western) fandom consensus of the ship being BAD!! As the anon said, they claim it is proship because midori abused shin and shin was his victim. that's no good, that's an unsubstantiated claim. a headcanon being expressed as fact. the whole proship controversy isn't something i would prefer to even give the time of day seeing as its really stupid but I'm of the opinion that its only morally acceptable as long as the toxic or bad aspects of relationships are not romanticized or fetishized. It's not right to label someone as a proshipper because they ship soushin due to the overwhelmingly negative connotation of 'proship' aswell as the insinuated support for fictional pedophilia, incest ect. <- bad stuff

but i'm toootally getting off topic of the response post! lets continue

They say a couple times that my evidence is mostly assumptions and i'm hypocritical for doing so but it was never my intention to prove indefinitely that soushin isn't abusive, i was simply explaining my interpretation of their relationship and explaining my stance on it. I mean surely if people can tell me I'm romanticizing abuse due to how they see a pairing then I have the right to show them how I see the pairing, no?

alright specific points now

They bring up how i assume things about Midori's age but that's kinda the whole point of the post as I've already expressed. but I would like to point out this to add some more to my soushin theory crafting. “They were in highschool together” completely avoids the fact that midori didn't even go to shin’s school (said in the quote "I only found this out later, but... He wasn't even a student at my school." - of which a screenshot was included so that kind of confused me) I feel like it would make sense for this to be the case, i could easily see him having been homeschooled by his mother for asu-naro and the like. I feel like it makes sense midori wouldn't need to transfer schools because of asu-naro as well but i also doubt they would make midori pretend to be a student if he wasn't in the age range of one. when he could take the part of an adult just as if not easier like he had in the other situations, he could take the role of school counselor like with gin. But if he was a teenager it makes sense to have gone the student route. I'm getting side tracked again but I also saw another reblog that said something about Midori needing years of schooling for playing the role of a nurse/councilor/officer etc. I would just like to say I highly highly doubt that he actually did the actual educational/training requirements for these positions due not only because of just how long that would take (upwards of 6 years) but because why would he need to do that? I mean it just seems like a waste of time when he is part of such a powerful organization that controls so much behind the scenes, they could definitely just pull some strings and get him the positions. but anyway

Sure, its sad, whatever. That doesnt automatically make his actions okay. This point is irrelevant.

this point i think is funny i like it but i will clarify i was just being silly i apologize if my sarcasm was not clear in the text when i said "awww. isnt that so sad" i was in no way justifying his actions, just a bit of fun

as for the eye contact thing when shin ai was talking about their relationship i had planned to say more in my original post but really i couldn't think of anything to say funnily enough. like yeah that's a weird thing to do. and i ended up forgetting to add anymore on that, same thing with the midori not actually being a student at shin's school. fellas is it problematic abuse proship to be suspicious and weird really it comes down to my main point that claiming it is abusive, grooming, etc. is wrong. that was the point of my post and i feel like we mostly agree as you said you don't believe it is abusive, just some misunderstanding that's alright. I hope you understand what i meant a bit better now. i don't see soushin as "abusive or not abusive" i'm just trying to put it into the terms they do. shin and midori are two complicated characters with a complicated relationship and i like them lots I do really enjoy how you articulated this post! I completely respect the way you view these characters and I do feel like you have a good grasp of this, I may just have not made myself clear enough in the first place. If you do want to keep debating feel free to reach out again because I do have a blast reading what you have to say.

ok thank s for reading

u said ur not a proshipper and stuff but isnt soushin a proship tho.... abuser x victim>???? and shin saw midori like the older brother he didnt have../??? /gen

Originally I wasn't going to respond to this, I thought it was funny so I giggled at it with my friends and I thought that would be it. But I realized this is a wonderful opportunity to write a really long post disproving these theories that this fandom insists are canon. I’ll start by debunking some common arguments. I put a lot of effort into this and am actually using proper grammar IM SERIOUS GUYS!!! This is really long by the way

“Shin saw Midori like an older brother”

I’ll get this argument out of the way first because it’s weak, it’s a common trope in media where relationships are described as familial to show the closeness of the relationship. Even so, Shin probably said that because he looks up to Midori and respects him. If you just want to see them as having a brotherly relationship, that’s fine, but this argument doesn’t stand for calling Soushin proship.

“Midori groomed Shin”

I honestly have no idea where this theory even came from. Some people say that Midori preyed on Shin and that he was much older, while it’s more likely they are both in the same age range. Shin is canonically 21-22 years old while Midori’s age isn’t stated, but since they were in highschool together it can be assumed he wasn’t all that much older than him. Not saying you can’t headcanon that they aren’t, but you shouldn’t push your headcanons as canon to insist Soushin is proship. Midori changed to Shin’s school so that he could get his signature but he also became his friend in order to make the Shin AI. He could have easily just been a highschooler himself. Midori is an Asu-Naro agent and from what we know about them they have used underaged people for labor (eg. Kai, Sei, Hinako). If the common theory that the silhouette in Kai’s mini episode being Midori’s mom is true, it’s probable that he grew up similarly to Kai and Sei, being made to do Asu-Naro’s bidding as children. It’s not like you need the credentials of an adult to give out contracts. You could also make the argument that Midori must be older because he worked as a nurse and school counselor while trying to get participant signatures, but one could argue Asu-Naro has the connections to get him in such a position without schooling or even have higher levels of schooling to get the education in a shorter timespan. But I’m getting off topic. Many people who say Midori groomed Shin say that he groomed him into believing he had to leave himself behind and that is why he took on Midori’s persona in the death game when it’s clearly not the case in canon. It was Midori who wanted Shin to be the best version of himself.

“And you… should become the person you want to be, so you can meet them proudly.”

This dialogue is part of Shin’s lost memory, where they are talking about Shin’s wish to meet his lost sibling. It’s one of the only shown scenes of Shin and Midori pre-canon, and he’s clearly being supportive and wanting Shin to be happy with himself.

Here ‘???’ is the shadow version of himself, he is having an inner conflict of interest. Commonly referred to as Shadsou, is the actual reason Shin took on Midori’s persona. What Shadsou is exactly is ambiguous but generally it’s the personification of Shin’s devil's advocate. People often assume that Shadsou is another consequence of Midori’s impact on Shin, as if he isn’t his own character who can make his own decisions. This fandom often waters down his character and infantilizes him like this.

“Midori is Shin’s abuser”

Again, another headcanon people insist is canon. The reality is that Midori and Shin’s relationship is ambiguous and it hasn’t been explored much in canon. Soushin can be explored in many different ways because of how vague their relationship is. Saying that Midori abused Shin is an unsubstantiated claim so it’s just a headcanon, not saying you can’t have that but again, you can’t be claiming it’s fact.

This is the one cg we have of Midori and Shin pregame btw:

This is the cg where Midori is encouraging Shin to be someone he’s proud of. Not very abusive guys.

“But it’s implied to be abusive”

This is usually the evidence they use for the implication:

“He’s… a scary friend of mine…”

Midori’s mannerisms are scary. It isn’t just Shin who thinks that he is, he’s one of the main antagonists of the game. Shin finding Midori to be scary doesn’t mean he abused him.

“Though I learned a lot of things at his house…”

It’s insane to me that people use this as evidence but, this is clearly about Midori teaching him how to code. People claim that it has deeper meaning but really it comes down to how you want to interpret it.

There are multiple points where Midori is shown to feel affection in strange ways. It’s possible he didn’t understand ordinary forms of affection, similarly to Kai who was deprived of affection growing up as an agent. Midori’s odd mannerisms towards Shin could just be how he shows his love. awww. isnt that so sad

Many people call Midori Shin’s abuser and claim Soushin is proship without proper canonical proof. A lot of people who kin Shin project onto their relationship and insist that it’s abusive because their bias rooted from their own trauma and experiences clouds their perception of Shin. This happens along with people infantilizing Shin and excusing all of his actions by blaming the supposed ‘grooming’ or ‘abuse’ he experienced from Midori. This is just a common problem with mischaracterization of Shin and Midori by the fandom. It’s gotten to the point where people like this dear anon believe these things to be true!

Then there's the people who ARE proshippers and insist that Soushin is abusive or pedophilic because they want it to be and are looking at them with that lens of thinking. These people greatly help spread the idea that Soushin is a proship, making it much harder to discern canon from fanon when much of the Soushin content is by these people, specifically outspoken adult western fans that praise proship and advocate out for Soushin being problematic, that's what the general fandom now sees it as even though it’s just not canonically happening.

At the time of posting this, Shin’s minisode has yet to come out. I’m sure that once it does it will give a much clearer view of their relationship, maybe I’ll have more to say then! For now, that is all I’ve got for you tumblr.

#im doing this again hey #yttd #soushin #your turn to die #kimi ga shine #i was so surprised when i saw this reblog like wow? hey #thank you though

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midorihiyori · 7 months