#is the same way i'm describing here. it's just reserving that particular tone (i'm better than you and am displeased with you)

[ice-cream-beat]

Hi, I'm an avid reader of Dark Horse Running and Where the End Begins, and I was wondering if you could share more on your thoughts of Vanitas? Specifically makes you think there's something beyond his apparent lust for bloodshed and cruelty towards Ven? Do you think there's any chance of a redemption for in the series? And also, how would you ever write/how do you picture pre-split Ven's characterization?

Hello! Sure thing! And I apologize in advance for how long this is inevitably going to be. 8D;

Specifically makes you think there’s something beyond his apparent lust for bloodshed and cruelty towards Ven?

This really isn’t something I attribute to him personally as much as

A) one of KH’s big themes is that darkness isn’t inherently bad, it’s what you choose to do with it that makes you who you are. Obviously, Vanitas has chosen to give into it entirely, but I think he has the potential to control it. The first comparison you could make is to Riku and Terra, but the biggest difference between those three, obviously, is that Vanitas doesn’t have a strong light in his heart to balance his darkness (not anymore, anyway) which is what calls into question whether it’s even really possible for him to change. But I think it’s a bit more accurate to compare him to Xehanort – a case of someone who’s given into darkness, but who (and I’m putting all my bias for the Wayfinder trio aside to say this objectively) isn’t actually evil. Xehanort does some terrible, terrible things of course, but even Nomura up and stated that Xehanort isn’t a “monster.” He never does things just for the sake of being cruel; everything he does has a purpose behind it. Granted, that doesn’t excuse anything he’s done and he’s still a terrible person, obviously, but it’s still a step above someone like Vanitas, who clearly enjoys hurting and mocking others, and who legitimately got excited when talking about the impending Keyblade War when he had nothing to gain from it besides participation and/or watching the apocalypse happen.

THAT SAID, I think there’s a grey area between Ultimately Good Guys who use darkness like Terra and Riku, and Utterly Evil Villains Who Are Swamped In Darkness like Vanitas. But I’ll talk more on that in a bit.

B) I think he’s as human as Ven is. Even though Vanitas was created unnaturally, I figure that he and Ven are really the same when you get down to it, since they each come from the same heart, and the only real difference was that Vanitas was given a new, separate body. And since all humans are potentially redeemable (in my opinion), I think Vanitas could change if he wanted (keywords: “if” and “wanted”).

And while it’s sometimes tough to figure out when Xehanort’s lying, when he’s telling a half-truth, and when he’s being honest, I also personally think that what he told Terra – “He has no control over the darkness in his heart[…] He’s an abomination beyond hope of salvation.” – was probably a lie, considering almost everything else in that conversation was false. Putting Vanitas down as irredeemable (whether or not it’s true in the end) was probably Xehanort’s way of ensuring that Terra would have no doubts about potentially tracking down this kid and killing him as he was told to do.

tl;dr: Xehanort lies a lot and I don’t think you can use what he says about Vanitas as definitive fact.

Do you think there’s any chance of a redemption for in the series?

WELL… if you’ve read those two fics of mine, then it’s probably obvious that I believe it’s possible, yes – but do I think canon will go out of its way to set up the circumstances that Vanitas needs to turn around? I’m really not sure. tbqh my dream scenario for KH3 is that everyone gets redeemed to some degree, that nobody has to die and we get the ultimate happy ending, and I personally find this to be more likely than just one or two villains getting redeemed. So specifically – disclaimer: I have nothing to back this up, this is purely speculation – I would think Vanitas only stands a chance at surviving and turning around if Xehanort does. From a plot/meta standpoint, it would probably make more sense for Vanitas (who is legit darkness incarnate) to be redeemed only if Xehanort (who’s given into darkness without letting it take total control of him, as I mentioned above, and is thus arguably an “easier” case of redemption than Vanitas) is as well.

To go deeper into it, though, I actually think Vanitas would stand a better chance of being redeemed if Xehanort survives. And before anyone jumps on me about how Xehanort mistreated him and is at fault for the way he is and shouldn’t be allowed anywhere near him etc etc etc – first, I don’t acknowledge the light novels, and I think Vanitas would have been screwed up with or without Xehanort in his life. He had the natural inclination towards evil because of what his heart was made up of. Second, consider the circumstances of Vanitas’ life. Ever since being born, he’s had a purpose: fight Ventus, create the X-blade, usher in the Keyblade War. He trained for it for four years straight. If my suspicions are right and he’s one of the Thirteen in KH3, then again, he has a clear-cut purpose that defines his unnatural existence.

So even if he survives the War in KH3, his life will be radically different because he doesn’t have a purpose to fight towards anymore. Sure, Eraqus could adopt him with the rest and tell him to fight for the good side now, but what reason does Vanitas have to just suddenly throw away all his bias and beliefs, changing the way he is and suddenly fighting alongside the enemies he’s always looked down on? I don’t think it’d be that easy, which is why I say Xehanort could be the key.

Regardless of anyone’s thoughts on Xehanort personally, there’s no denying that he’s always given Vanitas purpose, that he’s the only authority and mentor Vanitas has ever known. He’s the only person Vanitas has had the potential to respect. So I’d think it’s much more likely that Vanitas would follow a reformed Xehanort long before he followed anyone else, especially anyone good and light-centric like Eraqus or Ven.

And you can probably see where these thoughts of mine tie into Where The End Begins, specifically. XD In particular – and I hope I don’t come off as too full of myself by quoting my own fic for my argument – I basically summed it up in this scene:

“I’m… kind of surprised he’s still here, actually.”

“He has nowhere else to go.” There was no pity or concern in Xehanort’s tone; it was simply matter-of-fact, as though this were an obvious truth. “Like anybody, he needs a purpose, and familiarity is always the best starting point.”

Ven didn’t hide his confusion. “You mean he chose to stay with you?”

“I did not twist his arm, if that’s what you are thinking. He is of my making, so I do not deny responsibility in the matter; I gave him some incentive to remain, but nothing more.”

Incentive…? Ven frowned. As far as he knew, Vanitas was assisting with the Heartless problem to kill time, but that was it–

He straightened up a little as a thought occurred to him.

“Wait a minute. He’s not still training under you, is he?”

Leaning his temple against his fist, Xehanort gave a thin smile. “Like yourself, Vanitas has much power, much untapped potential. More than I initially estimated. It would be a shame to let that go to waste.” When Ven’s face darkened, Xehanort added, “Or perhaps you would prefer to have him explore his abilities on his own – unguided and unrestrained?”

“N-No, but…”

“You can sense it, can’t you? He hides it well – remarkably so, considering his nature – but you of all people should know what he is truly like.”

…Although for the sake of fanfic plot, I’m complicating the matter a bit with how Vanitas has trouble putting his past aside and can’t always control those impulses (e.g. when he overdid it in knocking Ven around later on), but my ultimate point is that he does need guidance and purpose, and Xehanort is (for now) the only one who can give him that.

I think it’s also worth mentioning that, even should Vanitas be redeemed canonly, I don’t think he’ll necessarily join up with Sora and the gang as someone with entirely pure interests. I imagine him as more of the lone wolf who acts on his own the vast majority of the time, only grudgingly teaming up when necessary, and who’s really more of a neutral force than strictly a “good guy.”

AND THEN there’s the possibility that Vanitas might die in KH3, but be taken back into Ven’s heart and accept it, and thus be “redeemed” that way.

And also, how would you ever write/how do you picture pre-split Ven’s characterization?

Let me start by saying that I’m avoiding Union X spoilers like the plague, so I’m not taking that into account (on top of the fact that my thoughts on that are VERY COMPLICATED RN) so this conjecture is based entirely on what little we were shown in BBS.

I actually haven’t written Xehanort-era!Ven before, which admittedly surprises even me?? lol. But I’ve thought about it regardless, and I don’t imagine there was that much of a difference between Xehanort-Ven and Eraqus-Ven. I don’t want to use the “Vanitas’ birth” scene as a sole basis for Ven’s personality at the time; it was an extreme situation and Ven’s reaction – fear – was normal, so I don’t really like when people assume he was timid or “pessimistic.” If you took the scene of Eraqus and Ven from the end of BBS out of context, that could give the same impression. The fact that Ven stood up to Xehanort in his own way by refusing to give into darkness – blatantly disobeying his master’s orders – says he had a good sense of right and wrong back then just as he does under Eraqus. Xehanort even describes Ven when he met him as being “too benign” in his reports.

BUT moving from canon evidence to personal thoughts, I imagine Ven was probably more reserved under Xehanort. He probably didn’t have any real friends other than people he might have talked to in passing (assuming Xehanort traveled with him), meaning the majority of his interactions were with Xehanort, who obviously isn’t the most loving teacher, so I picture Ven being quieter and not quite as excitable since Xehanort wouldn’t have responded very enthusiastically to the kind of social butterfly personality that Ven has later. I also like to think he was happy with Xehanort (that flashback scene notwithstanding), but I also headcanon that Ven was an orphan prior, so for an adult take him in and give him an important role and so much attention (even if it wasn’t affectionate) would be kind of a big deal.

Plus he would have been curious about everything outside of his homeworld, so he would have asked a lot of questions, and since Xehanort holds intelligence in such high esteem, I can picture him taking the time to explain and pass on even some irrelevant knowledge, which again would make Ven feel respected and important. And that could have then led to Ven doing everything he could to respect and please Xehanort in return (again, that one flashback notwithstanding, since his morals/fear were called into question), so I also figure Ven probably tried to be as well-behaved as possible and mimic Xehanort’s behavior to a degree, reinforcing the idea that he wasn’t as talkative or prone to getting excited over everything at the drop of a hat as he is in BBS.

….THAT WAS SUPER LONG, SORRY. And I hope that rambling made some sense?? lol. Thank you for the questions, though, it’s fun to think about. :D

#ask #salve-sis #kingdom hearts #ventus #vanitas #xehanort #text post #mine #tl;dr #fanfic #headcanon #two cents #long post