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eyesanddragons · 1 year

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Sorry if this is a weird question but like. What are your thoughts on the whole Darkstalker/Peacemaker thing? Like I get that Kinkajou was trying to help but I feel like erasing all of his memories and experiences was. Kinda an iffy way to do it? I'm trying to figure out if this is something other people think or if it's just me.

It bothers me immensely and I don't like it! Actually I hate it! I talked about it before but I hate it so so much, it's a terrible way to resolve the plot and it goes against all the themes and there's some serious tone dissonance with how Kinkajou reacts and the reality of the situation and it's chock full of horrifying implications- I don't like it.

Uh...I'll try to say something more coherent uh- I think the Strawberry scene has a lot of problems, especially in the way they treat Darkstalker.

Darkstalker is a Lost Cause. Darkstalker could of never Been Better because he Couldn't Be Better, he's inherently bad, somehow. His soul was corrupted by his magic, and such.

They even alluded to this in Darkstalker Legends, his opening has him be ominous and mysterious as he hatches from his egg...when he was a baby.

This, bothers me. It's ignoring the impact Arctic had on Darkstalker as a child and attributing it to inherent evil. Darkstalker isn't bad because he was treated in a way that caused him to grow up in an unhealthy way, he's bad because he was born with a lot of power.

What the strawberry scene is saying, is that, since Darkstalker was just, born more evil. It is right to rewrite his mind. All the other people he did it to? That's bad (though the treatment of Fierceteeth is a...whole other issue) but if He was affected by it? It's fine, because Darkstalker is Evil.

It's another situation where WoF Is being frustratingly black and white about a serious issue.

Arc 2 is about being forced into a box you don't fit in and/or being outcasted because you don't fit and the trauma resulting from that. It's about what society wants from you and how that affects people. It's about preconceived notions and how that affects others. It's about focusing too much on what someone is rather than what they do.

Qibli is worried about not being good enough and lies to protect himself because the last time he wasn't good enough he was sold off, Winter is an abused child dealing with not being Good Enough for his kingdom (and his family), Turtle hides to protect himself so that he doesn't have to live up to any expectations, Moon is isolated from everyone due to either being a Nightwing, or not being on the volcano and has to deal with hearing other people's thoughts and the Future weighing on her the entire time. Kinkajou is constantly underestimated due to being a Rainwing. And Peril is trying to reconcile her bloody past, with who she actually is, with who people think she is.

When Darkstalker rewrites People's Minds he is literally forcing people to be someone else. Darkstalker was literally gonna do a genocide because he had a preconceived idea about Two Entire Kingdoms. Darkstalker expects the Jade Winglet to be like his friends.

I don't like him and I really think they should of just made him Evil and Bad instead of trying to do whatever this is.

But in WoF canon he is not pure evil, he is a product of his time, a reminder of the mistakes made by the people around him. He is a genocidal manipulator because of the abuse he suffered and the multiple tragedies in his life.

Darkstalker, Having his mind rewritten, against his Will, goes against Everything! It goes, no, Darkstalker would always be like this. That Darkstalker couldn't of been prevented, that some people are just inherently evil.

So uh yeah, I don't like the strawberry.

#wof #wof darkstalker #wings of fire #asks #so so sorry for how this is

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sunshine-jesse · 4 months

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I have multiple thoughts I want to express after reading multiple of your Coffinalyses again.

Isn’t it interesting that the character development for Andrew, the more subtle manipulator of the siblings, is generally agreed to be harder to miss than that of Ashley, Ms. Black Heart on her Long Sleeves, whose is of such subtlety, few in the fanbase could/would recognize it for themselves, instead letting the cognitive bias inclined by the initial narrative insist he’s but a footstool? Maybe it’s difficulty seeing past her awesome fat tits?

Do you think it’s plausible that as kids (or not) Andrew would covertly fake/induce a sickness in himself just to make Ashley feel needed (as his nurse) and sooth her insecurities?

What do you make of a personality swap AU? There’s a take that if such were canon, the game would be in the realm of less enjoyable, more contentious, or something like that. That sound like a reasonable take?

Have you seen a post that highlighted the significance of the different ending shots of Chapter 2 (mark of the demon on Andrew’s cigarette-holding palm vs cleaver, cigarette pack, & lighter in the backseat)? I’m not sure if this was also pointed out in that post, but in Burial, the sibs have determined their next move- new identities and keeping the hell away from the scene of Mr. Washing Machine’s corpse; in Decay, they’ve got no established plans beyond the possibility of murder-suicide and fighting over Ashley once again using the Andy nickname.

I wonder if you’ve thought of writing an analysis in fanfic form from Andrew’s perspective, like you did with It wasn’t ok.

Ashley's character development being hard to notice is twofold: The assumptions many make going into the story make it difficult to conceptualize it as a change. Sometimes it's garden-variety misogyny, sometimes people just don't alter their frames of reference as the story goes on and view every action through the lens of her as a toxic abuser trying to control Andrew. Usually the two are linked. The other issue is that her change doesn't have as blatantly visible an effect on the narrative's as Andrew's does. You have to really go into the weeds to see how different things would've been if Ashley actually didn't change, and you can manifest that refusal to truly change in the story through the decisions you make in the basement.

I think that's pretty plausible, yeah.

Currently, TCOAAL has a lot to say about gender roles and expectations. It's kinda (not really) covert, but it's there. A personality swap AU would undermine that. If the writer of said AU is aware of that, go off, kings and queens, but the work itself would be much less thematically coherent, yeah. A lot of personality swap AUs I've seen also rely on fundamental misunderstandings of the characters lmao

The way chapter 2 ended makes me think Decay will focus a lot more on the siblings than the world around them. Maybe it'll have more of the flashbacks we see in the dev logs? Dunno. It's probably gonna rip me apart either way.

I don't spiritually relate as much to Andrew as I do to Ashley so I think I'd have a lot of difficulty writing a fic from his perspective.

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scream-away-the-day · 1 year

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Mm, it would seem no coherent thoughts have come to me, instead I have been hit with the realisation that Hermie is, in fact, Double Trouble from She Ra and that he would embody them as much as he could after he discovers them.

How would he find out this fact? It all starts with Normal going through Hero's online library (and I do mean library, because it's fucking massive) of anime and cartoons in an attempt to relate to Taylor more. Instead of finding an anime that he wants to watch, he stumbles across She Ra and he gets Hooked.

Normal watches all 5 seasons over the course of a weekend, gelling hard with the characters, the colours, the themes of friendship. My boy, for lack of a better term, hyperfixates.

Anyway, as he's watching he sees his friends in the characters. Scary is Catra: a girl that's lost, that has people keep leaving her, that is fighting for what she thinks she believes in because she's finally getting attention and validation even as she misses her friends on the other side, a side she doesn't think she can get to (also Willy is Shadow Weaver, a manipulative asshole that preys on vulnerable young people and uses emotional and physical abuse to make them bend to his will).

Link is Bow: someone that values friendship and trust above all else, who can hold a grudge when he gets betrayed. He loves his dads even if their relationship is strained sometimes, and he's almost always the one to get them back on track when they start down one tangent or another.

Taylor is Frosta: someone quick to violence but very loyal and loving, even if he doesn't express it in traditional ways. He's also very enthusiastic and (despite very clearly being the main character, obviously) is willing to help his friends, even at risk of endangering himself.

Normal sees himself in Scorpia. She's so friendly, and she tries so hard, and he relates to holding onto friends too tightly because he's afraid of them leaving. He relates to being the peacekeeper and mediator, bending over backwards to try and keep his friends happy. He relates to having a core piece of his identity being taken from him, twisted into something he isn't sure he can be or relate to anymore.

As he goes further through the seasons, Normal has fun with the show while also hurting for the characters. When DT first shows up in the Crimson Waste, he's on edge, worried about what this new character might do, but as he goes through and DT starts to turn up more regularly he becomes endeared to them, enjoying them and the chaos they bring even as it kinda fucks up what the Princess crew are trying to do. It isn't until Normal sees how DT interacts with Catra while they infiltrate Brightmoon that he really starts to see some Hermie in them.

It start when DT calls Catra "kitten". Normal has a vivid flashback to Hermie saying almost the exact same thing to him, and from there the parallels only become more apparent. The casually flirty nature, the ability to disappear into roles (shape-shifting, surprisingly, included) the confidence in themselves but still needing a role to slip into to stay safe. There are some bits that don't translate quite so well - Normal's fairly certain that Taylor isn't paying Hermie to stick around with them (or maybe friendship is just Hermie's currency... Huh), and the thought of Hermie betraying them after all they've been through together just doesn't quite sit right although if it happened with Scary it could happen with anyone.

Anway, after this, Normal feels like he can't just keep this reaslisation to himself and so he trawls the mess the internet has become and sends Hermie a DT compilation video with a very simple "its u :)" for context. Normal sees that Hermie reads the message but thats it, no response or anything so Normal, a little saddened that his friend didn't seem to like the comparison, goes about his day.

The next time Normal sees Hermie, he has his hair slicked back, is dressed in green-and-black skin-tight everything, has coloured contacts, and heeled boots that seem too high to walk in (Hermie, of course, manages to flawlessly). He even seems to be able to blink sideways like DT. As he walks past, all Hermie does is glance at Normal, wink, and purr "kitten" in a low voice before strutting away. Normal nearly blacks out from the rush of blood to his face.

#hermie is a flamboyant bitch he just cant help himself #flustering normal is his favourite hobby #when he sees the video normal sends him all he thinks is “i see an opportunity” and by god does he take it #hermie the unworthy #normal oak #oakworthy #lincoln li wilson #taylor swift dndads #scary marlowe #willy stampler #dndads #dndads s2 #she ra #double trouble

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twdmusicboxmystery · 1 year

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My Re-Watch of Ghosts, Part 4

@wdway:

I can't wait to read your next Carol/Beth timeline segment, @galadrieljones! It fit well with @twdmusicboxmystery's thoughts from Ghosts. The photos below I believe was to emphasize the white cross on the black crate (that also has diamond shapes) and the black car white cross car that carried away Beth from the funeral home.

I don't know if you realize though that there is another tie with Carol's car and Beth, on top of the crate is a IV bag. Which would connect to Beth's IV bag and foreshadows Carol at Grady being watched over and protected by Beth. I can envision the scene and hear Beth telling Carol, "I just want you to know I was here," (paraphrasing.) Loving all of this!

@galadrieljoness:

Oh I forgot about that line. I feel like the fact that Beth speaks to Carol solidifies that Carol was embedded in her timeline, even if only for a little while!! I’m actually super relieved my thoughts are coherent lol. I was so tired when I typed this and I feel like I reordered it and reread it like three times before hitting send so like my brain had gone to bits and I was like “Welp here goes nothing!!”

@wdway:

I've been thinking about how Carol somewhat has no time nor physical boundary. I just wanted to point out that that Maggie, Glenn and Company came in the front. Rick and Company came in the back and reunited in the A train car, but even though we saw Carol shooting rockets into Terminus, we never actually saw her enter nor did we see her leave. It is as if she didn't physically come or go. She was simply there, suspended in space and in time. See, I have been reading and thinking about what you are saying about Carol and time.

@galadrieljones:

That’s super good! It’s true. She just sort of materializes inside and then suddenly she’s in the woods taking off her camouflage. That’s exactly the kind of thing I’m talking about!!

I mean honestly Carol really is sort of like a ghost. Her entire strategy for survival is basically to remain as invisible as possible. It makes a lot of sense based on her past abuse. Daryl exhibits similar tendencies but while Daryl will literally just disappear or simply stay quiet, Carol is more of a chameleon. She can be anyone, fit in anywhere. The ruthless killer, the happy homemaker. She infiltrates the CW via her connections with Lance. She infiltrates the Wolves, infiltrates the Whisperers by manipulating Negan. She infiltrates Terminus. If and when Melissa returns she would be the perfect character to infiltrate the CRM.

@wdway:

I think I have mentioned this before but I'll tell you about it again it concerns codas. There are two others I think we could call them official TWD coda's although they're not in season episodes.

The first coda I believe that we ever saw in the series was in the official trailer for s5 that aired at Comic-Con that summer. The trailer ended and then we had a coda of Beth being slapped by Dawn. Of course we didn't know who the officer was at the time or anything other than that Beth was in hospital scrubs and a policewoman slapped her.

The other coda came the following summer during Comic-Con in the official trailer for s6. Again it was after the trailer ran and then credits came up or the TWD logo if I remember correctly then it went into the coda of Daryl being tied up by Dwight. We found out later when it aired that it was from e6 Always Accountable. I don't know if this would mean anything to you but I just thought I would tell you or remind you of these two other coda's. Now I'm going above and read what you just sent.

@galadrieljones:

Ever since the TTD guy (I think?) referred to the WB coda as a “coda” I feel like this is all really important.

I want to come back and talk some more about Ghosts. I also think I might rewatch The Same Boat now. I honestly think I’ve only seen that episode once lol. I don’t remember liking it that much. But now, with a better lens through which to view the episode, I have a feeling that might change.

The whole theme with Ghosts is “seeing,” or “not seeing.” We just got done talking a lot about how Carol has seen something others have not. She’s the only person who was inside Grady with Beth, who was in Beth’s story and may have witnessed what happened, and how this is connected to what’s going on in Ghosts. Everyone in Ghosts is “not seeing” something, aka they’re in denial, except for Carol.

As I said earlier, Carol is “unstuck.” I think because of this she lacks the blinders that many other characters seem to have, in terms of the truth. In Ghosts, everybody has the thing they want to believe, and the thing they can’t see. The main thing is the question as to whether or not Alpha sent the walkers. Mary says it isn’t Alpha and so does Lydia, but this can’t be true, because then who could it be? The actual truth is too much to handle. It’s too big and the possibilities are ferocious. This is just a precursor to a lot of other ways the characters are in denial.

Michonne and Daryl are repeatedly appeasing Alpha to prevent further bloodshed, and to prevent another war, but the thing is, they need a war. Their inaction or indifference, while simultaneously having overstepped their bounds with Alpha and her “rules” causes them to lose more land, only pushing things further to the brink. The Highway Men are right, in that Alexandria needs to fight. But Michonne and Daryl are like a snake with its head cut off. They aren’t the leaders the community needs. They are still mourning Rick.

Aaron, meanwhile, is in denial about what happened with Eric. Eric fought willingly in the war with the Saviors and died per his own choices to do so. Aaron blames Negan, so Negan projects on Aaron in an uncomfortable way, which is to say, he didn’t protect his wife, and she died. Negan, too, is still in denial about his role in what happened to Lucille, something he doesn’t let go of until Here’s Negan.

But Negan doesn’t really see clearly either, not until he has to face Maggie in 11A, when he reminds her that it was Rick who started that war, and he doesn’t regret his actions. He regrets that Glenn had to pay the price, but he commits that no matter what, somebody had to. That it was Glenn, that’s just fate, and for this, he is sorry, but he wouldn’t go back and change a thing, and he’s not going to grovel.

But Carol. In Ghosts, Carol is having bad dreams but she is able to see the whisperers because her subconscious, cracked open by drugs and lack of sleep and a lack of inhibition or greater purpose, leads her straight to them. Carol sees Alpha for what she is. She knows that Alpha needs to die, and she is sick of the dance they’re doing to appease her. Carol is RIGHT about this but her approach is all wrong, bringing that gun to the meeting, because, just like always, she’s brash and selfish.

Even in Find Me, I want to point out that Carol is right to question Daryl’s sanity, his emotional stability, and what went on with Leah. It’s just, she already fucked that up with what happened to Connie, so nothing she says or does will ever reach him. She was also right btw to try and pursue Alpha in season 10 after what she did the Alexandrias, but again, she did it all wrong. Because rather than find a way to lead, Carol tries to do everything on her own, and it just doesn’t work that way. Carol’s intentions are often right. Her instincts are often spot on. It’s just her approach that causes so many problems.

In Indifference, she grovels to Rick. She says she had to do something, because Rick wouldn’t. She earlier says, “You can be a farmer, Rick. You can’t just be a farmer.” I think in the episode, we are drawn to think of Carol as the indifferent one, because she seems only to be out for herself and what she thinks is right, and this might be true, like what Daryl accuses her of during their fight in Find Me; however, I think Rick is also truly indifferent. He drives Carol away because he can’t commit to dealing with Tyreese, dealing with what to do when somebody does what she did. He can’t make this choice so he just…removes it.

When she says she had to do something, Rick says, “No, you didn’t.” And he’s technically right. But where he’s wrong is that SOMEBODY had to do something. Maybe not THAT, but something. But Carol is selfish, always focused on her own point of view and her own objectives. She’s not a leader. She’s a mother, protecting her young above all others, only her young are all dead, so she has nobody on whom to project this ruthless, selfish mechanism.

This is what causes people to disbelieve her, including Daryl. They assume she’s only out for herself. Carol is not beholden to anyone or any one set of ideals, just as she’s not beholden to any one timeline. She is, however, highly intelligent, and this is something that we see play out in season 11 a little bit, when Carol is sort of past her internal conflicts and her selfishness, and when she’s no longer putting pressure on herself to avenge those she’s lost, but instead, she makes it her entire life goal to help and protect others, like Kelly, like Ezekiel.

In Hunted, for example, she gets flack from Magna for fuelling Kelly’s hope that they will find Connie, and Carol struggles because she’s not sure: Is she actually doing this for Kelly, or is she only trying to make herself feel better? In the end, after everything that happens with the horses, Carol decides that she’s doing it for Kelly after all, and so she defies Magna. Once again, she’s right. They do find Connie. And because her approach is unselfish, everything is okay.

In his dream story, Daryl says something like, even tho his dad was a drug addict, it doesn’t mean he was wrong. This is right. It’s like Carol talking to herself. Just because I’m a selfish co-dependent ruiner doesn’t mean I’m wrong.

Some other notes, related. In his dream story, Daryl’s dad sees a girl being hit by a truck, who disappears. Odd that this is what Carol’s mind would invent, as, back to Grady, she was hit by a car and disappeared. “There was no girl,” Daryl says. Is this some sort of allegory? Is this some sort of story Carol is telling herself about what happened? Intriguing.

Carol is seeing things. They’re real, but not in the way it seems. She’s being lead around by her subconscious. In Fear, we see this happening with Grace in “In Dreams,” very obviously, and also with Siddiq in Open Your Eyes. The subconscious is a storyteller and a truth bomb.

Per Siddiq, he’s REALLY not seeing. He’s traumatized. Siddiq is having flashbacks, when he is with Dante. It’s like Dante’s voice is triggering him, but he doesn’t know it yet. He isn’t seeing. He’s only hearing.

Per the other storylines: It’s important that Negan is the one who sees, while Aaron is blinded. Negan’s act of tough love helps Aaron see again, literally and figuratively, but it also forces Negan to make a choice. Is he loyal to these people? Yes, he is. Or else he would have run. He wouldn’t have helped Aaron. He might have just killed him or let him die. It’s the same with Rosita. She helps Eugene to see. It’s hard but it sets him free, gives him his “crushing moment of clarity.”

Seeing is akin to waking up. Opening your eyes. Eugene talks about how when one is sleep deprived this “enhances impulsivity” as if one is drunk. “Drunk minds speak sober hearts.” Dante brings Siddiq the moonshine. Dante was also a field medic, same as Bob.

In the end, Daryl is smoking a clove cigarette and for a second I thought it was a cinnamon stick.

Idk why they have him smoke that clove cigarette with the brown paper. I don’t know that they’ve had him do that before. He doesn’t smoke a lot in those seasons tbqh.

I think it’s obviously meant to call us back to Alone, and to what Carol saw that he didn’t see. But ofc I am biased.

The ending dream with Henry is weird, because it seems unsettled. It seems like he’s still waiting for her. The compass calls us back to the day she was unstuck.

Carol’s cast. Why did she get a big old cut like that in her arm? This episode is full of broken glass. “Did you have to break the glass?”

The callbacks to Indifference intrigued me, too, because in Indifference, the B story has Daryl and Michonne’s group traveling to the school to find drugs and supplies. In Ghosts, they also go to a school, and the bleeding eyes is consistent with the theme of “not seeing.”

Like at some point, Daryl says something to Michonne about what they need to do about the walkers and she snaps back, “I have eyes.” Aaron goes blind. I’m wondering now if the bleeding eye disease is just a symbol meant to communcate to us that there is something majorly unseen at work.

There’s also something weird, too, about Judith sitting by the window. She just sits there, the whole episode, and RJ is fast asleep. He sleeps through the whole ordeal, like the little Red King. Had me wondering if he wasn’t just dreaming the whole thing. Made me think of how Michonne isn’t seeing them, or like they don’t exist when she’s not there.

She says something like, “It’s not smart to go to sleep unless it’s safe.” This recalls Carol, who is obviously feeling unsafe. Henry told Daryl that story about the reason she used to cut her hair, because Ed used to grab her by the hair, and the fact she let her hair grow out showed that she finally felt safe enough to do so.

Continued tomorrow...

#beth greene #beth greene lives #beth is alive #beth is coming #td theory #td theories #team delusional #team defiance #beth is almost here #bethyl

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lizacstuff · 3 years

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(1/2) At this point, I feel like talking about the last seven episodes of SCK is a bit moot, considering that the amnesia plot is done and the team of writers responsible for most of it is gone, but I am curious to get your opinion on whether you feel Serkan actually fell in love AGAIN with Eda. I personally don't feel that Eda and Serkan had enough meaningful interaction to suggest that he re-fell in love. There was definitely more "telling" than "showing" and the heart "remembering..."

(2/2) ...what the head didn't. I know I'm probably splitting hairs, and at this point, everyone is happy he regained his memory, so who cares? But I'm just feeling very unsatisfied with the storytelling. Meh.

Oh, I disagree. Well somewhat. See, I think they 100% showed us that Serkan fell back in love. However, I do agree that it was very unsatisfactory storytelling, and that they’ve exhausted me to the point that I’m also beyond really caring. I think we’re all beyond caring, because the truth is these writers dropped the ball so hard during this arc that I’m embarrassed for them. They were handed a slam dunk romantic story and they fell flat on their faces.

That being said I think they gave us plenty to suggest that Sekan fell in love. IMO it was obvious in episode after episode. You say they did more telling than showing, and I think its the opposite. They did plenty of showing. What they didn’t do is tell us straight out. Think about it this way, if Serkan had verbally admitted in this episode that he loved her prior to getting his memory back, say when asked by either Aydan or Engin, would we be having this conversation?

The problem is they didn’t do that and instead relied on what they showed us. And I think they showed us, in individual scenes, Serkan falling in love with Eda pretty much in every episode. The problem is that every episode, and sometimes in the very next scene in the same episode, they seemed to start him over back at square one so it was very disjointed for the viewer. We’d have a romantic, emotional scene and then he would suddenly be a giant dick in the next scene without exploring on screen what was going on in his head. I think the writers themselves thought he was reacting to his trauma and guilt and manipulation and reacting against his blossoming feelings for Eda (ala ep 3) but they were lazy and clumsy and didn’t spend time and give us that insight so it just felt like whiplash. The execution of this story was appalling, I can’t believe how badly it was done (those writers suck) but the bones of it was all there.

Think back as far as episode 30. At breakfast he’s fixated on Deniz, very jealous, but is not remotely threatened or bothered by his own fiancé’s ex-fiancé who is right there. Then there is the bridal style carrying her, it was like a primal need he had in that moment to help her, and then that fireplace scene! Oh the fireplace scene. Now, I’m not arguing that he fell in love with her during that scene, but that was a very intense, very emotional, very romantic scene that showed that he was open to her, drawn to her, intrigued by her and experiencing feelings he didn’t understand. It pretty much opened the door for everything that came after and paved the way for how quickly he was going to fall for her again.

By 31, I’d argue that he was over 2/3rd of the way to being in love with her. He overhears Eda making plans with Deniz for that evening, so he invents a reason to go to his cafe, lies to his fiancé, stays all day until he can drive Eda home ensuring she doesn’t spend the evening with Deniz and then they have an adult, emotional conversation. Then they do the same on the boat, engaging in intense, emotional conversations, and when it’s over, he sends his fiancé, who has been missing, on her way so that he can sit there and think about Eda. Do you do that over someone you don’t love? Seriously? At the end of the episode when Eda’s wedding day was announced, he looked like he’d been run over by a truck. Again the only explanation for that reaction is deep, deep romantic feelings.

By 32, I’d argue that he was all the way there, but did not have the tools to recognize the emotions or deal with them. For the LOVE OF GOD he was sleeping in his office clutching her wedding invitation. What other explanation is there for that, other than that he was in love with her? Would you do that when your business associate announces a wedding date? I’m guessing no. Then he spent the whole episode fixated on Eda and in turmoil. The coffee shop. Finding out she was in trouble and going back to the office to help. Being pleased that she fell asleep on his shoulder. Playing in the snow. He never would have thrown that party for Selin if Deniz hadn’t manipulated him into it by guilting him and telling him that Eda was only really happy now because he’d ALMOST DIED in a plane crash. However, the second she was in trouble he ghosted the fiancé on her birthday and went to rescue Eda and proceeded to be vulnerable with her.

In 33, they reset him again via Selin’s guilt, however he still was fixated on Eda, questioning her about her feelings for Deniz, going to find her at the flower shop and doing something entirely out of character for old Serkan by sitting down to make terrariums with her. Telling Engin that her scent was driving him crazy. Having Melo set up the dinner. And then kissing her. Again, this was very poorly rendered by the writers because none of the connectors between scenes really flow or make sense, but what they were trying to go for was that no matter how much guilt and emotional manipulation Selin laid on him after finding him sleep snuggling with Eda in the cabin, and no matter how upset he was that Eda remembered their great love, but could still discard him so easily, he couldn’t forget her and was constantly thinking about her and wanting to spend time with her. Even after seemingly having Selin’s version of Eda verified by Ceren. Would he do any of that if he wasn’t in love with her? Again, I don’t think he could identify that feeling and admit to it, but that doesn’t make the feelings he was experiencing less real.

And in 34 it was pretty much full on. He doesn’t stop thinking of her for a minute in that episode. He’s fixated on wanting her to admit her relationship with Deniz is fake. Now he might tell himself that it’s because he wants to win their little battle of sexual tension, but really it’s that he so badly wants it to be true. He so badly wants for her to not have moved on from him. Eda screws up in this episode and lies to him about loving Deniz during a very sincere conversation, if she’d come clean, maybe he could have admitted his own feelings.

By 35, he’s full gone. He’s frantic when she fell off the yacht, way more so than Deniz who says he loves her. He was ready to leap into the sea, in the middle of winter, when they were probably no longer anywhere near where she went in, and then he leaps off that thing before it was fully docked in order to get to her and make sure she was okay. Wanting to jump in the water is the irrational reaction of a frantic man worried for the woman he loves.

After that, the wedding prep drives him crazy. She drives him crazy. After seeing her in a wedding dress, he’s close to a full on panic attack and his heart practically fails on him. Even when they’re high on cake and tea, and being very close, he can’t let go of the fact she’s getting married the next day. He spends the whole episode clutching her necklace and brooding over it. It’s eating him up, but he won’t admit to Engin or Aydan that he’s in love with her, because he thinks she’s happy with another man. However, that doesn’t make those feelings any less real.

Would you walk on the docks at night starring longingly at a necklace of someone you didn’t love? Come on. He was fully back in love with her by at least 32, they showed it very obviously, they just didn’t tell us. The writers were able to give us plenty of great individual scenes that very clearly illustrated his feelings, they just weren’t able to put together a coherent narrative that told that story in a satisfying way. They suck, and turned what could have been a very romantic and lovely story into a disjointed mess but they didn’t ruin the characters. What Serkan was doing in every single scene, against all odds and attempts at abusive manipulation, was falling in love with her.

#Sen Çal Kapımı #Sen Cal kapimi #edser #serkan bolat #sckask #sck episode discussion #edser discussion #sck 1x35 #asklizac #anonymous

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janiedean · 5 years

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I have to tell you something but PLEASE, please, don't be mad. I love Brienne, and I loved her with Jamie, and I'm mad and sad that they didn't get to have their happy ending...but I don't think his ending was shit. Or OOC. First at all, book!Jamie is not TV!Jamie: his relationship with Cersei is different, not as sick or manipulative. He loves his siter and is loved by her in a more "helthier" way: in the show she told Tywing the truth about them, and it's huge considering the love for power1/?

He watched her lose their 3 children, he learned about her walk of shame to get back to Tommen, he witnessed Robert’s humiliations. I think he would have stayed with Brienne if she knew his sister was safe, but he couldn’t be happy if his siter died and he did nothing to save her. He needed to be that person, otherwise all his growth would be lost, and he would have dragged Brienne in his spiral, and he didn’t want to make her miserable. To me he is still an honorable man, bc when there was a chance to do something, he did it: he killed the king to save KL, he fought the dead army, but over and over he said that the Lannister army didn’t stand a chance against the dragons or the Dathraki, he was not a fool. His speech was not about NOT CARING, it was about knowing there was nothing he could have done. He did good, he was good, and till his last moment he tried to be honorable, he tried to be the person Brienne inspired him. P.s.: Still heartbroken that he died, but I think there is some poetic justice with Cercei crashed by the symbol of the power she tried lo long to hold.

anon, I appreciate that you’re being nice and I appreciate that you’re trying to find some sense in this entire thing, but… okay, I’ll go over it and please don’t take me as *me* being mad or whatever but I don’t think a few things were clear here so I’ll try to do it now:

jc in the show is not healthier. it might be different, but it’s not and the fact that it might have been less obvious doesn’t mean that they didn’t drag that toxic mess out for four seasons when it had no reasons to exist. now: I was down with looking at it until s4 because that was book canon and I can deal with book canon. I had to look at three more fucking seasons of that toxic abusive mess happening and I don’t know if it’s obvious or not, but if I have one thing, like one in the universe that I can’t deal with, that I hate and that makes me feel sick more than anything else it’s emotional/psychological manipulation. and show!jc has that in spades and I can’t. like, as it is right now I’m pretty damn sure I’d take reading explicit thramsay fic that ends horribly with annexed detailed fanart than even rewatching five seconds of a scene where those two are in the same frame and is2g if they had kissed at the end of 8x05 I’d have thrown up. please for the love of everything if you think it’s better than book canon your prerogative, but don’t come at me informing me of that because I can’t. especially not right now;

I honestly can’t give much of a damn about the stuff c. suffered when 80% of that is her damn fault and I’m especially talking about tommen who only did that because she gave zero shits about his opinion in anything but we’re supposed to think she’s a good mother or that she cares which makes me especially sick because people have decided that for her out of nowhere when we all know how much leeway they give catelyn for that and I’m honestly done with it, and maybe it’s not inconsistent that he’d care, but it’s inconsistent how they wrote it;

because I mean if they showed some half-regret over leaving brienne or she was mentioned or if the entire thing was addressed instead of spending four episodes building it up and then did in four minutes what it took six feet under an entire season to do with nate and brenda back in the day is bad writing, has no consistency, it also murdered tyrion as a character because I can’t believe that in the span of two episodes he goes from I’m happy that you’re happy to WELL I DON’T HATE MY SISTER SO MUCH JUST GO TO PENTOS when ah, wait, c. sent bronn to kill both of them?

also ‘who ever cared abotu the innocents’ or whatever the fuck that line was??? wow, that’s all this asshole has ever cared about in canon to the point of losing his reputation for it not counting c. or tyrion at least in the very beginning of the series when everyone thinks he’s an ass, and I have to buy that this episode was halfway decent writing?

also: even if I was okay with jaime’s ending - which I could have been if at least it amounted to something because that entire episode was a plot hole after plot hole (where’s widow’s wail? he waves WITH THE FAKE HAND??? WTF??, did he ring the bells so he actually helped destroy the city without knowing dany would lose her shit through jon connington’s ghost possessing her? if bran didn’t rat him out bc he had A ROLE TO PLAY what was the damned role since he hasn’t done anything until now that warranted it??? just the first four) and he didn’t even… help cersei or take her out like he literally was there to just give her some basic human comfort and rocks fall everyone dies, what’s the sense of it?? -, anon, this entire narrative leaves brienne horribly;

because sorry but in the best of chances she’s not pregnant and someone lies to her and tells her jaime went there to stop cersei and tried to be honorable (which given what they made him say about not caring for the innocents makes it bad writing but nvm) and she can think okay, I waited years for the right guy to trust/open myself to and then he left me like that but at least he did it for a good reason now will I ever trust anyone again, maybe, and I assure you that getting over such a thing is not too easy, but that would be the best option. mid-bad option: she still thinks he did it for the right reasons but she’s pregnant so hey, she has an illegitimate child from a man who left her like that to go into a senseless death making her believe she was wrong about him and breaking her heart and she has to play single mother in tarth without him or maybe she can hedge knight along with the kid or leave him with pod or smth but that doesn’t look good on jaime either. or worse, she’s pregnant and she finds out he went just to die with cersei and didn’t even mention her or anything to tyrion along the way so she did all of the above…. for a guy who at the end of it as the narration puts it just went back to die with c. and a kid he didn’t even know might be real or not when she could have given him what he always craved/wanted/needed and left her like that? like, anon, even if it was a good ending for jaime, there is no bloody way that brienne gets out of this mess of a season with a dignified ending unless they somehow manage to pull a miracle out of their arses and sorry but their writing has been so bad that I honestly doubt it, not even david milch showing up like the calvarly could salvage this crap of a finale, and for all characters tbqh, not just them;

on top of that, sorry but it passes the message that brienne, only rep. in this show for nonstandard attractive people who spends years thinking she’ll never find love and suddenly thinks she can be happy with the guy who also fulfilled her greatest dream and opens herself up to him putting her vulnerability on the line (and while I don’t really think the whole virginity thing is that much of an issue since she actually did manage to give it to the guy she wanted it does mean something in this context)…………. shouldn’t have done it because wow, left like that without a second thought and without being addressed in the next episode at all by at least tyrion who has spent the previous four episodes either admiring her or trying to get her and jaime together never mind jaime? wow, I mean, I surely signed up to see the character I always saw myself in getting this shit treatment by people who obviously didn’t understand either her or jaime at the bottom of it for as much as I still think 8x04 did it right until the end?

anon, I appreciate your optimism about that narrative, but this episode was so badly written that it managed to about destroy the narratives of characters that weren’t even in it (sansa and brienne, and let’s not even discuss sansa because lmao), to have every single person but davos and possibly jon but meh behave ooc given what half of their lines said if not their actions because even if we take jaime’s actions as your reading (legit) what they made him say was still atrocious and ooc and same for tyrion, let’s not even touch dany or sandor/arya or really anyone that wasn’t davos. I cannot, in all good conscience, find anything good about this mess because it was badly written. period. even if we decide that the plot and motivations were fine and we try to make them make sense the way you did, the execution was shit, the dialogue was shit, it looked like they weren’t even trying, it did a disservice to every single character that was in it except davos who was there for five seconds to smuggle stuff and I honestly, honestly, cannot even find the force of will to try to make sense of it.

this entire season has been a gigantic plot hole, it wasn’t coherent within its own narration see ep. 2 clashing with ep. 8, 90% of what happened post 8x02 was for shock value without giving a single fuck about making it look in character and making the characters behave nonsensically - and I don’t mean just jaime, I mean all of them to serve the undoubtedly wtf shocking ending they have in plan for us which if I guessed already I’ll hate with the force of a thousand suns, and I’m honestly done with trying to make sense of this thing because nothing makes sense anymore. I appreciate that y’all are trying but I give up. I can’t make sense of a narrative that goes like ‘we’re doing this because it’s cool and if it doesn’t add up with everything we did before who gives a fuck’, and I honestly can do without trying to find a silver lining in a show that has totally twisted the message of the books and turned into an angst fest for which everyone has to be miserable at all costs or it’s not good tv, and that’s the last I’m going to say about this specific matter because:

a) I’m tired, b) I want to finish my spitefics and ignore this mess ever happened and concentrate on doing something that makes me happy, c) if I just keep on thinking about how bad this was IN GENERAL I wish jaime was my #1 problem I just feel worse and I don’t need it, d) the fact that they did brienne this dirty and she wasn’t even in this episode is really leaving the worst sour taste in my mouth and it’s already bad enough that I have to hope her ending is only 80% crap and not 100% crap, I honestly can’t with discourse that tries to find any basic sense in how this episode was conceived and executed beyond my problems with jc, jaime’s writing and the fact that they managed to get wrong one of his three most basic character traits that has nothing to do with brienne or jb for that matter.

thanks for being polite and nice about this and I swear I’m not mad but I honestly can’t with this episode and I would appreciate if from this point on anyone could refrain from trying to make jc sound better than it is where I can see it/where I can’t blacklist it because it’s really not a good idea right now. thanks again and have a possibly nicer than than mine. ;)

#Anonymous #ask post #only slightly less toxic than chernobyl's ruins #anti-cersei lannister #anti-cersei #anti-lannincest #anti-jaime x cersei #got negativity #game of thrones spoilers for ts #jaime x brienne for ts #otp: i dreamed of you #guys i get it but no #and now i'm going to do some work see y'all later

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onebizarrekai · 6 years

Text

(Dreamswap) What friends are for (3)

First | Previous

Apologies for the delay. I know it’s been quite some time.

Nightmare: Error just got back.

Cross: How can you tell?

Nightmare: Why else would super strong feelings just appear upstairs?

Nightmare: He's in his room.

Nightmare: Bet he had an encounter with Blue.

Cross: Your ability to identify this is both admirable and creepy at the same time.

Nightmare: I'm gonna go talk to him.

(Nightmare goes upstairs and knocks on the door of Error's room.)

Error: Please leave.

(Nightmare opens it anyway. Error is curled up in a ball on the end of his bed and doesn't respond when Nightmare enters. Nightmare sits down next to him, saying nothing.)

Error: …

Error: … what do you want…

Nightmare: I want you to tell me why you keep hiding and trying to take care of your problems by yourself.

Error: … because… they're mine.

Nightmare: I can't let you do that. It's not working and you know it.

Error: I… I don't care if it works, I just want to be alone right now.

Nightmare: That'll only make this worse.

Nightmare: You ran into Blue, didn't you?

(Error quivers and clenches his teeth.)

Nightmare: … that's too bad.

Error: Haha, yeah, 'too bad'…

Error: There are worse things…

(Error is starting to glitch sporadically again.)

Error: I can't stand his presence, he makes me sick… I can only imagine that I hate him.

Error: He used me, I was just another plaything to him. It… pisses me off so much!

(Error clutches at his legs, his hands shaking.)

Error: And then he just… he just goes ahead and acts like I suddenly have a reason to trust him!

(Nightmare slowly rubs Error's back.)

Error: How… could he even do that?!

Error: The worst part is, I don't even know if I can! I almost wish I could, but… no, I don't! I want him to go away!

Nightmare: …

(They hear another knock at the door. Cross opens it slightly.)

Cross: Hey Error…

Cross: … do you need some feel-better chocolate?

Error: ……..

Nightmare: He needs the feel-better chocolate.

(Cross tosses it into the room and Nightmare catches it flawlessly. Nightmare hands the chocolate to Error as the door closes.)

(Error still says nothing.)

Nightmare: So, what do you want to do about this.

(Error tears open the chocolate bar's wrapping.)

Error: Frankly, I want to hide and wait for my problems to go away, but that hasn't worked for the last however long.

Nightmare: So you're going to–?

Error: Drink several cups of coffee and mope around anyway.

Nightmare: Error, you know we have to figure this out.

Error: I can't. Not now.

Error: I need a coherent thought process in order to actually make decisions.

Nightmare: … okay. All right then. If you want to wait this out, then you can. I'm just worried about you.

(Error sits there in silence as Nightmare stands up.)

Nightmare: Try to not drink too much coffee, okay?

(He leaves the room.)

(…)

(Error didn’t realize that Nightmare has other plans in mind.)

Cross: Now you're leaving?

Nightmare: Hey, I can leave if I want to, man.

Cross: I'm gonna be super pissed if you get caught.

Nightmare: Don't worry so much. I should be fine.

Cross: … should, you say…

Nightmare: (… this is where he said Blue lives… right?)

Nightmare: (… what am I doing. Why the hell would he be home if Error just ran into him?)

Nightmare: …

Nightmare: (… unless… he came here on purpose…)

Blue: What are you doing here?

(Nightmare spins around, noticing Blue behind him.)

Blue: What, does this have something to do with Error?

Blue: Did he tell you about our little encounter?

Nightmare: What the hell did you say to him?

Blue: Like I would tell you, little runaway.

Blue: And you better be doing just that before I get bored and decide to turn you in right now.

Nightmare: …

Blue: What are you looking at?

Nightmare: … Fine. I'm leaving.

(Nightmare opens a portal and goes through it.)

(Nightmare just felt it. He had actually felt something from Blue, something aside from the usual. He noticed the frustration, the confusion… more importantly, he noticed something he had learned to recognize a long time ago.)

(Loneliness.)

(Nightmare walks into the house to see Error lying face-down on the couch.)

Nightmare: Hey, um, Error--

Error: You tried to talk to him, didn't you.

Nightmare: Was it really that obvious?

Error: I told you I didn't want you involved.

Nightmare: We only talked for like twenty seconds.

Error: That's the way it is with you, you always just take unwanted initiative and start doing things on your own.

Nightmare: Yeah, that's right. That is always what I do.

Error: Well it's not cool.

Nightmare: You know, I went in and read his feelings.

Error: …

Nightmare: He was being rather hostile, but he was actually feeling depressed and lonely.

Error: He can suck it up.

Nightmare: You want to see him, don't you?

Error: No! I don't!

Nightmare: I felt that, there was a little glimmer of hope--

(Error stands up, clenching his fists.)

Error: THIS IS SERIOUS! MIND YOUR OWN BUSINESS!!

Nightmare: …

(Error stops and sits back down.)

Error: … dammit…!

Error: I don't know what to do!

(He chokes out his words as tears begin to fall from his eyes.)

(Nightmare stands there in silence, not sure what to do. But before he can even make a decision, Error stands up, shakes his head, and makes a portal.)

Nightmare: Error--

Error: Sorry.

(Error goes through the portal and it closes behind him.)

(…)

(He sits there, staring out into space.)

(The Outertale treatment isn't really working this time.)

(Error glances down at the needles in his hands, feeling no inspiration to continue. He sighs, throwing the needles through a portal straight into his room.)

(He keeps feeling chills, glancing around himself from time to time, continuously expecting Blue to be right next to him just as he was earlier that day.)

(But it's quiet, and he is alone, just as always.)

(Why does it hurt so much?)

(Anxiety is boiling in him, refusing to go away. He has stopped glitching by now, but he can still feel it. It's rushing through his entire body, in his chest, in his head, even his hands…)

(Error viciously shakes his hands and the feeling does not leave.)

(Not knowing what else to do, Error lies down in the dirt, staring up at the space above him.)

(Perks of Outertale. No bugs.)

(He has to make a decision. He can't just hide from this, he must do something about this.)

(Can he really trust Blue? Is he willing to?)

(If Blue shows up right now, what will he do?)

(Blue had manipulated him, mentally abused him, and toyed with him like a plaything. He doesn't deserve Error's trust.)

(Error can feel thumping in his chest, sending more anxious feelings coursing through him.)

(Show him who's boss…)

Error: (Frick that, there's no way I can do that.)

(Imagine how funny it would be if Blue like, actually liked you. Oh wait, that wouldn't really be funny, would it.)

(Error abruptly sat up, lightly hitting his own face.)

Error: (How about no.)

(Man, if you were like, another shipper and not you, would you ship yourself with him?)

Error: (NO, I don't need MORE mental abuse.)

(More like amore.)

Error: (Why the hell is my conscience so obnoxious today?!)

(Blue doesn't want to hurt you. You should give him a chance.)

Error: …

(Remember that rock you saw?)

Error: (It said…)

(He pauses in thought.)

Error: (That was a blatant indication of the fact that he sees me as a possession. An object. A toy.)

Error: (Take that, weird-ass conscience.)

(Or he wants you to be his and is just asserting himself.)

(Error makes a very confused face as he realizes his thoughts are seriously spiraling out of control and into a fictitious territory.)

Error: I don't… want that.

(He mumbles to himself.)

(This isn't a fanfiction. This sort of thing is not as straightforward as whatever an ignorant mind can conjure up.)

Error: (Wow, that thought sounded like Dream.)

(Blue wants to change, didn't you see it? You don't have to be scared of him!)

(Besides, you're stronger than him!)

Error: (… I can't use my powers on him. He always…)

(Okay, maybe you're not stronger than him. But you can always escape!)

(No, wait. Keeping that in mind probably isn't going to make this better.)

(Think about what Nightmare said. No one's opinion is more valid than his when it comes to stuff like this.)

Error: (… he's lonely and frustrated, huh.)

Error: (Well that is literally his own fault. Nobody made him do anything he did, he just decided to be a manipulative jerkface.)

(Can't you give him a second chance?)

(Don't be Dream.)

Error: (… I'm afraid.)

Error: (I don't trust him… he's hurt me so much… and the worst part is that I never even realized it until it was too late.)

Error: (For all I know, this could just lead to repetition of the past.)

(But you have friends now.)

(If Blue hurts you again, they'll kick his ass.)

Error: ………..

(You can do this now.)

(You can play Blue's game.)

(Face the past. Whatever you decide to do is up to you in the end.)

Error: (… Blue…)

Error: (I'm not your toy anymore…)

(Error stands up and brushes himself off. He makes a portal straight back to the Outertale where Blue lives.)

Error: (If he's not home, I'm vandalizing his house.)

(He takes a deep breath and steps through the portal, clenching his fists.)

Error: Hey! Blue! Are you still here?!

(Blue is lying on the roof of his small house, seemingly staring blankly up into the cosmos. He hears Error's voice and immediately sits up.)

Blue: You're… back.

Blue: That was earlier than expected.

(Blue leaps off the roof and lands flawlessly. He starts to walk towards Error.)

Error: I have one question for you.

Error: What the hell do you want from me?

Error: You want to be friends again, or… something?

Blue: Error, I know this must be… difficult… after everything I did…

Blue: But yes… Yes.

Blue: I can't stand being alone anymore…

(Blue continues to walk, and Error simply watches him.)

Blue: Everything was a game… but then it all changed, when I realized that you were all I really had.

Blue: Since… I lost everything… you were all I had…

(Blue's left eye is glitching slightly. He stops walking, keeping a regular distance between him and Error. Blue looks down, gripping his arms.)

Blue: More time passes… I feel like I'm just… falling to pieces…

Blue: I don't know if I can take any more of this…

Blue: … I'm sorry…

Blue: I'm so sorry…

(Tears are falling, and Blue closes his eyes.)

(Error doesn't know what to think. He stands there for a few moments, carefully trying to make a decision.)

(He shuts that off and makes the decision that he feels he needs to.)

(Error walks forward and hugs Blue, ignoring his haphephobic tendencies for possibly the first time.)

(Blue stands there in shock for a few moments, but quickly hugs him back. Error is shaking, but he’s trying his hardest to ignore it.)

Error: I-I understand.

Error: However… you've… you've given me no reason to trust you.

Blue: …

Error: I won't trust you until you prove it.

Blue: Prove it?

(Blue moves away, wiping the tears streaming down his face on his sleeve.)

Blue: Ha…

Blue: And how, praytell, do you suppose I do that.

Blue: How long has it been? How long has it been since it happened?

Blue: I've never once… tried to force you to come back to me… even after you left me behind.

Blue: And I don't blame you for leaving. I really don't.

(Error stays quiet, unsure of what to say. Blue feels him shaking from the contact and lets go of him.)

Blue: I don't want anything from you.

Blue: I just…

Blue: I thought maybe we could put everything behind us.

Blue: Be friends again, at least.

(Error blinks.)

Error: … at least…?

(Blue scoffs a bit, wiping his eyes again as the tears stop.)

Blue: Where is your mind going? I mean, as opposed to good friends?

(Error's face lights up a little.)

Error: I-I'm not--

Error: Obviously!

(Blue smiles, rolling his eyes a bit.)

Blue: Haha, of course.

Blue: Too soon, perhaps?

(Error crosses his arms, almost glaring.)

Error: Fine.

Error: I'll try to like you a little more.

Error: But if you frick this up, there will be consequences. Do you hear me?

(Blue sighs.)

Blue: Yes, I 'hear' you. You're all tough now, aren't you.

Error: Yeah. I am.

Blue: You're still cute, though.

Error: You're fricking this up already.

Blue: Oh, give me a break.

Error: I grant no breaks.

Blue: It was a compliment!

Error: Not out of your mouth it isn't.

Blue: Okay, okay, okay.

(It's almost nice.)

(There is still tension, but slowly, ever so slowly, it's growing calmer.)

(Error feels so powerful. He doesn't know how long it will last, but Blue isn't scaring him so much anymore.)

(What did Blue ever even do to make him so scared…?)

(As for Blue…)

(He can only think about one thing.)

(Never letting Error go again.)

(Error is going to be his.)

#:)#dreamswap stories #dreamswap #ds error #ds blue #ds nightmare #ds cross #ds meme squad #error's conscience is like you guys #eyy it's just like the comic #swapscreen

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