#we know from svsss that mxtx knows how to do meta shit

[bijoumikhawal]

Okay I've read the main body of SVSSS. I think it's really good as a meta parody and gives some interesting insight into MXTX's mind- I think some of the criticism of her work is unfair and this book is a pretty good example in parts (the running commentary about misogyny in stallion novels is a lot more unambiguous than her accurately depicting misogyny in others wirks like MDZS, though I don't understand why the latter gets read as an indication of her as a person).

However I don't think it works well as a romance story. There are main two problems; one,that while all of MXTX's main characters are people that have gone through the wringer and lashed out on others because of it, sometimes in really grusome and reprehensible ways, we get to see who they are not just before it goes to shit, but after they've acted in a such a way and either by intentional choice or just the passing of time, behave in a kinder and more upright manner. SVSSS's main story ends right after LBH isn't being an antagonistic force driven to the pits. Additionally, LBH is (understandably) a very misanthropic character which makes the way you'd show him learning how to be a person not driven by grief, fear, and anger different.

The other point is SY/SQQ's internalized homophobia is handled in a way that distracts somewhat from his feelings for LBH, and this combines with a lot of the things taken as romantic by other characters being misinterpretions of his internal world. Some of the latter seems to be him bullshitting himself though- "I'm not crying because I'm facing down my beloved student who I've failed horribly and hates me before I off myself without knowing for sure if my contingency plan will work, the sun's just in my eyes", sure Jan. Given how WWX acts its clear that MXTX now knows how to balance internalized homophobia with the character falling in love even if he doesn't realize it, and TGCF doesn't really have internalized homophobia on the protagonists part as far as I've read, he's just a sworn virgin. (However one could argue HC had some issues when he was human depending on how you read the Land of the tender scene).

SVSSS is short compared to her other works, and while I'm not sure how one would do it, having us spend some time with LBH and SQQ after they've gotten rid of his evil sword and SQQ is helping him work through his misanthropy, desire for control, and abandonment issues would improve their relationship from a story perspective, especially because of how obsessive and unhealthy LBH has spent... 8 years of his life regarding SQQ. There's already a foundation with LBH taking SQQ back to his home peak to be taken care of after his near death experience and leaving alone when he gets chased off, and SQQ choosing to go with him with no pressure on him to do so other than LBH's wellbeing (which is no longer tied to things like the apocalypse). I just think there needs to be a bit more between that and what I'm reading in the extras so far.

And it is needed because of how much LBH's dark behavior was directed at SQQ. WWX's dark behavior wasn't so targeted, LWJ's had an instance of targeting but a large part of the novel has been about him doing his best to respect WWX's boundaries and not repeat his parents relationship. I'm not up to snuff on what happened after XL's first banishment yet so I'll keep quiet on that. LBH is so desperate for this one person's affection that he almost destroys the world to ensure he has no other choice but him (and they have terrible fuck or die sex that no one enjoys about it). Evil sword possession making him decide this was a good idea or no, to work as a satisfying romance story, you need to after of all that. Especially because the evil sword had the ability to push him that far because of how chaotic and wrecked his mental and spiritual state were. They're still wrecked.

#Cipher talk #SVSSS #Just thoughts. Overall I like the novel- I think SQQ's internal monologue is hilarious and the comedy is decent #But the romance aspect needs workshopping #I think one way to work this in with a Main plot might be to revisit SHL's father causing trouble #Like that didn't get dropped exactly but you could have him trying to take advantage of the post 'oh gods we're all still alive' mindset to #Cause chaos at the borderlands or have him trying to take advantage of LBH taking a power hit from not using his evil sword anymore #Have SQQ accompany him while dealing with it #Maybe have it be a campaign where we see more of LBH's other aides and have part of it be LBH learning to actually have relationships with #Them and not suspect everyone 100% hates him for being half human half demon. The value of not acting like a monster even if it's expected #Hell maybe have his relationship with SHL improve so they're not romantic but he's not holding her in such contempt #Or make her turn traitor because of his contempt for her #Thereby expanding the theme about women not just being harem collectibles by having her have a platonic relationship with him or by having #Her take logical actions instead of just sticking to LBH like glue for ??? Reasons #I could write this but I have several wips already and I don't feel well versed enough in Chinese culture to write fanfic for it #(Or any of MXTX's works. It's not about feeling not allowed to its about wanting to pay respect to the work #And wanting to do it in a way I'll be satisfied with)

[eldritch-elrics]

“man i wish we could have gotten more lore about mo xuanyu, like maybe a flashback that included him or something like that”

vs

in denying us almost any information about mo xuanyu that does not come from a biased outside source, the narrative itself parallels the violence inflicted upon him by the cultivation world and by himself. like his half-brother jin guangyao and his body-heir wei wuxian, mo xuanyu is the subject of much rumor and speculation, yet we never hear the entirety of his side of the story. in the untamed, he doesn’t even have his own actor, it’s just xiao zhan there at the beginning - there is nothing about mo xuanyu that isn’t intrinsically bound to wei wuxian. the price of the sacrifice is more than just destruction of his soul, it is destruction of his entire metatextual character and narrative. in order for the protagonist - the character the narrative spends the most time looking at - to complete his story and get his happy ending, another character must be completely excluded from the narrative’s gaze. mo xuanyu forfeits his entire being, becoming something that exists only in the memories of other characters and not in the eyes of the narrative. mo xuanyu would not be the same character if we had ever been allowed to meet him in-story or if the tragedy of his sacrifice had ever been properly lingered upon. it is the gaps in the narrative, the things that are never properly questioned or called attention to, that make him who he is and that add an extra level of heartbreak to his already tragic story. in this essay i will

#mo xuanyu #mdzs #analysis #I KNOW IT'S NOT THAT DEEP BUT LISTEN. #we know from svsss that mxtx knows how to do meta shit #so like this is probably not intentional but i am thinking about it #my post #mxy #i'm just like obsessed with the concept of narrative violence don't mind me

[hunxi-after-hours]

Hunxi, your meta about BingQiu is absolutely amazing and I 100% agree with you about the fact that the book ends at their beginning. Like, shit. That’s some powerful stuff. And it makes me sad that people judge the book based on the main story and then completely disregard the extras. I do wonder what you think about Shang Qinghua, our Airplane Bro. Do you like him as a character? An Ding Peak? How he’s bullied a lot? What do you think of the Moshang couple? So sorry, just knowing you like QQ AND SV has me sooo excited!!

ahaha I mean I took a solid few weeks break between finishing the main story and starting the extras so I’m quite fond of the main story the way it is. MXTX’s works in general tend to suffer from a lot of bad faith readings, which is pretty unfortunate because like you said, she’s got a lot of powerful stuff in there!!! her protagonists grapple with a number of issues ranging from the world-ending to the minute, and it’s both delightful and revelatory to see her characters make mistakes, clown on themselves, and struggle to work through things to become better and happier -- always, crucially happier. there’s such a focus on joy and how/where to find it when the world around you is on fire in her books that, if you’re not careful, it both can and will lay you out flat on your bedroom floor on a weeknight, haha no not speaking from experience at all, what makes you say that

I’m afraid I don’t have many thoughts about Shang Qinghua beyond the fact that he is, like, peak hilarity at all hours, if he is in a scene it is guaranteed to be laugh-out-loud funny and I do love that about him

beyond that, he’s a wonderful foil for Shen Qingqiu, and I mean that besides their shared metafictional transmigratory tendencies -- both of them respond to Plot Events with a similar mix of 1) sass, 2) reflexive roasting, and 3) matter-of-fact decency. I am specifically thinking of the moments where they roast each other verbally (beginning with their first official conversation because I will never stop laughing about Shen Qingqiu, three seconds after their mutual stunned silence of finding another transmigrator, immediately yelling plot holes! elementary school language! unfulfilled plot threads! in Shang Qinghua’s face), to their eventual relationship of being able roast each other with just an eloquent eyebrow raise. Likewise, we see in the extras that Shang Qinghua shares Shen Qingqiu’s habit of doing Actually Very Noble Things while passing it off as 1) saving his own skin, and 2) the basic, human, decent thing to do. Both share similarly optimistic, sarcastic, and supremely oblivious attitudes towards their world and circumstances, which enable them to navigate the (frankly rather treacherous) plot of PIDW/SVSSS with humor and a baffling amount of grace

(I’ve also been thinking lately about the fact that, had SVSSS not been mediated through Shen Qingqiu’s hilarity and blisteringly sarcastic humor, it honestly would have been. uh. extremely traumatizing and mildly terrifying? yeah)

I think where the difference between Shen Qingqiu and Shang Qinghua lies is, well -- Shen Qingqiu (likes to pretend that he) has dignity (他的老脸总是拉不下来啊）, whereas Shang Qinghua has gleefully and shamelessly thrown that out the window. “I have noble literary aspirations!” he says while selling out in a heartbeat. Never forget that, when all the dust from SVSSS settles and Shen Qingqiu confronts Shang Qinghua in the last chapter, Shang Qinghua literally says:

尚清华：“你瞧不起基佬男主吗？纯文学作品，都喜欢塑造基佬。你看，”

Shang Qinghua: “What, do you look down on gay protagonists? Literary authors, artistic works, all of them like portraying gay characters. Look--”

他掰手指：“断背山，白先勇，霸王别姬，经典，名家，他们都喜欢写基佬。纯文学青睐基佬你知道吗？！”

He counted on his fingers. “Brokeback Mountain, Bai Xianyong, Farewell My Concubine--classics, famous authors, all of them like writing about gay dudes. Pure literature favors gay dudes, don’t you know?!”

(chapter 81)

Shang Qinghua, we thank you for being an ally but did you have to be so mercenary about it??

this is also supremely hilarious considering (checks notes) the extras

anyway, as someone who has put in Hours (weeks, months, years even) doing backstage and technical work in theater, let me just say that An Ding Peak is Such a Goddamn Mood. 后勤无罪，后勤万岁 indeed -- seeing the little offhand mentions of An Ding Peak and all of Shang Qinghua’s copious eye-rolling about the other peaks freely abusing An Ding Peak’s services honestly reminded me of John Scalzi’s Redshirts, which is, incidentally, an absolutely insane novel and one I heartily recommend for anyone who loves (and loves to gently roast) the Star Trek franchise

uhh l’m running on a deficit of brain cells these days so I’m just going to throw some of my favorite Iconique Shang Qinghua Moments (TM) in the rest of this post and call it a day:

exhibit A, aka Shang Qinghua Actually Being Pretty Heroic But Treating It Like Another Goddamn Tuesday:

漠北君像是完全没料到自己也会有被人打飞的一天，保持着这种表情，转眼坠下埋骨岭。尚清华魂飞魄散，抓了一把剑就冲过去，沈清秋忙拽住他：“你干啥！”

It was like Mobei-jun had never imagined that he would one day be knocked flying by someone else, so his expression remained frozen on his face. In the blink of an eye, he had fallen down Maigu Ridge. Shang Qinghua, scared out of his wits, grabbed a sword and was about to chase after him when Shen Qingqiu hurriedly pulled him back. “What are you doing!”

尚清华咆哮道：“我靠，他不会飞啊！”说完便跳了下去。

Shang Qinghua bellowed, “Fuck, he doesn’t know how to fly!” And immediately jumped down [after Mobei-jun]. (chapter 79)

friendly reminder that Maigu Ridge is currently the location of two realms being squished together like grilled cheese in a panini press, and Shang Qinghua just. jumps right into the middle of it for his shitty employer that he nevertheless would die for

exhibit B, of Shang Qinghua being petty and Extremely Iconic About It:

尚清华道：“你什么你？又是‘你敢’？告诉你，我现在还就真敢了。来！” Shang Qinghua said, “What about me? What do you mean ‘do you dare?’ I’m telling you, I’m daring right now. Come on!”

说完撸起袖子，当着漠北君铁青的脸跃跃欲试活动拳头。漠北君眼神里嗖嗖放出冷刀子，尚清华毫不畏惧，一拳挥出，冲着他的脸就是一下。 Finishing, he rolled up his sleeves and began warming up his fists right in front of Mobei-jun’s ashen face. Mobei-jun’s gaze was like cold knives, but Shang Qinghua seemed utterly fearless, throwing out a fist at his face.

漠北君本能地别过了脸，只觉得脸皮一紧。 Mobei-jun could have turned his face away, but felt his skin tighten.

很陌生的感觉。有点痒，有点小疼，却完全不是预料的重击。 A strange feeling. A little itchy, a little painful, but completely not the impact he had been expecting.

尚清华两根手指捏住他一边的脸颊，使劲儿往外拉，道：“怎样，痛不痛？！” Shang Qinghua used two fingers to pinch one of his cheeks, pulling outwards with force, and said, “How about that, does it hurt?!”

边拉边想，这他妈跟老子心里想做的不一样啊！揍他啊，趁他不能动揍他啊。拉拉脸就算，怎么看也是自己亏了！ While pulling, he thought, this wasn’t what he fucking wanted to do at all! Beat him, take advantage of when [Mobei-jun] couldn’t move to beat him up! Just pinching his face? No matter how you cut it, this was a terrible deal!

但是没办法，果然……还是下不了手揍这张脸！ But there was nothing he could do, since in the end... he still couldn’t bring himself to hit this face!

漠北君被拉得口齿不清，坚持道：“你完了！” Mobei-jun’s face was being distorted so much his words came out muffled, but he stubbornly said, “You’re done for!”

尚清华嘎嘎笑道：“有骨气，这种状况下还能威胁我，爹欣赏你。” Shang Qinghua guffawed, “You have some spine, threatening me in your current state. Your father appreciates you.”

他另一只手也加入进来，捏住漠北君另一边脸，一会儿往相反方向拉，一会挤成一团。漠北君往日里高贵冷艳的形象被他一双贱手毁得鸡犬不留。尚清华嘴里还重复：“还不痛？痛不痛？” His other hand joined in, pinching Mobei-jun’s other cheek. He tugged [Mobei-jun’s] cheeks in opposite directions, then smushed them together. Mobei-jun’s past aloof coldness and stunning beauty were thoroughly destroyed beneath his dirty hands. Shang Qinghua repeated, “Doesn’t it hurt? Huh?”

Shang Qinghua: I’m going to exact my revenge upon you for all the pain I’ve suffered at your hands!

Shang Qinghua: (gives Mobei-jun the cheek smushies of his life)

just. if bingqiu is a flaming clown car careening off the side of an upside-down mountain range, then moshang is the rest of the circus, blithely following close after while continuing to bang cymbals together to provide the clown music to the unending clownery of SVSSS

#hunxi thinks about SVSSS #I read the extras kinda piecemeal so my understanding of moshang is a bit fragmented #also I suspect the version I read is missing parts so meep

[natsunoomoi]

More SVSSS stuff because I just watched ep 5. I’m not in a position at the moment to pay for the VIP pass and plus it’s like one show that I’d be paying for, so eh. I think I can wait.

The highlight for me is definitely always just looking at Shen Qingqiu’s face. I really like how he looks. Like when they show grown Luo Binghe he looks nice too, but it’s not that often. When Liu Qingge comes out of the cave I’ll probably enjoy the eye candy for every episode thereafter. I’m not normally really like this, so I think the aesthetics of this show just touch on something very comfortable deep in the recesses of my memory of some kung fu movie I watched with my Dad as a young child that imprinted on me so I have a very specific weakness for men with that kind of a look.

I also have a very specific weakness for villain characters that have a kind of redemption or a complicated past with some inklings of maybe they could be redeemed even if overall they were kind of a dick for at least a portion of their lives. This is my Hiei from Yu Yu Hakusho weakness that almost universally applies to almost all my interests in life. I think the idea that Shen Jiu set his owner’s house on fire and killed them all except for his friend relates rather strongly to that because that is the thing that Hiei ulitimately decided not to do, but was the thing the Koorime in Hyouka no Kuni feared. Except Shen Jiu acted on it.

But like Shen Jiu supposedly could have been saved if the original’s author was a better writer and wasn’t writing a bullshit stallion novel. Like the fact that he saved Haitang is a compelling example of how his heart wasn’t completely cold. Of course she was his fiancee and people kind of are iffy about if they really were, but like they probably were between each other. Even if he was a slave, she lived in his house and she was his friend and they talk to each other. Naturally if you get along with each other really well, maybe as kids you just say, “When I grow up, I want to marry you.” Then because they’re friends and they like each other, they agree and they plan it that way. Just between them. Nothing to do with her family or the reality of the situation. Just two cute kids making a promise innocently. But like with that backdrop, it’s kind of understandable that he would save her from his slaughter and the fire that he set to destroy her family house. The interesting thing is that he never once in his entire time living there or even in the aftermath tried to tell her what her family was really like and what they did to him. He left her to hate him for what he did and assume that her family was innocent and the attack was unprovoked. He didn’t do anything to destroy her image of her loved ones.

It’s really sad how strong his mistrust for other men is, but that’s trauma too. We’re not really given specifics of how exactly he lived as a slave. We know that he was the 9th one bought, but he likely slept in close quarters with other slaves because it’s not like a noble family would give a whole lot to their slaves and amenities were probably sparse. For very different reasons, the disciple quarters even on Qing Jing Peak are probably similar. Sparse to focus on training and cultivation and close because of the number of disciples and just the overall situation. Even if the quarters had relatively more space than his slave quarters, that does sound too similar for it to be a huge trauma trigger for him on top of being surrounded by mostly other males. Self-isolation as a result of the trauma and hyper focusing on just his cultivation as a means to survive and get by day by day and create the foundation for his entire identity and basically it’s definitely the set up for disaster and all of Shen Jiu’s problems socially that lead him to being the main villain for the original story. It’s very sad. If only Yue Qingyuan tried to actually talk with him more instead of apologizing. I know he probably figured ultimately his excuse doesn’t matter, and it doesn’t, but Shen Jiu really needed help and to feel like his whole world wasn’t cold. Just knowing that he was in his friend’s thoughts and he tried to come back maybe could have eased his suffering even a little and start to build up a new level of trust again for him in particular but even for men in general. It’s sad as well that no mentors in his time there as a disciple ever like kind of noticed and tried to like just talk to him. I know he keeps his cards close and probably didn’t show outwardly he was struggling, but like how come no one asked how come he was spending so much time at the Warm Red Pavilion with women? That’s strange right? No one was concerned? I mean, like even if ultimately you say, it’s up to you if you want to keep going and that’s your business, still maybe ask and be like, “Hey, so I notice you’re not sleeping along with the other disciples and spend every night with the ladies over there? Uh, what’s up?” I think like for his teachers that might have been an important thing they should have done, but no one did? That seems like a big plothole to me that he was allowed to just continue like that with no one asking even once or showing concern that the top disciple of Qing Jing Peak was not socializing with the other disciples or sleeping in the same quarters as them. I’m surprised even not one of the ladies in the Pavilion even asked why he was there every night. I mean, I’m sure they wouldn’t want to shoo a way a client, but like no one asked even like one time? I understand from the meta point of view that plothole is probably there on purpose to show how the original’s author was a dumpster fire to create a horrible world of super toxic masculinity as an ouroboros eating itself, but jfc I really feel bad for Shen Jiu that he was made to feel such suffering as a result of absolutely shit writing just to make him an enemy for Demon Binghe.

Oh and he just had a shit first cultivation master too. What the hell with the horrible luck. This poor kid is just trying to survive and he just gets a raw deal.

But I suppose that’s also like a masterful backstory on MXTX’s part to make us root for Shen Yuan’s rewrite and create a happy life for “Qingqiu” that he wasn’t able to make himself. He did it initially for his own self-interest, but the Qingqiu everyone knows in the end is much more well-adjusted. I’m still sad though that it feels like that means original Shen Jiu still left that world with Shen Yuan replacing him only knowing sadness.

So then I was poking around the tags on here and saw someone had a theory that original Shen Jiu got punted from his timeline and turning into Shen Yuan who knows the whole story and then dies and gets put into his old body. I actually buy this, but my version of the timeline is different. Like I was thinking Shen Jiu-Qingqiu died as a human stick under all the torture and everything and then became reborn as Shen Yuan reading through his whole life and mistakes through a horribly written story and then dying via food poisoning and brought into his own old life with a chance to redeem himself. I really like this idea except that Shen Jiu seems really, really straight and Shen Yuan may be a bit more fluid.

But all this to say, that I have an itch in a confluence of all of my weaknesses to want to really comfort Shen Jiu. ;o; There’s a small part of me that while enjoying Shen Yuan’s rewrites, also really wished Shen Jiu could have been happier so he didn’t turn into such a dick because literally no one else around him seemed to do anything except let him fuck himself over including the people who supposedly cared about him. So very sad. T_T

And then maybe this should be in a different post that’s a different topic. I kind of touched on a bit how the image of the situation probably doesn’t look great, but it looks like some people are like bashing on the Bingqiu ship? It’s the canon ship for one, so just stop there.

But if you really want to go into it, as another person pointed out, the actual teacher-student relationship was between original Qingqiu and Binghe. We’re reading a different situation because it’s Shen Yuan who was a Binghe fanboy who has the relationship with Binghe. The imaging isn’t great because he’s in and controlling Qingqiu’s body, and the rest of the characters in the world don’t know this, but the meta reading of this is that it’s okay because it’s a different person actually. In world, the other characters do probably find it a little odd and the issue with Qingge in the succubus cave as I mentioned before, he’s probably panicking when the succubus mentions that Qingqiiu’s love interest is a junior because he can only think of himself as that role and didn’t think to include a disciple into that description. It doesn’t seem like it’s completely unheard of or taboo though because there seems to be some implications that maybe Shen Jiu originally had some kind of designs on Ning Yingying because he’s also a bit jealous of Binghe for getting her attention too? A large part of his jealousy comes from his insecurity with his cultivation and other people having more advantage or potential to surpass him despite his hard work, because again trauma and hyper focusing on building his entire identity around one thing and no one helping him, but like also seems in this world there’s some leeway between teacher-student relations turning into something else. This is not really a normal kind of situation where they go into a modern school or anything. A lot of the disciples were probably at one point also juniors to their master before they graduated to become a lord, and when they grow enough to end their disciple term and can become more independent cultivators they’re not really obligated to stick by such a standard because they’re adults. Like maybe they hang around the sect still and work as like someone they happen to send out on demon slaying missions if they choose to stay instead of going off somewhere and it functions a bit more like an army in that regard where they’re not really learning anything new or getting any new instruction, but they’re still kind of a disciple. It’s not a perfect 1:1 relation to teacher-student relationships because of the structure of cultivation sects. It’s not great in the army to have a relationship with your CO either, but the point in the story when their relationship develops is more like that. But like Mingfan probably eventually would go back to his family and just live out a noble life because he is a noble, so it’s not like all the disciples would stay and perpetually be students forever. There’s some very important distinctions at play here in the story that the people who object to this aren’t understanding. 

Like this isn’t like an actual school like in Harry Potter or something where the kids all go off to Hogwarts and there are actual students and teachers and every Peak is like a Hogwarts House. They’re learning and the peak lord gives them some level of instruction, but there’s also a great deal of independent study because cultivation is very personal and bound by natural talent and how much you put into it. The fact that everyone has their own manual should tell you a lot about the structure and how it’s okay for Qingqiu to leave for 3 years to go meditate in a cave. The masters in these situations are more like more well studied seniors who just have more experience and have been appointed to help you get unstuck or something because they have more experience to troubleshoot. There’s some authority carried with that as well, but it’s a very different experience from like a boarding school, so such a relationship is not entirely taboo. It’s not perfect because if you’re still trying to play the old roles at the same as your new role as a partnership that can get kind of weird, but it can work out if there’s communication involved as with generally all things.

So yeah, Bingqiu is actually okay, and rather than harping on something that’s not an issue, I think the more interesting discussion is how obligated a person is to be faithful to a different person’s life if they end up in their body. Like for body swap movies where the change is temporary they’re always like “Hey, don’t f up my life!” But like this is a permanent change where Shen Yuan was inserted into Qingqiu’s life after he was already established. What is the philosophical theory to how much he should keep up Qingqiu’s responsibilities and how much freedom should he exert for his own desires? That’s the real question. I think the balance he struck became ultimately more happy for everyone in the sect, so eh.

I realize a lot of this is not related to the episode, but the episode is just a continuation of the sparring match and nothing much else to say about it. The most interesting thing is getting to see a flashback of the original Qingqiu and getting a better idea of who he was like instead of the Shen Yuan version we know.

[eldritch-elrics]

i think its rly interesting to compare how svsss treats og sqq and how mdzs treats mxy when both their roles are characters the mc has the body of and pretends to be and also to other novels with the trope

OOOH yes this is such an interesting point. i think i made the connection before but haven’t put a lot of thought into it until now

it’s sort of interesting how... uninterested mxtx is in really having the protags struggle with worrying about how well their pretense is going. wwx doesn’t really take especial pains to perfectly imitate mxy - all he’s gotta do is act ~crazy~ and people will buy it. luckily for him, mxy’s reputation is what it is, otherwise he might come up against greater resistance from characters like jin ling questioning him. another thing to note is how most characters figure out “oh shit it’s wei wuxian” pretty quickly, so the reveal in jgy’s chamber is kind of underwhelming

on the other hand we’ve got shen yuan, whose entire conflict throughout the beginning of the novel is focused on imitating og!sqq. thing is, we never get the impression that he’s gonna fail at that. he’s helped along by the system, and he very quickly unlocks ooc mode, after which the deception is quickly forgotten. it’s actually kind of surprising to me how little resistance sqq is met with when he starts acting ooc. perhaps this is a testament to the nature of the world and how it bends to the whims of him, lbh, and the system, but to me it reads as mxtx being more interested in the relationship he’s building with lbh and the other characters, and the question of narrative fate/destiny rather than identity

(confession: i actually would have liked ooc mode to stay off for a little while longer! i want more of sqq identity issues! struggling to roleplay this evil dude while still secretly trying to make things not suck for lbh!)

this is the point at which i admit i am NOT very far through svsss LMAO. i’ve read a little bit past the endless abyss (chapter 28), and haven’t read more in a couple weeks because i’ve been reaaally busy lately :( i want to soon though!!! super curious to see what happens with sqh because i’m sure that’ll make the story even more meta...

so yeah i can’t completely analyze sqq’s whole predicament properly but this WILL be something i keep in mind when reading in the future! i Really Really Hope that there will be some sort of pivotal moment where sqq is forced to reveal his real backstory to lbh. DON’T TELL ME IF THIS HAPPENS OR NOT i want no spoilers!!!! but i am thinking about it.

(another interesting thing to note is that the narration called wwx in mxy’s body “wei wuxian,” whereas shen yuan in sqq’s body just becomes “shen qingqiu.” it makes sense for the sort of story that’s being told, especially given that sqq has to Live This Other Guy’s Life Or Die, but... it strikes me all the same)

i’d also highlight a way in which mxy and og!sqq are almost opposites. mxy, a Real Dude (at least in the context of mdzs), has his story almost completely erased. but we know all about what og!sqq was like! and pidw has been read by so many people! we may never meet og!sqq, but he’s really important and pivotal to both narratives!

also interesting to think about how much of mxy’s story/life has been fictionalized...

and i’m SURE there’s something here to be said about the transmigration genre as a whole and this sort of character archetype. i am super not qualified to make any observations/generalizations though

anyway thank you for the ask!! i definitely think that mxy and og!sqq (and even og!lbh...) occupy interesting positions in the narrative and i’m excited to think about this more re. scum villain

#mdzs #mxy #sqq #svsss #my post #analysis #once again do NOT reblog this with sv spoilers or anything!!! #i will have more thoughts when i read more #anonymous #asks

[eldritch-elrics]

svsss: shen qingqiu corpse hot potato (among other things)

so i actually read all this last week and then forgot to finish my post about it but?? here you go. more commentary!

got all the way to chapter 57 and shit is getting wack

“it wasn’t sqq’s first time being kissed” please we need more than little tidbits of shen yuan backstory i want to know more

honestly i’m dying over the commotion over sqq’s corpse. binghe you are so weird (affectionate). really xuexiao’ing it up in here

(for the hundredth time, binghe go to therapy challenge)

sqq holding his own corpse djkhgsds

also oho, beginnings of sqq sexuality crisis: he says he’s definitely straight right now but hmmmmm. we shall see

in general it’s so funny that he’s now Remembered Gay People Exist and it’s just shattered his whole worldview

binghe is seriously so emotionally constipated. he’s getting better at revealing his true feelings and not going the route of either “being too cold” or “straight up lying about his situation” but still.... man. they’ve got soooo much work to do on their communication still lol

oh also!! sqq finally realizing that his lbh is different from og!lbh! and that he shouldn’t just treat him as a character in a novel! that’s progress!!!

i think it would make sense for their respective development to involve like... learning to stop objectifying each other? sqq’s gotten pretty far with this, as his reason for helping binghe now is less out of self-preservation instinct and more out of compassion. i’m comparing it to the places in the beginning where sqq threw lbh in front of monsters and stuff, knowing he’d survive because ~plot armor~ but not considering how lbh might have felt about that.

that same theme even shows up in like jinlan city/the water prison, in the parts where i was complaining about sqq making the system solve problems for him instead of solving problems for himself. because he saw binghe as a problem to be solved with game mechanics rather than with interpersonal skills

it’s really interesting! personally i find sqq’s actions easy to understand/ “justify” but he’s certainly wronged binghe and he’s realizing that now. character development! i really like how the meta stuff plays into it

so! zhuzhi-lang! plothole filling!!!

i knew the snake in the cave was gonna come back :3

i have Thoughts about him and tianlang-jun but i’ll get to that in a moment

so we’ve gone from “rumors about bingqiu fucking” to “an entire ballad about bingqiu fucking” and wow. that is so much. loving sqq’s reactions

if sqq was on tumblr he’d have “do not interact if you support rpf” somewhere on his blog

i like that you can rent swords

the scene with lbh facing off with the peak lords!!! oh man!!!!! emotions

yue qingyuan has huge lan xichen vibes

so has lbh known sqq was alive ever since sha hualing brought him to him? it was a little unclear how long he’s known

SO happy to see shang qinghua again. my BOY. sqq is so fucking mad at him kjhsdjhgjhsds

mobei-jun just fucking tossing him into the center of the room lmao

so i had to switch translations because the one i was reading was unfinished! the other one seems pretty good too though

but it censors swear words :(

also i think it’s interesting that it calls it the sun moon dew seed/plant/flower? instead of mushroom? i guess 芝 (which is afaik a character used to describe it) is ambiguous enough..... idk i went on a bit of a research binge about this the other day lmao because i liked the mushroom plot thing so much

finally sqq is like “alright. i made this mess with lbh so i’m gonna fix it by going with him.” woooo we love character development

poor dude in house arrest though lol. this is not really a great situation and i totally understand why sqq is upset

so i’m not a huge fan of how possessive the love interests of mxtx novels are? like i get it, i know the relationships aren’t supposed to be realistic or totally healthy or whatever, but it’s not my thing. so i hope lbh grows out of it? or at least out of this toxic iteration of it

SQH VISIT HELL YES... MY DUDE...

trash man i love him so much. he’s like. totally rooting for bingqiu to happen it’s so funny. oh and he’s absolutely jealous as well (didn’t it already get established that binghe has a huge dick? well. hmm.)

poor guy lost his cool outline :( was forced to write a shitty harem novel :( the injustice of it all. no one has suffered more than airplane :(

jokes aside i LOVE how he's this.. passionate author who had to tone down the interesting-ness of his ideas because of what his readers wanted. makes him a little bit more sympathetic

ok back to bingqiu. this scene was interesting because i can see where both of them are coming from. both of them have lied to each other! and finally lbh is doing some apologizing

and then they have their whole fucking tussle on the bed which was definitely a little uncomfy (binghe use your words challenge! not everything can be solved by ripping open your crush’s shirt!) but also really hilarious???? idek. they’re just like. wrestling. and lbh likes being hit. ok kinky bitch <3

idk, this was one of the scenes i was warned about because Iffy Consent, and i agree it’s iffy, but personally i didn’t find it that upsetting at all? it seemed pretty clear that binghe was just being dramatic for the hell of it and i wasn’t worried that he’d actually do anything sqq was not ok with. (apart from, yknow, the whole house arrest thing in general lol.) i think i’ve heard there’s some more dubious stuff later on - interested to see what i’ll think of that. really there is so much already that’s fucked up about their relationship - at this point i’m just along for the ride! it’s like that post that’s like “why must a relationship be healthy is it not enough to see two fictional people destroy each other” or whatever it was

anyway. omg sqq back in his old body!!!

i’m actually very surprised about this. the mushroom body had so much spiritual energy and now it’s just... gone? guess they’ll have to find another way to solve the xin mo thing

poor binghe had to see his shizun fucking rot before his eyes though??? man. i want to draw that now

thought: is zhuzhi-lang's whole character just puppeted by the system in order to fill plot holes?

OKAY SO TIANLANG-JUN

he’s funny. and very calm. just sittin in a coffin! i like that

other than that i have mixed feelings. on the one hand i feel like he is a pretty good villain - i love that the system is actually making sqq fix plot holes, and i love that TLJ was the big bad of airplane’s original draft, and “i need to steal my son’s body in order to come back to life properly” is great (i’m always up for fucky body swap stuff)

on the other hand, it feels a little bit late in the story to introduce a major villain. i would have liked to see a LOT more foreshadowing on this - more talking about tlj (maybe in a way that assumes he’s not a threat but makes it clear he’s going to be important), more of the system getting sqq to fix more minor plotholes, etc

however some parts of it do work as a pretty good twist! especially the realization that zzl is the one who started the jinlin city sqq callout party!!! that’s pretty fun, and makes a lot of sense :0

oh i also like that tlj is like “no what i like humans i’m not gonna wipe them out! i just don’t like the sects”

now i don’t think this is going to happen but i think it would be very fun if tlj had some sort of fourth wall awareness and was siding with sqq for meta reasons to take down the protagonist

so binghe daddy issues huh

i made a post on this already but freud would love him. no wonder lbh got so attached to sqq......

now that i’ve remembered sv exists i’m gonna read more :0 excited to see what happens next!

#my post #svsss #finn reads scum villain