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#Lilith clawthorne
rockymountainqueen2 · 13 hours
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From this -
This post is mostly for those who don't want to have to click on the link in order to read the entirety of The Owl House's series bible.
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mthsmelo · 12 hours
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Pilot Lilith
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dailycanonlgbtq · 23 hours
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day 21: Lilith Clawthorne from The Owl House is canonically aroace
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sepublic · 18 hours
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Alright, let's talk about some details from the TOH pitch bible;
A lot of the stuff is what we've already seen and/or in line with the show. What's interesting is that King WAS a former King of Demons at one point, and we would've had an episode where he runs into his old gang and chooses Luz and Eda over them. It makes me wonder if he even had a connection to the Titan in earlier drafts, if he wasn't recognized as one back in the day because he just wasn't big enough, etc. Eda makes a deal to help remove the collar, which IS the source of King's woes, placed by a 'mysterious wizard', I wouldn't be surprised if it was Obron AKA Proto-Belos.
What gets me is that Tibbles originally started off as a friend to the protagonists, while Bump was an antagonist! Coupled with Tibbles being re-elected as mayor after Bump is deposed for corruption. I like the detail of Bump being a parasite controlling a body from the head, because it carried over into his final design with Frewin, and before we got confirmation Frewin was a separate entity, I loved the joke theory that the imp on Bump's head was the REAL Bump!!! Seems that was always the implied story of the design, I love it. Tibbles being the demon fan of human stuff would eventually become Gus instead, so this is technically Proto-Gus too…?
Interesting how Bump and Tibbles' alignments switch completely with one another, and it makes sense that with Lilith no longer the principal in the final draft, it goes to Bump, who ends up being really chill and a subversion in his own right! Interesting, but I do prefer the final Bump we got, and that's fine by me, because when the concepts aren't as interesting as the final product, it means we got the best possible version.
I've already discussed Obron and William in a separate post, and Pupa is someone we've been told about in a previous livestream. Lilith would've been both head of all covens (and not just the Emperor's Coven) AND principal at the same time, and she seems much more of a jerk to Eda in general; She has no qualms with cursing Eda because of a direct order from Obron.
Apparently the curse would've been an AGING spell, which settles my questions on how it would've been portrayed in earlier drafts! This goes along with Eda's older look. Likewise, there would've been a subplot of Eda considering Luz's sacrifice as a way to restore her youth, which likely goes hand in hand with Obron's orders to bring Luz to her, etc. The 'Bloom of Eternal Youth' quest, which Eda and Lilith go through together as their sisterly relationship is explored, feels like a carryover from this past idea.
I think I prefer the final draft; I like that the curse isn't just aging Eda, but also takes away her magic, makes her turn into a beast, etc. I like Lilith being a lot more complicated in her relationship with Eda, instead of just hating her and cursing her without hesitation. The redefining of the curse makes it less about age, and more a chronic illness metaphor, and I like how Eda in the final draft is upfront about having to learn to live with it, deal with it, on her own terms. She isn't trying to find a cure (although Lilith being promised one by Obron feels like a carryover of Eda's moral dilemma with Luz), and that adds another nice dimension to her conflict with Lilith, as well as Gwen. It's pretty frank in its own right about normalizing disability, and those who play an antagonistic role (however brief) are the real weirdoes for making such a fuss about it.
The Bat Queen would've had more of a recurring role based on the description, which saddens me; I always got the vibe she was planned for more, but between all of the other stuff the show had to juggle, plus the shortening, she ended up getting shafted despite being one of the earlier characters. Sashley, Pasha, and Bruno are also interesting, with Pasha in particular giving me freaking Philip Wittebane vibes with his grossness, beard, and anti-demon attitude; He even starts off as a potential friend to Luz because fellow human, only for his true bigotry to show. Makes me wonder if Philip ended up incorporating Pasha, we also have bodily transformation because of consuming magical stuff... P-names.
(Also, I like how in the drawing of typical Demon Realm denizens, I can see an eye demon who resembles a past drawing of Dana's!!!)
Eda was actually a late bloomer, which creates a parallel with Luz in one way, and their relationship is referred to as sisterly (in the final draft it’s explicitly maternal). So Eda wouldn't have been the talented youth, in fact things may have switched between her and Lilith; Lilith's disdain may have partially come from Eda not being as innately talented as her.
Luz and Amity's dynamic seems like it would've had Amity retain a lot of her more stand-offish, pragmatic personality even as a friend with Luz, and this would've come up more; So basically, she'd remain more like S1 Amity. That, or this part of their relationship would've lasted longer, and then we would've seen character development as Amity unlearns a lot of the issues her parents passed on. I also wonder if the Willow who cameos in the pilot was originally supposed to just be an extra separate from ‘Paulina’, but then they combined the two together.
The themes are exactly as I expected, glad to see they're still there, nothing changed! Luz becoming a witch and defying all odds to do so, putting in real work and passion. Celebrating individuality amidst conformity, plus Luz trying to impose her own fictional tropes onto the world, only to have to put that aside... Just like Wing it like Witches. It seems Amity would've had more involvement with Luz's journey to become a witch, though we still do have a carryover of that disconnect with her rant near the end of Covention.
I love the Demon Realm being situated BELOW the Human Realm, way to be subtle about being Hell you guys lol... Apparently portals to the human world are a lot rarer to find and use, which makes me wonder if the pilot's 'dimension port' doesn't have access to the human world; Meaning Amity is Luz's only way back, so her improved relationship with her is linked to getting back home. There's a gag about the Knee having service with the human world, but I can see how that didn't make the cut, for dramatic purposes; It seems like the premise for a S1 episode or at least a B-plot. Would Luz have struggled to communicate with Camila through this, or would her search for wi-fi be for mundane reasons?
Apparently Luz's magic would've required a lot more steps to complete, and I see why the show simplified things down to just glyphs. I wonder if there was always going to be the connection of glyphs as a gift from the Titan, or if the Titan and her story was going to be less intertwined in the overall narrative. There also don't seem to be nine main covens, just the many, many covens, some of which are pretty ridiculous, and Covention's sub-covens seem a callback to that.
Luz's first spell would've been levitation, and THEN she would've infiltrated Hexside, with Amity being a lot subtler about exposing Luz, though in the final draft she does figure that out as the way to go in I was a Teenage Abomination. Yeah, I prefer Light being her original spell, feels so much more symbolic and personal, etc. I wonder if the Titan is even as much of a character in early drafts, and if there's still the whole connection/relationship with the land and learning to respect it aspect. Some of these hypothetical episodes push the idea of Amity as a more episodic, typical popular kid antagonist, though in the final draft, the show goes through her character development and explores Amity's romantic relationship with Luz and its complications.
It seems the idea of the Mirror Ghost was split into Adegast and Vee, with Adegast being the one who offers the easier narrative for Luz to believe in about becoming a witch (only to be a fraud who uses uncanny puppets), and Vee being a doppelganger whom Luz communicates through with mirrors. Interesting how Yesterday's Lie was born from this. We saw the test animation from Spencer Wan for TOH, so I guess we know what Luz's puppet-doppelganger is called! And we can safely call her Proto-Vee. I wonder if she also would've been a sympathetic character, I always thought she reminded me of Lake from Infinity Train (and speculated her to be as such since Enchanting Grom Fright), and now the similarities are even MORE apparent!
Alas, The Good Witch Azura, or 'The Unassuming Princess' seems like it'd have been a lot less dear to Luz's heart, as the pilot also reflects; In the end, it turns out the author is just Eda's ex using her adventures as basis, and including private information. I remember when I once speculated that Raine, before we saw their face, would've been just like this as the author of Azura... Again, I think I prefer Azura as being a lot less mean-spirited in the final draft, and instead a celebration of who Luz is as a person, her relationship with fantasy and fiction, etc. We also would've had a Luz birthday party, the Quincenera we've been hoping for since S1...! In the final draft (and episode) we still get that Human-Demon Realm disconnect, though by that point, Luz is much more attuned and chill with the isles.
There’s definitely more of an episodic, sitcom feel to this pitch bible, especially when you compare Proto-Yesterday’s Lie to its final version. Makes sense, Dana is pitching this to Disney executives, though her statement on Understanding Willow feeling truly like her show makes me wonder if she always intended to push TOH in that more serious, emotional route we got.
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TOH Pilot Spoilers!
Okay, so I am definitely glad they changed some things. I am happy that Eda's curse now reflect her owl status and that is is not something that she can just do. Also, that Lilith is a guard instead of a headmistress. I don't really understand how a teaching position would have her working directly under the emperor. I feels more distanced. And I am extremely thankful that Eda is no longer secretly working for the emperor's coven / Oberon.
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nerdasaurus1200 · 13 hours
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Ohhh dang the pilot is so different!
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rockymountainqueen2 · 16 hours
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From The Owl House pitch bible - https://web.archive.org/web/20240425221922/https://litter.catbox.moe/581x55.pdf
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amoritasart · 10 hours
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Greetings my fellow humans I have seen the original TOH pilot and I am going insane. HEADMISTRESS LILITH?? AND WHAT WAS HER BAT TRANSFORMATION WAS SHE ORIGINALLY THE CURSED ONE? OR WAS THAT SOMETHING THAT WITCHES JUST DO AT WILL?? (SHE’S SO CUTE LOOK AT HER ) I HAVE QUESTIONS !
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(Her bat form remind me of the Chiropterans from my fav anime next to Pokemon: Blood + 😭!!) Anyways her interactions with Eda were so fun !! Man I would have been so curious to see where she ended up at the end ! And her relationship to Obron. Speaking of which, sounds pretty ruthless! So it turns out the gems on their clothes originally did have a purpose (apart from showing Eda’s curse progressing). They can shock you! Reminds me of the shock collars in the original Zootopia storyboards.
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I read from the pitch that Eda is offered to heal her curse (which appears to just cause her to age?) in return for giving them Luz. Apparently a human soul is required for whatever Obron wants to do. Curious that it is mentioned there are more stray humans than just Luz… but he still wants HER (and not William? Hmmm). ANYWAY yeah this… COMPLETELY DIFFERENT than what we got. 😭 Lilith being headmistress sounds so cool to me, but I do wonder if this version of her was also gonna get redemption considering she seems more cold.
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pickledragon · 18 hours
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pilot!lilith clawthorne is EVERYTHING
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stars-and-birds · 1 year
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Dana’s last ‘fuck you’ to Disney
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He/they collector
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Genderqueer/bi-gender papa king
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TWO girlfriend kisses
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Onscreen mlm kiss
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Implied aladarius
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a happy ending to the bi/enby couple
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A happy ending to the aro/ace character
And
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Death to the white Christian puritain
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teartra · 1 year
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Character Growth
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And yes they’re okay with killing Luz at some point
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maryheart22 · 1 year
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Wanted to draw the sisters ^^ Love their new looks!
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uselessalexis165 · 1 year
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LOOK AT THE OUTRO ART!!!
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thunderlina · 1 year
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How It Started vs. How It's Going
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The way that this show used it's character designs changes to reflect character growth is just- *chef's kiss*
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That one Barbie meme with the Clawthorne sisters 🧍‍♀️
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strawberri-draws · 1 year
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She accidentally called her teacher “mom” again 😔
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