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givehimthemedicine · 2 years

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ace max mayfield

just a couple quick thoughts on Max being aspec and relationship stuff *unfurls a huge dusty scroll that rolls across the floor and down the stairs and out the door*

let's start with Ralph Macchio. taken at face value this exchange is the #1 proof I'd point to for both allo Max and aspec El. but let's say it's not face value, and that Max could be saying this because of internalized stuff, and that's how she thinks she should feel, and that this is what girls say at sleepovers.

but I think there are motives specifically involving El here too. if milkvan is outkissing lumax, and I'm certain they are by a lot, Max has known it all summer. but now El has come to her for sage relationship advice and she doesn't want to let on that she's actually less experienced in that department than her little protégé, so she's trying to sound like she's some kind of expert but without actually lying.

her delivery of the amazing kisser line looks like she's more interested in El's reaction than she is in actually thinking about kissing this boy (otherwise I'd expect her to keep staring at the picture).

btw you know that post about teenage girls strategically choosing a harmless boy to decide to be in love with? Ralph Macchio is 1000% harmless boy material.

I don't think there's any arguing that Max is aesthetically attracted to guys. you can definitely experience aesthetic attraction without realizing it isn't also more than that, and that would explain Max's behavior for me

it's funny that she's in a relationship for a year and yet we really only ever see her express physical interest in anyone from a distance (a safely unattainable celebrity and Steve 50 yards out in the dark).

actually I just realized I don't think Max or Lucas have ever complimented each others' looks in any way. ily lumax

anyway it's surprising to me that Max would ask about Mike's kissing skills given her relationship with him (if anything I'd hc El volunteering something and Max being like "ew TMI"). maybe she's not so much a fan of kissing, but figures it must be super enjoyable if El is doing it so often, right? so maybe El and Mike know something she and Lucas don't, and maybe she can find out while still sounding like she totally already knows?

methinks the lady doth hype kissing too much

wouldn't you think somebody written to be this pro-kissing would be the one who's constantly making out with her boyfriend?

milkvan ditches the party to go make out for the millionth time and Max defends it as romantic

Lucas makes fun of Mike for wanting to make out with El forever and Max tells him to stop

Ralph Macchio is probably an amazing kisser

is Mike a good kisser

no but the fact that she brought up kissing at all, when El did literally nothing but silently look at a picture of a boy

she might've let the topic go but she's still thinking about kissing when she opts to use spin the bottle as a means of random name selection when there are easier ways. El has no idea spin the bottle is a thing. that was Max's idea.

like, check that ralph moment again and tell me you'd guess the character who's only shyly kissed (1) time is the one on the left? Max is all bark and no bite, El is all bite and no bark.

have you ever kept bringing something up because that would make it true somehow?

this eyeroll at the couple making out in the hallway could be explained as any combination of Max being unhappily single, depressed, and judgy about PDA. where's "aw, it's romantic" now? did she get disillusioned by milkvan?

this is the only time we ever see Max react to the idea of kissing when she's alone with no one watching, in a way that's definitely not performative. if you ask me, this is how she really feels about it.

lumax's only kiss

Max kisses Lucas in a very "quick before I lose my nerve" way, and that can of course be explained as they're kids and first kisses can be nerve wracking.

but it's very easy for me to read this kiss as Max checking off a box, like she wanted to have kissed more than she actually wanted to kiss. or as the panic of oh boy this situation is a high kiss risk Ima take charge and get it overwith 1 song in so I can actually enjoy my evening.

after the kiss she looks relieved she's done it and hugs him, which is the part she really was looking forward to. I can debate the kiss but that hug is sincere affection (and a huge chunk of why I love lumax). a hug isn't really a social milestone or something anyone feels much pressure to do or brag about having done in the way that kissing is, she really just wanted to hug him, not out of attraction but because he's her first friend who's really cared about her in a while, maybe ever, and she feels safe with him. (and as a bonus the hug also closes the door to a second kiss)

as of the snow ball they're about on par with milkvan, but we don't see their physical attraction level up at all as they get older.

Max acts very 😒 about her relationship

I started writing a post about whether lumax was even supposed to be Max's first relationship because she acts so much more experienced. she displays the weary aloofness of a girl who's seen it all and is long over it. but she's 12? where are the butterflies? the only moment I can think of is that 1 second smile when she kisses Lucas. what she'd have you think is maturity and confidence I think is actually just her not giving a shit.

Drive Him Wild! 9 Ways To Sit That Scream "Cool Story, Bro"

she's not the slightest bit pleased that she's brand new in school and 2 boys immediately have crushes on her

she confidently says she thinks Lucas is making up all the upside down stuff to impress her or fool her for "experience points"

Steve's advice to Dustin doesn't work on her at all, which is hilarious because the advice is "treat girls like you don't care" and Max is the one who doesn't care for real

when Lucas is trying to ask her to dance, he's all fumbly and she's just like lmao let's go loser

compare the pre dance scenes, Lucas is rehearsing nervously in his mirror, Max is sulking while her mom tries to do her hair and rolls her eyes when she says it looks pretty. (and ok I'm getting into a tangent here but she wore pants <3 if her mom didn't intervene Max would've gone to that dance in the same thing she wore to school that day)

when El said Mike was her first boyfriend that would've been a perfect time for her to say if Lucas was also hers, but I really think Max preferred El not to realize that

throughout s3 while Max clearly has affection for Lucas she gives me the consistent impression that she's the one less invested in their romance. the closest she ever gets to flirty is sarcastically calling him smooth or don juan (actually has she ever said anything genuinely nice to him?). she dumps him at the drop of a hat to the point where he's paranoid about it. by dump #6 she doesn't even have to tell him so, he just correctly assumes.

I know a lot of that just chalks up to Max's personality and them still being kids, but you'd think a 12-13 year old girl might be a bit more twitterpated about her first boyfriend?

this relationship seems mostly like a comfortable friendship, especially for Max. in fact in s3, if you blink at the wrong few moments, you could almost miss that Lucas and Max are even a couple.

Max's "romantic experience" is secondhand from media

this doesn't exactly fall under orientation but it's worth mentioning how Max's perspectives on romance are informing her decisions.

Max has no positive examples of romantic relationships in her life. being a child of divorce, seeing her mom marry an abuser, and watching Billy grow up and start pursuing girls in what's probably been a gross way from the start, has not done anything to give Max a great impression about romance/sex/relationships, and she's had to look elsewhere for examples.

I imagine young Max spent a lot of time alone and, like El and her soap operas, gaining a lot of her ideas on relationships from media. and when you do that it's probably not all realistic, healthy or age-appropriate, only you don't always know that at the time.

Max seems very into magazines especially. to broaden El's horizons regarding boys and relationships, she supplies her with Tiger Beat, Bop and Super Teen, and sure that's just for fun, but it shows that a lot of what Max is taking in is sensationalized if not outright fantasy. probably the most realistic thing she reads is Skateboarder.

this whole family loves their periodicals

"oh but El already had those magazines before she was friends with Max! everybody read magazines in the 80s!"

nah. that's a TV Guide she's pretending to read. (and did Mike bring a Space Gamer magazine to El's house hoping to get El interested, or for himself to read there?)

anyway, notice how the parts of Max's advice that actually help El grow as a person are the parts that come from the heart (ha) and that's all the stuff about being independent. her relationship advice doesn't serve El super well (act like he doesn't exist! he'll come crawling back!! yeah, to Will lmao) because it's not from experience or real positive examples, it's just the regurgitated wisdom of shit-stirring teen gossip magazine advice columns.

Max thinks to lend El a Cosmo so she can learn about happy screams herself because that's probably how she learned. (I'm not putting any greater meaning in the way she's grossed out by that conversation in general considering they're talking about Billy and who wants to give their friend The Talk anyway)

I can only guess that not-so-healthy romantic relationships being glorified in media are how she can defend Mike and El ditching their friends all the time, even though she sure had a problem with similar behavior in season 2 when her new friends kept ditching her, but the difference is this is Romance and that makes the same shitty behavior okay, because romantic relationships are more important than anything else, right? (until she finds out El isn't actually having a good time, and maybe she's lowkey relieved to be able to drop that cognitive dissonance, and then suddenly there's more to life than stupid boys)

Max says "boyfriends lie all the time" like she's never been able to trust a word Lucas says. and yeah, in this episode he does back up Mike's lie, but he has not done that yet at the time when Max says this. as of this point, the only thing close to a lie I can think of him telling her is that out-of-order sign on the arcade machine (which he felt bad about). to me, in 1 and 2 he came off as the most honest one in the party. if he's become a huge liar since then, we didn't see it. I feel like Max might be regurgitating external stuff again that isn't really even about Lucas but just boys in general.

maybe the "emotion not logic" stuff is because it makes no sense to Lucas how Max goes straight to petty tactics and breakups whenever they have an issue. in his parents he has basically the show's only healthy marriage to look up to, and we even see him ask his dad's advice at one point, so when he and Max are having a problem he wants to talk and work through it. Max, having only broken relationships and fake bullshit to refer to, doesn't know how to deal with someone caring about her so seriously and she gets cagey and runs.

high school hits different

I know she's just deflecting but oh boy is that line easy to read in an ace way.

I also just noticed the banner behind Max's head that says "all the way in 86" when she says this, which is an interesting choice of wording and timing when it could just as easily have said "go tigers" if it wasn't supposed to evoke anything besides basketball. Max talked a good show for a middle schooler but now her peers are starting to get sexually active for real and she could be starting to feel social pressures (not from Lucas, but in general) and it's becoming rapidly more apparent that she's Different. OR it's just random set decoration!

anyway she still cares about Lucas and loves him at least as a friend, but still keeps him at a distance. of course depression has a lot to do with that, but it could be that she's afraid if she lets him too close even platonically that he'll get romantic ideas again.

which he does. as soon as she says she's glad he's there, he asks her on a date. going to the movies isn't explicitly romantic but, that's a date. she sure took it that way.

so why might an ace Max not only accept but draw adorable stick figures holding hands? maybe she's remembering times that were happy for other reasons and she's going all in because her current circumstances are pretty bleak and she welcomes something to cling to. I feel like it's a little bit of a pipe dream to her at the moment, like mikvan's snow ball and jopper's enzo invitations made on the cusp of probable death. she knows full well she might not be alive on friday. maybe she figures if she survives by some miracle she'll give the romance thing another whirl and that'll magically work too.

there's probably more but this post is getting too long. tl;dr max internalizes a lot of stuff and doesn't know she's a gray ace. the end

#max mayfield #this doesn't stop me from shipping lumax #and disclaimer yes none of this is uniquely ace behavior #that cosmo joke is really one of those lines that's purely for the audience because el would have had followup questions #I think max would like them all to think she had a boyfriend in california. you dont know him. george glass #did not know when I started this post that my receipts on ace max were CVS length #analysis #mine #long post #character analysis

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willandmichael · 2 years

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something i keep circling back to is mike's characterization from a (byler)-outsider point of view.

the duffers saw the way the public reacted to mike in s3, he went from being a loved character to someone most people found annoying and just plain rude (the cause: his relationship w el). he became someone that started to act extremely out of character for what people knew of him in s1-s2 by ignoring his friends and his BEST FRIEND (who btw everyone saw him going crazy over the last two seasons bc he almost died twice in the span of 2 years). so, going in, the public expects that in s3 he would absolutely be clinging to will, being protective and not.. pushing him away, ignoring him and making fun of him wanting to play d&d. the public was left with a bad impression of mike, but nothing that he can't come back from. we get left with the just the plain "mike is annoying" from everyone.

so if you're writing the show and you want people to like mike again, what do you do? well, this character who was left with a bad impression last season needs to have a new arc and stop giving everyone more reasons to dislike him. but then we get to the whole ordeal of s4 and boy oh boy, the amount of times i saw people saying they wish mike was the one to get vecna'd and die was overwhelming. even finn himself was getting the bad end of it :/

if the duffers don't have an actual reason and resolution in s5 as to why mike is acting the way he is for 2 whole seasons then it will just be bad writing i'm sorry lol we get to sit here to write and read analysis and truly try to understand mike, we believe he acts the way he does because he's battling with himself over liking will and having internalized homophobia.. but the general public only sees what's on screen and don't really have many thoughts about it. all they're going to see when they think of mike in stranger things is that he went from a loving, caring kid to an annoying, rude teenager that treats his girlfriend like shit and ignores his friends.

the milkvan relationship will be in shambles and terrible, why push this relationship that doesn't work? why does mike treat eleven like that if she's supposed to be the love of his life? why write all this conflict in the first place?

and the byler narrative will also be unfulfilled and make no sense, why would mike change so much in regards to will if 1) he doesn't know will is gay / is projecting onto will: did he say "it's not my fault you don't like girls" / "we're friends, we're FRIENDS" for no reason? it was just to hurt will, the canon gay character, even more? 2) is not attracted to will himself? what other explanation could they give to mike's behavior around him?

all this to say, would they be dumb enough to "ruin" mike's character for no reason and to "ruin" mikvan's relationship for no reason for 2 seasons in a row? if they're going the byler route they need to have the public seeing mike being his true self again with will (which we get in s4), where he is caring and soft and likeable. in s5 they have the opportunity to actually explain mike's actions and have everyone looking in retrospect and going "oh, so that's why"

but if the duffers are actually that dumb and anything happens otherwise, i feel bad for el, will and my beloved s1-s2 mike.

#byler #iza.txt #rambling cause i don't accept the fact they don't have a clear reason for all of this #finn wolfhard was not looking at noah's lips for no reason come on now

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dd400 · 2 years

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Very long post.

So, you're telling me this all was queerbaiting and bad script? Ok, let’s assume.

I’ve noticed this special friendship of Mike and Will from the very beginning. From the first scene I knew already that I liked this couple and I wanted them to be romantic. But further I was absolutely sure that I watch completely standard story about boy meets girl etc, that I’ve watched many times. Therefore I didn't have a single doubt that Mike and El will be that standard couple. I didn’t come in social network to read fans opinions, I even didn’t know about existing the word “byler”, I didn’t watch the interviews with creators, I didn’t look for the deep meaning in the series, though I really loved it, rewatched it a few times, but I considered it just sci-fi show with horror and drama and comedy and whatever, I didn’t think about some hidden hints. And Mike-El relationship was actually cute in S1 and 2, I didn’t notice any tricks. But then came out the S3, and their relationship became something horrible. I really sincerely wanted to Milkvan the happy ending. But in the very first episode of S3 – what was that anyway? It doesn’t look at all like Mike wanted to stay longer with El, when she told him “I wish you were still here”. He was hurrying to go to the movie with his friends. I watched this scene from absolutely heterosexual point of view, not even thinking that he might be gay or might be in love with someone else. I just didn’t understand, what was this? And after they gave us an indistinct explanation like “I was jealous and wanted you all to myself”. It explained his conflict with Max, but it didn’t explain his behavior in 3x1. Ok, I’d just swallowed it and forgot about it. I decided to close my eyes to what happened in the last episode of S3: this kiss and weird Mike, I decided “whatever, I don’t understand what’s happening and I don’t care”. I’m not that person who think too much about the tv series. And now, came out S4, and I already forgot about all those weird things in S3, but now there are them again – and again some ABSOLUTELY INDISTINCT explanation: “I was afraid to lose you, so I couldn’t tell I love you”. What?? Ok, let’s say, Duffers don’t give a sht about Mike, Finn doesn’t give a sht about Mike, and I can forget about this misunderstanding again.

After watching the Vol.1 of S4 it became obvious that Will is in love with Mike, and I was sure it’s unrequited. But I'm left with the feeling that there's something wrong with this whole story. So I went to twitter to read what fans write about ST. And there I came across the post about byler, and then I had read some thoughts, then I went to tumblr and realized how many details I’ve missed because I never watched attentively. And then I started to rewatch the whole series, and in the past month I watched all the seasons twice. And I clearly saw that these details – they’re actually there, maybe not all of them, but the most, it’s not the fan imagination. And now you tell me it’s queerbaiting? But, see, I didn’t even notice these hints, if I’d never read tumblr posts. I saw only unrequited Will's love, awfully written love story of Milkvan, and, maybe, bad actor play by Finn (?). I saw the queerbaiting in Sherlock, klance (and I didn’t see a potential of klance canon), Teen Wolf, different anime; I didn’t watch the Supernatural, but I heard what happened there. Queerbaiting puts two guys side by side, makes cute scenes with them, screaming about their bisexuality. Queerbaiting assumes these hints are VISIBLE. But here in ST I did not notice anything. But now I see these hints – handpicked soundtracks, opened closets, constant comparison of relationships Mike+El and Mike+Will, their common and their contrast in the same time. However, these hints are not fcking noticeable. If this is queerbaiting, then too much effort has been put into it and into hide it.

Separately, I want to talk about Mike’s confession in Vol.2. Everything he said – it’s the repeating all that he had once said to Will! “Remember that day we met”, “I’m afraid to lose you”. If it’s queerbaiting, this is the most terrible, absolutely senseless and merciless.

Even if I forget about all that hinting, and be just casual viewer like I was earlier, I want to say – all milkven story since S3 is such a nonsense. I like the stories of Joyce and Hopper, Nancy and Johnathan, Nancy and Steve, Max and Lucas, but THIS – what is this??? I don’t believe not in ONE scene with Milkyway, it all looks FAKE.

And if we assume that Milkyvan – is actually bad script, then queerbaiting makes things even worse – it turns out that their relationship is total bullsht and it is entirely built on this queerbaiting and love triangle. I mean, it turns out Duffers are so dumb that are not able to write proper relationship development of Mike and El, but they decided to put their efforts to subtlest queerbaiting.

So, now you tell me, Milkvan – is true love and in S5 Mike and El will finally start normally TALKING to each other, and maybe even Mike finally start kissing her like he WANTS to kiss her, not like he just LETS her doing this? Or we have to admit that Finn is just not able to show romantic interest in Millie? Ok. Let’s see.

What I want to say, this puzzle will be gathered, if they’re doing byler endgame. And can we now unplug our disappointment about unrealized dreams and think? We didn’t know for sure about Will’s feelings in previous season. But we see it now, and still it is not said out loud on the screen. Why we even had hope that Mike’s feelings will be opened up too in this season? I still see a very slow burn. We knew that Mike loves El, whatever love this is. We knew that he cares about her very much, she means for him very much, he adores her, really. And i see Mike is trying to hold on to El, like his lifebuoy. That scene with the confession was terrible. I wanted to turn away because it was so painful. Will was standing next to him and hearing this. I felt like I’m dying. But I kept thinking and realizing that it was like he was talking all this to his friend who standed behind him, because he already said once this to him, and if my feeling is right, then it was painful not only for Will, but for Mike too, and I felt like he yelled it in desperation, but it was just not the whole truth.

With these thoughts and confused feelings I stay now in emptiness and delusion. So try to convince me, that it’s bad script and queerbaiting.

#Sorry for my bad English I hope the blood doesn’t flow from your eyes #byler #stranger things #byler is endgame #long post

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chirpsythismorning · 1 year

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Birthdaygate didn’t seem plausible to me, and to be truthful I’ve hated it ever since that gate surfaced. But your recent posts have fully convinced me. All of that can’t be a coincidence.

Changing lives, one byler birthdaygate denier at a time 😌

#byler #stranger things #birthdaygate #also thank you!#I know some bylers hate the theory #I just hope that for their own sake they’re actually looking at all of the evidence #as opppsed to just ignoring it and then saying it makes no sense #that’s borderline Reddit/toxic milkvan behavior #to say it makes no sense and there have been no signs #even though you’ve barely looked because you don’t want it to be true #if you read it all AND still believe it’s not happening #it is what it is!!

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chirpsythismorning · 2 years

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I'm sorry but, I really don't know how anyone can still believe with full confidence that Mike is straight after the airport scene.

It's arguably the most blatant, yet overlooked scene between these three characters, specifically Mike's dynamic with El vs. Mike's dynamic with Will.

Although Mike shows up in sunglasses, I highly doubt he wore them the entire flight. This means Mike probably put on the sunglasses to go from the plane, through the Passenger Boarding Bridge, and directly to the gate entrance where they were waiting for him, all of which are indoors.

Yes, it's sunny in California, and that's what makes this such a good excuse (alibi) for Mike.

Now could this just be a coincidence? Yes, it definitely could!

Now, does Mike ever wear his sunglasses again? No..

Not even for sun purposes in sunny California? No.

(At least not technically until the end of s4... but that's a whole other blatant metaphor about 'eyes being windows into the souls' for another time.)

It's only after him and El have kissed and hugged that Mike finally takes off the sunglasses... How convenient.

But you want to know what Mike did in this scene right before this, that's just... there's really no excuse for it.?

If I was a hardcore milkvan fan at this point, THIS is what would've ended that era for me. Like, I just can't think of anything other than one obvious reason for why Mike did this...

Picture it.

You're Mike, reuniting with your girlfriend with whom you haven't seen in about six months. You were even kind enough to get her a gift, flowers, which you, *reads notes*, quickly put in between you and your girlfriend moments before she embraced you, with you almost instantly shouting CAREFUL, CAREFUL YOUR SQUISHING YOUR PRESENT, so that she had no choice but to separate...

How... sweet?

Nope. I'm sorry, but no. Nothing excuses this at all.

Dude literally risked ruining the present he got for her, by using it as a shield. He literally used the present he got for her as an excuse for why they had to separate sooner than later...

Like, this is repressed gay behavior of epic proportions, especially considering what follows.

Notice how when Mike approached El, he's decked out with hat/sunglasses, his hands full with the flowers and his duffel bag?

Well, notice how in contrast, when Mike approaches Will right afterwards, as he's going in for a hug, Mike switches his duffel bag from his right to his left hand (now empty after giving el the flowers) so that he can go in for a better hug with Will, with his dominant arm, only to immediately backtrack and settle for a shoulder bump...

We also get a shot of Mike looking Will up and down, no sunglasses to hide his reaction this time.

So.. basically, Mike's instinct here with El was to not make it so obvious he's not in love with her, while his instinct with Will was to not make it so obvious that he's in love with him (and boy did he fail)...

Mike addressing Will's painting, assuming it's indeed for some girl, only to never attempt to find out anything else whatsoever, for the rest of the season, about said girl his best friend is in love with?

Argyle calling Mike's shirt a knock-off, essentially calling Mike a knock-off?

Mike looking offended at Will's mention of Angela???

Like, this scene is just all around Mike being an absolute gay disaster, and the fact that 99% of audience doesn't realize this, is downright hilarious.

#stranger things #byler #airport scene #4x02 venca's curse #gay mike wheeler #bi mike wheeler #bisexual mike wheeler #this scene does have bi mike wheeler proofs so i should say bi disaster #he's a disaster all around #gay disaster #bisexual disaster #disaster all around #but we love him #but someone should also check in with him besides #unreliable narrator will byers

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chirpsythismorning · 2 years

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Rewatching s1 and… just being full serious for a second, I used to ship milkvan, like I thought I loved them in s1-2. Then when s3 happened I sorta lost interest. And in between the long hiatus between s3-4, I discovered the theories about the ending of s3 and byler and started to watch the show differently. Since then it’s just been a transition from thinking Mike and El were cute romantically, to being indifferent about it, and to just being sort of off put by it entirely by this point. Especially after all the analysis about Mike and him seeing her as a superhero with what we got in s4 in canon, it’s sort of ruined their dynamic for me.

If you guys thought the parallels between Brenner and Mike in s4 were bad, holy shit it somehow manages to be worse in s1.

There were literal scenes of Brenner forcing El to find someone for him, followed scenes of Mike, Dustin and Lucas basically doing the exact same thing to find Will.

Don’t get me wrong. I do think Mike did genuinely care for her as a person who was vulnerable and needed someone to protect her, because she was literally in danger.

But when she started lying to them about leading them to the gate, and hearing Lucas’ comment about how she was only doing what they asked because she needed a roof over her head, etc., technically, that wasn’t far off…

She doesn’t know Will, therefore she has no obligation to keep hurting herself in order to please Mike and prove herself worthy to Lucas and Dustin, by finding Will, just so that she can stay.

Do I think that makes them or her inherently bad? No. I just think that there was an obvious miscommunication here, where El wanted to be cared for, and to have someone to depend on, and she thought that in exchange she had to do these things to get it, ie. Find Will.

I don’t think Mike genuinely even felt like her only value was finding Will, but the circumstances were pretty bizarre. His best friend goes missing only for Superman to land on his doorstep and say that he’s alive. While it might not be his intention to use her, he is giving that impression and that’s undeniable watching s1.

What makes her sacrifice so sad at the end of the season, is that Mike had just gotten to a point where he was starting to see her as a person and not just a girl with superpowers. And right at that moment, she sacrifices herself to save them. A selfless act of the many she’s been doing all season. And now Mike feels awful. Because he’s realized that he used her for his benefit, to find Will. And at that point, they didn’t even find Will yet. So at the moment, her sacrifice was for nothing.

Whenever she wasn’t successful, he lashed out and pushed her away. And yet in the end she practically killed herself for him and his friends. I feel like if Mike had empathy and regretted his behavior, then his literal reaction in the end, to her ‘death’, does make sense and fits pretty well with someone experiencing survivors guilt.

Because although he’s got his best friend back, and that’s what he’s most focused on, he’s simultaneously feeling this immense sense of wrong doing on his part. He feels indebted to her now, in the same way she may have felt indebted to him for helping her and putting himself in danger to do so.

So I think s4 is just a part of this cycle, of Mike not understanding that he’s wronging her until its said and done.

So, more than anything tbh, I just want her soooooo badly to lash out at him in s5… and not in a dramatic way, but in a necessary way that I feel like is required for them to go from romantic to platonic without any bitterness.

I remember reading someone say that they hoped that we got a scene that paralleled Mike to El in season 1, when he said “You hurt me. Do you understand? What you did sucks!” And I don’t need or expect it to be word for word exactly like that, but something along those lines. Where as soon as El starts speaking and telling Mike how she truly feels, about their relationship and everything that they’ve been through, no bullshit, I just know as soon as it gets real, as soon as she calls out his idolization of her and his obsession with her powers, and how she hates that and she’s been through that enough, I honestly think it’s gonna click for Mike and he’s gonna listen and accept it and take responsibility for not being fully honest with her.

I am a byler truther forever atp, but it’s also really important to me that Mike and El end things in a way that feels true to what they both deserve out of it, in terms of closure. Especially El!

Which means that they’re both honest about everything from the beginning. And I think once we get that (if we hopefully get that), it’s going to give the audience closure too.

#byler #elmike #stranger things #mike wheeler #el hopper #will byers #stranger things theory #mike wheeler i know what you are #stranger things meta

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