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cellydawn · 3 years

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undertale meta deepdive: sans is not a good person (OR the sans theory masterpost pt. 1)

❤️ || Part 2 || Part 3

Sans is far from this valiant epitome of good that the fandom so often paints him as. He’s not a hero—hell, he might even be a bad, terrible person. At least in the past. My intention in this post isn’t to crush popular fandom interpretations of Sans in a bad faith argument, rather, it is to challenge preconceptions that have existed for years and to open up discussion on the dubious morality of this popular and loved character; I certainly love him a little more after doing this analysis.

Section I - A Bad Person (The “What”)

Sans is certainly not opposed to leaving us little breadcrumbs for us in regards to his mysterious past. We get the idea that Sans is separated from his home, likely due to something he did. Something he had thought was important. Something that led him to take his home for granted.

So based off of the previous dialogue, this “type” that he intimately knows... he’s talking about himself. He was very “determined” to do whatever he did, which cost him his home, likely nearly everything he cared about given his angst.

So let’s say Sans used to be “determined”.

Sans is also aware of the SAVE function, meta knowledge that only the player and Flowey should know about because they have or have had this ability in the past.

“Take it from me”: accept that what I say is true, because I know or have experienced it. Sans should have quit when he had the chance. Never satisfied, too determined to bow out. But is he talking about the same thing we’ve been doing?

When Sans threatens us with the infamous “bad time”, he is NOT referring to the fight... but what comes after, because only after he is struck down, he gives us one final piece of advice:

But HOW does he know that the world is going to be thrown into the “abyss”? Unless he has experienced this first-hand.

This is Papyrus confronting us in the genocide run antecedent to his fight…

…and this is him on Sans. An eerily mirrored piece of dialogue from Papyrus describing us and his brother. What do we know so far? Both Sans and the player need to be kept on “the straight and narrow”, both are “determined”, and both do irreparable damage to the world, possibly sending it to “the abyss”.

Purgatory: a place or state of suffering inhabited by the souls of sinners who are expiating their sins before going to heaven. Not to mention the suspicious usage of the word “abyss” by Papyrus.

From the evidence gathered, it seems that the reason why Sans isn’t able to return to his world is because he destroyed it in the same manner we destroyed Undertale in the genocide run. Why else would he say “take it from me”; he empirically knows what happens when the world is pushed to its very limits.

But which world could he have destroyed? What world did Sans come from?

(Continues under the cut because this gets really long.)

Section II - The Deltarune Connection (The “Where”)

If you’ve read some Deltarune theory posts, you know that Gaster is prominently featured in Deltarune. He addresses us at the beginning of the game and there are blatant references to him (the phone call in the Dark World, the strange bunker, etc). I’m going to try to prove that Sans will also play a large role in its story. Let’s take a look at the lyrics of the end credits, Don’t Forget.

When the light is running low And the shadows start to grow And the places that you know Seem like fantasy There's a light inside your soul That's still shining in the cold With the truth The promise in our hearts Don't forget I'm with you in the dark

The truth: Sans says this to us before giving us access to his room, the entrance to which is suspiciously identical to the fast-travel doors that Darkners use. We also get access to his basement.

Promise: Sans has a history of promises. He is regretful of a promise he made in the past.

Don’t forget: Appears on a poorly drawn picture of three smiling people, in Sans’s basement. This phrase is also used in a description for "Memory” in the sheet music booklet from the Collector’s Edition. What do you know, it’s written in Comic Sans too. Go figure.

Now, let me introduce a character that is featured prominently in Deltarune, someone that is somehow related to Sans, someone who isn’t Gaster.

Ice-E is everywhere in Deltarune’s Hometown, but the only inkling we get of his existence is from Sans. The Ice-E word search that Sans gives us is interesting because the title itself is written in comic sans.

In one of the hospital rooms, there’s a “1-to-10 pain scale using Ice-E as a model”. It’s an uncanny description of Sans.

Ice-E is also characterized for its missuses of apostrophes. One might call it an “apostrophe-dog”.

Moving on.

Section III - Gaster (The “Who”)

Oh boy, this section is going to be absolutely massive. I’ll try my best to make the logical flow easy to understand. So we know that Sans did (will do) some pretty shady things in the world of Deltarune. To understand why, we have to examine how exactly Sans and Gaster are related. Let’s start with Ice-E since we know that he’s somehow associated with Sans.

The “Nightmare” variant of the Ice-E word search appears in fun values between 56 and 57. There is only one other snowman that appears in Undertale.

We are asked to take “a piece” of it. Let’s investigate where else this specific phrase is used. Following this trail of breadcrumbs reveals other phrases that Sans and Gaster-related things share.

Exhibit A: Gaster follower #2, “time and space”

The prophecy has something to do with Sans and Gaster. I’ll let the evidence speak for itself.

Exhibit B: Memoryheads, “be seeing you”

Memoryheads are the first amalgamate we encounter in the True Lab. Before their spare conditions are met, they are known as " " (six blank spaces). Gaster is frequently associated with the number six.

If we attack the Memoryheads, these statements flash by quickly in red text:

FAILURE

But it didn't work.

nope

Absorbed

Don't worry about it.

I'm lovin' it.

Occurs when the player tries to name themselves Sans.

We see the phrase “be seeing you” in only these instances. Below is the Sound Test Room that has a chance to appear if the fun value is set to 65. This is the only place that “Gaster’s theme” can be accessed in-game.

Exhibit C: The dump

“The abyss” makes an appearance again. It’s something to pay close attention to--it’s always somehow related to Gaster. So what does a piece of trash falling into the abyss mean? Well, we know that Gaster “fell” into his creation...

We know that Flowey refers to Sans as “Smiley Trashbag”. Papyrus states that Sans frequents Grillby’s, a “purgatory” and “hamburger abyss”.

(note: Papyrus is referring to a literal trash can here, but the implication that Sans is “trash-like” is here)

If it’s not clear what I’m getting to, then let me spell it out: Sans is a piece of Gaster, they are one and the same. Sans/Gaster took his “experiment” with Deltarune too far, possibly destroying the world and displacing him in Undertale.

I’ll continue this in another post because it seems that tumblr is breaking.

❤️ || Part 2 || Part 3

#undertale #deltarune #undertale theory #deltarune theory #sans #gaster #cellytheory

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queen0fm0nsterz · 10 months

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Gonna say this rn before I forget, but personally I am of the opinion that while the Nowhere (the official name of the LN world) has a regular time continuom, the children who are brought in from different timelines/universes can pop in it at completely random points in time.

This could explain why, in the podcast, Noone did not know/understand Jester's joke, and why doctor Otto mentioned it was an old joke. Two or more children from different time periods could stand together in the Nowhere. And it could also explain why the LN universe seems to have so many different aesthetics clashing together.

I am also of the opinion that some children (pointing to Mono and the Pretender, but partially to the Refugee Boy as well) could very well be natives from the Nowhere, while most other children -- Six included -- come from other worlds. The logistics of how they get stuck in the Nowhere are unclear for now, but it seems that at some point their physical body stops being in their original universe/reality and follows them into the Nowhere which is what gets them completely trapped.

#little nightmares #the sound of nightmares #the sounds of nightmares #little nightmares iii #little nightmares podcast #ln meta #little nightmares theory #little nightmares iii theory #little nightmares ii theory #{IM MENTAL}

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cappymightwrite · 2 years

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Hey cappy love your metas and in depth analysis of Asoiaf . I wanted to ask you whether there is some literary connotation attached to a young girl dreaming of hounds to her choosing and ending up marrying a man below her station because recently I have been seeing this peddled by some shippers in context to Sansa's endgame ? You know the shippers, I don't have to mention them . The blog should be censored or else idiots will start jumping into your inbox and send anon hate which I don't want to happen to you .

Hello and thank you!

Apologies for the delayed response... I know I've been a bit MIA recently 😅 But strap in for a very detailed answer because this is certainly an interesting question! 🤓 I should preface this though by stating that I am not in any way a definitive source on dream symbolism, so I could be mistaken, etc.

That being said... after doing a bit of reading around, I couldn't find anything to suggest that there's some well-established motif to do with dreams of dogs/hounds foreshadowing marriage to a person of a lower social status. Now, maybe there's an obscure reference somewhere that I'm just not aware of, but in terms of something well-known that I could easily draw up an example of... nope.

(Kindly meant warning to any wayward S@nsan shippers or H0und fans, please avoid reading any further for your own peace of mind! I've tried to censor names + use the appropriate tags, but on the off chance this slips through... GO NO FURTHER!)

Granted I haven't seen that particular theory, but... it seems quite a stretch, especially since there seems to be little literary precedence for such a thing. Moreover, does Sansa explicitly dream of a h0und in the literal sense? She certainly has a nightmare that strongly alludes to the H0und...

That night Sansa scarcely slept at all, but tossed and turned just as she had aboard the Merling King. She dreamt of Joffrey dying, but as he clawed at his throat and the blood ran down across his fingers she saw with horror that it was her brother Robb. And she dreamed of her wedding night too, of Tyrion's eyes devouring her as she undressed. Only then he was bigger than Tyrion had any right to be, and when he climbed into the bed his face was scarred only on one side. "I'll have a song from you," he rasped, and Sansa woke and found the old blind dog beside her once again. "I wish that you were Lady," she said. – ASOS, Sansa VI

But the imagery used in this passage isn't romantic nor suggestive of marriage, instead it is a patchwork of trauma, of death and violence. Also, quite crucially, we see Sansa rejecting the "old blind dog" rather than choosing it, instead reaffirming her Starkness through her longing for her direwolf, Lady. Indeed, it somewhat parallels another instance in which Sansa rejects the offer of a dog, in favour of loyalty to a Stark direwolf, way back in AGOT:

The king was in no mood for more argument. "Enough, Ned, I will hear no more. A direwolf is a savage beast. Sooner or later it would have turned on your girl the same way the other did on my son. Get her a dog, she'll be happier for it." – AGOT, Eddard III

I understand that SxS shippers see the line "Get her a dog, she'll be happier for it" as foreshadowing for their ship, however they fail, or rather choose not to consider, the context of the moment, and in particular Sansa's own response to that suggestion:

That was when Sansa finally seemed to comprehend. Her eyes were frightened as they went to her father. "He doesn't mean Lady, does he?" She saw the truth on his face. "No," she said. "No, not Lady, Lady didn't bite anybody, she's good…" – AGOT, Eddard III

There is no internal musing on Ned's part that oh, yes if only these direwolves had been dogs, etc. If anything this suggestion is outright ignored, as though it were never spoken — neither Ned, nor Sansa, respond to it. For a dog is no replacement for a (dire)wolf. Sansa would therefore not be "happier" with a dog.

"She's not a dog, she's a direwolf," Sansa pointed out as Lady licked her fingers with a rough tongue. – AGOT, Sansa I

She is loyal to her Lady, she loves her Lady, and we see this longing for her direwolf, and how no other can replace her, throughout the series, post her unjust killing:

"I wish that you were Lady," she said. – ASOS, Sansa VI

But anyway, back to the topic of dreams. The only other instance I can think of in which Sansa, dreams and dogs/h0unds come up is this passage from Feast:

By the time they finally reached her father's castle, Lady Myranda was drowsing too, and Alayne was dreaming of her bed. It will be a featherbed, she told herself, soft and warm and deep, piled high with furs. I will dream a sweet dream, and when I wake there will be dogs barking, women gossiping beside the well, swords ringing in the yard. And later there will be a feast, with music and dancing. After the deathly silence of the Eyrie, she yearned for shouts and laughter. – AFFC, Alayne II

However, as we can see, she isn't actually dreaming of dogs. She says she will dream "a sweet dream," and upon waking the scene she describes eerily recalls past days at Winterfell, at least to me it does. Like I mentioned previously, the motif which you describe is either non-existant, or it is extremely obscure — I looked on both Google Scholar and my uni's online library database for articles alluding to this and came up with nothing, though perhaps a more extensive search might have produced something??

What I did find that might be of interest was an article on animal symbolism in dreams... The Cat, the Dog, and the Horse in Dreams, by Regina Abt. Looking specifically at dogs in dreams, and their symbolism more generally, I think there's some very interesting connections to be made with the characterisation of the H0und.

[...] dogs can be thievish, gluttonous, and disobedient. In mythology and folktales, the dog is commonly cast as a thief and cheat.

You could argue that there is something gluttonous about the H0und in his relationship to alcohol, sex and violence, and more pyschologically, the way he wallows in nihilism, in cynicism, etc:

"True knights," he mocked. "And I'm no lord, no more than I'm a knight. Do I need to beat that into you?" Clegane reeled and almost fell. "Gods," he swore, "too much wine. Do you like wine, little bird? True wine? A flagon of sour red, dark as blood, all a man needs. Or a woman." – ACOK, Sansa II

But what is perhaps most interesting to me is this idea of the dog as a thief and how that is perhaps represented in the H0und:

He made a queer sound, and it took her a moment to realize he was sobbing. "And the little bird, your pretty sister, I stood there in my white cloak and let them beat her. I took the bloody song, she never gave it. I meant to take her too. I should have. I should have fucked her bloody and ripped her heart out before leaving her for that dwarf." – ASOS, Arya XIII

The H0und "took" a song from Sansa, in other words he stole it. And what's more, he meant to r*pe her as well, which can also be regarded as a violation connected to stealing — a stealing of agency, of control, of access to one's body, a stealing of intimacy. Even the way he phrases it — "I meant to take her too" — envokes stealing.

But why is the dog considered a thief in folklore and mythology? Regina Abt notes that "in various tales the dog is described as the thief of fire," which is very striking since the H0und is traumatically connected to fire, thanks to burns he received from his brother Gregor. Of course, the dog doesn't have wholly negative connotations in dreams and mythology, but in its darker aspect Abt mentioned its connection to disobedience, which is linked to the various myths concerning the stealing of fire:

A tribe in Biafra says that the dog stole fire from heaven and brought it to man. In a New Guinea legend, the dog stole fire from his first owner, a rat (a nocturnal animal with devilish features). In the upper Nile region, fire was stolen from a snake, or from the gods, or from the rainbow. From all these myths we can see that the dog, even in his dark aspect, serves the development of consciousness. Like Prometheus, who stole fire and brought it to humankind, the dog commits the sin of disobedience. Yet, it is this very animal which will later become 'man's best friend' and helper.

The H0und arguably has an interesting relationship with obedience, since he is introduced to us as a lackey of the Lannisters...

He looked at Sandor Clegane. "And you, dog, away with you, you're scaring my betrothed."

The H0und, ever faithful, bowed and slid away quietly through the press. – AGOT, Sansa I

... obediently following Joffrey's orders, later standing by as Sansa is beaten. Interestingly, although the H0und never beats her himself, it is notable that that may be because Joffrey never actually explicitly asks him to. So, we could view that as a rather convenient loophole:

The others obeyed without question... except for the H0und, but Joff never asked the H0und to punish her. He used the other five for that. – ACOK, Sansa I

What might he have done had Joffrey demanded that of him? Would he have followed orders... or not? Would he have disobeyed?

I guess we'll never know, but it's shouldn't be ignored that his hands are only clean in this regard largely because it was never outright asked of him. Perhaps his conscience would have got the better of him though, after all he did make a weak (and ultimately ineffectual) protest at Sansa being stripped, and also subtly assists in regards to Ser Dontos' near brush with death... These instances could be viewed as moments of disobedience, and yet he never fully commits to them, because after all, any kind of stronger interference would have cost him his own standing, and even his life perhaps...

Where the H0und is clearly the most disobedient, however, is in his rejection of knighthood, in his cynical and nihilistic worldview. And it notably costs him relatively little, materially and socially at least, to display this form of disobedience. He proclaims to be "no ser," to shun chivalry and the institution of knighthood, and yet he is never truly disobedient where is really counts... though maybe that's where his arc is headed? Perhaps in a self-sacrificing and mortal moment of true chivalry (which others have speculated will be in aid of the Stark sisters) he will finally go against the negative worldview he's so fiercly clung to. He will finally be disobedient in a way that counts, in a way that is conversely positive. Sometimes it's right to disobey.

Looking at his current story, however, it should be acknowledged that some would like to argue that the H0und positively opens Sansa's eyes to the harsh realities of the world and perhaps in this way he references the helper aspect of the dog Abt mentions. And yet, I reject that association, as although the H0und likely thinks he's doing her a twisted service, he is nevertheless no friend to her, and his worldview is not one that should be unquestioningly adopted. Certainly, he reveals the darker aspects of the world to her:

Only Ser Dontos had tried to help, and he was no longer a knight, no more than the Imp was, nor the H0und... the H0und hated knights... I hate them too, Sansa thought. They are no true knights, not one of them. – ACOK, Sansa III

Cl3gane laughed again. "Your father lied. Killing is the sweetest thing there is." He drew his longsword. "Here's your truth. Your precious father found that out on Baelor's steps. Lord of Winterfell, Hand of the King, Warden of the North, the mighty Eddard Stark, of a line eight thousand years old... but Ilyn Payne's blade went through his neck all the same, didn't it? Do you remember the dance he did when his head came off his shoulders?" – ACOK, Sansa IV

But what the H0und says is in no way a universal truth, and really, it is more his own actions, rather than these "truths" he tells, that reveal the ugliness of man... and it is an ugliness far greater than any burn to the face could achieve. When he speaks of all men enjoying killing he is speaking of himself, and why does he enjoy killing, why does he enjoy physical intimidation?

Sansa hugged herself, suddenly cold. "Why are you always so hateful? I was thanking you... "

"Just as if I was one of those true knights you love so well, yes. What do you think a knight is for, girl? You think it's all taking favors from ladies and looking fine in gold plate? Knights are for killing." He laid the edge of his longsword against her neck, just under her ear. Sansa could feel the sharpness of the steel. "I killed my first man at twelve. I've lost count of how many I've killed since then. High lords with old names, fat rich men dressed in velvet, knights puffed up like bladders with their honors, yes, and women and children too—they're all meat, and I'm the butcher. Let them have their lands and their gods and their gold. Let them have their sers." Sand0r Cl3gane spat at her feet to show what he thought of that. "So long as I have this," he said, lifting the sword from her throat, "there's no man on earth I need fear." – ACOK, Sansa IV

It is quite clearly about about control, isn't it.

His proclivity for violence, which he justifies through his warped worldview, gives him control when once he was helpless, it gives him the power to inflict pain rather than recieve it... all the things he was without as that boy who had his face forced into the fire. It's not based in any superior understanding of the world, instead it's rooted intimately in his own experiences and trauma, his own feelings of worthlessness and powerlessness, but to admit that would be to relinquish that sought after control, to be vulnerable... and he can't be having that!

By contrast, Sansa's innocence, her own vulnerability, arguably casts a light on the H0und's unresolved issues reaching back to childhood... and it shames him, it points a finger, it questions the stability of his outlook. It loosens his control.

We could now say that when the dog, as an instinct, is constellated in the unconscious, it can bring new light, an opportunity of seeing things in a new way.

Like I said, although it is not a worldview to be adopted, it is nevertheless an illuminating one, and it cannot be denied that the H0und does play a significant part in Sansa's disillusionment arc. Where opinions differ is whether this arc, and his involvement in it, should be read as an ultimately positive occurence, enabling Sansa to lose her rose-tinted glasses for the "better," or, if on the other hand, this should be viewed as something far more tragic... a loss of innocence and a degradation of idealism. I'm firmly of the latter opinion, though it checks out as structurally analogous with a bildungsroman narrative.

But anyway, if we return to Sansa's nightmare, which ends with the H0und climbing into her bed, the imagery which precedes it informs us of the threatening intent behind his behaviour during the Blackwater. In her waking moments, Sansa rewrites the events of that night into the infamous "unkiss", as a means of avoiding the realities of that traumatic event. This dream, however, reveals the reality, using strikingly violent and somewhat animalistic language:

As previously noted by Abt, the dog in dreams can sometimes reveal, or lead us to, a new way of viewing things. Furthermore:

The dog in Western alchemy is identical with the lion, which is an animal of the sun. Thus the dog in alchemy also is associated with the illuminating light of consciousness.

Admittedly, I know absolutely zilch about Western alchemy, but isn't that a cool observation? Lion and the sun, dogs and fire...

In the songs, Lann was the fellow who winkled the Casterlys out of Casterly Rock with no weapon but his wits, and stole gold from the sun to brighten his curly hair. – AGOT, Eddard VI

Indeed, as I mentioned, Sansa goes through this disillusionment arc closely connected to key figures like Joffrey, Cersei, the H0und and to some extent Robert Baratheon, proving that all that glitters is not gold, kings and queens aren't always honourable and neither are knights, etc. As the lions of Lannister rise, so does their symbolic sun to reveal their corruption and injustice, and the H0und is an extension of them as "Joffrey's dog" (ACOK, Tyrion X), and thus part of this ironically disillusioning illumination.

But as fire is also a symbol for fiery emotion or sexual passion in its dangerous, overwhelming aspects, the dog instinct, which brings up all of that, may be experienced as threatening.

Intriguingly, even though the H0und is understandably fearful of fire, he nevertheless behaves with "fiery emotion" and it's very much connected to fire — he is overwhelmed by fire, and most threatening to Sansa against the backdrop of fire, at the Blackwater:

The blood masked the worst of his scars, but his eyes were white and wide and terrifying. The burnt corner of his mouth twitched and twitched again. Sansa could smell him; a stink of sweat and sour wine and stale vomit, and over it all the reek of blood, blood, blood.

"I could keep you safe," he rasped. "They're all afraid of me. No one would hurt you again, or I'd kill them." He yanked her closer, and for a moment she thought he meant to kiss her. He was too strong to fight. She closed her eyes, wanting it to be over, but nothing happened. "Still can't bear to look, can you?" she heard him say. He gave her arm a hard wrench, pulling her around and shoving her down onto the bed. "I'll have that song. Florian and Jonquil, you said." His dagger was out, poised at her throat. "Sing, little bird. Sing for your little life."

Her throat was dry and tight with fear, and every song she had ever known had fled from her mind. Please don't kill me, she wanted to scream, please don't. She could feel him twisting the point, pushing it into her throat, and she almost closed her eyes again, but then she remembered. It was not the song of Florian and Jonquil, but it was a song. Her voice sounded small and thin and tremulous in her ears. – ACOK, Sansa VII

The H0und had turned craven, she heard it said; at the height of the battle, he got so drunk the Imp had to take his men. But Sansa understood. She knew the secret of his burned face. It was only the fire he feared. – ASOS, Sansa I

In the first passage, the emotional instability of the H0und in this moment is perhaps best highlighted by the physical tick of his mouth twitching — an involuntary moment, something out of his control. His dangerousness is also clear to see in the way his physically accosts her, moving her to the bed, putting a blade to her throat, then twisting it's point, as though to further emphasise the threat he poses to her. And Sansa is overwhelmed by this — "Her throat was dry and tight with fear." The dark aspect of the dog is very much present in this scene, including the sexual aspect, which is alluded to in the way the H0und "shov[es] her down onto the bed."

I think also the threat of death at the end of a blade, while made overt in Sansa's own internal thoughts — "Please don't kill me" — somewhat conceals another threat, the one of r*pe, which some readers pick up on easily, while others choose to ignore, or misconstrue as devoid of real intention. But, as she is forced down and held on the bed, his "dagger" is "poised", then "twisting [at] the point", "pushing [...] into her." Like... come on. Maybe it's a good time to use this meme I made:

As a rule I don't tend to discuss the ships I'm anti on because a) I'm rarely asked about it, and b) I prefer to ramble on about ships I do enjoy. But this ask does give me the opportunity to confirm that I do find SxS pretty damn repellent! I think there's nuance to the H0und, sure, but I dislike him immensely. So that's that on that, lmao 😅

But back to what I was saying... as we know, or rather some of us know, the Blackwater interaction was no hollow threat. The threat of assault was very present, as the H0und himself admits to:

"[...] I meant to take her too. I should have. I should have fucked her bloody and ripped her heart out before leaving her for that dwarf." – ASOS, Arya XIII

This is the dark sexual aspect of the dog, very clearly laid out. And yet, I'm aware of the counterargument that this statement should be dismissed, or taken with a grain of salt, because it takes place in a moment where the H0und is goading Arya to give him the mercy of a quick death. But what is more hurtful, what is more effective, than goading with a horrible truth? Yes, he is goading her, but he is also telling the truth, because his confession is tellingly preceded by this:

"Don't lie," he growled. "I hate liars [...]" – ASOS, Arya XIII

But ok, let's say, bless his heart, he was exaggerating. Even so, telling a child, the sister of your almost but sike, not really victim, who is also a child, that you intended to brutally r*pe her and then kill her in a twisted form of mercy to spare her from her husband... this is not the mark of a moral person. This not behaviour we should be understanding of or sympathetic to. It's repugnant. Certainly, there is an explanation for this behaviour, rooted in his trauma, but explanation and context does not equate to justification.

But anyway! I feel like I started off fairly chill but then I riled myself up 😅 So, moving on... back to the dark aspect of dog symbolism.

In Egypt, where dogs were the subject of special attention and sincere affection, the most important canine god was Anubis, patron of embalmers and protector of the necropolis, who guided the deceased and participated in the divine judgement. Anubus is shown in the embalming rituals, which were a condition for the soul to attain immortality. The priests who did the embalming wore a mask of an Anubis head, thus creating an identity. Anubis is also depicted as a jackal-headed human. Later in this funerary role Anubis was identified with Hermes Psychopompos or Mercury. Hermes is also shown with a helmet or a cap that resembles a dog's head.

(^Anubis attending the mummy of the deceased)

This is an interesting parallel to the H0und and his connection to death symbolism, as like the priests of Anubis, he too wears a kind of mask of a dog, but in the form of a helmet:

He had lowered the visor on his helm. It was fashioned in the likeness of a snarling black hound, fearsome to behold, but Tyrion had always thought it a great improvement over Cl3gane's hideously burned face. – AGOT, Tyrion I

Thrice Ned saw Ser Gregor aim savage blows at the hound's-head helmet, yet not once did Sand0r send a cut at his brother's unprotected face. – AGOT, Eddard VII

He couldn't hide the scars behind a helm, either; not so long as the helm was made in the shape of a snarling dog. – ASOS, Arya X

Furthermore, from just a quick google image search, it seems quite typical for depictions of the jackal-headed Anubis to be black in colour. But this use of a helmet also parallels depictions of Hermes, as mentioned above. So, since the H0und appears to be consciously or unconsciously quite closely connected to the dark aspect of the dog... if he's going to feature in any of Sansa's dreams, it's not going to foreshadow a future marriage by any stretch.

To return to this idea that the H0und is connected to death symbolism and to a potential funerary role, akin to Anubis, we need only look to the name of his infamous horse:

The horse was a heavy courser, almost as big as a destrier but much faster. Stranger, the H0und called him [...] He was gentle as an old gelding with his master, but otherwise he had a temper as black as he was. She had never known a horse so quick to bite or kick. – ASOS, Arya IX

This is an interesting choice of name, to say the least, when we consider what the Stranger represents in the faith of the Seven:

And the seventh face... the Stranger was neither male nor female, yet both, ever the outcast, the wanderer from far places, less and more than human, unknown and unknowable. Here the face was a black oval, a shadow with stars for eyes. – ACOK, Catelyn IV

Joffrey's bier had been laid out beneath the Stranger, who led the newly dead to the other world. – ASOS, Jaime VII

Again we have these parallels themes of the colour black, a funerary role, something "less and more than human", someone who guides the deceased to the afterlife. This is all fairly typical of death deities, e.g. you see these characteristics represented in the Norse god Óðinn. What's interesting here is the death deity's link to dogs...

The idea of the dog as a guide for the deceased is widely known.

We see this connection extended further in regards to the H0und when he washes up on the Quiet Isle and becomes the mysterious gravedigger. Indeed, whilst unconfirmed, the likelihood of this being the H0und is made stronger by the fact that Stranger, his horse, is also stabled on the Isle, as well as his affinity for dogs:

[...] they passed a lichyard where a brother bigger than Brienne was struggling to dig a grave. From the way he moved, it was plain to see that he was lame. As he flung a spadeful of the stony soil over one shoulder, some chanced to spatter against their feet. "Be more watchful there," chided Brother Narbert. "Septon Meribald might have gotten a mouthful of dirt." The gravedigger lowered his head. When Dog went to sniff him he dropped his spade and scratched his ear. – AFFC, Brienne VI

Returning back to Ancient Egypt, Abt notes that:

In Egypt dogs as carrion feeders were often seen around Necropolis and its graves, so the connection with death is at hand. The dark side of the symbol of the dog not only belongs to Anubis, the god of death, but also to Cerberus, originally a god of death and the watchdog of Pluto, the god of the underworld.

(^Cerberus, with the gluttons in Dante's Third Circle of Hell, by William Blake)

In light of this, whether this parallel was intended or not, it's even more likely and striking that the H0und takes of the role of a gravedigger. This mention of Cerberus as a watchdog of Pluto (in Roman tradition, Hades in Greek) is also pretty noteworthy in relation to the H0und's previous role as a kingsguard, as well as his passivity during Sansa's beatings — he more or less just watches it happen.

Barbara Hannah says that the Cerberus qualities, on one hand, have to do with the 'angry instinct.' [...] It is obvious that we cannot fight Cerberus, nor should we offend him. He is a powerful god, who can only be appeased by sacrifice.

The anger of Cerberus is also apparent in the H0und and this volatile nature is made clear in pretty much all his interactions with Sansa:

The scars are not the worst part, nor even the way his mouth twitches. It's his eyes. She had never seen eyes so full of anger. "I... I should have come to you after," she said haltingly. "To thank you, for... for saving me... you were so brave."

"Brave?" His laugh was half a snarl. "A dog doesn't need courage to chase off rats. They had me thirty to one, and not a man of them dared face me." – ACOK, Sansa IV

This particular depiction of dogs is not restricted to Classical myths, and are often connected to representations of wolves as well:

In mythology and legends the dog is sometimes a ferocious beast, equal to the wolf, and representing untamed aggressiveness.

In mythology wolves belong to the dark side of Apollo, to Mars and to Wotan. Wolves and black dogs in our legends rush along in the wild hunt with Wotan and the souls of dead people. They are daemonic dogs, linked to wild, unrestrained emotions and aggressions.

While I won't deny that there isn't a close symbolic relationship between dogs and wolves, as I mentioned earlier, I think asoiaf makes it clear that whilst connected... there is a marked distinction.

I've talked a lot about the dark aspect of the dog, but obviously that's just one side of the coin. Although I don't like him as a person, writing this has revealed some interesting things. What I find tragic and pitiful about the H0und (although my sympathy can only stretch so far) is that he is clearly someone is deep need of emotional healing.

Sansa found Bryen's old blind dog in her little alcove beneath the steps, and lay down next to him. He woke and licked her face. "You sad old h0und," she said, ruffling his fur. – ASOS, Sansa VI

So, whilst the dog is associated with volatile emotions and death, it's notable that it also has a "healing function" according to Abt:

We find a healing function in a dog's character but also within the psyche. Dogs and snakes were associated with Aesculapius, the Greek healing god. It seems that in the Aesculapian temple of Epidaurus, sacred dogs as well as serpents took part in the healing ceremonies and were, so to speak, the living repository for the healing power of the god. Because dogs can heal themselves by licking their wounds, people believed they could do this for human beings too.

As most people have inferred that the gravedigger and the H0und are one in the same, it is striking that the Quiet Isle is a place of penitence... self-healing if you will. Now, some theorise that the H0und's time spent there is effectively preparing him to be a man worthy of Sansa's affection. Gotta say hard disagree on that one! I think it would rather undermine the point of penitence if the outcome is that he is rewarded with the girl he's traumatised, but I digress.

What is notable about the H0und for me is that he has the potential to mirror the positive, protective aspects of the dog... but more often that not has mirrored its darker aspect instead:

The dog as the bringer of fire signifies warmth, protection, and light, but in its shadow aspect, is possessed by overwhelming emotion. Aggression, covetousness, greed [...] are other shadow sides of the dog instinct.

To conclude this long ramble, in many ways, I think the H0und is far more representative of the "shadow aspect" of the dog, than anything to do with high+lowborn marriage or fairy tale romance. However, I wouldn't be surprised if his arc is leading him towards... not quite redemption, but a better understanding and embodiment of the good aspects of the dog. That doesn't erase the trauma he's inflicted, however, nor should it grant him a romantic "reward."

Maybe its the rather forced association with Beauty and the Beast that has duped people into believing his is a romantic figure? But I don't buy that at all. I think these connections to death and healing are far more interesting and compelling, so if he does ever appear in another nightmare, or a dream, those are the associations that have more of a background in actual real world folklore and mythology.

Lmao 😅 this is why it takes me a while to respond to my anons... I really like to answer them as thoroughly and interestingly as I can.

Thanks for the ask! :)

Article Used:

Regina Abt, "The Cat, the Dog, and the Horse in Dreams," Psychological Perspectives 49, no. 2 (2006): 166–227.

#cappy's thoughts #sansa stark #anti sandor clegane #anti sansan #anti the hound #please beware the tags!!#animal symbolism in folklore and mythology #tw: assault

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tomhiddelstonandzaynmalik · 3 years

Text

Love at first sight?

Chapter 5

Warren Worthington III x Reader

Word count: 1340 words

Warnings: Language, suicidal thoughts.

prologue chapter 1 chapter 2 chapter 3 chapter 4

"[...] I wish I was a heavenly angel

For I would always cling to my sword

But I am no heavenly angel

Hence I must fight the pain of my fault [...]".

-Heavenly Angel by an unknown author.

"Don't you have a life or something?". Warren teased Hank. It was 3:49 AM when the young man awoke from his slumber. "Not really, thanks to you". Hank's intentions had been good. To return the teasing only. But the purpose got lost when he saw Warren looking down in shame, shifting in bed as he seemed to try to make himself disappear.

It was a touchy subject for him, Hank had forgotten. He knew just how much he felt like a burden to everyone at Xavier's. It was clear Warren was not much of a talker himself. But when those sleepless nights came, where he would jump out of bed covered in sweat and breathing harshly after a particularly awful nightmare, that the idea of staying awake with his companion was more inviting than to go back to his made-up Hell.

Only then Hank had learned about the extravagant life, filled with luxurious items and exotic vacations Warren had grown in. Hank also found out about Warren's handsome but cold-hearted-control-freak father, about his loving but impotent mother, about what it was to have it all only for it to be having it taken away. The lonely days and lonelier nights that followed after, the age-inappropriate behaviours, one bad decision after another, and mostly, Hank realized just how worthless the "poor rich kid" deep down felt.

"It makes no sense". Warren said softly, looking down at the cup of freshly-made tea he was holding in his hands. "What?". The older man asked him while pouring some of it on his mug. "Me! Me being here makes no sense!", "I'm nothing but an inconvenience". Warren let out with sight. Although he was referring to him being at the mansion, the hidden meaning of it sent a shiver through Hank's spine. "Hey, stop saying that! You are NOT an inconvenience, Warren. You should be here!". Said Hank as he got closer to the boy, placing a reassuring hand onto his shoulder. There was some absolute concern in Hank's voice as he saw a glimpse of a tear peeking through Warren's eyes. "Oh! bullshit!". "You more than any other person should be pissed off with me!". "You're working extra hours on a lost cause!". Hank's heart hunched. It was true Hank had been depriving himself a lot so Warren could have the best treatment. Yes, he attempted to kill him and his friends before. But the more time he had spent with the kid, the more he had realized: Warren had been a pawn, manipulated only by the true villain, Apocalypse.

"Hey! Look at me, Warren." He said firmly. "Yes, you are right. I should be taking better care of myself. But I'm only doing so because I'm not willing to slow down until you're heald". He said, with such convincement, it made Warren believe there could be someone being finally genuinely kind to him.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

"I- I was only, umm, you know it was just a joke, right?". Hank nervously stated. "Sure, man". Even though Warren seemed to pay no mind towards Hank's comment, his voice had failed him, having it come out on a lower pitch rather than his usual vigorous one.

in an attempt of changing the topic, Hank pointed at your still sleeping figure. "So... An old friend of yours?".

It was somehow painful for Warren to see you there, resting at the infirmary room connected to all those noisy machines. In the end, your near-death encounter, in theory, had been Warren's fault. Hank's question had rumbled within the blond's mind. You weren't friends. He didn't even know your name. And honestly, he was more preoccupied with the atrocious first impression he believed he'd made in front of you. "You are the biggest idiot on earth if you think she'll ever want to even see you after what you've put her through". Warren's inside voice scolded him.

"No". The young mutant finally answered. "oh! I see". Hank teased again. Even though what Hank was implying: The real reason You were there was because of Warren's attraction to You, was nothing but the truth. Warren couldn't stop the blush from tinting his pale cheeks." It's not what you think, okay!". "Well, your face says otherwise, Romeo". The older man was grinning at him in amusement. "Shut up!". Warren's effort of sounding threatening failed due to his face heating up impossibly harder. His natural porcelain-white face was now a deep shade of red, making his facial tattoos stand out even more. Hank was having the time of his life. While Warren was acting like a teenage boy, he couldn't stop the laughs from coming out. "You done?". Warren said from behind one of the wings he'd been using as a cover. "Hey, take it as payback from running away".

"[...] I wish I was a heavenly angel

For my heart shall always be in joy

But I am no heavenly angel

Hence I must behave just like a boy".

The atmosphere remained comfortable. After an hour or so, Warren fell asleep again, not after convincing Hank to do the same. Who after, some reluctance, finally gave in and left to his room.

"Wakie, wakie, sleeping beauty". A hoarse grunt came from Warren's sleeping form as Ororo was poking his cheeks to get his friend out of Morpheus' grip faster. "Come on, Dollface. You have to get out of bed! It's almost 9 PM!". "What the hell?" Warren shifted in bed, reading the big clock on the wall. "You little shit, it's only 9... AM!".

Ororo's giggles were resounding through the room. "Oops". "Well, now that your up, we might as well get breakfast. Don't you think?". He was going to argue about how unholy early his friend had decided to show up when his stomach gave him in. It had been more than 18 hours since the last time he'd eaten, which was why he decided to let it slip. "Fine! But you'll have to give me your bacon to make up for waking up a man who almost died in a fire at 9 AM".

"Yeez, you sure are a Drama Queen, Warren". Ororo was walking toward your bed, peeping at the monitors. "Hank said she was the one who got it bad". "Your problem was only exhaustion, which reminds me of: Hank told me, to tell you that you're free to go".

Warren zoned out the moment Ororo mention you. Under the morning's light, it was easier for him to examine You. Your H/C locks were stiff from all the dirt and ash from the fire; Your face, which had been whipped clean when you arrived, allowed him to scrutinize every inch of it. Nothing was going unnoticed. Even the tiniest of your scars located under your left brow had been seen. He was so lost on himself taking your features in he'd forgotten he was in the middle of a conversation. "Earth calling Fallen Angel, do you copy, Fallen Angel?". Ororo raised her voice. "Uh? Yes, what?". "Dear Lord, you didn't hear a thing, did you?". Ororo was irritated but decided against scolding Warren. Him showing interest in people was an odd sight. "I said if you wanted me to get you your breakfast so you could spend more time with her before your appointment with The Professor?". He only wished his friend wasn't able to see his excitement from such an offering. "That would be ni-, wait which appointment?". "What? Your pigeon brain didn't register that either? The Professor said he had something to tell you. Be at his office at 11 sharp". After that, the girl stormed off the room while yelling something along the lines of "not being people's secretary".

It had been only then, as he stood in the middle of the room when Warren heard a muffled voice behind him.

"I'm I dead?" You said.

#warren worthington iii #warren worthington x reader #archangel x reader #ben hardy x reader #ben hardy #xmen x reader #xmen #ororo munroe #hank mccoy

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raith-way · 3 years

Text

stories i would write if i had 12% more inspiration [1/?]

Fandom: Twilight Series

Main Original Character: Antonia “Toni” Swan

Side Original Characters: Alana Santos, Gabriel Lassiter, Sara Castle

Main Pairings: Toni Swan/Jasper Hale & Bella Swan/Edward Cullen

Side Pairings: Carlisle Cullen/Charlie Swan, Esme Cullen/Tanya Denali, Alice Cullen/Rosalie Hale, Emmett Cullen/Gabriel Lassiter, Jacob Black/Alana Santos, Sam Uley/Leah Clearwater, Paul Lahote/Sara Castle

Summary: Having her younger sister living at home is a dream come true for Toni, even if things do start to get a little stranger in her small sleepy town. She keeps running into Doctor Cullen’s kids, Bella is having nightmares and wakes up speaking riddles, and Toni isn’t a fool. She finally gets Jasper Hale into direct sunlight and has all of her theories proven as his skin changes right before her eyes. Where the sun touches his skin, unhindered by clouds or shade, there’s tendrils of smoke starting to curl through the air. Her sister’s nightmares aren’t just nightmares. This is real. Vampires are real, and everything is going to change.

Part I – Viridian this battleground is deadly but you wear blood well for one so gentle.

Bella returns to Forks, and Toni befriends Jasper Hale. Things are going great, until Bella starts having nightmares and insisting that something horrible is coming for them. Something monstrous. Balancing Bella’s warnings with her every day life gets a little tricky, but having a new friend to talk to about mundane everyday things helps. Until she starts to really listen to what her younger sister is saying. The first time she sees Jasper start to burn in the sun, just small wisps of smoke, she faints. Luckily, vampires have quick reflexes and he saves her from cracking her skull right there behind the diner while on her lunch break. Before she can fully process that Bella is apparently psychic and that Jasper is an actual vampire, there’s a ballgame like Bella dating a vampire is completely normal and then her sister is running away from home. When Toni chases after her sister, who is being chased by a real-life myth, she gets there too late to help her sister and just in time to see the destruction. Vampires save her sister’s life, but that doesn’t mean she has to like all of them. As far as she’s concerned, they’re all on thin fucking ice.

Part II – Amaranthine and this was always your nature to give light in the dark

Toni greets the summer with forgiveness in her heart, and she rekindles her friendship with Jasper. She also still insists on calling him kid, as a petty punishment for stealing off with her sister in the middle of the night. On the night of Bella’s birthday celebration disaster, she tries to comfort Jasper and then tries not to take it too personally when he rebuffs her. The next day, when he stops by the house to tell her that his whole family is leaving, she takes it very personally. That anger is put on the back burner as she searches for her sister, and she’s beyond relieved when Sam comes out of the woods with Bella in his arms. Even if her old friend won’t speak to her or even look her in the eye. With the Cullens gone, Bella’s nightmares reach new heights. This time, Toni listens to every riddled warning. Makes notes to be afraid of the color red and to not be afraid of the moonlight. Thankfully, Bella spending time with Jacob seems to help some. Jacob is the kind of solid support that her sister needs, a normal friend, until he turns out to be a werewolf. Sam and Leah, her high school friends who just stopped talking to her one day, are werewolves. There’s also a guy that keeps coming into the diner and asking after the Cullen family, which puts Toni’s teeth on edge. Then Bella takes off, again, and Toni’s world becomes red. Like the hair that flashes across her vision, the mark on the side of her throat, the matching punctures circling her dad’s wrist, the scarf wound around diner guy’s neck, the shining pendant of one of Bella’s classmates. Suddenly, it seems like no one in their sleepy little town is entirely human. Bella returns, saving one nightmare and walking into another one.

Part III – Titian to shatter when needed

Toni is no longer human, neither is her dad. With a little bit of magic and tragedy, their changing process was halted. Dhampir is what she is now, not quite human and not quite vampire, and she doesn’t have much time to adjust. Her poor dad is still trying to reconcile the whole vampire thing, with Doctor Cullen’s help, and Toni spends most of her time with Jasper while trying to understand what she’s become. Diner guy has become Gabriel and is always around, but she doesn’t care if they’re the same species because he still sets her teeth on edge. (She’s also avoiding her sister, who wants to be a vampire because she’s seen herself as a vampire for years before she ever realized her nightmares were actually visions. Toni doesn’t want to be around for Edward’s brooding when he discovers that Bella doesn’t want to be a vampire for him. Bella wants to be a vampire for Bella, which means talking her out of changing is going to be impossible.) On top of the changes, there’s an army being built and Bella is convinced that there’s going to be a fight. Toni believes her sister, she knows better than to doubt her at this point, and things get even stranger. The vampires and werewolves start working together, Sam and Leah actually start talking to her again, and her (hopefully human) best friend returns to Forks to take over her family’s funeral home. The witch that saved her life won’t glance her way, which gets awkward considering how much time teenaged Alana spends around Jacob and the wolves. Also, Jasper fought in the Civil War? She almost decks him when he mentions being in the south at the time, with plans to claim she was just testing her strength, when he tells her about joining the Union and sneaking into the south to help others escape. The history lessons are fun, almost as fun as punching werewolves in the face, but the fun doesn’t last. The fight arrives, Bella’s nightmares becoming reality once more, and her sister is still so frighteningly fragile. So human. Even Toni and Charlie are practically human next to newborn vampires, but they join the fight anyway. Anything to keep Bella safe, now that they can. The fight ends in their favor, but the fight wasn’t so black-and-white. One vampire is spared, a girl younger than even Bella, and Toni and Charlie are tasked with getting Bree to safety before the Volturi can arrive. They manage their escape, they win the day, and Toni still has to listen to Bella scream at night about the monsters coming to rip them apart.

Part IV – Sable they say that the biggest stars burn brightly and die quickly.

Bella gets engaged, and Toni takes the plunge and kisses Jasper. She’d resisted during all of their tense moments, when they were pressed close and a movie would have had them bridge the gap, and waits until a quiet moment. It’s just the two of them, talking like they always do, and she kisses him like it’s something she’s done a hundred times before. In that moment, the pain of having vampire venom halted in her veins feels almost worth it. To have this moment with her best friend. Bella gets married, Toni gets to laugh at Jacob pulling at his best-man tux, and Jasper makes it look like she knows how to dance. (If she accidentally walks into a room to see her dad crying and the good doctor tenderly wiping his tears away, it’s a secret that she’ll keep for eternity.) While her sister enjoys her honeymoon, Toni gets to learn what makes Jasper laugh and what gets him to say her name in that way that makes her knees feel like jelly. Life is finally peaceful in their quiet sleepy town, until Bella walks into the Cullen’s house with a very visible baby bump a few weeks later. Toni stays by her sister’s side, mainly to attempt to get her to change the awful baby names that she picked out, and she watches as all their alliances start to fall apart. Witches don’t trust the unknown. Werewolves don’t trust the unknown. Vampires don’t trust the unknown. The only problem is, Bella’s baby isn’t an unknown. Alice can’t see the baby, but Bella can and Toni trusts Bella. One night, Bella wakes up laughing and tells Toni that everything is going to be perfect. The baby is going to be healthy, and Bella is going to be what she was always meant to be. Again, Bella is right. Things look dire for a while, her dad can’t go more than half an hour without a panic attack, and then there’s Nessie. (Toni refuses to say the entire name. It’s either Ren or Nessie.) Bella wakes up, and their family is whole. While the others marvel at her sister’s control, Toni isn’t surprised at all. Because this is who Bella was born to be. They get moments of bliss before the nightmares start again, Bella doesn’t need sleep to suffer through nightmares, and the Volturi come for them. For Nessie. Alice. Edward. Jasper. It’s a fight, it’s always a fight, and Toni doesn’t back down. She meets other vampires, what she thinks of as real vampires with their blood red eyes, and snaps her teeth at the ones who think she’s lesser for only being half of what they are. (She believes her human half is what makes her special.) Her only solace is with Jasper, and then the fight comes. Watching lines of black cross the white snow frightens her, but Toni stands her ground next to her family and she fights. They fight, and they win.

Part V – Mazarine achilles was the sun but baby, you were always a supernova

They get to see Nessie grow up, to see their family expand, and Toni is so happy that she feels like she could burst with it. Even Jasper smiles most days, and they start their life together. He shows her all the places she dreamed of seeing and never believed would be possible, and they frequently meet up with other members of their family. Edward and Bella, in France, traveling with Nessie and Bree. Jacob and Alana, in Spain, after the kids have enjoyed their own extended honeymoon. Sam and Leah and Paul and Sara, back in Forks, keeping the quiet town safe. Esme and Tanya and Garrett and Kate, under the beautifully dark Alaskan sky. Alice and Rosalie and Emmett and Gabriel in London, laughing in the streets. Carlisle and Charlie, in Brazil, where Toni and her dad can stay in the sunlight all day long without the fear of burning. Years pass, beautiful memories and beautiful moments, and Toni cherishes Jasper’s every sigh and laugh. When Bella finds her, with tears in her glowing golden eyes, Toni knows that this is it. Bella has dreamed of the monsters that would come for them since they were little girls. They’d glimpsed the monsters, and that had been a mistake. The monsters had seen them in return, knew what to expect and had time to plan, and Toni takes her sister’s hands and promises her that this time will be different. This time, they’ll kill them all and show them what real monsters can do.

Forever Taglist: @jinxsflame @hughstheforcelou @uno-reverse-reversed @hiddenqveendom @asirensrage @ocfairygodmother @jewelswrites-ish

#fandom: twilight #oc: toni swan #fic: caught off guard #ch: jasper hale #jasper hale x ofc #jasper hale x oc #clearly a lot of thought has gone into this #it’s thoroughly planned out #it haunts me #i’m hoping posting this will purge the thoughts #so i guess #meet toni swan #my disaster child

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oddberryshortcake · 4 years

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pplz,,, great zimothy,, tell me you got some tallest red meta and/or headcanons i must be FED

I do!! I have lots actually, I dunno why I haven’t talked about it much. I have started writing a fic that I hope to go into more depth on how I interpret his character

-Despite his commanding presence, the fact that Red is far more invested in Operation Impending Doom II than Purple is, and the fact that Red takes charge in dire situations...He’s a lot more patient when it comes to Zim than most people would be. He indulges in Zim’s rants (He legitimately was listening to Zim talking about how dumb humans are), he knows how to communicate to Zim in ways that Zim can understand (”You’re trained as an Invader, Zim, battle tanks are for hardened soldiers”), and it is because of him that Zim has this fake Earth mission. He could’ve just sent Zim back into exile, or executed him, but for some reason Red’s solution was to make Zim get lost. Maybe he’d die, maybe he’d end up somewhere else and stop bothering them. It’s a strangely peaceful resolution to someone who had ended up injuring/killing multiple people. To me, there’s just a small bit of pity that might be there. They grew up together after all, Red knows very well that Zim isn’t normal. Irkens aren’t known for being cordial, in fact, they’re all pretty nasty and mean. But some Irkens show just a little bit of humility and decency, and as much as both Tallests hate Zim...Red shows Zim patience that many wouldn’t. Maybe it’s because he doesn’t want to deal with Zim, maybe it’s because there’s a part of him that recognizes Zim as someone who he’s known forever and Zim can’t help being defective. I think it’s a bit of both.

Red is technologically/mechanically gifted. If he weren’t shoved into the Tallest position (and also if he weren’t already training for the Invader position as he was in The Trial) I have a feeling he would have been a great technician. Although that sort of position is usually reserved for Vortians per Irk previous alliance with them, Red both knew how to fix the Massive in Backseat Drivers from Beyond the Stars and also literally created Gir out of trash in the Nightmare Begins.

Red is actually considered defective! Not to the degree that Zim is, but his memory is known to be imperfect. He often forgets words and struggles to remember them (Forgetting what an Armada is in the first episode would be the best example) and also forgets names and faces (Forgot who Zim was for the first few minutes of his first appearance in Enter the Florpus, Called Larb “Lorb” in the comics.) Given that Irken’s have a second brain that is a computer, his memory should be better than it is. I also personally headcanon this as being an extension of something similar to Dyslexia or Aphasia/Anomia. It isn’t really touched upon, and Purple is usually there to remind him of what he’s forgetting, but it could be a source of insecurity

Red looked up to Tallest Miyuki ever since he was little. He was genuinely distraught when she died (Just listen to the audio recording of The Trial) so when Tallest Spork took the mantle and the Control Brains and Irk had decided to enact Operation Impending Doom I, Red dedicated his heart and soul to it, even more so when he chose to revamp it during his own rule. It’s possible that Red always had dreams of conquest, but I like to think that Miyuki’s death fueled this desire within him to make Irk as powerful as it can be, to be so strong that no one would dare harm them (Up until the Trial, it was theorized that a Vortian had caused Miyuki’s death so there’s some real bad blood there) Going on another theory I have that Irkens were originally/still are prey animals, Red also has a desire to be strong and feared. Not that it’s the right thing to do at all, in fact, it’s awful, but this is what he wants his legacy to be and it ain’t looking good.

Now this one is a huge theory, IF THE MASSIVE SURVIVED THE FLORPUS HOLE, I think Red would have a complete breakdown regarding his actions. In the Florpus, he adopted a lot of Purple’s habits due to not seeing Zim in years. He stopped taking things seriously, he didn’t take responsibility and it’s his lack of guidance that condemned him, the Massive, and all of Operation Impending Doom II. Just as Zim’s earth mission is his doing, entering the florpus is also blood on his hands. Irkens aren’t known to reflect...But if his direct actions are the reason why the IZ series and the end of the ETF movie happened, he’d have to actually face the fact that he allowed all of this, intentional or not. He would have to decide to either take a new course of action or attempt to conduct an Operation Impending Doom III in an effort to save his legacy...And knowing Irkens and how messed up they are without any mental health care options available, I think Red may make another bad decision.

#Invader Zim #Tallest Red #IZ meta #this was really fun to type out thank you for asking!!!

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emilyblame · 3 years

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so i was thinking: album openers. what a great thing. every album has one. some of them go unnoticed. but some of them are like a bucket of cold water to your face (in a good way). so here’s my 10 favorite album openers in no particular order (i mean, i think technically they’re in alphabetical order by band because i need things to be somewhat orginized but--)

CAPRICORN (A BRAND NEW NAME) - 30 SECONDS TO MARS / 30 SECONDS TO MARS

omg the y o u t h ! but also why does Jared look exactly the same? this song is honestly one of my favorite things in the whole world because of the way it makes me feel when i listen to it. and i’m not sure i can quite put it into words but-- i guess it makes me feel... powerful? idk if that’s it. but it’s like, the anthem of reinventing yourself. also, this whole album feels like a sci-fi movie and i fucking love it.

BRIANSTORM - ARCTIC MONKEYS / FAVORITE WORST NIGHTMARE

bitch, the drums. b i i i i i i i i t c h. so, maybe Matt Helders III is one of my favorite drummers of all time. and i may also perhaps have a weakness for young Alex Turner because he didn’t give two fucks about being a little shit. ugh. i love Arctic Monkeys.

THE PHOENIX - FALL OUT BOY / SAVE ROCK AND ROLL

this song just sounds epic as fuck. which is the perfect start to an epic as fuck album. also, this being their comback album and this song’s first line being ‘you are brick tied to me that’s dragging me down’ is just one giant middle finger up in the air, fuck you haters and all. i know the first like is technically ‘put on your war paint’ but bear with me here.

PAPERCUT - LINKIN PARK / HYBRID THEORY

i already talked extensively about what this song means to me. it’s just perfect. it’s the perfect album opener. and i miss Chester :(

NEW BORN - MUSE / ORIGIN OF SYMMETRY

i mean... do i even have to explain myself here?

CAREFUL - PARAMORE / BRAND NEW EYES

talk about starting off with a bang. this is actually not only an amazing album opener in my opinion, but it’s also my favorite song from Brand New Eyes. it’s so strong and angry. like-- same.

THE HAUNTING - SET IT OFF / DUALITY

aaaaand speaking of songs being epic as fuck. the theatricality of this band. please. go listen to Set It Off. you won’t regret it. i promise.

SHUT UP - SIMPLE PLAN / STILL NOT GETTING ANY...

what i love about this song as an opener is that it sets the mood for the whole album. it’s loud and angry and doesn’t give a fuck. if you’re not singing and dancing by the end of this song, are you even listening to Simple Plan?

REVOLUTION - THE USED / IMAGINARY ENEMY

if i’m being really honest with you, i think all of The Used’s opening songs to all their albums are fucking brilliant, but this one is my favorite. mostly because of Jepha BEST BASSIST EVER Howard. that little riff at the end of every chorus... *chef kiss*. yas boi.

CHERRY RED - WATERPARKS / FANDOM (i still hate this album title)

last but not least. listen. i’m not a huge fan of either “Hawaii” or “11:11” (actually, i usually skip “11:11”), but “Cherry Red” is one of the best album openers out there. it feels like the very beginning of a movie. it hypes you up right off bat. it is so fucking good. it has every emotion this album has throughout collapsed into 1:25 minutes. it is... ~perfection~.

HONORABLE MENTIONS!

since Conventional Weapons is not really an album i couldn’t include “Boy Division” by My Chemical Romance. but if it were... uuuhhh boi. best album opener ever.

“Jumpsuit” by twenty øne piløts from their album Trench. what i like about this song is that it’s the heaviest on the album. it’s a scream to your face only to get your attention. then the rest of the album gently guides you through Tyler’s mind.

“Arms Unfolding”, dodie. now, listen here, i know Human is technically an EP, but we can look past that for a minute. this song barely has any instruments. it’s mostly vocalizations and i just think it’s fucking brilliant god i love dodie so fucking much what a taleeent! please stop sleeping on dodie (if you are-- if you’re not, here’s a star for you: 🌟).

now, let’s pretend for a second that “!!!!” + “Bad Guy” are one song. goddamnit Billie and Phineas are ridiculously good songwriters. i used to be one of those “wHaT’S tHe HyPE arOUnD BilLiE EiLisH?!” people, but then i listened to when we all fall asleep where do we go? and realized i was just clowning my way through life. the use of sounds that one wouldn’t normally put in a song-- now, i’m not saying they invented it, i’m just saying they do a really good job at it.

and, finally, since we’re pretending that intros and first songs are one thing, let’s not forget about “Thoughts That Breathe” + “Nightmare”. an absolute epic beginning to the most epic Set It Off album: Cinematics. psst! kids, go listen to Set It Off!

#30 seconds to mars #arctic monkeys #fall out boy #linkin park #muse #paramore #set it off #simple plan #the used #waterparks #idk what to tag this it's a me thing?

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jackoshadows · 3 years

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Do you think that Daenerys will burn kings landing in the books? She did it on the show and she has to show the strength of her dragons in Westeros like in Essos.

For the answer to this question, I would direct you to Dany blogs that dissect her story arc using the books. You could read their theories and speculations based on the books and come to your own conclusion on this.

As for my speculations on this,

1. Dany has done nothing so far in the last 5 books that leads towards her going on a random rampage in KL. She has shown a lot of concern and care towards the civilians and common folk of Essos. More than the likes of Robb Stark for example.

2. Dany burning down KL would turn her into her father. This goes against what I think is GRRM’s message in the series - that the younger generation can rise above their birth and the societal biases against them.

3. That said, I do think that the author means for us to question and speculate, along with Daenerys, if she would turn into her father. This is an internal conflict that the character is struggling with and a part of her story. More on this below the cut.*

4. I think there will be a second dance of dragons between Young Griff/Aegon and Daenerys in KL. Going back to the original outline, the second book of the original trilogy - titled the Dance of Dragons - was supposed to be about Dany’s conquest of Westeros. There will be casualties in this war. GRRM has been explicit about the consequences of war on the small folk due to the WOT5K. Robb Stark may have had a just cause but innocent people suffered and died due to his war for independence. Even with Stannis’ march to Winterfell, we see a 14 year old soldier being burned to death as punishment for cannibalizing a corpse because he was so hungry and there’s no food. War is brutal.

5. Dany can win KL without massacring thousands. The Lannisters did it in the books when they sacked KL and no one - not even the honorable Ned Stark - complained about it. She could have done it on the show and won - except, suddenly pacifist Tyrion kept advising against it. In fact if the dragons act as a nuclear deterrent, there will be less casualties. Aegon the conqueror won the North without a single casualty.

5. Westeros is already in a bad way and winter has come to KL by the end of the fifth book. Dany will end up in charge of a war torn Westeros down south. By which time, the North is overrun, Winterfell is lost and the survivors head south. IMO, the Others will not be defeated at Winterfell in 30 minutes like on the show. They are the central antagonists and the last book will mostly be about the rest of Westeros uniting against them. Dany will acknowledge the central premise of the series - ‘ When dead men come hunting in the night, do you think it matters who sits the Iron Throne?’ and joins Jon, Bran, Arya and others to defeat the army of the dead.

6. I have no idea how her story will end in the books. Considering she dies on the show and if it’s the same in the books, I would think that if she goes out she will go out a hero and not a villain. There’s a lot of prophecies associated with her and I would speculate that her character is instrumental in defeating the Others. Fire and Ice and all that.

7. And speculate is all we can do, considering we will never get the last book and a conclusion to GRRM’s version of the story.

* Now to expand a little bit on the point number 3 above.

I would like to comment on a line of thought/discourse regarding Daenerys Targaryen, Jon Snow and Targaryen madness.

I have seen a few posts from time to time making the assertion that if one speculates on mad queen Dany, but does not do the same for Jon Snow, then this is sexism. I disagree.

Now, if one is making that argument that by genetics, Daenerys Targaryen is designed to go mad and she will go mad, burn down KL and die while Jon goes on to be King or goes into exile etc. then yes, this argument would indeed be sexist, IMO. If we are going to speculate based on Targaryen genetics, then, not much is different between Jon and Dany. They are both Targaryens. Dany is not fire proof and neither is Jon. While Dany has some strongly prophetic dragon dreams, there are indications that Jon’s dreams are prophetic as well.

“Sleep came at last, and with it nightmares. He dreamed of burning castles and dead men rising unquiet from their graves”

He has dreamed of Winterfell burning, of Ned being executed, of being told that he is not a Stark by the old kings of winter in the crypts where his mother is buried and of Bran as a weirwood.

Jon’s dream here is very similar to what Dany dreams of:

“Snow,” an eagle cried, as foemen scuttled up the ice like spiders. Jon was armored in black ice, but his blade burned red in his fist. As the dead men reached the top of the Wall he sent them down to die again. - Jon Snow

That night she dreamt that she was Rhaegar, riding to the Trident. But she was mounted on a dragon, not a horse. When she saw the Usurper’s rebel host across the river they were armored all in ice, but she bathed them in dragonfire and they melted away like dew and turned the Trident into a torrent.- Daenerys Targaryen

We know zombie ice spiders are going to be a thing. And the armor of black ice that Jon references here could be Euron Greyjoy’s black valyrian steel armor.

So if Dany is going to go mad because of genetics, then there is every chance that Jon will as well.

But from a narrative point of view, the author wants us to question if Dany will go the same way as her father. The mad king Aerys III is a part of Dany’s story. She questions if she is going to become her father. Other characters – allies and enemies – do the same. It’s a conflict that Dany wrestles with as she comes to terms with her Targaryen identity. It’s an obstacle she faces as she takes on both enemies and friends.

"Freedom to starve?" asked Dany sharply. "Freedom to die? Am I a dragon, or a harpy?" Am I mad? Do I have the taint? (ASOS, Daenerys VI)

A shadow. A memory. No one. She was the blood of the dragon, but Ser Barristan had warned her that in that blood there was a taint. Could I be going mad? They had called her father mad, once. (ADWD, Daenerys II)

The old knight did not blink. "Your father is called 'the Mad King' in Westeros. Has no one ever told you?"

"Viserys did." The Mad King. "The Usurper called him that, the Usurper and his dogs." The Mad King. "It was a lie."

"Why ask for truth," Ser Barristan said softly, "if you close your ears to it?" He hesitated, then continued. "I told you before that I used a false name so the Lannisters would not know that I'd joined you. That was less than half of it, Your Grace. The truth is, I wanted to watch you for a time before pledging you my sword. To make certain that you were not . . ."

". . . my father's daughter?" If she was not her father's daughter, who was she?

". . . mad," he finished. "But I see no taint in you."

And then there is the discourse that her enemies start about her being mad. The propaganda that she is just like her father. Propaganda that will no doubt be also used in Westeros.

The clever Volantene swordsman who always seemed to have his nose poked in some crumbly scroll, thought the dragon queen both murderous and mad. "Her khal killed her brother to make her queen. Then she killed her khal to make herself khaleesi. She practices blood sacrifice, lies as easily as she breathes, turns against her own on a whim. She's broken truces, tortured envoys … her father was mad too. It runs in the blood." (ADWD, The Windblown)

Madness and the mad king is nowhere in Jon’s story arcs or narrative themes. GRRM still thinks that R+L=J is some big secret and was so impressed that Benioff and Weiss figured it out he gave them the show. The author does not question whether Jon is going to become a mad Targaryen with a fascination for burning people to death.

Jon’s internal conflicts and the problems he has to surmount are different in nature. He is a bastard born of ‘lust and deceit’. If we want a connection here to the Targaryens that explores Jon’s narrative arc, then there is the Blackfyre rebellion. Daemon Blackfyre’s attempt to usurp the throne is used as an example in Westeros to be wary of all bastards, noble or base born.

So if the speculation is that Dany is going to turn into her father and become the mad queen, then the narrative equivalent for Jon would be that he would be a deceitful usurper who takes Winterfell from his trueborn siblings.

And this is something that is explored in Jon’s story.

When Stannis offers Winterfell to Jon, the only reason he does not accept is because of his oaths as a NW brother and his reluctance to burn down the heart trees in Winterfell. But in his heart, he wants it.

He wanted it, Jon knew then. He wanted it as much as he had ever wanted anything. I have always wanted it, he thought, guiltily. May the gods forgive me. It was a hunger inside him, sharp as a dragonglass blade. A hunger … he could feel it. — Jon Snow, ASOS

Just as Dany wrestles with whether she will turn into her father, Jon wrestles with his feelings of wanting Winterfell and feeling ashamed of those feelings.

His dreams in regards to this are interesting:

The world dissolved into a red mist. Jon stabbed and slashed and cut. He hacked down Donal Noye and gutted Deaf Dick Follard. Qhorin Halfhand stumbled to his knees, trying in vain to staunch the flow of blood from his neck. "I am the Lord of Winterfell," Jon screamed. It was Robb before him now, his hair wet with melting snow. Longclaw took his head off. Then a gnarled hand seized Jon roughly by the shoulder. He whirled …- Jon XII, ADWD

Jon literally beheads Robb in his dreams.

There is a lot of speculation here that after he comes back from the dead, we are going to get a darker Jon Snow who is going to go after Winterfell and not care much about the trueborn siblings ahead of him in the queue. We could see conflict between Jon and Rickon or Jon and Sansa. The original outline hinted that Jon and Bran would not get along.

And just like Dany faces the ‘Mad Queen’ propaganda because of Aerys III, Jon too faces the biased prejudice against bastards because of the actions of Daemon Blackfyre. While prejudice against bastards existed before then, the Blackfyres are often used as an example to caution against them.

Catelyn’s hatred for Jon Snow is based on the fear that someday he would usurp and take away Winterfell from her children.

“Not unless he’s legitimized by a royal decree,” said Robb. “There is more precedent for that than for releasing a Sworn Brother from his oath.”

“Precedent,” she said bitterly. “Yes, Aegon the Fourth legitimized all his bastards on his deathbed. And how much pain, grief, war, and murder grew from that? I know you trust Jon. But can you trust his sons? Or their sons? The Blackfyre pretenders troubled the Targaryens for five generations, until Barristan the Bold slew the last of them on the Stepstones. If you make Jon legitimate, there is no way to turn him bastard again. Should he wed and breed, any sons you may have by Jeyne will never be safe.” - Catelyn, ASoS

Similarly the Blackfish – having not even met Jon Snow – distrusts him.

"I will permit you to take the black. Ned Stark's bastard is the Lord Commander on the Wall."

The Blackfish narrowed his eyes. "Did your father arrange for that as well? Catelyn never trusted the boy, as I recall, no more than she ever trusted Theon Greyjoy. It would seem she was right about them both..." - Jaime Lannister, AFfC

The existing prejudices against bastards in Westeros is strong.

"Trueborn children are made in a marriage bed and blessed by the Father and Mother, but bastards are born of lust and weakness." - Jon Snow

Orys Baratheon was a baseborn half brother to Lord Aegon, it was whispered, and the Storm King would not dishonor his daughter by giving her hand to a bastard. The very suggestion enraged him.

Go away, I wanted only Freys up here, the King in the North has no interest in base stock.— Walder Frey to little Walda Rivers

Bastard children were born from lust and lies, men said; their nature was wanton and treacherous. Once Jon had meant to prove them wrong, to show his lord father he could as good a true son as Robb Stark - Jon Snow

So both Jon and Dany face internal conflicts and the author wishes to interrogate if Dany can overcome her own self doubts with respect to her father and society’s opinions of her and if Jon can overcome his desires and personal ambition for Winterfell and society’s opinions of bastards as untrustworthy and deceitful.

If a reader is therefore making the argument that Dany will become the mad queen like her father and burn down everyone – they should also rightfully be arguing for Jon turning against his family for a selfish power grab and essentially turning into Daemon Blackfyre.

Remember how Daemon took the Targaryen sigil with colors reversed – a black dragon on red giving him the nickname ‘The Black Dragon’

Jon was referred to as the ‘White Wolf’ on the show and as per the books, two bastards have reversed the sigils. Jon’s direwolf Ghost is white and he would therefore have a white wolf on a grey background as opposed to the Stark grey direwolf on a white background.

The sexism arises when Dany is singled out for turning into exactly what her enemies expect her to be, while the Starks overcome societal prejudices and expectations and end up the heroes. That, while Dany turns into her father, Jon Snow continues to love his Stark family (i.e Sansa Stark) so much and would sacrifice everything for them.

The show’s thesis and final message for these Targaryens is that they cannot rise above their birth and are exactly what society makes of them. That their final destiny is decided from birth and that they cannot change it no matter how much they tried. Daenerys turned into her father, randomly burned down KL for no reason and massacred thousands. Jon Snow pretends to support her, gets close to her, deceives her and kills her. He becomes a kinslayer, a queenslayer, a traitor – deceitful and untrustworthy and is exiled. It was an utterly nihilistic ending for house Targaryen.

I strongly believe that GRRM is not heading in this direction for these characters. It would be very disappointing if this is what he intends for them. It would indeed be sexist if GRRM wrote Dany as turning into her father, while Jon remains good and faithful to his family. From my reading and interpretation of these books, the story is about these underdogs triumphing over their internal conflicts. The conclusion of this tale would be Dany not turning into the mad queen, Jon not turning into a deceitful traitor, Arya not fleeing Westeros because she does not belong, Bran becoming king despite being a cripple.

But that is the final answer. In the meantime, GRRM means to explore these characters and their narrative themes and conflicts. In that context, it’s valid to question and theorize whether a possible direction for Dany’s story is her becoming her father. Five books in there is nothing to support this theory, but it is a theme that GRRM is interested in examining for the character of Daenerys Targaryen.

#Daenerys Targaryen #Jon Snow #asoiaf #anti GOT #asks

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