#bonefall reads dotc

[bonefall]

Here it is, lads.

I'm at the Bumble part.

My stomach dropped as soon as I realized this was the moment it was happening. I think we as a fandom know what's coming up next, but I do wanna make sure to ring it up again.

Bumble is violently assaulted by the father of Turtle Tail's kittens, Tom. She is a canonical... "survivor" of domestic violence. "Survivor" because she does not survive.

She is constantly called fat and clumsy through the text on these pages. It is up there with Spottedleaf's Heart as a shockingly insensitive portrayal of a serious, dark issue.

I will be tagging #tw abuse and #tw fatphobia, if you need those things filtered.

Be warned and be safe.

#Bonefall reads DOTC #I will probably use this post for RB so I can delete the older versions and keep this section in one place

[bonebabbles]

Tom's Redemption

There's a special kind of brain rot out here, folks. Yes, Tom gets redeemed by the narrative.

In Blazing Star, the story has decided that Gray Wing is not the real father of the children he raised. Ever since Tom literally kidnapped them and got their mom killed, they've seen him as their dad.

Clear Sky brings Tom into the group despite knowing that he kidnapped the children a few weeks ago.

Sparrow Fur (child) runs away from the Moorland Group to go find out the truth about her Real Dad. Eventually One Eye attacks her and tries to kill her.

Tom jumps in to save her,

This is Death Equals Redemption. Denying that this is a redemption is a complete and total failure of literature analysis.

This is one of the oldest types of redemption in literature. This is fucking biblical. This is Gospel of Luke, penitent thief dying on a cross type shit. The term "redemption" was created to describe this sort of situation.

Just because this trope is (rightfully imo) unpopular does not mean it is not categorically a type of redemption.

Tom gets to die a heroic death saving his child as both of the women he battered are dead and cold in their graves, because of him. One of them couldn't even be buried.

And, no, the narrative doesn't just gloss over it. This is a major motivating force for Sparrow Fur later in the book, when she explicitly avenges "her father".

Tom is a character that the narrative redeems. The story that they are telling is that because Tom was her biodad, that does mean he truly did love her and was willing to give up his life to save hers. The kittens' immediate love for a man they 1. Never met before the kidnapping and 2. Beat the shit out of their mom and got her killed is a GOOD and JUSTIFIED thing in this narrative.

That's what is literally on the page. Read the book before you lace up your clown shoes.

#DOTC #warrior cats analysis #bonefall reads dotc #Tom

[frostfour]

Fighting demons every minute of every day. (<- Debating reading DOTC)

#Firestar's Quest my comrade my personal chew toy my sworn enemy is on the mind with worldbuilding again. #And it got me thinking about how the clans were formed in the books. Mr Frostfour did not read DOTC. #Something to do with the Tribe? I know very little about the arc. But the formation of the clans could be a nice read. #Knowing how Firestar's Quest handled building a clan my trust is low however that Super Edition snared me. Would it be worth the time? #Is it worth the 200 fridged wives (according to user Bonefall)? #(All I know of DOTC is from Bonefall and 90% of what I can remember is Bumble deserves a weighted blanket).

[skyscratch-wc]

The Skyfall AU Masterpost

This post will be an archive of sorts for the information posts for the Skyfall AU.

The goal of this AU is to hammer out a solid timeline for warrior cats, emphasize the downfall of Skyclan and the aftermath as key drivers in the plot, and better flesh out the characters and clan culture(s)! Additionally, I hope to address some of the more problematic elements of the canon text to make a narrative that is more satisfying and lives up to the potential the warriors world has. I also want to pin down a setting (at the moment I am leaning towards SW Scotland) for the books in order to make the names and environment consistent and accurate.

This AU will focus primarily on the the time frame from the fall of Skyclan to the end of OotS, since those are the books I read as a kid/teenager and are the books I have the best grasp of. I stopped reading the series consistently several years ago, but have re-read TPB recently. As such, I probably won't do much work on anything post-The Last Hope. Perhaps later, but certainly not anytime soon.

I hope to tackle DotC at some point, since I got about halfway through that arc before stopping reading the books.

This project is roughly broken into a few categories that are subject to change:

History of the Clans and Timeline Work:

Timeline from The Skyfall to Modern Day [DRAFT]

Clan Culture:

Skyclan's Cultural Evolution

Cats of the Gorge: A Full Summary

Clan Ranks and Structure

Ceremonies and Rituals

Shadowclan After Brokenstar

Naming Conventions in the Clans

Crafting

Collecting and Trade

Plot:

Skyclan's Downfall

Thunderclan Civil War (aka The Skyblood Conflict)

Disbanding of Skyclan

Characterization:

Goldenheart (SF Tigerheart)

Brokenstar

Tallstar

Peatstar (Onestar)

Geography and Ecosystems:

Flora and Fauna of SW Scotland

Allegiances:

Into the Wild: Thunderclan

This AU is inspired not only by the canonical warriors books that I read as a kid/teen but also by the work of @bonefall and @cryptidclaw, both blogs I absolutely love reading through because the ideas in their respective AUs/rewrites are superb and get the creative juices flowing. In particular, I plan on using the clanmew language system developed by bonefall and @troutfur and drawing from the clan culture bonefall has numerous posts about.

#warrior cats #wc skyfall au #masterpost

[wc-confessions]

i don’t cry when i read books. i’m not a super expressive person. i recently saw bonefalls post on Bumble and…man. i kinda broke down. how could they do her like that? i’ve tried to read dotc but didn’t find it interesting. it was just…wow.

/ᐠ｡ꞈ｡ᐟ\

#anonymous #confession #warrior cats

[blimbo-buddy]

Absolutely sobbing over your praise. I am but a mere and chaotic writer of kitty angst. I'm so glad you're loving it because it's just- man, I like writing it. I honestly was just taking from the prompts and bonefall's snippets. It's been like - gosh, about 9ish years or so? - since I read DotC.

I am 20% sorry for putting you through this, 50% thankful, and 30% ready to do it part 3.

The part about Turtle Tail not saying sorry was something I subconsciously hammered in my brain. I didn't want her to apologize because that wasn't the goal. Turtle Tail's self-loathing of herself blinded her. She hated what she did, so she beat herself down and tried to fix this situation with more hate at first. Then, she threw all of her insecurities out there in hopes of explaining herself.

In my mind, her fatal flaw is that she thinks too self-centeredly. Notice how Turtle Tail, while she admits her flaws, thinks that's her apology. She thinks that pointing out how much Bumble means to her is apologizing.

Not once did she say, "I'm sorry for everything I said to you."

But several times she did say what she thinks and how she feels.

There's no empathizing with how horribly wounded Bumble is.

There's no apologizing for breaking her promises.

It's just hatred for herself and the world.

It was something I knew subconsciously, but it hit me when I checked for myself that she didn't. I was shocked despite my brain knowing before writing what the last sentence of the Bumble part would be.

Turtle Tail told herself she changed, but did she? Was this truly change?

Stay tuned for more of me as, once it is not 2AM and I am not running on questionably made tea, I will return for your ankles.

You've done this to me anon. YOU DID THIS TO ME

But in all seriousness I am ready for part 3. I really like the fact that, yeah, TurtleTail only spewed out self-loathing comments about herself, unknowingly making the situation revolve around her and not her… you know… dying friend. I feel extra bad for both of them in the situation (seeing as they are dotc women and get the short end of the stick), but extra EXTRA bad for Bumble. And this story exemplifies it, imagine Bumble just waiting for TurtleTail to actually say "Sorry", hoping that she does, silently begging that she does. TurtleTail acknowledge the horrible thing that led to this and says that she had been thinking back on it, but, she missed the most important part of an apology, the apologizing itself.

TurtleTail had lost the opportunity to change in Bumble's eyes. Bumble pitied TurtleTail's self loathing, she knew that TurtleTail's "apology" was unknowingly focusing all of the attention back onto TurtleTail without that bullshit "I wish you could have been happy with us but you could never have been a wild cat" canon line we get, like, damn TurtleTail what a fucking line to tell your dying friend. But in this story, TurtleTail is truly hurting, so badly. She genuinely feels bad for what she had done (or lack thereof) and she wants to atone for it, but her apology doesn't stick, it's not really an apology without the sorry. So it gives you a mixed perspective of TurtleTail, not so much morally grey though, I'm sure there's a word for it.

I love the open-endedness of the two stories (especially the Bumble pov one), does Bumble truly forgive TurtleTail? Will TurtleTail give a proper sorry? Will they reunite when they die and that's when TurtleTail apologizes? Will they try again? GAGH, it's all so great! I'm really excited for part 3, don't stress yourself writing it anon I'd gladly wait weeks and months for it

#blimbo rambles #ask

[yuridovewing]

If I had the strength, I would reread dotc and make a video about that arc because I don't think enough people talk about BAD it gets. Even as a teen, I knew it was worlds worse than anything that came before because it turned me off of the series for years. Still haven't finished the arc, I think I stopped when Starflower and clear sky were getting together because it grossed me out! It made me angry to read

I would love a video on dotc like that but of course that would take a lot of time and energy and. Driving yourself insane probably (I'm having a crappy time with AVoS overall despite liking Shattered Sky and Tigerheart's Shadow I can't imagine the slogfest it'd be like revisiting DotC. Especially since I did read it when it came out)

It does help to make posts pointing out it's many flaws. Like @/bonefall's posts on Bumble was the first time I actually saw someone point out and dissect all the nasty shit involved with her storyline

#anonymous #mail

[sidglorious]

Yeah, in English versions Bumble is called Fat and lazy. Look up Bonefall, I think they're doing a read through of DOTCs right now but you may have to ask they what their read through blogs name is. They post certain paragraphs and their thoughts.

I will take a look to make my opinion !

Because if fat is used as a descriptive word I don't have issues with it.

[bonebabbles]

Clear Sky: "My kingdom, your REAL dictator is back! I laid my life on the line to free you from the guy I let into the Clan against all warnings. It was the 2nd or 3rd worst mistake I've made in the past year and I vow I will spend the rest of the afternoon atoning. Yes, all of you are permanently scarred with the tyrant's tattoo and one of you died horribly of illness, but I've learned a valuable lesson and Petal was a woman anyway, so are you ready to accept my unquestionable authority again :3 ?"

Snake:

#dotc hate #bonefall reads dotc #Snake DOTC #Clear Sky #The Blazing Star #gif

[bonebabbles]

The Infected Wound

"Yeah Clear Sky isn't perfect and he made some mistakes but--" Shut your mouth. Read this first;

Thunder is about 6-ish months old, the WC equivalent of a 13-year-old. He has the 'audacity' to confront his dad about all the murder he's been doing to pointlessly expand his borders, and in response, Clear Sky summons Frost, whose wound hasn't healed from a forest fire.

He publicly humiliates him, ordering him to flash his weeping wound to all the cats in the clearing, announcing that he is a danger to everyone now because he is weak and must be exiled.

And he finishes with,

Because, this is a test.

This is a mind game that Clear Sky is playing with Thunder for standing up to him. Once again, he's creating a situation that will HURT Thunder, to watch him follow his orders, to prove Thunder's loyalty and his own power over him, because he's mad. This is retaliation.

This is not a mistake.

This is abuse. Intentional, malicious, controlling behavior, involving Frost's life in the game he's playing for his own ego. This has NOTHING to do with the "wellbeing" of SkyClan. He did this in response to Thunder pointing out that the forest is healing and there is no need to murder more innocent people.

And if that wasn't enough, he even took his teenage's son's face and shoved it in the festering, reeking wound, telling him to lick it.

Was that an accident? Did he slip and a billion monkeys on a typewriter came up with "lick his wound clean"? Did Clear Sky effectively utilize girl power for the good of the Clan when he shoved a child's face in infected pus?

Next there's a fox quicktime event where a random fox is in the camp, because the writers have never heard of pacing, and Clear Sky blames Thunder for attracting the fox (somehow), shoving him off the rock to fight it.

Then Thunder leaves to bring Frost to a doctor.

What all of this says about Clear Sky, what we can observe all the way back to Sun Trail, is that we know what he wants to do with power. Even as early as the Sun Trail recruitment, he is trying to pressure Bright Stream into coming. Later, he's already getting in public fights with Storm and his controlling behavior is a reason why she leaves him. He does nothing as Fox mauls Gray Wing on his orders, squealing when Fox is killed in accidental self-defense.

Now he uses his power to neglect and harass people who are disabled and infirm, saying that the presence of "weakness" is a threat to his Clan, using Frost as a pawn in an controlling display over his child.

Power reveals. This is who he is. This is who he has always been.

#bonefall reads dotc #tw gore #tw infection #tw infected wounds #gore #infection #infected wounds #tw child abuse #child abuse #abuse #tw abuse #tw medical gore #medical gore #I am no longer playing around actually #Fuck you if you ever try to say to me that he Made Some Mistakes #Being pro-eugenics isn't a fucking accident

[bonefall]

Clear Sky: *invents borders and gathers violent rogues to defend them*

Clear Sky: *acts controlling over his pregnant wife, giving her orders in public*

Clear Sky: *isolates his younger brother from the rest of his family, commanding he go hunt immediately instead of catch up with Gray Wing*

Narrative: "He's just protective guys!! He just cares a lot!!!! Everything he does is for his Clan be nice to him :(((((("

#Dawn of the clans #Warrior cats analysis #Bonefall reads DOTC #Die by my hand clear sky you do not belong in this world

[bonebabbles]

Wind Runner gives birth a month early and loses a kitten to a seizure, indicated by the child having 'spittle' frothed at the corners of its mouth.

Gray Wing shuffles up with his Characteristic Wisdom,

"Maybe it's for the best that your weakest child died"

"Also maybe it would make your loss easier if you started believing in our religion just like we pressured you into taking a name like ours"

Harsh? Yes.

Deserved? Also yes.

Maybe next time he'll think twice about proselytizing to a mother of a different faith who just horrifically lost a child, still cradling its corpse, after going off about how "maybe only the strongest should survive"

At least Bumblestripe waited for the funeral! The dead baby is NOT EVEN COLD, GRAY WING!!!

#tw child death #child death #bonefall reads dotc #He never does lose a child btw #He dies before every single one of his children including the adopted ones #which the narrative has already decided don't count because it hates adoption #btw the narrative is actually building up to gray wing being right #because he always is #Wisdom is just writer clairvoyance and not any kind of emotional intelligence

[bonebabbles]

Tom kidnaps the children, Turtle Tail dies, etc etc, Thunder and Lightning Tail finally catch up to Tom where he has to keep the children hidden so the human doesn't find them. Once the twoleg goes away, they jump out.

?????????????????? what? "Now that they know he's their Real Dad™ we can't snatch them back"

Like it's a spell??? I actually don't understand what this is supposed to mean, will the children explode of confusion if you don't leave them with the domestic abuser somehow?!?!

"we have to leave them with the man who kidnapped them and beat two women bloody because Tom told them he's their dad"

#bonefall reads dotc #dotc #wc tom #this arc is endless suffering and pain #just say he's lying?!?! #'Gray Wing is your father!' END OF STORY #DOTC HATES ADOPTION

[bonebabbles]

Reunion scene analysis

This scene in DOTC is fucking fascinating and such an interesting example of how the writer ableism gets in the way of their storytelling.

So this is right after the forest fire in Thunder Rising, when Proto-SkyClan is taking refuge in Proto-WindClan after they saved the aggressive forest group's lives. Bumble has already been exiled and Jagged Peak's only action during the entire ordeal was to agree that she was fat and useless.

Now, Clear Sky is buttering up to Thunder, seeing that he can hunt and has value as an able-bodied person and possible recruit. It's causing tension between Gray Wing and Thunder, though it's worth noting that the narration only uses "father" to refer to Clear Sky.

They have a tense meal where Proto-SkyClan sits at their little separate lunch tables and glares at their hosts. There's a Quiet Rainkin family reunion here-- Jagged Peak is hovering on the side working up the strength to talk to the brother that exiled him, Clear Sky compliments Thunder and then,

Clear Sky spotted his younger brother, too, and whipped around to face him. Jagged Peak jumped, startled. “And you? What have you done to prove yourself?” Clear Sky demanded, scorn in his voice and eyes. “Well,” he added sneeringly, “you survived. That’s as much as you can do, now.” Jagged Peak’s shoulder fur bristled. “Actually,” he began, “I was responsible for looking after the camp and the cats who—” “So you stayed behind, where it was safe,” Clear Sky interrupted. Gray Wing couldn’t ignore that. He sprang to his paws and padded up to the group. “Jagged Peak is being really useful,” he mewed sharply. “Injured leg or no injured leg. He protected the cats who stayed in the hollow, and in case you didn’t notice, he did an excellent job of welcoming your cats into our camp. We need him, Clear Sky.”

...he's not. DOTC can never refute this point, because it's constantly defining cats based on their ability to contribute, up until its very last book. Bumble was exiled for exactly this, sent back to an abuser, for the idea that she wouldn't be able to hunt and would be 'another hungry mouth.'

Jagged Peak can't do what he used to. He can't heroically lunge into a forest fire like his nephew Thunder. He is disabled. But the writer here DOES believe that everyone must do work for the Clan at large

And they express that by putting it into Gray Wing's mouth. "No no no! He IS helpful we swear! He... protected the cats who weren't in danger! He welcomed you into camp! We need him, really, promise"

It's hollow, and that makes this whole scene uncomfortable. Gray Wing does not actually refute Clear Sky's philosophy. He does fundamentally agree with it, he's only correcting Clear Sky on technicalities.

"It IS bad to not contribute, but actually, Jagged Peak does justify his existence."

So... what if he couldn't?

Turning toward Jagged Peak, Clear Sky gave him a long look from intense blue eyes. “I’m sorry,” he told the young cat. “I take back what I said.” But Jagged Peak’s gaze was still full of pain and anger. “It’s too late!” he spat, “You clearly think I’m a waste of space. Why else would you have thrown me out of the forest? And now that I’m beginning to prove myself, you need Gray Wing to tell you what I’ve done.” He shook his head. “Will I ever be good enough?”

What the scene is trying to get at is that Jagged Peak feels disrespected, and that his recovery isn't being acknowledged. That his self-esteem was destroyed by being exiled. But, instead, it reads like to me like Clear Sky very callously popped a comfortable bubble that Jagged Peak was living in

Jagged Peak ISN'T contributing like his Clanmates and THAT SHOULD BE OKAY. He is LOVED, He HAS innate worth, and that's the POINT of having a society in the first place.

Instead of challenging the notion of value being tied to contribution, this is about Clear Sky accepting Gray Wing's flimsy argument that Jagged Peak has 'proven' himself, and that he isn't acknowledging that 'progress.'

But why are we here? Why does Jagged Peak need to "prove" his life is worth living? Take note of this framing, and what sorts of values are treated as a given.

“I told you I’m sorry . . . ,” Clear Sky began. But Jagged Peak wasn’t listening. Turning his back on Clear Sky, he limped away to join Rainswept Flower. Clear Sky let out a sigh as he watched him, then turned to meet Gray Wing’s gaze. “I didn’t mean . . .” His voice trailed off. Gray Wing twitched his whiskers in exasperation. “You never do mean anything, do you, Clear Sky?” “I’m just trying to do my best for every cat!” Clear Sky protested, instantly defensive. “By humiliating your brother?” Thunder was watching the two of them, drinking in every word. Gray Wing couldn’t help feeling glad that the young cat was seeing firsthand that Clear Sky wasn’t perfect. But even thinking that made Gray Wing squirm with discomfort. Why do I care so much? Why shouldn’t Thunder be happily reunited with his father? “Well, I can’t help it!” Clear Sky snapped, his neck fur beginning to rise. “It’s not my fault Jagged Peak fell out of that tree. Every cat has to contribute, and weak cats just don’t count.” He gave a single lash of his tail. “It’s about survival!"

I drop the phrase, "Clear Sky's redemption arc was a mistake" a lot. What I mean by that is, the entire arc is built around the struggle for Clear Sky's family to help him become a better person. Instead of refuting what Clear Sky represents as a character, DOTC is stuck in a tar pit that can only focus on him as a person.

He doesn't mean to hurt anyone. He doesn't have any malice. Noo, he was a fundamentally good person the whole time, and Gray Wing is right to always always see The Good in him and fight against any nasty instincts to keep his family away from the eugenicist ghoul

But fuck, this arc could have been FANTASTIC if it didn't bother with trying to keep this character redeemable. If it was about toxic family, cutting off people that hurt you and continue to hurt you, recognizing and challenging the deep assumptions that you end up believing as a result of loving someone like this, breaking cycles of abuse and accepting that some people don't change no matter how hard you try...

But YOU can.

But instead, it's just the same trend we see every time that a male character hurts someone for a self-absorbed reason.

Sandgorse was a hero, actually, and that's why you should remember him uncritically Talltail.

Stormtail just wasn't present, Bluefur, but that's no big deal since he's here for you now.

Ashfur just loved your mom too much, Jayfeather, so him trying to murder you wasn't Hell-worthy

Bramblestar was just worried about ThunderClan, Squirrelflight, and you shouldn't have spoken over him at that meeting

Clear Sky actually loved his Clan all along and everything was hard choices, for survival and because he was so afraid, so you have to accept his apology (even though he never actually changes.)

#bonefall reads dotc #tw ableism #every WC blogger has their white whale and BY GOD this entire arc is mine #I am on a Crusade #Warrior cats analysis

[bonebabbles]

Tall Shadow: "I don't think negotiating with Clear Sky will work but I'll go on the negotiation patrol anyway, in the hopes we can settle this peacefully"

Clear Sky: "I'm soo stressed from clobbering this kitten, exiling disabled people, starving my hostage, murdering a mother and suggesting we kill her children, beating Bumble to death, mentally abusing my son, and commanding my cats to slaughter anyone who refuses to leave my territory. I think trying to murder a negotiation patrol unprovoked would make me feel better, make sure you kill everyone guys! Here's a freebie!"

*throws Tall Shadow into the murder crowd*

Tall Shadow: *kills someone who was attacking Thunder*

StarClan: "Tall Shadow and Clear Sky are both responsible for this."

#bonefall reads dotc #dotc #if you read my bumble post and somehow think it makes anyone less bad than clear sky you have brain worms #Clear Sky is the causative agent of Bumble's death and everyone else was a contributing factor #Don't be a moron

[bonefall]

What's the star line you mentioned?

This one in First Battle,

Gray Wing pushed himself onto his paws, his legs trembling. “Kill me,” he rasped at Clear Sky. “Kill me and live with the memory. Then tell the stars that you won.”

It's the line that makes Clear Sky stop the battle he started in the first place. Completely out of context it's a quotable line, but actually, it sucks ass narratively.

After 2 and 1/2 books about Gray Wing being a thick-headed idiot and totally unable to acknowledge the damage Clear Sky causes, clinging to "hes my brother :(( he could never be bad :((( it's so sad that bumble showed up murdered because now no one sees the good in Clear Sky that I do :((((" it pays off.

He was right all along

Turns out Gray never had to grow, or change, or acknowledge that he was blindly parroting Clear Sky's beliefs and making the budding society of the Clans a worse place to live in. NOPE! After months of murdering innocent people, public humiliations and abandoning "worthless" (disabled) people, shoving his son's face in a festering, rotting, pus-dribbling wound, Gray Wing was right that His Dearest Brother was just a scared little sadboy who would listen to reason if he just got one more 100th chance

None of that was too far, but killing Gray Wing is.

Still soaked in the blood of Rainswept Flower, ANOTHER innocent woman, that's THREE women he brutalized, Clear Sky sees that Gray Wing was too far.

So actually, fuck the Star Line. It's trash, just like everything else in this god awful arc

#DOTC Hate #Me starting the reread: 'i dont remember this arc being too bad' #(CLUELESS) #bonefall reads dotc #if only gray wing was also a woman then clear sky would have killed her too LOL #clear sky will see a woman and say ''is anyone going to cut her in half'' and not even wait #tw ableism