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otterskin8 · 4 years

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You ever read something and just keep saying ‘YES’ over and over again? It’s just...so nice to have words to describe this. Thanks, man.

Loki vs Thor - A Psychoanalysis

This essays exists because of a one wonderful, insightful and very determined person who has been asking me to psychoanalyse the Odinsons for many years.

In the course of researching this I binged watched all the films with Thor and Loki in, read as many commentaries, interviews with writers and directors as I could get my hands on, and browsed tumblr.

So here is a psychological analysis of Loki and Thor (the marvel movie versions).

It explains:

why they have such different personalities,

why they are not able to relate emotional to each other

how they feed into each other’s emotional dysfunction, which creates the conflicts that drive the films

Thinkers vs Feelers

Thor and Loki have very different personalities, and often have difficulty relating to each other emotionally. Whilst some of the difference is genetic in origin, the vast majority of their personality differences and relationship dysfunction can be explained by their upbringing.

The development maturation model explains not only why Thor and Loki are different but also provides an excellent lens through which to examine their motivations, and emotions through the films.

The model predicts that during the first years of life, infants learn coping strategies to handle strong emotions. This is a vital part of human development which everyone undergoes but the path an infant “chooses” determines their future personality, their susceptibility to psychiatric conditions and response to psychiatric therapy.

All infants start off with the basic instinctive need to gain attention; it is an essential survival strategy but there are two broadly different methods that infants learn to use to gain attention.

“Feelers” are infants who learn the best way to cope with emotions is to amplify them because this brings attention/comfort from the primary care giver. “Thinkers” on the other hand learn that internalising their emotions in favour of pleasing the primary care giver leads to attention/comfort.

I think the best analogy for Thinkers and Feelers is:

If emotions were fine wine, the Feelers would all be drunk and the Thinkers utterly sober.

The functional Feelers would be amusingly tipsy, bringing joy and laughter to the party, whilst the functional Thinkers would be savouring all the subtle aromas of the bouquet and discussing the quality of the vintage.

The dysfunctional feelers would be smashing up the wine cellar in a drunken rage, whilst the dysfunctional Thinkers would be stoically standing the in the middle of the carnage refusing to acknowledge that wine can stain their suits.

Most well-adjusted adults exist somewhere on the spectrum between two extremes. They are able to retain the good parts from their original “path” and learn the beneficial strategies of the opposite “path”.

Thor the Feeler

From this model we can see that Thor is very much a feeler. He clearly expresses and amplifies his emotions throughout the films. At first, we see him doing this regardless of how it affects other people around him but as Thor develops, we see that he learns to control how and when he expresses his emotions. He is learning the “Thinkers” strategy of coping with emotions and applying it to balance out the negative impact of his “Feelers” strategy.

Thor’s “Feeler” instincts to express and amplify whatever he is feeling is part of the reason why he is seen as an honest and open person because he never tries to disguise his emotional state. We are hardwired to respond to other people’s emotions and thus superficially at least Thor is often easier to relate to than Loki.

When Feelers must deal with stressful emotional states, their instinctive strategy is to simply amplify their emotions. We see this clearly in Thor 1, when Thor has a screaming match with his father, and then flips a table over in anger. We see this again when Thor fails to pick up Mjolnir on Earth and cries rather dramatically in the rain. Even without an audience, Feelers instinctively over express their emotions as a coping mechanism. Some psychiatrists believe this is actually a helpful stress release mechanism, and Feelers are less likely to develop stress related psychiatric conditions.

Loki the Thinker

Loki on the other hand is definitely a Thinker and, like all Thinkers, he experiences emotion, but that experience is superseded by his conscious thought process. A Thinker’s relationship with their feelings is far more complex than a Feeler’s. Instead of simply feeling the emotion and then expressing it, thinks see emotions as tools to be utilized in social interactions. Functional thinkers tend to only express emotions that are acceptable and appropriate to help lubricate social interactions. Other emotions that are not deemed to be social acceptable are suppressed and ignored.

Thinkers when confronted with stressful emotional states, first tend to over-analyse and then inappropriately contain their negative emotions. This containment allows the Thinker to feel in control, and projects the illusion of emotional control to others. However, Thinkers pay a high psychological and physiological price for this containment. Their strategy for emotional management creates more stress for themselves. Thinkers are more likely to develop depression, particularly treatment resistant types, anxiety and other stress related psychiatric disorders.

The best example of Loki containing his emotions is after he returns from Jotunheim and works out that he is a Frost Giant. Thor, the Feeler, would have screamed the place down and demanded answers immediately, but you can see that Loki keeps his negative emotions contained and does not express anything.

The scene in the weapons vault between Loki and Odin is an excellent example of a Thinker having what is essentially a nervous breakdown.

Loki starts off in control of his emotions and the conversation but swiftly we see the containment of his negative emotions crumble and collapse. The ensuing emotional outburst from Loki is like a dam breaking. It is not just the emotions that he has been holding back for the last few hours that breaks through but all of the negative emotion he has likely contained within himself for years. The emotions wash over him, and completely overwhelm his ability to analyse or contain them. What we then see is the Thinker finally Feeling emotion.

Moments like this, if handled well, can be very cathartic for Thinkers because for the first time they truly loose control and just experience their emotions. With that loss of control comes the chance to express emotion in its raw state. It can be a very liberating feeling, and during this process the Thinker is learning how to be more of a Feeler and balance out the negative impact of their chosen coping strategy. With acknowledgement, and positive reception, dysfunctional Thinkers like Loki can incorporate Feelers strategies when managing their negative emotions.

Unfortunately for Loki, Odin falls asleep in the middle of his emotional catharsis, and Loki never gets the chance to truly express his emotions and be acknowledged for doing so. Therefore, he never learns the benefits of expressing his emotions. Instead we see that after Odin falls asleep Loki immediately feels guilty and reverts to the Thinker strategy of containing his emotions once again. His voice drops, he crouches down to touch Odin. Once again, he has forced himself to put his own emotions aside for the sake of someone else and from a psychological point of view this is both tragic and damaging for Loki.

Brotherly Love and Dysfunction

Why is Thor and Loki’s relationship so dramatic and dysfunctional?

The root cause of their relationship problems is not Loki’s jealousy or Thor’s disregard for Loki’s feelings, those are merely symptoms.

Just like the Holmes Brothers, Thor and Loki have opposite coping strategies for emotions and therefore they have very different emotional needs. Both of them are firmly entrenched and dysfunction Thinkers/Feelers. Whilst Thor does develop a more comprehensive and balanced approach to his emotions, this only happens when he gets thrown into a completely new environment and meets new people. Loki never get this chance.

Their dysfunctional Thinker/Feeler coping mechanisms significantly affect their relationship with each other. Unlike the Holmes Brothers, even as adults Thor and Loki spend most of their time together, they have the same social circle and that exacerbates their inability to grow and change.

Thor is locked in a perpetual cycle of expressing and amplifying his emotions without any kind of filter. This is because no one has managed to convince him that his emotions are not the most important things in the world. I can imagine that Thor, as Odin and Frigga’s longed for son got a lot of unconditional love and attention as an infant. He only had to cry to get the attention he wanted. As he grew older, crying turned to screaming and shouting. Essentially Thor’s emotional outbursts have always been rewarded with what he wants, eventually. Therefore, Thor has never had to learn the Thinker’s strategy of modifying his emotional expression to relate to other people.

It is not that Thor doesn’t understand or care about other people’s emotions: he clearly has the capacity to do both when he falls to Earth. He just doesn’t do it on Asgard because he doesn’t need to. In nearly all situations his emotions have been treated as being of paramount importance. The world almost revolves around Thor’s feelings. It is only when his outbursts are directed at Odin that they fail to get the effect he wants. Therefore Thor, instinctively shouts louder which escalates the situation and ends up getting him banished to Earth.

Apart from Odin, no one ever holds Thor to account for his emotional outbursts. When he flips over a table after his argument with Odin, no one even comments except for some light protesting about wasted food. Instead, Loki actually comes closer to acknowledge Thor’s feelings and provide him with comfort and advice.

Here we see that Loki is perpetually stuck in the cycle of enabling Thor’s dysfunctional Feeler strategy.

Loki has become a Thinker probably by necessity. He only got attention, comfort and acknowledgement when he displayed the right emotions. This is most likely because his parents had already got into a bad cycle of providing unconditional attention to Thor, and did not have enough capacity, when Loki arrived, to give him the same undivided unconditional attention. Therefore Loki learned to display emotions to please the people around him in exchange for attention. As he became older, Loki necessarily became the diplomat, the person who smoothed things over in disagreements. He puts his own emotions into containment so that he can display what other people want to and need to see. This is completely instinctive by the time we meet him in Thor 1.

Unfortunately, a dysfunctional Thinker like Loki simply feeds into Thor’s perpetual cycle of amplifying his emotions. He always has a captive audience in his brother, he always gets the acknowledgement he wants from Loki. He never has to acknowledge Loki’s feelings because his brother never appears to be inconvenienced by any negative feelings.

This is probably why Thor loves Loki so much and just assumes Loki must love him back. This is also why Thor is so surprised when he finds out Loki actually resents him at the end of Thor 1. Loki is very good at containing his feelings, and a Feeler like Thor is completely ill equipped to read between the lines and see what emotions Loki isn’t expressing.

Keep reading

#meta #admired meta

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otterskin8 · 4 years

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Is it too late to do this?

Sure, here’s my go:

slow burn or love at first sight - Neither, I’m too Asexual.

fake dating or secret dating - Gonna have to pull my Ace card again.

enemies to lovers or best friends to lovers - Geez this card is wearing out

oh no there’s only one bed or long distance with correspondence - Nothing wrong with snuggles.

fantasy au or modern au - I mostly read fantasy so a fantasy au of a fantasy seems silly. Modern is more fun because you can translate things with more thought.

smut or fluff

mutual pining or domestic bliss

alternate universe or future fic - Both? Both is good.

one shot or multi-chapter - There is nothing so terrible as an unfinished multi-chapter, unless it is the one shot that should have been so much more...

kid fic or roadtrip fic - I mean most stories are roadtrip stories. A story is about leaving one place to get to another.

reincarnation or character death - Reincarnation? Like, as something else? ...then it’s not the same anymore.

arranged marriage or accidental marriage - Not a big fan of either but accidental sounds more modern at least.

high school romance or middle aged romance - More old people in everything, please

time travel or isolated together

neighbors or roommates - I guess family, so...long term roommates?

sci-fi au or magic au

bodyswap or genderbend

angst or crack - But only because I write jokes in my angst

apocalyptic or mundane - Both? Both is still good

There you go, @aninfinitenumberofmonkeys!

I tag...@jaggedcliffs, if she doesn’t mind.

Fic preferences game

Thank you to @aphrodaisyacs and @mercia-lachesis for the tag!

Rules: Bold your fic preferences because why not, gotta choose one (near impossible, but go with your first gut instinct).

slow burn or love at first sight

fake dating or secret dating

enemies to lovers or best friends to lovers

oh no there's only one bed or long distance with correspondence

fantasy au or modern au (I prefer non-au settings but if I had to choose...)

smut or fluff

mutual pining or domestic bliss

alternate universe or future fic (especially if it's a canon-divergent au, my fave)

one shot or multi-chapter

kid fic or roadtrip fic (both. roadtrips are the best but also kiddos)

reincarnation or character death (resurrection? 100% into it. reincarnation? not so much)

arranged marriage or accidental marriage (not a huge fan of either but I chose accidental for the comedy aspect)

high school romance or middle aged romance

time travel or isolated together (always a fave)

neighbors or roomates

sci-fi au or magic au

bodyswap or genderbend

angst or crack (both. both at once is even better)

apocalyptic or mundane

No pressure, but I'm tagging @writernotwaiting, @otterskin, @celestialsilhouette, @mykingdomforapen, @untitledfirbolg, @adhdasianaroace, and @iguessyouregonnamissthepantyraid

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otterskin8 · 4 years

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Newest chapter is now live. The plot may just arrive, if she’s feeling up to it.

#finnesang #my fic #thor fic #loki #odin

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otterskin8 · 4 years

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Stable

It had started as a punishment.

Loki no longer remembered just what it was he had done to earn it. It had been many millennia since, of course, but in truth, it was likely the sheer scope of his little mischiefs that made identifying a specific bit of discipline for a specific bit of fun near impossible.

Perhaps it had been for turning Thor into a frog. He recalled Odin saying something along the lines of ‘If you have such an interest in animals, you can study them closer up.”

That was how he came to be ankle-deep in horse manure.

It was dirty work - a lot of mucking out stables, treating infected hooves, plucking off ticks and scrubbing and oiling the tack. Yet Loki could not wholly resent the tasks, as it did allow him time closer up with the animals. He’d always liked beasts - often preferred their company to that of the court. They did not expect much of you, and there was no sense in putting on airs. You could be honest with a horse in ways you could not be honest with yourself.

His favourite part was grooming. Sleipnir would press his nose against his chest and snort, and Loki would stroke his cheek with one hand while the other, clad in the brush, he’d pull down the horse’s neck. It brought him a great deal of peace to do this.

Which is why he didn’t at all appreciate it when he was interrupted by a boy his own age telling him “You’re doing that wrong."

“This is how Sleipnir likes it,” Loki had said, stubbornly. “I think I know my father’s horse better than some random stablehand.”

The boy had sidled in to stand beside Loki, and to the young prince’s irritation Sleipnir didn’t at all seem to mind.

Looking sideways at him, the youth said with a smirk “What nobles know to do on horses is the same thing they know about everything else, because it's all they ever do.”

“And what might that be?” Loki played along.

“Sitting.”

That had actually made him laugh. “Did you work that one out a while ago and were just waiting for the right opportunity?”

“Well, to be honest, I’ve used it before; never had the chance to tell a nob themselves, though.”

He’d frowned, it suddenly occurred to him that there had to be a reason this servant thought he could get away speaking thus to the son of a king. “And you figured I was in such a powerless position that you could risk it?”

“Yes. Any complaint you could make about a rude stableboy at this point would likely be seen as you trying to get out of your punishment, or cause further trouble. And it is hardly an offence worth hanging me for; I am the best stableboy you’ve got, and that’s not nothing.”

He reached out a dusky hand and took Sleipnir’s nose from Loki, blowing into it gently. Sleipnir puffed his own breath back in his face with a friendly snort. “I am one of the only people around here the king’s horse likes. And the king probably has a better opinion of his horse’s opinion right now than yours.”

“For a moment, I almost liked you there. Thank you for curing that in such short order,” The prince sniffed.

The stableboy brushed that aside. “It’s impressive how much this horse likes you, despite how badly you brush him.”

“I am not doing it wrong -“

But the youth then materialized a series of different brushes from his belt and spent the next hour lecturing Loki on the use of each one, the order he was meant to go with, and how to untangle the mane and safely comb the tail.

Loki hated being told what to do, but he hated not knowing how to do something even more. So he had listened. At one point, the boy had slipped his hand on top of Loki’s inside the brush to show him the correct amount of force to apply to the brushing. It wasn’t as simple as following the hair. It was about flicking the dust loose, sweeping and much as stroking.

That had been the first time he’d felt it. The smallest flutter, in some gangly, unformed part of himself. A spark that would soon light a shameful flame in the lowest parts of his guts.

But, at the start, there had been no shame.

“My name is Sialfi,” the boy had said.

Loki met him two weeks into a three-month punishment. Oftentimes he wished they’d met sooner, that they’d had that time as well.

But at least they’d had time at all. So much wasted on his part - halting, nervous. Unsure of himself or his feelings. It was near the end that he had at last kissed Sialfi.

Allowed to go riding after a day of hard labour, they’d taken a lonely path long past the boundaries they were meant to stay within. When they’d finally reached a vantage point where they could see the edge of the very planet, they were gasping and sweaty, as were their horses. Manure was still stuck to their boots, a few stray pieces of hay in their hair, and a particularly dogged fly ignored their every attempt to shoo it off.

It only made the kiss all the sweeter.

Sialfi. He could remember the name; he could remember his deadpan sense of humour, often mocking and aloof. He could remember the way the sun used to hit his hair, absorbed by the center but always diffused around the edges, creating a halo about his head.

But he could no longer truly remember his face, or what he had tasted like.

After his discipline was over, Loki found every excuse he could to go to the stables. He went riding often, or would claim to be going elsewhere and slip away. Like this, he managed to have a few more weeks with Sialfi. A few more clandestine kisses. A few more moments where they pressed against each other as they groomed their horses together, hands joined in the brush.

Then had come the day he came to the stable and found Sialfi missing. Sleipnir had been agitated; no-one was soothing him. There was no point in searching the place - Sialfi would never have allowed Sleipnir to be in distress. He’d spoken immediately to the stablemaster. All he would say was that Sialfi was a lucky boy, so very lucky, to have been promoted like that. How unexpected. He was lucky to have met you, the King’s son, and gotten a chance to so impress. Odin himself had asked after him, and next thing you know, along came a chance to squire for the Lord Dagur himself. Of course, Lord Dagur was such an itinerant - never in one place for long, always travelling the Nine and beyond, never in one place for long. Off to Vanaheim already, and likely not to stay there for more than a day after that. He never rested, that Dagur.

But how had Sialfi, a boy from such a low family, managed to catch the eye of Dagur?

He wanted to run to his father’s study right then and there, bang on the door, accuse him - accuse him of what? What could he have said that wouldn’t have admitted…did that mean he knew? Or merely suspected?

What if it were purely chance? Dagur had one of the most magnificent mares in all of creation. Skinfaxi, with her mane of light, twice as many hands as the tallest horse - that would surely have caught Sialfi’s attention. Perhaps he’d taken good care of the beast, as he always did, his affection and talent plain for Dagur to see. And on a whim, the Lord had requested him, and who would Sialfi be to refuse such an honour?

After all, it wasn’t like he and Loki would ever be able to continue as they were. Why would he sacrifice his future for a few more moments with the stringy second prince, risking his life for the simple pleasure of besmirching royalty? Why even risk telling Loki, who might be expected to sabotage everything out of spite?

Perhaps it was as simple as that.

So he had waited. In a few more months, he had brought it up at the end of a family meal when it happened to be just him and father left at the table. Asked casually after that stable boy he’d gone riding with a few times. What had ever happened to him?

“Ah,” Odin had said. “I heard that you were close with that boy. I should have said something sooner. Lord Dagur dropped by quite unexpectedly one day, you know how he is. He needed someone to help with his horse; his last squire got himself kicked in the head, and then fell in love with his nurse. No-one quite wants to volunteer their highborn children to a traveller like Dagur, and few of those are any good with horses. But I recalled you once mentioned your friend and spoke highly of his compassion for Sleipnir, which the stablemaster confirmed. I knew that if he were a friend of yours, Loki, he would be of good temperament and sound mind, nevermind his low birth. Such individuals deserve the chance to rise above their station. When Dagur asked for such a companion during that brief stay of his here - I wonder if you even had a chance to notice, he didn’t even stay for the evening feast - I recommended the lad, though I never did hear if he’d accepted.”

“Oh,” Loki had said.

He had lain awake that night wracking his brain for a memory of having ever mentioned Sialfi to Odin, even off-handedly. Yet he was sure he’d only ever said he wished to go riding and take a companion servant along. Sure he’d kept Sialfi’s name obfuscated.

But perhaps all Odin had to do was ask the stablemaster.

And perhaps Lord Dagur would return soon.

He did. Eventually. Many decades later, when Loki had nearly forgotten what that should mean.

He’d stayed for the feast that time, and when he saw Loki he’d clapped his back and told him what had become of his old friend. “Natural with horses, you’d think he had a centaur for a grandfather! I’ve never had a better squire. That is, until he and my sister’s squire ran off with Skinfaxi and Hrimfaxi's foal. But knowing your growing reputation, my boy, I should’ve assumed any friend of yours would be a wily one! I almost admire his gumption. I’m glad Odin asked me to take him on, in the end; a foal is a small price to pay after his years of excellent service. Though he’ll truly need her if he ever shows his face around here. Can’t be letting the small folk get away with such behaviour, or we’ll hardly have a single horseshoe between all of us in a century.”

Dagur had wandered off after that, leaving Loki to wonder about what he meant by ‘glad Odin asked me to take him on’.

He never confronted his father about it. Perhaps Dagur had simply meant to imply that Odin had mentioned Sialfi, perhaps asked Dagur to give a lowborn boy a chance he would not otherwise have. Perhaps that was all it meant.

Or perhaps…perhaps his father had known. And sought to protect Loki from himself.

Loki was old enough to hear how people talked of such things now. Old enough to know to bank that hideous flame and quell half his desires. It wasn’t like all of him was bent like this; there were avenues yet that were perfectly acceptable.

Really, he should thank his father.

He should be grateful.

He should.

#myfic #loki #odin #finnesang: deleted scenes #finnesang

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otterskin8 · 4 years

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Posted this on Christmas Eve, but I’ma add it here!

Synop: A strange dream is followed by a frigid awakening.

#finnesang #My fic #odin has a turn in the narrator seat

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otterskin8 · 4 years

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A bit of fanart for JaggedCliff’s stunning and satisfying One Step Away.

https://archiveofourown.org/works/2759003/chapters/6185519

#one step away #fan art #thor #fic rec #odin #loki

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otterskin8 · 4 years

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👀!

“What might happen if I expressed an interest in joining your… little revolution?”

The Kronian’s expression brightened. “That’d be terrific! The revolution could always use more revolutors. Except…” he frowned. “Might be a bit tricky, what with you going to be dead and all. It’d be right tough handing out pamphlets as a ghost. They’d fall right through your hands!”

Loki smiled through gritted teeth. “And what if I wasn’t a ghost?”

Korg shook his head. “No, but I’m afraid we can’t have zombies in the revolution. Not that I’d mind personally, understand, I’m pretty open-minded, but what would the others think?”

Loki stopped even trying to hide his frustration. “That isn’t what I mean either. What if I wasn’t dead?”

“Well, not to be gloomy or anything but I wouldn’t count on that,” Korg said cheerfully. “I’m sorry to say things aren’t looking too good for an escape just now. Those chains, for one thing. You’d have to chew your own arms off or something, and your teeth don’t look quite sharp enough for that, not to mention I imagine you’re pretty attached to them.”

Oh, forget this. Loki prayed for patience and bit his tongue. “Or,” he said, “you could let me go?”

#is this long enough to be a fic rec?#anyways made me laugh #can't wait for the whole thing

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otterskin8 · 4 years

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Loki smooths over some negotiations with mistrustful alien strangers. His skills are then called for again - to deal with his confused, mistrustful father, to whom he is a stranger.

#finnesang #My fic #probably best to keep each chapter linked here #sorry for spam #thor fanfiction

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otterskin8 · 4 years

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First two chapters are up (prologue and what should be chapter one, but apparently AO3 has decided to renumber them for me :/). I’m very excited to share this one. The pitch is thusly:

Odin is missing a raven. Without Muninn, Odin isn’t quite who he used to be. The only thing more dangerous than a man with secrets is one who can no longer keep them.

Thor's become exactly the kind of king he believes his father would be proud of - if his father were still the man Thor thought he was (if he ever was).

Loki knows his place - servant of Asgard, advisor to his brother, and caregiver to his ailing father. Important roles, necessary ones - and yet he feels forgotten. Sometimes literally.

Being forgotten is dangerous when all that you are is someone else’s lie.

If y’all are up for some whump, family feels, drama, a little humour, a sarcastic raven with no time for Asgardian social shenanigans, a Loki trying to keep it together, an Odin falling apart and also trying to keep it together (poorly), and a Thor who will soon find being Thor not enough of a solution for this particular problem, etc. and more, it’s gonna be in there. My Christmas gift to you all.

#finnesang #My fic #thor 1 canon deviation #still builds just as much off of the rest #thor fic #thor fanfiction #family drama

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otterskin8 · 4 years

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Teaser.

A longer fic is on its way. And yes, there will be illustrations.

#finnesang #illustration

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otterskin8 · 4 years

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Yo, Chapter 2 went up. Many thanks to JaggedCliffs for Beta-ing this. I’m incredibly lucky to have such an amazing author and ‘comprehender of grammar’ looking over my work.

This features Thor picking up Ragna from the school....’s infirmary, after a little incident on the playground.

I’d love to hear feedback on the chapter, negative or positive, constructive if you’d like. In general, I’m always looking to improve, and that can’t happen without critique.

#my fic #it comes in yellow #thor #ragna

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otterskin8 · 5 years

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This is so beautifully put. It was wonderful to hear that perspective. Thank you for sharing. I am as white as a water-flavoured sno-cone, so I really appreciate hearing your experiences. I think many of us are raised with inherent biases that take as awhile to unpack. Even if those biases are against ourselves and cause us great harm in our efforts to be different than who we are. I certainly had plenty to unpack, and it always seems I’m discovering a new box of toys in the back of my brain attic that I didn’t even realize were influencing me in negative ways.

I breathed such a sigh of relief when I saw how they introduced Loki in Ragnarok. It was so beautifully done and showed how much the director understood the character. My least favourite iteration of the character is in Avengers and TDW, when I feel they were more focused on Loki’s comic depiction, which lacks the things I love in the original mythology. Not entirely - there’s still lots of humour based around emasculation in both (admittedly probably my least favourite part of the myths), but it feels like an unintentional reference. It’s just common to emasculate the bad guy and have your heroes look cool.

In Ragnarok, I never felt that the humour was at Loki’s expense, or to make the heroes look good in comparison. The humiliation was shared, and the purpose was to confront all the characters with their ridiculous posturing; to shake them up. It felt equal and purposeful and thoughtful. It was humiliation with the goal of humility and growth, not just plain slapstick to make fun of the less-physically imposing villain.

Honestly, I’m heartbroken that we lost this Loki. I can’t believe I’ve got Avengers Loki back instead for the Loki series. I remember thinking, after that movie, that we had a lot of work to do...and after TDW, I gave up hope that Marvel and I had the same hopes for the character at all.

Waititi and the writers got back to the awkwardness and subversiveness I found so endearing in the first film and brought it forward. I can’t thank them enough.

I’ve talked a lot about why I despise interacting with Loki’s “army” with how they have belittled other Loki fans and vilified Taika Waititi (going through such great lengths to do so, I might add), but I don’t think I talk much in length as to why I appreciate and love Ragnarok and its handling of Loki.

I see so much of both who I am and used to be in his character: toxic parents, self-hatred, “scapegoat,” etc. And we see how these things contribute to the bad decisions he makes in Thor and in Avengers. In the past, I’ve said things that hurt other people and I did things that hurt myself. I thought I was in the right. You couldn’t tell me I was wrong. Sound familiar? Even when Thor tried to reason with him in Avengers, he refused to see eye to eye. He was stubborn and self-centered. He continued on with his destructive behavior.

Just to give you all an idea of what I went through before I started to grow, I’ve mentioned before that I’m biracial (Black), and the family I grew up with was mostly white. I was adopted by one Black and one white parent, and the Black side of my family had little influence on me since they lived on the other side of the country. My white parent is very toxic and very anti-Black. I held self-hatred for my “Black side” and grew up listening to microaggressions inflicted on me by white members of my family. I wanted as little to do with my Black side as possible, and when people throw this kind of hatred your way, you start to believe it. Even though I would have never labeled myself as anti-Black back then, I now know that I was. I’m now at a place where I’m learning to love my Blackness and I’m recognizing anti-Blackness and calling it out when I see it, even if it makes the toxic people in my life uncomfortable.

And the thing is, I think a lot of people who hold self-hate for themselves go through a self-destructive stage before they begin to learn the errors in their ways. If you’re like me, it takes someone you have a lot of respect for to call out some behaviors you’re exhibiting, and suddenly, you start reexamining your beliefs and the people in your life. Unfortunately, for Loki, it took the death of his mother in TDW for him to start reexamining his actions (it was he who told his mother’s murderer the best route after all).

What I see in Loki in Ragnarok is a person who is just starting to see the error in his ways and doesn’t quite know where he stands. He’s more awkward and he’s still making questionable decisions, but throughout the movie, I get the impression that he’s at least questioning those questionable decisions. And for the first time, he’s starting not to see his brother (who was just as much a victim of his father’s toxicity as he was) as an enemy anymore. I think what a lot of people in the Loki fandom don’t get is that once you start to get out of a dark place, there is awkwardness. You know you’ve done wrong, and because of this, you know people are right not to completely trust you. Loki has done some pretty unforgivable things, and he knows this. He knows he doesn’t quite fit in with the likes of Thor and company. Loki of 2012 would never dream of teaming up with his brother, but he knows it’s the right thing to do if he wants to save the people of Asgard. So he does it, regardless of how uncomfortable it makes him.

And I think one of the things that makes me so uncomfortable with the fandom’s mischaracterization of him is the fact that they treat anything good he does as a way to erase what he’s done in the past, and as someone who will always be working to become a better person, I know that even though it was the self-hate and privilege talking, the things I’ve said in the past cannot be unsaid. The choices I made to hurt myself cannot be taken back. Those things will always be a part of me. The same could be said for Loki: The words, the betrayal, the harm he has inflicted on other people, and the lies cannot be taken back. Part of becoming a better person, I think, is owning those things, and so many people in his fandom refuse to let him do that. It’s a real shame.

#other people's opinion #that i agree with #ragnarok discourse #taika waititi appreciation

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