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katyahina · 4 months

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Who are Yahar'gul hunters? (compiled reference and observations on 7 obscure NPCs)

Like the title suggests, I decided to cover whatever could be said or speculated about a group of NPCs in Bloodborne in one post as despite suffering from not having unique names or at least titles (save for Antal), they are distinct enough to have the characters and lore nonetheless in Soulsborne's trademark nonverbal fashion! They are a valid part of overall Bloodborne cast and I've found out they offer plenty to work with!

Some shared observations

(Description are always taken from Last Protagonist's retranslation document ( x ) to not miss out any nuance)

1) Yahar'gul hunters are Healing Church hunters, rather than Old Hunters (the hunters of Gehrman's type) or Yharnam hunters (simple citizens who, albeit trained by Ludwig, don't count as Healing Church hunters)! Not only five out of seven of them use Healing Church weapons (six out of seven if you count Archibald's weapons as such) and not only School of Mensis is another faction of "nerds" of the Healing Church but also some visual hints can be seen:

^^^ For example, the metal helmets of Yahar'gul Hunters are the same as what Executioners (enemies) in Hunter's Nightmare are wearing! These Executioners are likewise staff of the Healing Church, or used to be in the times of the past. It is up to interpretation if their caged helmets were to contain those eldrich tentacles and School of Mensis simply took the design to honor their roots (like they honored their Byrgenwerth roots with uniforms), or if those Executioners were given to the Healing Church BY Micolash/Mensis to begin with, or the secret third/fouth/fifth thing! I just think the design implication being here to begin with is interesting

(The images of Church Giants are from this ( x ) page in Bloodborne Wiki (that awesome one created all by the same person))

^^^ Healing Church staff also seems to have a knack for ropes tied around (and the Madmen, former Tomb Prospectors, repeated the idea by tying long empty phantasms shells in a similar fashion)! Yahar'gul Hunters are said to use it as both restraint for kidnapping and... yeah, as 'lucky charms'.

2) It is rather interesting that they are, functionally, doing the same as what Snatchers (big Pthumerian guys with a sack) do - kidnap people for School of Mensis! My headcanon is that School of Mensis worked primarily with their hunters as kidnappers, and Snatchers were doing their own thing but simply shared living space with School of Mensis! Moreover, they do not aimlessly kidnap people long after Mensis Scholars "ascended", but need people for their own ritual of attempting to create an Amygdala, which is The One Reborn. It is a long rabbithole, but internal name of Amygdalae is 'evil god' and internal name of The One Reborn is 'failed evil god' ( x ). But alternatively, School of Mensis worked with the hunters and only afterwards was able to get Snatchers to help them! Regardless of interpretation, at least at some point in timeline, Yahar'gul Hunters were School of Mensis' tools for kidnapping.

3) Five out of seven of Yahar'gul hunters are not white. More specifically, one of these hunters (the Hunter's Nightmare one) is distinct, when other four are similar 'type' of model (not sure what to call it) with Henryk. Yeah, from game developing standpoint, devs probably just used Henryk as a base for creating Yahar'gul hunters, and naturally DLC hunter would look unique. But for all we know, it could also be an implication! Like how Heir Rune that Henryk drops is also found in Yahar'gul! At the same time, out of shown covenants of the characters, proportionally Yahar'gul hunters have the biggest amount of not white people. Yharnamites believe foreigners caused the plague of beasts, and Yharnam is very much Slavic: Czechia+Poland inspired, mostly with white people of course. Maybe people who were visibly foreigners had the hardest time whenever bias against foreigners began, and so these hunters had to turn to School of Mensis: a faction that takes in everyone, needing simply people willing to do crimes, and also provides opportunity to hide from the public eye.

4) Yahar'gul Hunters are the only type of Hunters in the game to use Archibald's weapons!

Archibald is not necessarily against the normal Healing Church; he is referred to as 変人 (a weirdo), unlike, say, Powder Kegs that are called 異端 (heretics). But, the items associated with him (Tonitrus, Tiny Tonitrus and Spark Hunter Badge) are all found in School of Mensis! One Yahar'gul hunter uses Tonitrus, one other uses Tiny Tonitrus, and Bolt Papers are dropped by one of the Yahar'gul Hunters and Snatchers, and also found on corpses all over School of Mensis! But maybe it was him being fascinated with "magic" of beasts instead of straight up denying all about them, or the fact that bolt harms Kin (who used to be an important deal for Healing Church) that earned him the weird looks. It further feels like Micolash was collecting various rejects by his side, sure that they'd do every mad thing he needed while having no choice, and Yahar'gul Hunters rather joined because of hard situation. Heck, there are two Yahar'gul hunters that defected from School of Mensis!

5) Back to Loran implications, because there are some!

Remember how Henryk is implied to relate to Loran? Further in cut content as his set used to be called Hunter of Gremia Set (Gremia used to be name for Loran ( x )) This is also the case with Suspicious Beggar, who straight up can turn into a unique beast that comes from Loran and isn't anything spawned by Healing Church's antics. Loran is very desert-inspired, so.. heck, appearance of Yahar'gul Hunters + Archibald exploring Loran electric beasts can also be useful for interpreting this cast of characters. Maybe Archibald specifically searched those with Loran heritage as part of his interest in Darkbeasts and School of Mensis had to comply for like... Archibald being to Micolash what Ludwig is to Laurence. Or maybe people with Loran roots were shunned not by Yharnamites in general, but by Healing Church itself, all over suspicion that they were more subjected for giving into beasthood than everyone else. :/ *insert 'This place is reserved for Whites' meme again*

6) In two out of three cases where you meet these Hunters, they fight as a group in which members also mutually balance each other with their skills. You'll see what I mean when I describe each hunter individually! But yeah, they group by compensating for each other's weak points, as opposed to, say, normie Church hunters that group by 'a cool person and their bodyguard' system (like the girls at Research Hall or Forgotten Madman and his escort for example). Really efficient.

Alright, I think I am done with overall review of the cast, and like I said, I am going to bring up each individually under Keep Reading! I just figured general observations were needed first! Will also be using screenshots of their face data that I recreated in game to have references, face sliders are datamined by Zullie the Witch! (( x ) ( x ) for videos and ( x ) for extremely handy compillation on the same cool Wiki)

The Defectors

I group these characters together as it is easier! They are Antal and a Yahar'gul Hunter that we meet in the Hunter's Nightmare, in Underground Cell! Both of them are using Church Pick, and both are actually against Healing Church by what we can conclude. I've heard that before Zullie datamined these hunters, people used to assume they were the same character 🤔

Antal

He is the only named Yahar'gul Hunter and is a summon against The One Reborn and Darkbeast Paarl! His weapons are Church Pick and Flamesprayer! He doesn't excell in any stats, nor there is anything remarkable about his build.... and I also used to think he had a tiny mustache because of that shadow just above his lip, but turns out he doesn't have facial hair fhdhfds Let's say he has it shaved or something.. Also, Antal is apparently young, both by feature sliders and actual age picked for him. I assume early balding working under Micolash is normal.. -_-"

With his summon locations, it is up to interpretation whether he is dead (since some summons do raise from the grave to hunt) or simply prefers to work against School of Mensis "from inside", helping the kidnapped if he crosses paths with them, rather than straight up leaving. At the very least, IF he died, he betrayed School of Mensis before his death, as the title suggests! Also according to internal files ( x ), Antal had an unknown occasion to appear in Hunter's Nightmare that was cancelled. It isn't clear whether it was as a hostile NPC or as a summon, but, having it cut is interesting because there IS another Yahar'gul Hunter there in the final game:

Yamamura's boyfriend Yahar'gul Hunter from Nightmare

OKAY OKAY but hear me out fdhfsdh This is the hunter we find in the Underground Cell in Hunter's Nightmare, where people that learned too much about the Healing Church's secrets are thrown to die!

It is quite a bold move for someone who worked for School of Mensis of all things to be considered someone that learned too much, right? I think that an intention to betray had to be the factor, then 🤔 Yamamura is a summon not only against Living Failures, but also in Yahar'gul for Darkbeast Paarl and The One Reborn! Summon locations indicate the characters' backstory, so Yamamura once was at Yahar'gul. I think it is a logical conclusion that this hunter had helped him to run away... or maybe was convinced BY Yamamura to consider his life choices and to run? Was Antal helping the two as well but didn't make it out alive, or he chickened out to run with them and did stay as "passive" rebel? What do you guys think?

Well, the potential backstory aside.. This guy has blond hair and blond (shaved) beard and eyebrows, which I like for an interesting design! He is shaved, not bald. His built sliders are quite big, especially arms at 245 and the chest area at maximal 255. Among other NPCs he excells at Strengtht with 45 (third place amongst NPCs shared with Brador and Yamamura) and Skill (second place, shared with Yamamura and Bestial Hunter). He uses Church Pick and Repeating Pistol; both are Church weapons, like Antal! He is also my favorite Yahar'gul NPC because he is totally forming Detective Gang with Yamamura, Gratia and Simon trust me guys my uncle works at Fromsoft fdhfdhshfd xD

But yes, I think if Antal's cut appearance in Hunter's Nightmare is of any indication, developers decided to make two characters instead of one in the end! Good for them!

Cathedral Ward Hunters

They are the two guys that you fight when approaching the 'normal' entrance to Yahar'gul - a chapel where Patches directs you towards! Just the outside guards of the Yahar'gul. If you also follow there with Henriett summoned, she will help fighting them.

CW Hunter with Tonitrus

He is really frail and old, as you can see. He uses Tonitrus and drops 4 Bolt Papers! I'd say he is the most 'electric' hunter out of everyone we meet, heheh; He is also the only NPC to use Wooden Shield, others who use it as Yharnam Huntsmen enemies!

As it is not an effective thing against the beasts, he maybe simply chosen it because his purpose is to fight people, not beasts. Maybe he also does originally come from regular citizens, and Tonitrus was simply something he took after starting working for Yahar'gul when normally we'd see him with a pitchfork or alike. Finally, he has one of the lowest Bloodtinge stats amongst all NPCs (9), as third weakest, so maybe using shield instead of a gun was a necessity from his blood being too weak to reliably use for the bullets (which are created from the user's blood!). I favour the latter version particularly and I'll also explain why soon!

CW Hunter with Rifle Spear

SURPRISE MOTHERFUCKER fdjfds

Okay, well, this Yahar'gul Hunter uses generic placeholder data, and this is what it looks like xd So his appearance is entirely up to interpretation. He uses Rifle Spear and Ludwig's Rifle, and drops 10 Quicksilver Bullets! I like the fact that both of his weapons are able to shoot! Furthermore his most excellent stat IS Bloodtinge: 35, that puts him on 6th place amongst NPCs (shared place with Brador and Simon). It is very clear what his specialization is, in contrary to his hunting partner! They're like opposites x)

The three Hunters ambush you in Yahar'gul

I guess anyone who had a Skill Issue (like me т.т) remembers THESE guys. I've found them challenging to kill, but at LEAST they do not respawn. Also, in the area where we fight them a previously accessible Lantern is completely smashed after Rom is defeated and can no longer be used! I think it should have been them who smashed it... Maybe after seeing the Moon turning red, they simply knew what was going to happen? Not sure whether they protect Micolash's secrets even past his disappearance or have their own motivation; like I said, it is also possible that after Mensis Ritual the remaining people in Yahar'gul were doing their own thing!

Beast Claw Yahar'gul Hunter

Uh... So yeah, he shares all sliders and stats with the Tonitrus Hunter from Cathedral Ward! I personally like to simply take this idea and make them be twins! But even this aside, his sliders make a lot of sense for me!

Amongst Yahar'gul Hunters, he is the only one wearing a variant of Yahar'gul Helmet without the hood. Moreover, it is the only piece of attire he is wearing, otherwise naked (if you don't count underwear lol)! He uses only Beast Claw and drops the Clawmark Rune (also dropped by Gilbert). What I like about simply reusing these stats is that his physical weakness might be either the result of continuously turning to beasthood or, better yet, the reason why he has to turn to beasthood! If him and Tonitrus Hunter are twins, there might be some physical weakness (or even sickness) shared genetically, and both have to compensate for it somehow!

Despite sharing face data, they have different stats, with this hunter having stronger stats in everything. Most of them could simply be because he is a later game NPC that must be stronger, but the one that stands out is Bloodtinge which is significantly bigger compared to Tonitrus Hunter: 38, that puts him in 5th place amongst other NPCs and is a place shared with other two from the same trio. Super sold on the idea that it is also because of beasthood; he'd need to consume a lot of blood to awaken it, so...

^^^ Interestingly, his weapon yet again is related to the Darkbeasts ('black beast' refers to them in this file)! Although not electric, but it is still fitting to use for someone from Yahar'gul since Paarl is there too!

That rat around the corner Yahar'gul Hunter with the Cane

I honestly remember this guy much more from how he sneaks up on you from behind when you approach the other two hunters from the trio and also spams Tiny Tonitrus attacks than from him using Threaded Cane (and Flamesprayer).. but Cane is what he is commonly referred to with. Also the second Yahar'gul Hunter, together with Antal, that isn't shaved. His built is average, but he has a very strong, visible stripe of a scar on his left cheek. Also rare case of Yahar'gul person that has eyebrows o_o Unacceptable!!!

There isn't much else to say about him, other than the scar is interesting. Also, this trio of hunters mostly shares the stats, with each of them being weaker than the other two at something, and this hunter's weakest stat is Strengtht (14)! Guess he doesn't need it much, since his weapons are long-distance combat! Or maybe he started being very careful after receiving this scar somehow... Or, maybe, he is the smartest one in the trio (he even drops Madman Knowledge) and the Beastclaw Hunter baiting the Paleblood Hunter while he ambushes from the corner was HIS idea. ...and maybe smashing the Lantern was his idea too? Yes, I like the idea that he is just the smartest amongst them and takes the lead as a strategist, and also the most careful.

Yahar'gul Hunter with the Cannon

Okay, this NPC I actually never forget for one minute because he has THE most buff buld amongst ALL NPCs! He is the only character that has chest, abdonmen, arms and legs all at 255! What, you guys thought that Alfred had the biggest tiddies? Compared to this Hunter, Alfred is just a pathetic twink!!!!!! Just look at HIS build for comparison:

(aww he got a belly tho :3 )

But yeah, anyways, this Hunter uses Cannon and Rifle Spear. Very, very powerful shooting force that drops 20 Quicksilver Bullets, and damn, that Cannon is heavy. I am supposed to say "interestingly how both of the weapons he uses are made by Powder Kegs", but....

..turns out that localization team made a MISTAKE, and for some reason attributed it to Powder Kegs! When even the original Japanese script says かつて医療教会の工房が試作した大型銃 ('a large gun that was once invented at the 'medical church' workshop'). Sighhh.... it even makes perfect sense because you do not get the ability to buy this weapon by obtaining Powder Keg hunter badge, you just find it! It makes EXTRA sense because there is a weapon CHURCH CANNON, that was remodelled FROM the original Cannon! AAAAAA WHAT WAS THE POINTTTTTTTTT-

Okay OKAY I am calm now

Yes, all in all, the guy is also very interesting! As an artist I also love that his hair is very dark, almost black, but his eyebrows and beard are brighter brown (darker blond?). I like small details like this! He is also amongst people with THE lowest Arcane stat from all NPCs (8, the last place) and has a very tiny mole on his left side of the nose that is invisible because of the color chosen for it. Awesome.

__________________

Yeah, I think I've covered whatever observations and ideas I've had on these guys. I just really wanted to because Bloodborne is still rich with easily-overlooked NPCs even ten years later! And honestly, not giving them the names is what made it so bad in my opinion... Like for example, imagine how easier it'd be to communicate about and ship the two female Hunters at Research Hall had they only been named internally? Someone could argue that Yurie is "loreless" character, but since she has a name it is easy to identify her, and thus pin down lore implications and make a story. @ Fromsoft please stop giving your obscure NPCs enough to work with and then not give any way to instantly tell them apart besides what weapons they use ;-;

In any case, these guys were kinda hard simply because there is many of them, but at this point I can easily distinguish them 🤔 Maybe someone else will find this post useful or interesting!

#bloodborne #defector antal #yahar'gul hunters #bloodborne observation #bloodborne reference #bloodborne obscure characters #(I knew I'd have to use this tag someday fshfdhs)#(there is just no other way to tell what they are guys don't even have names or distinct titles such as 'djura's apprentice' for example)#use later #not art #text post

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beesmygod · 10 months

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BLOODBORNE LORE Q+A PART 6: the founding of pthumeru, the discovery by byrgenwerth, and the fishing hamlet

part 1

part 2

part 3

part 4

part 5

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BLOCK #LONG POST/ TO NOT SEE THESE HUGE POSTS

shawn asked me a question about the mensis ritual and mergo and the process of trying to answer it in short became a catastrophic failure.

this is going to be a nightmare (hehehuhehehe) to try to explain in broad strokes to people who don't know bloodborne or even to people who do, but i'm going to do my best. anyone who tells you they know what happened or they have "solved" the mensis ritual is a liar. the timeline is muddy and deliberately vague, up to and including how long ago everything happened. i have educated guesswork but that's it.

i will post pure speculation in italics and important nouns in bold. i am peppering this with as many wiki links as possible to back up my claims. not gonna lie this looks like a fucking MAD magazine editor went to town on it or like the timecube website submitted a guest article.

but much like how you need to first make the universe in order to make an apple pie, we must first talk about the history of yharnam before we can talk about its newest resident, mergo.

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untold eons ago, a race known as the pthumerians served the great ones as they slumbered. after becoming exposed to the deliberately vague notion of "the eldritch truth" (it is unclear if this is a specific phenomenon, like the secret to their longevity, or simply the knowledge of the great one's existence), they developed a unique and startling appearance: pallid skin, black eyes, and slacking jaws. i mean, they also lived underground so they look like underground creatures do. either way, they are distinctly inhuman humanoids.

this civilization became lost, but did not die; they continued to serve the "gods" underground, excavating tombs and chambers without rest. over time, they elected a leader, yharnam, pthumerian queen, who was given a ring imbued with special meaning by the great ones indicating her commitment to bearing a special child, a child of blood (the ramifications of this are not known). she still wears the ring today.

arguably, a civil war breaks out in pthumeru, (as evidenced by the armors left by what must have been early cainhurst knights, but i have not looked into this enough to be satisfied) that results in a schism that pushes some pthumerians to the surface, where they become the modern day royalty of cainhurst. the cainhurst royalty and the pthumerian royalty both aspire to have a child of blood and have knights that work explicitly to further this goal, putting them at odds with each other. today's cainhurst royalty maintains some of the "pthumerian look" but not to such an exaggerated degree, with the resemblance fading with each removed generation.

pictured above are the canonical cainhurst royalty and their descendants in order of relation from left to right: annalise, queen of the vilebloods (top left), lady maria (top middle), arianna, woman of pleasure (right; she is also the most distant descendant). the bottom image is concept art of lady maria during her boss fight with a more exaggerated look that did not make it into the game.

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anyway: a bazillion years later or whatever. the cainhurst royals rule over a land that includes the victorian england-ish city of yharnam, named for the forgotten queen of pthumeru. the main appeal of yharnam is its proximity to a university of bold, weird research.

the school of byrgenwerth and its scholars were once an archeological and historical research center. however, during the course of their studies they discovered a vast labyrinth beneath the school where (if the first location they discovered was the same as ours this would be the pthumerian labyrinth) they encountered ancient humanoids, women with the ability to re-animate corpses, an perpetually burning dog who somehow still lives and, most intriguing of all, a creature that defied all understanding. further investigation revealed an unspecified "holy medium", ritual blood, which does not coagulate. this is the ritual blood found in old yharnam on the altar.

further investigation of the labyrinth was halted by the first encounter with a beast. here is a longer post about that encounter and my evidence that leads me to believe it occurred.

this is where things get really fuzzy as to which event happened first. im going to post this part without italics because all the events do happen. its just not clear in what order.

in order to combat these newfound beasts gehrman, a student of byrgenwerth (as he has dialogue where he refers to willem as "master"), took up self-styled arms (the first trick weapons) and became the first hunter. he was followed by a collection of self-styled mercenaries that would come to be known as "the old hunters". there is evidence of the old hunters having once been in the labyrinth as you can summon one to help you fight and the bell descriptions reveal that they were used by the first hunter after discovering them in the labyrinth.

the miraculous healing abilities of the old blood (the origins of which are not specified but i can show you my guesswork later lol) in the labyrinth became known to the students at byrgenwerth. the blood is used to combat the beasts by use of invigorating injections. blood is plentiful and works quickly to heal.

byrgenwerth also begins study and collection of the "phantasms" present (or were once present) in the labyrinth. the discovery of the augur of ebrietas, a slug that summons flailing tentacles of unknown origin, and the arcane properties of pearl slugs drives the school's continued plunges into the depths in spite of the danger posed. part of this research involved discovering the parasitic qualities of these creatures, which could inhabit eyes.

while continuing to investigate the ruins, byrgenwerth became aware of a fishing village where a washed up carcass of a monster was teeming with otherworldly parasites and a stillborn fetus. the parasites had caused the villagers to transform into fish-like monster people not dissimilar to the monster on the coast. the villagers seem alright with this change and actively cultivate millions of the parasites for daily use, such as especially potent lamp oil [1].

upon arrival to the village, the school and its hunters helped themselves to a little bit of genocide just for fun. villager's heads were treppaned open in the search for "eyes on the inside" (a visual metaphor for insight as well as a literal phenomenon) and the monstrous corpse was desecrated by the byrgenwerth researchers who took her child (as the villagers of the fishing hamlet chant) and one of the orphan's three umbilical cords, the one lined with eyes.

i know we find this in a weird place later. we'll get there.

but this wasn't just some pile of fish goo they were fucking with, it was the corpse of the great one, kos (or as some say, kosm). kos's wrath and retribution would come in due time. this event triggered the creation of the hunter's nightmare, a sort of eternal, bloody hell for hunters who participated in the massacre and those who become "blood drunk" where the must relive the event for all eternity. notable hunters trapped in the nightmare from the time of the old hunters include ludwig (not yet notable), laurence (looking awful but he had a busy couple of years before he wound up there), some named NPC hunters such as yamamura and gratia, and lady maria.

lady maria, gehrman's apprentice, could not tolerate her role in the fishing hamlet massacre and threw her beloved weapon into the fishing village well. she, with others, joined laurence when he split from byrgenwerth to found the healing church. its not explicit that the fishing village massacre was the reason for the split, as there were ideological differences (and family matters) brewing that also came to a head, but a one sided genocide seems like a matter that would cause a splinter between one faction that is ruthless in its methods and another that appears to be in the business of healing.

but thats a whole other post.

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uhhh this took a very long time but once im done with this i will never have to type it ever again. the next one covers the healing church in its entirety and should end with the arrival of our hunter in yharnam as the city fully slides into chaos. thank you for reading. or not. its none of my business.

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https://www.reddit.com/r/bloodborne/comments/3uq6wq/interesting_lamp_in_the_hamlet_spoilers_maybe/ which leads to this image: https://i.imgur.com/zVJbcJ2.jpg

#bloodborne #long post/#lore

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fantomette22 · 1 year

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Bloodborne fan fiction: A scholar's dream

Long ago, a group of scholars from Byrgenwerth made an extraordinary discovery in the depths of the city of Yharnam. In the tombs of the ancient gods, they assimilated the eldritch truth of the ancient Pthumerian civilisation and brought back a sacred medium with exceptional properties. It is said to be the blood of the gods. With the goal of ascending humanity and reconnecting with the great ones, their thirst for knowledge leads them to go further and further. However, this wild curiosity led them to repeat the same mistakes as their predecessors. This is how their dreams turned into a nightmare.

Chapter 4: Meeting at Cainhurst

Master Willem and his associates travel to Cainhurst Castle to secure new funding and recruit new students to further explore the Pthumerian Labyrinth.

There it is !!! The long awaited chapter is finally here ! It's Cainhurst time ! // Vous pouvez trouver la version française ici.

#bloodborne #bloodborne fanfiction #fanfiction #part 1 : a scholar’s dream #provost willem #laurence the first vicar #gehrman the first hunter #annalise queen of the vilebloods #cainhurst knight #lady maria of the astral clocktower #lady maria #cainhurst #my art

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katyspersonal · 8 months

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you‘ve probably discussed this, I might have missed it. what do you think laurence’s motivations/goals were for everything he did? would you say he’s morally grey? had good or bad intentions?

I would not be surprised if I already discussed it and forgot myself! I am talking about Bloodborne SO much that I end up not remembering what I've discussed already :') I do think that he is morally grey; his most prevalent intentions were good ones, but I think he had some "badness" about him, mostly in the form of wanting to become the new ruling power in Yharnam! Okay I'll go bit by bit.. or try to.

THE biggest clue I have towards his good intentions is the fact that the holy blood is... well, a thing that heals. Not only we can witness it in the game first by using blood vials, but people do address it, verbally! However, I think the evolution and protection bit is really important here, if not MORE important.

There is a large possibility that beasts started becoming a problem even without the scholars messing with the dungeons! Yharnam stands on the "tombs of gods" that are related to the civilizations that actually messed with the blood first, Suspicious Beggar being unlike any other beast but a Loran one could mean that he inherited beasthood rather than developed it... even the very first Caryll Rune was the howling of the beast, and it is paired with the rune that points out beasthood is inherent for humanity:

We are talking about the setting where magic and aliens are real and where there were "first people" (Pthumerians) who caused irrevercible damage on the mortals in general, so the concerns could be real! My personal headcanon is that concerns over beasthood started to come up because meanwhile Kos was washed on the shore, thus abandoning her own concealment of the Eldrich Horrors; she was like Rom, since Sea and Lake runes refer to the barrier both. 🤔

But, yes, notice that Clawmark refers to the inherent thirst for blood within human nature, whereas Simon sarcastically refers to Healing Church's ministration as "beast cleansing", and Amelia's prayer goes like this:

(Sorry for always ripping excerpts from retranslation document ( x ), I am just incapable of working without it after discovering plenty of mistranslations fsdjhfdhs)

We can get a picture that the point of blood ministration is basically, 'The beastly nature within humans craves blood so it is better to satisfy it with some, but if you are not careful about it, you will just keep wanting more and more blood uncontrollably and become a beast anyways'! That's why people should fear the blood... yet, at the same time, seek it. Just in moderation. I would not say that it is a bad plan, but believing that religious agenda and presenting what were the stakes would be enough to keep people's will power strong is... strangely optimistic? Again, Laurence was a smart person, but he had more faith in humanity than, say, Willem or Micolash.

And at the end, besides healing properties and protection from the curse of beasts (that, again, might be inflicted on humanity genetically in this setting all history concidered), there is evolution factor too! There is a very important bit about Sedative:

Byrgenwerth people started to investigate Eldrich Horrors as soon as they returned from Isz, and also after massacre of Fishing Hamlet! I already talked about how Frenzy is relevant to bloodlust, hunt and Oedon here ( x ) and here ( x ), so it is still tied to 'feed your inner beast some blood so it doesn't rip you from inside'! But also, what could be observed directly was, 'if you peer into cosmic horrors too much you go insane and fucking die'. And ALSO:

Willem, and Byrgenwerth in general, pursued the Insight / Eyes Inside and cosmos as the means to improve the humanity:

So, like... it became plain that whereas the researchers could go insane and die from witnessing too much, they could also... NOT do that, and simply study mysteries of the universe normally - all they needed to do is to sip some blood sometimes! I actually can envision Willem, as well as Choir and Mensis that continue his ideas (albeit twisted) to believe that the "weakest must go"! That if someone died during research - it is a tool for the scientists coming after them, and if someone could not handle it then maybe they were not worthy! Meanwhile, I think initially Laurence disagreed with that and thought it would be better to just sip some blood when it gets hard, and evolution without the blood would simple have too much of a body count, with the "survivors" having lost their humanity (figurally OR literally)!

+ This is also an important observation in my version of lore and timeline, in which Healing Church and Byrgenwerth were one at first and Willem was the 'pope', so they were doing both blood ministration and research for eyes (most notable in Adeline's arc), and later Laurence elbowed Willem away to have more control over his own thing 🤔 This is not the most popular theory but the one I am satisfied with the most, I explained it here: ( x )! (fun fact: creator of that one BB fan manga centered on Lady Maria had that interpretation too! xD I feel validated.)

So yeah, in the conclusion, Laurence had plenty of reasons to put his faith in the blood! Healing, protection and evolution. But whereas the next most influential person (Willem) insisted that it was the worst idea ever, other people who LIKED the blood (Cainhurst nobles) apparently were doing it "wrong". They reveled in blood thirst and curse, whether truthfully or that was the prejuduice. Knowing Soulsborne settings, it was both. There must be the reason Lady Maria distasted it, okay? Maybe Fauxsefka too, if you believe she was one of the OG ones and not taken from Cainhurst as a child. Laurence needed to assert the blood healing, but also to have it as the good thing! A thing that connects you with the gods, whereas protecting and advancing your humanity, not corrupting it!

So, he needed to replace the oligarchy (Cainhurst), but to also not let someone else rise instead! Though I still could write it down as good intentions too, albeit twisted - Laurence could not TRUST someone else to act for the betterment of humanity, as well as to have courage to do sacrifices and morally burdening decisions. He was somewhat arrogant but he had the reasons to be, as a genuinely smart person. In his eyes? Micolash and Rom maybe were "smarter", but at the same time so detached from humanity that he could tell in the end they'd forsaken it, by their own will or unintentionally. And wasn't he right? Well, wasn't he?? Micolash is "You are too stupid to make such decisions" (derogatory), but Laurence is "You are too stupid to make such decisions" (affectionate)! Caryll was his equal intellectually but Laurence could tell he lacked the 'courage' and risk-taking streak (by being unwilling to mess with the blood, first of all). Willem was certainly smart, but not only avoided the blood like Caryll, but Laurence could tell he was prone to "gatekeeping". In Laurence's eyes, the 'peasants' deserved a chance for evolution too (and this is some contrast with his teenage "Sorry hun, I don't speak poor uwu" years xD Character development!).

________________________

Anyways, thank you for this ask very much! I LOVE talking about Laurence, he raised in amongst my favourite characters since recent times.. and also discussing the depth and complexity of his character is just what I need x) Yeah, sadly enough, he was not much better in terms of great sacrifices for his goals and machiavelism than Willem or other scholars he looked down on. But, Laurence believed that when HE did that it was different, because at least his ways were 'productive' xd In his opinion, I mean.

The concept of Laurence who was just evil and selfish asshole that wanted power and religious-ish control over everything does nothing to me :pensive: But, I do think that whereas ensuring his power and theocratical control was a necessity, he could still enjoy what he got even a little! I don't see it as corruption arc from nice and good person to a deranged asshole, but rather from a person with clear ambitious goals and comprehension of what it will cost to... well, a person horrified of the cosmic insight and gods that once guided him and getting obsessed with blood in the exact same way he warned others not to.

#bloodborne #laurence the first vicar #bloodborne theory #bloodborne headcanons #use later #ask replies #damn I love talking about him #he mico and rom all have the same problem for me where I have SO much to say about them that I keep forgetting some details #but this is the general gist of it!

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schrodingersgerbil · 2 years

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Hello! I saw your post about bloodborn being a gothic fantastic horror and how it is very similar to Frankenstein! I am planning to write an essay for my university course on exactly this topic, (Bloodborne being very similar to Frankenstein) and wondered if you'd want to share your thoughts/ elaborate on that post? :)

Hey! So, I am SO glad you asked this question because you gave me a chance to ramble about one of my current fixations. Basically I think Bloodborne (when it doesn’t dive straight into cosmic horror) pulls a lot of narrative tropes from famous works of gothic fiction, ESPECIALLY Frankenstein. I am going to try to fit in some major points but I’m unfortunately leaving out a few for the sake of brevity.

The first major point I want to bring up is the one I posted about, with youths trying to break the natural order and take power that would otherwise belong to the divine. It’s one of the key aspects of both Frankenstein and Bloodborne. The Byrgenwyrth scholars find something in the tombs which allows them to transcend humanity and heal otherwise impossible injuries, but at a terrible cost. Victor Frankenstein, also a college student, does the same thing, attempting to create a “better human” and is successful but it blows up in his face. Both of these are their narrative’s respective “Prometheus,” the one taking the power of the gods and being punished for it. Hubris is the key word for all of this.

Speaking of that punishment, the phrase “More than human, and human no more” which is used in the Japanese game instead of “we are made men by the blood etc etc.” can be used to apply to MANY gothic novel’s protagonists. It applies to Frankenstein’s creation Adam, Carmilla, Count Dracula and his victim Lucy, and Dorian Grey. All of these creatures have transcended some human weakness, such as death, illness, or emotion, but have lost something key about themselves in the process. This is also the case with the Byrgenwyrth scholars, the school of Menses, and the Healing church. They surpass humanity, sure, according to the game Yharnam reaches new heights of culture, art, science, and refinement… all before the beast plague hits. This comes back to the Prometheus motif. If we consider Laurence, due to his flame motif and founding of the healing church, or Gerhman, due to his confinement by the moon presence, as our “Gothic Protagonist,” it is not only them who is punished by the Great Ones but the whole of Yharnam. This parallels Prometheus being chained by the gods but also Humanity being punished with Pandora and her diseases.

Speaking of Pandora and Lucy, another way in which Bloodborne parallels Gothic lit is the treatment of women in the plot. Even “Badass” women like my beloved Eileen and Maria have very little agency in the plot. You have women such as Ariana and Adeline filling the similar role to Lucy in Dracula or Elizabeth in Frankenstein, being the passive victim of supernatural torment due to the actions of others. Maria and the Doll are another case of this, being primarily described in their relationship to Gehrman and their tragic death, rather than in reference to their own life and choices. Finally, on the flip side, women in the game also have a strange connection or link with the supernatural, which is a recurring theme in gothic lit. (Also sexuality but I don’t want this post to get flagged oops.)

Anyway, this is basically my quick and dirty take on the connections between Bloodborne’s overall arching themes and some of the famous Gothic lit it takes inspiration from! The “don’t play god” and visual motifs, as well as many character archetypes really lends itself to gothic horror well. I also would like to point out the thematic connections between Jurassic park and Frankenstein but that’s an essay for another time.

#i am SO sorry this ended up being so long #I’m a grad student and love picking apart lit and history and such #i also have a rant on bloodborne and 19th century spiritualism and eugenics bumbling around in my back pocket thanks to my advisor #bloodborne #gothic lit

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batteryrose · 3 years

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The Original Scholars

bloodborne au and all that

ok so I might as well try to explain my concept on it.. in a vague way similar to how bloodborne’s lore itself is told, bc I think that’s the charm of it and overexplaining wouldn’t give it justice. The game likes to give its lore through item descriptions, so I try to imitate that.

Might update and add to this in the future, look out.

Original scholars

The scholars of the Old College were the first to find advancement in the Higher learning. Their teachings started from their delving of the deep catacomb labyrinths below Paris. It gave them path to the Cosmic knowledge, the insight to realise the existence of the Great Ones.

Old Blood

Deep beneath the labyrinths are the tomb of gods where the old knowledge is found and the blood alongside it. It was the main foundation of the Healing Church, whose conception the result of the breaking up between College scholars, some favouring further use of it while the other complete abstinence.

"The blood has great potent healing properties and also the capability of evolving mankind."

Vlad

Former scholar and the founder of the Healing Church. Forbidden knowledge led him to see the inevitable catastrophe that one day will befall civilization. Thus he believed the Old Blood as a way to transcend humanity, through transfusing it into human bodies. The Church promised a cure of any disease, and citizens flock to them for healing.

Comte of St Germain

Provost of the Old College. Held a great distrust towards the blood that led to the falling out between him and Vlad, and the breaking up of the scholars. Believed further pursuit of the Cosmic knowledge and establishing contact with the Great Ones should be the way of ascension instead.

Leonardo

Close friend of the provost. A dedicated scholar that prefers the field-work side of things. Involved in the discovery of the Fishing Hamlet, folks that worships a stranded Great One who came from the deep ocean. It is rumoured that both the college and the church's pursuits contributed to its desecration, and Leonardo possibly took part in it, being a proficient hunter himself.

The Scrouge of Beasts

The all-healing Old Blood brought a side-effect. Bloodthirsty beasts born out of men started to plague the city, terrorising folks at night. Hunters are deployed by the church to get rid of these beasts, but they soon too become addicted to the blood and hunt itself, continuing the cycle of beasts.

They burned part of the city down and locked the beasts in one place. The church closed their doors after, but its likely they continued their work of ascending humanity in secret, perhaps even more ambitiously.

Meanwhile, the abandoned hunters still looks for preys.

The Dream

A plane of reality materialised by the Moon Presence (a Great One) upon the Comte's eventual successful contact with them. He became tied to the Dream and the Moon through their "contract", with conditions that he never quite understood. This led him to seek more great scholars and men to be binded into the dream too, and figure out the Cosmic will.

Anyone bound to the Dream are unable to truly die, waking up inside it every time they did and can go back to the waking world if they so choose. A mansion stood lonely upon single piece of land. One cannot venture further than this.

One day a strange man showed up inside the mansion, not knowing to agree to any sort of contract. The Comte has long since fell into a mysterious slumber, so he couldn't have invited him here....

#all these excuses when truly #i just havent develop it that deeply yet HJKLASDFA #no really though vagueness is the charm #anyway peace out #ikevamp bloodborne au #ikevamp #ikevamp comte #ikevamp leonardo #ikevamp vlad #ikemen vampire #ikeseries #ikemen series #art

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bimboficationblues · 3 years

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So I’ve been running through the FROM Software games over the past month, here’s thoughts:

Dark Souls (Remastered)

The original Dark Souls really agitated me at first because of the one-two punch of the third and fourth bosses on the standard route, but once I broke through that wall I got really into it. I love the interconnected world and the tactically oriented combat; it really captures a great feeling of both adventure and foreignness.

Thematically I think it’s pretty interesting, even if I’m not sure the narrative is communicated in the best way possible. The player-character is essentially a sacrificial lamb for the powers-that-be (often without even realizing it as the player), and the boss encounters and world-building reveal the ultimate hollowness that stand behind thrones and crowns. Also, the bosses are great! I’ve been keeping track of which ones I’ve enjoyed most throughout the series and the vast majority of my favorites are from DS1; there are some serious low points (most of them in the Demon Ruins), but the high points are incredibly high. It makes me sad that the Remaster didn’t include anything new, like DS2′s Bonfire Ascetics, to allow me to refight Quelaag, Ornstein and Smough, or Artorias the Abysswalker.

The main things that keep me from lavishing DS1 with praise are certain tedious design choices (kindling bonfires, the inability to warp to any bonfire after unlocking warping, the incentives towards turtling up, and the incentives for finding cheap and unexciting ways to defeat bosses) and the truly disappointing last third of the game. The Duke’s Archives is a great level and I have mixed-but-positive feelings on the Tomb of Giants, but the Demon Ruins/Lost Izalith are hideous and full of boring encounters and bad bosses, and the New Londo Ruins is a slogfest from beginning to end (died to the boss? have fun on your way back to it, which requires going down an elevator, up a staircase, across a bridge, past five dragon enemies, through swaths of quick-attacking humanoid enemies that wear black in low lighting, all because there’s no bonfire in the vicinity).

Dark Souls II: Scholar of the First Sin

Dark Souls II is not as bad as it’s made out to be and I disagree with the substance of most of the traditional complaints, but it is still pretty underwhelming. The enemy placements can be frustrating but are generally a good change for people already familiar with DS1′s approach to encounter design; the Shrine of Amana is singled out for this, but it’s really not that bad, especially if you summon for it.

The narrative--a falling into darkness, the cyclical decay and disappearance of states, the direct and observable involvement of Nashandra and the Emerald Herald in the plot--is arguably more interesting than DS1′s, though it takes longer to get off the ground. New quality-of-life changes, like the revised system for weapon durability, are also good. The introduction of new healing items was also helpful, although I disliked having to farm for them sometimes (the inevitable result of a very hard game tying healing items to currency, which is also an issue in Bloodborne).

“Dudes in armor” bosses are good, and DS2 does have some great dudes in armor (specifically the Fume Knight and the Looking Glass Knight), but the problem with DS2′s bosses (irrespective of whether they’re humanoid or monstrous) is that they are not well-served by the game’s camera direction, the arenas they’re in (which are consistently and observably just big empty circles), and their visual designs (which are generally drab). Ornstein and Smough felt like forces of nature, pale shadows of themselves who nonetheless tower over you and will wreck your shit through sheer inertia; their rough equivalents, the Throne Watcher and Throne Defender, feel like beefy standard enemies. Overall I think most of the bosses are “boring but practical,” which is not really what I wanted.

One thing I consider unforgivable in this game is the ruining of the parry system; not only are the timings very weird and hard to pin down, the changing of riposte attacks from a quick, desperate counterattack to a slow, arduous process of executing a prone enemy is really annoying. I would probably have made a parry-centric character as I did in DS1 and taken the time to learn the new attack timings, if it were not for how unrewarding it feels to riposte in DS2.

Dark Souls III

DS2 also makes changes that carry into DS3, namely the ability to warp at the start of the game between any accessed bonfire, the use of a hub world, and the need to regularly return to the hub for leveling up. These are all bad choices imo. Immediate access to warping is probably a good thing, but it instills a sense of relief at being done with a chore, as opposed to the unique atmosphere of curiosity and dread that DS1 instilled. In DS1 I was always excited and fearful to see what I’d run into next; in the sequels I was often hoping to barrel through to the next bonfire. The hub world also contributes to this lack of curiosity, and having to return to it to level up means you never really feel like an adventurer in a strange and terrifying land because you can--and must--just nip back home if things are getting too rough. DS3 is a little better about this with a slightly lower number of bonfires, but not by much. At the same time, DS3 abandons good ideas from its immediate predecessor such as the ability to refight bosses, lifegems, and the “power-stance” for dual-wielding weapons.

DS3 also introduces a god-awful mechanic; in DS1, there’s pretty much no real downside to being Hollow, while in DS2, remaining Hollow after repeated deaths will steadily decrease your max HP. DS3 instead puts a hard cap on your max health. (This is framed as losing a 30% HP “bonus” from being “Embered,” rather than a 30% cap, but they achieve the same basic effect, especially since being human is supposed to be the “base” state. If DS2 did this shit, people would be mad about it.) In general I dislike when these games punish players who are having a difficult time with a section or a boss by making the game even harder (which is also why I’m really not a fan of the PvP system).

DS3 also accelerates some of the frustrating things in encounter design from DS2; not only are there many areas with insane swarms of enemies, but those enemies are all often obscenely fast and hit like a truck. The new Silver Knights (who were some of my favorite foes in DS1) are the worst offenders so far; they were slow and methodical but punishing, but now they’re used as a gank-fight.

Finally, DS3′s narrative is mired in nostalgia-bait. While DS2 asked about Gwyn, Lord of Cinder, “who’s that?”, DS3 acts like Anor Londo was the most important kingdom to ever exist, undermining both previous games’ themes. It doesn’t really feel like it’s telling its own story. So even though DS3 is more technically polished than DS2, and I think definitely has a better selection of bosses and levels, I think it’s the inferior product overall.

Bloodborne

Bloodborne is definitely the most moment-to-moment fun alongside DS1 imo, but is less visually interesting so far compared to the hideous muck of Blighttown, the splendorous ocean of Heide’s Tower of Flame and grim industry of the Iron Keep, or the terrifying, frostbitten beauty of the Boreal Valley. But I also don’t own a PS4, so I only got a third of the way done playing on my friend’s. However, the new approach to warping, the streamlining of the weapons system, the emphasis on parrying, the rallying system, and the increased speed and flow of gameplay are all great developments and I’m excited to explore the game more in future when I’m able to.

Demon’s Souls and Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice

Demon’s Souls is next if I can acquire a PS3 copy (or if one of my friends gets a PS5), and while Sekiro strikes me as very different in kind from the rest of these games, it’s still on my to-play list.

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xenodile · 4 years

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@tainbocuailnge here’s a more complete Bloodborne lore breakdown since you’ve finished the game now:

Byrgenwerth was a college of archaeology and science that regularly sent expeditions into the tombs beneath Yharnam to study the Pthumerians, an extinct precursor race. On one trip they found a “holy medium”, a bowl of ritual blood, through which they communed with the Great One, Formless Oedon. What’s more, the blood that was used for this communion became imbued with supernatural properties, healing sickness and granting enhanced strength when drank or injected.

Provost Willem, headmaster of Byrgenwerth, shifted the focus of studies away from archaeology to learning more about the Great Ones and the “blessings” they may provide. His protege, Laurence, was more interested in the power of the healing blood, and so took his followers back to Yharnam and founded the Church Of Blood Healing, becoming the First Vicar.

The use of blood in medicine and recreation in Yharnam boomed, and all was good, for a time. It wouldn’t last however, as a virulent plague called Ashen Blood swept through the city, killing hundreds and transforming the survivors into hideous malformed beasts.

To deal with this plague, Laurence contacted his friend Gehrman, and asked his help in recruiting warriors to deal with the monsters that now beset Yharnam. Gehrman agreed, becoming the First Hunter, and established a Workshop, where he might train apprentices and develop new weapons and techniques for hunting beasts.

Gehrman and his Hunters took to the streets, slaying and burning beasts, cleansing the city of the Ashen Blood Plague. The charred district where the beasts were corralled for slaughter became known as Old Yharnam, and was sealed off and forgotten.

While the sickness was dealt with, the beasts were not. New, more gruesome transformations persisted across Yharnam, and new measures had to be taken. Laurence enlisted the help of Ludwig, who established the Church Workshop, training specialized Church Hunters to combat the ever large and more terrible beasts.

But even with more Hunters and more weapons, things in Yharnam only became progressively worse, as the Great Ones that Byrgenwerth and the Church so carelessly called on began to exert greater influence, indifferent to the fates of the mortals whose world they toyed with. So Laurence beseeched the gods for assistance. He gained the attention of a nameless Great One inhabiting the moon, which came to Yharnam and created The Hunter’s Dream. The Dream pulled the Night of the Hunt into a sort of suspended time, a world between worlds, and gave the Hunters a place of refuge where they could rest and fight beyond their mortal limits, ensuring that no matter how horrific the Hunt became, Hunters could continue to fight and see things through to end so long as they had the will to continue.

The Dream emboldened Hunters and allowed them to combat the worst the Hunt had to offer, but Gehrman was trapped within it, unable to awaken or escape. Laurence vowed he would end the Beast Plague, the Hunt, and the Dream, but sadly, he himself fell to corruption and transformed into the first Cleric Beast shortly afterwards. Ludwig fell soon after.

Fearing the collapse of the world under the influence of the Great Ones, Willem conducted a dangerous ritual to convert of his fellow scholars into an artificial Great One. The result was Rom, the Vacuous Spider, whose existence served as a kind of shield to lessen the power the other Great Ones could exert on Yharnam. Though the ritual was successful, the exposure to the Eldritch Truth left Willem braindead.

With their leadership broken, the factions in Yharnam went mad. Byrgenwerth split into the Choir and College of Mensis as they delved further into madness and moral depravity. The Choir viewed the Great Ones from a scientific perspective, seeing them as no more than animals that could be used and exploited to elevate humanity, or rather themselves, to new heights. The College of Mensis, lead by Micolash, took a more religious point of view, seeing the Great Ones as gods who could help them transcend the limits of mortality through prayer and ritual worship.

The Choir took over the Church in Ludwig and Laurence’s absence, while Mensis snuck into the dark corners of Yharnam and established Yahar’gul, the Hidden Village. Under the Choir’s leadership, the Church Hunters were divided into factions, the Executioners, the Preventative Hunters, and the Harrowed Hunters, and were converted into the Church’s secret police more than proper Hunters.

Meanwhile, Mensis began abducting citizens of all types for use in grisly occult rituals that they might recreate Willem’s ritual of producing artificial Great Ones, and call upon yet undiscovered Great Ones to receive their blessings.

This cycle continued many times, with countless Hunts repeating night after night, as Hunters continued to struggle and fight to contain the ever growing threat of the Beast Plague, eventually falling to Plague themselves, or losing themselves in the Dream.

And then one day, just before sunset, a foreigner arrives in Yharnam, seeking its vaunted healing blood to cure some wasting sickness. Upon receiving a transfusion of healing blood, they are pulled into Hunt.

#long post #Bloodborne spoilers

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trebaolsmovingcastle · 3 years

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As somebody who has never even looked at anything dark souls like, let alone bloodborne itself. whut?

So...with Dark Souls you’re theoretically tasked with saving the world by perpetuating this age of fire. Realistically though that is actually kinda a bad thing because it serves the interests of the ruling gods of the world. Darkness, darkness is the essence of humanity in Dark Souls...and not like...evil, but the in game universe image of an Age of Dark that is the opposite of the Age of Fire...so an age of man instead of God.

Bloodborne is...an ancient race called the Pthumerians made contact with cosmic slugs who indifferently launched them into a golden age. In their pursuit of ascension to their own godhood they discovered that imbibing the blood of these cosmic beings, and their kin, could cure all diseases and prolong life. However there is a war in heaven, and blood also changes you, it opens you up to ancient truth and wisdom, and for those unprepared incurs beasthood.

Pthumeru falls. Yharnam is built by people on top of the ruins, the Yharnamites live and work while the tombs are investigated, until discoveries by the local university introduce the idea of blood imbibing to cure ailments and elevate the mind. In conjunction with this the concept of ‘eyes’ wisdom, but also literal cosmic eyes, become important, as a mind that is lined figuratively and literally with eyes will allow connection to the cosmos. The university pursues this knowledge to a terrible end, murdering and experimenting on an entire fishing village who had fallen under the watch of a deceased great one.

The curse laid upon the scholars, and their descendants, creates a pocket reality to which all of these figures are trapped, an eternal damnation to live and die over and over as spiritual manifestations of their guilt.

The university takes this knowledge of arcane truths and plunges deep into the catacombs beneath yharnam where the idea of blood ministration is rediscovered. The university splits, between those that believe there is a way to ascend via knowledge and ritual, and those that believe the clarification of blood and its uses will cause humanity to become cosmic entities.

From that point the Healing Church is founded, and likewise sees a promulgation of hunters, citizens who fight the monsters that rise up from the ancient Pthumerian ruins, but since the arrival of the Healing Church have begun to appear in greater numbers within Yharnam itself.

The Healing Church attempts to commune with a variety of entities who may be sympathetic to them, most specifically Ebrietas, daughter of the cosmos, who the church experiments upon and attempts to find pathways towards ascension through. The Church schisms again, seeing the scholars of Mensis attempt to create an ascended plane of existence via a ritual involving the scholars and elaborate cages for their heads. This kills all the scholars...and much of the town, transporting them into a nightmare version of it where the lead scholar rules and continues to beckon the Moon to Yharnam.

The problem is this moon ritual does indeed beckon the moon presence, whos proximity to Yharnam drives the city, now drunk on blood ministration which has outpaced liquor sales in the city, to madness and the townsfolk largely transform into beasts much as what happened to the ancient Pthumerians who had originally convened with the ancient beings of the cosmos.

As this has occurred the remnants of the university conduct a ritual, transforming one of their own into an abomination that acts as a bulwark against the moon presence, protecting yharnam but plunging the world into a state inside and outside of time. The city has become an ideological battleground between cosmic creatures who either are indifferent to one another or actively hate one another. These great ones seek a child however, as they are incapable of reproducing, so through their own means and bizarre machinations attempts are made to create a new great one in Yharnam.

Your goal...seek paleblood, transcend the hunt. If you do good, you eat some umbilical cords and become a slug that no longer worries about its humanity, but also spares Yharnam the suffering of being an eternal battleground between ancient gods.

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tacetnix · 1 year

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@yellowfingcr replied to your post: // MAN ;--; Hey? I Cry

---- "..........were my descriptions that horrid..? That.. they'd make you cry..?"

Mary sleepily turns over, taking a deep breath and huffing. Her voice slips back into its natural, native, Yharnamite accent. "..you'd seen the same things... it don't make not a lick'v sense ta me."

#yellowfingcr #Scholar of the Tombs of Gods | Bloodborne #Going Nonverbal! | IC

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woolishlygrim · 4 years

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So here’s a thing that has probably been done before but also maybe been done worse: The timeline of Bloodborne.

Like … more or less any Soulsborne game, tbh … Bloodborne is remarkably laconic with its storytelling, leaving a lot of gaps but, more importantly, leaving a lot of stuff that isn’t directly stated but which can be reasoned out if you kind of take a step back from looking at things in terms of a set of facts to be fitted together, and instead look at things in terms of a set of causes and effects, if that makes sense. It’s not thing happens, thing happens, thing happens, it’s thing happens, and since we know who does that thing and what motivates them later on, we can reason out how that thing would then lead on to another thing.

...

Anyway. Timeline.

Massive trigger warning for … hoo boy. References to violence, references to stillbirth and dead infants, references to sexual assault, and references to suicide. Jfc, Bloodborne.

-- So, at some point in the distant, distant past, almost prehistoric, the Isz Civilisation (likely the city of Isz) flourishes in a particular coastal spot on a northern archipelago. The Isz aren’t originally from this place, they hail from somewhere else: Rather, they choose this site for their new city because it is a place within the waking, physical world that passes uncommonly close to the world of dreams.

-- In time, the people of Isz (or at least some of its people) cease to be human, or at least humanoid. We know that they were humanoid at some point, because the Isz labyrinths are laid out for humanoid creatures, but at some point they ascend, and this is likely a deliberate choice on their parts.

-- The mechanism of their change isn’t explicitly spelled out, but since we see in-game one example of a human ascending in a similar fashion, and a great many failed attempts to ascend, we can kind of tease out a rough idea of how it works, namely that it involves gaining more insight into the eldritch truth, and mutations of the blood. Either way, they become the Great Ones, godlike beings who are wholly alien but nonetheless kind and sympathetic in spirit. Every Great One is unique: While they are a species, they are a species that shares no commonalities, with every individual functionally its own species.

-- At some point, the Great Ones ascend in a different way: Their bodies enter an eternal sleep, while their spirits ascend to the dream and nightmare realms. One of them, Ebrietas, is left behind. While it’s never made clear why, the references to her as ‘abandoned’ and ‘left behind’ imply that she didn’t choose to stay behind.

-- Now absent of people, Isz falls to ruin. In time, however, a new civilisation is built on the wreckage: The city of Loran. A desert city despite the coastal location of Isz, we know little about Loran, only that at some point they found the slumbering bodies of the Great Ones (perhaps guided by Ebrietas, as others would be later). They take blood from the Great Ones, blood which can be used to strengthen a person, or heal any injury or sickness.

-- In time, the Beast Plague strikes Loran. At certain times, as the Great Ones brush close to the waking world, those who have imbibed too much of their blood are transformed into monstrous beasts. This is the first time the Beast Plague appears, but it’s not really a plague, not in the truest sense. As we see later on, the more insight into the eldritch truth one has, the more complex, strange, and alien a person’s beastly transformation is, the more they keep their mind in the process, or may even find themselves elevated: Because the Beast Plague isn’t a disease, it’s a mutation. It’s the act of ascending, spurred on by the blood of the Great Ones, to a new form, falling far short of being a Great One but nevertheless becoming something more than human.

-- Nevertheless, Loran falls. In time, the Beast Plague overtakes it, and only monsters remain. The city is swallowed by the sands, and the region goes dormant once again.

-- In time, though, the Pthumerians happen across the same site. It seems likely that the Pthumerians were human, or at the very least human-like, at one point, but they don’t remain that way for long. Anyway, on the ruins of Loran which is in turn upon the ruins of Isz, the city of Pthumeria Ihyll is built.

-- The Pthumerians are wiser than the people of Loran, in a way, or at least more curious. While the people of Loran careless imbibed the blood of the Great Ones, the Pthumerians study, becoming more knowledgeable of the eldritch truth (most likely, once again, under the guidance of Ebrietas). Eventually, they make contact with the Great Ones, and form a kind of friendship with them.

-- An alliance is born. The Great Ones guide the Pthumerians, elevating their civilisation and helping them achieve inhuman forms, less than a Great One but greater than a human, and still keeping their minds. In return, the Pthumerians guard the tombs of the Great Ones, where their bodies slumber. The Pthumerians do seem to eventually partake of the Great Ones’ blood as part of their semi-ascension, but they do not appear to suffer from the Beast Plague (at first), and they seemingly gain a kind of immortality.

-- At some point, a great queen of Pthumeria Ihyll, Queen Yharnam, enters into a marriage with Oedon, a Great One who lacks any kind of physical form (and, it’s worth noting, the only male Great One we ever hear about). The two of them conceive a child together, Mergo. This, we are told, is a preoccupation of the Great Ones, and perhaps not the first time it happens, for each Great One longs for a child, each Great One searches for a surrogate to bear it, but each Great One finds their child stillborn.

-- Mergo, the daughter of Oedon and Yharnam, is no different, born already dead, but there are signs that something truly horrible happened to Yharnam. Her lingering spirit can be seen handcuffed, her body apparently cut open to remove Mergo. Whatever the Pthumerians did at the moment of Mergo’s birth, it was traumatic and violent, and Yharnam does not seem to be a willing participant.

-- Nevertheless, Mergo is stillborn, as all infant Great Ones are. While dead, Mergo is still a god, however, and even a dead god exerts its will upon the world around it. A Pthumerian woman is, through the power of the Great Ones, elevated to a higher form (not, it would seem, a Great One, but something startlingly close), and becomes Mergo’s wet nurse and protector. A nightmare is created to cradle Mergo.

-- After this, Pthumeria Ihyll falls. It’s not entirely clear why, save that eventually they, like Loran, found themselves suffering from the Beast Plague, which consumed their civilisation much as it had Loran. It is speculated in passing that the Great Ones, in spite of their sympathetic and kind nature, may have severed their alliance with Pthumeria Ihyll, withdrawing their support.

-- Time passes. Eventually, humans of the College of Byrgenwerth attempt expeditions into the ruins of Pthumeria Ihyll, and in time a city, named Yharnam for the Pthumerian queen, springs up atop the ruins of Pthumeria Ihyll (which is built upon Loran, which is built upon Isz). Byrgenwerth, led by Master Willem, is primarily interested in learning to perceive more of the eldritch truth, to elevate their minds.

-- However, Laurence, a student of Master Willem, discovers the slumbering Great Ones, and the properties of their blood. While Willem abhors the idea of using the blood, Laurence is fascinated by the idea that they might achieve ascension a far quicker way. He splits from Byrgenwerth, taking several scholars with him, and forms the Healing Church, distributing the blood as a miracle cure.

-- Laurence found allies in this endeavour, of a sort. Micolash, another former student of Byrgenwerth, created the School of Mensis within the Healing Church, devoted to making contact with Mergo. Another scholar, whose name is unknown but who would later take the name Iosefka, establishes the Choir, a section of the Church which, under the guidance of Ebrietas, would endeavour to study ascension without the use of blood. Another student, Gehrman, meanwhile, would keep his distance from the Church -- but when the Beast Plague struck, as it struck every civilisation that abused the Great Ones’ blood, he became the first Hunter, and established the Hunter’s Workshop.

-- At some point, the noble house of Cainhurst take up residence near Yharnam. Their relationship with the Yharnamites is fraught, to say the least, and they covet the Great Ones’ blood.

-- Gehrman takes several early apprentices: Maria, a scion of the Cainhursts; Izzy, a scientist who is fascinated by the beasts; the Crow of Cainhurst, who styles himself as a hunter-of-hunters; Eileen, a woman who would also, in time, come to style herself as a hunter of hunters; Djura, who is dreadfully kind and terribly foolish; and Ludwig, a cleric of the Healing Church who was possessed of an ancient, magical sword, possibly even a relic of Isz, which was both weapon and mentor to him.

-- For all of the Hunter’s Workshop’s goals in containing the Beast Plague, they rapidly find themselves unable to contain it, and their organisation spirals into chaos. Ludwig breaks away from the Workshop to form the Church hunters, recruiting mobs of regular townspeople, but also empowering the Church to form a secret police of sort, a cadre of hunters who were permitted to hide among the populace and strike with impunity if they believed they saw the signs of plague. Maria, for reasons unknown, steals a sample of the Great Ones’ blood and delivers it to the Cainhursts. Their own experiments yield the Vilebloods, an ‘impure’ breed of humanity led by the immortal Queen Annalise, who sets about feeding on the blood of hunters in the hopes that doing so will let her conceive a ‘child of the blood’ with Oedon. The Crow, afflicted by the beast blood, goes mad. Eileen and Djura, both disillusioned with Gehrman, begin to drift away from the Workshop, with Djura gathering his own band of hunters. While Izzy’s fate is unclear, we know that they were a threat to the Church, and were most likely killed.

-- A war breaks out between the Cainhurst Vilebloods and the Executioners, a fanatical sect of the Church committed to wiping them out. The war ends when Logarius, leader of the Executioners and seemingly a man of Pthumerian extraction, dons a crown of illusion and separates Castle Cainhurst from Yharnam. Unable to die by natural means, likely owing to his Pthumerian blood, Logarius begins an endless vigil.

-- At some point, Gehrman and the College of Byrgenwerth discover a fishing hamlet in a symbiotic relationship with Kos, a Great One. In the name of learning more about how to reach the eldritch truth, the Byrgenwerth scholars visit horrifying experiments on the people of the hamlet, cutting them open and carving open their skulls to examine their brains, seemingly while they still lived.

-- Gehrman, facing a losing war against the Beast Plague, and with most of his apprentices and allies having abandoned him in one form or another, does something worse. While it isn’t entirely clear how he does it, since Kos’ physical shape is a gigantic nudiform, he seemingly manages to impregnate Kos in what appears to be an attempt to create an undying, perfect hunter, equipped to kill both beasts and Great Ones.

-- Kos perishes and washes up on the shore of the hamlet. From her dead body emerges the Sweet Child of Kos, the son of Kos and Gehrman. He is ‘wizened’ upon birth, and either born dead or dies of old age shortly thereafter.

-- Responding to the wishes of the people of the hamlet, though, the Sweet Child of Kos, dead but, like Mergo, still able to wield the power of a god, creates a nightmare realm, the Hunter’s Nightmare, and curses every hunter: When they die or lose their minds, they drift into the Hunter’s Nightmare, there to engage in an endless, maddening hunt.

-- The fishing hamlet is destroyed, whether by Byrgenwerth or, perhaps, by simply being transported wholesale into the Hunter’s Nightmare. In disgust at Byrgenwerth and Gehrman, Maria casts her blade, Rakuyo, into a well. She later dies, although it’s unclear exactly how -- but the available evidence points to suicide.

-- In Yharnam, confidence in the Church begins to fail, driven not least by the fact that clerics of the Church, who have more knowledge of the eldritch truth, become the most powerful and most vicious beasts.

-- The situation in Yharnam goes from bad to worse. Perhaps seeking to re-establish the authority of the Healing Church after confidence in the healing blood has been eroded by the Beast Plague, Laurence and the Church poison the water supply of Old Yharnam, and then approach the people of the district with the offer of the blood as a cure. The result is an outbreak of the Beast Plague unlike anything ever seen before. Desperate, the Church and Gehrman seal off Old Yharnam and send in Djura and his Powder-Keg Hunters to burn it and everyone in it.

-- On the same night, Ludwig succumbs to the Beast Plague, transforming into a horrible beast as his mind is shunted into the Hunter’s Nightmare. He is killed, but without his guidance, the Church Hunters fracture, with some of them being absorbed by the Choir and the rest of them becoming little more than a roaming mob.

-- Laurence succumbs to the plague not long after. While his mind takes the form of an ever-burning Cleric Beast within the Hunter’s Nightmare, his body becomes the Bloodletting Beast. While it is decapitated in a battle against Brador, a Church Hunter in the employ of the Choir, it survives this decapitation and flees into the remains of Pthumeria Ihyll. It is never caught.

-- With Yharnam in chaos, and his first plan to create an undying hunter a failure, Gehrman uses the Sweet Child of Kos’ umbilical cord to summon a Great One. The Great Ones are sympathetic in spirit, and so his pleas are answered by Flora, the Moon Presence. The Moon Presence creates for Gehrman the Hunter’s Dream, a dream-realm version of the Workshop. Hunters who are drawn into the Hunter’s Dream can venture out into the waking world as dreams, ensuring that no matter how many times they die, they can always return. But the Moon Presence also imprisons Gehrman in the Dream, to act as its guardian and to guide new hunters.

-- Several hunters are brought into the Dream and allowed to hunt without fear of death. Djura is one, and Eileen is another. Eventually, Gehrman frees each of them from the Dream, an act which also cuts off their ability to dream altogether (and perhaps saves them from the Hunter’s Dream).

-- At Byrgenwerth, a woman chooses to ascend to the very brink of being a Great One, but the imperfect process destroys her mind. The resulting being, Rom the Vacuous Spider, dwells beneath the Byrgenwerth lake, using its powers to shield Yharnam from the encroachment of the Great Ones’ dream realms, and obscure the truth.

-- Djura’s nephew is struck by a terrible illness, most likely the Beast Plague, but seems to recover from it as something uncannily similar to a Great One. Djura has him smuggled out of Yharnam. His spirit broken by his long career as a hunter, the events with his nephew, and the razing of Old Yharnam, Djura retreats to the ruins of Old Yharnam, there to protect the beasts still living in it.

-- At some point, the School of Mensis succeeds in achieving an audience with Mergo. In doing so, they kick off a resurgence of the Beast Plague. The Player Character, drawn to Yharnam to ‘seek paleblood,’ is drawn into the Hunter’s Dream, as Gehrman’s latest hunter, tasked with finding and killing (or ‘killing’ as the case may be) the infant Mergo.

-- The Player Character kills Rom, removing the last line of defense against Mergo’s influence. The Beast Plague erupts into an even more cataclysmic form. Without Rom to shield Yharnam, Oedon impregnates two women -- the fake Iosefka, who had been attempting to conceive a child with him, and Arianna, a descendant of Annalise who, it would seem, was impregnated with the child Annalise had wished for, as Oedon, being formless and alien, cannot distinguish the difference between them. Neither woman survives the birth, and their children are born dead.

-- The Player Character eventually finds their way to the Nightmare of Mensis, the nightmare realm made to cradle Mergo. Killing Micolash, they proceed onwards to eventually kill Mergo’s Wet Nurse. Without her nurse to nurture her, the dead Mergo finally passes from the world, her long suffering finished. Queen Yharnam bows to the Player Character in thanks, then departs as well.

-- Returning to the Hunter’s Dream, the Player Character confronts and kills Gehrman. The Moon Presence descends, and the Player Character, now grasping almost the entirety of the eldritch truth, and having consumed a massive amount of blood (along with the umbilical cords of four Great Ones -- Mergo’s, the Sweet Child of Kos, Arianna’s child, and Iosefka’s child) battles and defeats it. Consuming it, the Player Character abandons their form as a human and is reborn as an infant Great One -- the first, and only, infant Great One to be born alive.

-- While much of Yharnam is destroyed, there are survivors. Perhaps better for them, there is now a Great One who may yet understand humanity, cradled in the Hunter’s Dream, and when it is grown it will guide humanity towards ascension.

#bloodborne

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occultdigest · 6 years

Text

Consider this a vague intro of sorts for Tib, Sliabh, and Amadeus. If you gave my three hunter folk here their own vague story

Bloodborne: Revelations

The Fox and the Hound are a duo well known in Yharnam for their love for violence and chaos. Powerful fighters on their own, it is when they are together that they form a unconquerable killing machine. When tales of mystery and horror (and most importantly riches) are said to be found in the Chalice Dungeons of the city, they set out to conquer these new lands and carve their names deeper into the flesh and bones of Yharnam.

Tiberius “Tib” Rex The Fox

“Back home, they say “Murder is the most honourable of sins”, and I like to think of myself as an honourable man...”

Tib is what happens when a violent man has never faced any sort of misfortune in his life. An infamous bodysnatcher and murderer, he has managed to avoid any sort of punishment and karma on his journey of bizarre carnage. Thanks to this, Tib has built up an inhuman sense of self-righteousness and gross overconfidence that makes him impossible to take down and impossible to shut up. The one thing that gives him almost as much pleasure as murder is a good performance. Be it playing the fiddle for a lively party or singing after the slaughter, Tib loves to draw crowds and play to an audience, even if it is just his partner in crime. After running far from his birthplace, he has found a special sort of home in Yharnam. It’s a city built on blood and violence and bad people, and those are some of Tib’s favourite things...

Sliabh Donard The Hound

“I am not the Wheel, I am the Hand that Turns the Wheel”

Do not let her soft voice and calm demeanor lull you into a false sense of security, Sliabh Donard is the personification of harsh power and control. With an iron hand and a sharp intellect, she can take command of any situation she’s in and will stay in charge for as long as she feels is needed. The moment the reigns are ripped from her hands, Sliabh’s calmness is shattered and her infamous visceral rage takes over and one can only hope for a quick death at that point. Although she may come off as a villainous individual, she has a peculiar sense of justice that can spare even the most unfortunate of souls. Sliabh is judge, jury, and executioner, and she will deliver the cruelest divine wrath God will allow...

In their preparation for tomb prospecting, Tib and Sliabh come across the perfect individual to show them the research and maps that will guide them on their journey, a hapless Mensis Scholar who is possibly the only survivor of the school’s meeting with Mergo. When he isn’t leading them through tedious arcane rituals, Amadeus is forced to act as bait for whatever horrible plan the duo has in store.

Amadeus Mattheus Edison Mensis Scholar

“Drastic measures must be taken, but I will try to make this as painless as possible!”

Amadeus is a gentle man who’d much rather bury himself into a medical book the be thrown into the fray. He unfortunately is rather squeamish and weak-willed, which makes him a poor traveling companion for Hunters who revel in the gore and mess they create. Amadeus a very well-read student who has published several studies that were quite well received by his peers and even the school’s headmaster, although this research he conducts is quite grim. In an attempt to study the strange phenomenon of “Insight” and “Second Sight”, Amadeus has toured in many surgical theaters experimenting on the brains of victims from Mensis’ harvesting of the Unseen City, with some of these people still very much awake. Considering how messy surgery is and how disturbing his line of research, one would think it would clash with his disgust of murder and mayhem, but Amadeus keeps his chin up and puts on a brave face. After all, “Evolution without courage will be the ruin of our race."

#my characters #my stuff #Bloodborne #Maybe #long post #blood #eyes #trypophobia

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fantomette22 · 1 year

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it's finally here ! The 3rd Chapter of the Bloodborne fic !

And the link in French :

#bloodborne #bloodborne fanfiction #part 1 : a scholar’s dream #gehrman the first hunter #patches the spider #laurence the first vicar #runesmith caryll #provost willem #byrgenwerth #graveguard dores #gatekeeper liam #more cool stuff 👀#i promised next chap is not at Byrgenwerth for once lol

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domandeve22 · 2 years

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paleblood-skyler · 6 years

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Understanding Bloodborne, Option A: Moon Presence is Oedon.

During my exhaustive observation of Bloodborne’s fantastic community (seriously, the friendliest and cleverest I’ve ever seen), a surprisingly limited amount of Big Picture theories and variations have ever come to my attention. They often work off of the ideas or assumptions presented by the more prominent “lorehunters,” and subsequently become rather homogeneous. Now I’d like to explore for myself what seem to be the most important ideas from which all others might branch. In an attempt to cover the most ground with the simplest conclusions, I’ll be using the identity of the Moon Presence to explore two major trains of thought, starting with the one that is bafflingly entertained the least (due to a single adjective that, with Kos as my witness, I will work around).

Note: The Old Hunters will temporarily be considered “optional content” for these Oedon-centric theories. The Hunter’s Nightmare elucidates a LOT of Truth of course, but I’ll be reserving it for future theory extensions which I’m greatly looking forward to.

So, Option A. The Moon Presence is Oedon. This was the conclusion I naturally came to back in 2015, before exposure to the online community. Option A has a lot of what I think is really compelling evidence, but keep in mind that each train of thought will reveal very different themes and takeaways for the overall story. You may prefer one theory over another not due to facts but because of what you feel the story is about. Regardless, here’s the reasoning and consequences for Option A.

“Human or no, the oozing blood is a medium of the highest grade, and the essence of the formless Great One, Oedon. Both Oedon, and Oedon’s inadvertent worshippers, surreptitiously seek the precious blood.” - Oedon Writhe Rune

Alright, let’s tackle the big question first. If Oedon is consistently referred to as the Formless Great One, how could he possibly be the moon-dwelling physical thing we brutalize with a [brutal hunter weapon]? “Formless” is the one detail that sticks out to people about Oedon, and the immediate discounting of this possible identity of the Moon Presence means that people miss an entire way to interpret the story. It’s incredibly important to entertain a shift in perspective here, an embrace of the dream logic that this game clearly operates on. According to the description above, Oedon is a presence. A force. He may traditionally be described as formless, but he’s still a legitimate Great One that is so powerful that he is considered to be everywhere and nowhere, with blood as his essence. A literal god of blood.

Consider Oedon Tomb where we find Gascoigne. This is a fully-realized tomb featuring a statue of a physical idea of Oedon, surrounded by gravestones. This is a graveyard, and it’s difficult to imagine a graveyard dedicated to a figure that’s still considered among the living. When paired with the ideas that Mergo is formless after stillbirth, persisting in voice, and the Wet Nurse is likely the formless spirit of a dead Great One (given the ghostly effects and siderite weapons), it may be extrapolated that Oedon is persisting in spirit after death. Given the statue and the nature of other Great Ones, it’s conceivable that Oedon once had a physical form, and if we learned anything about the dream, it’s that dead things can survive in it. (See: Micolash, Laurence, and Maria.)

“In the age of the Great Ones, wedlock was a blood contract, only permitted to those slated to bear a special child.” - Ring of Betrothal

“Every Great One loses its child, and then yearns for a surrogate, and Oedon, the formless Great One, is no different. To think, it was corrupted blood that began this eldritch liaison.” - One Third of Umbilical Cord (from Arianna’s celestial child)

Now if we have a god of blood, it’s important to know how exactly he has his power in the present age of Yharnam. Back in the Pthumerian days when eldritch contact was prevalent, Queen Yharnam was selected to bear a Child of Blood, a pairing with Oedon himself. This wasn’t just because she had a special ring, but because she would come to have compatible blood for bearing such a child. (See: Queen Annalise in the modern day attempting to bear a Child of Blood, imbibing countless blood dregs in an attempt to gain that compatible blood type.) However, every potential Great One child is lost, either due to death or separation, and Yharnam’s baby Mergo died in stillbirth, becoming formless like their father.

“Well, once a group of young Byrgenwerth scholars discovered a holy medium deep within the tomb. This led to the founding of the Healing Church, and the establishment of blood healing.” - Albert

And when Byrgenwerth eventually pillaged the ruins of Pthumeru like the fishing village before it, they found and bound the immortal remains of Yharnam, from whom they discovered and extracted Old Blood. The miraculous blood of Oedon which would lead to the founding of the Healing Church. Provost Willem foresaw the dangers of imbibing the blood of a dead god, turning his attention away from blood altogether and instead focusing on inner eyes, but this didn’t keep Laurence from leaving the college with Old Blood in tow.

“Runesmith Caryll, student of Byrgenwerth, transcribed the inhuman utterings of the Great Ones into what are now called Caryll Runes.” - Rune Workshop Tool

“The Great One Oedon, lacking form, exists only in voice...” - Formless Oedon Rune

So we have a Great One, a god of blood, who was at least at one time considered to be the greatest of the great (see: Oedon Chapel, the only place of worship dedicated to a single god), who now only exists in voice. His whispers echoing across the dreamlands, likely enhanced by the mass imbibing of his special medium, were heard the loudest by Caryll the Runesmith. This idea is strengthened by the fact that Oedon is the only Great One to have runes named after him, which only makes sense given that runes are “inhuman utterings” and Oedon is the most prominent vocal presence in the dream. In fact, with the power of that voice, it’s likely that many of Caryll’s runes were transcribed straight from Oedon’s own voice. These runes include the Hunter’s Mark itself, which a Great One used to brand us as hunters of the dream, as well as “several runes [that] relate to ‘Blood.’” This is important for what’s up ahead, a link between Oedon’s blood runes and the Moon.

“When the red moon hangs low, the line between man and beast is blurred. And when the Great Ones descend, a womb will be blessed with child.” - Note in Byrgenwerth

Okay, there’s a lot stemming from this one note. We have a few connections, including the first tangible connection between blood and the moon. This, paired with the fact that the Moon rune grants more blood echoes, gives the sense of some twisted relationship. And not only does this note reveal a causal relationship between the blood moon and outbreaks of the scourge of beasts, but also between the blood moon and invisible impregnation, made most obvious by Arianna’s fate. The nightmarish celestial child she gave birth to below Oedon Chapel was, in fact, one of many of Oedon’s attempts to create a surrogate child since losing Mergo (see: earlier Oedon-heavy description of the Third Cord from this child). And this came directly from the unveiling of the blood moon, a symbol we will see is synonymous with Oedon, and by extension, the Moon Presence. But first let’s unpack that earlier connection, between the blood moon and the scourge of beasts. This will involve the very origins of the dream, which will be much further explored in research on The Old Hunters.

“The nameless moon presence beckoned by Laurence and his associates. Paleblood.” - Note in the Lecture Building

First, about Paleblood. Now there are many dream-logic connections to be made between Oedon and Paleblood, but the clearest is a cause and effect seen at the very start and end of the game. “Seek Paleblood to transcend the hunt.” If transcending the hunt means becoming an infant Great One and earning humanity a new childhood, then seeking Paleblood is defined by our encounter with and the slaying of the Moon Presence-- i.e. the creature that comes from the blood moon, well-established as the symbol of Oedon. Beyond this cause and effect, we also have, “Behold! A Paleblood sky!” This Yahar’gul note becomes relevant once the blood moon appears, unmasked by Rom’s death. In a rare moment of director Hidetaka Miyazaki speaking on the story, he mentions that the idea behind Paleblood was the pale color of the sky as if it’d been drained of blood. And what could have drained the sky of blood? The looming blood moon, a celestial sponge now exuding its highest cosmic strength. So in this respect, Paleblood represents the absence of Oedon’s blood power, the blood having been drained from the sky as a manifestation of his greed. Thus, seeking Paleblood entails the defeat of Oedon, the elimination of his blood power, which would end the scourge of the beast and afford humanity its freedom, a new childhood. And now if we play along with the idea that the Moon Presence is Oedon, a lot of interesting consequences for the story arise.

“The Third Umbilical Cord precipitated the encounter with the pale moon, which beckoned the hunters and conceived the Hunter’s Dream.” - Third Umbilical Cord (from the Abandoned Old Workshop)

Notice that the moon wasn’t always a thing that would turn blood-red, not at least until after the dream was conceived. It was a pale presence, distant yet, from Laurence’s perspective, something to be contacted. With the Moon rune granting more blood echoes, it’s possible that Laurence, drunk on the power that the Old Blood and the Healing Church gave him, wanted to strike a deal with whatever formless presence hid in the moon to amass more power. Little did he know that this nameless thing was in fact Oedon himself. So it was very likely that Oedon, searching for a surrogate child while forever yearning for his beloved Mergo adrift in the nightmare, saw an opportunity in this encounter.

The game can never state it enough. “Every Great One loses its child, and then yearns for a surrogate.” Every single Great One that attempts to bear children somehow loses it. This plays into larger themes of knowledge, survival, and the cost of power but I’ll keep the discussion on Oedon and Mergo for now. Mergo, a formless child lost in the dreamlands, eternally crying out for their parents, is all alone in a brutal world where all other children have died. The grieving Great Ones yearn for a surrogate, and Mergo is the most tempting in any reality. We see Mergo’s cries as a magnet, Amygdalae converging on Yahar’gul when Mergo’s cries ring out from the nightmare. (Note: those Amygdalae weren’t there before the ritual was revealed, since no amount of insight will show them. They gravitated in direct response to the blood moon and the wailing.) There’s just one problem for the usual Great One, keeping them separate from their ideal surrogate: Mergo is dead, formless.

“Hunters of hunters dress as crows to suggest sky burial.” - Crowfeather Attire

“This red-smudged rune means ‘Hunter,’ and was adopted by the hunter of hunters oath. These watchmen admonish those who have become intoxicated with blood. Be they men or beasts, anyone who has antagonized the pledgers of the ‘Hunter’ oath surely has an issue with blood.” - Hunter Rune

It only makes sense, then, that the Great One that manages to swoop in and imprison Mergo is the ironically named Wet Nurse. When struck, it reacts the same way as all the other spirits and dead things do, with an unearthly noise and a puff of smoke. It’s formless beneath its hood, like dead Oedon and Mergo. Its feathered cloak is reminiscent of a crow, suggesting sky burial. And its siderite blades are sister weapons to the Burial Blade and Blade of Mercy, weapons forged from a mineral that fell from the heavens and specialize in the dealing of death to hunters. Finally, the music that plays is Mergo’s Lullaby, a tune that became popular in contemporary Yharnam. This combination of elements is incredibly suggestive of a hunter of hunters, one who has an issue with blood and those intoxicated by it. Depending on where your head is at, it would be equally easy to imagine two things: She was a human hunter who’d transcended the hunt, took issue with Oedon’s blood-drunkenness, and was killed for her transgression; or, she was an already-existent Great One killed by Oedon and her human worshippers created a Hunter of Hunters clan in her honor, vowing to hunt the blood-drunk. In either case (or any possibility involving these traits of hunter-hunters), her spirit would be absolutely opposed to Oedon, the most blood-drunk of all, and would be more than happy to take Mergo as her surrogate child. It’s unclear whether the Wet Nurse succeeded in taking Mergo because of her deathly state or the power granted by her vendetta against Oedon and the blood-drunk, but there we have two potentially valid reasons for her success. As such, the way we end what would become our night of the hunt is by freeing Mergo and quelling Oedon’s wrath. The nightmare is slain once the Wet Nurse is gone and Mergo has a few moments to calm down and escape the awful dream.

“Loran is a tragic land that was devoured by the sands. The tragedy that struck this ailing land of Loran is said to have its roots in the scourge of the beast.” - Ailing Loran Chalice

“There are trace remains of medical procedures in parts of ailing Loran. Whether these were attempts to control the scourge of the beast, or the cause of the outbreak, is unknown.” - Lower Loran Chalice

So this heavenly conflict of interest between Oedon and every Great One who yearns for a child surrogate is what leads to the dream and the scourge. In communicating with power-hungry hunters, Oedon did two things to get his way. For one, he began to do to Yharnam and its mortal plane what he did to Loran in the old days when they’d attempted to imbibe his blood and become Great Ones which would threaten his child. Essentially, he spiked the collective drink. All who imbibed in his Old Blood would go into a frenzy and devolve into mindless beasts who stood no chance at ascension, starting with Laurence who’d likely taken the blood from Queen Yharnam himself and lusted for power. The other thing Oedon did was conceive the Hunter’s Dream and contract hunters who’d become undying by the scent of the moon and the guidance of the messengers. These hunters were to hunt and kill to their hearts’ content, amassing power through blood which Oedon would absorb for himself by the night’s end. Their mission was to “Hunt the Great Ones. Hunt the Great Ones.” But one particular night of the hunt was more important than any other, and calls for a brief dip into Old Hunters content. So why The One Reborn and the Wet Nurse and Mensis on tonight of all nights?

“In his final years, Master Willem was fond of the lookout, and the rocking chair that he kept there for meditation. In the end, it is said, he left his secret with the lake.” - Lunarium Key

“Great volumes of water serve as a bulwark guarding sleep, and an augur of the eldritch Truth. Overcome this hindrance, and seek what is yours.” - Lake Runes

When Kos washed up on the coast of the fishing village, she was dead. She’d also been pregnant, and her orphan was taken by the likes of Gehrman during the Byrgenwerth raid. Willem had ordered it, having given up on the prospects of blood and instead turned to the idea of internal eyes, for which the villagers were forcibly searched. When the child was taken back to Byrgenwerth, they were assuredly dissected and their parts studied, especially the umbilical cord from Kos. It’s not immediately clear what they did with this cord at first, but I’m of the belief that Willem’s actions weren’t swift. He held onto the possibility of ascension through the rest of his teaching years, and the formative years of the Healing Church. And then, the trigger became clear. Once the scourge of the beast surfaced in Yharnam thanks to Laurence, Willem enlisted his student Rom for the most important experiment. Having foreseen the dangers of the Old Blood, he watched, waited, and he knew that the moon was a sort of window that allowed a nameless presence to operate in reality through the blood. With his Third Cord, through the power of dead Kos, Willem granted Rom eyes and elected to become the host of the dream they would create. With the Moonside Lake, their own shard of the dream, Willem and Kos became a bulwark guarding reality from the nightmare in an attempt to suppress Oedon’s power over the blood. The ritual meant Willem would finally achieve enlightenment through Rom, but would be unable to share it. Evidently, the hosts of dreams are somewhat shackled to the Great One that created it, and Rom would appear vacuous in her perpetual state of keeping the window between worlds muddied.

“Ahh, Kos. Or some say Kosm... Do you hear our prayers? As you once did for the vacuous Rom, Grant us eyes, grant us eyes.” - Micolash, Host of the Nightmare

“The Mensis Ritual must be stopped, lest we all become beasts.” “Madmen toil surreptitiously in rituals to beckon the moon. Uncover their secrets.” - Notes in Yahar’gul

Nights of the hunt would pass, and the Healing Church would split into its sects. The Choir, having found Ebrietas in Great Isz, would look to the sky, where the Pthumerians departed, for their chance at enlightenment. But the School of Mensis would look back to the sea, the “source of all greatness,” which would require the study of the dead. Having learned of Rom’s ascension through the power of Kos, the goal of Mensis would be to study the nightmare where dead things persist, in order to contact Kos. Penetrating the veil between worlds en masse would require the power of the moon, that window to the nightmare, even if it meant inviting the scourge of the beast.

“This Cord granted Mensis audience with Mergo, but resulted in the stillbirth of their brains.” - One Third of Umbilical Cord (from Mergo’s Wet Nurse)

“Nightmarish rituals crave a newborn. Find one and silence its harrowing cry.” - Note in Yahar’gul

It’s unclear where all of the Third Cords came from, but it could be tied to a certain cut item description. Instead of debating its canon here, I’ll move on with the clear knowledge that Mensis had a Cord and intended to use it to contact Mergo. It seems they hoped that by contacting the spirit of the much-desired infant, it would draw in many other wandering Great One spirits like, they hoped, Kos. And while the walls between realities were sufficiently shattered and they were pulled into the nightmare, their brains were “stillborn” as a result of their close contact with the dead child. A Great One spirit known as the Wet Nurse coveted Mergo atop her newly manufactured cathedral-cradles of dead servants, ready for Oedon’s retaliation; and Micolash, the new host of this nightmare, relished in Mergo’s cries while awaiting the arrival of the one who would finally grant him eyes. Indeed, this entrapment of Mergo as gruesome bait would be known as the Mensis Ritual, and Oedon’s wrath through the scourge would only get stronger. Thus would begin the longest night yet, and the most important of Oedon’s contracted hunters. Rom would still suppress the greater effects of the nightmare, but even Willem in his helpless state knew that someone would have to come and unmask the Ritual in order to enter the nightmare and end it. As for The One Reborn...

“Great old bell discovered in the underground labyrinth. Its ring resonates across worlds...” - Beckoning Bell

“When all is melted in blood, all is reborn.” - Ritual Blood

With the Unseen Village vacant and the longest night of the hunt beginning, mad Pthumerians with sinister bells and sacks for kidnapping wandered to the surface, preparing their own ghastly ritual. The remaining Pthumerians from the Tomb of the Gods were left behind by their ascendant brethren, lingering in the immortal madness wrought by the eldritch Truth. Whatever conscious drive they had in surfacing in Yharnam, it must have been a visceral sort of reasoning based on Great One worship. They likely felt the waxing power of the moon and decided to capitalize on its coming surge to please their gods. For the Pthumerians, especially the bell-ringers, enjoyed something like necromancy. They used inter-world resonances to manipulate blood itself, and shaped it into whatever they pleased. In the Unseen Village they would indeed find immense power in Oedon’s blood moon. So ritual materials were required. Kidnappers took people from throughout Yharnam and locked them in cells or caskets. Once Rom died and the Mensis Ritual was properly revealed, it seems Oedon’s power was greater than they’d anticipated, reanimated beasts and other horrors lashing out at everything that lived.

Still the bell-ringers summoned protection through the blood. Perhaps they knew that guarding the site of the Ritual would ensure that their beloved Amygdalae would continue to bless their skies. Or maybe they saw this as their own opportunity for death-fueled ascension, because once our hunter arrives at the Advent Plaza, bell-ringers summon through the nightmare what may in fact be their own attempt at reaching Kos with the body parts of captured Yharnamites and Mensis scholars. (See: translated lyrics for “Hail the Nightmare” express a desire to use the power of blood to reach the dead mother of the sea. And is that a half-born Orphan jutting out the top?) After all, it would make sense to call Kos “The One,” of all Great Ones. Were it not for her death and promise of ascension, great many tragedies wouldn’t have befallen the people of Yharnam and the fishing village.

“Both Oedon, and Oedon’s inadvertent worshippers, surreptitiously seek the precious blood.” - Oedon Runes

“Queen Annalise partakes in these blood dreg offerings, so that she may one day bear the Child of Blood, the next Vileblood heir.” - Blood Dreg

This was supposed to just brush on the larger aspects of the story so I won’t go into too much more detail here, but there are a couple more tidbits that make Option A a worthy approach. First, the runes directly named after Oedon enhance our hunters’ Quicksilver, which is infused with their powerful god-enhanced blood. This medium can then be translated through many tools via the arcane, strongly tying Oedon’s “oozing” blood to the unseen forces that weave between worlds. Second, there’s the appearance of the Moon Presence itself. Unlike any other Great One we find, it’s absolutely drenched in blood and utilizes the most unique blood powers, as if it’d been manufactured straight from the blood moon itself like The One Reborn. Like the avatar for a thing without form, a dead thing only given life in a dream. And finally, there’s Annalise, trying to recreate that union with Oedon in ancient Pthumeru. How curious that the blood artifact she requires, as pointed out by the community on multiple occasions, “appear in the blood of echo fiends” when embracing a Blood Rune (Corruption), the very sort of blood echoes so ravenously desired by our own Moon Presence... So yes, Option A is the route of guises and greed. “If I can’t have it, then no one can.” Dead gods peering in from realms of eternal sleep.

Many of these ideas may carry over to my exploration of Option B since they may hold up regardless of the identity of the Moon Presence, but perhaps by the time I get there, everything I thought I knew will seem ridiculous. Just writing this out, as few details as possible and keeping it to the big picture, I’ve had to challenge what I took for granted over the last three years. Maybe by putting this out there I can get some input and challenge it some more! And I also look forward to tackling The Old Hunters in depth as well as the little things that may later inform the big picture. But for now, I need a few sedatives...

#bloodborne #oedon #moon presence #story #lore #entry

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