#transandrobros

[a-polite-melody]

Waitwaitwait

Is “transandrobabies” really another term people are trying out to deride trans men and mascs speaking on our oppression?

Really?

When one of the things we constantly talk about is that we are infantilized to hell and back?

Actually?

I am… y’know. I wish I could say I was surprised. But at this point I’m not. This is not what genuine criticism of transmasc theory looks like, it’s not ever done a good job being dressed up to pretend that way, and the people coming up with these terms of derision absolutely know what they’re doing.

#my post #transandrophobia #transmisandry #we just keep collecting more #transandrophobia truthers #Aidens and theyfabs #cuntboys #zippertits #tmras #transandrobros #tbros #transandrodorks #birthday boys #transandrobabies #how many more?

[pretty-little-martyr]

terfs: we should try and infiltrate trans men's spaces, and in this post where I detail how, I keep misgendering them and referring to them like lost stupid women

people on this website, somehow: This Is Trans Men's Fault For Speaking About The Transphobia They Face

#DO YOU HEAR YOURSELVES. #if youve ever called a trans man speaking abt their oppression a 'transandrobro' or 'transandrophobia truther' #then just know that 1) i hate you and 2) i want you as far away from me as possible

[kidfur]

btw cuz ive seen sum ppl being weird abt trans mascs lately: i luv trans mascs u are all AWESUM.

#wishy speaks #i dont want to get too discoursey but ive seen ppl use like #transandrophobia truther or transandrobro as really really mean words #and i dont think thats right #like there is probably trans guys who are mean to trans girls but i dont think its an excuse to say ur gonna do awful things to an entire #group of trans mascs #its really mean #so im giving a big hug to all my trans masc mutuals and followers

[fite-club]

it’s still so sad when trans guys are like “transandrophobia is real, i lost my support systems when i started taking T” like i’m sorry baby but that’s just transphobia. they don’t particularly care that it’s a man you’re transing into, it’s the transing at all that makes those people stop being around you. losing friends/etc after transition is not a transmasc-specific experience, it’s a trans-specific experience. i’m not downplaying anyone’s struggles when i say this i’m literally pointing out the systematic oppression you experienced and calling it the correct name

#i mean this goes for like 90% of what those guys call ‘transandrophobia’ anyways #but uh. yeah. if your friends thought men were inherently evil before you transitioned then maybe they were just TERFs all along #and you’re only realizing it now because it’s directly affecting you #all this shit about ‘my friends tried to talk me out of transitioning/surgery’ #its not as simple as ‘they think men = bad so trans men = bad’ #its more like ‘these people see gender as something inherent and your identity contradicts that’ #like im not saying all these transandrobros came from TERF circles. but some of y’all are telling on yourselves #is the person in your life saying ‘testosterone is a dangerous poison’ really your friend?

[iintervallum]

one good thing about not having the tumblr app because the UAE decided to block it in the app store, is i don't think end up spending a lot of time on here. i mainly just queue posts but forget to put a queue tag lol

the only negative thing is missing out on the water filters to drown bad posts but alas, I'll take that

#aster.txt #i mainly use it my phone browser #duckduckgo actually has a pretty decent phone browser have been using it more than chrome #but on my laptop is by far my favorite because of 1)shinigami eyes 2)AdBlock 3)the dashboard unfucker #shinigami eyes makes things very apparent when someone is a terf but i never trust anyone marked green #because so many of those transandrobros here are marked green #also did you know most news sites are marked red? it's kind of interesting but also kind of moot

[autolenaphilia]

Edit: as hoshi9zoe pointed out, the original version of this post needlessly berated other transfems like Jennifer Coates, for which I do apologize, and I have toned it down in this edited version. The original version survives in reblogs.

Some months ago, I was searching through this transandrobro blog to see if they posted a callout of me, and i found this reblog, which I couldn't really write about for months, because what do I even write. I recently wayback machined it for posterity, and I guess this is my attempt to write a post about it.

It's saint-dyke himself, the coiner of transandrophobia, saying that the infamous (at least for me) article "I am a transwoman. I'm in the closet. I'm not coming out" is what made him coin the fucking word. It's literally bolded and underlined: "Reading this article is what made me coin “transandrophobia”.

The reason I put off writing this post is that reading that article makes me feel like i'm drinking poison. And it is poison, make no mistake, it's internalized transmisogyny brainworms dripping out of the writer's brain and onto the page.

It's a justification for why the author, known by pseudonym Jennifer Coates, doesn't want to transition, despite knowing she is a trans woman. And it's the exact kind of internalized transmisogyny that keeps trans women in repression and not transitioning. "I'm not going to pass, i'm forever going to be an ugly freak who will at best be humored by other women, the closet is uncomfortable but at least it's safe"

It's the same exact bullshit a lot of represssed trans women tell themselves because it's what society tells us about trans women, that we are freakish parodies of women, that we will never pass, and if we don't pass we have failed and are ugly freaks. It's all to scare us into staying in the closet and make others hate and fear us. Transmisogyny permeates our society, and the majority, maybe all transfems will absorb and internalize some of it.

Coates says that it all is just applicable to her, but again so many transfems believe this shit before transitioning and realizing it's a pack of lies. If this bullshit was in any way valid, a lot of trans women shouldn't transition, because before we actually transition many of us believe it word for word. And "it's only true for me" is how we justify it to ourselves. We tend to be way harsher on ourselves than others. This kind of self-hating transfem tends to think: "Other trans women are beautiful graceful goddesses, earthly manifestations of the divine feminine, always destined to be women, while I'm an ugly forever male ogre who just has a fetish."

It's all bullshit, it's poison, it's internalized transmisogyny.

And the rest of the article is bullshit too. It is not some insightful mediation on gender as some people say, it's the author confusing and mixing up actual transmisogyny with an imagined problem of misandry. She does this because she has gone full repression mode, and decided she has no other choice to live as a man, so her dysphoria and experiences of transmisogyny are actually men's problems.

It's a bad article, excusable because as Coatas points out, it's "essentially a diary entry." that was meant to be a way to "vent frustration" and she "did not intend for anyone else to actually read it." It is clearly not the product of a healthy mind.

I hope the author sometime in the past seven years eventually did transition, and that for whatever reason she didn't want to publicly repudiate her own article. Maybe she lost access to the medium account so she can't delete it.

Far worse than the article itself is the response to it. I've seen it passed around as some insightful commentary on gender by the "feminists are too mean to men, misandry is real" crowd. I have argued against this before. And other people have made insightful comments about it.

And learning that saint-dyke claiming that he was inspired to coin the word "transandrophobia" because of this article is the cherry on top of this shitcake of transmisogyny. For my thoughts on "transandrophobia" theory and how transmisogynistic it is, see here.

Of course, Saint-dyke absolutely could be bullshitting here. Claiming that Coates's article is what inspired him to coin the word might be a lie to claim that transandrophobia theory is not transmisogynistic because it came from listening to trans women.

This is why "listen to trans women" doesn't work. Because TME people will always choose a trans woman who confirms their prejudices. Blair White has made an entire career out of this. And Coates article is popular because it says that misandry is real and trans women's issues are partly caused by it, misgendering herself and other trans women.

And it's popular for another reason. Coates has thoroughly internalized transmisogyny, and thus her article presents a trans woman that is exactly as transmisogynistic patriarchal society wants her to be. She is suffering, but ultimately accepts her assigned role. She truly believes that her biological sex dooms her to forever be male. She literally "manages her dysphoria by means other than transition" as conversion therapy advocates want us to do. She never makes an social claim on womanhood by actually transitioning, so she doesn't invade the sacred women's spaces. Yet she performs the role of woman perfectly by serving men, by defending them from supposed feminist misandry. And she fulfils the ritualistic role that the rhetorical figure of "trans women" sometimes serves in progressive spaces, of giving a blessing to TME people's pre-existing views and actions, all while actual flesh-and-blood trans women are destroyed by those same deeply transmisogynistic spaces. This time it's a blessing for the same "misandry is real" soft-MRA bullshit that has infested the online left and created the transandrophobia crowd.

That is why this article and the positive response makes me sick, makes me feel like i'm drinking poison. This is what its fans want trans women to be like. I'm acutely aware this kind of self-denial is exactly what transmisogyny wants from me and tried to indoctrinate me into doing it. And I want none of it. I want to live, I want to be a woman.

#my writings #transmisogyny #jennifer coates #this is a lot more emotional than i usually am #but i'm so angry and disgusted

[baeddling]

Something that rlly irritates me abt like a handful of the more popular transandrobros is how often they conflate butchness with being afab nonbinary and then declare that anti-butch oppression stems from anti-male discrimination.

[doberbutts]

I think we (the trans community on Tumblr) fucked the discourse when we tried to create separate terms for the kinds of misogyny trans ppl experience. It's the intersection of trans-ness and misogyny that gets you no matter if you're trans fem or trans masc and there's no guarantee that the oppressor will see us as our true identity either way. -a fem, transitioned trans man who gets a lot of misplaced transmisogyny

I have said over and over again that when I was first learning trans theory it was from an in-person mentorship from a trans woman thru my college's GSA and she is the one who taught me that transmisogyny applies to all of us.

The reason I don't really use the word "transandrophobia" at all is specifically because of this. And yet I'm still labeled a transandrobro and transandrodork and a truther because it was never about the fucking word and it was always about being mad that trans guys were pointing out where harm was coming from.

I started my trans journey in fellowship and solidarity with trans women. That's how I'd like to finish it too, however many years into the future my death arrives.

[vaspider]

Ah, yes, the very valid and useful opinions of someone who uses the term "transandrobros"

Surely these will be good fait-- oh, it's just recycled "you're close enough to hit so I'm gonna take a swing"? I am truly, truly shocked.

anyway

[a-polite-melody]

“Omg the transandrobros trying to make autoandrophilia (AAP) a thing are so transmisogynistic. They see the transmisogynistic theory of autogynephilia (AGP) and say ‘how can I make this about me?’ There’s nothing here to reclaim for you, you’re just stealing valour from transmisogyny.”

Way to just make a bunch of assumptions.

There absolutely is a concept that’s been weaponized against gay transmascs from medical bs around transition (it was basically impossible for lesbian transfems, as well as gay transmascs, to transition in the US at least until the 1980s; look up Lou Sullivan for more on that) to social media callouts, dogpiles, and doxxings. It is a concept that doesn’t have a formalized name like AGP (though a quick google search shows that prominent people who speak about AGP have been using AAP in conjunction with AGP since 2009) but is a concept which is similar to that of AGP and used in some similar ways against transmascs as AGP is against transfems.

One place you can very easily find this attitude (to go back to the stuff about social media, though there are implications beyond the scope of just social media here) is baked into the transmed “criticism” of gay/mlm transmascs/AFAB nonbinary people which featured (unfortunately) pretty prominently in the tumblr trans world for a long time, and while it may not be nearly as prominent now, it’s still around and easy to find if you look specifically for transmed stuff. Hell, it moved out of transmed spaces and became a tumblr-wide phenomenon of harassing (and worse) the “fujoshis”—these gross women who were so fetishistic of gay men and into gay fanfic and bl manga they deluded themselves into thinking they’re the gay boys in their favourite anime—in the name of protecting the trans community and the gay community from these infiltrators and walking conversion therapy fakebois.

I denied that I was transmasc for so long because I was worried that this “phenomenon of delusional women tricking themselves into thinking they’re men to absolve themselves the guilt of being fetishistic creeps toward gay men, reinforced by encouraging each other into the delusions” was an actual, real thing I needed to worry about, and that I might have been falling into this trap.

I worried, because the world was telling me that this (though not called the phrase) AAP phenomenon existed at the same time as when I had to actually like… actually fully delve into learning about the LGBTQ+ community after realizing I was bi to even know that being trans in a way that was something other than MTF even existed. It made more sense to me that I, while actively trying not to, was actually internally fetishizing gay men and falling into delusions than it did for me to be transmasc, because being transmasc seemed like hardly even a thing while the problem of these “fujoshis” seemed like something huge.

But yes. Absolutely nothing to reclaim here. Only wanting to steal valour from trans women and be big huge transmisogynists by making trans women’s problems into our own, not talking about any actual problems transmascs actually have because we don’t have those kinds of problems because some dumbass on the internet says so. (/this whole paragraph is sarcasm)

#my post #transandrophobia #transmisandry #anti transmasculinity #atm #autoandrophilia #more people being horrible in the transandrophobia tag #how you know I just blocked someone: I make a huge post like this #lol

[gamblegun]

So fucking tired of going on random people's blogs and seeing not just blatant, but self-congratulating transphobia. Even when I take a break from the current discourse, I can't escape it. I was just scrolling through someone's blog and saw a "transandrobros fear being emasculated, which is why they're raging transmisogynists". Blocking tags doesn't help, because even seeing the phrase "transandrodorks" or whatever is enough to let me know that this person is bigoted towards transmascs and I should feel deeply disappointed in them for buying into second hand hearsay. I honestly just can't trust anyone to be normal anymore.

#I feel for asexual people when that discourse happened #truly constantly jump scared bu hoe many random 'allies' hate you so fucking much #and then they lat themselves in the back for defending trans fems #horrible #transandrophobia #anti transmasculinity

[trans-androgyne]

Confused bc this is exactly what transmascs talking about transandrophobia are trying to say though?? A huge point is that people aren’t letting transmascs talk about their own experiences of oppression without demanding they clarify that transfems have it worse or centering transfem voices. I literally can’t go through the transmisogyny tag without being shit on for talking about transandrophobia but it’s transmascs talking about transfems too much? Comparing “““transandrobros””” to baeddels is pretty fucked in many regards

#transandrophobia #intracommunity issues tag #mine #transmasc #transmasculinity

[fite-club]

Greg again — I saw someone in the transandrophobia tag once say that there was a trans men to incel-lite pipeline on tumblr and while that initially irked me because I’ve dealt with ‘nice guys’ in my life I like… Fully agree with them now and think the sentiment is hilarious. Like yeah, the way these dudes talk about “baeddels” gives the vibe of a guy who got rejected from one girl and now they secretly hate all women bc of it lolol. Like I see it in a way where if there are trans women who hate trans men it’s kinda not my business and it shouldn’t really affect me. Trans guys being sore about that are just sipping that toxic masculinity “women give us problems” juice tbh. And also irl I’m friends with plenty of trans women who would look at me like I’m crazy if I ever even brought this discourse up to them and probs dont even know what a “baeddel” is soooo—

Idk as someone who hasn’t even transitioned yet the prospect that some trans women could hate me for being a man/trans men was something that was scary to me because of the trans women in my life I care about but I kinda had to realize what a non-issue it was. Like if some trans women end up hating me for being a man that’s really none of my business and fully their prerogative.

when a small tiny handful of transfems voice a distrust of transmascs it’s a dire community issue that needs to be addressed, but when a small handful of transmascs voice a distrust of transfems its just silly infighting and you cant generalize a whole group based on the experiences of a few bad apples and people just need to let us vent and its totally different ok

#the main thing that connects transandrobros and incels is the ‘blaming women for their problems’ thing #but the other thing is the ‘clearly does not interact with women irl’

[txttletale]

I like you, but, in terms of the "transandrobros support zionism" thing. Like I don't think you can reduce one social stance as a pattern of degeneracy, y'know? Like, I've seen: trans fems support Zionism & transandrobros support Gaza, Jews who support zionism and those who don't, communists who support the death penalty and those who don't, materialists who support all kinks and those that make callout posts about any kink spicier than BDSM- politics and cognitive dissonance go hand in hand.

when you see girls talking about tmra zionists it's referencing like a single digit number of very popular blogs. like these are a clique of specific guys who are like that we're not making a broad prognosis or anything. also idk where 'degeneracy' comes into it

#ask

[haughty-ojousama]

transmascpetewentz reminds me of a former friend I had who was a left-leaning transmasc, converted to judaism, and pete wentz sounds like one of the white boys he'd obbsess over. he was also a transandrobro, I wonder.....

[angellurgy]

i cant even. im so fucking pissed off about all of this. yall fucking love to hang out with anti tme/tma transfems and let transandrobros fucking thrive in your notes but like. still pretend you fucking care 😭. i have to see y'all talk to n spread that pillsbury-soyboy transhuman-priestess person who belittled me with ageism and bs in front of their followers for simply tying to imply that trans men were harassing trans women and that tma/tme is not a false binary, and yall just fucking LET em tout that shit. fucking radio silence when someone whos not super popular makes a comment about it tho. not to mention letting trans men call trans women terfs in your replies, its fucking everywhere. people just want a fucking popularity contest you cant actually hold morals or stay true to your 'beliefs'

#no one gives a fuck lol you see someone comment on someone you know and just block em instead of thinking #but the girls who actually have to fucking deal w any of this get nothing #teehee :3