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so-much-for-family-huh · 3 years

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“HATE wins, Incest wins, we got a Bibro ending!” First off, hate? What in the world are you talking about?? There are non-ship related reasons to criticize and dislike the supernatural finale but do not just sum up and start attacking tags/blogs/actors just because your ship didn’t have a fairy tale ending like you wrote about in fan fiction; if anything that is why many users on this hellsite don’t like the finale, and you can’t hide that behind your sudden 180 on the “Jensen is a homophobe/Dean Winchester is abusive and Cas deserved better than him” hot take that people so eagerly blogged about post-confession scene and then swapped sides because shippers think Jensen has been “on their side all along” (so NOW the sudden Jensen hate stops and we get “Jensen deserved better!!!11!!1!!” posts from these same people...tumblr is pretty quiet about it switching sides though).

Dean Winchester literally said “I love you” to his baby brother, his own words literally from the finale. Their final conversation as Dean is dying from that not-tiny-at-all nail just shows their love and care for each other, and that strong bond is what gave us this ending to the episode. There is no kiss, no wedding, nothing in the finale points at this being about a particular ship being canon (d*stiel or w*ncest). The brothers ultimately got their ideal way of spending the afterlife - together and finally free to do whatever they want, with their close friends and other family to possibly see. Yes you can be upset at the finale, but don’t go attacking people on this site AND those who worked on the show like Jensen (and Jared, again, probably) just because they won’t pander to you like Misha Collins has for years and continues to do so now. Don’t attack them just because you watched the show with shipping goggles and took Misha’s word as gospel above everyone else who has worked on this show for the last decade.

#anti destiel #I'm literally not a bibro or a wincest shipper #I just understood that the show has always been about sam and dean #what show were YOU watching???#technically #anti misha #because I'm finally tired enough of this man to not be quiet about it.#destiew #almost forgot to add that nbckxhvi

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bluephoenixdruidicprincess · 3 years

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So, I was taking my dog for a walk tonight and whilst doing this, I was thinking on the SPN finale, you know, like everyone, just trying to figure out the mindset of the writers, why they chose this particular emotionally stilted ending. And I think I've figured it out and it actually has a lot to do with a lot of my problems with the past few seasons.

The problem I've had with the past few seasons is the writers' inability to really kind of commit to well, anything. The writing has been feeling very wishy-washy, like they're holding back trying to please everyone. They want to give the TFW stans things they like, they want to give the bibros things they'd like. But instead of finding a way to really actively mesh the concepts together, they keep flip-flopping back and forth and it just feels really choppy and a lot of times not very satisfying. And I think there's an element of that the writers were trying to put in the finale. They were trying to give bits and pieces that the different factions would like except it landed a little bit too heavily on the bibros side. And even as a bibros ending, it still feels pretty wishy-washy. So the writers wanted to please the bibros, so they got this ending where Sam and Dean get to spend eternity in heaven together. And if you want to imagine any of your other favorite characters in this new heaven-verse hanging with the Winchester Bros, than you can, it leaves room for you. They wanted to please the Cas stans so they leave these comments here and there that Cas is not in the Empty and is setting things right in heaven with Jack so that leaves room for Destiel or Sastiel stans to imagine whatever they want in terms of their ship. Hell, Megstiel stans can even imagine that Jack chose to save Meg from the Empty as well and she and Cas are now "moving some furniture around" in heaven while Dean was going on his marathon drive. However, if you are not a Cas stan or even if you actively hate him, then you can just imagine he fucked off or whatever. In terms of Sam's blurry wife, you can imagine it's Eileen or if you're not an Eileen stan, you can imagine someone else in that slot. See where I'm kind of going with this. I think this was the writers were trying to do while also failing at it. They were trying to leave room for everyone to get some semblance of what they wanted. They didn't succeed, but I think that's what they were attempting. If they made the fan service a little bit more evenly distributed, I think it might've turned out better. But instead, as I said before, we got this really wishy-washy, emotionally stilted, disappointing tragedy of a finale. It sucks but this is what we got. I'm not in any way justifying the finale, I'm just free-thinking here trying to understand the writers and what they were trying to go for with this finale.

#spn finale #spn carry on #spn 15x20 #spn 15.20 #the15yearshow

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missjackil · 4 years

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Andrew Dabb is by far the weakest showrunner SPN has had. I dont understand why you stan him? I mean, you're entitled to your opinion of course but to me he obviously doesnt care about canon or the Winchesters, only the side characters and pandering to the 1% (Hellers)

First, let me say I don't “stan” him, I just don't think he’s any worse than any other showrunner SPN has had, and in some ways, he's even better. Apologies up front that this may run long, but I have a lot to say about the subject.

I didn’t join the Tumblr fandom until s11 was over and the show had changed hands from Carver to Dabb. All summer long I heard from Hellers how Dabb hates the Winchesters toxic co-dependency and is going to do away with it. And he is “for sure” going to make Destiel canon because he likes it and so does his assistant, she even had books published on the subject! So everyone not interested in that ship, dispised Dabb before the season even started filming, However, the Hellers were proven wrong, Dabb has done the least destiel pandering than ANY other showrunner, and has improved on Sam and Dean’s relationship while still managing to keep them dangerously co-dependent, but for some reason, the Hellers still preach the opposite and the bibros still believe them. I don’t think the fandom gave Dabb a fair chance.

Now, I agree that there have been some bad stories, and failure to keep up with canon and some annoying retcons but because i actually watch the series over and over, I can see this has been a problem with every showrunner, even Kripke. A problem I have seen with the show since the beginning is maybe, there have been too many writers and maybe they dont watch the show or read what other writers have written from episode to episode. But since this has been a constant, I dont go nuts when it happens over and over because I still love the show and I am still invested in the whole story.

One thing I learned quickly when I came to the fandom is the hypocrisy is level 50 on all sides. One side hates the other because theyre bullies but the other side isnt much better. Bitter girls are critical of the other brother for things they dont hold against their fav and everyone thinks J2 hate the show as much as they do. These people may never know how ridiculous they look by watching a show for 10 years past the time they stopped liking it, or bitching about a show they dont even watch anymore and pretend they have a clue whats going on.

As I watch the Krikpe era recently, I like picking out things that the fandm would cry about if it happened now. In s1 Faith all the reapers were scary monster looking shriveled old dudes, and then in 2.1 (Less than 10 episodes later) Dean’s Reaper tells him Reapers can appear as whatever they want even a pretty girl “RETCON!!!” I could hear y’all crying if Dabb did that. And why did saying “Christo” help point out a demon once but never again? (till s14 when they did a call back)

How about fan-favorite Mystery Spot? We all love that right? But if it wasnt an episode until the Dabb era, you would all flame it because Sam keeps saying every day is exactly the same, thats how he knows what is going to happen and yet none of the days are the same as the one before. “THESE WRITERS SUCK!!!!!” is the response you all would give

The End is literally double Dean and 5 minutes of Sam. In the Beginning is literally 46 seconds of Sam, if these episodes happened now alll id hear is “Dabb hates Sam... writers hate Jared!!”

How about S4 when the Angels are threatening to kill Sam for using his powers, and yet, they want him to kill Lilith with his powers?? What? Theres no way that would fly in the Dabb era.

How about introducing the Anti-Christ in a season about The Apocolypse and not following through on it? Or how everyone shades Dabb for pushing Wayward sisters when Kripke pushed Ghost Facers? Even threw in a random and highly out of place advertisement for their web series that never went anywhere? (random promo in Hammer of the Gods) or having girls constantly getting in the boys’ way and Dean frequently telling Sam he cant trust him and doesnt believe in him?? “No one knows the brother’s love as well as Kripke uwu”

As far as destiel fodder goes, if anyone just started watching SPN in s12, they would never get a vibe that Dean and Cas have a thing, but maybe Sam and Cas do, Cas and Dean are hardly even friends since S12, yet the Kripke era gave birth to Destiel, and Gamble and Carver fed into it “I gripped you tight and raised you from perdition” “He was your boyfriend first” “Bases loaded bottom of the 9th, (cas) Id rather have you (as opposed to Sam) “ *dean carries trench coat around in the trunk of all his beater cars* “I need you.... we need you” “Theres people, and feelings, that I want to experience differently now, maybe for the first time” (when the only people in Deans life at the time were Sam and Cas) ALL came before Dabb, and what is Dabb guilty of? “I love you, I love all of you” and a mix tape.

So no... Dabb isnt perfect, but he definitely doesnt suck. I just think y’all decided to hate him before s12 and just never gave him a fair shot. Hardly any of you rewatch the series and cant remember things that happened back in the day, you just all seem to have this notion it was all gritty car scenes, googly eyes and dirty motel rooms.

Have a Merry Christmas

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missjackil · 5 years

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What I Think is Happening

We saw a big focus on Dean and Jack’s relationship this past episode, and I think it’s for a plot reason. No, its not so Sam can be sidelined because Jack is popular so TPTB want to make him Dean’s son instead, but because Dean and Jack need some ground to be made up for starters. We all already know Sam and Cas are very close to Jack, but Dean was harsh on him until the end of 13x04 last year, and soon after, Jack got lost in the AU. And then this season, Jack recently said that if Michael cant be killed without killing Dean, then Dean dies too, so even if thats all water under the bridge, it was still bad water, and they need to come together. That’s part 1.

Part 2 is that, a common SPN pattern is that something gets built up before being torn down, or strongly challenged. They tend to play up relationships or roles right before something comes along to crush it or change it drastically. Remember in S1, Sam and John fought tooth and nail until they had a heart to heart talk and then soon after, John died. Later in S5, Sam and Dean were at odds right before each chose each other. Or S11 when an emphisis was put on Sam and Dean being together and Dean never leaving Sam, and then ending on Dean needing to choose the world over Sam and Sam accepting it. What I think is probably happening here, is that soon, Dean will be trying to kill Jack (as Michael!Dean) or Jack trying to kill Dean (however that may come about) and most likely. Sam needing to make a choice between Jack and Dean.

Supernatural is a horror/drama show. Emphisis on drama. Any way to kick us in the feels, they will do. If this isnt what you like, then there are a bunch of other shows that don’t deal in drama to choose from, this one however, likes making us cry, and get angry, and scared and stressed. Im pretty sure this is about to be one of those things,

Remember that Jack was able to kill Michael but he didnt, so as Im convinced Michael is still in Dean but hiding, its probably coming soon that Michael!Dean tries to kill him. Of course in attempt to protect himself in case Jack recovers his grace and then will be strong enough to kill him again. Same way hes been looking for dark Kaia’s spear. So why does this story arch have to be Dean’s and not Sam’s? Because it would have never made any sense for Sam to have been unaccepting of Jack, unless Jack was bad. However, Jack is good, and no better way make a new character likable, than to have Sam like them. Imagine if it was Dean who accepted Jack first and not Sam? Sam would have a valid reason to, with him being Lucifer’s son and all, and it would feel wrong , or OOC for Dean to like Lucifers son when Sam didnt and samgirls and bibros alike would be side eyeing Dean, like “How could you do this to Sam? He’s the son of the entity who tortured him for 180 yrs and taunts him to this day!” And then after a few episodes, Sam for whatever reason warms up to him. It would always be in our mind that he’s rightfully uncomfortable around Jack, and we’d wonder if Sam wasnt just keeping the peace, for Dean’s sake, and still quietly hates Jack. Jack wouldnt be as well loved as he is, if this arc had gone the other way and when the question of chosing one over the other rears its ugly head, it wouldnt be as dramatic. As we learned in the last 13+ seasons, is that Sam and Dean will die for each other, kill for each other, destroy the universe for each other, and that wont ever change, but throw in someone they both love as a son, and now you have a problem. If one brother would choose Jack over the other, it wouldnt be that they love him more than their brother. It would be that they do love Jack, and hes so young and hasnt even had a chance to live yet, and they know their brother is more than willing to be a martyr, and has more often than not, wanted to die and stay dead. Now we truly do have a moral delema. This also wouldnt be as dramatic if the boys needed to choose between their mother and each other, because even though many of us dont hate Mary, I dont think we’d hurt too much if she died. If this happens, Im pretty sure, that something else will interviene and the choice wont have to be made. Like when Lucifer was holding Dean by the throat and telling Sam to either say “yes” or Dean dies. Something happened so that the choice never needed to be made, and to this day, we dont know how Sam would have chosen. We could say “Oh well obviously, hed say yes, because he wont let Dean die” but, he DID just tell Lucifer he was ready to watch the people he loves die, but he isnt ready to be his bitch. So really, we dont know what Sam would have chosen in the moment. So while I wont lie and say Im not salty about low Sam content thus far this season, I am finding the other stories unfolding very interesting. Even what would seem to be very boring stories, have potential to go a very interesting way. I generally dont care about the demons, but what if the fact that they have no ruler, and are scared of Sam, that he unintentionally became the King of Hell?

I dont give a crap about the Angels either, but what if the only way to save them (and yes of course Cas will try to save them) is to release them from The Empty which also unloads a bunch of nasty demons from the past that the boys have killed? Azazel. Lilith. Alistare Ruby? (note: bringing back dead follks has been part of the shows actual formula since S2 and its not going to change. Accept it and stop crying whenever it happens. you dont have to be a fan of the person they brought back, but just accept its always been part of the show) So obviously now, Lucifer is coming back and I too am tired of the character, but I accept that Lucifer will always be the series long big bad and we’ll have to deal with him off and on till the very end. However, now that he has Jack’s grace and Nick has made it obvious that hes a psychopath, what if Lucifer comes back as freakin scary, and not the spoiled 16 yr old he was? How much worse could he be to Sam then? So yeah, I see lots of interesting potential that could unfold from these stories. This brings me to my final thought. And its just a thought, something Ive been batting around since yesterday. What if Michael is making Jack sick? Just hear me out. Jack wasnt sick till Dean came home. We dont know of him being sick while Cas had him away on a hunting trip, he got sicker after spending time with Dean in 14x06, and is now near death after spending the afternoon with Dean. Dean had a couple of dizzy spells, and possibly even some lapses in memory. Not remembering Jacks last name, when he was born, (but yes, these just may have been normal confusion in the heat of the moment) but Michael can obviously manipulate the biology of a creature. like giving the Djinn more powers that he only needs to touch someone to make their nightmares come to life. What if he’s manipulating Jacks health and when he does so, it makes Dean dizzy? I mean he cant just snap his fingers and Jack explode or he’ll blow his cover right? Make it look natural and no one will suspect anything. Anyway. that part is just a thought. Im sure there’s holes but, it does make me wonder :)

#my meta #whats going on here #sam winchester #dean winchester #jack kline

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missjackil · 5 years

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Someone is arguing Dean is not dual protagonist along with Sam and you are saying its good stuff. WOW, way to be a Dean supporter. You all preach Bibros and both brother supporters, at end of day you are just a Sam stan.

Right away, I know a couple things about you. You dont know what a stan is, nor do you understand what protagonist/antagonist means, and you dont know me. Ill start this by telling you I never lie and say I dont favor Sam, because I do. However I love Dean too and I know he is equally important to the show as Sam is. Being a lead protagonist doesnt mean te other is less important in any sense. In fact, Im sure Jared and Jensen get paid the same, and maybe Jensen gets more when he directs. You are free to go through my entire blog and try to find where at anytime I ever throw shade on Dean, because I never do. So automatically, that makes me not a Sam stan, but Ill proudly say Im a stan for the brothers. Maybe a “Bronly” is a better term for me? I dont know, Im fine with either.

Now, I believe Sam and Dean both have equal importance to the show, I dont believe their roles are the same. Sam changes constantly, and Dean doesnt change much, This is not a bad or insulting thing for either. Sam and Dean are The Show, and like the show itself, Sam is the twists and turns and game changers, and Dean is the rock, what will never change about the show even if there are some adjustments made. The show will always be about 2 brothers who love the world and each other and will do anything to save both (Dean) but it moves and twists and blind sides us all the time too, and remains unpredictable (Sam).

From seasons 1-7 Sam was the main focus. Dean never really had a strong storyline of his own, even in S3 when it should have been focused more on trying to keep Dean out of Hell, it was more like a back burner story to chasing Bela around and MOTWs, but there was a writers strike so it probably wasnt intentional to not give Dean’s story more attention. But during 1-7 the story was mainly focused on Sam (protagonist) and Dean opposing whatever he was doing (antagonist) while both were still on the same side of wanting to do good (dual protagonists) are you following?

In S8, there was a shift. In the first half both Sam and Dean had seperate and equal storylines. They were both protag/antag to each other, while still being dual protags in the big picture. When we got to The Trials, the arc went back to being Sam’s yet, this time Dean was supporting him, so he wasnt being an antagonist, even if they argued a little sometimes. Then s9, the story was about Sam, being possessed by Gadreel, but the POV was from Dean. Very little was shown to us about what Gadreel was doing to Sam, other than he began getting very tired. It focused more on how worried Dean was that he made the wrong call and Gadreel would hurt Sam. Then we have the big bro fight, at which time theyre both being antagonistic, then the MOC which put Dean in the position of protagonist and Sam as antagonist (to each other) for a whole season and a half, all while they are both still dual protagonists in the big picture. Finally in S11, theyre not at odds with each other, theyre in full support of each other and completely dual protagonists, both in the big and little picture. This has carried on all the way till the last few episodes where Dean wanted to lock himself in a box, and Sam doesnt want him to. This makes Dean the protagonist, and Sam the antagonist... and yet theyre still dual good guys trying to do right by the world.

I think most of the problem is that y’all get defensive, as if saying the story has mainly opened up around Sam is an insult to Dean, and its not. Its just how the story is being told. Jensen isnt bitter about it, he chose to play Dean. Jared isnt a snob about it, he never puts Sam as more important than Dean. Neither would keep going without the other and they both love their roles, ther characters, and the show. So really, the problem only lies with the perception of a few viewers who think “different” means “hate” much like the problems of the world right now.

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