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suzyundertale · 5 years

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Deltarune Theory - The Red SOUL

It’s pretty clear that, in Deltarune, the person we are “playing” as is not Kris directly, but the red SOUL that is controlling them.

After all, when Kris tosses the SOUL out of their body, we can still control it.

So then, the question is... Who IS the red SOUL?

In this post, I’ll go over several theories, their main points, and evidence for them and against them.

It’s not Kris’ SOUL.

With the information we have, it’s nearly impossible for this SOUL to belong to Kris.

First of all, in the Dark World, Kris’ description describes them as follows:

“Body contains a human SOUL.” Not “THEIR” human SOUL, “A” human SOUL. That’s just about the most suspicious-sounding way you could possibly word that.

Second, the first time we go to save the game, a save file titled “Kris” is overwritten by one with the chosen name of the “creator”.

And, throughout the epilogue, everyone keeps pointing out how strange they’re acting, how they aren’t like themself...

They’re acting unlike themself because they aren’t themself - they’re being controlled by someone else.

... Someone who knows some things Kris doesn’t.

(Because of the above two, I’m going to assume that all of the dialogue choices come from the red SOUL.)

The SOUL also seems a little, um, opinionated:

And they apparently don’t know who Rudy is, when Kris definitely does.

So... who could they be?

Theory 1: The Player (“Player Theory”)

This is probably the most popular theory going around right now. In this theory, the red SOUL represents us, the “player”, as an actual in-game entity.

This is an understandable interpretation, as Undertale is known to be very meta at times. It’s not totally unthinkable that ‘we’ exist as an actual force in-universe.

Evidence against Player Theory

There’s a significant amount of evidence that the red SOUL has their own personality and is their own person, such as:

They have their own opinions on Mew Mew 2.

They can’t play the piano. I’d imagine a lot of players can, so it’s strange to put this here if they’re meant to be the player. It would be odd to exclude a significant amount of the player base (including Toby himself) for, um, literally no reason.

Support for Player Theory

According to Deltarune’s official website, Deltarune is a game “intended for people who have completed UNDERTALE.” Therefore, the “player” is supposed to know everything that happens in Undertale.

Therefore, these interactions make sense:

... Because the player knows who Sans is, and they know that Alphys and Undyne were dating in Undertale.

...However, there is someone else who knows all the same things about the Undertale universe that the player does.

Theory 2: Frisk

From Undertale, we know that Frisk has a red SOUL. This theory says that the red SOUL present in Deltarune is also the very same Frisk from the Undertale universe.

Evidence against Frisk Theory

Toby has said this about Deltarune in relation to Undertale:

...so, that shoots a bit of a hole in this... but. Hear me out.

[EDIT]

On February 14th 2019, a FAQ section was added to the official Deltarune website. One of the questions is:

Basically confirming that there are “connections” between the Undertale and Deltarune universes.

So... I guess there isn’t any evidence against this theory, now.

[END EDIT]

Support for Frisk Theory

Like the “player”, Frisk knows everything that happened in Undertale. They’re friends with Sans, so they would be excited to see him. They know Alphys and Undyne are dating, so they would be eager to ask Undyne about her girlfriend. And they don’t know who Rudy is.

And, of course... there’s the intro sequence.

Gaster prompts us to create a “vessel” to hold our SOUL...

A vessel that just so happens to always have exactly two stripes on their shirt.

However, the person that interrupts the intro - Chara, if you remember my post about it - doesn’t seem very happy about this whole vessel thing.

... Which would make sense if the red SOUL is actually Frisk. Frisk is Chara’s friend, Chara wouldn’t let Gaster suddenly try to turn them into a whole different person. So... What if Chara was actually trying to say “Your name is Frisk”, but was cut off?

After all, in Undertale, there’s a scene that this is likely meant to be a parallel to...

... And, of course, after beating the game, we know the speaker of this line is Asriel, and he was saying, well, “My name is Asriel”.

Speaking of Chara... the voice of the narration in Deltarune is suspiciously similar to Undertale’s, and at some points, seems to almost intentionally call back to Undertale.

(In case you’re not convinced by the above one - it matches word-for-word in the official Japanese translations, as well.)

...Which would make sense if, not only are we playing as Frisk once again...

...But Chara is the narrator once again, as well.

Of course, Frisk themselves could just as easily be the narrator. It’s difficult to tell at this point. I’m personally leaning towards Chara, though.

Also, it’s probably just a bizarre joke, but this line would make a lot more sense if the person controlling Kris was actually a child:

My favorite thing about this theory is that if it is true, Toby would have tricked us into thinking Frisk is actually an in-game representation of the player not once, but twice.

Theory 3: Chara and Asriel’s Combined SOUL

This theory proposes that the SOUL is a combined human-monster soul - specifically, Chara and Asriel’s.

It’s said in Undertale that Asriel absorbed Chara’s SOUL, and then died. However, it’s never explicitly stated that the SOUL shattered. We know that a human SOUL can persist after death presumably indefinitely if preserved properly, and a boss monster SOUL can survive outside the body for a few seconds... But we don’t know how long a combined human-monster SOUL could last outside its body.

Evidence against Combined SOUL Theory

There’s no evidence in the game that the SOUL belongs to two people. In Undertale, Asriel states that when he and Chara were sharing a SOUL, control was split between them, and they were both actively fighting for control over their body.

There isn’t any instance of any sort of “internal argument” within the SOUL. Unless you interpret the differing dialogue choices as such, but even so, you’d think there’d be more of a hint that there’s actually two people fighting for control. But who knows, maybe it’ll only become more obvious in later chapters...?

Support for Combined SOUL Theory

The red SOUL is... odd. And I don’t mean their personality, I mean the SOUL itself.

(screenshot and gif from this post, which is what inspired this theory!)

When Kris removes the SOUL from their body... It glows red and white. White, of course, is the color of a monster SOUL.

While it could just be a visual effect... It’s at least one more thing to be suspicious about.

And, like I touched on before, we never know what exactly happened to Chara and Asriel’s combined SOUL. Some people think it could even be the red heart in this machine in Undertale’s True Lab:

... and, with this theory... perhaps that machine might be somehow connected to the Deltarune universe.

Theory 4: Suzy

No, not Susie, Suzy! The one from Undertale. If you don’t know who I’m talking about, read this post.

This is my personal favorite theory, even though it’s quite unlikely. The premise of this theory is that Suzy is actually a human, and the red SOUL belongs to her.

Of course, a lot of people think “Suzy” is simply the Undertale universe version of “Susie”. That’s fair, and that theory certainly fits in with “fast approaching”. But I’m going to assume they’re completely different people for the sake of this theory. (Plus, why would Susie be the only character with a different name from their Undertale counterpart..?)

Evidence against Suzy Theory

This theory doesn’t have an explanation as to why the red SOUL knows about Alphys and Undyne’s relationship. (If you can come up with one, please tell me.) I mean, even though she exists in the Undertale universe, they only get together at the very end, and Suzy almost certainly wasn’t there. But who knows. Maybe she’s been shipping them the whole time. /s

Also, as much as I love the concept, it is quite unlikely that Suzy is a human. I do have a couple of explanations for it as you’ll see below, but I will admit that it’s still kind of a stretch. Still, what’s theory-making without a little fun?

Support for Suzy Theory

No matter whether or not Suzy ends up being the red SOUL, or even a human, she has to be in the full version of Deltarune. And, considering what we know... It’s not a stretch at all to think she might be in the very first chapter.

“Don’t Forget.” The title of the main theme of Deltarune is a phrase that is specifically associated with Suzy. In Undertale, you can only see the “don’t forget” note in Sans’ lab after speaking with Clamgirl and, consequently, learning about the existence of “Suzy”. Therefore, the phrase “don’t forget” is intrinsically linked to her.

This note also gives us another hint about who Suzy is: She knows Sans.

... Hm.

And, of course, her knowing Sans in combination with the fact that you only learn about her when you have certain “fun” values... it’s likely she knows Gaster, or at least of him.

Okay, I think you see where I’m going with this...

Now, for the “Suzy is a human” part. I’ve actually had this theory since before Deltarune, but I never made a post about it or anything.

In Undertale’s No Mercy route, Sans says something quite... interesting.

This line of dialogue implies that Sans knows or knew someone with Determination. A lot of people theorize that this line is referring to Gaster, who may have injected himself with Determination, which is a valid theory... However, I think Sans knew a human. Specifically, a human girl named Suzy.

Sans also knows a lot about concepts such as “LOVE” and “EXP”, and has secret passwords for “time travelers”. This implies that not only did he know someone with Determination, but likely with someone with the ability to “saving”, “loading”, and “resetting”... and, combined with what he talks about in his fight about “knowing our type”... it’s likely this person did a “no mercy run” in the past, or at least killed a significant amount of people.

Wait. If Suzy is a human, and she’s still alive in Undertale... How does she manage to survive in a world of monsters who need just one more human SOUL to break the barrier?

Well.

I have a few theories...

Sub-theory 1: LOVE

I mentioned before that if Suzy is a human, it’s possible, even likely, she has high LOVE.

And, well..

Apparently, once you reach 20 LOVE, you become completely unrecognizable as a human being. Even to the king of all monsters, who would otherwise even compare Frisk to his own dead human child.

Sub-theory 2: “Goner” form

Clamgirl’s “fast approaching” line shows us that, apparently, some people can switch between their “normal” forms and their “goner” (grey) forms at will.

If a human had this ability... perhaps their SOUL would also turn grey? Then it would appear more like a monster SOUL than a human one. Sure, it would still be upside-down, but it’s an interesting thing to think about.

Speaking of “goner” forms...

In the files, Deltarune’s vessel creation sequence is called “GONERMAKER”.

Sub-theory 3: She’s not fully human

Remember earlier how I mentioned how the red SOUL glows red and white in the ending sequence, and how that could possibly be a hint towards the SOUL being not fully human? Well, that could apply here, as well. It’s possible Suzy could be half-monster, but we don’t even know if that’s a possible thing. I’m thinking that perhaps she could have had her SOUL infused with monster magic or dust or something of the like, since it’s likely Gaster experimented with SOULs at some point.

Sub-theory 4: Someone is hiding her/concealing her identity as human

Since Clamgirl talks about Suzy being her neighbor’s daughter, it’s possible her parent is protecting her or even hiding her. I’m not sure how exactly this would work, but it’s a possiblity.

There’s also a few other things I’d like to mention about this theory that I couldn’t fit in:

1. Clamgirl tells Frisk that “In life’s grand scheme, [Suzy] might be why [they] came here in the first place”. This could be implying that Frisk knows Suzy from the surface, which would support the theory that she’s a human. However, it could just as easily be Clamgirl going on about how Frisk and Suzy are fated to meet, especially considering Clamgirl’s phrasing makes it seem like Frisk and Suzy haven’t met before.

2. Clamgirl’s “Fast approaching” line only appears in the Switch version of Undertale, which was released less than two months before chapter one of Deltarune came out. There are 3 possibilities you could take from this:

a. Clamgirl was lying (unlikely)

b. Deltarune’s release was a distraction from some more content coming soon that will actually feature Suzy

c. Suzy is in chapter one of Deltarune.

Conclusion

Anyway, those are the four theories I could come up with on who the red SOUL could be. It could also be a completely new character. Who knows.

Well, now that you’ve read this far... I’d actually like to gather some data. I’m curious what people think the most likely outcome is after reading this. If you could take a few seconds to vote on this poll, I’d really appreciate it!

#deltarune #deltarune spoilers #analysis

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comicteaparty · 4 years

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February 26th-March 3rd, 2020 Reader Favorites Archive

The archive for the Reader Favorites chat that occurred from February 26th, 2020 to March 3rd, 2020. The chat focused on the following question:

What generally makes the pacing of a comic too fast or too slow for you?

chalcara [Nyx+Nyssa]

My favourite comic style are those large sized, panel and dialogue heavy European comic books, line Blacksad and Asterix. Since every 80 page book tells a complete story, every page is progressing the plot significantly, and the whole thing is pretty compressed and the rate splash page has an impact you don’t get in a more lose, decompressed comic. I love that kind of stuff and I look for similiar pacing in webcomics - heavier on the dialogue but without choking the art, low on wordless scenes (they tend to make me skim), taut and tight story-telling, every page asks and answers a question. I know it‘s a matter of taste and got told more than once that I am too dumb for comics because I don‘t have the patience to read through six pages of wordless, plotless mood-setting; but eh - that kind of stuff just doesn‘t work for me. I firmly believe comic‘s big enough a field that mood pieces and tightly plotted stuff can happily co-exist and find their own readership. I‘m just gonna be in the „plot, all the time!“ corner.

sagaholmgaard

The a comic starts focusing on minor characters that don't hold much importance for the plot I'll find it to be wayy too drawn out. While One-Punch Man is one of my favorite comics, some fights are pretty unimportant for the overarching plot, focusing only on random small-fry heroes fighting random small-fry monsters and it's just... a million action panels for be too read through while waiting for the main cast to return (this turned out to be pretty specific, oops!)

Ash🦀

Honestly, coming from a writing/literature background, I feel that most comics are too fast-paced for me;; I love the slow build up, it makes everything much more rewarding at the end, and the mood-setting that just lets you breathe and stare at the page, yes, a thousand times yes. I guess this is why I don’t like reading or writing actions scenes... so fast-paced and they feel more like “this is action for interesting action and the hero needs exp and not because it’s a necessary battle” ;; but this is more of a personal preference than anything, and... yeah, I definitely blame the books I used to read xD

Capitania do Azar

I'm a little confused with the filler concept introduced here, given that most webcomics are made by individuals (not teams)... What would they even be filling for? I think it's fair to talk about less interesting b-plots or when the scenes are focused on characters we don't like as much, but I would hardly call anything a single artist decided it was worth enough to spend hours drawing by their volition "filler"

As for the pacing question, it is sometimes hard to combine the two facets of webcomics: that they're published on a page-to-page basis but they are often read in bulk, when digging through archives. I don't know if it's possible to find the perfect balance between these two, which makes it possible to think that certain scenes are too slow (oh no, we've been at this wedding for three months now!) but when read in the archive are suddenly too fast... I think breathing room is necessary every now and then, even for faster-paced comics.

RebelVampire

I think you need to consider that just because an artist doesn't see something as filler, doesn't mean readers won't. I've known a lot of comics where the creator created a scene that they loved, but in the bigger scheme of things it served absolutely no purpose to the plot and felt super out of place

So while the filler wasn't intentional as a "I need filler", to the readers it comes off as filler

FeatherNotes(Krispy)

I like long paced, slow- burn type stories where there is an obvious carefully crafted plot with each stitch placed intentionally for a bigger reveal and payoff. Much how i like any relationship shown in stories, i love it when an author almost makes readers work for that payoff. It makes the re-read value go way up, and to catch on to the subtle nuances of plot reveal on the second or third go at the story is very rewarding both as a writer and reader!

chalcara [Nyx+Nyssa]

You can easily have slow burn relationships in a faster paced comic. I actually like that better, because that usually requires the characters to have actions and interests outside of the relationship of interest, which leads to more well rounded characters.

A good example is the novel Clockwork Boys and it‘s follow up - slowburn romance, and while the characters figured THAT one out, they solved a huge mystery.

renieplayerone

Im a big fan of stories that are able to turn the pacing up to 11 on a dime without it getting old or lowering the stakes at all. It takes such talent to be able to tell compelling stories with high flying action at the same time, so I appreciate anyone that can manage that balance

chalcara [Nyx+Nyssa]

My personal approach to writing pacing is that each page has to do at least two of three: further the plot, introduce/deepen story-relevant world building, deepen the characterisation. I aim for all three at once; if there‘s only two, there better be a good reason to keep that scene around, if there‘s only one, it gets cut and/or merged with another one. Eg. I have a scene where the character cook (food‘s relevant because there‘s a famine) and a scene where they argue about their plans, those can easily be combined.

Some scenes are still slower or faster than others, but they all matter to the story.

FeatherNotes(Krispy)

Def agree with Renie on that point too!

Ash🦀

Chalcara makes a good point too, and it’s something I definitely try to keep in mind in my own pages. I try to answer a question and ask another with my pages and pull as much double duty as I can wrench out of it. Now, whether I succeed every time? Absolutely not. But this is a good reminder when I’m going back to edit issue 3- keep the push and pull of questions and answers in mind.

RebelVampire

Ok so at this point I do want to jump in and remind people that as per Rule #1, this chat should mostly be about your experiences as a reader vs. your experiences as a creator. So just want to make sure the convo doesn't delve too far into that realm.

Cronaj (Whispers of the Past)

My answer to this question is very much based on specific situations in comics. Pacing is SUCH a complex thing, and it's not always easy to see the impact in the grand scheme of things. To make a story seem too slow to me, a few things have to happen: the pages/ panels don't further the plot, don't deepen the characters/world-building, or the tension remains consistent for too long. Coming from a theatre background, I sometimes like to refer to this idea as beats. I focus a lot on the importance of every line having purpose. If a character says something, and it doesn't add anything to the experience, then perhaps the dialogue shouldn't be there at all. Or if a panel without dialogue doesn't add anything to the reader experience, the same thing applies. There should be no wasted space. Honestly, I am kind of a sucker for slow build-up (as long as there is actually build-up at all). So I'm not against slow-burn stories. To me, slow-burn shouldn't feel like it's dragging along, or like "nothing is happening," which is a common trap stories fall into. But we as readers need to see those slow moments in order to understand the fast moments too. Which brings me onto pacing that is too fast... Honestly, this is a much bigger problem to me personally. There is this influx in fiction of wanting to have the quickest jump into the action at the beginning of the story, and it always makes me want to stop reading. If the writer doesn't want to have ANY exposition at all or introduce the characters in any meaningful way, how am I as a reader going to give a shit about the characters? That's pretty much an instant story-killer to me. I don't mind if characters are introduced as we go, but completely glossing over them in favor of the biggest explosions never keeps my attention. All in all, I read comics (and fiction in general) for the human experience (which doesn't mean that your characters must be human, lol, fantasy and sci-fi writers).

keii’ii (Heart of Keol)

@chalcara [Nyx+Nyssa] Thank you for mentioning that comics are big enough to accommodate all kinds of tastes. What I find to be too fast might be just right or even too slow for another person, and honestly, it's all valid.

FeatheryJustice

I like a coherent story. It doesn't matter if it is slow paced because I get to absorb the information. I don't mind if it is fast paced as long as I can understand it. If the story itself doesn't make sense because you want a slow paced story with weird inserts in the middle, you have lost me. If your story is too fast to the point of skipping scenes and details you lost me.

spacerocketbunny

I love slow building stories with larger payoff. Making sure that characters are fleshed out and given the chance to breathe while still facilitating the plot is a tricky thing to pull off but I've definitely seen it happen in comics like Shaderunners, TINF and Tiger Tiger for example. Shaderunners does an incredible job of showing a multifaceted inner conflict with characters while never missing a beat with super fun and high stake heists. TINF is one of my favourite romance stories that carefully builds up and constructs the characters and their feelings for each other while still maintaining that significant information on every page. Tiger Tiger is a slower paced story but keeps me on the edge of my seat every update. Petra utilizes space beautifully and I never feel like there's a need for condensing on pages. I boost these comics a lot but I personally find that pacing is a huge factor in my enjoyment for a comic, and I love these ones so much bc they suit my preference quite well!

keii’ii (Heart of Keol)

There was a Korean professional webcomic (on Naver, though I don't think it ever got officially brought over to Webtoons) that I read, that had this interesting situation: seemingly fast pacing, very high tension, yet slow. It was a thriller that pitted a serial killer against the surviving wife of his latest victim. Once she got an inkling who the killer was, the tension skyrocketed, and it was a big game of chase. Problem was the chase part. It LOOKED fast paced if you just looked at like, one chapter of it. But they kept repeating the same scenario, just flavored differently. It was a rinse-and-repeat of this: "the wife found a new evidence; now everyone will believe her!" "oh no, the killer is about to catch her!" "the new evidence is lost" "wife finds another new evidence" etc. (It's been a while and my memory may not be accurate, but the idea is there) Nothing really changed throughout the repeated cycles. So yeah, repetition can be a problem.

Capitania do Azar

Haha, @keii’ii (Heart of Keol) I understand your frustration, but I feel like that kind of story is just aimed at a different audience... It almost feels like watching an episodic Tv show where everything has to come back to the starting point by the end of each episode

keii’ii (Heart of Keol)

That is certainly a type with its own audience. Though if that's what they were going for, they probably could've benefitted from a different way of starting the story so readers would've known what they were in for. And there were lots of things that really felt like could have gone somewhere, but never did.

Hmm, I guess that's another thing that could affect how pacing is perceived: loose threads?

RebelVampire

IDK I think there's a difference between something being episodic and something being annoyingly repetitious. For example, Detective Conan is arguably episodic. Each situation in the larger scheme of things is largely the same: Crime happens -> There are red herrings and twists -> Conan solves it. As a mystery comic, it's never gonna deviate from that formula. But if literally every crime had the basic same plot flow, like if the red herrings and twists were the same everytime, then it ceases to be episodic and just becomes bland and repetitive.(edited)

keii’ii (Heart of Keol)

OH and speaking of Korean webcomics, I wanna talk about a pacing-related concept that gets brought up a lot in their comment sections: yam vs sprite (they call it "cider" bu they really mean sprite/ 7-up). Baked yam is a common wintertime treat. It fills you up, it's delicious. But it's notorious for making you thirsty. It kind of clogs up & dries up your throat. Whereas sprite is a thirst quencher. So, the idea is you can't eat yams forever. You need sprite to balance it out. Yams are a metaphor for frustrating build-ups. There is a sense that you (and/or the protagonist) are being wronged. e.g. It's a sports comic, and the leader of the opposing team keeps trash talking, even cheats and gets away with it. Sprite is a metaphor for satisfaction. In the same sports comic example, the arrogant, cheating leader finally gets what they deserve. Most stories need its share of yams. But if the yam portion of the story goes on for too long, the comment section will be filled with "where's my sprite!!!" "I feel like I ate 1,000 yams and now REALLY need some sprite" etc.

spacerocketbunny

Ahh that's an interesting concept!

keii’ii (Heart of Keol)

There are certainly stories that are big piles of yams by design. But I think when done well, readers who like a lot of sprite can tell what it is, and walk away pretty early on. So those comics attract readers who are into piles of yams.

(Of course, there's always gonna be That One Person who walks into a yam party and loudly demands a 5-gallon bottle of sprite... )

LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)

In that case, I definitely avoid yams! No matter how much I love a character or cast, I tend to go crazy if we stay in one location too long, or in one slow storyline for too many pages, or if I find myself going "COME ON, DO IT, DO THE THING, WE KNOW YOU'RE GONNA." To me, something new should happen on every page, even if it's a tiny plot progression or a tidbit of character info. I very much appreciate when a story takes time to breathe - and I find it's those quiet, cute, or slightly-unnecessary moments that are most memorable when I think of a comic - but too much of that will make me fidgety. I really need alternating paces to be happy.

kayotics

I think for me, it’s easier for a comic to go too slow than too fast. I’ve definitely seen comics go too fast, but the slow pace is more frustrating for me. What makes a comic slow for me are a few things: too MUCH focus on atmosphere (like multiple hand shots that don’t have dialogue), repeated events, too much buildup for an event, and the last thing is technical ability (like speech bubbles that are too large or in vertical scroll comics the panels being way too far apart). I’m pretty ok with letting things breathe, and I actually love that, but I need something to keep my interest, and those things above don’t do it.

keii’ii (Heart of Keol)

I don't think yams are about repetition, though it can certainly involve repetition. It could be a new level of frustration on every page, revealing something new about the characters. But those would still be yams.

Deo101 [Millennium]

I'm also of the mind that its way easier for comics to go too slow than too fast. However, I think that its also really easy for a comic to introduce too many things too fast, without giving me the time to get to know anyone (contradictory, I know, hear me out) I think a lot of comics will start in a boring setting, before the initial action. It takes a very long time to ramp up to the ACTUAL story, because they want to get me to a baseline of knowledge before we get to all the action. This is really slow though because essentially nothing is actually happening, plot wise, and I think that the creators know this and so they try to do it all as fast as possible, so by the time we get to the action there are 10 characters and a ton of lore I don't actually know.... So I think there are two kinds of pacing, the actual plot/events of a story, and the introduction of new ideas. For me, the plot/events need to be relatively fast, but the introduction of ideas needs to be slow. I can't start a story with 6 people, it will feel too fast no matter what, and I can't start a story with slow action or it will feel like it's dragging. I don't know if this makes sense or not

kayotics

I think I agree with that pretty wholeheartedly. I want a comic to get me into the action pretty quickly, but introduce new characters and concepts slowly. Give me, like... 3 characters tops to start with.

keii’ii (Heart of Keol)

Yeah, too slow AND too fast is definitely a possibility!

kayotics

Fantasy and sci-fi are both genres that can fall into that trap easily, and I think the comics that bring me into the world building best is the ones that don’t explain things IMMEDIATELY, but explain things over time as I need to know them

Deo101 [Millennium]

^ yes I feel this too. I think there is also a certain respect for a readers ability to suspend their disbelief that is oftentimes not taken into account... I think that, for the most part just being told something exists is fine, and learning how it works is what needs to take time. But, a lot of stories may try to justify things existing, which feels like overexplaining

kayotics

It’s like explaining why trees exist. Sometimes they just... do. I don’t question why they’re there

LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)

Agreed, I think stories set in the real world have the advantage of starting with a bang, without much need for explanation - there's always a need for some explanation upfront in a fantasy/sci-fi setting, even if it's done through visual shorthand. You don't need to overexplain, but you definitely have to explain... more. Or at least make it abundantly clear that A) this is a different world, B) this is the general event that's happening, and C) this is how you should feel about it, even without living in that world.

Deo101 [Millennium]

Yes exactly I feel like I see it most commonly in scifi/fantasy, like you said, where someone wants to explain why their magic exists immediately. This will sound rude but at this point I don't care why it exists, maybe way later you can tell me but I don't care when I'm only just starting .. it feels like reading someone's worldbuilding essay idk

kayotics

Yeah... that’s definitely a thing that can affect pacing negatively. I don’t need a world building essay on how the magic works right away. As long as the logic is consistent in magic I’ll figure it out as a reader. Then you can explain details later and I’ll be into it.

Deo101 [Millennium]

Yeah cause later on it feels like connecting dots, almost like revealing the answer to a mystery

LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)

Yes yes! I love that sense that as a reader, you're being trusted to learn - not so much that you're being fed information, but that you're given enough to put the pieces together. Even done slowly, it's very satisfying.

chalcara [Nyx+Nyssa]

I like my storys with some unexplained mysteries. I mean, how many people know exactly how the internet works, and yet we use it daily? Dumping down a dissertation on how x works more often than not kills pacing for me.

kayotics

I think it can be done well to keep the pacing going, but it needs to be combined with something. Sometimes you need to provide that info dump so the story keeps working

I can’t pinpoint any exact scenes but I seem to remember Gunnerkrigg Court doing that pretty well. There’s a lot of unusual concepts in that story that need to be explained, but it usually doesn’t feel like a slog

Deo101 [Millennium]

Yeah for sure. I do think it can also be used either in tandem with or as an instigator to moving things forward, if done right. Its not illegal to reveal information about the world

I think people tend to do this kind of thing better with Characters than the world. Because with Characters, we want to get to know them and this comes more naturally, but with worldbuilding... It often feels like worldbuilding should be a baseline knowledge rather than also a storytelling element I guess

snuffysam (Super Galaxy Knights)

One thing that really annoys me with pacing is when a single story beat that should be relatively simple takes way too long in real time. Like in one comic I read, the villains tell the heroes to urgently meet them at some location. And, like, the heroes are talking back and forth, deciding who they should send and such. But, like... it's been six months, and they still haven't left the house yet. I guess the urgency feeling is probably there if you're binging the comic? But, it really doesn't encourage me to follow along with the comic if it's such a slow read. I'm not saying that these sorts of authors need to update faster, but if your update rate is to the point where it takes months to finish an urgent conversation, maybe some things should be cut out? Or they should at least be walking out the door while they're talking? I guess it's just sort of a general "something should happen each page" thing though. Like if the conversation is just going in circles, there's really no need for it, and it can be annoying to follow along when it's seemingly so urgent.

keii’ii (Heart of Keol)

I know it's not the same thing, but that reminded me of all the gaming comic strips out there that poke fun at "it's final dungeon time, the stakes are higher than ever, and the player spends the next 80 hours completing the minigames"

sssfrs (JOE IS DEAD)

I have a rule that if any piece of dialogue isn't either directly advancing the plot, giving the reader new information about the characters speaking, or is funny, it should be cut

Definitely agree with what people have said, that big infodumps right off the bat are not enjoyable. I honestly don't ever want the author to sit me down and explain something to me. It's much more interesting to see parts of the worldbuilding in action, or to see things that arent explained and have to theorize about what it is or how it works before the mechanics behind it are shown

Capitania do Azar

I very much second that notion, @sssfrs (JOE IS DEAD) , that's my rule of thumb when I'm writing

Deo101 [Millennium]

I have a similar rule with my pages, but with dialogue I like to have more fluff so we feel like we're spending a bit more time with them

Capitania do Azar

if the info is not something I need the reader to know (and character development is) then what's the point of forcing myself to draw more stuff

but @Deo101 [Millennium] , fluff IS character ;D

Deo101 [Millennium]

Yeah! But it's not always new information is all

You gotta reestablish stuff, let some things marinate, and repeat things for them to really settle in I think, so it can't ALWAYS be new stuff, even if the page as a whole is introducing something new. I mean usually you can do it alongside other stuff but yeah

keii’ii (Heart of Keol)

I think sometimes it's the same for the characters. e.g. The same characters can have multiple conversations about the same topic, but their understanding/ feelings toward the topic can change as things marinate.

Deo101 [Millennium]

Yeah for sure

sssfrs (JOE IS DEAD)

Meaningful conversations where you get to know the character’s personality would fall in the 2nd category

Sometimes its hard to judge whether dialogue will be interesting to someone who’s unfamiliar with the characters

Shadowmark Productions

Someone once told me that dialogue should reveal character and action reveals plot. If done correctly, both work in tandem to advance the story without exposition. I’ve found that to be very useful.

LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)

Ooh. True!

mirandalorian

That's a good way to put it. And it seems like that idea is pretty important in comics.

keii’ii (Heart of Keol)

I think it's 100% fine if dialogue isn't interesting to people unfamiliar with the characters -- as long as it's compelling to people who have been reading from the beginning?

I live for the kind of scenes where like... character A just smiles... it's an ordinary smile to people who don't know A, but it means the world to people who know the context and the character

sssfrs (JOE IS DEAD)

Action can reveal character too

chalcara [Nyx+Nyssa]

I‘d say it‘s even more important, I for starters love characters that say one thing and do another; it‘s a good way to show conflict!

(Inner conflict, I mean)

RebelVampire

For me whether I think the pacing is too fast or too slow are actually two different things. In regards to finding the pacing too slow, I generally base this on a character's progress for their goals. While I like to see characters face setbacks and don't expect everything to be solved immediately, I expect some progress to be had. So if I wind up reading a comic and it's basically taking more than 100 pages for any progress to be made in the protagonist's goal and growth, that's just way too slow for my personal tastes. It kind of just ruins my investment in their goal since it doesn't feel like they're actually working on it, and that kind of defeats the point of a goal. In a similar but different vein, pacing is too fast for me if the comic never stops to breathe to exposit or showcase character emotions. Obviously, expositing a whole bunch is bad, and you don't want to take 20 pages to show a character crying. However, these moments where you take a step back and say "Hey look this character is struggling and here is a hint of their backstory" are super important for creating a bond between the reader and the characters. Without them, it just feels like you're sprinting from Plot Point A to Plot Point B. In relation to this, another element that would make it too fast is if characters are getting over things way too fast because plot is to be had. When something emotional happens, such as a character dies, I should still be able to feel those affects much later even if its not at the forefront. Of course, these are clearly just to my personal tastes, which pacing generally is a subjective thing in most cases.

Eightfish (Puppeteer)

For sure that thing about needing space after emotional events

not a webcomic but some of my favorite parts of One Piece are the crew goofing off after ever major arc

I feel like webcomics can fail at this sometimes, because things that feel tediously slow when writing week -by-week can feel fast when read back all at once

#ctparchive #comics #webcomics #indie comics #comic chat #comic discussion #reader favorites #comic tea party #ctp

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sanderssidesfanfiction · 5 years

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We’ll Carry On - Chapter Forty Three

We’ll Carry On Tag

General Content Warnings: Sympathetic Deceit Sanders, Substance Abuse, Abandonment, Minor Character Death, Transphobia, Implied/Referenced Child Abuse, Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder, Dissociation, Bullying, Homophobia

February 16th, 2019

Logan woke up slowly, blinking the sleep out of his eyes. It was a Saturday, so he didn’t have to worry about his alarm going off. Something was different, though, and he couldn’t put his finger on it. He stared at the ceiling for a minute. His hair had been cut, but he had gotten used to that, mostly. He was in the Picani’s place, not the Harkness’ place, which he was also used to.

Roman walked in their shared bedroom, grinning. “Hey, sleepyhead. Your legal dads are waiting for you downstairs with a celebratory breakfast.”

Logan blinked, frowning, trying to absorb that information. It hit him over the head like a sack of bricks: he was adopted yesterday! That’s what was different! He was legally part of a family again! He grinned, sitting up. “All right, all right, I’m up,” he said, grabbing a sports bra and getting dressed. Today was going to be a good day.

February 15th, 2020

Logan sat up in bed with a stretch and a sigh. It was February fifteenth, according to his phone, which had a little reminder about “Dad and Ami go crazy today.” He tried to puzzle that out for a minute before he remembered: the anniversary of his adoption. Dad and Ami had done a celebration for Roman about a month before, and they had asked Logan what he wanted in terms of his. He said he didn’t want a lot of fanfare, just maybe picking out lunch or dinner and his family there to support him.

The odds of that actually happening were slim to none, but hey, he tried. He climbed out of bed, got dressed, and stumbled down the stairs, rubbing his eyes with his free hand. “Ugh,” he grumbled as he walked into the kitchen.

“Morning, Lo,” Dad said with a smile. “Sleep well?”

“Debatable,” Logan responded, voice creaking in protest of being used.

“Have some juice to help your voice,” Dad said, gesturing to the fridge. “Then you can help yourself to breakfast, because I know you wanted to experiment with cooking.”

“Mm,” Logan hummed his thanks and went to the fridge, bringing out apple juice and pouring it into a glass Dad passed him. He took a grateful sip, letting the sugar coat his throat. He put the apple juice back and pulled out an egg. “Show me how to make one sunny-side up?” he requested.

“Sure,” Dad agreed.

Roman came down and grabbed breakfast as Dad was teaching Logan to cook the egg, and Dee, Virgil, and Pat soon ran to the den and turned on the TV for Saturday morning cartoons. Logan took his breakfast, successfully cooked, into the dining room to eat and think. Roman came over to him with a Pop Tart and spoke as he ate. “Any idea where we’re going for lunch or dinner?”

Logan pulled a face. “Roman, don’t talk with your mouth full. I don’t need you spraying crumbs all over my breakfast.”

“Mm. Shorry,” Roman mumbled. He swallowed. “Still, any idea?”

Logan shrugged. “Not really. I don’t really want to go anywhere super fancy. Maybe...like, Panera. Their sandwiches are good, even if it makes me sound like a ‘basic white girl.’”

“You are not basic, nor are you a girl,” Roman pointed out.

“True,” Logan allowed. “But people will say I sound like one anyway, even if I pass as a guy.”

“Why?” Roman asked.

“Well, if I pass as a guy, they aren’t using it to misgender me, they’re just insulting my taste,” Logan said with a shrug. “As far as I’ve gathered, at any rate. People are...not my strong suit.”

“Yeah, I’ve gathered that before,” Roman said with a grin and a bite from his Pop Tart. “But seriously, why do people compare guys to girls as an insult?”

Logan shrugged. “Because effeminate men are not supposed to exist, I suppose.”

Roman nodded, before frowning. “Logan...”

“Hm?”

“If you were...I don’t know...able to get surgery at one point, if that’s what you wanted. And your breasts were gone. So people very clearly saw you as a guy. Would you ever wear dresses or skirts or makeup?”

Logan considered. “I’m...not sure. I suppose I would give it a try, but...I don’t think I would go out of my way to do it often. I’m more androgynous-to-masculine in my style.”

Roman nodded. “That’s fair. I was just wondering if you didn’t like feminine things because you didn’t pass, or if you just didn’t like feminine things.”

“No, I’m just more masculine in style,” Logan said. “However, I do like pastels. I don’t wear them often because they make me look more ‘soft’ according to people at school, but they are fun to wear, provided I don’t get misgendered wearing them.”

“So when you’re an adult and have had all the surgeries you want, you’ll wear pastels and be the man of your dreams?” Roman asked. “Oh, wait, my mistake, Jack is the man of your dreams,” he teased.

“Roman, I will kill you,” Logan warned.

Roman just laughed, finished his breakfast, and left the room. Logan sighed and finished his breakfast before retreating to his room to read for a few hours. He considered writing, especially because he had seen a fascinating Sherlock Holmes theory recently, but he didn’t have the energy to write too much today.

So he read, curled up on his bed, until there was a knock at the door and Dad poked his head in. “Hey, did you want to go out for lunch as a celebration?” he asked. “Or should I come back around dinner?”

“Lunch is fine,” Logan said, putting down his book and standing. “I was just thinking we could go to Panera. Somewhere simple. Everyone likes something there, and we don’t go very often. Besides, I like their sandwiches.”

Dad smiled. “Sounds perfect. Shall we go?”

Logan nodded and followed Dad downstairs and out the door as Ami wrangled the boys into the van. Logan just sat in his usual spot, scrolling his phone. To him, it felt more or less just like another Saturday. The exception being that they were going out to lunch at a place of his choosing.

When they finally managed to get everyone inside the restaurant and figured out their orders, Ami suggested, “Why don’t you find a table, Logan? I need to grab something from the car, but the boys can stay with Dad, or they can help you if you want.”

Logan squinted. It wasn’t like Ami to forget something in the car. This was probably what his surprise was going to be, like Roman’s surprise was the book from his mom. Still, he didn’t want to ruin the surprise for the others, and Dad and Ami were clearly desperate for him to play along. “Okay. Dee, do you want to help me find a spot that’s quiet enough for you?”

Dee nodded and the two walked away from the rest of the group. Logan sighed. Dee looked up at him. “Dad and Ami are trying to surprise you,” he signed.

“Yeah, I figured,” Logan said with a tired smile. “I didn’t want a lot of fanfare, though. It’s an important day, true, but I don’t like all the attention on me. Some is fine, but all? That makes me uncomfortable.”

Dee nodded in understanding. “Same,” he signed.

They found a table in the front, by the windows that no one was using. Most of the people around here were quiet, too, so Logan and Dee took a seat. Logan stared out the front window and sighed again. “I know this is supposed to be a happy day, and it is, but I feel...I don’t know,” he muttered.

“Bittersweet?” Dee asked.

“Monachopsis, maybe. I just always, always feel like I’m slightly out of place. Even in this family, where everyone belongs, I feel like I...don’t. And usually it doesn’t bug me, but today, I guess I thought I could relax and fit in with the rest of the family, but I still feel...off,” Logan said.

Dee shrugged. “I felt that way for a while,” he admitted. “I thought the second I did something bad Dad and Ami would send me away. Because they’re good people and I’m me. But I screwed up, and they forgave me, and we moved on, and I’m still here. You do fit in, even if you don’t feel it. And it’s okay if you don’t feel it.”

Logan signed a quick “Thank you,” to Dee as Patton and Virgil ran over, giggling, and Roman and Dad were carrying trays with lunch behind them.

“That should be everyone’s lunch,” Dad said. “Now we just have to wait for Ami.”

Patton and Virgil giggled more and Roman grinned. Dee looked about as lost as Logan felt. “Did I miss something?” Logan asked.

“Dad told us what he and Ami got you for your adoption anniversary,” Roman said. “And we all agree you’re going to love it.”

“What is it?!” Dee asked frantically. Virgil whispered in his ear, so quietly that Logan couldn’t hear it. But Dee gasped loudly and held his hands over his mouth as he exclaimed, out loud, “Really?!”

Patton nodded. “Yeah! They decided they should kickstart it now, to help later on!”

Dee turned to Logan. “You’re gonna love it,” he signed, practically bouncing in his seat.

Logan felt a little stunned at the sheer energy at the table. This wasn’t fanfare, but it was attention, and he wasn’t sure how he felt about it. Ami came over, with an envelope about the size to fit a greeting card. “Sorry for the wait, everybody!” Ami said. “There was no way I could just give the game away the second we came inside and I was holding this!” He passed it to Logan. “But you’re free to open it now.”

“Okay...?” Logan said, sliding his finger under the seal of the envelope.

Opening it, he saw it was indeed a greeting card. It said “Bye bye ta tas” on the front. He opened the card and his eyes widened in surprise. There were five twenty dollar bills residing in it, and when he took them out, the inside of the card said, “Hoping all goes well with your top surgery!”

“Maybe the card was a little preemptive, because obviously you’re not getting top surgery yet...” Ami said.

“...But we figured we could kickstart the fund to help you get there, since you’ve told us that’s the route you want to go,” Dad finished. “We told your grandparents our plan and they immediately contributed fifty dollars to the cause.”

“I...I don’t...” Logan swallowed. “I don’t know what to say. ‘Thank you’ doesn’t begin to cover it.”

“Say you accept, and maybe let us tell you there’s a jar at home with your name on it,” Ami said with a grin. “We want to support you in whatever way we can, Logan. And if we can help fund your top surgery, we’ll do it.”

“I...okay,” Logan said, still staring in shock at the card.

“Also, Logan, you might want to eat before your food gets cold,” Dad gently prompted.

Logan jolted upright like he had been shocked and nodded, putting the money back in the card with the envelope and the card on his lap. “Right. Good point. Thanks.”

Everyone started to eat, excitedly chatting. “That’s such a cool anniversary gift!” Patton exclaimed. “Helping to get top surgery! How much does that cost, anyway?”

“Like, a couple thousand dollars,” Roman said, pulling a face. “And that’s not counting what you have to pay the hospital, and the doctors beyond the surgeon, and the consultations. So a hundred bucks won’t get the entire thing done, but it’s a decent start.”

“Yeah,” Logan agreed softly. “It’s a long process, but I’ll get there.”

“I know you will,” Patton said, with all the certainty that he would use saying gravity existed. “Because you don’t let other people tell you what to do. You do what you want when it comes to your body. That’s super cool, and super brave.”

Logan tried not to feel choked up at that, and failed. He felt a few tears slip through his façade, but he let them fall. This was his family, they wouldn’t judge him for crying. Dee pat Logan’s leg softly and Logan laughed, giving Dee a quick, one-armed hug before going back to eating.

“Wait,” Virgil said. “Why do you need a surgeon to do that job?”

“Because breasts aren’t just fat,” Roman said. “They have veins and stuff and you could get hurt if you didn’t know what you’re doing. So you need a surgeon.”

“Oh,” Virgil said. He wrinkled his nose. “That’s still expensive, though.”

Logan sighed. “Yeah. But one day it’ll be worth it,” he nodded before continuing, “I’ll look like the man I was meant to be, and no one is going to take that away from me.”

#we'll carry on #sanders sides fanfiction #logan sanders #deceit sanders #remy sanders #emile picani #our creations #danger gays

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joyofcrime-elinorhigh · 5 years

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Ouran High School Host Club REVIEW:

Hello there, everybody. My name is JoyofCrimeArt and welcome to the first cartoon review in my month long "Deviant-cember." event. For those of you who don't know every Friday for the rest of December I will be posting a new cartoon review, because I really enjoy making these reviews and hopefully you really enjoy reading them. Plus why not make something extra for the month of December. I mean all of those Youtubers are doing it. Anyway, I think I've gotten a bit off track, it's review time! So a couple months ago my little brother decided to randomly pick a show off of Netflix and start watching it. After he saw the first episode he decided to ask me if I was interested in watching it with him. This show was none other than the 2006 anime series "Ouran High School Host Club!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S1SxNoqhwHA

For those who are unaware, "Ouran High School Host" is an anime series produced by Studio Bones and based on the long running manga by Bisco Hartori. This manga series seems to be pretty big in Japan as this series not only got an anime adaptation but also a live action series that aired on the Japanese version of TBS. And THAT series was apparently popular enough to warrant a live action film based on the series to be created. I didn't even know that Japan even had any live action shows! Like what!? Man, what will those Japanese people think of next... Anyway Ouran High School Host Club is a comedy anime that pokes fun at the Shojo genre of anime and manga. The Shojo genre seems to be defined as, quote "Them anime's where people don't spend all of there time powering up, fighting, and blowing stuff up." I didn't even know that Japan even had any anime like that! Like what!? Man, what will those Japanese people think of next...All jokes aside Shojo is apparently anime that is mainly targeted mainly at teenage girls. I've never seen any other "Shojo" anime before this but if this parody series in indication I would guess it features a lot of roses, fancy outfits, and flamboyant men. But enough background information, let's talk about the series plot! The series focuses on Haruhi Fujinoka, a first year high school student who is attending the illustrious private school Ouran Academy on scholarship. (SIDE NOTE: the show makes a big deal about, even though we actually only see our main characters actually DOING schoolwork in like two episodes out of the twenty six. And even in those episodes all we see are characters do is like a fitness exam and planning a school fair. Like does anybody actually do like, math and stuff at this school? Like, I know this show is about an after school club and all, but dang! Okay tangent over.) Everything is going well until Haruhi accidentally walks into the room of the Ouran High School Host Club. Now, I know what you may be wondering if you aren't Japanese or haven't seen this show before, "What is a host club?" Now, I'm not going to say that I'm an expert on the subject or anything but based on my limited research a host club is basically a less sexual and gender flipped version of a Hooters. There basically bars or clubs that feature attractive men who's job is to charm and flirt with female customers. This show takes that idea and just puts it into a high school and removes the alcohol. Haruhi accidentally knocks over a vase that belongs to the club and, since this is a precious private school owned entirely by rich people, the vase is valued at 8,000,000 yen, or a about 70,561 dollars American (give or take inflation. Thanks Google!) And thus, Haruhi is forced to work at the host club in order to pay off her debt but, shocking twist, Haruhi is actually a girl! Wah Wah Wah! So now Haruhi has to disguise herself as a man in order to work of her debt to the host club, and many shenanigans ensue!

(You know that the vase is going to break because they have an arrow pointing at it for the entire scene before Haruhi breaks it. It's because the show thinks that if there wasn't an arrow pointing at the vase, we might forget that the vase is important.) So let's talk about the members of the host club. First we have Haruhi. She's smart, hardworking, and independent to a fault. She acts as the straight man of the group and honestly she serves that role perfectly. Her default emotion ninety percent of the time seems to just be "indifference," and I mean that in the best possible way. Her deadpan attitude acts as a perfect foil for the other members of the host club. That being said it's not like she's a static character, as she does show emotion when a scene calls for it. Without Haruhi down to earth attitude the show would not work at all, as without it the show would just become to zany. You really need that voice of reason character to balance out the wackiness, even in a show as silly as this. Also, while I don't know how much this applies in the Japanese version her American voice actress, Caitlin Glass, does an excellent job delivering her lines as this character. Also yes, I did watch this show dubbed and not subbed and that is because I am a FILTHY CASUAL PLEBE! Next we have Tamaki, the leader and co founder of the host club. Tamaki is very much the dumb but beautiful type of character. He's self absorbed, though it seems to come less from a place of ego and more from just a place of ignorance. And despite him being so self absorbed he isn't selfish. He is shown to be a kind person who cares deeply about helping people, which does keep him likable. Tamaki is just such a passionate character it's hard for you as the viewer to not get as passionate as he is. He has a crush on Haruhi, which is obvious to everybody except himself. Many episodes focus on him trying to impress her, or focusing on his jealousy of anybody else who wants to get close to Haruhi, leading to many comedic situations. The obvious irony here is that Tamaki is in love with the only girl in the school who isn't madly in love with him. Like for real, every other girl in the school just melts in his hand, except for Haruhi. This is something I simply do not get, Tamaki is a doofus. I just don't see the attraction.

I mean sure he's attractive, I guess! What with that shaggy blond hair, and those deep blue eyes...that look like two glistening pools of water in the moonlight. And he does have a sort of innocent boyish charm to him...and those luscious, kissable lips....I-Ugh, what was I talking about again? Oh yeah, the review! Hehe, um...Where was I again? Also in the dub Tamaki is voiced by none other then Vic Mignogna. Most people would probably recognize him as Eric Elric from "Full Metal Alchemist" but the role that I most recognize him from is Uncle Qrow from "RWBY." QROW IS TAMAKI GUYS! I WILL NEVER BE ABLE TO TAKE QROW SERIOUSLY AGAIN!

Then we have Kyouya, the other co-founder of the host club. He's in charge of all of the planning and actual day to day running of the host club. He also acts as a straight man for the group, though not as much as Haruhi. He's cold and calculated, being in the club more business reasons as oppose to Tamaki who does it in order to make women happy. He's an excellent foil for Tamaki and an excellent tool for exposition for the writers, because he always does extensive background checks on literally every character in the series because, well, he's kinda a creep. Though in all serious he is a good character, especially as we get to learn more about him and get past his calculating exterior, as we learn he truly does have a soft side. Then we have twins Hikaru and Karou, who are in the club in order to appeal to guest who attracted to a certain, specific, type of yaoi....And this has gotten weird already if you get what I'm saying. Though to be fair it is left a bit vague how much of there "brotherly love." is real and how much is just an act for there clients. They are mischievous and overall pretty awful people overall, doing really jerky things pretty much just for the fun of it. Luckily they do get character development over time that fixes this a little, but yeah. They look completely identical to each other and act pretty much the same for the first half of the series too. There's even an episode where the dye there hair differently so it'd be easier to tell them apart.

(...I think this how Akira Toriyama got his inspiration for the "Future Trunks Arc" of Dragonball Super.) They do however start to divulge more in the second half with Hikaru being more rash and more of a jerk while Karou being a bit kinder and more sensitive. But don't worry, if you think that that's the last of the awkward and possibly unfortunate implications this show presents, you'd be way off- -Cause we also have Honey! He's a seventeen year old who's whole gimmick is that he both looks and acts like a five year old...God damn it, Japan. Okay to be fair the girls in the host club don't seem to actually seem to be "attracted" to him per say, they seem to just like to fangirl over how cute he is. So at least there's that. Honey is the cute one of the host club, who loves naps, stuffed animals, and cakes. While the anime gives no explanation on why Honey looks and acts the way he does the creator of the original manga gives one, and it's the dumbest answer ever. Bisco Hatori has jokes the reason Honey looks and acts so young is because Honey was born on February 29th, and thus only ages every four years. Well played Hatori, well played. There's also the host club manager, Renge. Now according to Tvtropes at least, she's kinda a base breaker character, meaning people either love her or hate her. I personally love her, but I totally understand how people might find her annoying. She's doesn't really serve much purpose to most of the plot, probably because she was only in one chapter of the manga. She's an insane Otaku who's only real purpose is to be genre savvy. She also always rises from the grown on a platform powered by a powerful motor. Even when there outside or something. Don't ask, there is no explanation.

...Oh, there's also Mori. Yup. Mori's was definitely there too.

here are some other characters, like Nekozawa, Haruhi's dad, and Zuka club but I don't want to go into all of those characters here. I don't want to spoil the entire show. Oh! I almost forget everybody's favorite side character, John Cena Senpai!

(All credit to twitter.com/thaniasenpai for the original tweet/joke.) If there was one word that I would use to describe this show it would be "farcical." This is a really frickin' silly, especially in the first half. There's lots of yelling, over exaggerated facial expressions, and even some fourth wall jokes. Also this show has this weird thing with banana peels. Like y'know how in most slapstick comedies you'll see a character eating a banana, and then they'll drop the peel and later on some character will slip on it. This show just skips the set up and just has them slipping on the peel from the get go. The banana peels seem to just, kinda spawn. It's really kooky. The comedy is definitely over the top, but it's a really fun kind of over the top that I found to be very enjoyable personally. When your "Alice and Wonderland" episode of your show is actually one of the more serious episodes, I think it says something about the tone of your story.

(Example of Kooky.) About half way through the series the show starts to change in tone slightly. The show still remains goofy all the way through, (That image above me is actually a shot from one of the last scenes of the last episode.) but we start to get some more serious episodes mixed in with the silly ones, or episodes that have both silly and serious elements to them. We start to get more backstory on the various members of the host club and it's actually pretty effective the majority of the time. It's really weird because you wouldn't expect the show to go off in that direction but I think it's good that it did. They know not to ever make things get to heavy and give us just enough drama to be drawn into the story a bit more without substituting the shows original appeal, which is the comedy. We see the characters open up and develop as time goes on, becoming more complex and interesting. Honestly after watching all twenty six episodes of this show I didn't really have much to complain about. The only problems the show has is that the jokes don't always land and some of the unfortunate implications. And I don't just mean the stuff I mentioned earlier with Honey and the twins. When you get right down to it a lot of the host clubs antics, if placed in a less comedic setting would be a lot more creepy. Like how Tamaki claims himself as Haruhi's "Daddy." and tries to stop her from having any romantic relationship with someone else, and is kinda forcing Haruhi into his weird love club until she starts to actually start enjoying the club, almost like stockholm syndrome. Now obviously that's not the implication we're suppose to take away from all of this, as the show's tounge and cheek attitude prevents any of this stuff from getting too weird, and the bond between Haruhi and the members of the host club are genuine, I'm just saying that there's an great darker and edgier horror movie in here waiting to be made! So in conclusion is Ouran High School Host Club the greatest anime ever made? Yes. IN YOUR FACE "Hayao Miyazaki!" No, while Ouran High School Host Club may not be the greatest anime ever made by any stretch, I found it surprisingly enjoyable. It has great characters, good comedy, and a surprisingly well told and heart warming story. I think a lot of the parody and and some of the weird implications the series would work a bit better if I know more Japanese culture and the shojo genre, but regardless I do think it's a good show that is worth watching. This show will not be for everybody. It's comedy may be seen as "too goofy" for some, some of the implications might be a bit squicky for some people, and some people may not be able to get over how flamboyant and cheesy it is. But if your willing to look past all of that, and your just in the mood for a silly, nonsensical farce featuring a lot over the top characters, a lot of yaoi overtones, and a lot, and I mean a lot of roses, Ouran Highschool Host Club might just be the show to give you all of that, plus maybe a little bit more. While the show is no longer available on Netflix it is still available on Hulu both subbed and dubbed. You can also watch the series on Funimation.com for free, or buy the series on DVD and blu-ray. Check if the show sounds interesting to you maybe check it out. It'll most likely be time well spent. So that's my review of Ouran High School Host Club. Have you seen the show? What do you think of it? Feel free to tell me your thoughts in the comments down bellow. Even if you disagree with my opinion I'd love to hear yours. Feel free to fav, follow and comment on this post if you liked the review. And don't forget to come back next week for the second review in my multi-part "Deviant-cember." where I'll be talking about the 1992 Holiday "classic" Frosty Returns. See you guys then and have a great day.

(And here we have Tamaki, about to break through Wall Maria, releasing the titans onto the citizens of the Shiganshina District.) (I do not own any of the images or videos in this review all credit goes to there original owners.)

https://www.deviantart.com/joyofcrimeart/journal/Ouran-High-School-Host-Club-REVIEW-650271772 DA Link

#ouran host club #Ouran High School Host #Anime #Cartoon Review #2000's

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anotherenbyjourney · 6 years

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why now?

Something I was asked by my doctor during my assessment was: Why now? Why look to pursue surgery now? Why come out to everyone and make these changes now? I turn 30 in just over a month. I’m not a kid, or a teen anymore. Far from it. I suppose I should know who I am by now, should have had that figured out, but honestly do any of us ever really know who we are? Ever?

My entire life I’ve felt just... Odd. Weird. “Other” a lot of the time. Not just because I’m a nerd (that’s not helped lol), but I have never really fit in properly with the majority of your average girls or women. I felt the “odd one out” amongst my family who were predominantly female. In offices staffed with majority women, I felt like a complete outsider. I’ve very rarely “clicked” with girls and I get along a LOT easier and faster with guys. Any age, any background, any education level, getting along with guys was much smoother.

I put it down to “they just don’t “get” you”. I didn’t get the same feeling with my friends, male or female. We shared enough of the same interests, had the same sense of humour, liked the same things etc. But that’s how it works right? The people you click and vibe with, you make friends with. Age was maybe also a factor in “not gelling” with other women. People also come from different walks of life.

“You're not just a big weird freak, you’re just made from entirely different moulds, right? You can’t get along with everyone?”

It’s only within the last few years that I started finding out about gender issues, nonbinary specifically. The more and more I read into it, the more stats and facts and studies I absorbed, the more little bits of information, the more RELATABLE AS HELL the stories I was reading were getting... the more I started to consider; Hey wait a minute. This is all making FAR too much goddamn sense.

It took a while for things to start adding up to the point I started making changes in my life or thinking differently about myself. All the things I was learning, and how they related to me and the way I think and feel, started to change my outlook on myself. About 2 and a half years ago, I started thinking to myself: “Right. I’m Nonbinary. This is me!” I tried it on, entirely privately, non-verbally. It’s how I thought about myself. And it... fit. It worked. It felt right.

Some time later, I told my husband and a few very close friends “hey I think I might be nonbinary” or at the very least “I’m having very weird Gender Feelings you guys...” The ability to talk it out and bounce ideas and feelings off my friends, some of whom are trans themselves, has been utterly invaluable. Last year I made more baby steps towards accepting this strange new-but-not-new part of myself, that I’d managed to finally put a name to. I told a few more people. I would drop it into casual convo. I made posts around pride week and national coming out day. The binder I’d bought to wear for cosplay purposes, I started wearing on a more casual everyday basis. I -embraced- my masculine swings a lot more often and dressed how I wanted to dress, moved how I wanted to move, spoke how I wanted to speak. The way that felt most natural at that time. I stopped worrying I “looked super butch” or “like a lesbian” when I looked and dressed more masculine.

And it all felt - really good-.

Imagine you’ve gone the majority of your life, thinking like.. “theres just something not quite right here.” It’s nothing causing you physical pain. There are no real symptoms you can put a finger on. “Not fitting in with women”, “not being into girl stuff”, “having body confidence and body image issues”, “liking to wear boys clothes/have short masc haircuts/wearing cologne/etc/etc/etc” were all just weird little facets of yourself you’d had to live with and feel weird and “other” about.

And then suddenly someone goes: hey that weirdness you’re feeling? There’s a name for that. You’re not just a freak! You’re not different all of a sudden, nothing has changed, but aaaall the stuff that made you “you”, makes a heck of a lot more sense now that you can put a name on it.

This is not “Who I Am Now”. This is Who I Have Always Been.

It all started to make sense. Everything. I wasn’t just weird. I didn’t have to worry about “looking like a man” anymore. My dysphoria made SENSE. It sucked ass, and still made me feel like shit, but it made sense! I’m not broken.

The biggest “click” and the thing that lit a real fire under me was New Years eve 2017. It was a themed party, and people were all in costumes. I went as a male character and wore my binder (I’m going to talk a bit about costuming as male characters later because this is also Important I think). I’d had a few drinks, and when it came time to take the costume off and get into something a bit more comfy after midnight (and because I was coming to the end of my binder time. I like to bind safely) I found that it was HEARTRENDINGLY UPSETTING... to take the binder off and “go back to being girl-me again”. I’d always been really sad after a solid weekend of dressing as a man for male costumes and having to “go back to normal” but this was like an intense version of that feeling. That I’d spent 29 years doing this, living with and putting up with “girl-me”. Like that version of myself wasn’t the real me at all. That I was facing another year, approaching thirty, and that this was going to be how things were for the rest of my life unless I did something about it.

January 2nd I sent out an email to my chosen doctor (I’d been researching it all for months at the back end of 2017 but done nothing about it) to try and book an appointment to pursue top surgery, which I told my husband about and we had a long discussion around.

February 4th I came out to my mum and my two sisters who had a lot of questions but were incredibly supportive. They told me that “actually that makes a lot of sense...” considering my childhood, and while they were worried for me from a “this is a surgery you cannot come back from, I hope you’re sure” point of view, supported me there too.

Last month I went a lot more public with my gender and I’m trying to make more and more people aware of it, since I interact with large groups of varied people as part of cosplay and costuming. I’ve literally faced nothing but support (and questions of course, but I’ve got all the time in the world for supportive people who just want to understand things so they can better help and support their friends and others like me.)

It’s been thirty years. And I still have a long way to go. But I’ve honestly never been more comfortable within myself and with every babystep I’ve taken towards hacking my way out of this shitty little “desperately trying to conform to gender standards” chrysalis I’ve been trapped in for my entire life, the better I’ve felt.

#trans uk #transgender uk #top surgery #nonbinary #enby #nb #nb uk #enby uk #nonbinary uk #big question post #why now #gender issues #dysphoria #tw!dysphoria #tw:dysphoria #binder #gender questioning

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crouzerzero · 6 years

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Yahari ore no seishun rabu come wa machigatteiru Vol.12 Chapter 1 " Finally, the seasons change, and the snows melt."

Translated by FatFluffyFish’s I have long since gotten used to the winter cold. Because I have never left my place of birth, or this street, this cold was something I’ve been acquainted with for a very long time. Thus, I didn’t feel that there was anything special about winter in Chiba. Whether it’s the dry air, the prickling icy wind, or the chills creeping up my back from my feet, they weren’t that particularly loathsome. Though, it was still annoying. You could say that for things with which one becomes accustomed, they are seen as natural occurrences, and thus are widely accepted. Anyway, whether it’s hot or cold, it’s a question of how much that has surpassed the current weather standards. In other words, you can’t compare this cold against anything if you have never experienced winter in other places. So, if you don’t know what warmth is, then you would never know about other sources of warmth. For example, warmth is just like when you blow out white breaths of air to warm your frozen hands, or the soft sound of your coat and muffler rubbing against each other, or just like when a bunch of people sit on a bench and accidentally rub their knees against each other, or even the simple heat from the person sitting next to you. I thought about why warmth obtained through touch was so scary as I stretched myself. By the way, the people sitting next to me were Yukinoshita and Yuigahama. The two of them were sitting a fist apart. At night, in this park that was just next to the sea, there was no one else but the three of us. If I looked up, I could see the two condo buildings where Yukinoshita was staying. This park was a small walk away from the shopping district in front of the station, and if you took the main road, you would immediately arrive at the street filled with condominiums. Although it was by the sea, because of the presence of various majestic trees, and the trees planted to firm the sand, the sea breeze was not that chilly. Even so, the reason why we all could feel the winter air so strongly was because of the lack of people, and the gradually accumulating snow. The day was still the 14th of February. People call this day Valentine’s Day — or the day of dried sardines. Today was the day that my sister, Komachi, was going to be taking the entrance exam for my school. At the same time, it was the day where we headed towards the aquarium together. The snow that had fallen since morning had not accumulated much, but its presence could clearly be seen on the trees and grass. Let me tell you, snow can absorb noise. Although I didn’t think that such a thin layer of snow could possibly reduce noise by any discernable amount, it seemed like none of us were making any noise — just staring off silently into the night. For a fleeting moment, the moonlight snow and streetlamps illuminated us. Thanks to that, our figures lit up brightly in contrast to the dark night. I remembered that in the past, the lamps emitted a pale fluorescent light. If that was still the case now, I am pretty sure that light would make us all feel colder. The orange color that reflected off the snow did however give off a warm vibe. Still, the snow would disappear after the slightest touch. That warm, transient light tells me that the sparkling snow that fell into the ocean in the setting sun was not a hallucination. Snow had indeed fallen, and the day that we had spent together was real as well. The snow was proof of it, yet, with a subtle temperature difference, or with the slight passing of time, it will disappear. If you touch it, it disappears, and if you play with it, it will crumble and break. However, even if nothing was done to it, it will still disappear one day. If the weather remains cold like this, is it possible that it would stay there forever…? I keep thinking about these meaningless “ifs.” With a shiver, I tossed those wild thoughts aside. The answer to that was found long ago when I made that snowman back when I was a kid. I shook my head, and left the bench. From the corner of my eyes, I spotted a half red half blue vending machine. Just as I was about to head over, I turned my head and asked, “Want to drink something?” Hearing my question, they looked at each other for a brief moment, but just as quickly, they nodded their heads. I nodded my head to show that I understood. I walked to the vending machine and took out some spare change from my wallet. Like always, I chose coffee. Then, I chose two plastic packaged red teas as well. Squatting down, I quietly slipped them into my coat’s pocket. As I was taking out the drinks one by one, the last one that reached my hand was a little scalding yet had an unusual chill to it. If I were to keep holding it, I would definitely be scalded. As I quickly tossed the can back and forth from one hand to another, I thought about the reason why it would even feel cold. When my hand got used to the heat of the can, my question was answered. The warmth that could be felt by one’s body could be represented in numbers. Without ascribing to them any sort of meaning, they are only numbers. However, I do know of warmth that was more than that. The difference between warmth and warm temperature was not just in their words. I had felt it through actual experience as well. Despite that, I didn’t feel that I had noticed anything worth praising since I had only just realized that. When comparing the warmth that I could obtain through coffee with a 100 yen coin, I felt that the warmth given off from body temperature that I received in that swift instant when our knees touched was a lot warmer. While ignoring the heat in my hand, I continued to walk towards the bench. As I walked, I reminisced about the warmth in my chest that had remained to this day. I had an inkling that, most likely, it was no longer possible for me to feel this warmth again. Hence, I wanted to let time freeze in this instant, yet I found myself continuously marching on. The seat that I had been sitting in when I walked off was still empty when I returned. Since I now understood that warmth, I couldn’t bring myself to sit down. What, then, is the correct distance to be? Up until now, I have not found an answer to this question. So I thought, “It should be fine up till here. I would probably be allowed to take a step further,” as I continued to walk slowly towards them. Just like how this entire year had played out, I gradually approached them, testing my limits as to whether I can move a bit closer, and at the same time, continuously recalculated the sense of distance between us. I made bold steps forward while not knowing anything, yet carefully treaded whenever I noticed something. However, when I realized that I didn’t understand anything, my legs couldn’t take another step forward. Just one more step. Even half a step would be good. But, at this distance, I stopped. The streetlamps illuminated the bench like a spotlight. Shadows snaked off into countless directions, gradually fading off into the distance. I gazed mindlessly at those shadows as I took out the two cans of red tea and silently passed it to them. They both seemed a little troubled, but thanked me anyway. They reached out for the tea, and I carefully handed it over so as to not touch their fingertips, then put my hands back in my pockets. In that moment, there was a clear, crisp crinkling noise. I could feel something smooth in my pockets, and, upon inspection, I noticed that it was the packet of cookies that I had just received. The amount of cookies had neither increased nor decreased. Well, even if I were to repeatedly smash them, it would not increase either. Likewise, happiness would not increase so simply. Be it Peter, Chita, or Carrousel,* they have all mentioned this. (*Refers to Shinnosuke Ikehata, Kiyoko Suizenji and Maki Carrousel, no idea how they are related to the sentence.) Yet, despite it clearly not increasing, the fact that it could so easily decrease or be lost was a horrible characteristic of it. Worried that they might’ve been smashed, or mashed into some weird shape, I took them out of my pocket. Luckily, the pink wrapper had protected it by acting as a cushion. Heaving a sigh of relief, I had originally intended to put it back into my pocket, but then I heard someone exhale beside me. Looking at the source of the noise, I noticed Yukinoshita looking at the cookies. “Those are really beautiful…” She seemed to be looking at the cookies with much yearning as she said that. Those words that had suddenly slipped from her mouth made Yuigahama very surprised. However, she quickly leaned forward and replied,” Ah, yup! The bag and masute, I took a really long time to find them.” “Huh? Masute? Is that some greeting in India?” Yukinoshita pressed her fingers against her temple and said, “The greeting is namasute, and she’s talking about the masking tape.” “It’s a surprise you know so much pointless information about greetings despite not really doing many greetings of your own.” “Are you stupid? With the proper greeting, the atmosphere will quickly turn into that of friendly conversation. The set phrases for greetings are a must to know.” With that said, Yukinoshita looked tired and gave a bitter laugh. “Well, if it’s you, a greeting would probably count as a conversation too.” “Ah, true. That’s why I try to avoid greeting people.” “Hikki, are you really that bad at making small talk!?” Well, I can’t help it if my name’s “Hikki.” How true it is that a person’s name determines their behavior. Come to think of it, I had actually gotten used to Yuigahama calling me Hikki… If it was the past, I would have totally ignored the person calling me by such an embarrassing name… Maybe I would’ve even looked away blushing and objecting to that name calling in a small voice. Yeah, right, as if I have any memories of that sort. I had simply given up and accepted her way of addressing me from the very beginning. Masute, the abbreviation for masking tape, huh? Alright, I’ve remembered it, but I still don’t really know what kind of tape it is or how it is used. Come to think of it, Miss Yukinoshita, you seem to have quite a good grasp of youth’s terminology. What a surprise. I shifted my gaze to her while I was thinking of this. As though understanding my intentions, she smiled gently. “Masking tape. It is originally used for the sole purpose of sealing things. However, it has recently been used for decorations and design purposes.” “Yup! There are many cute ones too, it’s very mainstream! It’s commonly used for packaging or on notepads.” As I listened to Yuigahama’s explanation, I took another look at the bag. I see, it really is quite exquisite. The bag had been tied with just the right amount of golden string. Even the little dog paw prints on the bag made it look pretty cute. Altogether, it was a beautiful design. I continued to look at it. Yuigahama, who seemed uneasy, started to shift restlessly about. Her eyes kept darting about as well. “Well, about the taste… I don’t have much confidence, but I did my best.” With that, she looked at me with a determined look. Her serious eyes made it clear she was not joking. I gently caressed the bag of cookies. Without a trace of sarcasm, I replied, “…Yes, I am pretty sure of that.” This was something she had made with the best of her efforts. Although I didn’t know the taste because I hadn’t tasted it yet, this was something she had expended her best efforts on despite not being good at cooking. Thus, I know very well that she had indeed put her heart and soul into it. Hence, to the best of my abilities, I will tell her my feelings honestly, without any sort of deception or beautifying it. However, she seemed to know what I wanted to tell her. “Right? Hikki, didn’t you say that before? Something about ‘as long as one tries their best,’ or something like that.” Yuigahama laughed and puffed out her chest. She wagged her finger proudly as she did that. “…You still remember that?” It was a little surprising. She had a surprisingly good memory. Well, of course, I remembered it as well. What I said back then wasn’t a lie. I really did feel that way from the bottom of my heart, but it did make me a little embarrassed to have people tell me about what I had said in the past. I am one of those people who feels like dying each time I think about what I’d said in the past. However, it wasn’t only me who seemed embarrassed. “Well, that… instead of saying that I remember it, it’s more like I couldn’t possibly forget it. See, at the very beginning I was a little taken aback by those words, and so…” With yet another embarrassed laugh, she stretched her body slightly as though she was feeling uneasy. Hey, if you keep doing that, I will become uneasy too! I ended up joining her and laughing as well. When our eyes met, Yuigahama swiftly averted her gaze. “Well, Hikki’s always saying stuff like that. I have already gotten used to it.” Then, as though she was telling a joke, Yukinoshita laughed and added on, “Yes, he really betrays people’s expectations.” Yuigahama nodded her head vigorously in agreement to Yukinoshita’s words. “Yup yup.” Meh, I wished that they would keep those thoughts to themselves. I stared at Yukinoshita for a brief moment as I thought that, expressing my disapproval. “Regarding that, I don’t think I am the only one. Aren’t you the same too, Nanameshita-san?” “What is up with that barbaric name-calling…?” Yukinoshita raised her eyebrows in displeasure and stared at me with a sidelong glance. In contrast, Yuigahama’s eyebrows were lowered and seemed troubled. “Ah, right, that animal therapy at that time…” “Well, that included, I am not exactly sure whether or not she was above or below my expectations.” I scratched my cheeks gently, and nodded my head in agreement to the slightly embarrassed Yuigahama. At that time, our relationship was not that good, hence we didn’t say anything. However, now I would definitely ask, “what is that person doing?” Maybe Yuigahama thought the same way as well, for she was also nodding her head like she was thinking of something. “Well, how do I put it? I thought that she seemed really smart, but…” Whoops, here comes the disagreement. However, she had already said “but,” so what comes after must be something refuting the first. What Yuigahama intended to say was probably, “she just wanted to play with the kitten.” Anyway, not saying it out loud is also a form of kindness. If I were to relentlessly question her, she would surely counter me with a long rebuttal. Hence, I pushed the words I wanted to say back into my chest. However, Yuigahama seemed unable to hide it. Indeed, looking at her chest… of course she can’t hide it. “Well, Yukinoshita does have her moments.” Although Yuigahama said that to try and smooth the conversation over, she was met with Yukinoshita’s icy gaze. “Don’t you mean yourself?” “No, nothing like that. When we were playing big two, I was properly using my brain.” Yuigahama began her rebuttal amidst hesitation as she thought about past events. Her words once again brought up memories of that time when we were playing that dark game. “Really? I thought that you were just lucky back then.” “W-Why should it matter? Luck is also a measure of one’s true ability. It was my birthday on that day too, so having good luck was to be expected. Good things happened on that day too and I was quite happy.” Yuigahama, who had started off talking in high spirits, hung her head and lowered her voice as she went on. Please don’t say stuff that you will feel embarrassed about half-way through. When I thought about the present on that day, I wanted to die of embarrassment. Unconsciously, I lowered my head as well. All of a sudden, Yukinoshita started to mumble to herself, “So you were lucky because it was your birthday…” “Does it matter?! We won, and that’s good enough.” Yukinoshita tilted her head as she voiced her opinion. Meanwhile, Yuigahama seemed somewhat displeased and unhappy. Looking at them, I couldn’t help but laugh. It was just as Yuigahama said, no matter the process, it was enough as long as we won. This sort of positivity from her had always been the thing that saved me. Yukinoshita as well. Yukinoshita understood this too and smiled, then she brushed her shoulder-length hair and nodded her head in satisfaction. “Well… winning is a good thing after all.” “Here we go again, that ‘I hate losing’ attitude.” Without thinking, and with a bitter laugh, these words escaped my mouth. As soon as I said it, I was met with a stare from the wide eyed Yukinoshita. “You sound like you enjoy losing.” “Not really… I try my best to win every time.” Although that was what I said, the two of them didn’t seem to be listening seriously. In fact, Yuigahama sighed, as though agreeing with Yukinoshita. “Just like that time during tennis and judo…” “Now that you remind me, I do think it was a waste of effort on your part.” Yukinoshita seemed to have suddenly grown tired, or she was just out of words as she just sighed. Being seen in such a light, I was a little unhappy. Thus, I made the effort to correct them. “There was no such thing. My bones didn’t break,* it was just that my waist hurt during judo that time.” (*Hachiman misunderstanding Yukinoshita. Waste of effort = 骨折り損, and bone breaking = 骨折り) Hearing my reply, Yukinoshita suddenly became angry. “It was just a figure of speech. What do you mean by your waist hurt? Anyway, did you go to see a doctor? Waist pains may have long term effects. It could have negative effects in the future.” “What’s with that surprising amount of concern?! I-I too am very concerned as well.” Looking at Yukinoshita who had suddenly began asking about my waist, Yuigahama felt surprised, to the point where she interjected to show that she cared. Although I am very grateful for your concerns, it would be better if you had voiced them out when I was actually injured… Well, since they are now showing me their concern, I guess I should update them as well. “I did go, although it was just to an osteopathic clinic, but I did manage to get a formal excuse from gym class.” Looking at my smug look, Yuigahama said somewhat halfheartedly, “You did what?! To think I was still worried for you!” No, I am pretty sure you weren’t that worried back then… Probably from noticing my reproachful glance, Yuigahama quickly added, “But, those sort of idiotic activities were fun, the ones where everyone is involved.” “…Really?” I did agree with her on the idiotic part, but I was a little skeptical about it being fun because everyone was involved. Yuigahama puffed her chest and replied, “Yes, with Yumiko, Hina, Hayato-kun, Sai-chan, and Komachi-chan… It was fun playing with all of them. Like that time during summer break.” Yuigahama was now gazing off into the distance. Yukinoshita nodded her head at those words. “Rinkan School, right? Putting the issue of whether it was fun or not aside, it was indeed very lively… You haven’t forgotten her, have you?” I did a mental headcount of all those who went to Chiba village and started to remember. “There was still Hiratsuka-sensei… Well, she’s the teacher, so it would be hard to say we were all playing together.” “…But, I do think that she had fun.” It wasn’t as though I didn’t understand Yukinoshita’s feelings, who was now frowning. Ah, well, Hiratsuka-sensei always seemed to be quite happy… Tobe was there too. Screw that guy. It’s Tobe anyway. Tobe, I still remember your request very clearly, so please go rest in peace. Tobe probably heard from Hayama about all those strange things that I did. It would be great if I was the only one who remembered that. During that summer break, there were a great many things that left behind deep impressions. That bitterness accumulated like sediments, lurking about within my heart. I was unable to just ignore that person called Tsurumi Rumi, because she looked exactly like someone I know. Even though the concept of “everyone” was vague, there was a strong pressure to be in sync with everyone else. It was this pressure that nearly crushed her, or maybe I just felt that she shouldn’t be pressured. The outcome of that couldn’t be termed as good. However, she still held out her hand despite knowing everything was fake, and I still held the faintest of hope, a prayer-like wish for her. This was yet another thing that I hope only I would remember. But, regardless of how one thinks about an event, memories were something shared amongst those who had gone through the same experience. Hence, she would probably talk about something that she wished only she would remember as well. Raising her head to the sky, Yuigahama said, “The fireworks were fun too.” Looking at her, I couldn’t help but raise my head. There were no giant rings of light or golden showers of rain, just a pitch black night sky. “Fireworks, huh?” “You still remember?” “Well, although I didn’t do anything, that day was something I remember.” There was a slight teasing in Yuigahama’s voice. Thus, I shrugged my shoulders and replied in a self-depreciating manner. Having been through those events, we were able to treasure our shared memories. What followed were bouts of light laughter that turned into the shallow noises of soft breathing. Our breaths gradually faded away until everything was devoured by silence. Yukinoshita, as though trying to break the silence, inhaled deeply. “That summer break was about 40 days long, yet I only have memories of those few days…” “That’s probably how summer break is like. Before you know it, it’s already over… Come to think of it, we became really busy after that.” “A lot of things happened in the coming semester after that.” “Ah… Well, I blame the committee president for that…” Suddenly, I started thinking about that one person, and my tone quickly grew unpleasant. Yuigahama chewed her lips, looking a little troubled. “Hmm… No comment.” Ah! Yuigahama-san, you are too kind! Normally, at this moment, one would be like a judge who would jump up with much vigor and issue the death penalty! As I thought that, I noticed Yukinoshita shrugging her shoulders. It seems like Yukinoshita wants to voice her own opinion. Nice! Yukinoshita-san is not such a kind person! “It wasn’t just the fault of Sagami alone.” “Ah, her name, you said it…” “…You’re one to speak, I doubt you were going to say her name at all.” Yukinoshita placed her fingers to her temple and looked at me with a frown. I could only nod my head in an expression of “yes, yes.” I know, my bad. She lightly coughed before continuing, “At that time, it became the way it was because of various reasons.” Her way of saying it felt somewhat abstract, as well as a little broad. Then again, how else could one put it? Even so, we were still able to understand what she meant. There were factors like thoughtlessly pushing one’s expectations, or becoming stubborn to make it feel like it is not a good thing to simply push one’s request onto others, or maybe something like thinking that one has thought everything through, thus selfishly assuming people’s thoughts in their stead. However, in the process of going through these things over and over again, and learning a little more about each other, I now feel like we have acquired some new answers. These answers were probably a little different for each of us, but they were probably the same in the end. “Anyway, the schedule was way too packed.” Yuigahama and I nodded our heads. “True. Our school field trip was immediately after that camp.” “We were rather busy during that trip as well.” I didn’t dive further into the topic. However, Yuigahama and Yukinoshita did. “I always thought that we didn’t really have the spare time to go and do some leisurely sightseeing. I think we only went to Kiyomizudera? Then there was that place with the many bird’s nests? We didn’t get to eat many local specialties as well… But the trip to the movie village (Toei Uzumasa Eigamura) was really fun! The haunted house too!” “…I thought the haunted house would’ve been a most bothersome place.” In contrast to Yuigahama’s excitement, Yukinoshita appeared unmoved. Although we did indeed have different schedules because of us being in different classes, I didn’t think that Yukinoshita would ever enter a haunted house even if we were together. To be honest, I didn’t think she was good at that sort of thing! No, I’m absolutely not good with them, you know? “I think we more or less visited all the sightseeing spots. There was Ryuanji, Fushimi Inari, Toufukuji, Kitano Tenmangu, and so on… There were other places that I visited as well. As for food, we did have tofu and udon sukiyaki hotpot back at the inn. I also managed to go to a café that I had always wanted to go.” Yukinoshita seemed to be quite happy. …Ah ah. It was just as I thought, that café that you went to in that morning was due to your own interest. Well, the shop’s appearance was very fashionable, and the food was delicious too, so I don’t really have many complaints… As she was reminiscing, Yukinoshita seemed to have thought of something and added, “As well as the ramen…” “Ramen?” Yuigahama tilted her head, looking doubtful. Yukinoshita shut up immediately and I quickly said something to redirect the conversation. “Ah, there are a lot of famous shops in Kyoto. Places like Kitashirakawa and Ichijiyoji are super popular. If I had more spare time, I would love to go to those places too… Not to mention Takayasu, Tentenyu…” “Huh? What?” “Ah, nothing. Those were just the names of ramen shops that I wanted to visit, don’t mind me.” “O-oh, okay…” Now that I’ve finally gotten rid of Yuigahama’s suspicions, I decided to continue on with the previous conversational topic. “Well, after that was a huge bother as well. Shortly after we freed ourselves from Sagami’s issues, we had to deal with Isshiki’s.” “Ahaha… The student council election was really something.” Yuigahama let out a bitter laugh and Yukinoshita’s shoulders drooped a little. Watching her, I exhaled exaggeratedly. “After the elections, that Christmas event happened. Really, those were the hellish days of ‘logical,’ ‘magical,’ and ‘preach it…’” With a chuckle, Yukinoshita bit back with a vicious remark, “It was really hard understanding what that person was talking about… Then again, what you said just now was hard to comprehend as well.” Her back, which was hunched over a little while ago, was now upright. Yuigahama nudged her. “Well, we did get to go to Disneyland for free, and we had great fun there too! We also bought many Pan-san goods!” “…Well, I suppose that’s true. It wasn’t all that bad I guess.” Yuigahama let out a laugh and looked towards Yukinoshita. Yukinoshita looked away. It was heart-warming to see those two like this. Indeed, it wasn’t all that bad. I thought that the things that we did during those days were meaningful. Had we done our best to help and look out for Isshiki? Maybe not. Did we help Tsurumi Rumi end up at the right place? I don’t know. Needless to say, I had no idea why she said those things as well. But, at the very least, it was not all in vain. It was because of all these thoughts that we were able to live out this year in peace. I suppose it wasn’t only me, but also the two of them who were also holding on to this warmth. This was probably why Yuigahama could talk about all these past year memories with such calm. “I always felt that things really did go by in a flash. Is it because so many things happened in the past year…?” “I thought that it was really busy after the New Year as well… Especially since that’s when Komachi really began to prepare for her entry exams.” After the start of the new school term, it became very busy due to all the rumors and all the other things happening. The time where it was truly peaceful was during the brief period of the New Year. Hence, all I could really remember was that period during the start of the New Year. Whenever I thought about it, I couldn’t help but worry about the outcome of Komachi’s exam. My worries over the outcome of the examination results were probably plastered all over my face. Yukinoshita offered me some encouraging words. “It would be great if the shrine visit at the start of the New Year brought her some good luck.” “Uh? Oh, right. Yeah, I hope so…” I decided to change the mood of the conversation and added, “Well, I guess it wouldn’t do anything even if I kept worrying about it.” Yuigahama nodded her head at those words, “Yes. How about this? Let’s celebrate her hard work when it all ends!” “Ah, sure. Let’s host a huge party to celebrate her passing of the examinations.” “…Okay.” “Let’s!” Although what I said hinges on the presumption that Komachi indeed passes, the two of them did nothing to point this out. They stood there smiling. I am really grateful for their words, and, so, I smiled as well. Then, Yuigahama’s mood grew a little solemn. “But, it will be our turn soon, huh?” “That’s right. At about this time next year, we would be taking our college entrance exams. Then after that…” As Yukinoshita rambled on, her gaze lowered gradually as well. We knew what she wanted to say even without her continuing. After the exams, it would be our graduation. “This year went by really fast…” As I said that, the reality of it all hit me a little harder than I expected. One year. The length of this period of time was nothing more than the summation of all the events that we had talked about previously. I think the two of them understood that as well. “This year is the fastest year that I had experienced so far.” Yukinoshita sighed heavily, and Yuigahama immediately replied. “I think so too! How should I put it? You know, it’s like what the adults like to say? How the feeling of time gets shorter as one grows older.” “Ah, well, it’s because of this, and that we were so constantly busy… The requests just kept coming in one by one, but I blame all that on Hiratsuka-sensei.” “When you put it that way, you make it sound like she’s the New Year Monster.” Yukinoshita laughed bitterly, to which Yuigahama and I expressed similar expressions too. Really, everything had happened because of things that one person had said. All of it was really not much of a big deal. They were probably things that she just happened to decide to push onto us. Now, all of it was coming to an end. Ultimately, I was always unable to reach a decisive conclusion, just some vague ones. Even so, I want to remove that vagueness; even if I’ll make a mistake, or even if I‘ll lose something, I’ve decided that I shall find my own answer, our answer. There would be no end to it if we keep thinking about the past; I could say as many things as you wanted me to about the past year. They would all be joyous and happy, things that would make one keep on laughing. If one needed to say something, it would be said, but if one didn’t, it would hidden. Yet, there wouldn’t be a single breath for what one truly wanted to say. Arbitrarily, intentionally not saying those things would also be proof that one cares about those things. Regarding this point, I think the three of us knew this all too well. Hence, our conversation came to a halt. The time that we had spent together was barely a year. In this one year, there were many memories. Whether we remembered them, or forgot about them, or even pretend to forget, it doesn’t matter. All this talk about the past will have to end one day. If we were to talk about the past until reaching the present, then conversation coming to a halt was unavoidable. Hence, what should follow should be about the future. Perhaps because we all knew this that all three of us made sighing noises, but no one spoke. The future was something that cannot be seen, cannot be known, cannot be understood, and cannot be gone against. There was no way of seeing it, or any way of knowing it. Despite it clearly being incomprehensible, there was no retreat once one proceeded on. In this moment of silence came the sound of a muffler rubbing against the clothes. “The snow seems to have stopped.” Yuigahama raised her head to look at the misty night sky as she said that to no one in particular. Yukinoshita did not reply to her, she merely gave off a smile that was like the moonlight piercing through the misty, cloudy night sky. She nodded, and then raised her head as well. I guess she was looking at the moon too. It has always been like this thus far. At the same place, looking at the same things, spending time together. However, I fear that the answers we would give would not be the same. It is our answers that we each absolutely believe to be unchanging. Hence, so as not to say it, we kept talking about other things like the weather, or the very sweet coffee, or maybe some other trivial memory. “It was snowing on the day I was born. So, Yukino… this name is really simple?” In this silent moment, Yukinoshita suddenly talked about her name. Watching her self-mocking smile, Yuigahama replied in a gentle voice, “…But, it’s a very beautiful and wonderful name.” Although I knew that Yuigahama wasn’t looking for any sort of approval for her comment, I nodded my head naturally. “…It is a good name.” Hearing my reply, Yuigahama blinked in surprise. Yukinoshita also opened her eyes wide in surprise. What’s with those reactions you two? It will only make me feel embarrassed. Thus, I averted my gaze. I raised the coffee to my mouth and took a small sip so as to disguise the awkwardness. I really did think that it was a good name, so it would be really strange for me now to go and deny what I had just said. There was also nothing else for me to do. The name Yukino suits her pretty well. Beautiful and transient, along with a ring of loneliness to it. What was unusual was that I didn’t associate her name with any form of coldness or frostiness. “…Thank you.” Hearing her soft words of thanks, I turned my gaze back and noticed Yukinoshita had lowered her head. Her hands were clasped tightly together on her skirt. Her smooth black hair was like a curtain that covered her face. Yet, one could see her blushing from a small gap in her hair. Yuigahama had probably noticed this bit as well. Her lips twitched a little and laughed softy. She probably heard her laughter because she coughed and raised her head before correcting her posture. “This was decided by my mother. Then again, this is just something that I had heard from my sister…” Her voice sounded calm from the very beginning, but it felt as though her voice had gradually faded off into the night sky at the end. Looking up, and then looking down once more, she let out a somewhat bitter laugh. At that instant, Yuigahama and I were at a loss for words. Should we just follow up on her words with anything we could think of? For example, “My name Hachiman is even more simplistic. My parents clearly were frustrated for a long time when trying to think of Komachi’s name, but my name was decided almost instantly.” Maybe something as random as that? Or maybe I should let Yuigahama do the talking. She will probably handle it better than me? However, both Yuigahama and I chose silence. We used the sound of our breathing in exchange for words to reply her. Yukinoshita’s mother, as well as Haruno-san… Regarding the relationship between them, we didn’t know much. Well, I didn’t know much about Yuigahama’s family relationship as well. Rather, I have absolutely zero idea. Furthermore, the two of them probably didn’t know much about my family either. What I didn’t know was something even more basic. I didn’t understand her or the both of them. Because I didn’t understand, I didn’t know the correct way to reply them. If it was a case of me utterly not knowing anything at all, I suppose this was excusable. It can’t be helped if someone says something strange because they don’t know the other person. It’s natural to expect one or two misunderstandings because they don’t know them, and it’s natural to not be concerned because they don’t know them. If troublesome matters were to come about, then just pretending that one doesn’t know would be good enough. After all, we really don’t. Yet, the understanding between us has reached a point where we can no longer ignore it. We can no longer pretend not to know. It would be completely shameless to pretend to ignore it at this point in time. In the end, I still did not know of the appropriate way to approach this relationship amongst the three of us. On the surface, all I did was go about exchanging banter with them, expressing agreement with their views, conversing about our own stories, and voicing some not-so-strongly worded suggestions. I could more or less do all of that. These were probably model answers. Anyone would have normally done these to the extreme as well. But, it was because we wanted to reject all of these things that we were here on this day. Unknowingly, my hands had begun gripping the coffee can with much more force. However, the metallic can wouldn’t be crushed flat just from that force alone. Thus, my fingertips started to shake, and sound of water could be heard. The fact that these soft noises could be heard was proof of just how quiet we are right now. Slowly, I raised the can to my mouth and shook it slightly to gauge how much was left. I made a decision. After drinking, I will speak. If it’s something I decided upon, I have to do it. It has always been this way. Although I might be dragged along, swallowed up, or pulled along, in the end, I must be the one to make the final judgment. This is my personality. Having strong judgement was not something worthy of praising. Rather, it was just second nature to me. There’s only yourself, hence you yourself must do everything. That’s what it means to be a loner. You could call me a utility player, but I definitely cannot do everything. In fact, there are many things that I am not good at. If you really wanted to know something that I was good at, that would be deceiving myself through persuading myself to give up. However, now was not the time to be deceiving myself. I have to be honest with myself. Frankly, I felt that I’ve always avoided thinking about the future. Running away didn’t seem quite an accurate description. But it was the closest word to it. You could also call it avoiding. But it was definitely not escaping. Even right now, I felt a little annoyed. In the end, I was not hoping for any sort of answer, solution, or conclusion. I was only hoping for things to somehow disappear. I was only waiting for all these difficult problems to somehow vanish into thin air. I fear that the three of us were probably subconsciously wishing for all of this to just disappear. That was what I had thought for my own convenience. Although it was quite arrogant of me to make this conjecture about their feelings, I felt that this wasn’t far from the truth. After all, the time that we had spent together was like a slumber, or you could call it one that seemed to slowly drag out. Yet, it was also a time that had its moments of ups and downs. However, I know that this would not come true. Yuigahama Yui had already tossed her question out into the open. Yukinoshita Yukino was already preparing to answer it. If so, what should Hikigaya Hachiman do? The past me would surely have laughed at this dull situation. The future me would surely not allow this conclusion that couldn’t even be called an answer. However, the present me does not know the correct thing to do, but felt that this situation wasn’t right in any case. If so, then what I should do would be to try my best to right this wrong. What I should be doing is to speak. After drinking the last bit of coffee that had already gone cold, I began to speak. At the very beginning, nothing but the sound of me panting came out. Then, the sound of slight moaning as I thought about what words to use. Finally, I said something somewhat decent. “…Yukinoshita, can I hear it? The things that you want to say.” I wonder what I was trying to tell her through those words. The parts that I wanted to hear about were not conveyed clearly at all. However, this should be more than enough for the both of them. The sentence had no head or tail, as well as no trivial bits. However, it is still possible for it to be the start of something. At the very least, this sentence conveyed the idea of the want for a conversation as well as advancing this relationship, which was now at a standstill. Yuigahama inhaled lightly and stared at me. Her gaze seemed to be asking about my resolve. However, Yukinoshita’s body seemed to stiffen and she lowered her head. “…Do you really want to continue listening?” Her hesitation could be felt through her reserved tone. The glance that she sneaked at both me and Yuigahama seemed a little weak, and hesitant. Yukinoshita’s question. No, I wasn’t even sure if it was a question. What she said was not directed at me. To settle this, I coughed a little, and looked at her for confirmation. Yukinoshita looked somewhat troubled, dropped her eyebrows, and became silent. Like me, she was probably searching for the right words. As though wanting to give Yukinoshita some support, Yuigahama sat by her side and touched her hand. “I have always felt that… it is right to keep on waiting. Up till now, even if it’s a little by little, you have told us a lot of things.” Yuigahama leaned her head on Yukinoshita’s shoulders. I wondered what color those eyes were that were hidden behind her closed eyelids. I did not know. However, the stiffness of Yukinoshita’s body slowly began to relax, just like ice gradually thawing. This was either due to Yuigahama behaving like a puppy wanting treats, or because of the warmth that she gave her. Her fists that had been tightly clenched and placed on her skirt began to loosen up as well. She reached out to hold Yuigahama’s hand. She held both hands as though trying to confirm each other’s warmth, and then slowly began to speak. “Yuigahama-san, you once asked me what I wanted to do, right…? However, I myself still don’t quite understand yet.” I always thought that Yukinoshita’s voice was somewhat entrancing, like a small kid who doesn’t know how to speak. I probably had a similar expression too, like that of a small kid who didn’t know where to go as I listened to her quietly. Yuigahama looked down, seemingly hurt. Yukinoshita noticed this as well, and as though being mindful of her, or maybe encouraging her, tried her best to be cheerful and smiled gently. “But you know, in the past, I too had things I want to do… things that I wanted to do.” “…Things that you wanted to do?” Yuigahama was probably somewhat surprised, for she repeated Yukinoshita’s words. Yukinoshita nodded her head proudly. “My father’s work.” “Ah… but that’s…” Now that she mentioned it, I remembered as well. I had once heard that Yukinoshita’s father was a member of the diet, and, in the past, had ran a construction company. These were something that Haruno-san had once told me. As I tried to think of something to say as I recalled these vague recollections, Yukinoshita spoke first. “Yes. But, because my sister exists… that decision is not mine. It’s always been my mother’s.” Yukinoshita’s voice had grown a little cold. She was looking into the distance, as though staring at something there. Watching her like this, we didn’t say anything at all. There was a saying that when one talks about their memories, they would look off into the distance. Yukinoshita was now looking up at the sky, and I followed her gaze. I didn’t know if it was the wind from the sky, but the clouds that were soft like candy floss kept on drifting, and the clouds that were bathed in moonlight kept on changing their shapes. It seems like I didn’t have to worry about this weather. The clouds that would make snow fall seemed to have already drifted far away. Maybe we could even see a few stars. The light from the stars came from sources that were tens of light years away from us. The light was vague in the sense that, even in this instant, we had no way of knowing whether it really existed right now. Because of this, it looked all the more beautiful. Something unobtainable, or maybe something that was about to disappear, is the most beautiful. Because I knew this, I was unable to extend both my hands. Surely, in the instant that I touch it, its color would fade and rot. I knew too, that for a person like me, that was not something that I could grasp a hold of. Yukinoshita, who was describing her wishes in the past tense, as well as Yuigahama who was listening to her, was surely aware of all this. “From the very beginning, my mother had decided everything. She has my sister tied down, yet she gives me complete freedom. Hence, that is why I keep following in my sister’s footsteps, because I do not know how to act…” From her murmurs, I could feel a tinge of nostalgia and regret. Looking at her side profile, her gaze looked somewhat lonely and sorrowful. “…Even until now, I still don’t know anything… Really, it’s just like what my sister says.” As she softly spoke those words, her focus had shifted from afar to looking at her feet. Motionlessly, as if trying to ascertain if she was unable to move, she gazed at the tips of her beautiful boots. All of these quiet murmurs from her rendered us unable to speak. Yukinoshita had probably noticed this painful silence, so she raised her head and smiled. “This is the first time someone has listened to me about this.” I was attracted to that smile. I let out a somewhat relieved sigh from my dry lips, and replied. “Have you not told anyone else?” “I think that I might’ve talked about this a little to my parents…” She seemed to be thinking hard as she said that. That was probably something that she did a very long time ago. Yukinoshita continued to try her best to recall, but in the end, she shook her head. “However, they’ve probably never taken me seriously with regards to these matters. They did tell me that I shouldn’t worry about all this however… After all, the heir to the family’s business has probably already been decided to be my sister.” “Have you said anything to Haruno-san?” “…I think not.” Hearing Yuigahama’s question, Yukinoshita put her hands to her chin and thought about it for a while and gave a bitter laugh. “That person, has that sort of personality after all.” “Ah, true…” Be it from her sister, Yukinoshita, or from her childhood friend, Hayama, as long as the topic is about something like the future, or love, or dreams, or hopes, Yukinoshita Haruno was not someone especially suited for conversations of this sort. If it was someone that she had utterly no relation with, perhaps she could put on a sincere face and give a suggestion that fitted the current cultural norm. She would not only be able to give a good reply, but also let the other party agree with her view and make the other party very satisfied. For that person, doing this should be easy for her. However, if the party was someone close to her, she would take an entirely different approach. She would not only laugh and tease you, but would even continue to treat you as her toy and bully you despite the problem being long resolved. This was something that Hayama Hayato had said some time ago. He and she had probably experienced something like that as well. Hence, this was why Yukinoshita had never once talked to Haruno-san about it. Well, I wouldn’t purposely discuss my future plans with my own family. I don’t know if this was lucky or unlucky, but up until this point in time, I have never faced any major decisions that far exceeded my area of discretion. But, it was because of this that when I heard about problems relating to family, I didn’t feel any sense of being able to relate to her. If my family was running some sort of business as well, then perhaps I could sympathize with her a little. Unfortunately, my family was the typical salaryman family, so her conversational topic seemed a little far from what I could relate to. This was probably true for Yuigahama as well. She had lowered her head, looking as though she didn’t quite understand. Yukinoshita didn’t seem to mind our reactions and continued on. “However, I should tell her properly. Even if it’s possible, it won’t come true in the end… But, it’s probably because I am afraid of that answer that will set everything in stone that I am always unable to seek confirmation.” Yukinoshita’s voice carried with it a tone of nostalgia. Perhaps this was regret on her part. No matter what, the past was something that cannot be changed. Yet, her eyes were still looking head on. Right in front of her, were Yuigahama and I. “That’s why, I should start seeking my confirmation from there… I want to decide it by my own volition, not because of anyone’s words, but because I want to think it through properly, to understand… to want to give up.” Her light breathing sounds were accompanied by a silent smile. Through her calm voice, Yukinoshita had said it. That she wanted to give up. In Yukinoshita’s heart, she had probably been very sure about it. Yet, that line of thought had never received any sort of confirmation, hence it kept going through her mind. If one doesn’t open the box, one would never know. Before that time comes, before the moment of observation, the result is not yet determined. Be that as it may be, but if the observer had always been understanding and accepting of that, then the end result matters not. At the very end, the result will not change. “I only have one request… I want to ask you to see it through to the very end. That much will be fine.” Yukinoshita took a hold of her scarf and closed her eyes. She didn’t look like she was trying to tolerate the surrounding cold, but rather trying to correct the position of her scarf. Haltingly, but with much care, she had said each and every word just now as though she was swearing an oath in front of a god. “That is… Yukinon’s answer?” Yuigahama said that in between bouts of hesitation. Although this appeared to be a question, Yuigahama had lowered her gaze, and was not looking at Yukinoshita. However, Yukinoshita continued looking directly at Yuigahama. “I suppose, but it could be wrong…” Yukinoshita put up a seemingly wry smile, and softly held Yuigahama’s hand. Yuigahama raised her head. “In that case…” When she was in the middle of her sentence, her eyes met with Yukinoshita’s, and it was at this time that her words got cut along with the contents of what she wanted to say. I also lost my voice, maybe because I forgot to breathe. Yukinoshita’s smile was beautiful. Her long, seemingly-combed black hair flowed gently, revealing her white, slender face; her crystal-clear eyes captured me. Her gaze was without tremor or doubt as she fixated on us. I thought there wasn’t even one lie behind those deep, blue colored eyes that seemed to suck me in. “However, I… I still want to prove to everyone the things that I am capable of doing. I feel that this is the only way things can really begin.” Not only did her words contain no hesitation, even her tightly gripping hands, her fixated gaze, and her upright posture contained no hints of doubt. “Truly… begin…” Yuigahama’s face seemed fired up as she said that softly. Yukinoshita nodded her head in confirmation. “Yes. I need to go back to my parent’s house and properly discuss it.” “…So this is your answer.” The way I said it made it sound like it wasn’t a question at all. This sort of sentence that didn’t address anyone was no different from a monologue. However, this softly spoken sentence reached Yukinoshita’s ears. She placed her fists lightly on her knees and gently spoke. “I never gave up on it no matter how much time has passed… That’s why I believe these are my true feelings… I think there’s no mistaking it.” As she finished, Yukinoshita sent me a fleeting glance. I could understand parts of what she said, but those were probably the parts that I could relate to. If something were to not change no matter how much time passes, and if it didn’t fade away no matter how long it was cast aside, then I would have no reluctance in calling that genuine. This was different from those false feelings that would vanish after waiting for so long that you end up parting from them. If something does not disappear despite turning your face away, or averting your eyes from it, or pretending not to see it, or being forgotten, then it shouldn’t be wrong to call it a genuine desire. If this was the end that she wished for, then I have nothing to say. There was only one point that I was fussing over. Yukinoshita should proceed on her own, and decide on her own. She shouldn’t decide based on someone else’s intentions, expectations, peer pressure, situation, or mood. Even if she were to destroy something, that wouldn’t be a good reason to rob her of her value or dignity. What I wish for aren’t her words that are meant to answer someone’s request, but ones that come from her heart. “Wouldn’t it be fine? Giving it a try.” I said that as I lightly nodded my head in response to her gaze that seemed somewhat lacking in self-confidence. Hearing my words, Yukinoshita touched her chest, somewhat relieved. “Okay… I’ll do it because I think that also counts as an answer.” Yuigahama, who was silently looking at Yukinoshita’s face from the side, quickly removed her gaze and stared down at her feet. Then, as though making sure of something, Yukinoshita slowly nodded her head a few times. “Thank you.” Yukinoshita quietly muttered that as she drooped her head. I couldn’t tell what kind of expression she wore because of this. I’m afraid that I would likely never know. Even if I were to see it, I surely would have immediately forgotten it. That’s because Yukinoshita’s expression was extremely bright when she raised her face once more. Without giving me or Yuigahama a chance to say anything else, she quickly stood up. “We should be on our way. It’s beginning to get cold.” Saying that, Yukinoshita took a step forward. Her destination was probably the exit of this park, and the room where she resided in. Yukinoshita looked over towards us who had still not moved. Her flowing black hair, fluttering skirt, swaying muffler, and upright figure were so beautiful that I hesitated to approach her. But, I had already promised that I would see it through to the end. Thus, I began to walk in her direction. I hoped to myself that at least her words held some truth, even if I ended up regretting it.

#oregairu #yahari ore no seishun love come wa machigatteiru #oregairu volume 12 #my romantic comedy is wrong as i expected

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hannahberrie · 7 years

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Roses Are Red, Foxes Are Too (Part 1/2)

Fandom: Zootopia Pairing: Nick Wilde, Judy Hopps Rating: K+ WC: 2586 Summary: It's Valentine's Day at the ZPD, and love is in the air! Judy's arranged a rose exchange, giving her partner-in-solving-crime the perfect opportunity. Nick just might summon enough courage to tell Judy how he really feels about her...

...Or maybe he'll just get Clawhauser to do it for him. A short, fluffy, two-shot fic for the holiday!

[Part 2] [AO3]

If there was one thing Nick’s best friend loved, it was holidays. While the fox himself was hardly festive, Judy Hopps was more than enough for the both of them.

“Don’t you just LOVE the holidays?” She’d asked last Christmas, as she cut out paper snowflakes while wearing a Santa hat, while also listening to Christmas music, while waiting for Christmas cookies to come out of the oven, while all in the midst of decorating his apartment, for Christmas.

This was a surprise in more ways than one. One, being that Nick never knew it was physically possible to be this festive. Two, being that it was 8 am and he’d just rolled out of bed to find all of this, without warning.

“Good morning to you too,” He’d yawned, a grumpy pout settling on his face. “Remind me why I gave you a key again?”

“Because we’re friends!” Judy insisted, going over to Nick’s windows to hang up her newly finished snowflakes, “And best friends don’t let other best friends spend the holidays being a Grinch!”

“I’m not a Grinch!” Nick defended, weaving his way through the garland that snaked across his living room floor. “I just…don’t care.”

“Well, you should!” Judy huffed, “Holidays are the best time of year! You get to spend time with your loved ones, and make everyone happy!”

Nick ignored the way his heart lurched at ‘loved ones,’ because he wasn’t that much of a sap, only enough of one that he still had those snowflakes up, and it was February now.

And with February, brought Valentine’s Day, which meant Judy had to have something in store. After all, she’d been responsible for planning the ZPD Easter Egg hunt for the local children’s hospital, the ZPD Labor Day picnic, the ZPD Trick-or-Treating Night with the local elementary school, the ZPD Thanksgiving Potluck, the ZPD White Elephant gift exchange, and the ZPD New Year’s Eve ‘Extravaganza’ (her words, not his).

Bogo had long since given up on reminding the bunny that her festivities couldn’t distract her from her work. Namely because it didn’t distract from her work — somehow, Judy was always able to plan these elaborate events, and still have time to crack down on Zootopia’s toughest criminals, all before dinner time.

So that’s why it was a surprise to absolutely no one when Judy announced on the 1st of February that they would be doing a ZPD rose exchange.

“The roses are from my cousin’s farm, back in Bunnyburrow, and all proceeds will go to the Zootopian Make-A-Wish foundation!” She explained, standing at the podium in the front of the debriefing room. Well, standing on the stool Bogo had left there, just for occasions such as this. “They’re only $5, so all you have to do is find me or Clawhauser before February 12th, and I will place an order for you! Then the roses will be delivered to the person of your choice! We can also have the roses sent to an address if there’s someone outside the force you’d like them sent to!”

“Thank you, Hopps,” Bogo finished for her, giving the bunny a tight smile.

“So how many roses will you being buying me, Chief?” Nick asked dryly, earning a handful of chuckles from the rest of the ZPD officers.

Bogo gave him an equally dry look. “One, to bring to your funeral Wilde.”

There was another round of laughs, and Bogo dismissed the officers.

“You did good up there,” Nick said as he met up with Judy.

“Thank you!” Judy beamed, leading the way back to their office. “I just really want to make the world a better place anyway I can.”

“So I’ve heard,” Nick smirked, giving the bunny a playful nudge.

Judy giggled as the two took to the stairs. “So, are you going to buy a rose for anyone?” She asked, a question that made Nick flush far redder than he should have.

“I dunno,” he shrugged, thankful that his red fur hid his blush. “It’s not like I have a mate to buy them for.”

“Well, you don’t have to buy them for a mate!” Judy reminded him, “You could get some for a friend, or your mom, or even…Finnick! I’m sure he could use some to brighten up his van!”

Nick let out a bark of a laugh. “Yeah, that’s not happening.”

“But your mom?” Judy asked, a pleading tone raising her voice to higher pitches. “Pleaseeee? It’s for charity!”

“If it’ll get you to leave me alone, then fine,” Nick sighed, smiling when Judy cheered and gave him a tight hug.

“Thanks, Slick!” She squealed, pulling out her carrot pen. “I’ll put you down for the first order!” She gave him a quick hug and ran off ahead to their office, hopping excitedly along they way.

“Thanks to you too!” Nick replied without thinking, though he quickly realized that the reply didn’t make much sense, as he didn’t have much to thank her for. “I mean, y-you’re welcome!” He corrected quickly, but by then Judy was already gone.

Nick groaned, still flushing red and filled with self-loathing. Back in the day, he was always calm, cool, and collected. He knew just what to say to hustle any sultry vixen into coming home with him at night, and yet now he found himself searching for words that he practically stumbled over, just like some naive schoolboy. All because he couldn’t stop thinking about some bright-eyed, bushy-tailed bunny, a bunny who most likely viewed their friendship as nothing more than that: a friendship. Platonic. One that would lead him to a live of pining, of watching as she fell for some buck, of being at her wedding and watching her tearfully exchange vows, of serving as “Uncle Nick” to her kits.

The fox sighed, dragging a paw through his fur and flattening his ears. Don’t let it get to you, don’t let it get to you. After all, none of that had happened yet (thankfully). The last date Judy had gone on had ended rather horribly, with Judy pouring her drink on said date’s head, after he’d made a comment that he thought female bunnies should be at home raising kits and waiting on her husband, not working in law enforcement.

And besides, it wasn’t like Judy liking him was completely out of the question, right? They were best friends, had been for almost 2 years now. Friendship was always a great base for a relationship, or at least that’s what he’d heard.

All this worrying was getting to him, so he shook himself off and went to join Judy in their office. She was scribbling away at her clipboard, seated at her desk and not even looking up when Nick entered the room. “Guess what, Nick? Francine just came in and ordered 3 roses, so we’re already off to a great start!”

“The bunny can sell,” Nick smirked, sliding down into his own desk chair. “I shoulda brought you along back in my hustling days!”

Judy glanced up at him to stick out her tongue, though the sparkle in her eyes gave away the laugh she was holding back. “Dumb fox.”

“Savvy bunny,” Nick replied breezily, swiveling in his chair to face his computer. He turned on his desktop computer, pausing to lick his chops before speaking again. “So, uh, you got any actual plans for Valentine’s Day? You know, other than passing out roses?”

Judy made an indifferent sigh. “Not really. Fru Fru asked if I wanted to watch Judy, so she and her husband can go out, so I might just do that…”

“Babysitting?” Nick threw her a glance over his shoulder. “That’s your idea of a romantic evening?”

“Better than yours!” Judy huffed, turning to give him her own glance. “Your idea of a good Valentine’s Day is fried chicken and making fun of The Bachelor contestants.”

“That was only last year!” Nick grinned, “And last time I checked, we had a pretty good time.”

Judy smiled as she shook her head at him. “You’re clueless, Wilde.”

“Well, what would you recommend, oh great and mighty, Carrots?” Nick asked, wheeling his chair beside hers. “Please, bestow upon me your award-winning relationship advice!”

“I’m no romance expert,” Judy giggled, pushing his muzzle away as he leaned in. “I’m just saying, if you didn’t mind being cliché, which you mostly don’t, you could at least get some flowers or chocolates.”

“A, I already got a flower for my mother, and B, I’ll just swipe a chocolate doughnut off Clawhauser’s desk when he’s not looking,” Nick retorted, counting off his options on his paw, “There — a perfect Valentine’s Day plan.”

The bunny snorted. “You’re ridiculous.” She turned her focus back to her paperwork, leaving Nick to wheel back to his desk.

Nick pulled out their most recent case file, skimming over it without really absorbing any information in it. “Would you even be into that kind of thing?” He asked in what he prayed was a conversational tone, and not some nervous, hesitant warble. “All that mushy roses and hearts stuff?”

“I dunno. I’ve never been a romantic bunny, but it might be nice. I always did get a little jealous when all my other sisters would have serenading bucks at their windows, or giant daisy deliveries for their birthdays from their latest crush. It would just be nice to know someone liked you that much, I guess, even if it was a little cheesy.”

“Yeah,” Nick nodded, the gears in his head spinning as he began to form a plan.

“But, I don’t think there’s anyone here who likes me that much,” Judy added in what Nick knew she wanted to sound as playful. It almost did.

“Well, ya’ never know, Carrots,” he teased, “Miracles do happen.”

Judy chucked her carrot pen at him for that one.

Later that afternoon, when Judy was buried in casework and wouldn’t have noticed if her desk had caught fire, Nick sneaked off to the bakery down the street, ready to put his plan into motion. It would require a bit of his old hustling techniques, but then again, he wasn’t expecting that the mammal he’d be hustling was going to be difficult.

He was right.

“Clawhauser!” Nick exclaimed, sauntering up to the ZPD front desk with a box full of doughnuts. “Buddy, I need a favor!”

The cheetah beamed, instantly straightening up in his seat and inching closer. “Sure thing, Nick!” He chirped, though his gaze was fixed solely upon the pink box of sugary treats approaching him.

Nick had hardly set the box down on Clawhauser’s desk before the cheetah dived right in, munching away happily, a content smile settling on his face. “These are ah-mazing,” he sighed, eventually turning his focus back to the fox. “So, Nick, what can I help you with? Is there a case that needs solving!?”

“Not quite…you’re helping Judy with the rose thing right?” Nick asked hesitantly, glancing around to make sure the bunny in question wasn’t around.

“Mmm hmm!” Clawhauser nodded, frosting already smeared across his muzzle. “Do you wanna place an order?”

Nick could feel a lump form in his throat, in a very non-hostler fashion. Maybe asking Clawhauser wasn’t the best idea, after all, the lovable cheetah wasn’t known for being the best secret-keeper. And letting him know this was probably one of the biggest secrets Nick had. However, if it came down to asking Ben or asking Judy, the answer was pretty obvious. So…

“IwannaplaceanorderforCarrots.” Nick mumbled quickly, getting it all out in one breath.

Clawhauser eyed him, confused. “What?”

Nick glanced around once more and took another breath. “I want to place an order for Judy. I want to buy some roses for her.”

There was a moment of silence as Nick’s declaration hung in the air, and then Clawhauser’s cheeks scrunched up into a wide grin and he emitted a high pitched noise that was either a whistle and a squeal, Nick couldn’t quite tell, maybe it was both. Either way, it was loud, so loud that some of the other officers in the lobby turned to look.

“Ben!” Nick hissed, ears rising to stand straight on end. “You can’t tell anyone about this, and I mean anyone! If Judy finds out…”

Clawhauser beamed, his paws pushing at his cheeks as he giggled uncontrollably. “I knew you liked her!” He squealed, thankfully more quietly this time. “The way you were always looking at her, and smiling at her, I just knew it!”

“I don’t like her!” Nick scoffed on impulse, the words coming out with great familiarly., Needless to say, after 2 years of being just friends, it wasn’t like this was the first time this conversation had come up with someone. He’d quickly learned how to deny his feelings, not that this was necessarily a new skill. “We’re just friends. It’s a friendly gesture.”

Clawhauser smirked and raised an eyebrow. “Uh huh.”

“I mean, of course I like her, as a person,” Nick continued, suddenly feeling very warm. He reached a paw up to scratch at the back of his neck nervously. “We’re partners, after all. But I don’t like like her.” He cringed at the phrase ‘like like’ as soon as it left his mouth, a phrase he hadn’t used since middle school. “I appreciate her as an individual,” corrected (though he wasn’t quite satisfied with that wording either).

“Riiiiiiiight,” Ben smirked, giving Nick a knowing smile. “If you say so!” He grabbed another donut with one paw as he clicked the end of his glittery Gazelle pen with another. “So, back to the roses! How many do you want to order?”

Nick hesitated. “50.”

The cheetah choked on his doughnut, causing a flurry of sprinkles to bounce off Nick’s muzzle. “50!?” He exclaimed a hushed whisper, “50?! You know they’re $5 each, right?!”

“It’s for charity!” Nick defended quickly. “For kits!”

“But that’s $250!” Clawhauser whispered, jaw hanging open. “And a LOT of roses!”

“Well, ya’ know what they say: go big or go home.”

“But that’s really big!”

“It’ll be fine, I’ll just go back to hustling for a day or two,” Nick replied, only half-joking.

Clawhauser just blinked at him before pulling back and shaking his head, returning to smile once more. He pulled out his clipboard and starting jotting Nick’s information down, humming a Gazelle tune all the while. “Alright, then!” the cheetah smiled, giving Nick a playful wink. “50 roses for your friend Judy.”

Nick felt relieved, excited, and nervous, all wrapped into one sappy package. “Thanks buddy, I owe ya’ one!” he smiled, giving the cheetah a salute. “And remember, not a word to Carrots!”

Clawhauser made a zipped-lips motion. “Not a word! You can trust me Nick; I can keep a secret! I’ve kept Bogo’s secret that he likes Gazelle for years!”

Nick’s eyes widened. “What?”

Ben froze. “Nothing! That was just the sugar talking! Good luck with Judy!”

Normally, Nick would have brushed the sentiment off. Nick Wilde didn’t need luck — he made it. But now, with Judy…

Trying to win her over was going to be harder than any hustle. A lot riskier too. But looking at Judy as he walked back into their office, handing her a fresh cup of coffee and watching the way her face lit up, seeing the smile she gave him, eyes sparkling and two little front teeth biting down on her lower lip all shyly...

She was definitely worth it.

#wildehopps #zootopia #zootopia fanfiction #nick x judy #judy x nick #wilde hopps #disney fanfiction #wildehopps fanfiction #berrie fics #zoo 3 fic

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aikasjournal · 4 years

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April 26, 2020 - honest things

A literal lazy Sunday. But because we are not in a normal world, there is always a strange feeling to the normal things we used to have, like Sundays.

Weekends now are spent just here in our own homes, looking at the same gadgets, the same loved ones, consuming sad news of higher confirmed cases, never abating just increasing, distracting ourselves by books, social media, bread, cookies, coffee, dogs, Zoom meetings, memes, and more more internet time.

Anyway, I just have a hard time identifying what to think and what to feel these days. It’s like the most difficult question these days, “how are you?” But let me try:

1. I’m still not okay. I cry mostly at night these days. Every day still. I miss papa with every ounce of my being. His memories are so vivid, his essence, his body, his laugh, his voice, the way he stands, sits, and shakes his feet, are on my mind every minute of every day. I have slowly succumbed to it, to allow them to float in my mind without crying, without much resistance. And when I smile or laugh like nothing happened, I immediately pause in my head, checking if it’s okay or a betrayal of sorts. But daytime is usually kinder to my thoughts than night time. The sun is friendlier to the grieving.

2. I cannot fully articulate the weird space of grieving for two big things at the same time: my personal loss and this pandemic. They look almost the same from the outside, both shitty things that we all wish we could wake up from. Like all things we try to understand and go through, I read to inform and equip myself on how to handle these shitty things. It comes as no surprise that both events deal with grief. But there’s only so much grief one or rather I can handle. There’s not much contest actually. Since my father’s health crisis in February, I have gone through the phase of grief head on, no lessons, no experience. Just head on pain, sink or swim. That’s all I ever thought about, all the while trying to accommodate the fact that a lot of people are also prematurely dying of this fucking virus.

Now that my first loss has moved on to a permanent case, I’m slowly catching up to the rubbles of what we currently have right now — an unknown future.

3. There’s not much to do is there? What do we do other than wait and bitch and grieve of our pre-Covid existence.

Because grief is painful, I’ve turned to all types of anecdotes of people who have experienced grief. One of the best I’ve read were FB COO Sheryl Sandberg’s words on losing her husband. This NPR interview is worth reading for sure. It’s a little corny at first glance but she said that the way to build resilience in the face of adversity is to cultivate gratefulness. I know, brand new information right? But damn did that work!

Days after my father’s funeral, I joined an online FB grief group (US based, couldn’t find one in PH), and I started reading about the specific cases of other people’s losses, a lot of them COVID-related too. If you weren’t grieving yourself, it would be very depressing. But for me, it underlined the feeling of “it really could be worse.” As shitty as everything seems at the moment, there is joy in recognizing that we still have our health, some of our loved ones, good friends, food, and other BASIC BASIC stuff that are actually good, even great enough at any given time. I am super grateful to have the basics.

4. After what seemed like eternity, I have regained my ability to be absorbed in a book and finish BOOKS. Over the years, I don’t know if it’s just life or technology, but I have lost the rapture I used to have for books. I could read in bed for weeks on end and I will not care whatever happens to the outside world. That was back in high school to be honest. And now here I am. It took, what looks like, the end of the world for me to reinvigorate this part of myself and I am so happy and proud of myself for it.

I don’t know what happened exactly. When I was in the throes of my grief for papa, all I wanted was to consume words, read everything I could get my hands on about people who suffered the same loss. From the core of my being, I have now fully understood how stories heal. Reading stories about how people, real or fictional, struggle with loss (or any life changing adversity, really) made me feel less alone. I know these are not new information but it bears repetition come the time we are in the frontline experiencing these shitty things.

5. God bless Stephen Colbert and Anderson Cooper’s conversation on grief. If there’s one other thing I struggled with during this time, it’s the question of my faith. Death forces us to look at life stripped of its noise and trappings. It made all my existential tendencies to reveal itself from hiding, asking me to ask myself “now what?” What do we do with this life again? And why do we need to die? Why should we die? Why should my loved ones die? Why can’t we all be vampires and live forever like no one ever did? Colbert’s response was basically a defense on the less-than-obvious gift of life’s shitty things. Colbert boldly says, “what punishments of God are not gifts.” His response is so beautiful I took it upon myself to transcribe every word from 12 minute mark onwards.

I could go on and on about grief if someone would care to listen actually. There is no doubt in my mind that I’ve felt and learned a lifetime’s worth of lessons and even more questions since my father’s death. To think it hasn’t been a month, and we’ve been quarantined now for a little over a month.

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theheartofcoding · 6 years

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What does Stack Overflow want to be when it grows up?

I sometimes get asked by regular people in the actual real world what it is that I do for a living, and here's my 15 second answer:

We built a sort of Wikipedia website for programmers to post questions and answers. It's called Stack Overflow.

As of last month, it's been 10 years since Joel Spolsky and I started Stack Overflow. I currently do other stuff now, and I have since 2012, but if I will be known for anything when I'm dead, clearly it is going to be good old Stack Overflow.

Here's where I'd normally segue into a bunch of rah-rah stuff about how great Stack Overflow is, and thus how implicitly great I am by association for being a founder, and all.

I do not care about any of that.

What I do care about, though, is whether Stack Overflow is useful to working programmers. Let's check in with one of my idols, John Carmack. How useful is Stack Overflow, from the perspective of what I consider to be one of the greatest living programmers?

@StackExchange @codinghorror SO has probably added billions of dollars of value to the world in increased programmer productivity.

— John Carmack (@ID_AA_Carmack) September 17, 2013

I won't lie, September 17th, 2013 was a pretty good day. I literally got chills when I read that, and not just because I always read the word "billions" in Carl Sagan's voice. It was also pleasantly the opposite of pretty much every other day I'm on Twitter, scrolling through an oppressive, endless litany of shared human suffering and people screaming at each other. Which reminds me, I should check my Twitter and see who else is wrong on the Internet today.

I am honored and humbled by the public utility that Stack Overflow has unlocked for a whole generation of programmers. But I didn't do that.

You did, when you contributed a well researched question to Stack Overflow.

You did, when you contributed a succinct and clear answer to Stack Overflow.

You did, when you edited a question or answer on Stack Overflow to make it better.

All those "fun size" units of Q&A collectively contributed by working programmers from all around the world ended up building a Creative Commons resource that truly rivals Wikipedia within our field. That's ... incredible, actually.

But success stories are boring. The world is filled with people that basically got lucky, and subsequently can't stop telling people how it was all of their hard work and moxie that made it happen. I find failure much more instructive, and when building a business and planning for the future, I take on the role of Abyss Domain Expert™ and begin a staring contest. It's just a little something I like to do, you know ... for me.

Thus, what I'd like to do right now is peer into that glorious abyss for a bit and introspect about the challenges I see facing Stack Overflow for the next 10 years. Before I begin, I do want to be absolutely crystal clear about a few things:

I have not worked at Stack Overflow in any capacity whatsoever since February 2012 and I've had zero day to day operational input since that date, more or less by choice. Do I have opinions about how things should be done? Uh, have you met me? Do I email people every now and then about said opinions? I might, but I honestly do try to keep it to an absolute minimum, and I think my email archive track record here is reasonable.

The people working at Stack are amazing and most of them (including much of the Stack Overflow community, while I'm at it) could articulate the mission better — and perhaps a tad less crankily — than I could by the time I left. Would I trust them with my life? No. But I'd trust them with Joel's life!

The whole point of the Stack Overflow exercise is that it's not beholden to me, or Joel, or any other Great Person. Stack Overflow works because it empowers regular everyday programmers all over the world, just like you, just like me. I guess in my mind it's akin to being a parent. The goal is for your children to eventually grow up to be sane, practicing adults who don't need (or, really, want) you to hang around any more.

Understand that you're reading the weak opinions strongly held the strong opinions weakly held of a co-founder who spent prodigious amounts of time working with the community in the first four years of Stack Overflow's life to shape the rules and norms of the site to fit their needs. These are merely my opinions. I like to think they are informed opinions, but that doesn't necessarily mean I can predict the future, or that I am even qualified to try. I've never let a little thing like being "qualified" stop me from doing anything, and I ain't about to start tonight.

Stack Overflow is a wiki first

Stack Overflow ultimately has much more in common with Wikipedia than a discussion forum. By this I mean questions and answers on Stack Overflow are not primarily judged by their usefulness to a specific individual, but by how many other programmers that question or answer can potentially help over time. I tried as hard as I could to emphasize this relationship from launch day in 2008. Note who has top billing in this venn diagram.

Stack Overflow later added a super neat feature to highlight this core value in user profiles, where it shows how many other people you have potentially helped with your contributed questions and answers so far.

The most common complaints I see about Stack Overflow are usually the result of this fundamental misunderstanding about who the questions and answers on the site are ultimately for, and why there's so much strictness involved in the whole process.

I wish more people understood that the goal of Stack Overflow is not "answer my question" but "let's collaboratively build an artifact that will benefit future coders". Perhaps SO could be doing more to educate people about this.

— Jeff Atwood (@codinghorror) April 30, 2018

The responsibility for this misunderstanding is all on Stack Overflow (and by that also mean myself, at least up until 2012). I guess the logic is that "every programmer has surely seen, used, and understands Stack Overflow by now, 10 years in" but ... I think that's a highly risky assumption to make. New programmers are minted every second of every day. Complicating matters further, there are three tiers of usage at Stack Overflow, from biggest to smallest, in inverted pyramid style:

I passively search for programming answers.

Passively searching and reading highly ranked Stack Overflow answers as they appear in web search results is arguably the primary goal of Stack Overflow. If Stack Overflow is working like it's supposed to, 98% of programmers should get all the answers they need from reading search result pages and wouldn't need to ask or answer a single question in their entire careers. This is a good thing! Great, even!

I participate on Stack Overflow when I get stuck on a really hairy problem and searching isn't helping.

Participating only at those times when you are extra stuck is completely valid. However, I feel this level is where most people tend to run into difficulty on Stack Overflow, because it involves someone who may not be new to Stack Overflow per se, but is new to asking questions, and also at the precise time of stress and tension for them where they must get an answer due to a problem they're facing … and they don't have the time or inclination to deal with Stack Overflow's strict wiki type requirements for research effort, formatting, showing previous work, and referencing what they found in prior searches.

I participate on Stack Overflow for professional development.

At this level you're talking about experienced Stack Overflow users who have contributed many answers and thus have a pretty good idea of what makes a great question, the kind they'd want to answer themselves. As a result, they don't tend to ask many questions because they self-medicate through exhaustive searching and research, but when they do ask one, their questions are exemplary.

(There's technically a fourth tier here, for people who want to selflessly contribute creative commons questions and answers to move the entire field of software development forward for the next generation of software developers. But who has time for saints 😇, y'all make the rest of us look bad, so knock it off already Skeet.)

It wouldn't shock me at all if people spent years happily at tier 1 and then got a big unpleasant surprise when reaching tier 2. The primary place to deal with this, in my opinion, is a massively revamped and improved ask page. It's also fair to note that maybe people don't understand that they're signing up for a sizable chunk of work by implicitly committing to the wiki standard of "try to make sure it's useful to more people than just yourself" when asking a question on Stack Overflow, and are then put off by the negative reaction to what others view as an insufficiently researched question.

Stack Overflow absorbs so much tension from its adoption of wiki standards for content. Even if you know about that requirement up front, it is not always clear what "useful" means, in the same way it's not always clear what topics, people, and places are deserving of a Wikipedia page. Henrietta Lacks, absolutely, but what about your cousin Dave in Omaha with his weirdo PHP 5.6 issue?

Over time, duplicates become vast fields of landmines

Here's one thing I really, really saw coming and to be honest with you I was kinda glad I left in 2012 before I had to deal with it because of the incredible technical difficulty involved: duplicates. Of all the complaints I hear about Stack Overflow, this is the one I am most sympathetic to by far.

If you accept that Stack Overflow is a wiki type system, then for the same reasons that you obviously can't have five different articles about Italy on Wikipedia, Stack Overflow can't accept duplicate questions on the exact same programming problem. While there is a fair amount of code to do pre-emptive searches as people type in questions, plus many exhortations to search before you ask, with an inviting search field and button right there on the mandatory page you see before asking your first question ...

... locating and identifying duplicate content is an insanely difficult problem even for a company like Google that's done nothing but specialize in this exact problem for, what, 20 years now, with a veritable army of the world's most talented engineers.

When you're asking a question on a site that doesn't allow duplicate questions, the problem space of a site with 1 million existing questions is rather different from a site with 10 million existing questions ... or 100 million. Asking a single unique question goes from mildly difficult to mission almost impossible, because your question needs to thread a narrow path through this vast, enormous field of prior art questions without stepping on any of the vaguely similar looking landmines in the process.

But wait! It gets harder!

Some variance in similar-ish questions is OK, because 10 different people will ask a nearly identical question using 10 different sets of completely unrelated words with no overlap. I know, it sounds crazy, but trust me: humans are amazing at this. We want all those duplicates to exist so they can point to the primary question they are a duplicate of, while still being valid search targets for people who ask questions with unusual or rare word choices.

It can be legitimately difficult to determine if your question is a true duplicate. How much overlap is enough before one programming question is a duplicate of another? And by whose definition? Opinions vary. This is subject to human interpretation, and humans are.. unreliable. Nobody will ever be completely happy with this system, pretty much by design. That tension is baked in permanently and forever.

I don't have any real answers on the duplicate problem, which only gets worse over time. But I will point out that there is plenty of precedent on the Stack Exchange network for splitting sites into "expert" and "beginner" areas with slightly different rulesets. We've seen this for Math vs. MathOverflow, English vs. English Learners, Unix vs. Ubuntu... perhaps it's time for a more beginner focused Stack Overflow where duplicates are less frowned upon, and conversational rules are a bit more lenient?

Stack Overflow is a competitive system of peer review

Stack Overflow was indeed built to be a fairly explicitly competitive system, with the caveat that "there's always more than one way to do it." This design choice was based on my perennial observation that the best way to motivate any programmer .. is to subtly insinuate that another programmer could have maybe done it better.

This is manifested in the public reputation system on Stack Overflow, the incredible power of a number printed next to someone's name, writ large. All reputation in Stack Overflow comes from the recognition of your peers, never the "system".

Once your question is asked, or your answer is posted, it can then be poked, prodded, edited, flagged, closed, opened, upvoted, downvoted, folded and spindled by your peers. The intent is for Stack Overflow to be a system of peer review and friendly competition, like a code review from a coworker you've never met at a different division of the company. It's also completely fair for a fellow programmer to question the premise of your question, as long as it's done in a nice way. For example, do you really want to use that regular expression to match HTML?

I fully acknowledge that competitive peer review systems aren't for everyone, and thus the overall process of having peers review your question may not always feel great, depending on your circumstances and background in the field — particularly when combined with the substantial tensions around utility and duplicates Stack Overflow already absorbed from its wiki elements. Kind of a double whammy there.

I've heard people describe the process of asking a question on Stack Overflow as anxiety inducing. To me, posting on Stack Overflow is supposed to involve a healthy kind of minor "let me be sure to show off my best work" anxiety:

the anxiety of giving a presentation to your fellow peers

the anxiety of doing your best work on a test

the anxiety of showing up to a new job with talented coworkers you admire

the anxiety of attending your first day at school with other students at your level

I imagine systems where there is zero anxiety involved and I can only think of jobs where I had long since stopped caring about the work and thus had no anxiety about whether I even showed for work on any given day. How can that work? Let's just say I'm not a fan of zero-anxiety systems.

Maybe competition just isn't your jam. Could there be a less competitive Q&A system, a system without downvotes, a system without close votes, where there was never any anxiety about posting anything, just a network of super supportive folks who believe in you and want you to succeed no matter what? Absolutely! I think many alternative sites should exist on the internet so people can choose an experience that matches their personal preferences and goals. Should Stack build that alternative? Has it already been built? It's an open question; feel free to point out examples in the comments.

Stack Overflow is designed for practicing programmers

Another point of confusion that comes up a fair bit is who the intended audience for Stack Overflow actually is. That one is straightforward, and it's been the same from day one:

Q&A for professional and enthusiast programmers. By that we mean

People who either already have a job as a programmer, or could potentially be hired as a programmer today if they wanted to be.

Yes, in case you're wondering, part of this was an overt business decision. To make money you must have an audience of people already on a programmer's salary, or in the job hunt to be a programmer. The entire Stack Overflow network may be Creative Commons licensed, but it was never a non-profit play. It was always imagined as a viable business from the outset, and that's why we launched Stack Overflow Careers only one year after Stack Overflow itself ... to be honest far sooner than we should have, in retrospect. Careers has since been smartly subsumed into Stack Overflow proper at stackoverflow.com/jobs for a more integrated and most assuredly way-better-than-2009 experience.

The choice of audience wasn't meant to be an exclusionary decision in any way, but Stack Overflow was definitely designed as a fairly strict system of peer review, which is great (IMNSHO, obviously) for already practicing professionals, but pretty much everything you would not want as a student or beginner. This is why I cringe so hard I practically turn myself inside out when people on Twitter mention that they have pointed their students at Stack Overflow. What you'd want for a beginner or a student in the field of programming is almost the exact opposite of what Stack Overflow does at every turn:

one on one mentoring

real time collaborative screen sharing

live chat

theory and background courses

starter tasks and exercises

These are all very fine and good things, but Stack Overflow does NONE of them, by design.

Can you use Stack Overflow to learn how to program from first principles? Well, technically you can do anything with any software. You could try to have actual conversations on Reddit, if you're a masochist. But the answer is yes. You could learn how to program on Stack Overflow, in theory, if you are a prodigy who is comfortable with the light competitive aspects (reputation, closing, downvoting) and also perfectly willing to define all your contributions to the site in terms of utility to others, not just yourself as a student attempting to learn things. But I suuuuuuper would not recommend it. There are far better websites and systems out there for learning to be a programmer. Could Stack Overflow build beginner and student friendly systems like this? I don't know, and it's certainly not my call to make. 🤔

And that's it. We can now resume our normal non-abyss gazing. Or whatever it is that passes for normal in these times.

I hope all of this doesn't come across as negative. Overall I'd say the state of the Stack is strong. But does it even matter what I think? As it was in 2008, so it is in 2018.

Stack Overflow is you.

This is the scary part, the great leap of faith that Stack Overflow is predicated on: trusting your fellow programmers. The programmers who choose to participate in Stack Overflow are the “secret sauce” that makes it work. You are the reason I continue to believe in developer community as the greatest source of learning and growth. You are the reason I continue to get so many positive emails and testimonials about Stack Overflow. I can’t take credit for that. But you can.

I learned the collective power of my fellow programmers long ago writing on Coding Horror. The community is far, far smarter than I will ever be. All I can ask — all any of us can ask — is to help each other along the path.

And if your fellow programmers decide to recognize you for that, then I say you’ve well and truly earned it.

The strength of Stack Overflow begins, and ends, with the community of programmers that power the site. What should Stack Overflow be when it grows up? Whatever we make it, together.

p.s. Happy 10th anniversary Stack Overflow!

Also see Joel's take on 10 years of Stack Overflow with The Stack Overflow Age, A Dusting of Gamification, and Strange and Maddening Rules.

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