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iloveyouemanuelmarco · 1 month

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I don't understand how Vivziepop still has a fanbase anymore that unironically still supports her after all the scenarios of controversy where she brushes it off as petty internet drama from "petty envious antis" atleast before she runs off into her crowd of chronically online and discourse obsessed problematic adults on any social media platform(Mostly Twitter to be specific but still)who are just a group of yes-men for her to use to attack not even only children on the interwebs who just happen to be uncomfortable with the fandom she's cultivated over her career of a wannabe artist and animator, but other adults too who by the way are somewhat consisting of survivors of abuse, rape, are LGBTQIA+, BIPOC, neurodivergent/disabled and possibly more. It honestly makes me sad as it does angry because the concept of the show isn't that crazily impossible in my opinion atleast and it could of had so much potential to do way better if not only the obvious subject matters were treated with much more care in an attempt to rework the scripts but also if Viv didn't do half of the stuff she did just a bad person in general. Like...is that really the best you can do for your fanbase???You cannot be not-joking atleast a little bit when you're telling me that apparently not only are children not being stopped from engaging with an 18+ rated show(even though the amount of vulgar language is done so poorly that it could pass of as your average failed Newgrounds animation), but that they're literally being encouraged to interact with the fandom???Are you out of your mind???Don't even get me started on the other stuff that you all probably already know about such as the blatant mockery of S.A., abusive relationship dynamics, hypersexuality in victims of said scenarios that happen irl, having other such "jokes" including some sort of rapey scene at all and having someone who actively and openly supports "non-con" fiction???!!!! What is wrong with you people??And apparently I have to share the home of the beautiful planet Earth with these idiots choosing to have the cognitive dissonance and brain function of an almost-empty and dusty old peanut...Along with the fact that the woman herself treats her animators at Spindlehorse Productions(her studio I suppose)like utter dog-dung, she has proven to drag anyone who defies her problematic and dare I say dangerous behavior through the mud and gets away with it all because of her stans/fans making her the "face of independent animation/indie animators". I honestly feel so awful for those who may have genuinely looked up to her at one point, atleast not knowing how much of a horrible person she was behind the scenes of the computer screen but its whatever anyways I guess. If any aspiring makers of cartoons or comics(LGBTQIA+/BIPOC/Disabled preferred) would like to promote the stuff they male down below in my comments section than feel free☆. It's the least anyone can do under the storm that's being made and has happened for such a long time ughh. The project should have been attempted a little more to be prevented from the confines of those echo-chambery and gross parts of fandom-centric social media communities and It's so discouraging how long this has been going on too, but hey. She's the lady that unironically made a literal pedo character that she attempted to present as a villain while just having the original character end up as a sort of "cool af bad-girl aesthetic uwu" character. Oh my fucking God please stop at once I swear to the highest Heavens and the deepest, most darkest depths of Hell(Ironic).

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resisteverything · 3 months

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Spindlehorse Universe is just not the right kind of series to use rape as a serious plot point because it not just jokes about it, but does so in a way that treats it as no big deal. Here's a list of moments like that.

Blitzo threatens to rape both Moxie and Millie.

Stolas coerces Blitzo into sex and it's meant to be funny and later romantic.

The succubi try to gangrape Moxie.

The Succubi then have to give it up to an entire police force in order to avoid being arrested.

There are constant jokes about Angel dust doing porn even though it's later revealed that he physically cannot refuse and therefore cannot consent.

Sir pentius is gangraped for real but the story thinks it's not gangrape because he halfheartedly agreed to it only for the crowd to literally attack him while he screams and runs away.

#spindlehorse critique #spindlehorse critical #hazbin hotel #hazbin hotel critical #hazbin hotel criticism #helluva boss critical #helluva boss criticism #helluva boss #tw rape #tw sa

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almacambiondaughterofsaleos · 6 months

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Vivziepoop Having A Deaf Imp Doesn't Excuse What You Did With The Closed Captions

I know people are praising this scene, but it comes off as tone deaf when you remember what they did for the captions for "Oops".

Again another example of them being praised for representation, but in actuality are insensitive as fuck when they can get away with it.

#helluva boss #helluva boss critical #helluva boss criticism #helluva boss critique #vivziepop critical #vivziepop criticism #vivziepop #anti-vivziepop #spindlehorse #spindlehorse critical #spindlehorse criticism #spindlehorse critique

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theoddest1 · 13 days

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https://twitter.com/inf3licitous/status/1777184850472317433?s=19

Didn’t Hunter say that both Far-Fetched and Lackadasiy suck?

She trashed it when they won at the streamies, like full-on celebration

I say this is Karma for acting like a fucking ass. And is that Rae (someone else who works for Viv) I see at the top right there? "Jigo"

With how comfortable Hunter was saying this, makes me wonder how often this has happened...

#anon ask #vivziepop critical #spindlehorse criticism #anti spindlehorse #viv get a grip #vivziepop #vivziepop critique #vivziepop criticism #spindlehorse critique

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kawaiitail-chan · 1 month

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guitarspear makes no sense

so, recently, i have been seeing guitarspear content everywhere, and i don't get it, it's usually a ship chaggie shippers ship to get lute out of their precious "wholesome" wlw ship and they could have chose literally ANYONE but adam, i mean, isn't adam, like, 10 thousand year old? (Like 50 in human years but still) and lute seems like she just graduated from high school, i admit they have some funny moments but still, it seems vivziepop is going down the guitarspear rute which honestly disapoints me and think it will ruin their dynamic, but, befire then, LUTE X VAGGIE SHIPPERS UNITE!!!!!

#Anti vivziepop #anti hazbin hotel #hazbin hotel critical #hazbin critical #spindlehorse critical #spindlehorse criticism #spindlehorse critique #Vivziepop critical #They're my brotp tbh #But ships like spidermoth and stolitz are waaaaay worse #Anti guitarspear #I really hope vivziepop doesn't go down this ruite

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woomycritiques543 · 11 months

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Ok.

I cant beleive that im saying this but-

STOP TALKING ABOUT JUST HELLUVA BOSS!

-and from that I mean:

The show is awful beyond repair, and what we talk about now is just a repeat of what we’ve said before to the point of burnt out when we already know how this season ends.

The show has bad representation, we get the point. Move on.

-and number two.

THERE ARE PEOPLE IN REAL LIFE GETTING HURT RIGHT NOW AND ALL YOU CAN THINK ABOUT IS A CARTOON BIRD?!

Really, that’s what we’re going to do?

Whine about a cartoon bird being a creep while the creator in real life has been following a incest blog for over five years?! Not even mentioning the real life implications anymore but just a fictional character doing a bad thing? Not even representation and how it effects real people, but just going “WAAAA VIV’s DEPICTING INCEST IN A SHOW AND DIDN’T DO ANYTHING THAT HAS TO DO WITH REPRESENTATION IM TELLING MOM!!!” No, that doesn’t matter.

We already know how the show is going to end. We already know how S2 going to end and all of what needed to be said about the fictional characters has now been said.

When what is important is REPRESENTATION!

-and not just that, but helping those that worked on said cartoon that need our help because they’re being treated horribly- While most of us just sit there and whine about a cartoon character being evil, honestly, it’s becoming tiresome, we cant keep just making this about Helluva Boss anymore-

SPINDLEHORSE NEEDS OUR HELP! So many people are still at that studio and yet we’re still focusing on just the show and that’s not what’s needed at this point! We need to help with what’s happening IRL!

Vivzuepop isnt just transphobic, but also a literal ableist by calling depression “disingenuous” just because it isn’t obvious to her and literally called trans men and gnc “ashamed of being a woman” and a “trender!”

That’s horrible, and yet the fandom still tries to act as if this is somehow “normal” behavior for someone who claims to be a “trans ally” to have when it’s clear that she only shoves the transgender label onto characters that are on the storyboards, shoves them into the background, or erases them if they’re noticeable, when that just means that she doesn’t actually want to represent them, and with her outward transphobia, only did it for brownie points and to fetishize them for money while claiming that trans men are “ASHAMED OF BEING WOMEN AND ARE LOUD HARASSERS THAT WANT TO BE WHITE MEN!” when the “white” part is just a strawman argument to be transphobic.

In fact, everyone that Vivienne Medrano has hurt needs our help, and at this point, Helluva Boss is becoming a waste of moral time that could have been used to help someone in REAL LIFE! There’s so many of us, we can all do something if we combine our efforts instead of just getting angry on Tumblr about cartoon characters most of the time. But that’s it, we need to actually do something and go OUTSIDE OF TUMBLR to places that are more visible. So again- We need to have “#StopVivziepop” at least get close to trending. There are clearly enough of us, we just need to start doing it.

We need to get all that we have seen/learned, but it into a document, and post threads, along with interviews, etc. We need to make what’s wrong with what Vivziepop is doing known, while talking about the wrongs of the animation industry as a whole.

We cant just make this about the cartoon anymore!

We need to TAKE ACTION!

#STOPVIVZIEPOP

#helluva boss critical #vivziepop criticism #vivziepop critical #StopVivziepop #helluva boss criticism #anti vivziepop #anti helluva boss #spindlehorse criticism #spindlehorse critique #anti hazbin hotel #hazbin hotel critical #hazbin hotel criticism #helluva critical #tagging everyone here since we need the help we can get. STOPVIVZIEPOP!

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showtoonzfan · 3 months

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A recent article came out about the mistreatment and pay of Spindlehorse employees, please spread this around.

#vivziepop critical #spindlehorse critical #helluva boss critical #helluva boss critique #hazbin hotel critical #helluva boss criticism #helluva critical #anti vivziepop #Hazbin hotel #helluva boss #vivienne medrano #Vivziepop #spindlehorse toons #Spindlehorse

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uniquepeanutcreatorfire · 4 months

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Fandom: VIV GETS HATE FOR NO REASON

Reasons: Toxic workplace allegations, not addressed

Appropriating a closed religion that’s been demonized by Hollywood for years (also making a profit off it)

Burning bridges with other artists/friends (one that implied she was abusive)

Going to animal cafes in Japan with abused and neglected animals

Supporting businesses (Starbucks) that are against Palestine then posting on social media

Liking tweets referring to people as sub-human

Liking tweets referring to criticism as hate or defending from valid criticism

Not giving certain physical features to POC/POC-coded characters in their design to indicate they are POC/POC-coded and also using harmful stereotypes

Fandom: SHE GETS HATE FOR NO REASON!!!

#helluva boss critical #vivziepop critical #helluva boss criticism #helluva boss critique #spindlehorse critical #vivziepop criticism #spindlehorse criticism #hazbin hotel criticism #hazbin hotel critical #hazbin hotel critique

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spooky-donut-ghost-house · 25 days

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Viv is the only person that thinks that putting God and Jesus in her show is going too far but fetishizing rape and abuse is fine

Also wait so putting in Lucifer and other known demons as well as Adam and Saint Peter is fine but God and Jesus is going too far????

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starlight-bread-blog · 7 months

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Why Stolas is a Terrible Person/Character

Oh this will be long. In this post I will cover why Stolas is a character that fundamentally fails at everything it tries to accomplish. I probably have to say that you can love Stolas. That's just why I hate him.

Trigger warnings for: Racism, casteism, power dynamics, sexual assault, sa apologism, abuse, and neglectful parenting. A lot, I know, but that's Stolas.

His Actions in S1

Despite the title, there will be two examples from season 2.

Racism/Casteist

Stolas is from the upper caste, a royal. He seem to often fetishize imps, or the fact that he's sleeping with someone who's less than him. I even saw fans pointing this out. He have empathized Blitzø being an imp in a sexual context.

(Notice the use of words: "little", "plaything", to me this is blatant racism and fetishism).

He also showed a certain lack of empathy for his imp butler.

Stolas isn't particularly violent, he doesn't choke people left and right. He's just angry, at Stella, so he decides to.. choke the imp.

Stolas has been dehumanizimg imps. Fetishizing an imp for being an imp, calling him an "impish little plaything", and he has been willing to choke an imp just because he was angry at something unrelated. He's racist and casteist.

Treatment of Blitzø

"Treatment" is putting it lightly. In the first episode, Stolas does something inexcusable that will taint their dynamic for all of season 1. First, he sees Blitzø in a vulnerable position, where he cannot think or negotiate. Thus, stripping him of what little choice he has on what he's about to offer.

What Stolas is saying is, "Fuck me or I'll shut down your business". This deal he makes is just a threat with extra steps. Which, is a real life abuse tactic called Quid Pro Quo:

"Quid pro quo harassment occurs when someone in a position of authority over another directly or indirectly demands sexual favors in exchange for some benefit, or to avoid some detriment in the workplace".

One element I haven't brought up yet, is the political power imbalance. Stolas is royalty, one with a lot of power, influence, credibility, etc. Blitzø has non of that. Other characters have commented on that the fact that Blitzø even has a business is a miracle.

There are so many layers of imbalance and how Blitzø has no choice or agency. A royal is """offering""" the powerless a Quid Pro Quo while he's in a life threatening situation.

And their dynamic looks exactly like you'd imagen. Stolas is consistently sexualizing him against his consent. (As it's been established, Stolas's racism feeds into this). And refuses to do the surface level courtesy, not even calling him his real name (x).

Stolas treats Blitzø as a lesser being, violates his boundries, forces himself on him, and strips him of all autonomy.

Faliure as a Father

Stolas's role as a father is directly tackled in Loo Loo Land and Seeing Stars. At the beginning, both episodes show Stolas being a good father to Octavia, but does this still hold true in the currect day? Well, no.

In Loo Loo Land, Stolas wants to take Octavia to a theme park. Octavia is 17, and Stolas ignores her when she says she doesn't want to go. (In retrospect, Stolas coud be oblivious because he's projecting onto Via his experience meeting Blitzø).

But that's just the start. Stolas then invites Blitzø to the trip and harasses with him all throughout. Essentially, Stolas is forcing his daughter to watch as he harasses "the homewrecker", all the while he's supposed to be with her, on a trip she didn't even want to go to.

After a whole day of this, as expected, Octavia runs away. Stolas chases her. (And of course, he's still thinking of Blitzø on his way to find Via). There's an apology scene that looks deep, but when you dissect it, it's rather empty.

Stolas never actually provided an explanation as to why he just did what he did, nor of the "drama" with Stella. There is nothing here. Octavia only makes up with him because he said he isn't gonna leave her. Which is bare minimum.

After he realizes that his affair hurts his daughter to the point where she feared he's gonna leave her, what does he do? What practical actions does he take to improve? Divorce Stella? Cut off his deal with Blitzø? Explained the situation?

Nothing. And now we see he's willing to stand up on a stage and let people know.

In Seeing Stars, Stolas bashes Via's mother to her. Which, does she know about their situation? Does she not? She isn't shown to hate or.. anything Stella. Is he hiding the situation (which I'll cover), while also trashing her mother? That's impulsive and negligent.

But that's nothing. She later runs away, Stolas is stressed as he should be, but the second they arravie on earth he's all calm and everything's normal.

When his daughter is missing. When he is shown to be stressed, it's for the sake of plot. But he's willing to just chill, watching Blitzø's show.

Stolas is, dare I say it, neglectful. He might care about his daughter, but he's proven that she's not enough of a priority to focus on her when it matters.

Cheating

Yes, I know what ended up being revealed, I'll cover that. In season 1, the relationship is presented to not be perfect before Stolas cheated.

But there were instances that showed that what Stolas did changed their relationship for the worse. (Some additional rebuttals).

It could have been a loveless marrige, they could hae fallen out of love, they could have been arranged. But their relationship was manageable. Love or no love, it's a committed relationship. and Stella didn't deserve to get cheated on.

Who was Stolas?

Stolas's behavior is common among royals. Stella has no problem throwing said butler at Stolas (S1 E2), and the Goetias are shown to be casteist. They're untouchable privileged assholes.

Stolas was born that wealth, never having to suffer the consequences of his actions. Always putting himself first, hurting others. He doesn't mean to, he wants for everyone to be happy, he does care.

However, when it actually matters, he acts on his worst tendecises with no self control. He never had to learn self control. That is, until Ozzie's.

Before Ozzie, Blitzø and Stolas are at obligation. Stolas's actions had tainted them. There was one redeemable moment: He saved Blitzø's life. Stolas did something for him. But this one act of goodness doesn't magically fix anything.

Stolas's family life have been escalating. Stella hated Stolas for cheating and his daughter just had to take it. In Loo Loo Land, he learns the full weight of the damage he caused. And in the next episode we see him, he proceeds to take no steps to improve the situation. In the end of that same episode, we learn that Stella hired an assasin after him. Because he did nothing.

The season 1 finale, Ozzie's, is aware of all of this and absolutly delivers.

The episode starts with seeing Stolas alone, in his big house, miserable. It appears that Stella finally left the house. (Also he later says "Octavia is with her mother this weekend"). He's eating a bowl of cereal, pitying himself, wallowing in his despair. You feel bad for him, he looks so torn down.

And then Blitzø calls. The one he loves, asks him on a serious date. It's hope, it's honest, and it's exactly what he wanted. It's almost as if the universe handed him is fairytale scenario.

Almost. Reality smacks him right in the face on that date. Asmodeus calls him out on losing everything he had. He had a family, a happy daughter, but gave it all up for an affair.

Blitzø calls him out on treating him like a pet, not earning any of that emotional connection he wants or even communicating it, just violating him, they have nothing.

The show held him accountable and called him out. While it's not perfect, Stolas is a morally grey character. Now, a character arc was set up where he learns to treat people better. Stolas is exactly the character I want to see from a show like Helluva Boss. He's a horrible person, but nuanced, who does care.

Season 2

Yeah... all of that is thrown out the window. Because apparently, Stolas is just imperfect. He simply made a lot of mistakes. He misread a lot of situations, really it's all just an accident. He's an oblivious victim. So, let's get into the woobification of Stolas.

Surrounded by Evil

In The Circus we're given Stolas's ✨️backstory✨️. And we find out he had such a terrible life.

Stella is, and always was, an abusive evil bitch. From the day she was born. Pure evil.

So you see, Stolas did nothing wrong. Let me be clear, you are not obligated to stay loyal to your abuser. We can erase "cheater" off the list. But that's the only reason why it's done. So we can erase that off the list, and that we could feel oh-so-sad for him.

Because Stella isn't written to be an abuser. She's a cartoonishly evil. We see a picture of her as a kid where she's the same person. Spongebob villians have more depth than her, you know, the abuser in the adult show.

Helluva Boss reversed an established dynamic where Stella is the victim and Stolas is at fault, except without any of the depth or nuance.

But that's not all. Stolas's dad (Paimon) is also neglectful. By "neglectful" I mean, of course, a Saturday-morning cartoon villain.

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He doesn't remember his name. This is such bullshit. I can buy Stolas having a horrible father. It's also not bad to show Stolas's trauma. What is bad is that the subject matter is handled with less seriousness as the fish fight in Spring Broken. And Helluva Boss did write Crimson as a serious abuser, the episode did have comedy, but not Paimon.

The reason why all of this is happening, is so we could feel bad for Stolas. They do zero of the work to earn a good story about abuse, but still go "Do you see how sad he is? Look at how they're treating this poor baby!!"

"Recontextualization"

In said ✨️backstory✨️, we also learn that Stolas and Blitzø are childhood friends. But also not really, they just hung out for one day. Where did this come from? How does that enrich the characters? I would tell you, but I don't know. However, what I'm sure of, is that it's done to make Stolas look less problematic.

DO YOU SEE HOW CUT THIS IS? He isn't just horny for that imp, he is special, it's absoultly pure! Don't worry, totally safe.

Later in the flashback, we see how Blitzø and Stolas reconnected after over 20 years. Apparently... Blitzø was the one who sexually manipulated Stolas, selling him that he wants him.

All Stolas did was just buying into Blitzø's narrative he was imposed on. It's a role he leaned into, because he thought Blitzø liked it. I.. WHAT???

If this horseshit is true, why did he make this weird r*pe deal with Blitzø? If Blitzø was the one who acted like he's interested at first, and he was sexually exploiting him, why did he lash out at Stolas in Ozzie's? Did it just hold no weight for Stolas? It went from "Don't pretend to have something when you've been harassing me this whole time" to "You misunderstood".

The Stolitz backstory makes no sense, it's cheap, and fixes nothing. No matter what the story is trying to sell, in season 1 Stolas knew what's happening enough to try to force it. And maybe Stolas wanted Blitzø because of a connection, he still harassed, dehumanized and violated him.

Note: Stolas realizing "he imagened the relationship" is completely ignored one episode later in Seeing Stars. This is a huge deal, didn't he learn? Just further evidence that he's willing to violate the guy. (x)

Before this backstory, we had a story of a selfish man hurting the person he loves while explointing the broken system and the power that he has over him for his own selfish desires that he's forcing on him. Now, we have the same thing, but with fanfic tropes – and the story refuses to confront that.

Casteism is Brushed Off

Helluva Boss pretends that Stolas isn't racist, because he didn't want Blitzø for being an imp, but for being his fanfic trope childhood friend. Which fails to adress the disgusting fetishism of Blitzø for being an imp, and he also continued to dehumanize his imp butler in Seeing Stars. He's still racist.

Imperfect Father

In The Circus, Stolas devivers this line: "The only reason I have endured your constant insults and cruelty, was for that girl to have a normal life".

Sounds impressive, he stayed all these years just for his daughter. But that's the thing – it sounds impressive. Every time their relationship is the focus, Stolas is being the scum of the earth. What I see here, is a person. A person who despite being willing to stay passive, acts on his his selfish wants, forgetting to look around him. Mind you, this fact is also being revealed one episode after Ozzie's.

But no, one episode later, in Seeing Stars – that was covered as a prime example of everything I just descriped – Loona says this:

Yeah. He's just a good father "trying" his "best" and makes some.. "mistakes". The Circus did present Stolas as this, but Seeing Stars really solidified how his parenting will be handled moving forward. And I think it's comlete and utter dogshit.

Damsel in Distress

The title is a bit misleading. This section is mainly about Stolas's power being toned down. Both magical and in presentation.

In season 1, he was energetic and enthusiastic, while being able to set his foot down and intimidate when needed. He's still all of those things, but in some instances his characterization made my raise an eyebrow.

In Seeing Stars, he's being weirdly gentle with people kidnapping Blitzø and are later beatting him.

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In Oops, he's excited to start negotiating with literal kidnappers. I have no idea why he's so nice.

(He did harass Blitzø again in Seeing Stars and bashed Striker, all of which isn't soft, but it's also the two moments where he should have shut up).

Further more, both of these conflict rely on Stolas not using his powers for some reason or another. Why didn't he just do whatever he did in Truth Seekers to track Fizz/Via?

About Via, I'm gonna have to call bullshit on the "My powers are limited on earth" nonsense because, for starters, kid Stolas is shown to remember the contents of his books and now he's been studying them for years. And two,

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There is no excuse for Stolas to not use his powers and whenever the show says otherwise it's bullshitting its way out of it.

Even in Western Energy, before Stolas gets captured he was just aimlessly going in and out of his demon form. Why didn't he turn him into stone like he did in Loo Loo Land?

Stolas has been presented as weaker than he is. He's made to look more vulnerable, less "above it all". He was untouchable, and when he wasn't, it had a harder impact and made sense. Now, I almost forgot he's a powerful demon.

And his characterization is at the core of this issue. At times he's just so kind and gentle with people who should get smacked in their heads.

What about Ozzie's

The big clash, the one that called Stolas out on everything, the one that set him on a genuine path to grow, what about it? How is it adressed while the show tries to pretend he's a good person?

No, not the message Stolas is looking at, the ones in the background he just scrolled through.

I'm not breaking this down. I refuse. The only reason I put it here is to show how fast it goes. I'm not touching that.

Who is Stolas

Stolas is a moral scapegoat – "a character that is bad, but the book/movie/show portrays them as good". It's characterized by the story twisting itself to make one character look good.

Stolas didn't start out as one, but became one over one season premire and it just kept escalating from there.

Helluva Boss takes place in Hell. A horrible place filled with horrible people, the root of all evil. Stolas fits right in there. He was already problematic, awful, fed into Helll's broken system. Why trying to cover up his faults? It's Hell, and it was great. But now, we're supposed to pretend he's just flawed.

With the show actively ignoring everything he did, what's left for him? What does he have to learn? How will he grow as a person? How will he improve? What's his character arc? It's nothing. Because everything that happens to him isn't his fault, and at times could just be solved with one conversation.

#Youtube #helluva boss critical #helluva critical #helluva boss criticism #helluva boss critique #anti helluva boss #anti stolas #stolas critical #anti stolitz #stolitz critical #vivziepop critical #vivziepop criticism #anti vivziepop #vivziepop critique #spindlehorse critical #spindlehorse critique #anti spindlehorse #spindlehorse criticism #spindlehorse toons critical

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