#but I prefer the parallel with Loki

[nightswatchdisbandmentera]

As Rykker filled it for him, Bowen Marsh said, “You have a great thirst for a small man.”

“Oh, I think that Lord Tyrion is quite a large man,” Maester Aemon said from the far end of the table. He spoke softly, yet the high officers of the Night’s Watch all fell quiet, the better to hear what the ancient had to say. “I think he is a giant come among us, here at the end of the world.”

We’ve all talked about ASOIAF being heavily influenced by Norse Myth, but I rarely see people talk about the parallels Tyrion Lannister has with any of the Norse gods.

An obvious parallel, I think, is the god Loki. Loki was a trickster god with extreme cunning and wit. He was known for his intelligent schemes which tended to both help and hurt Asgard. He also had a certain charm about him that made people love and hate him all at the same time. If you were to come across a witty comeback or jab in an exchange between deities, best believe that Loki would be present. I think we see this of Tyrion, as early as his first three chapters in AGOT. Jon I and II link Tryion with “tricks” and Tyrion II and III showcase his great cunning and wit.

But what makes Loki such an interesting parallel for Tyrion, imo, is the difference in stature. See, Loki is descended from the Jotunn - giants in Norse myth. Tyrion on the other hand is a dwarf, which is a far cry from being a giant. However, we are told time and time again that he is a small man who casts a large shadow. He’s even called (ironically and unironically) a giant several times in the books. So there is an inverse there, Tyrion may not physically be a giant but boy does he have the presence of one! And Loki is a god with a strong presence throughout Norse myth.

And we also have to look at the roles both Tyrion and Loki occupy in their respective verses. Loki is one of the most prolific of the Norse deities (among Thor and Odin) and Tyrion is considered to be among the central ASOIAF characters (whether you believe in the big 5/6 or the big 3).

And if we look at the relationships both establish in their respective worlds, we can see even greater parallels. Loki is a blood brother to Odin, the god of the Norse gods and perhaps the most important one. Well, Tyrion has thus far established some very meaningful relationships with ASOIAF’s two main Odinic figures: Jon Snow and Bran Stark. He and Jon even go as far as officially recognizing each other as friends.

It will be interesting to see just how far these parallels will go as ASOIAF nears completion. In myth, Loki is a key player in the starting of Ragnarok and even takes on the role of an antagonist against the Aesir. While Tyrion siding with the Others in the upcoming apocalypse is a laughable notion, it’s entirely possible that he plays a big role in the political destruction of Westeros. After all, we have been promised a dance of the dragons and Tyrion is said to be a small man with a giant shadow snarling in the midst of all.

#tyrion lannister #asoiaf #valyrianscrolls #loki #norse mythology #mythical parallels #I’ve seen some people link Tyrion to Fafnir #but I prefer the parallel with Loki #my stuff

[worstloki]

not a fan of people saying Odin and Loki are similar in a moral or decisive sense, particularly when it comes to Thor. that makes it sound like Loki doesn't know Thor or care about him beyond what he symbolises (regarding Asgard/the throne/family/worthiness), when that's a defining part of their relationship

#like i get WHY people go 'oh Thor is like Frigga (they care™/bring Emotions in) and Loki is like Odin (calculating™ /For The Greater Good)' #but if you make such a clearcut comparison you neglect a lot of stuff that Odin and Loki do drastically different #like there are literal contrasts that are pretty evident around Thor particularly #like Odin does expect Thor to be some ideal version of himself that obeys Odin implicitly and doesn't have his own volatile emotions? #while Loki more sees that Thor isn't who he tries to pretend to be and generally encourages Thor to realize that #the most obvious parallel would be how they in TDW try telling Thor that Jane won't work out #and Odin goes for the whole 'well they're insignificant' angle despite Thor caring about the humans and Jane particularly #Odin tries to go 'here's Sif and since you shouldn't have your own preferences (they're wrong and bad) consider my choice' #he largely disregards Thor's emotions #most people do on Asgard???? #like it's literally wild how everyone saw Thor being major depressed and they basically told him to pretend to cheer up #like im sorry Thor's grief means nothing to y;all. he fell in love with someone very mortal and his brother is changed forever #Loki tries putting Thor off by first off. Thor KNOWS Jane isn't going to live long he's not never thought about it #he doesn't even make the decision for Thor he tells him to consider his choice well bc it WILL hurt him when she's gone #Loki is like treats Thor like a person and Odin is like nah I own him #I feel like in converting the brother/father relationship difference over people lose the differences in those aspect #they skip to similarities of heartlessness and Machiavellian ends meeting the means when Loki overall is #a far more moral character than Thor (at the start of Thor's arc) and Odin. and a lot of culturally Asgardian ideas #that's literally part of Loki's original characterization that he DIDN'T match up with their views #he didn't do stuff like take killing lightly like it's for fun and that's one of a long list of obvious aspects that make the setup cool #don't tell me Odin and Loki are the same #like there's some blanket understanding that Loki doesn't show or care about the people he loves #while Thor and Frigga have always been softhearted and refused to sacrifice themselves for what is deemed better for everyone #don't mistake selfishness for apathy and don't say Loki didn't cry himself through the first movie because duty to the throne comes first #that's literally Thor's bit #idk

[books-and-dragons]

Chaos and Victory

The first time he hears 'your Sigyn', Goro hates himself for the way he immediately knows who Loki is talking about, lashing out with furious denial before he can can allow the implications of such a title to fully wash over him. It's easier this way, Goro tells himself.

He should have known better than to deny a manifestation of his own soul, but refusal comes easier- it always has, and it's not until there's a bullet in his side and a bulkhead barrier between them, that Goro finally allows himself to accept the truth Loki had so clearly laid out before him months ago.

Then, really, it's impossible not to recognise the every parallel between themselves and the Norse deities that came before them.

read it on ao3 here

_____

did i write this nearly half a year ago and i'm only sharing it now? yes. and what of it? i'm kidding i am so so apologetic

the amount of parallels between akechi/akira and loki/sigyn had me obsessed from the moment i realised it, and with hope this is not gonna be the end of this specific brainrot. not by a long shot.

i do have intentions of doing a post on here elaborating on these parallels (also, just sharing more about sigyn, because there's basically nothing about her out there and she deserves BETTER) but maybe that's for the future, depending on if this is a me-specific fixation?

#persona 5 #p5 #persona 5 royal #my fics #i hide in shame i finished this fic in FEBRUARY #then i was gonna post it bc i missed shuake week and then l i f e but hey!! i'm doing it now!! #i am o b s e s s e d with the parallels between loki/sigyn and goro/akira and not sorry for it #best believe you haven't heard the last of my loki-goro sigyn-akira agenda #i used ren for this fic but honestly i think i still prefer akira? AAAA #shuake #akeshu

[maniacwatchestheworld]

What if only the afterlives that take place in a different space exist within the Ghost Zone? But that all the death gods & reincarnation gods are equally important there?

Perhaps imagine it as being a reflection of the polytheism of the living DC realm? All the death gods

Somehow, I doubt that Pariah Dark was truly the literal king of the Infinite Realms. The very name implies that they are infinite. If he had, why would he be referred to simply as king & not emperor or god-emperor? He was certainly a big enough jackass.

It's possible that he was simply a conqueror &, thus, the right of rulership of the lands of the dead that'd conquered would obviously have changed due to this. However, the likelihood that he managed to conquer literally the entirety of a place that is infinite is nil. Because it is an impossibility in the grand scheme of things.

As such, it's more likely that Danny would've only become ruler over those select areas & not the literal entirety of the afterlife. If anything, I see if being more so that he'll have to cooperate with the vast number of death deities within the IR that constitutes Earth.

I admit, I do have a bias in terms of religion & am obviously going to prefer my own over all others & will believe that it is the right one no matter what & this likely shows in my own theories & worldbuilding.

At the same time, I try to be respectful of the cultures of others. Though, perhaps I can sometimes come across as a bit tone deaf.

And I can definitely understand not liking the white-washing of cultures. I hate it when Hades & Loki are portrayed as evil in a ridiculous attempt to draw parallels to Christianity. Because they aren't Christianity & that isn't how they are in their actual stories. Same with Zeus being portrayed as good, because... woof... He uh... he was messed up. Like, holy cow messed up...

I mean, I can understand a degree of creative liberty. Like, I could understand if the myths were portrayed as being his dark past that he's trying to move on from, but the fact that they aren't even addressed sometimes is... I don't like it.

Nods nods. And hey, no worries. You don't feel particularly tone deaf here. The fact that you're giving this some thought at all is enough for me! And hey. I get the having bias towards your own religion. I'm the same way too obviously. :p

But yeah. I'm alright with this way of going about the Infinite Realms and Ghost Zone in relation to other afterlives. It probably wouldn't be how I would personally want to go about this, but I wouldn't mind seeing works using this particular reading of the Infinite Realms.

And I ABSOLUTELY feel you about the Christianization and flattening of mythological figures. Always a very >:T time for me when I see people portraying Hades as evil. Because like... He's not. Also I can't help but to love Loki. He's such a freaking doofus and I love the he. But yeah... I also get frustrated by the flattening of DC characters within this fandom too... Obviously it's not the same, but the ideas are related so thinking about that just reminded me of that... Just... Siiiiiiigh...

#anonymous #anon ask #answered #religion #religious discussion #dpxdc #dc x dp #dp x dc crossover #danny phantom #dc x dp crossover #dp x dc #dcxdp

[vashtijoy]

something i think about literally all the time is how goro's powers with loki are literally the opposite of what the phantom thieves do. the phantom thieves free people from their distorted desires. call of chaos either gives people the freedom to or forces them, depending on your perspective, into giving in to their distorted desires. he's such a good foil to them it makes me insane.

and by nature of what he's doing, it provides him yet another rationalization for what he's doing, because well, they *wanted* to do this anyway. these people already desired to hurt people, goro just gave them a little push. he's not making people do anything they didn't already want to do on some level. the fact that people have these desires in the first place proves the corruption of people and of society.

but the truth is that he is, just like the thieves are, brainwashing people to his own ends. he's doing the same thing they are but from the opposite direction. he's creating chaos by revealing the worst parts of society by forcing the dark underbelly to the surface, and he doesn't care because every time it works it proves him right that society is beyond saving. people don't deserve anything other than the chaos he creates.

Yesss. All of this. *armwaves* Oh, Akechi, my dude, my guy....

... you little hypocrite, lmfao.

Akechi 第一、人の心を無理やりねじ曲げるなんて、人間が一番やっちゃいけない事ですよ。 dai-ichi, hito no kokoro o muriyari nejimageru nante, ningen ga ichiban yaccha ikenai koto desu yo More importantly, you should never forcefully change a person's heart. [lit. Most of all, a thing like twisting somebody's heart out of shape by force - that's the thing that most of all, a person should never do.] Most importantly, twisting someone's heart out of shape to suit yourself is the worst thing you can do.

ねじ曲げる nejimageru suggests twisting something hard out of shape, like a pretzel is twisted. It's another word that can translate as "distorted", though it's not the yuganda of "distorted desires". And Akechi is emphatic—he says dai-ichi... ichiban yaccha ikenai koto: "most of all... that's the one thing you should never do".

But nothing he says here is in terms like "change of heart" that the PTs would recognise. Instead, Akechi is describing a violent assault, in terms that perhaps clarify a bit more of Ryuji's hostility.

He is, in fact, describing exactly what he, himself, does.

but in the third semester

Akechi: And you assume we'll buy into your brainwashing and just live in the palm of your hand? Akechi: Honestly, that sounds absolutely revolting.

Akechi obviously believes what he's saying in the third semester; his whole arc centres on it. Again, it's that freedom to be who you are, no matter the cost; to choose for yourself, without anyone twisting you out of shape, forcing you to act a certain way.

It's this parallel to the third semester that suggests Akechi means what he says on 6/10—that his objections to the PTs are real. Remember, he does tend not to lie outright—he prefers to find some way to use the truth. Which leaves us with a number of possibilities regarding how he rationalises that one:

he has other objections, such as the risk to his plan, the risk to the Metaverse, or the Metaverse belonging to him alone. For sure.

he doesn't care about his victims. Almost certainly.

he views it as something you should never do, and does it anyway. Almost certainly.

he views his victims (and anyone else affected) as deserving what they get. Likely.

he views Call of Chaos not as an attack, but as a liberation or a gift, as him just giving them what they want. At some level, IMO.

he views it as unfortunate but necessary collateral damage. Probably in the middle somewhere, but IMO not at the start, and not at this point.

"you should never do this to anybody" means, specifically, you should never do this to me—and probably not to Shido, either. Definitely IMO.

and lots more exciting, varied possibilities!

conclusions??

Call of Chaos really is so fascinating, in the way it's described as an unchaining, as being out of control; in the way it suggests Akechi may have started out thinking he was the only one without these repressed desires. Because no shadow, right?

Later on, I think he knows a bit better, and is probably a bit spooked at the idea of what the PTs could do to him. But he still views those distorted desires the PTs arbitrarily dispose of as inherent to who someone is: someone's right to choose badly is a core part of their right to choose at all.

He's probably not exactly wrong. It's just that actions have consequences. Or they ought to.

#asks #persona 5 #p5 meta #goro akechi #call of chaos #i hate the marukiverse

[broomsick]

A few personal thoughts concerning Marvel, and deity depictions in pop culture

I will first and foremost start by saying that when it comes to pop culture depictions of Loki, Floki Vilgerðarson seems a lot closer to the deity’s true character than Marvel’s Loki, in my opinion. It’s his laid-back mannerisms but cryptic nature that do it for me. For whatever reason, some pagans still like to establish parallels between Loki as a deity and the shallow depiction Marvel makes of him, though when you observe the two even remotely, they really have nothing in common. Still, pop culture will be pop culture, and we cant expect for non-pagan writers, scenarists and the like to depict deities in the same manner as we pagans would, for the reason that they simply don’t believe in these deities. A fictional work will have to forego certain ties to myth (in the case of Floki Vilgerðarson, symbolism that tie him with the deity Loki) for the sake of scenario.

Now, the major difference between these two depictions is their purpose, or base intent, and it’s what makes me to slightly prefer Vikings’ Floki as a deity depiction. The thing is, establishing a few parallels between him and the deity without ever clearly stating that he does embody the deity creates quite a subtle result. Members of the audience who are familiar with the norse myths will recognize right away that Floki serves as representation of this deity, while those who aren’t, perceive him simply as another character among the cast. In fact, one could observe that in many instances, Floki plays the same role within the narrative of Vikings as Loki within the myths. This makes for quite the interesting parallel and, by never clearly highlighting this symbolism, the show leaves Floki’s ties with Loki to interpretation. This, in my opinion, is quite the clever way to depict a deity. So much so that one could think the writers of the show were aware of neo-paganism as a modern practice. They treated Ragnar Lothbrok’s character in the same manner, often emphasizing his resemblance with Óðinn, but never truly asserting it.

On the other hand, in terms of purpose, Marvel’s Loki has never had any pretense of being even remotely close to the deity of the myths, which makes him a very wobbly inspiration for new pagans to picture Loki. Unfortunately, this seems to be a tendency which sticks on many social media platforms. Which is why I think a crucial step in research within the context of pagan belief is to entirely detach oneself from pop culture depictions. This might sound obvious, but I have often witnessed pagans base their opinions of deities upon pop culture, whether they’d been aware of it or not. For example, I have once seen someone tell me they wouldn’t ever respect Thórr or his worshippers, because he was, and I quote, a “prime example of toxic masculinity”. Which, to me, is quite contradictory, considering how his historical worship was more often than not centered around fertility of the crops and non-violent concepts. Plus, his role as a sort of “warrior” deity in the myths is far from unique. In fact, many norse deities have been depicted as warriors in the myths, and Thórr is far from alone in that matter. Hence, the idea of his “toxic masculinity” does seem to stem from pre-conceived ideas created by pop culture. Which is why as I’ve mentioned, it was extremely important on my spiritual journey that I draw a clear line between deities and their pop culture depictions, no matter how accurate, and no matter if the deities concerned were believed to appreciate these depictions.

It is, of course, easy to subconsciously associate a deity with their pop culture counterpart and it would be an impossible task to not find parallels between the two, especially if attention was given to respecting mythology. For this reason, I don’t and will never try to avoid tv shows, games or movies that depict the Gods. Enjoying such content is not disrespectful in the slightest, in my opinion. The name “God of Outcasts” has, for example, become commonplace in pagan circles despite having been created from scratch by Marvel, for Marvel’s Loki. In this case, however, I believe the name does no harm at all. In fact, it seems quite popular among pagans, so much so that many aren’t aware it even stemmed from pop culture. One could see the name as respectful of the myths and for this reason, I believe it’s entirely harmless for worshippers of Loki such as me to use it within their practices, as long as awareness is kept concerning the fact that his has little ties with historical practice. Such a practice is among the perks of neo-paganism being centered around the individual and their ability to nurture their own belief! The only hazard I find to be worrisome, when it comes to pop culture and its depictions of deities, is when one’s idea of a deity starts to blend with a fictional depiction, and when the fictional character starts to have precedence over the deity.

#personal #thoughts #paganism #norse paganism #mythology #norse mythology #deities #norse gods #spirituality #deity work #polytheism #heathenry #pop culture

[nostalgia-tblr]

not to Discourse, but about Sylvie snapping at Mobius:

She was right. She could have said it nicer (well, someone else could have - i adore Sylvie but i wouldn't really say she's consistently 'nice' and there are very obvious reasons for that in her backstory) but it's true, Mobius has been bizarrely chill about so many things this season, to the point where it does seem odd, actually. I think it's easily missed (maybe?) partly because fandom has decided long ago that Mobius is some sort of therapist/social worker who is always calm and so emotionally insightful and his role in fanfic is to be supportive at the more obviously fucked-up characters. But like. He's also fucked up. He's already said that he's avoiding finding out about his old life in case it was good, so it's not like "Mobius won't let himself think about the sad things" is a new idea, is it?

I don't think Sylvie gets why he's like this (or she wouldn't have been so angry, for a start) but those two have spent very little time together (I think we the audience sometimes forget how little) and I know shipwars are inevitable and eternal but the show really does kind of break down into Loki-with-Mobius and Loki-with-Sylvie almost like two parallel worlds that interact less than might be expected. So why does Loki not "stand up for Mobius" there? Well there's the fact that it's true and that Loki was (unlike Sylvie) there when Mobius said he's scared of uncovering his old life so is more likely to connect the dots. And the element of "oh no my faves are fighting! i cannot take sides or at least one of them will hate me! i shall just stand here awkwardly and say nothing!"

I assume Loki and Mobius will talk this stuff over at some point, but in this episode there's not time for any of the several conversations that need to happen (and presumably this is a deliberate writing choice to drag things out a bit keep the tension up) and idk about anyone else but I would find it a bit weird if Sylvie had instead been unusually gentle (for her) and softly asked Mobius if he's feeling okay or does he want to have a chat about anything? Perhaps over a nice cup of tea and some chocolate biscuits? Nah, she's tense, of course she's going to snap. Ideally she wouldn't have done that but *gestures vaguely* what about any of this situation they're all in would you describe as "ideal"?

Maybe she'll apologise in one of the remaining episodes. But if she does he'll say that her observation was right, if not delivered in a way he'd have preferred.

tl;dr - Mobius is fucked up too and Sylvie (who has just in as many words says she thinks being soft makes you weak) is not diplomatic at the best of times, let alone while the multiverse is in the process of collapsing/exploding/whatever-the-fuck-it's-doing.

#loki spoilers #sylvie my precious blorbetta #mobius #also the reason sylvie doesn't have the manners of a (literal) prince is the people mobius just spent however-long working for. #so like. there's a certain sad aptness here i feel. #or maybe the pie really is drugged after all! either works!

[lucianalight]

Connections between Gods of Stories: Control vs Freedom

From "Loki God of Stories - A Comparison between MCU and Comics" series - Co-Written by @lucianalight (Luci) and @theitcharchives (Hollow)

MCU Loki’s story begins as the sidelined, undervalued second prince of Asgard. He is different in all the wrong ways, preferring magic and cunning to “bravery” and brute force. After growing up lonely and internalizing the bias against the Jotnar he then learns he was stolen from Jotunheim (after seemingly being left to die of exposure, implied by the attitude of the movie towards the matter) to be a puppet king–his destiny chosen by others for him.

(Even though Odin says he changed his mind which would have been an amazing thing to explore in later movies or series.)

Breaking under the constant pressure plus the shocking revelations, Loki spiraled until suicide seemed to be his only remaining means of control over himself left.

And that didn’t work either. Thanos found him, saw he could handle the tesseract business and had him brainwashed into it through Ebony Maw’s torture (as can be assumed by Loki’s Stuttgart speech and Ebony Maw’s own speech and treatment of Doctor Strange in IW). So even in arguably his most dominating vestments, Loki had no true control over himself.

(Which was another thing ignored after the events.)

Being caught by the TVA showed him that actually, no one truly had control over their destiny. He discovered He Who Remains did.

And he saw himself and what he could be in HWR. Someone afraid (and yet morbidly proud) of what his actions could cause, driven to become the ultimate tyrant to prevent those consequences. Now he’s got a dilemma: eliminate the tyrant and leave everyone free to bring about multiversal wars, or maintain the “sacred” status quo?

In Comics the three All-Mothers promised Loki that with every mission as the agent of Asgard, one of his old crimes would be removed from history. It meant a new start for Loki but he later finds out that All-Mothers’ goal was for him to play his old role, a villain who brings Ragnarok because it was better for everyone else. Everyone but Loki.

(I think it’s worth acknowledging there’s a good chance that the s1 parallels are mostly accidents. That those verbal and physical dressing drowns were not born of a will to be inspired by good stories but a will to be cruel to the character due to ignorance, self-righteousness and arrogance. Still, with the s2 outcome, we can be charitable and also consider there's a good chance they were actually planned and waldron’s hackery did not supersede the overarching ideas. I still think the execution and out-universe presentation of it was horribly handed -Hollow)

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#loki #loki series #loki meta #loki tv show #god of stories #comics loki #agent of asgard

[nobodymitskigabriel]

hi your asmodeus poll awoke the exact part of my brain that loves yelling about gabriel so. i have Theories. here's a corner of one: essentially, there is some level of canonical support for the idea that the supernatural universe is made up of stories. mostly the whole thing is chuck's, but the pagan gods obviously have their own, they just don't have the juice to make them play out for everybody. but the universe still bends toward familiar shapes, prefers to re-tread existing paths. gabriel's been playing loki for a really long time, so i think sometimes things happen to gabriel that are just. shaped like loki stories. asmodeus knowing he was an archangel wasn't enough to stop the "being imprisoned with his mouth sewn closed" Loki Brand Story Beat from coming back around for gabriel the way it was always going to ever since he walked out of his own story and into loki's.

Oh 100% the lips sewn shut is definitely a parallel to norse mythology but obviously it's not a peeerfect one to one bc Loki got his lips sewn shut for being a smart ass with dwarves. Gabriel never did anything to Asmodeus and as far as we know he just wanted to be cruel. But similar to Loki in mythology and to Gabriel's own victims, the crux of what happened to Gabriel was that he reaped what he sowed. Even though he never went that far himself, he was put in in the same sort of low power position that he put others in or that Loki had been put in.

#ask #loki spn #gabriel spn #asmodeus spn

[minalblood]

Episode 8, here we go! Finally! Im dedicating this review to @noybusiness and @shallowseeker for the encouragements to return to this.

Oh yes, Loki/Gabe! I forgot that's this one. I will say I still could not tell you which one it is. I WILL try to figure that out by the end of this.

I appreciate Mary immediately going to wanting to punch her dad while he's unconscious. Top tier sentiments.

I love (read: am banging my head against a wall) that John thinks what happened last ep counts as having hit the Akrida "pretty hard". It's kinda laughable tbh. The Akrida have already shown extrmely adept at infiltration (basically their whole thing) as well as the whole swarm of locust vibes associated. What i mean by this is, they have no clue how many Akrida there are or where and the dozen or so Samuel got rid of could easily be such an expendable number. But John assumes they weren't... why? Based on what? I also highkey love that Carlos just fully skirts addressing John's remark here and instead refocuses on the case du jour while Lata and Mary also say nothing. It's just funny to me.

Yessss, Lata and Carlos team up!!!

Ughh Dean's talking about dreams and sacrifices, just rip my heart out why dont u? Tho I will highlight his words about gaining more than u lose, Ive always appreciated the fact that Dean prefers to focus on what he has if possible. And it's not like he doesn't have a plethora of regrets, but he has reached a point by like.. season 11/12 I'd say where he became content with himself enough not to wish it different. I also deeply love the acknowledgement of said sacrifices made, it's not this empty optimistic view of things, shit has been bad before, but that doesn't negate or dimish the good that you've also gotten/found.

Lata's absolute judgement and unimpresed reaction to what Carlos has just called a "cathedral" give me life. This ep I think is one where we really start to see some more contrast in Lata. Because up until now, she's certainly been there, has def had complexity, but now we're not just seeing her be excited about knowledge, but rather learn some of the minutiae of her personality. Like how she is not easily impressed and also her niche interests and Carlos' dont match. We've seen Carlos be interested in her hobbies before, begrudgingly and with vague horrified expressions, but intrigued nonetheless. The opposite, we can now see for sure, does not apply in reverse for Lata. She genuinely doesn't seem to give a shit about the supposed prestige of the Knave and is more than happy to fall back to what she enjoys.

I adore the bartender. He is my fav and I am endlessly mad he dies. I loved that man and his "leave me.tf alone kid" vibes.

Carlos not wanting Lata to know about Rivers Gemini is soo funny. And 100% reminds me of Dean and how he prefers to hide his interests so he isn't made fun of/keeps appearences. And this won't be the only Carloa Dean parallel this ep. Hell, Dean's intro words apply most to Carlos this ep as is.

I love the fact that Mary and John actually TALK about their relationship and boundaries and the kiss. The emotional maturity is astounding tbh.

Jericho immediately making his excuses for why he hadn't seen Brock when he died gave me apprehension when I 1st watched this ep live, but now it's very obvious he was preemptively giving his alibi. It's honestly subtly done especially when contrasted to how obvious Loki/Gabe are. Glorious mustache on him btw.

Carlos has a very... interesting view on hunting. Because on the one hand, it did kinda kill their dream of being a musician, but they alao very much approach hunting with a lot of enthusiasm and genuinely seem to enjoy it. Again, the Dean vibes are off the charts with this one. I love Lata for adressing and checking in with Carlos as well, just making sure they're ok.

The roadie/Loki/Gabe is also pretty obvious in hindsight. It makes little sense to have this dude just go fuck off but oh no actually lemme tell u exactly what u need.

Oh no, Millie and Samuel. I am not ready for this. They are so similar and so different at the same time. Mainly because I genuinely believe Millie by this point has had the chance to process part of her issues whereas Samuel very much so is ... Samuel. And you can see this plainly for both of them. They are similiar, they butt heads because of it, but Millie has spent all this episode giving both John and Mary the space they need to work their shit out, without making any of her usual comments except for the tea Ada gave Samuel and even then she's quick to retract her statement when the tea works. Samuel meanwhile spends a good chunk of the episode saying shit that only serves to diminish or undermine.

I do appreciate the confirmation that Samuel knew who the MoL are/were. It makes perfect sense for the Campbell's to know considering their hunting legacy. And it's endlessly funny thay both him and Henry (when he met Sam and Dean) put down the other's profession. It's a fun parallel (i hate it). Millie putting him in his place was very very satisfying for me.

I will forever be screaming about Chuck being front and centre in this episode several times. An episode where we have Loki/Gabe and is about music (Chucks already said music is where humanity popped off for him) and on top of that discusses the themes of making up ur life as you want it despite whatever fate decrees (aka hunting means sacrifice and death but Carlos get to perform on the best stage in the area in from.of their friends regardless). Not to mention that I constantly have Chuck saying he likes "front row seats" and "hiding out in plain sight" on a loop in my head. Like of course he'd be keeping an eye out for his faves or would've done so before he was defeated. The timeline's a bit messy here because either this version is no longer the Chuck that Sam and Dean fought and defeated and is essentially the leftover consciousness from this particular world or time happens sorta simultaneoualy? I lean toward the 1st tbh, but then the question still remains of how much does he know. It's very very incriminating that he is in fact there.

And all this to say that I cannot believe that we have Loki alone here. I don't see it, can't. It makes more sense to me to actively mess with the Campbell-Winchester bloodlines via fucking with their friends while giving a speech about playing ur part for Gabe. But then... it ain't like Loki's mythos don't also deal with themes of predestination... soo...

And it's so so obvious that Loki/Gabe is gunning directly for Carlos btw. Like so obvious.

The bartender deserved better and I will go down with this.

Yep, that tattoo is def a parallel to the Mark of Cain. Which again, interesting choice 🤔

I love Mary's no nonsense vibe with Samuel, especially when he's trying to fuck around and find out aka deflecting the bullshit he's been pulling.

The photossssss, yesss.

I need John Winchester to not say shit like "should treat her more like a daughter less like a soldier' because I will have a stroke. I am so so in agreement and applauding but simultaneously thinking how fucking rich it is that this comes from any version of him. I am.in paaain. I wanna kill SPN!John with my bare hands and hearing this John say shit like this only adds fuel to the fire.

Ah yes... the innuendo. Forgot bout that. More on it, the personality Loki/Gabe shows here matches Gabe wayyyyy more than Loki, but the outfit and earlier peronality matches Loki. Cannot speak to MO since that's fully dif fron SPN, no just deserts here. Just a very bitter demigod/archangel. I am starting to think they are actively working together here and are both present and fucking around. He really really hates Lata tho. Like he's gunning for Carlos, but actively scorns Lata. Interesting.

Also also the disappearing Jericho thing... yes Loki could, but we've most seen in with Chuck and Lucifer, so I fully believe that the version that gets Carlos to make a deal is heavily leaning towards Gabe moreso than Loki.

Maggie's books save the day once more. God Maggie could've been a glorious Woman of Letters (to quite Charlie) in another life.

Uuuuuh Samuel seeing how things have changes, yess. Makes sense of course he's the one who's literally been on the outside and not being influenced by the Dean meddling til now so he still relates everything to what used to be true of the people we've been watching. But they aren't the same anymore, shit's changed and they've changed. This is what I've been trying ro highlight as it's been happening these past 8 ep that led us to Samuel confirming it.

At least he's self aware hes not a people's person. I do appreciate the distinction between monsters that kill to survive vs those that kill for fun. (And I am once more wondering if I should just post my bachelor's on the nature of monsters in spn)

Winchesters and their family specials... Aaaand I just realized they SPN!John likely had made his moms recipe for Sam and Dean when they were sick... think Dean called it cure-all kitchen-sink stew? If I remember my spn correctly...

Uuuu it was Samuel who mentioned the weapon...not Lata as Loki/Gabe accuses and mocks.

I love the arguememt between Mary and Samuel. And am mad that Samuel actually shows more emotional maturity in explaning himself here than SPN!John every did... I feel like I'm chewing glass here fellas, pray for me. Wonderful self awareness actually, love the clear generational trauma "dont want you to hate me like I hated him" indeed Samuel. Aaaand he's pulling a SPN!Mary move of rationalising his being away and distant and working on his own while his kid worries and fights the same fight by saying he's doing it for her...

So Samuel is Spn!Mary and is fueled technically by the guilt of what his choices have wroth his child. And Millie is son!John and is fueled by the grief and rage of having lost her husband to the supernatural and is reflecting it onto on her kid.

But... vitally, both are trying to fix shit and are given the space/time to do so.

Fun fighting sequence.

The bait and switch is a Loki/Gabe classic.

The Samuel stabing his daughter... oooof. Not left handed??? That's what u based it on, you absolute moron! I agree with Loki/Gabe mocking Samuel here tbh.

I will say the personality has shifted a bit after the bait and switch. The version of Loki/Gabe is now simmering with barely contained anger and is far more serious in his comments. There's more bite to them. I do believe thats more Loki leaning.

"For someone your height, you're very loud" was a helluva projection for Loki/Gabe.

I adore how Carlos breaks the rules here. And it's based in the sacrifice of hunting, but it's not because of it per se. And in doing the selfless thing, impulsively I'd even say, he broke the deal/curse. Ah... the free will of it all.

It's a very interesting arguement that Loki/Gabe gives here about humanity. Could fit either really.

Lata's mild sadistic pleasure about annoying Loki/Gabe, my beloved.

Awwwwww, they're familyyyy

I still like the Millie and Samuel dynamic. It's kind ... juicy with trauma in such a specific way.

At least now Samuel tells Mary where he's going, rather than just taking off like an asshole.

Calling Samuel, Sam... oh John, you disaster of a person, I kinda love you.

Carlos being fully behind forgiving Jericho, lovely. And omg Jericho is basically Lee here, isn't he? Is that a stretch??

Uhhhh such a gorgeous fucking voice.

Fucking Chuck still there tho and it gives me anxiety even tho I know how this ends.

I do like seeing everyone during the song montage, love the forward movement of it. The future it sorta aludes to. And Mary deciding to go on with her and John's relationship only adds to this sentiment.

Aaaanddd Dean MOTHERFUCKING Winchester has join the chat. I remember that moment when I 1st watched this... on his bday. Such a great time seeing this live tbh and it still is a hell of a reveal now too.

See y'all next time where we'll be diving into my still unresolved trauma of the spn finale, vampires (my beloveds), the Ursitoare and how annoyed I am constantly about the pronunciation of most Romanian in English shows and much more!

#spnwin #spnwin rewatch #spnwin 1x08 #lata dar #carlos cervantez #mary campbell #john winchester #millie winchester #samuel campbell

[lokiinmediasideblog]

hi! :D you've said before that you see mcu loki as ND-coded, and i'm curious about your specific thoughts on that. personally, i've mostly thought about this in terms of acquired mental illness stemming from trauma, but if i'm interpreting you correctly, you see him as innately neurodivergent? which is a fun + interesting take. are you thinking of a specific diagnosis, and/or is there a specific moment that stands out to you as ND Behaviour, or is it more of an overall vibe?

It started by thinking of Loki being ND-coded metaphorically, but I think he shows some behaviors. I will be breaking this down into actual behaviors and metaphors. I have ADHD, so I tend to skew his diagnosis towards that or AuDHD (and I have a mutual that thinks BPD also fits rather well and they're welcome to join in, lol).

Metaphors (movies):

1. The Jotun reveal. Aliens and changelings (both of which Loki is in cannon to Asgard) are common in metaphors to describe autism. From both the ND’s perspective as being in “Another planet” and from the NT’s perspective.

“A persistent trope in some autism communities is that autistic people are aliens, or, symmetrically, that non-autistic people seem like aliens to autists. Some autists are attracted to the metaphor of the alien to describe their own condition, or to say that they find other people alien (Hacking, 2009).”

“In addition to failure to thrive, before the development of modern medicine and psychiatry, it is very likely that any number of childhood disorders were interpreted as stolen children. Several modern authors have suggested that, in pre-scientific eras, children born with autism and other developmental disorders were probably considered changelings (Ashliman 1997; Wing and Potter 2002). By the late nineteenth century, science had begun to provide non-supernatural explanations for children who did not thrive or otherwise did not meet the normal expectations for a healthy infant, and belief in changelings faded. ”

2. Loki does not fit in at Asgard, the only home he’s known. His friends are actually Thor’s rather than his, and seem to tolerate him rather than like him.

3. Loki also gets blamed for misdeeds without good evidence: The W4 start suspecting a crown prince based on an enemy’s words and they assume Loki wants to harm Asgard. I think it’s important to note that they don’t assume he just wants the crown; they assume in his very short reign, that he’ll harm Asgard, which is never in his plans. And it’s unlikely they cared about Jotunheim since they wanted Thor back right away.

A parallel to being ND is that people distrust and even villainize you due to your mannerisms (e.g. “weird and quiet”). And I’ve talked about how I think Asgard promotes a very ridiculously straight forward mannerisms on its population to make self-policing easier. So Loki’s mannerisms must have clashed with the general population’s for them to distrust them so easily.

4. Loki’s main power-set being illusions, and unbeknownst to him, being changed into something he wasn’t born as (Jotun -> Asgardian), is a power-set analogous to masking (i.e. the process through which NDs camouflage themselves to fit in better).

Masking involves a lot of rehearsing and suppression to act in a more socially acceptable way. → Loki also needs to be useful to be appreciated

5. Thor being preferred for acting in ways deemed more socially acceptable by Asgard and Odin. A personal experience from me is getting shit to this day about how I was “so difficult as a toddler, unlike your brother!” and some mean comment about how I made life hell because they couldn’t take me to public places.

Some traits Loki showcases (and seem relatable to my ADHD-ass):

1. Tendency to fidget (in the movies and series). I think it’s even more noticeable in the series, where he’s doing random shit with stamps and hammers while he speaks to people (S2E1 talking with OB). It’s like he can’t stay still.

2. I pulled something very similar to the salad scene around an older mentor figure. It was rice I kept squishing in my hand while going off in a rant. My former mentor found my behavior amusing, for the most part, and never let me live that down.

3. Tendency to info-dump about how his magic works.

4. Poor impulse control (Loki series, gets drunk in a train, and cut Sif’s hair just because ← I HC he wanted to sabotage the relationship out of fear of vulnerability).

And that’s on top of the trauma-based extreme fear of abandonment he showcases in pretty much everything he’s been in.

Badly-formatted Sources:

Hacking, Ian. (2009) https://www.jstor.org/stable/40543987

#ND-coding #neurodivergence #headcannons #character coding #metaphor #mcu!loki #asks #ADHD #aliens and changelings

[marv-el-spot]

Please, can you make a parallel between Mobius telling Loki "Because we both know you love to talk." and the scene at the Citadel when Sylvie says "Well, if you think it’s a bad idea, I prefer you to speak your mind." Because that shows that Loki might love to talk but he knows when not to and that´s when Sylvie needs space. TYSM!!

Nice parallel! HERE it is. Hope you like it 😊

:))

#anonymous #answered #requests #loki #sylki #if you see it pls let me know!

[mythical-magik]

Thoughts on Season 2 Episode 6 of Loki

Am I the only one that doesn’t feel satisfied with the last episode? Some parts were perfect, but it feels like somethings missing, like there’s holes in it. That episode didn’t go the way I thought it would at all.

I think I actually prefer the theories of Loki going through the timelines to recruit the members again. Or Sylvie found a young Mobius, then her and Loki kidnapped him and he finds out.

I knew there’d be a separation between Loki and Mobius but this isn’t how I thought it would go. I thought there was going to be some huge truth bomb dropped instead of what actually happened.

I’m so used to seeing Mobius with Loki that when he’s not, it genuinely doesn’t feel right. Mobius looked lost, sad, lonely, unhappy when he was at his desk at the end.

One thing I’m obsessed with is the clothing transformation of the TVA uniform to the Cape and Horns. It was phenomenal. That was HIS MOMENT!

Ravonna’s ending was perfect. I feel like there’s something missing there but nonetheless I loved it.

I’m glad OB, Casey & B-15 are all okay. That ending in particular was okay. I’m happy everyone’s fine but it feels so … lacklustre, so flat, as if something were missing.

The scene between Mobius and Loki in the time theatre - not what I thought was going to happen. At all. A little disappointed. I don’t really get the point of it - like Loki obviously got what was needed from that conversation so good for him.

It’s got me asking, ‘what was the point of making a thing of Loki & Mobius’ friendship. Why focus on that.’ Because it seemed like that was what was taking up season 2 in the first 3 episodes. Then right at the end it’s SYLVIE who’s supporting Mobius as he goes back to see that life he was avoiding. Maybe she felt obligated- she knows that if Loki could have been there he would have. It felt as if the friendship didn’t mean anything in the end - like it didn’t even happen to begin with.

Moving on. I blew the whole ‘mobius grabbing the lapels of lokis jack’ so far out of context. I thought there was going to be begging, I thought there was going to be a heart felt moment but no. Turns out he doesn’t trust Loki? Why’s he mad- he’s actually trying to save you. Let him do his thing, you trusted his this far.

The end of season 1 scene; I joked when I said they should have killed Sylvie off then, then when it was brought up that killing Sylvie was an option I regretted it. Glad she’s okay and alive but they wasted her character, I genuinely don’t get why they kept her for season 2, she was irrelevant. The only thing I could think of was it shows a parallel of how mobius changed Loki, and the polar opposite of both these Loki’s.

This whole episode felt off until the very end, with Loki being the new ‘He Who Remains’. I was expecting that. I feel like this episode was rushed. It needed to be slowed down.

If I had to rate it out of ten, I’d give it a solid 7/10. Also I was fully expecting to see Thor and I don’t know why. No-one is dead, so I’ll take the win! There’s always next time. I’m just glad the Series is over, waiting week after week, left on cliff hangers does something to a person.

#loki #loki spoilers #loki series #loki season 2 #loki laufeyson #loki season 2 spoilers #Loki season 2 episode 6 #loki 2x06 #loki season 2 finale #loki marvel

[brokentoasterrr]

ok listen this has been on my mind for DAYS now so i’m going to shout it into the void and we’ll see what happens.

i have a note on my phone that says “exclude tags ao3” where i have written down every single tag i don’t want to see when i scroll through my favorite ship tags. this means that i don’t see what i deem gross on my feed, because every time i go scrollin’ i make the choice to curate my online experience.

the ONLY time i have ever reported a work on ao3, it was because there was a fic rated teen with tags that were clearly explicit. i didn’t want to read it, i didn’t want to leave a comment on content i wasn’t going to read, so i reported it for the sole purpose of the creator getting a little nudge so they could rate it appropriately.

the amount of posts i see about content being reported because it contains a squick of someone’s is BAFFLING to me. it’s insane that people feel the need to censor content that presumably wasn’t meant for you anyway. you cannot go online expecting the world of fandom bending over backwards to make sure that you’re safe, because guess what! the internet isn’t an inherently safe space! in order for it to be a safe space, you need to curate your own online experience, and if you’re not mature enough to do that, you should not be online. if you cannot see a piece of fiction or art or video edit without feeling squicked, grossed out, angry, or even triggered, then you have to ensure that you do not see it again. not reporting content that is “problematic” or inappropriate or offensive.

and on that note, fiction is allowed to be problematic. it’s fiction. it is not real. i have read fics containing infidelity, age gaps, murder, drug abuse, what have you, and it does not reflect on me as a person, or what i do during my time offline. i have written violent, disgusting fics; fics containing drug abuse, toxic, abusive relationships, but never in my life would i want to embody or experience what i write. i don’t want to bang a married, muscular silver fox as someone who’s much younger, but reading it? why the fuck not, it’s not about me.

i absolutely do not want to read underage stuff, or incest, or mpreg. it’s stuff that i personally think is disgusting and, to some degree, problematic (incest and underage, to be precise, i find very problematic—the rest is just personal preference). in order to avoid it, i filter those tags out. what one person thinks or feels about one certain topic should not affect other people wanting to read/write it.

the lack of nuance i see in younger people when it comes to fandom and content is frankly insane. they seem to draw such a large parallel between the fictional world and the real world, to the point where they’re incapable of seeing and understanding that the two are not one and the same. you can like a character who killed a bunch of people, write fics about it and explore who they are and why they are the way they are, without agreeing with their actions, beliefs, and values. (coincidentally, the same people who despise problematic content like graphic violence or non-con, will also take the murder character and make it into an uwu smol soft boy who just suffered trauma so its ok he’s doing this loki regulus barty crouch jr need i continue but we don’t have to unpack all of that right now)

sometimes it’s fun to be a problematic little rascal and that’s okay, because the outlet isn’t real. the fic isn’t real. it doesn’t reflect on any personal feelings, desires, beliefs, etc etc etc. the art isn’t real. if it feels too real to you, then????? don’t consume it??????? you can’t watch hannibal and then write to the show producers telling them that they’re horrible people because the show about cannibalism and murder contains just that, when you could’ve just stopped watching hannibal and done something else instead.

curate your own online experience.

#fandom rant #fandom disk horse #fandom discourse #anti anti #proship #fanfiction #fanfic #fandom #anti ship #anti proship #antiship

[valkyrieandstrangeridingaragorn]

Ravonna is such a waisted opportunity of a character. The way I view Loki is as someone who's seen past his home's propaganda. He goes along with it out of loyalty and when he rebels he knows there's no difference between what he's done and what Odin's done. I don't think Ravonna really cares about morality either. What you have is a character who could have been such a great parallel to Loki. She knows TVA is a lie but she stands by it because she's been deactivated, in the comics Ravonna and Kang love one another. They had a perfect counterpart for Loki. Loyal, cruel, sympathetic and prideful someone who can be all those things without contradicting themselves

Yeah it was a breath of fresh air when she refused to go all self-righteous like Mobius. She always knew what they were doing, she didn't have all the info regarding her personal life or what HWR had done to her but she was very much aware of their actions and she owned it like a champ. Kudos to her.

I prefer a character who is a villain and honest about it rather than someone who deceives himself into thinking he's a good guy despite his crimes and then goes around acting all self-righteous like he has the moral ground to hold other people accountable while he refuses to do the same for himself.

[megatron-fucks]

In tumblr neopagan circles there are these terms: UPG, SPG, and VPG to describe how "canon" someone's personal beliefs about their religious practice are.

UPG (unverified personal gnosis) is basically someone's headcanon about some aspect of their magical or religious practice ("In my experience, Loki prefers offerings of apples.")

VPG (verified personal gnosis) is supported by lore, such as recorded myths and practices. ("The fae don't like iron.")

And then there's SPG: shared personal gnosis. Which is when a bunch of people have the same UPG. It's not canon, but it's also not just someone's headcanon. It's a belief that is legitimised because many people share it.

I constantly find myself trying to use the phrase SPG when talking about fandom. There are so many headcanons that have become more-than-headcanon but are not canon, and I don't know another word for that.

Edit: @quetzalpapalotl reminded me that the word "fanon" exists lmao. Post cancelled.

There's also an interesting parallel that SPG (and tbf, UPG to a lesser extent) can enter into recorded lore and become VPG. All VPG starts off as things that people believe.

And the same thing can happen in fandoms that run for a long time. Eventually fans can become creators and take their understanding of the canon with them into that role. I'm pretty sure things (like Prowl being Praxian?) have entered into transformers canon this way. Probably also true of Star Trek canon, though I can't think of an example.

#fandom stuff #fandom terminology