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manchasama · 2 years

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Ah, i think i understand. Trigger warning for death/self harm, with this ask. I hope this was okay to send: it was a little long so I couldn't send this as a reply.

I feel in general , they would not kill. They like to help others, and rely on others. Like they would probably help the police or something arrest those people, preferring to see them jailed then have to deal with them personally.

If they're life is on the line, or those structures are things they consider unreliable for some reason (Corruption, not wanting to get into trouble themselves.) I think they WOULD kill , especially if they're worried about another person's life. (Be it their brother, or a passenger, or Spider Friend. ) Its just something they'd probably have to be pushed into.

Death itself is probably a highly tricky subject for them. It is an unfortunate truth that a lot of people do try to take their own lives at train stations. It's absolutely terrible when that happens. So assuming they had the same work as subway workers, They uh. They've probably seen/had to deal with the aftermath of some truly devastating things. This is something that probably affects their attitude to things like that.

Which might err them more on the 'having people survive if they have a choice'. They likely would have seen things like the surviver's families, and the witnesses (as well as the workers who witnessed that horror. ) Since in general they're such kind and caring people, I'd they would not want to see others go though that grief if it could be helped.

Though that's assuming this is a moment where they have time to think and reflect, and not pure instinct. Which would probably be to 'stop whatever is causing a threat/safety hazard at all costs, ' And if you're going the more disturbing route: well that is a very convenient cover story for someone who uh, didn't survive a fight with them.

Basically a 'With mob au, this is a subject/thought I had , but its REALLY REALLY REALLY DARK. So, it might be worth considering.

(As a fun fact, I was told one of the ways the mob hid some of their actions where things like unions. Doing things that benefit the community means that community is more likely to look the other way. 'oh that was the nice man that repaired my son's car for cheep? oh they would NEVER do anything that bad!'. Its quite likely that the twins in fact have had conversations/dealings with the mafia, but for labor union reasons! )

Completely fine to send, I'm honestly pleased as punch you did <3 I don't offend easy, don't have any squicks or triggers that I wouldn't bother at least going "nah not for me", so any honest ask will be treated respectfully. The only thing I don't have energy for is drama :p (I did my time!)

So to start, you basically hit where I'm at with them right on the head. I don't think I was really explaining it properly, partially because I have been stressed and over tired lately. In this AU in particular, I fully believe no matter what else I choose, the boys do not want to kill. There is no point where they think it's a desired path of action, nothing like that. I really hope it didn't seem like it was something they went out of their way to orchestrate, because that is not what I was thinking at all.

The thing I've been waffling over is in extreme situations what they would do. If they have a specific rule that they worked out deliberately to not kill, I think even in an extreme situation they would not kill. However if it was just...hm how to phrase. If it wasn't a goal for them to reach (aka a rule to follow), then in an extreme situation there might be a time they would. I think the thing I'm looking for in this fic is "they are more dangerous than they look", and they can already look pretty dangerous.

Hnnn, I keep typing things out and then chickening out of them. I don't know how to word a lot of this....

(Ugh I just lost some of the response, ty browser for being dumb. Luckily I was typing most of it in another doc and didn't lose most of it.)

Okay, let's see if I can finish this thought without backtracking again. One possible scenario I touched on lightly was one brother is attacked and the other has to save them.

The setup of this scene happens when they are still teens, probably like 13 or so. I know the pokemon world likes to tout that kids as young as 10 get to go gallivanting across the regions, but again this is a darker take where that would not be possible within Nimbasa City at least. Also kids are not adults, and do not have the experience or emotional maturity to handle situations the same way. Idk I am a cranky old lady who doesn't like the shallow emotions presented in pokemon games. Everything ends without impact. But that's where fanfiction comes in, to expand upon emotions and reactions that could or should happen when something so calamitous happens. (Example, MC gets kicked out of Jubilife village, and all they do is look mildly morose. And they immediately are mildly happy again when they are allowed back. Fanfics where it's more of an emotional impact ring more true to me.)

Sorry, went on a tangent. Anyway so the bros are still young, still not fully secure in their place in the world, still not strong enough to make a big enough impact on the city's underground. But they /are/ trying, are being a thorn in the underground's side as it were. In their early years, they mostly just raid and brawl the gang members, trying to drive them away from at least /this/ spot or /this/ meeting, all in all just ruin someone's day. Mostly in the subway tunnels, as that is the center of the gang activity. Out of sight of the rest of the city, transportation central, maze-like tunnels, etc. As they grow and get stronger, they can take on more people at a time, and have more of an impact. As kids, they need to plan more carefully, take on only one or two adults at a time, etc etc.

The gangs ofc know that /someone/ is being annoying, but it's not big enough to really do anything about. Those who were targeted directly are angrier about it, but higher ups really don't care about minor scuffles. They should be able to take care of their own turf without needing assistance, as it were. One of the bros is going to get caught out unexpectedly. Alright minor tangent again. I'm thinking it will be Ingo, which I am kind of torn about. I dislike any trend of Emmet being weaker than Ingo, and I may be over compensating, because I feel I'm making Ingo the victim too many times in this fic. *helpless shrug* They are equals in my mind. Either would struggle or succeed in the same situations.

Anyway, so Ingo gets caught out. I don't think he was even on a raid of any sort, he was just heading back home probably. The gang member who catches him doesn't even really know that this is the kid who's been harassing them. He just found a victim and an opportunity to let out some aggression. Ingo is in trouble, up against an adult who is stronger than him and has the upper hand, and so does not fair well in the ensuing altercation. He is in real danger, when Emmet shows up.

Once again idk if you remember, but in this AU I have decided to give the bros minor powers thanks to Litwick nearly draining them to death as kids, then pushing power back into them to revive them. It's nothing they consciously know about or use, but it can be more powerful in certain situations. It's also very emotion driven.

Emmet getting the drop on the gang member gives him an edge, but also the draining powers are working on overdrive. The draining powers alone don't do much, hence why Ingo didn't have an advantage. But a furious Emmet whose focus is solely on saving his brother and punishing this gang member? Yeah, gives him an edge for sure.

So here is the question. If they have a hard and fast /rule/ of not killing already, then Ingo definitely would step in to pull his brother away, remind him, calm him down, etc. This would give the gang member a chance to escape, since they are in no position to do anything about him. They would have to let him go, knowing he will probably try this again with someone else, because he's that kind of person. If there is no rule, then I could lean more into the hurt comfort of the interaction, the overcoming trauma of the situation. Ingo being hurt enough he can't act. Emmet's feelings over going so far (on purpose or not) to save his brother.

Either way makes a good story. Either way fits into the larger plot as a whole. It's just what angle do I feel like focusing on, what other situations does it give me one way or another. Because rest assured, there are some cool ideas a "no kill rule" path can go that the opposite cannot, just as there are some cool ideas for the "when pushed too far" path can go that you couldn't get any other way.

In any situation where they can ensure /something/ else can be done, they fight with everything they have for the better outcome. In a hopeless situation where they only way to get it to stop is to end it? They might find they have to, that it's the lesser of two evils, that it's the choice they can live with. Is it always the right choice? Doubtful. But it's the best they can do sometimes. And there are some people you can't stop any other way. You can try to put them into the legal system for justice, but they can and will slip out of it and continue their terrible ways. They have no desire to become a better person, they enjoy causing pain to others, etc. How do you stop someone who is truly evil? (Again, not something that really comes up in normal pokemon games. Everyone has a palatable reason why they do terrible things, has a path to redemption.)

And once again despite thinking about this a lot, it's not something I want to be a big part of the fic as a whole. I have a story idea, and a general idea of how I want it to go. There are just a few high stakes scenes that could go either way.

...Y'know, fine. I'll also add in the other thing I was going to scrap in this reply l o l

Here, I had one vague idea for a situation in mind where the "moral dilemma" could come up. Keep in mind this is not a solid scene or decision, just an idea I was kicking around on how to add it in.

When Ingo gets eeby deebied, Emmet does not handle it well. In this AU they are more co-dependent, since they've leaned on each other heavily through some trauma and tough times. So to have that support not only gone, but also the source of pain, Emmet is going to have a hard time handling it. I was thinking it's a spiral of him not taking care of himself, not knowing how to care about things, just the fugue of depressed giving up.

To the point that the dark elements who probably still try to cause the twins grief over the city takeover pop up and try to get him in his moment of weakness.

Now, idk if you remember, but in this AU Emmet and Ingo met Litwick together as kids, and it really is both of their first pokemon. So Chandelure is verrrrrry protective of her trainers. Emmet, not really caring to defend himself, is in danger. And she can do something about it.

My dilemma here is "Does she drain them to death", or "Does she drain them to unconsciousness". Emmet's reaction would be the key to the direction it went. I'm going to use this moment as a wakeup call to Emmet, that he can't just give up, that the world he and his brother worked so hard for still needs help, that everything they worked for could still fall apart, that he still has people who have been there since nearly the beginning, etc.

But it's a remote subway, there are no witnesses, and these people were going for taking him out so they can do harm to his city again. They are not benevolent, or /just/ targeting him, they have a plan to take back their power and fear.

The scene could go, that Emmet comes back to himself, pulls himself out of his funk as Chandelure pushes against him. That he becomes aware of his surroundings again, that he realizes his captors/attackers are all lying around him, still as can be. That he realizes that his own inattention forced Chandelure to attack and go so far. Perhaps even Chandelure is sharing the energy with him, once again trying to revive her failing trainer. Maybe Ingo is gone for both of them, but they still have each other.

Perhaps the gang members aren't quite dead yet. Perhaps Emmet recognizes some of them, knows the terrible deeds they've done and escaped justice for. Perhaps Emmet and Chandelure leave that abandoned tunnel alone. Perhaps they call for the police to come. It could go either way.

*puts hand on face* I promise I'm not trying to make this an "Emmet is the only one to go that far" or "Ingo is the victim" story. That's really why I'm hesitant to post this like thiiiisss, it's hard to convey thaaaaat.

Buh. Okay. Anyway. I guess in the end it depends on how I feel when writing it. This is the only story of mine where it's even a possibility, as again I don't really want to go that dark most of the times, but it's also fun to explore sometimes. I know I didn't really answer your ask /directly/, but I think I covered points you brought up as I rambled. The union thing tho...ooooh, that's an idea. I'll have to think about that one for a bit to see what percolates. Might explain why the gangs are so unshakably in charge of the subway systems tho~

#personal opinions ahead #anti mob au #i suppose ive also been thinking about cc lately #and seph and cloud are definitely both people who can and do kill rather easily #but not willy nilly #there is always a purpose or a larger goal they are fighting for #(well cloud is)#(seph is just along for the ride :p)#it's a different kind of 'fight for what you believe in'#waves hand #im rambly again #cannot phrase #the horrifying ordeal of being perceived

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