#from trans men to nb people to butch cis women. lesbians bi folks pan folks ace folks etc

[butchladymaria]

I agree with your list ! People being asshole about lesbian & other headcanons gtfo! That list could work for many other things too.

But to be sure everyone don’t mix thing up i just want to point out that not liking/ not being fan of an headcanon don’t equal  being an ass about it. It’s the mean actions or words afterwards that are bad. 

hey! i’m glad you found it generalizable. there’s a lot of things on there that get used against pretty much any “diverse” perspectives both inside and out of fan spaces. as for your second point, i don’t disagree with you. there are some queer headcanons that i don’t personally hold, but i’m going to be cheering them on rather than contributing to the negativity we face on a regular basis. you can personally hold a different headcanon without being a jerk.

this is not @ you anon, but there are a lot of people who believe that underrepresented groups seeing themselves in characters — whether through the lens of race, gender, sexuality, disability, etc — is “politicizing” fandom and ruining it somehow, as though a white/cishet/male/abled perspective is the default in art and anything else is “tainting” the “pure” fanspace. some of them might believe those voices can exist — so long as they keep their heads down and don’t take up too much space. the fact of the matter is that’s a bigoted thing to believe. our existence has been politicized against our will. for the marginalized, fan spaces are just another front we have to push to participate in. if someone finds themself constantly disliking one specific type of queer/nonwhite/disabled/etc. headcanon and feels the need to say over and over how much they don’t like it, they ought to seriously interrogate why that is.

#anon #ask #discussion of of bigotry cw #it kinda touches on most of them bc i feel the framework im talking about here is broad enough to apply generally #idk i dont think this is what anon meant? #but like. i feel there is a difference between having a different pov and actively openly disliking smth #i actually find utena tenjou to be a good example of this #utena is very ambiguous in both gender & sexuality as a character #ive seen all varieties of headcanons for her and all sorts of people relating to her #from trans men to nb people to butch cis women. lesbians bi folks pan folks ace folks etc #and i dont think any of those perspectives are wrong #i think shes a transmasc lesbian because i’m a transmasc lesbian and the show cracked my egg lol #but i dont think that means that like. transfem ppl are Wrong to relate to her. i don’t think it means bi ppl are wrong to relate to her. #i dont think hcing her as those things are wrong either #but if someone comes out and says people are wrong and bad and annoying for existing with those povs?? shut up #and when those ppl crop up they are usually trying to argue a character is more Normative #ex: gender conforming. straight. cis. white. etc. #so yes dont be an asshole over headcanons but being an asshole to queer hcs almost always looks very different #bc its usually built on bigoted foundations

[e-de-mimsy]

Sapphic Solidarity Flag as designed by me, January 2019

[Image description: a flag with three vertical stripes. All of them are of the same width. From left to right the colours are violet, a lighter rose, and a magenta-pink.]

Are there thousands of flags yet? yes. Am I sorry for creating another one? no, although I did hesitate.

Background: I myself currently identify as Bi, but most of last year I’ve been questioning if the label even fits me or if I’m actually a lesbian. I started following several wlw blogs and they all helped a lot. On top of that a good friend of mine came out as a trans woman to me and we found a lot of comfort in each other during last year. I am so thankful for this community and for everyone who helped me figuring this out. During all this I learned how important the solidarity and support for one another is in this community, but I also saw a lot of intra community disagreements or even bigotry. So I got this idea for a flag like this. One that celebrates all wlw, that stands for the support and solidarity, and is explicitly including trans women, always.

About the design:

It features the colour purple/violet for lesbians, the light shade of pink from the transgender flag, and a slightly less saturated bold pink from the bi flag. (Less saturated so it doesn’t clash with the other two colours)

I chose 3 colours because it makes the design easier to remember, also a design of 3 looks more balanced & harmonic in this case

at first I had the stripes in the common horizontal fashion, but then I thought that I’d prefer them to stand equally next to another. Additionally it makes the flag stand out in the sea of horizontally striped flags.

not only do I prefer the look of the transgender flag pink in the middle, it also has a meaning for me: per design it is 100% included and there to stay.

Who’s represented with that flag? Who can use it? (before anyone asks)

lesbians, no matter if butch, femme, bambi, ...

trans women, no matter what their orientation is.

wlw who are attracted to multiple genders (bi, pan, poly are all summarised under the stripe of the bi pink)

I know that people who ID as wlw/sapphic can have a difficult relationship with gender, so of course it includes NB people/people who fall under the NB umbrella.

questioning wlw. Labels can be difficult and we’re here to support & uplift one another

If you’re ace/aro and ID as lesbian, bi/pan/poly, are a trans woman or generally go by sapphic/wlw, then you’re included too of course.

you are any of the above and want to express your love and support for the others represented in this flag. This flag is supposed to be a direct statement against hate & bigotry.

Who cannot use it?

Transphobes, Terfs, Truscum, Transmeds

lesbophobes & biphobes

racist folks

generally: if you discriminate based on gender, orientation, ethnicity & race, religious believes, disabilities, class, ... I need you to better yourself. Until then this flag isn’t for you.

cis people who are not wlw

you’re a MAP

Additional notes (because this is the internet):

This isn’t anti gay/bi/trans men. This is not supposed to be a new, seperate community, instead it is about strengthening the wlw parts of the community and about the rejection of intra community transphobia. It is a symbol for the solidarity and respect I wish to become the future for the whole LGBT+ community. We’re the strongest when we work together.

While cis non-wlw women are not included in this flag it doesn’t mean we don’t care about them. Feminism is deeply rooted with sapphic and trans women, and we sure as hell won’t make exceptions when it comes to our feminism.

This flag is about love, compassion, support, solidarity, respect, united strength and acceptance. We stand up for another and won’t tolerate hate against any of us.

#wlw #sapphic #lesbian #bisexual #transgender #trans women #feminism #positivity #pride flags #lgbt community #original stuff by me #oof I'm anxious about how this will be received #terfs and transphobes don't interact #of course this flag is *just* a proposal #I just really like the concept #... obviously #wlw positivity #LGBTQ

[kkglinka]

Huh, apparently the differences in queer coding used by lesbians and bisexuals are interesting to people, especially in regard to butch identities. As I've never been femme, I can't and won't speak from that perspective, though I welcome input and can make very general observations.

Now, both lesbian and bi/pan women engage in masculine performance – not to be confused with actual masculinity as seen in cis and trans men. The performance involves elaborate and often exaggerated emphasis on desirable masculine traits, sans the offensive and tiresome bits that come courtesy of toxic masculinity in american culture. This performance can be outright tacky in its extremes, a deliberate deterrent against being co-opted by the dominant, straight society. Thereby, qualities that would be offensive or aggravating in a man become attractive in a queer woman (so long as they're purely performative).

I realize that the first sentence of that paragraph may be difficult for many monosexuals to believe (intersectionality is a thing so don't even both trying to harangue me about that word), but there have always been loads of butch bi women. There are plenty of men who are quite attracted to those traits in women, but toxic masculinity can undermine their desires; cis men are not socially permitted to be attracted to masculine traits. Many wind up crippled with homophobia...which they then take out on that woman. Hurray.

So, butch bi women often wind up with partners of the same or similar sex. (Bearing in mind the ~40% bi/pan overlap with the trans/nb communities). Which brings us to the differences in queer coding between lesbians and bi's. Many bi women respond to often vicious hostility from the queer community by blending in with conventional forms of femininity. In part because their own identity is more feminine and because, purely in statistical terms, there are way more heterosexual men than potential queer partners. It's plain numbers.

But those of us bi women that do queer code are trying to appeal to a broader pool of applicants. Okay, that sounds like we're seeking out employees, but whatever. Butch lesbian coding is marvelous to observe, but it's very expressly masculine in ways meant to put off men while appealing to other queer women. Further, butch is strongly linked to working class style in the US, which is why you get the absence of make-up, short hair, work clothes of all plaids, boots or trainers, etc.

Because blue collar is less threatening to the highest social caste of cis white men. That's one reason you see studs and dandies far less often — along with overall changes in fashion — but the other big reason is how radfems systematically assaulted the butch/femme tradition. Default queerness became gender neutral, an androgynous sort of grunge. But visit queer social media and you'll see women going bonkers for fashionable butch; there is a dearth. Seriously, it's time for a come back; queer women love a tailored suit and fancy hat.

I digress. Coding is deliberate, it takes effort and it's a very useful tool to communicate queerness. We have norms that allow us to generalize and many butch stereotypes are quite factual. It's why we get so pissed when straight fashion robs us of our tools. Especially given how various shades of butch have nuances (that cis straight folks often miss, which lead to the more hostile and unflattering stereotypes). The more fashion conventions they co-opt, the fewer we have to effectively communicate, at a glance.

The butch woman in the slightly grimy jeans and flannel, short hair, no make-up, emulating a masculine swagger and directness of speech is deliberately and knowingly communicating: lesbian. (Unless she's a he, duh). But that butch women in slacks, low heel boots, slick leather jacket, longer hair, light make-up and fashionable fedora? Now you can't be so certain because most anyone will flirt with her. As she intends. You are far more likely to see that overt mixture in butch bi women...because of that ~40% I mentioned earlier.

Wow, that got rambly, but it's because I feel strongly about the fascinating range of coding the butch community (intersectionality again!) uses. But in summary, butch bi/pan women and butch lesbians generally tend to code differently due to a different (somewhat overlapping) range of targets, and I think that deviation is cool.

#bisexual problems #it would be nice #if people quit equating #butch with ugly #i may be an average mcnugget #but damnit #I know how to match clothes #and accessories #butch is only ugly #because straight men feel threatened by it #because it's like a primer #on how to be masculine #without being an insensitive jackass #butch and metrosexual #are very similar

[colorisbyshe]

Ace Discourse is definitely Baby's First Discourse (except that inclusionists are a bunch of dusty 30/40 year olds like.... yikes), but what do you think about this new discourse (idk if it's actually new lol but it's new on my dash). I mean the "are all nb ppl trans" discourse. I'm nb and I don't consider myself trans, tbh. As an amab transmasc nb person, I don't think it fits? or is appropriate? but idk... btw this pan vs bi discourse is getting wild lmao pansexuals can seethe w/ Freud lmao

I think it’s complicated when we consider the broad range of nonbinary identities and their material realities. There are some nonbinary people whose realities more closely resemble those of cis people and there are some nonbinary people whose realities more closely resemble those of trans people.

Which is actually… the point of nonbinary identities. It’s important and vital to understand that nonbinary identities can take on many forms and some of them are… not far removed from cis. I’m saying this as a person who falls under that category.

I’m afab and feel “woman-aligned.” I go by she/her pronouns and don’t get overwhelmingly upset when referred to as a woman. I’m more impacted by misogyny than transphobia. My gender presentation is fairly genderless, I’m not feminine, but I don’t actually push any boundaries or transgress anything.

I’m not and likely never will be the target of most forms of transphobia.

And I don’t really identify as trans besides recognizing I fall under the umbrella of trans which means “does not identify with their agab.” I can recognize that while nbphobia stems from transphobia and is a facet of it and that people will not understand my gender identity because of transphobia and I can also recognize that… most transphobia is distinctly about people identifying as the “opposite” of their agab–ie people (wrongly) seen as “women” identifying as men and vise versa.

There is a gulf of experiences between me and trans people who identify as the binary opposite of their agab. And there… isn’t necessarily a huge gap between me and cis women.

There are cis women who resent the confines, expectations, and “rules” of womanhood as much as I do. There are cis women who hate being seen as women because of what it means as much as I do. There are cis women who actually push the boundaries of gender more than I do in terms of presentation and reception (ie butch lesbians are pushing against gender norms more than I feel I am).

So, y’unno, it’s complicated. Because there’s “transgender as does not identify as your agab” which all nonbinary people are and there’s transgender as “across gender” which a lot of nonbinary people aren’t. And that’s okay.

I’m not recommending a cut off of “your material reality must be this trans to enter.” Especially since trans realities vary so widely–the life of a trans person who passes is different from a trans person who does not who’s life is different from a closeted trans person, etc etc.

But I also think it’s unhelpful to pretend like an afab demigirl faces the same level of hardship and scrutiny as a trans man or a trans woman.

Regardless, I think we should stick together because we face the same aggressors, potentially the same issues, and we have the same goals and experiences and activism. We want the same things for the same reasons to the same effect. But we can acknowledge that different nb identities have a different relationship to transphobia, somewhat like how different bisexual folk have different relationships to homophobia– a woman primarily attracted to men has a different relationship to “gayness” than a woman primarily attracted to women. The relationship is there for all bi folk but your mileage may vary.

Likewise, a nb person who primarily identifies with their agab has a different relationship to transness than one who identifies as the “opposite” of their agab.

Both have a relationship to transness but it’s different.

And that’s okay.

So, I guess the simplest way to put is “I think all nonbinary people belong under the trans umbrella but different nonbinary people have different material realities when it comes to transness which is why we should stop conceptualizing nonbinary identities as a monolith.”

Across all trans and nonbinary identities, there are infinite experiences and for most cases little connects us together besides “Not quite a fan of being labeled a gender at birth :/// That’s rude.” Y’unno? Even trans/nb people of the same gender can have wildly different experiences.

But we all just want people to respect what we say our gender is and accept that how we present and exist is our choice that’s only our fucking business.

So, y’unno, if if a nb person says they’re trans, I feel it. If they say they’re not, I get it. But also we should all understand that sometimes… some people are “more trans.” That’s not at all the best way to phrase it but like… it’s the most blunt way to get my point across.

And I don’t think it’s a bad thing to be “less trans.” And I recognize that for people who are bigender or completely agender or not at all aligned fall in a grey area. Which is why I recognize nb identities aren’t a monolith--but for the “nb ppl who align with their agab” I think there’s room to say “Hey, sometimes our relationship to cis AND transness means some trans conversations and spaces aren’t really meant for us” and also “sometimes that means we have it a lot, lot easier.”

But recognizing that nuance is gonna get me labeled an nbphobe lmao. Just like I’m a bisexual biphobe for saying some bisexual people are “gayer” than others.

I guess I’m a bigot towards all of my own identities. Yikes.

#my politics are heavily invested in material realities when it comes to more abstract idnetities #and i'm never really gonna budge on that #Anonymous