#they deleted that and deleted the dialogue about Dean being the one and only one to spread Cas’ ashes

[insanesonofabitch]

Me when I remember that Dean was supposed to gently and lovingly touch Cas’ face in Tombstone:

#they deleted that and deleted the dialogue about Dean being the one and only one to spread Cas’ ashes #in the meadow by the windmill cus he thought Cas would love it. and he did. #they deleted all that. #supernatural #spn #spn deleted scenes #spn 13x06 #tombstone #destiel #deancas #casdean #dean winchester #castiel #dean x castiel #reiotalks

[crackers4jenn]

Jeremy Carver didn't get the respect he deserves in that pollsnatural writers poll. I need to remind y'all who was doing a lot of the heavy lifting when it came to early destiel. Jeremy Carver wrote (or, was credited as the writer) for the following:

3x11 "Mystery Spot" - not a destiel ep, just a banger 👍

4x03 "In the Beginning" - aka the first hint of Cas being sympathetic to Dean. 3 episodes into Cas's existence Jeremy Carver was asking the big questions, like what would it look like if Dean and Cas stared all soulfully into one another's eyes??? I MEAN,

4x20 "The Rapture" - the Jimmy Novak episode. Gave us Dean's tranquil fishing dream, Cas's note-passing interruption. Gave us all the conflict of Dean witnessing Jimmy Novak in place of Cas. Gave us that mic drop "I learned my lesson while I was away, Dean. I serve Heaven, I don't serve man. And I certainly don't serve you" hell of a walk-off line.

5x03 "Free to Be You and Me" - do I even need to expand on this one??? "I need your help because you are the ONLY one who will help me," Thelma and Louise quote, Bert and Ernie quote, "you are not gonna die a virgin," the Raphael confrontation, etc etc Dean tells Cas it's the happiest he's been in years!!!

5x08 "Changing Channels" - another classic episode that's great even without the undercurrent of destiel. But undercurrent there is. One of the recurring themes of the episode is Dean being worried about what Gabriel's doing to Cas. Plus, helloooo, "pretty boy angel" Jeremy Carver's horniness for Misha CAME THROUGH.

5x18 "Point of No Return" - do you all not remember "last person who looked at me like that, I got laid" do you all not remember "I gave EVERYTHING for you, and this is what you give to me????" do you all not remember "what the hell happened to him? / "me"???? And a sidenote: do you all not remember Cas carving a banishing sigil into HIS OWN CHEST?????? Again I say, Jeremy Carver's crush on Misha CAME THROUGH.

8x01 "We Need To Talk About Kevin" - I'm pretty sure at this point JC became showrunner, so there was a ~shift in the blatancy of destiel in his writing, but still. This ep is the start of the Purgatory flashbacks, the first peek at Dean's guilt over Cas not making it out with him.

8x23 "Sacrifice" - the 'ET goes home" bar scene, the dozens and dozens of pages worth of meta about cupid and the arrows and the two dudes falling in love in front of Dean and Cas.

9x01 "I Think I'm Gonna Like It Here" - Dean's "please, man, I need you here" prayer to Cas, which miiiight be the first time he prays to Cas seriously. Their v. soft phone call sometime after where Dean is just as worried for Cas as Cas is for him. Plus, hey-o, would it be a Carver episode without objectifying Misha in some way? This is the ep with the infamous laundry scene, of Cas shucking off his clothes in a very poignant loss-of-identity horny way.

9x23 "Do You Believe in Miracles?" - uh, ever heard of "to save Dean Winchester. That was your goal, right? I mean, you draped yourself in the flag of heaven but ultimately it was all about saving one man" which is pretty much a Castiel thesis statement dropped casually as dialogue.

10x01 "Black" - okay, picture this, Cas is depressed and lying wantonly atop a bed, clad only in a robe that's open juuuust wide enough his chest peeks through. To Sam, he wistfully admits "I miss him" as they tiptoe around the subject of Dean. Fanfic, you say? No, Jeremy Carver.

10x23 "Brother's Keeper" - there's a deleted scene of Cas showing up in Dean's dream, bloody and beat up, introduced by the bartender as Dean's "admirer." Not to mention! Winchester Derangement Syndrome. Not to further mention!! Shattered at the altar of Winchester.

11x01 "Out of the Darkness, Into the Fire" - gonna let this gif speak for itself:

#in conclusion: 👑 #destiel #supernatural #castiel #dean winchester #otp: profound bond

[meggie-stardust]

20 Questions for Fic Writers

Thanks to the ever lovely @lucky-bishop for the tag! <3

How many works do you have on ao3?

74! Which feels both like a lot and not that much at the same time.

What's your total ao3 word count?

270,119?!

What fandoms do you write for?

Right now primarily Teen Wolf and I recently revisited my first fandom of Gundam Wing. I've also written a ton for BBC Merlin, Percy Jackson/Heroes Of Olympus, BBC Sherlock, Harry Potter, Newsies and random other things...

Top five fics by kudos:

Act of Man | BBC Merlin | Arthur/Merlin

Nightmares | PJO/HoO | Percy/Jason

Looking for the Thing We Lost | Teen Wolf | Peter/Stiles

Here I Am (Stuck in the Middle With You) | PJO/HoH | Percy/Jason

Know How A Man Becomes a Beast | Teen Wolf | Peter/Stiles

Do you respond to comments?

Yes, on all of my stuff from the past few years. There are older fics that I've opted not to respond to comments on for varying reasons, but I do read them all.

What is the fic you wrote with the angstiest ending?

When I have angst, I like to have it with a happy ending, but I would probably say this fliclette I wrote based on the prompt: "Can you do a Jasercy fic where Jason is trying to comprehend the fact that Percy's gone, preferably death, but it doesn't have to be."

A Slow Deep Panic | PJO/HoO | Jason/Percy

What's the fic you wrote with the happiest ending?

I really like the end of Stuck Between Stations. After putting Stiles and Peter in the Wild Hunt and in time loop, the least I could do was give them a happy ending.

Do you get hate on fics?

Not hate, but I have gotten weird comments. I usually just ignore if they are just odd, but I have also deleted comments that are boarding on hate.

Do you write smut?

Yep!

Craziest crossover:

Aside from one HP/Sherlock fic that was co-written with my bestie and that we both abandoned, I don't really do long form crossovers (and that one wasn't crazy anyway). That said, there was a tumblr prompt game years ago, that was for 3 sentence fics and almost every prompt I got was a crazy crossover:

Dean and Castiel. Fight Club

MJN crew (bonus points for including Herc Shipwright). Supernatural hunters.

Sherlock/John. Teenagers working at Mooby's (View Askewniverse).

Jack/Spot, Night Vale AU.

Arthur and Eames. Exorcism.

You can read all of these and a few others: 3 Sentence Fic Collection. And actually, this was a fun trend, we should bring it back.

Have you ever had a fic stolen?

Not that I'm aware of, and knock on wood it never happens.

Have you ever had a fic translated?

Yes! A few actually, and it's always so, so, so flattering:

Acts of Man was translated into Chinese

Black Sails in the Sunset was translated into Português

Looking for the Thing We Lost was translated into Russian

This is a perfect time to say that I am always open to my fics being translated, podficced, remixed, etc. Just let me know so I can gush about it!

Have you ever co-written a fic before?

Yes, the aforementioned abandoned HP/Sherlock fic, but it's been ages. @punchedbymarkesmith and I have kicked around some collab ideas, which I think would both be a blast and also for a potentially niche audience. Maybe 2024 is the year this happens!

All time favourite ship?

Steter is the one I've stuck with the longest, but I do have a few that I will always return to in the same way you might eat a comfort meal.

What's a wip you want to finish but doubt you ever will?

Look, I really, really want to finish It's Only Forever. I have like 1, maybe 2 chapters left. But it's been so long and I feel like my writing has changed, and idk. Every year I say I'm going to work on it, and every year I don't... le sigh.

What are your writing strengths?

I think I'm really good at finding a small moment in canon and then diverging from that. I also think I'm good at authentic dialogue and I think I'm pretty good at world building.

What are your writing weaknesses?

Action/fighting. Keeping things short unless it's a drabble/other restrictive format.

Thoughts on dialogue in another language?

I am not fluent enough in any language other than English to do this confidently. Instead, I would write something like:

Stiles cursed at them wildly in Polish.

or

Peter responded in French, then turned back to Stiles and resumed their conversation in English.

First fandom you wrote in?

Gundam Wing. All of my old fic from *cough* 20+ years ago is lost to the annals of time (actually some is still on archived GW 1x2 sites if you look hard enough). And if you are one of like 7 people who remember my username, you can find my Newsies and Harry Potter fic (my next two fandoms) still on ffn. After I got out of a bad relationship that kept me from my own interests, including fandom, I returned with BBC Sherlock fic, which you can still find on AO3 if you scroll to the beginning of my profile.

Favorite fic you've written?

Gosh, I feel like this changes all the time, but I am particularly proud of At This Truth We Have Arrived. I loved exploring certain aspects of Peter's character, and doing a different take on Nogistune Stiles. I was also able to incorporate a lot of different themes and elements into it, as well as get my own closure with Monroe, something that has bugged me since the finale. Plus, I think I was able to accomplish a reveal that would add extra elements if anyone went back and re-read the story (even if I somewhat show my hand if anyone paid attention to the epigraph).

I have no idea who has done this yet, since I sat on this for a bit... so no pressure tags for @lolahardy @mirrorthoughts @myletternevercame @punchedbymarkesmith @midmorning-bomb @like-lazarus

#tagged #meg writes fic #writing meme

[ltleflrt]

Twenty Questions for Fic Writers!

Thanks for tagging me @prosopopeya 😊

1. How many works do you have on AO3?

112 (also 112 unanswered asks in my inbox, oops lol)

2. What's your total AO3 word count?

1,998,134

3. What fandoms do you write for?

Dragon Age, Mass Effect, SPN/Destiel, Baldur's Gate 3

4. What are your top 5 fics by kudos?

Kiss the Baker (9,346)

Satin and Sawdust (8,306)

Cursed Or Not (7,797)

No Words (7,754)

Addicted To You (6,079)

5. Do you respond to comments? Why or why not?

I try to! In order to conserve spoons for it, I only answer comments on my long/chaptered fics, and don't answer them on my short one-shots. Which makes me feel guilty sometimes, but setting up an exception is the only way I can manage my social anxiety about it.

6. What is a fic you wrote with the angstiest ending?

No Such Thing As Ghosts

This is a one-shot that I always answer comments on because if someone takes the time to read a MCD fic, they deserve extra gratitude, and probably milk and cookies and a box of tissues.

7. What's the fic you wrote with the happiest ending?

I write romances or smutfics, they all have happy endings lol

Probably the sweetest thing I've ever written is Where The Heart Lives which was for an October writing challenge a few years ago.

8. Do you get hate on fics?

It's happened, though it's rare. There was a troll that targeted me on FFnet like 10 years ago who was so over the top with their hatred that it was actually funny. Every once in a while I'll get a comment that irritates me, but it's not really hateful stuff, just something I disagree with.

9. Do you write smut? If so, what kind?

Yeah, original sci-fi alien smut was a thing for me when I was a teenager. For fanfic, I loooove writing smut. Some of my short fics are just smut. My favorite kind of smut involves being in a shower or a bathtub. It might just be masturbation, or full on sexual escapades, but there's water involved.

10. Do you write crossovers? What's the craziest one you've written?

I don't like crossovers, so no. I have a lot of ideas for fusions, but I haven't written any. I tried to do a Pacific Rim/Mass Effect fusion, but I only ever got 1 chapter, and it's the only fic I've deleted from AO3.

For reference, I consider a crossover something that includes characters from both universes in a story together, and a fusion is a story where characters from one universe live in the other universe, but there's no meeting of characters from both. Like, Dean is a Templar who knows Knight Captain Cullen in Dragon Age, vs what if Dean is the Knight Captain instead of Cullen.

11. Have you ever had a fic stolen?

Not that I'm aware of *knocks on wood*

12. Have you ever had a fic translated?

Yes, a few. One of them isn't on AO3 and I lost the link, which I'm sad about. But now I only give permission if it's going to be posted on AO3, so they show up under my name.

13. Have you ever co-written a fic before?

Not exactly, but @jupiterjames and I have worked so closely together that it's almost co-writing. @bendingsignpost wrote a prequel to a shortfic I wrote tho... does that count? That probably counts. Here's the series:

Bookshelf Boys by bendingsignpost, Ltleflrt

14. What's your all-time favorite ship?

They all feel equal in my heart, but I've written the most for Destiel, so they're probably a tiiiiny bit more important to me lol

15. What's a wip you want to finish, but doubt you ever will?

I'm starting to think I'm never going to finish anything ever again lol

My current posted WIPs are

Reaching Out (Dragon Age)

Shameless (SPN/Destiel)

I desperately want to finish them, but my brain is very NOPE about it. There's also the Untitled Haunted House AU I've been talking about for years now, but I've never posted any of it.

16. What are your writing strengths?

Capturing character voice in dialogue. Also shower/bathtub smut 😁

17. What are your writing weaknesses?

Descriptions. Of anything. People, places, emotions. I feel like I suck at all descriptions.

18. Thoughts on writing dialogue in another language for a fic?

I like to do it, but I definitely have to get help since I'm hopelessly monolingual. And I like when other authors do it too.

19. First fandom you wrote for?

Dragon Age, specifically DA2. It's what got me into reading fanfic in the first place, and eventually sparked the urge to write.

20. Favorite fic you've written?

This answer changes every time someone asks me the question lol... today's favorite is Peace because it's the most recent thing I've worked on and there are 2 people commenting on it, and I'm having a good time with it.

Tagging: @jupiterjames @mittensmorgul @slytherkins @valleydean

#ltleramblings #tagging meme

[deansmom]

1. How many works do you have on Ao3?

228 😅

2. What's your total Ao3 word count?

665,600 - I like coda’s and shorter fics, clearly.

3. What fandoms do you write for?

Currently, mainly Marvel. Historically supernatural, with some other things sprinkled in as inspiration strikes.

4. What are your top 5 fics by kudos?

Regarding Us deancas

The things I love deancas

Be careful, it’s my heart sambucky

Dean and Castiel’s excellent cockles love story

I found my bluebird

5. Do you respond to comments?

Sometimes! I read them all though, and deeply appreciate them 🖤🥺 just responding with a thank you feels almost disingenuous to me 99% of the time, so I’d rather just save my responses for when I really have something to say.

6. What is the fic you wrote with the angstiest ending?

Chapter 4 of stolen moments specifically, or its sister in remember me

7. What's the fic you wrote with the happiest ending?

Erosion or I want my life to be with you, probably. Or actually, probably a map of who you are

8. Do you get hate on fics?

Once. I matched their energy and they deleted the comment 😇😌 but I usually just occasionally get medium out of pocket comments about Sam being insecure in his & Bucky’s relationship, as if he isn’t a whole grown man 😩

9. Do you write smut?

Hilariously, I used to before I became a lot more comfortable with being asexual. Now when I try, I just hate it. Like, it’s fine? But I hate reading it, so I don’t usually publish it.

10. Do you write crossovers? What's the craziest one you have written?

I… may or may not have at one point. You can be an internet sleuth and try to find it lol

11. Have you ever had a fic stolen?

Not that I know of?

12. Have you ever had a fic translated?

Yes!

13. Have you ever co-written a fic before?

Christ, no. I would never do that to someone 😭 I cannot just sit down and decide to write, and it’s something that takes a lot of mental effort to do for me so I go months without writing.

14. What's your all time favorite ship?

It’s a tie between deancas & stevebucky. I’m sorry, they just get me.

15. What is a WIP you want to finish but doubt you ever will?

Are you ready to be strong? I’ve said it before but I’ll say it again: anybody is welcome to finish that one because I never will lol

16. What are your writing strengths?

Dialogue.

17. What are your writing weaknesses?

Everything else 😂

18. Thoughts of writing dialogue in another language in fics?

I try to do it sparingly, or I just write it but don’t translate it 😅

19. First fandom you wrote for?

Doctor who, I think?

20. Favorite fic you have written?

I’m probably the most proud of a map of who you are because it’s the first and only long fic I’ve ever finished.

be careful, it’s my heart

This monster of a series tbh. I’ve had so much fun playing with those characters the last couple years 🖤🥺

#mackenzie attempts fics #personal

[incarnateirony]

An anti dressed up as a shipper, an idiot, and a terf all walk into the same bar.

It’s the same picture person.

A lesson.

Warning: if the title doesn’t give it away, queerphobic content comes up in this from the other party being documented.

So, some of you may have watched a twitter exercise yesterday.

It started simple: concern trolling white knight “for the writers” comes in to angrily declare fans doing something tagged in support of them about Destiel was “out of line.” She claimed things like “Misha was gaslit into supporting Destiel”, and pulled all kinds of stunts.

She immediately got on a soap box yelling “I HAVE A LIT CRIT DEGREE, I KNOW AUTHOR INTENT” of course implying she knew better than EVERYONE around her how to read text. She then pulled, of all things, @chill-legilimens​​ ‘ article about the network gods gutting the show out of the internet, and somehow misread it SO FUCKING BADLY -- SO FUCKING BADLY -- she thought it aligned with HER. She argued that fans influenced the writers, essentially, and basically pulled the exact opposite of the very clearly delivered message there out. When it was pointed out we know this author and even sometimes help edit their pieces, and she was, flat out misreading it while bragging about how good she is at deciphering text, it turned into a SHITSHOW.

I had watched her give a large group of queer people 2 days of runaround, while they tried to be polite, and similarly tried to prove everything while she proved nothing. Just preached. After 2 days of them exhausting themselves on her, I came in doing my blunt & savage thing, because fuck civility culture when it’s used by oppressors. Of course, she immediately started tone policing, while herself being an arrogant shitbrick the whole way.

She continued to preach author intent and talk down about “headcanons.” You see, she knew the authors very well. Berens’ name was mentioned in passing, and she came back with. “Who’s Berens? Is that the author of the article?” after Deirdre’s name had been directly cited in associated with it about 15 times.

(credit: @judgehangman​ )

But it gets better. She started pulling the “authors have said Dean is straight.” line. Now, at this point, we had already sourced her at least four pieces of information (quite formally too: SPN Official DVD Collection Season 8 episode 13 creative commentary, Edlund and Sgriccia; Dissent Magazine The Attack Queers Bob Berens review; the books in the office with screenshots, and more.) So we issued one simple request: Okay. Source.

For the next-- I shit you not-- 10 hours she bricked the thread to death, finding any and EVERY rabbit hole she could try to venture down. For the first hour or two a few of us tried to actually debate her newly raised points, but still gave reminder that we were waiting for her source. Every tweet was an opportunity for her to drop a 15 tweet thread trying to derail onto a new topic, and often clarifying she had no idea about any of it (Edlund, Sgriccia, Berens, Dabb--who she couldn’t spell the name of--and Deirdre all became an amorpheous blob in her retelling that she swore she looked at sources and wasn’t convinced, while she crossed all the data and comments about the sources). She tried to challenge that anyone could know all the writers and episodes just because she proved she couldn’t, even when multiple people expressed it to her extremely rapidly with not just author and director listings, but cross references on when they overlapped and major elements (like the 15.20 shot 19 tree being the Kim Manners memorial tree). She randomly babbled about Kripke once. Lied her way through and claimed those sources were vague. Etc.

But at some point, I decided, we’re not playing this distraction game. You wanted a debate, you claim you have a lit crit degree, and thus know the entire art is Argumentation. A source, if you’re declaring knowing author intent. One source. Any time she dropped a distraction tweet, I replied to her thread with things like a list of our sources vs her lack of any and a reminder. I installed a counter ticker. How many times had she been asked to either recant her point or give a single source?

Someone made a list of the logical fallacies she used in the argument. It was two tweets long and still missed several obvious ones. That didn’t stop her. Neither did the dozens of requests for a source or a recant. Onwards, she marched, derailing time and again. She brought in a buddy to try to distract, but he fell out real quick when he realized “the burden of proof lies on the arguer” shot him and her both in the feet in record time and he ducked out. 

Other greatest hits came out like “Dubs (Dabb’s) fanfic books”, and calling the ability to list authors and episodes “headcanons.”

Over time, the dialogue shifted: see, she came in trying the snide “enjoy your headcanons” downtalk, but as time and time again she was pulverized on every point about the show, or the authors, or anything else while STILL never even giving a single source to even her FIRST POINT and running distractions, it became a reality-- she was told, “We’ll enjoy our canon and author intent. You can enjoy your headcanon of... Dabb’s fanfic books and Lord Barons and the writers being collective hallucinations and whatever else in your hot takes about the show content itself” and she FLIPPED SHIT. 

As the ticker for sources approached 100, she started becoming flustered. Before that, even, she started repetitively misgendering Ezra (no tumblr to link in), and Ezra screenshot their bio of they/them and asked them to adjust. Ignored. Ezra linked this request and asked it to be addressed again, and again, and again. 13 times. Ezra linked it 13 times. She even replied to several of them. No avail. No change. Not until literally any and every tweet in her vicinity either had “source?” or “address gender?” for her to reply to did she flee there, and write some giant write-around of “oh, I didn’t see this, sorry” but still refused to actually use it. Or “I’ll use the right one now.” No, just completely strickened pronouns from her vocabulary with Ezra moving forward, after not one mistake, not two, not five, but 13 answers.

At this point, I notice a trend: throughout the entire conversation, she had flip flopped on my pronouns, clearly confused as to what to call me. As I generally don’t care (honestly I prefer he but meh), it didn’t ping me as something to react to while she switched religiously between “he” and “she”. But I realized now, despite all of that confusion: she never once thought to use “they.” Also earlier we found tweets of hers that, while now declaring herself bisexual, she used troublesome wording in the past to blur the line on if she was an ally or, as she phrased it “maybe less than 100% straight in the bell curve” in other conversations.

I mutter about this on the side to Ezra and some friends, but continue on towards the 100 ticker that was the goal to show people in this digital terrarium how disingenuous most people you argue with are -- an exhibit for the class. They know they’re lying and have been caught, but will not cede to admit “oops, I guess I was wrong.” but rather stick, unironically, to their own headcanons about things. After all, they vaguely sorta apologized even if suddenly just refusing to use any pronouns at all on Ezra after that. And she’s so quick to disappear into 15 tweet bombs of distraction trying to play victim for being held accountable at this point, we just didn’t jump to a conclusion on that, alarming as it is.

So. You know. Source.

At this point, she RANDOMLY starts evoking the fact that like, How Dare, She Watched Gay Men Die To AIDS, She Is A Great Philanthropist How Dare How Dare. 

I’m sorry, did you just evoke the blood of our dead to run away from the most basic scrap of accountability in what is literally the first wave of a lit debate because for the last 10 hours you have refused to take the necessary steps to move on to the next point? Did you... just... evoke the ghosts of gay men that were genocided to, essentially, pull up a smokescreen and run away from being party to queer erasure? Or even just? Giving a source? or admitting you were wrong on one point in a debate? Wow, you really just did that. 

Naturally, people involved got pissed. Her Sources ticker hit 100, but at this point, all that haunted her was how completely fucking vile and inappropriate that was in this discussion. 

She got blocked. She then tried to glom onto anyone that hadn’t blocked or muted her and run the same argumentation points she had earlier been decimated in the argument with, while yelling “I ship Destiel too! I wanted them to have sex too! Why does this make me the bad guy?” around the block and hoping nobody actually read the thread. She tried to pitch the “headcanons” point of view again, hoping a new audience would lick her boots. She was, largely, ignored; given a few more comments about her leaving the conversation losing all points and only covered in the blood of our dead she was so proud of; blocked by a few more. (unsurprisingly, if you check her actual tweet history, she seems more invested in Megstiel but)

This is when CommaSameleon -- a professor with two lit degrees and a primary focus in teaching the art of Argumentation -- literally -- stepped in. She initially tried to engage the fact that, well, this woman not only can’t argue out of a paper sack but wasn’t even arguing, she was just running in circles and distracting from all the points and hadn’t addressed a single lit point directly while preaching down at people. But Sam, also, noticed something. This woman kept changing things like “queerphobia” to “homophobia.” Sam mentioned this kinda puts off TERF vibes (I think Sam picked up on the gendering thing herself too.)

Her response? Which she deleted since? But Discord’s embed helpfully saved?

Her inacted non-apologies remain weak, especially in any form of debate be it lit or now queer topics.

Oh I’m sorry, let’s recap her viewpoints: TERF is a slur. “They” is made up and should be avoided at all costs. The blood of dead gay men are a token to use in a lit debate you’re avoiding responsibility in. After this, “authors are headcanons” is suddenly not your worst take, but fascinating that you 13 times didn’t even read the blatant ass screenshot. And I mean, these weren’t subtle or easy to miss these 13 times.

100. She had 100 chances, literally, on a timer, to give a source or shut up with her platforming until she had one. Instead, she chose every rabbit hole she could manifest to disappear into, only to be met by another request for a source, and not moving on until we address the first points. We’ve given ours, now you give yours. Instead, you choose this. This is the hill you choose to die on, rather than admitting, “Sorry, I guess I was wrong” or “I guess I heard that somewhere, my bad.” 100 chances. 13 direct QT requests to address gender which she replied to but didn’t reply to until cornered (and still didn’t, truly, reply to), and “TERF is a slur.” Oh, and after waving around the dead men’s blood she also suddenly Can’t Be A Terf Because She Adopted Two Trans Kids. Lord help those children. Or, you know, the more realistic thing is she’s just manifesting all kinds of bullshit at this point to save face, which is probably why she deleted all the related tweets that show she’s a giant-ass TERF.

So anyway, this is very much a lesson on:

Paying attention to how people manipulate conversation to erase genuine discussion and debate.

Paying attention to WHY they do it. Motivation on methods and tactics will clear up a lot.

Figuring out HOW they try to sound woke about shit and when it’s entirely fucking vile and inappropriate to pull

And by all above points, figuring out that these people are among us, and how NOT to let them influence your conversations.

I don’t care if it’s about a discussion on a ship or show or anything else. People do this. A lot. Extremely dedicatedly, if the 100 asks doesn’t make that clear. 

Stop letting people railroad your conversations with disingenuous bullshit.

So anyway in honor of this I made everyone a gif

Use at will. It’s tagged anti-terf if you want to use the search feature on it.

UPDATE: 

Just went and checked. She went and deleted literally her entire side of the conversation, hundreds if not thousands of tweets. Luckily, Ezra mentioned repeatedly -- and I do trust them inherently -- that they were saving the entire conversation, so that zip file exists somewhere. How fascinating, after she accused us that we would want to delete tweets. Someone realized they had a bad look and giant failure all around.

Also, a related anon that links to an earlier part of this conversation I didn’t even document where she was crying about “cis erasure” [x] This shit went on so long I legit forgot about that.

#supernatural #spn #destiel #anti-terf #debate

[deeranger]

Fic Writer Questions!

@oddsocksandstuff tagged me in this, thank you so much, sweetie!  ❤️

 1) How many works do you have on AO3? I’ve got 40 so far (of which 25 are SPN fics). There’s more to come! 

2) What’s your total AO3 word count? 486,667, apparently. That tells me each of my fics has an average wordcount of 12,166.675… Seems about right. I was never any good at keeping things short.

3) How many fandoms have you written for and what are they? Uhh… On AO3 I’ve written for Supernatural, Supernatural RPF, X-men (Cherik) and McFassy (James McAvoy/Michael Fassbender). But I’ve written a lot when I was younger that has never made it online, including NCIS, Pirates of the Caribbean, and lots of weird one-shorts starring everyone from Michael J. Fox to Kevin Sorbo from “Hercules: The Legendary Journeys”. 🤨  

4) What are your top 5 fics by kudos? “A Lesson to be Taught” – an SPN Wincest pwp fic where a dominant Dean fucks (and spanks) Sam and they discover that Dean apparently has a daddy!kink. Comes with a photo manipulation too! There be dick.    

“Taking Game” – a semi-dark medieval Cherik (Charles Xavier/Erik Lehnsherr from X-men) AU. Basically, Charles is a poacher hunting on king Erik’s land to his great dismay. And so, he’s captured and gets the choice between losing his life or serving the king for a bit… Dubcon and smut ensues.   “Only Like This” – a little SPN Wincest dub-con fic about hopelessly pining Dean doping Sam just so he can touch and kiss his oblivious little brother. It’s okay. Sam won’t remember when he comes to.   “It’s Only Carnal” – A dark SPN Wincest noncon fic where soulless!Sam needs to blow off some steam. And when it comes to carnal activities his brother isn’t exactly a novice – so why not use Dean’s body to make them both feel good?   “Demonized” – a long and dark af SPN noncon fic written in collaboration with the awesome @palishere. Sam is captured by some nasty demons who use him to lure in his brother. At first it seems the demonic scumbags are just really perverted and have a weakness for sexual torture, but they turn out to have ulterior motives…  

5) Do you respond to comments, why or why not? Yes, always. I think it can be a bit demotivating for a reader to leave a comment and get zero response – and so, they might not bother to comment on the next fic. At least, that’s how I feel personally. And besides, I really want to let readers know that I appreciate them taking the time and effort to actually tell me what they think.  

6) What’s the fic you’ve written with the angstiest ending? Oufff… Seriously? How can I possibly pick just one when 99.8 percent of my fics are not only dark af but have gut-wrenching ambiguous endings as well? I, err… I’m gonna have to think really hard about this one, hold on… *Insert buzzing cicada sound*… Uhh… Well, I guess it might be… “Play or Pay” – a dark female!reader-insert Wincest fic where demon!Dean has you and Sam trapped somewhere underground. Sam ends up being on the receiving end of the demon’s cruelty when he tries to save you. Using Dean’s body the demon ends up raping Sam while the reader tries to escape to get help... There’s a little twist in the end. Loads of dead dove here, including death (not Dean or Sam).     “The Orange Hour” – where undercover inmate!Dean has to rape CO!Sam in order to save both of their lives and get them out of the jail in one piece. It doesn’t go completely as planned. (Comes with an nsfw photo manipulation).  “Demonized” – loads of bottom!Sam torture, full of hurt and absolutely no comfort... It’s just… I dunno, I think I and @palishere had a collective meltdown in the noncon and angst department. Sorrynotsorry.      

8) Do you write crossovers? If so what is the craziest one you’ve written? Nope, I’ve never in my life written a crossover. Usually, I’m too laser-focused on 1 obsession at a time. I can’t multitask, okay?   

9) Have you ever received hate on a fic? Yes, the fandom purity police has visited me on AO3. The usual self-proclaimed know-it-alls vomiting their bullshit all over the comment section about how “problematic” noncon is and how “sick” I must be. I thought about moderating comments for a while, actually – but I just deleted their follow-up comments until they left me alone. 😤

10) Do you write smut? If so what kind? Yes!! Gimme! Usually, I write noncon smut or just good ol’ pwps that feature some sort of dominance. That’s it. That’s my jam. In general, the only smut I don’t write is the cute, fluffy, feel-good, cuddly stuff… My smut’s usually pretty rough and/or some sort of dub/noncon.

11) Have you ever had a fic stolen? Yes. Someone stole “It’s Only Carnal” and posted it as her own on some Portuguese fanfiction site. She even replied to comments, answered questions and talked about how much she loved writing it, etc… Luckily a sweet mutual on Tumblr let me know about it and I reported her for plagiarism. The stolen fic was taken down shortly after and the account deleted. Goddamn thief. 😡  

12) Have you ever had a fic translated? Yes. Honestly, I can’t remember which fic(s). But people have contacted me on AO3 and asked for permission to translate my stuff into Chinese. I have - of course - happily allowed them to. It’s such an awesome compliment to get, I think!  

13) Have you ever co-written a fic before? Yes, 2. “Demonized” and the fluffy Ficfacers prompt fic “The Masks We Wear” starring Sam and Dean taking their pranks a step too far. Basically, the brothers get angry with each other and they need to talk it out… No smut in this one, can you believe it?!! But that was kinda the prompt we received. The prompt was literally: “Sam and fluff”. Anyways, both fics are co-written with the lovely @palishere. You can find her AO3 here. 😊

14) What’s your all time favorite ship? Wincest!!! Definitely. Gimme all the brotherfucking, please. No contest. And coming in on second place I guess there’s Samifer – never paired consensually, though. I just love Lucifer messing with Sam’s head and torturing him in all kinds of cruel ways.    

15) What’s a WIP that you want to finish but don’t think you ever will? Oh, that’s a mean question… I have a noncon WIP where Sam and Dean are in prison. I wrote a whole story outline, gathered my own little dictionary of prison slang, etc… But I never made it past page 10 or something. Sam was supposed to get jumped by a gang of inmates and then Dean was supposed to helplessly watch from the sideline, offering to trade places if they’d just leave his little brother alone… And after that it’s all about a mix of healing and vengeance… But the story has been lying on the shelf for more than a year and I doubt I’ll ever continue it. Oh, wait! I almost forgot – I have a long Cherik WIP sequel to “To Have and to Hold”! Just checked, its wordcount is 18,729! Holy crap…. What a waste, huh? But I honestly don’t think I’ll ever finish it, because I’m not into Cherik anymore. That ship has kinda sunk for me…. So, now I’m hyperfixating on Supernatural, yeah?     

16) What are your writing strengths? Description, I think. I just love details and setting the mood. I like to think I’m pretty good at writing in English too even though it isn’t my native language… I wish to be better and expand my vocabulary but I’m doing okay nonetheless.

17) What are your writing weaknesses? Description, I think. Yes, you read correctly. I often describe things TOO much. Sometimes to the extent where the pacing gets so slowed down that I feel like the scene loses its ‘feel’. I don’t know if it’s just in my head, but that’s my major concern about my writing. That and my signature ambiguous endings, lol.

18) What are your thoughts on writing dialogue in other languages in a fic? Love it. It can be difficult to pull off, but if you get it right it can be magical. Just don’t overdo it and make sure that the reader can follow. I don’t think I have any fics online where I do it, but I’m not a complete stranger to it either.

19) What was the first fandom you wrote for? Ack, my poor brain trying to go back to when I was friggin’ 13… You know how many years ago that was?! 25!!! Okay!? *Huffs*…. Anyway, I THINK it might’ve been Keanu Reeves’ character in “Johnny Mnemonic”. Or maybe David James Elliott’s character as Harmon Rabb in the early seasons of “JAG”. I dunno. Either way this question makes me feel really old and I don’t appreciate it. Don’t @ me. 😅   

20) What’s your favorite fic you’ve written? That’s probably a tie between “The Orange Hour” and “It’s Only Carnal”. They’ve both got nice pacing and that’s my biggest challenge, I think. Also, I love the whole Morse code thing in “The Orange Hour”. I don’t even know what happened or how I came up with it, but hey, I can surprise myself if I want to, I guess! And of course there’s the smutty noncon and all of the hurt… So, those two fics are my personal faves. 😏  

I’ll tag @jackandthesoulmates, @pinkoptics, @palishere, @wrenseroticlibrary, @decadent-prince, @negans-lucille-tblr, @juinae and @impala-dreamer and everyone else who feels like doing it! Feel free to ignore, of course. 

#dee answers #fanfiction questions #personal

[suncaptor]

s7 adoration

First off, one thing I love about it is the versatility of it. some of my favourite parts are the humour of it, and the balance to the horror of it. It does lean towards dark, and is certainly darker than the rest of the show, but that just makes the gravity of it all lift off so intense when there’s randomly then dick jokes and so forth. same goes for the characters in it with the themes.

I genuinely think that leviathans are one of the scariest and best villains on the show because of the reflection of psychological horror and the flip on the script of hunted/hunter.

That being said, I also think Dick Roman is a great villain for comedic reasons as well and genuinely find his dialogue memorable. So memorable, in fact, I made this uquiz.

I also think that it is the darkest season psychologically in supernatural, like it rings out nadir to me, yet at the same time, this is all canon dialogue. but also it is quite unseen, the depth of it, which is infuriating (and my main fix would it being from Sam’s perspective), but it makes it compelling to me too.

I actually really like having sodium borate being corrosive to leviathans

There’s a canonical bipolar main character who’s vital to the plot and who’s talented and who’s also part of the inner themed reflections of paranoia within without systems and being incapable of trust anything even your brain while still retaining that vitality.

The season starts out with perhaps one of my favourite arcs in the show, as well, which brings me great joy in all the dialogue while also introducing one of the other most compelling parts of the show (being godstiel then Sam’s PTSD hallucinations retrospectively).

Two of the three main writer’s I look to as the core of what I love about Supernatural are perhaps the strongest voices in the season (Sera Gamble and Ben Edlund) and I really actually love the addition of Robbie Thompson and think some of his episodes are top tier. I don’t like Adam Glass, Buckleming, or Robert Singer writing any of the episodes, and my fix to s7 would be deleting those episodes, and Dabb is on like, thin ice, but I do really like most of the writing and theming and all and am genuinely enjoying the individual episodes and think that tied with 2, 4, and 5 it’s got the best quality for being entertaining to me.

And when I was looking at favourite episodes in Kripke/Gamble era (which I generally vastly prefer), it had the most of top 30 (8), and 20% of the top 10. And of that, it would skew towards the top total.

While Hello Cruel World sets up the season’s intent extremely well, I think that Defending Your Life drives the points home about how this reflects onto Sam and Dean in regards of their own psychological issues and how it will then impact their actions, the conflict not at all then revolving around leviathans but the concept of monstrosity and mental illness. While the season is incredibly ableist constantly and with some writers it’s clear that it’s intentional and the characters and they treat Sam with respect, other times it’s clearly not. I still am obsessed with this because it is directly and not metaphorically addressing these issues even if poorly.

Slash Fiction has some of the most in character and pointed analysis in the show immediately, including this scene and actually references and uses the history of the characters and the show itself to be more horrifying.

How To Win Friends and Influence Monsters is just also the epitome of s7 in general, from Sam hallucinating Lucifer and saying he’s lucky and people have it worse, Dean at his nihilistic worst about to lose Bobby admit while high on a sandwich what it’s really about, the fact they didn’t ever want to shoot deer, and just iconic dialogue from everyone including our favourite Dick Roman and “bibbing” while also having Bobby see the plans building the tension of the overall arc in the season right before being shot.

And while Death’s Door is very painful for me to rewatch, it is also an astounding episode of television from the terror of going back to the origin “You can never go home” and the only genetic case of bullet to the head (generational trauma), the insight into the abuse, how it shaped all the memories proceeding it, how Bobby didn’t escape it or what it did to him, but he also never was anything like his deepest fears or his fathers, and also Bobby’s speech towards his father. I also think the way Sam and Dean respond is extremely well written and their grief is palpable.

We also then get these lovely random images I get to share here :) X, X, and X.

Repo Man I may have some criticisms about in terms of ableism and homophobia, but it is still one of the best, and most horrifying, episodes in the show. Both the mirrors and the revelations throughout the episode and the dark intoxicating obsession while also seeing Sam’s actual trauma in front of us… I feel like I could literally analyse this episode for years, it’s so rich and deep, as much of Edlund’s episodes are when he decides he wants to make something deep instead of comical.

that being said I think The Born Again Identity may be one of the best episodes in the entire show. I can’t rationalise this because it would take hours if you don’t like this episode we just have entirely different taste.

Though, outside of the actual episode writing, the way it opens with the surreality and mental deterioration is very important to me, and it’s just one of many aspects of this episode, but I feel like it may be less popular so I thought I’d say it.

Charlie’s first episode and actually having our first actually good fully fleshed out lgbt character genuinely changes something in me when I watch it like. It is so full of hope for me personally just because of how fun and deep it remains. We get to hear Dick Roman describe the spark in humanity he can’t replicate while also saying “Nothing’s safe. I like that.” (the thesis of the season). Donald Trump helped him get the leviathan tablet. We get the scene where Dean coaches Charlie through flirting with a man and also have her make Harry Potter references which I just personally find very funny to watch. And Charlie’s mere existence just makes me hope, like the way she is.

Season 7 is the first season Cas tells Sam and Dean he loves them.

And Kevin Tran is introduced, one of my favourite characters who also adds much to the season itself.

Reading is Fundamental is the episode that Kevin Tran is introduced, that we get to see more into Cas’s past through the ways in which is he more open in his altered mental state such as how he loved Neanderthal poetry and bees, Hester’s accusation towards Dean, more talk around the hell trauma transfer which intrigues me even if it also infuriates me, and Cas actually faces and reacting to what he’s done, even if in an altered state. There are countless reasons I love it.

Also, this may not be something someone who doesn’t ship destiel can see and leans much more subtextual, so ignore this part if you are bothered by those interpretations, but I think season 7 is when Dean realised he was in love with Cas and like I do have a lot of reasons for thinking this and find it just another layer of why seeing the psychology of the main characters is intriguing to me. I also then can do parallels throughout that reflect this grapping too. And it adds layers to how Dean finds him married then, maybe even add the demon he kissed.

And then, of course, is the matter of the trench coat.

this is very very limited, but I tried my best to be comprehensive of my highlights and reasons for loving season 7!

#s7 #spn #supernatural #incoherents #lists

[demonologist-in-denim]

Okay, let’s get into this, because I have put off talking about Crowley’s cut monologue from 12x23 for long enough. If you haven’t already, you can read it here, or in this great gifset.

I absolutely see why this was cut. And I’m only acknowledging it here to talk about why I not only think it doesn’t add anything to Crowley’s story or our understanding of him, but how it actually detracts from it. After that, I intend to ignore it and let it fade away into the ether of the spn fandom. That being said, deleted scenes and cut scripts live in a sort of canonical limbo – you can choose for yourself whether to accept them as canon, consider them glimpses from some alternative universe, or do away with them entirely. I’m choosing the latter in this instance.

(This was meant to be a post, but it turned into an essay.)

Whomever wrote this was either unfamiliar with Crowley as a character, or was intentionally twisting the character in such a way as to fit into the convenient narrative that removed him from the show. Blame it on Chuck in text, blame it on the showrunners outside of text, whatever your preference – this doesn’t read like Crowley.

There are very few parts of this monologue that felt in character, that read like something Crowley would say. Not just in the tone or the choice of words, but the openness of it. And that’s coming from someone who writes reformed and/or human Crowley, with his admittance to remorse and shame and love. In this cut script, he is uncharacteristically vulnerable, sharing self-reflections he would never have shared aloud at this point in his character development. His dialogue lacks the layers of meaning or deflection that Crowley would normally employ, that he employed everywhere else in the show, even when being emotionally vulnerable.

That’s not to say that Crowley didn’t think or feel these things – I will argue to the end of my days (in spn fandom) that after the cure, Crowley hated himself. He hated that he was alone and unloved. Some part of that was due to being a demon and the horrible, evil, messy things he’d done, and some of it he believed was due to his inherent lack of worth. And I think this monologue was written in part to have Crowley make that final confession out loud. Final because, if that’s the case and he’s willing to admit it – to his former enemies and now the only people he really has in his life – his story can only take one of two directions: redemption or death. Embrace the desire for change and move forward as a reformed demon and full Winchester ally, or dramatically (and unnecessarily) sacrifice himself.

And there is a way to write that, but with Crowley properly in character and with the emotional complexity we know him to possess, not this blatant declaration. Maybe the line would have worked depending on how Mark Sheppard played it, and it only falls so flat because it’s just a script – I’m willing to allow for that. But this moment, facing down the boys after letting Lucifer loose, in front of an audience of Mary Winchester that he doesn’t know well and isn’t comfortable with, it doesn’t feel like a moment for Crowley to be this open, this vulnerable, about something so personal and so monumental.

I’ve no doubt that Crowley expected the Winchesters would one day kill him, “for good this time.” He was a demon working alongside a pair of hunters; there was always going to be that risk. Crowley was intelligent, one of the smartest characters on the show. He had to know that was how things would play out – either that, or he would die on their behalf, or because of their actions, even if he had ended up leaving Hell and joining Team Free Will. That was what happened to people around the Winchesters. Crowley warned Kevin of that himself. “They use people up, and leave them to die bloody.” Crowley knew. And as he internalized more and more of his blood-born conscience, Crowley had to believe on some level that he deserved it, especially if he hated himself and what he’d done.

But once again, if Crowley was going to say something like that, that’s not how he’d say it. It would be as a dismissive aside, or a knife in Dean’s gut in a moment of intense emotion between the two of them, or as a rebuke that the Winchesters badly deserved. Or better yet, as something remarked between himself and Cas, who Crowley likely suspected would outlast him but also ultimately die in service of the Winchester cause. Words like those have power. And it’s unlike Crowley to lay them down in supplication like this. It doesn’t even feel like a heart-felt confession, like his monologue in 8x23. It reads like someone wrote what was meant to be under Crowley’s words, the intention behind his dialogue, the much-exalted subtext, but failed to add all the layers on top of it, to put it in actual character.

I’m just going to bundle the whole beginning of the monologue together and toss it out entirely. Firstly because I’ve argued more than once that Crowley is an unreliable narrator when it comes to his human life. What we know of it from Rowena comes with an agenda, and what we know of it from Gavin comes from a man who had a difficult relationship with his father. It’s about as reliable as young Dean telling stories to Sammy about their parents’ time together. And there’s canonical errors in this monologue to back that up – we know Crowley wasn’t buried in a pauper’s grave, because we saw it 6x04. The “dying in a puddle of his own sick” is a great detail in terms of storytelling, but it’s almost directly repeated from Rowena, who said it as a belittling comment to a young Fergus. It’s too forced. And we know at least Gavin came to the funeral, because he tells us so in a deleted scene in 12x13 (remember what I said about getting to pick and choose when it comes to cut scripts and deleted scenes?).

But more importantly – and this is the part that really grates – Crowley’s iteration of his human life reinforces the narrative of absolute morality in the spn universe. It supports the argument that if a character becomes a demon, it must be because they were a terrible person. There is no room for human flaws, for characters to have made mistakes – and that doesn’t just hinder characters in terms of backstory, but in character development and emotional growth moving forward. It’s a stance spn takes more than once, and especially with non-human characters, though never in regards to the Winchesters. The Winchesters can become soulless or demons, but they were “always good” before that, so they are deserving of redemption. If Crowley or other non-humans were “always bad,” that absolves the Winchesters from seeing them as people deserving of help, or of their ability to change, or even to be seen as beings deserving of any level of respect or agency. And it absolves the showrunners from writing a character capable of development, of being able to grow beyond their previous flaws.

That’s not to say that Fergus MacLeod wasn’t some or all of those things. But if he was a complex character – if he was a person, as all stories should aim to present their characters – then he was all of that and more, just as the Winchesters are their virtues and their faults all wrapped up in an individual person. And if Crowley had brought this up some other time, in reference to his human life, none of this discussion would be necessary. It would be easy to say: he’s an unreliable narrator, and this provides us with insight into how Crowley feels about himself, and it would be interesting and valuable. But here, it’s used in justification for Crowley’s status as irredeemable – which is not true – and as part of justification for what happens next.

Crowley’s death was written by the showrunners as an excuse to remove him from the show – attribute that to budget costs for the show, or running out of story ideas for Crowley, or creative laziness, whatever you want. And within spn, it can be attributed to Chuck not wanting another character like Cas muddling up his Winchester Brothersᵀᴹ grand narrative. I’ve written before both in posts and in fic about how Crowley’s character-central instinct for self-preservation crumbles into depression after losing Hell and the seemingly-irreversible depletion of his and Dean’s friendship in 12x23. And that this ushers in a desire to End in such a way that achieves revenge against Lucifer (not a significant motivation, in my opinion, you’ve got to outlive your enemies to win against them), earns him the appreciation of the Winchesters, saves the world (proving his capacity for good), and brings about an end to his waiting. Glory through death, redemption in death – tropes that are hard to associate with Crowley unless you buy into his character’s devolvement in the latter half of season 12, but which the writers do their best to smooth into place and the fandom was forced to choke down.

And I won’t argue that Crowley didn’t wanted an end to his waiting – I’d argue the opposite in fact. This blatant preference for suicide, however, is antithesis to everything Crowley. What Crowley wanted in that End wasn’t an end of himself, but an end to existing in a state of perpetual limbo. Be accepted by the good guys, embrace his more human aspects, or return to the full dark depravity of demonkind. An end to the emotional rollercoaster, to continuous and destructive self-doubt, to striving to be both the king Hell needed and the ally the Winchesters refused to admit they benefited from having. That’s entirely different than wanting to end himself. As much as Crowley hated himself, he would never have considered death to be a preferable option – not unless some outside force, be it Chuck or the spn showrunners, decided otherwise for him.

Even if that had been the case, and I am wrong about Crowley’s characterization and his motivations, I still do not think he would have been as open about that motivation as is written in this cut script. It is just not like him. It is too vulnerable, too self-pitying. Crowley was always concerned about the others around him, and especially the Winchesters, thinking less of him. He never would have said something like this to them, not as this is written. Nor would Crowley have gone to the Winchesters with the intention of them killing him. He might have known it was a possibility, once he confessed his actions, (and from his perspective, there was the chance the Winchesters didn’t know of his involvement in Lucifer’s escape anyway), but it would never have been his intention. It’s not unknown for Crowley to encourage abuse from those he’s wronged, and to revel in the attention and emotions of it (here I’m thinking specifically of Kevin beating him in 9x02), maybe considering the punishment just and due. And Crowley at this point likely suspected he would eventually meet his end in some way involving the Winchesters. But death by their hands in this moment would have involved none of the justifying benefits of death by his own hand only a few scenes later – glory, revenge, redemption, a sense of closure.

Compare this cut monologue and its potential death – at the hands of the Winchesters after confessing his role in Lucifer’s escape – to this cut line of dialogue from later in 12x23. “Tell Dean he was right – you bloody fools have rubbed off on me.” This is Crowley. This is emotional complexity, admittance to a change of heart, self-awareness, and a brave act of equal defiance and sacrifice, with his usual smug, snarky dismissal. This isn’t suicide brought on by depression, by an uncharacteristic vulnerability. It is resolved, determined, if reluctant. This is Crowley choosing the greater good and the boys, even if it means sacrificing himself.

For me, this small addition smooths over much of the unevenness in the showrunner’s attempts to justify Crowley’s death. He has lost Hell, he believes he’s had an irreversible falling out with Dean – all of which could be overcome, grown beyond. But then a rift opens, and Lucifer is an immediate danger, and it requires a life to save the day. Crowley knows it can’t be either of the boys – that tends to have world-ending effects – and it can’t be Mary Winchesters or Castiel, because of “Winchester man-pain.” So that leaves Crowley. And having exhausted all immediate alternatives, Crowley does what internalized Winchester logic and conscience tells him is right. It would still require a moment of hesitation, a moment we see him combatting his deeply imbedded trait of self-preservation. But at least that would have been in character and show definitive character growth on Crowley’s part.

So yes, I completely agree with the decision to cut this monologue in 12x23. It doesn’t tell us anything about Crowley that we don’t already know, and is uncharacteristic of him, and provides out-of-character justification for his actions that wasn’t needed. You don’t have to agree with me, obviously. And I’ll end this rather long rant of an essay by saying what I always say: that Crowley deserved better. He deserved better than the mangling of his character’s motivations in the latter half of season 12, and he deserved better than this monologue. I’m glad it was cut from the final script.

#crowley #character analysis #spn season 12 #spn script #crowley deserved better #happy sulphur saturday #this has been your pre-scheduled lunch time rant #not back to your regularly scheduled postings

[sketching-fox]

Fellow script writer here. The end also baffled me. The first books we study are the likes of The Hero's Journey. They had to know a "It was always supposed to end like that. With me dead." approach would be the total opposite of a cohesive narrative. Dean should've had a moment of self-realizitation which allowed him to emerge as a changed man in the "new equilibrium." But they returned to ground zero for some cheap nostalgia. And the cringy dialogue? That's all on Dabb. Not the network.

Hello my fellow writer! Nice to hear from you! Thanks for your message! (and again, sorry for my delay in my replies)

YES, exactly. And for Gods sake, Joseph Campbell´s book is like you said, the FIRST and starting guide to someone learning about write a story. So much more comes after that. And the basics of the art of writing a good narrative is the development of the characters, their journey and their arcs. As I said in a post here, in scholl we even joke about the 2 worst endings a story can have: 

1 - and they wake up and it was all a dream. 

2 - and they died and wake up in Heaven and in there they could be happy.

Well, those two are, in certain way, very close. In both, you denied ALL the conflicts the characters need to solve. You conclude their stories and put them in a new magic reality, were´s it´s all ok. A lazy and poor solution. 

In our case here, come on... we´re not talking about a smaller production company, a beginning company or a crew starting their careers, but one of the BIGGEST companies in the entire world, with producers, directors and crew and etc composed by experienced professionals that went to expensive schools. So, for God´s sake, could them at least worry a little more about storytelling?

And I´m not talking about ONLY the end, always was sad to me how much bad writing had this show, reason why I took LONG TIME to become a fan, and I became more because wow, great ideas, amazing characters, but always a lack in writing and development (and we are not even talking about that fight between Lucifer and Michal!Dean, LOL).

And this “Ok, let´s end as we started! This character will be wearing even the same clothes he was using 15 years ago, when he was a student, clothes he never used after the pilot episode. And after deal with bigger and bigger vilains, until the status of God himself, this one will die in the hands of a small common and simple villain from season one that nobody even remembers.” 

One thing is make a “homage” to the earlier seasons. It´s not THAT the thing here. Just bad writing. Lazy, poor writing. From a network that owns almost everything in the entertaitment industry and have money, lots of money, but offers poor product, knowing that fans will receive it (remember all the DC heroes movies, that were made by the same company)...

So sad, because this show build a huge fandom. And those who liked, liked only because of their hate and because “Oh, ok, we hate Castiel and he wasn´t in the last two episodes, so we´re reliefed. And the ones complaining it was bad are doing that because of a ship, only that.”  It´s just denying how bad is, and just a relief because they are being moved more for their hate than because of a good story. 

I reblogged a post about a IMDB review estremely interesting. And again, the person states ALL the reasons why the ending is bad, without talk about ship.

BUT, that review is saved here in blogs, but was deleted by IMBD. Looks like lots of reviews about the episode 20 are being deleted by IMBD - a site BUILT TO RECIEVE REVIEWS from fans. Coincidence? I don´t think so.

[starrose17]

Fic Writer Questions

Fic Writer Questions!

Tagged by @fandom-hoarder

1) How many works do you have on AO3?

On Ao3 I have 24, but that’s a fraction of all the fics I’ve ever written that are now deleted or lost on the ancient world of yahoo webrings.

2) What's your total AO3 word count?

800,044 (but it’ll be ALOT more than that)

3) How many fandoms have you written for and what are they?

Oh so many. Lemme think in order I’ve done Pokemon, StarGate SG.1, Kyou Kara Maou, Rurouni Kenshin, Yu Yu Hakusho, Fruits Basket, Harry Potter, X-Men: First Class, The Legend of Zelda: Four Swords, Vikings, Black Sails, The Witcher, Good Omens, Supernatural...and I’m sure I’m missing some others.

4) What are your top 5 fics by kudos?

-) Guardian of the Soulless - My Witcher fic, Geralt/Jaskier, and my favourite fic I’ve ever written.

-) The Impatient Snugglebug - A very old Harry Potter fic, Harry/Draco.

-) We Met At The Park - My X-Men Erik/Charles fic that shot me into fandom fame, where the now world famous @fahrlightloki cosplayed my Charles.

-) To The Stars - My Good Omens fic, Crowley/Aziraphale, based on the movie Titanic.

-)  Final Night - One of my very rare short fics, for Vikings, Ragnar/Athelstan.

5) Do you respond to comments, why or why not?

I do respond, cos I believe it’s the right thing to do.

6) What's the fic you've written with the angstiest ending?

I don’t write angsty endings.  I have angst and drama in the fic itself, but everything always has a happy ending. Though I suppose final night kinda had one but that’s only because it’s a fic that is written within an episode and the episode didn’t end well.

7) What's the fic you've written with the happiest ending?

THEY’RE ALL HAPPY! They also all end in weddings, like, all of them. I had a certain plot in all my fics that I found appeals so well to everyone so I write the same outline in different fandoms and it always 100% works.

8) Do you write crossovers? If so what is the craziest one you've written?

I did for the X-Men fandom, I wrote a few crossovers with the other films that Michael Fassbender and James McAvoy were in.  The craziest one I did was unfinished and called The Xavier Brothers Household, where I took a bunch of James McAvoys characters from other things and made them all brothers to Charles.  It was crazy.

9) Have you ever received hate on a fic?

The odd one here and there, but nothing major.

10) Do you write smut? If so what kind?

I do, an it’s always hot and heavy and very romantic.

11) Have you ever had a fic stolen?

Yes, see the below answer.

12) Have you ever had a fic translated?

Pretty much all of them until my most recent Bad Reputation one, but then I stopped saying yes to people who asked because I always asked them to send me a link to where it’s posted and they wouldn’t and I’d find it myself and it’d be under their name with no mention of me or a link to the original fic, so I stopped saying yes.

13) Have you ever co-written a fic before?

No.

14) What's your all time favorite ship?

That’s impossible to answer there have been so many, but I think the first one you have is one you can always fall back on, especially when you’re between fandoms, so I still find myself picturing Jessie and James from Pokemon ^_^

15) What's a WIP that you want to finish but don't think you ever will?

There’s very few fics I’ve never finished, only in the early days never anything recent.  There was a Harry Potter drarry fic of mine called Openly Confused, which isn’t even on AO3 but I think it’s still on my fanfiction.net account. I’d got to the last chapter and lost all interest in it and never finished it.

16) What are your writing strengths?

I like to think anything romantic. I could spend pages, and HAVE, with one character just thinking about the other.

17) What are your writing weaknesses?

I’m not the best writer I don’t know too many big descriptive words and such so my writing is very basic.  I’ve been told that alot. But also been told that people like that cos they can get lost in the feelings rather than the imagery, and I’ve also been told that people who don’t have english as their first language enjoy my fics cos they’re easy to read, so it is a weakness, but it had a plus side too.

18) What are your thoughts on writing dialogue in other languages in a fic?

As I don’t speak any other language, that’s never come up.

19) What was the first fandom you wrote for?

Pokemon. Rocketshipping. Most of my fics are still out there on what’s left of the yahoo webrings.  I found most of them still up on an angelfire site, they were written in 1997/8 and are the most corny crappiest pieces of writing I have ever read lol Yet I still remember being so proud of them at the time.  They’re here if you’re interested, just do Ctrl F and search for starrose and it’ll take you to them.

20) What's your favorite fic you've written?

Definitely Guardian of the Soulless.  Why? I couldn’t really tell you, I guess I’m just really proud of the story I did, of the relationship growing between Geralt and Jaskier.  And the bomb at the wedding scene, my God I’d never written anything so intense, and the shootout near the end, so much blood omg it was really outside my comfort zone and from the feedback I got I think I did really well.

Having said that, all of my long fics hold special places in my heart. My Black Sails fic L/S: I Will Stand Here With You, Flint/Silver, had the most amount of porn I have ever written in a fic before lol It was my longest ever fic at 165,104 words.

My x-men fic We Met At The Park got super famous in the fandom, had so much fanart done for it, and of course the cosplaying mentioned up above.

And of course a shout out to my most recent fic Bad Reputation, which has become my comfort love since I began it in February.  My version of Jared and Jensen live rent free in my head, they’re all I currently think about, even more than Sam and Dean.

Now as for tagging, I don’t actually read fic that much, so anyone whose a fic writer and reading this, feel free to tell the world about your fics!

[buticancarryyou]

Fic Writer Questions

@wincestismyheart thank you for tagging me in this. I love these kinds of things. Sorry it's taken me over a month to do it myself! Ha!

1. How many works do you have on AO3?

I have 27 works currently. I've deleted a few over the years.

2. What's your total AO3 word count?

207,118. That's actually crazy to think about.

3. How many fandoms have you written for and what are they?

Predominately, Supernatural. But I do write for Skam and its Remakes as well (Skam France and Druck currently).

4. What are your top 5 fics by kudos?

1) The First Time I Saw Your Face (263 Kudos, 4k, wincest) - I posted this one in 2019 crazily enough, so it's semi new and its also the only fic I have on ao3 that I attempted no promotion of. So how it ended up with the most kudos, is a mystery to me. This fic was a WIP for so fucking long and 2019 was a good year writing wise for me, so I was able to finish it up and post it. It's actually very endearing to my heart, because it's an over-compassing story in short glimmers of their love story from Sam's birth until Stanford!Era / Pilot.

2) Two Hearts, One Home (230 Kudos, 5k, evak - skam) - The first published fic for these two and it's literally just fluffy and porn. For some reason when I write them, I turn into a porn writing champion, which is a strange turn for me--as I usually struggle with it! Written in 2019.

3) Close Your Eyes & Make A Wish (203 Kudos, 7k, Datteo - Druck) - The first Druck fic I ever posted and it's a recanting of one of their episodes. I love Matteo and David so fucking much and they will always live in my heart. So happy I wrote this piece. Also written in 2019. (see what I mean about it being a good writing year?)

4) To Rise, We Must Fall (197 Kudos, 11k, Wincest) This was written for the 2014 reverse big bang. It was my first dip into challenges and I'm happy it exists because it gave me courage to attempt other challenges. I def don't think it's the strongest thing I've ever written, but I love it because it's Boy King related.

5) Treble Clef Confessions (191 Kudos, 1k, Elu - Skam Fr) - The first and only thing I ever wrote for Skam France. I don't anticipate writing anything in the future for them, but I do love this short little piece that reimagines a scene. This was also written in 2019.

5. Do you respond to comments, why or why not?

Oh yes, I absolutely do. I am so grateful for any comments I get, because unfortunately they are few and far between. I wish my readers left more tbh, because they just fuel my desire to keep writing. So I definitely love to take care of those that do, just to also encourage them to do the same for others.

6. What's the fic you've written with the angstiest ending?

There's two that I think of, but I'll go with the one that has had more responses from the fandom. Everything's For You was written in my earlier tumblr days for a tumblr challenge. The prompt was basically to imagine: “Dean says time is different in hell, but what if it’s not? What if Dean really spent 40 years in hell before Cas put him back to 2008? Write what 40 years without Dean may have looked like for Sam.” And well, things get a little sad.

7. What's the fic you've written with the happiest ending?

I feel like I try to make sure all of my fics end on a happy note, just because I like to make the angst so severe throughout the fic. Lol. But the Skam piece I am currently working on and isn't posted yet, is def going to be the happiest. So look out for, A Weekend To Remember.

8. Do you write crossovers? If so what is the craziest one you've written?

I haven't written one yet, not to say I never would.

9. Have you ever received hate on a fic?

I wouldn't say hate, but I have had people challenge the way I write and say it's too flowery. People also try to correct the way I write Brother in Wincest fics with a capital B, but that's my creative freedom as a writer. They're not just brothers. They're Brothers. <3

10. Do you write smut? If so what kind?

I do write it, but it really depends on the fandom I guess. When I write for Sam and Dean, I feel like the smut I write is few and far between. Not that it's hard to write, or that I don't enjoy it--but I enjoy writing them without it. Sometimes I feel like it means just as much without it, because that's just them. But then I put my Skam glasses on and I'm suddenly on a smut roll.

11. Have you ever had a fic stolen?

Not to my knowledge. I hope that never happens; I wouldn't handle that very well.

12. Have you ever had a fic translated?

No, but I would be open to it under the right circumstances.

13. Have you ever co-written a fic before?

Nothing posted, but maybe between friends--yes.

14. What's your all time favorite ship?

Def, Wincest. I don't care how far away from SPN I get, I walk by a flower stand and see sunflowers and with always instantly be reminded of Sam. I'll see wanderer things and think of Sam. I'll see leather candles and think of Dean. I'll see an impala on the road and think of the boys on the road in the middle of the night. I will always see them everywhere and they will always be a part of me.

15. What's a WIP that you want to finish but don't think you ever will?

Probably the 900 J2 fics I've started. I want to finish one, but I usually get distracted and start something else.

16. What are your writing strengths?

I think for me, it is dependent on how well I know a character...because if I know them like the backs of my hands, I can really get into the vein of them and write them well. The worst feeling for me is when I can't feel a characters voice as I write.

17. What are your writing weaknesses?

Probably that I get distracted entirely too easily. An idea will come up and I'll be all about it, write 10k of it and then think of something else. And then it'll sit in my drafts as a WIP for years, staring at me with pleading eyes and I just try my best to not think about the 'what-ifs'.

18. What are your thoughts on writing dialogue in other languages in a fic?

I try to stay away from it if I can, because to me it is distracting.

19. What was the first fandom you wrote for?

Unpublished Nsync fanfic for sure. LMAO. But second fandom would be Supernatural.

20. What's your favorite fic you've written?

There's so many things I want to say, but in this moment, I can't help but think of: A Brother's Lament (A Slow Death). It was written for the spnj2bigbang for 2016 and it's probably the longest fic I've written, being that it's 46k. It is a love story to Dean's slow and maddening deterioration after Sam's death in Swan Song. Of how he tries to live the life he promised, but finds that he physically cannot do it. It's sad and violent, dark and upsetting, but I put my whole heart into it and it's not even the most well received thing I've written--but I fucking love it so much.

Tagging: @sammichgirl @nyxocity @hellhoundsprey and @homo-pink because they're some of my favorite writers. <3

#karridoesmeme #tag you're it #gonna stick this in my #karriwrites #tag for fun #if i didn't tag you and you want to do this #please do it! #i just suck and literally have no idea who i can tag anymore

[chaotically-cas]

Tombstone spoilers

- - -

Oh my god. This is my raw reaction (I’m posting in the morning) to finishing Tombstone at 3:30 am. I finished it less than a minute ago. I’m in shock. I’m still crying oh my god. Literally crying.

I did not expect to enjoy a western cowboy movie that fucking much???? But I did??? I don’t even know where to start. I’m not sure if the acting from Wyatt Earp’s actor was good or bad. I genuinely can’t tell. But I thought that Val Kilmer fucking carried that movie dear lord is he so beyond talented oh my god. He is so good in these kinds of roles (Jim Morrison) I swear I literally got goosebumps so so many times. I think he is an incredibly underrated actor & that movie is excited why. Jesus fuck he was incredible it felt so real. It was one of the best performances I’ve seen on that type of role from anyone I can’t. The acting overall was for the most part down right magnificent.

The absolute heart wrenching showing of tuberculosis too omg. Especially in lines as small as ‘forgive me if I don’t shake hands’ to his beautifully the makeup department & Val did with showing how physical the disease was. I’m not sure what else to complement besides the fact that ‘the dying man’ is such a common character but I don’t think you can really do much better at all in this case. Top marks.

& the way it was filmed & the shots were so beautiful. It was so timely & cinematic oh my god I can’t describe it. They used close up shots & far away shots both so beautifully & in such a meaningful way I wanna give the director I high five man.

Jesus even Johnny Ringo’s character was absolutely perfect. I don’t remember the actors name off the top of my head but he is absolutely brilliant as well as the rest of the cast. Including Russell who practically directed the entire thing. Jeez I think he was incredible in that role. Even Ike was a fantastic character I’m sorry but I can’t lie.

I could talk about the scene where Johnny Ringo & Doc Holliday first met forever I think. Not only did they but probably two of the best actors in the movie the same room together. But it’s probably one of the most well known scenes too. Just the belligerence & the absolute wit between the both of them, especially Holliday, is mesmerizing. I love the way he turns to his girlfriend & talks to himself over whether the fact he should hate him or not. & he ends up deciding to hate him because he reminds him of himself. Which is again brought up so fucking incredibly later on in the movie. I think it’s amazing they didn’t let that aspect of their characters fall though. I think that scene is just magnificent. The way Doc is so sly & coy with a simple shot glass. Just the way the own shots are mocking themselves as well as the characters in a way is just. God. It’s unmatched. & the way they bring back the ‘he’s drunk’ later in the movie too as such a juxtaposition is just. Shit man. It’s beyond brilliant.

The scene where they all were at a draw & then Doc just winks. & you can see the other actors face go from fear to anger. & then wyatt realizes. Good it’s just a greatly filmed & directed scene everything about it is perfect from the reactions to the shots.

Now. Here is where I might be getting a bit controversial. This movie is gay. It’s fucking gay.

It’s a love story between Earp & Holliday. I said it. From the very very beginning when they first see each other again I could tell that Holliday was pining, he was crushing. & Wyatt was too except he didn’t know it. It was in the ways he cared for his well being & if he needed anything. They both just supported each other & were such good friends throughout it all even in the small things. But the big gestures is where it gets me.

The first being the multiple times Holliday stood up & actually took a deadly fight for Earp. All whole literally dying himself. He was literally willing to do fucking anything for him he was in love idc. & the second being the scene where he is saying goodbye oh my god. & Earp gives him the fucking book ‘my friend Doc Holliday’ oh my god. That’s when I started crying. Cause it was Doc saying that if Wyatt really loved him he would have to let him go & be happy. & then he died clutching the little book his best friend gave him omg. I cried. & of course Wyatt had to fulfill his best friends last wish. That killed me.

There was even a deleted scene between Doc & his girl where she is asking him why he is leaving again. & she is like ‘it’s Wyatt, isn’t it? It’s always Wyatt’ or something to that effect. & dear god I wish that scene was included because it only further shows how close they were. Both did & his girl also went to the lengths of pushing at the fact that he could & wouldn’t mind dying from him. I just think that’s interesting. He literally would do anything for his friend & his girl knows it (as she called herself.)

But what strikes me most is both times Wyatt was walking away from Doc, thinking he would never see him again, he give him something. Like pretty important too. Idk it really got me in my feels & I’m kind of glad it was so subtextual as well as implied through the clearly more than friendly gestures. I don’t think they could have portrayed the fact that they were so sadly in love any better. In my opinion. God I cannot it’s so sad. & the fact that they stayed by each other. The. Whole. Time. Through literally everything. I can’t describe it. They deserved better but at the same time it was so perfectly heartbreaking.

The way he looked down at his feet at the end & laughs right before he died breaks my fucking heard. Because he thought he would be dying down the road or honestly anywhere else. With his boots on. With his friends. I can’t it just kills me. It’s such a small & missable detail but holy shit if you notice it it hurts like a bitch.

I just. I can’t. I really loved this movie. I didn’t expect to like it a bit. I expected to be bored. But the action sequences were amazing. Everything was beautifully filmed. The dialogue was amazing (see quotes below) & just. Overall it was a great movie. I can see why it’s so a-claimed. I understand Dean Winchester so naturally I have to watch the tombstone supernatural episode again. Ah.

I strongly suggest the movie. Obviously with consideration of heavy gun violence & death. But yea it was incredible. Val Kilmer is god I’m pretty sure. I will most definitely be watching this again & sobbing.

- - -

“There’s no normal life. Wyatt. Theres just life. Now get on with it.”

“Don’t know how.”

“Sure you do. Say goodbye to me.”

- - -

“Live Wyatt. Live for me. Wyatt if you were ever my friend. If you ever had the slightest feelin for me. Leave now. Please.”

- - -

“What does he need?”

“Revenge”

“For what?”

“Being born.”

- - -

“I was just foolin’ about.”

“I wasn’t.”

- - -

“Apparently Mr. Ringo is an educated man. Now I really hate him.”

- -

“You’re so drunk, in fact, you’re probably seeing double”

“I have two Guns. One for each of ya”

- - -

“Maybe pokers just not your game, Ike. I know. Let’s have a spelling contest.”

- - -

“You’re no daisy. You’re no daisy at all. Pour soul. You were just too high strung.”

- - -

“You’re a daisy if you do.”

- - -

“What you doing this for anyway?”

“Wyatt Earp is my friend”

“Hell, I got lots of friends.”

“I don’t.”

- - -

“I’m your huckleberry”

- - -

“Not me. I’m in my prime.”

- - -

God I could quote this whole movie.

But lastly y’all when they were playing cards on his death bed & Doc was like ‘I don’t wanna play anymore’. Yeah. That broke my heart. That scene is 10x more sad imo than Jack’s death in titanic.

& just the fact that his very very last moments alive were spent thinking about his friends future just shows how much they cared for each other. My heart hurts. Such a beautiful portrayal.

& yes I’m going on again about Val’s acting in this because he deserved a fucking Oscar. God. His sophisticated sarcastic & overall ugh everything of the role was absolutely perfection. It’s most definitely my favorite performance by him & maybe actually one of my top ever performances. He is so talented I cannot stress this enough.

-

I was tying fast. Ignore any typos.

#tombstone #cas spams #Cas talks about movies #pos #tw cursing

[castiel-left-his-mark-on-me]

Okay hear me out! May be far fetched...maybe not...but we scene deleted scenes that held more weight and value to destiel than anything right?

So Jensen said that they cut a lot of things in the confession scene, which probably means dialogue?? Okay you ready? Do you think they cut out where he could of have said a variation of "I love you too" ??? 👀👀 they only did that for shock value cause they hate us. Cause you remember the crypt scene S8 ,where they going to let Dean say I love you but changed it cause it wasn't something Dean would have said??? This is all hopes of course but I believe Dean had reciprocate it but they didn't show it.

Okay im done 😂😂

Aghh Kay! I sure hope they wouldn’t cut anything that major! But I don’t think that’s the case because I really believe that the reciprocation is happening in the next episode. I mean honestly, just like Jensen said “What else is there?” They defeated Chuck, they fought Lucifer off along with all the other big bads, so now they’re “free” but free to do what? Mourn everyone who was taken away from them? That just seems like a really sad way to end such a beloved series ... even though SPN is sad in general, I just don’t think they’d finish off the show like that.

What I am hoping for is: the boys will work with Jack to make everything right again by bringing back all the ones who were taken, and that includes Castiel; and once Cas is back, Dean will tell him how he feels-- somehow, in some way, he will show him that he loves him too.

I mean, Jensen even said that the 15x18 confession was “Misha’s scene”. If they even had the thought of having Dean say “I love you too” the scene would be about both of them, not just Castiel and his sacrifice. They wanted the drama of that moment and the heartache of losing someone just after their true feeling were revealed; but by doing that with two episodes left in the series, they left themselves room to fix it.

What I imagine was actually cut from that scene was more emotional dialogue from Cas, probably a good fifteen minutes of longing stares, and then some more moments where Dean begged Castiel not to go through with it.

So my money is on the “I love you too” being in the final episode, because there is no way that Castiel isn’t in it, and if he’s there, then his and Dean’s reunion is going to be a big, big moment ... hopefully a big moment filled with a lot of “love” and tears and kissing getting passed around.

💜 💜 💜

[misha-moose-dean-burger-lover]

Can't Stop It

"Take one."

***

Dean clutched onto the tree branch, it seemed to be the only thing holding him up, as his entire world came crashing down around him.

Cas lay, more than halfway to dead, not more than ten feet away.

"Don't leave me alone here, Cas," Dean cried out, startling himself too with how desperate he sounded. He wanted to get to Cas, but he didn't know if his legs would take him. "Don't do this to me. You can't -"

Cas made no sound. A dreadful silence, escape for the dull, distant roar of monsters fighting amongst themselves, as never stops in Purgatory.

"I can't -" Dean began, instead. "Please, Cas, I can't leave you here, and I couldn't carry you like this. Hell, I can't even walk. I can't do anything -" His voice started to break. "All i know is that I need you to get out of here with me."

He just wished Cas would move, would prove that he was still here. He refused to believe Cas couldn't hear him. He tried to drag himself ahead, but it wouldn't work. He couldn't remember the last time he broke one of his legs. This felt worse.

"Hang in there, Cas. I cannot fail you again." Dean let out, strangled, not willing to stop talking as long as there was the slightest chance that Cas could hear him. "Not like last time here. Not like back on Earth. You mean too much to me, okay? We're getting out of here, and we're going to fight God and win, and - goddammit, Cas, can you give me a sign that I'm not talking to your goddamn corpse?"

And it's his own words which set him off.

He feels tears clouding his vision. "No. No, no, that can't happen. Please don't die, Cas. I need you. I - I'm begging you." The tears start to fall. He's never been so helpless before.

He can't do anything.

"I think I said I don't care, but I don't think I've ever cared more about anyone who wasn't blood. I tried to stop it, I swear I did, but I can't stop. I just can't stop -" Dean wrestled out of himself, his bloodstained cheeks clearing as his tears trail down his face.

They should cool him down, but it only gets worse. His face is burning up. His insides are burning up. His leg is killing him, and if he can't move, why the fuck is he still standing?

"I love you." Dean fell to his knees.

Everything hurt. There was no way out. He didn't - no, he didn't want Sam to deal with all the crap out there alone, but he just couldn't do it anymore. Not if Cas died, here in another realm, even as Dean crawled his pathetic ass back through the rift. Not if Cas didn't come back. Not if -

"Dean?"

***

"Okay, ugh." Chuck takes off his writing glasses, and starts to wipe them with his overshirt. "That's exactly the kind of bullshit which happens when you let your characters write themselves." He rolls his eyes.

And starts to backspace. "As if the three magic words could bring back Cas. The Empty doesn't work that way, Dean. These idiots do just about anything if you don't pay attention."

"Rule one of being God," He mutters, to no one in particular, stretching back in his desk chair thrice before flexing his fingers. "Slash, the only rule of being a writer."

"Remember it's you who's doing the writing." He declares, after a climatic pause.

Chuck rereads what he's typed out, squinting.

(It is a little bit like propheting, to be fair to his alias. At least the first drafts are.)

It takes him a godly moment to realize it sucks.

Way too much use of 'don't', and 'can't'. Way too out of character. The 'I Love You' is unnecessary. And the buildup is so pathetic, he should just delete the whole thing.

So then he does.

He pauses at the 'I Need You to get out of here with me'. Not bad. He can work with this.

Also, the 'Tried to stop it, but I can't' line is something that just stays with you. It's so emotional. He's a genius.

And of course, he's always been fond of 'falling to the knees' moments.

What about the rest? Well, everything else gets deleted.

Chuck decrees that there's no room for confessions in a purgatory death scene. This has to be gory, and not make-your-heart-gooey.

Like, sheesh, he's created some saps. He puts them into a violent setting, and it ends up with Dean admitting he loves Cas.

What kind of a ridiculous story is that? That's why first drafts are only good as fodder to the author's creative side.

They're good, only as long as the author is willing to delete it entirely, and not build upon it.

You see, one can't get too attached to their work.

Flexing his fingers once more for good measure, Chuck starts typing again.

"Take two."

***

Dean looked around in a frenzy, trying to spot the angel, or any part of him. He leaned his weight against a tree trunk, because if he didn't, he'd simply fall to the ground. He'd taken two bullets in his right leg, and had lost a lot of blood already.

***

Should he add more description of the nature of the wound? Probably, yeah. That's what the previous draft obviously missed.

***

He hadn't seen it coming, at all. Probably because, least of all, he hadn't expected human weapons here, in the land of scythes and clubs!

Dean still held onto his own knife - grateful that he could still wield one, even though he can't move.

"Cas!" Dean yelled, just about beginning to assume the worst. "CAS! We need to go back, Cas - the rift is wearing thin, and I need you to get out of here with me!"

***

It's utterly foolish to suggest that Cas is lying in front of Dean, and Dean can't get to him - shot twice, or not. Solution? Remove Cas from the scene.

Let him be dead in a ditch, and not ten feet away. Easy, peasy. That way, Dean can be reined in better, too.

***

"The portal's dying, you hear me? Cas, we can't make the same mistake again! We need to get out. Dammit, I need you to give me a sign you're alive -" His voice trembled.

The fear of the worst prevailed over hope.

"Where are you, Cas?" He shouted, and his throat threatened to give up. In a softer voice, he let out. "You can't be dead. It's - not you, too. Everyone - everyone's dying, Cas, you can't just -"

He drew in a painful breath.

"I'm supposed to stop this, I'm supposed to save my family, but nothing works, and everyone ends up getting hurt! I tried to stop it, but I can't - I just can't."

***

Huh. That nicely platonizes it.

Now it's no longer about unstoppable love. It's about unstoppable deaths of his adopted family. Better.

***

His words seem to drag him down with them, as he falls to the ground. His knees hit the ground first, and pain floods through his senses, almost numbing his brain.

All he can think of is how he's failed, time and again, at saving his family - and how it just happened again. About how Cas is gone.

Forever.

***

"Way, way better," Chuck whistled, pushing himself out of the chair, and starting to walk around. He reexamines his second draft in his mind.

No spontaneous declarations of love, check.

No hopeful cliffhanger, check.

Feelings of guilt, associated with Dean's role as the guardian, Check.

Fear of God?

Dammit.

He's going to have to write it again. And keep the family angst, the crushing feelings of guilt, and add in an element of villainy.

By the way, you're allowed to borrow elements from your second draft. It's just better if you don't. Don't be lazy, it's your writing.

If you don't put your heart into writing, why on earth do you even need one? Chuck resolves to make this one everything he wants it to be.

He selects the entire text, and blinks to have it obliterated.

"Take three."

***

Dean had looked everywhere, as much as he could, in his state of injury. His wounds made it difficult to think clear, but he knew who he was looking for.

Cas had to be somewhere around here. Why couldn't Dean find him? But he refused to give up hope yet, and kept on yelling the angel's name, weary hopes of a response running thin.

"We need to get out of here, Cas!" He shouted, holding onto a branch to stay upright. He doubted if he'd be able to get up if he fell. "The rift - it's closing, Cas. Where the hell are you? How do I know if you're alive? I need a sign, Cas - anything!"

Dean tried to move, but he stumbles and is grateful that he's still holding onto the branch. He resolves to not try to walk anymore. "Don't die on my watch, Cas - I swear, you can't die here!"

***

Guilting the other person back is a nice touch, isn't it?

***

Dean's chest constricted with the words, instead of feeling lighter. But he's finally letting it out, and he can't stop now.

"I can't do anything right! Can't save you, can't save my family, and I can't even save the world!"

He felt tears trickle down his face.

"He's going to win, Cas! He's God, and I'm just - I'm just the guy who once saved the world with his brother, and that too 'cause God must've willed it!"

"I'm trying to not think about how we've been lied to, our entire lives! I'm trying to stop feeling like we're puppets, like he's still controlling everything we say and do and think - I tried to stop it, I just can't -" He cried out, before his voice cracked, and he lets out a frustrated groan.

He can't go on - he just doesn't have the words. He doesn't have the strength.

So he falls to the ground, knuckles - white from clutching onto the branch suddenly relieved of their duty, and lying limp as he folds on the ground, unconscious.

It's the blood loss, and the pain, and the tears, and the loss - and it's all too much, and his body just gives in. He just gives up.

Dean can't do this anymore. He can't fight God. In fact, he never could.

And he's finally stopped believing in the farfetched myth that he ever could.

***

"Yahtzee." Chuck bit his lips, clicking on save, and pushing his chair away from his desk.

Now that's what you call a perfect scene.

It has everything. Whump beginning, gradual plot progression, poetic storytelling, heartbreaking dialogue, and a conclusion. A meaningful conclusion.

He's done a good job today. He managed to cut down a scene from love confession to familial guilt to helpless surrender - and he did it spectacularly.

With a satisfied sigh, Chuck walks off to the kitchen, to get himself some coffee, as he sits and ponders what happens next.

After all, he's going to have to start thinking, now, of what happens to his other favorite lead.

#supernatural #spn 15x09 #spn 15x08 #spnfamily #dean winchester angst #dean winchester #castiel #whump dean #whump cas #chuck shurley #purgatory #destiel #destiel undertones #destiel angst #destiel coda #spn speculation #spn s15 spoilers #spn s15 coda #spn s15 #spn s15 meta #mary winchester #jack kline #sam winchester

[incarnateirony]

Sorry abt all of the hate you’ve been getting recently. Here’s a (hopefully) interesting opinion to give you a break. I understand you believe DeanCas to be canon based on text. However, in a tv show, the script doesn’t equate to canon. In the end it’s the actors/directors interpretation onscreen. It’s fun to analyze DeanCas textually, but if there’s no onscreen payoff to the decade (?) long buildup. It’s queerbait. And knowing the history of LGBT+ cinema, it would be a very cruel thing.

Okay so this is a really uh, kinda cute attempt, but still about 3 years behind on things I’ve already addressed. In fact, your own take in a lot -- and I mean a lot -- of ways is far more self defeating than you think right here.

First of all, the script is the *base* of canon. I have always said, the script isn’t the complete canon and yes, it’s a collaborative work. This is not the winning argument you think it is. However, it is the base text. The base texts depicts the canon on page before the collaborative part presses it to on screen. (In fact to show how Not New Yet Backwards this take is, I've included a post at the end about social codes where I openly address how hysterical the fandom's limited idea of text is, and that whether inside or outside of Spoken Dialogue Only eg script the argument falls on its face and surrenders itself to reveal internalized queerphobia.)

For the record, I assume you went with the “script is just script” angle because I recently nailed down all the authoritative statements and receipts, but we’ll move on to your other points.

Now while not every-single-director has ever spoken up, some have. In fact, director Phil Sgriccia was one of the first people--in so far as being on the S8 DVD commentary--talking about Dean’s biromantic potential. Dick Speight also has been openly supportive and his framework is consistent. Many others don’t engage, like wright, but wright very obviously consciously framed things as per his previous work with Jensen on Dark Angel. We could go on. We could go on about set design, we could go on about all kinds of things.

We could go on about the way this fandom has a terrible warped way of reviewing AV media, wherein they used to chase curtains or assume certain lighting meant things it didn’t, *against* what crew said in some points, and then yell about interpretation. 

In fact your very evocation of the collaborative elements make this even more absurdist even if you really did pose this in innocence: after all, when this year a soap opera reporter who doesn’t even watch the show caught the 15.03 breakup, she gave swift review of the full cinematography being the classic framework of the Dark Points in the Romance. Because you’re right. It’s collaborative text. And especially as of season 15, that collaborative text--and in AV, visuals DO count as text--is painting them in romantic methods, in ways previously not done no matter what someone’s 8 year old meta sheet told them violet light meant. In fact, if you follow the actual crew’s statements of that violet light’s meaning, and look at 15.13, and then read through what I’ve been talking about on endgame speculation and where it fell, it falls into the fated twined paths of Dean and Cas at the end of the road together. No, the violet isn’t inherently romantic. Yes, it’s part of a large story. And yes, that story is leading them down a road together which I’ll bring up at the end of this post. Letting a romance speak for itself in the midst of mytharc is a whole other thing, and actually like, how it’s supposed to go? When it’s... literally an integral part of the structure?

All of this, all of this, is fundamentally true and I have actually made dozens if not hundreds of post to show how fandom has actually been -- in their attempt to be woke, to claim queerbait or not canon, or to whatever else -- persistently deleted creative commentary, turned it into accusations, or just defied basic AV crit standards both for and against itself. 

Are we really going to start talking about actor interpretations in the year even Jensen Ackles called it a domestic dispute, and turned a Samstiel question into Dean’s taste in Cas? Or Misha and Jared’s long histories of commentary? Or the other actors on the field over the years, even Emily Swallow or Curtis? Should we go as far back as to go to the showrunner note of when to play it like a jilted lover?

None of this is a new angle that I find interesting, it was interesting a few years ago when I first shared it, but here’s where your line breaks:

Jumping from that, any of that to “if there’s no onscreen payoff” isn’t just a nonsequitor, it buries your intent.

Even I have said, it’s true! The only base definition of queerbait is to create a bunch of queer-leading content without intent to follow through! Good job on that.

But you’re missing a whole bunch here.

I’ve simply said that setting ridiculous goalposts based on personal wants is not what makes canon. I don’t care if you want a kiss or sex on the map table or a rainbow farting unicorn pony for them to ride into the horizon--those are your goalposts, and those are not the only ways, nor the only valid ways much less, to have follow through.

The lack of intent to follow through is a hilarious presupposition. And follow-through does not only transmit one way. Hets get plenty of follow throughs like, I don’t know, at the end them implicitly asking someone to dinner and that’s it, that’s their happy ending. (Detty comes to mind.)  Some hets never even kiss. Nobody gets to set that specific *goalpost* and then erase all the other canon and text. That’s queer deletion. That’s regressive. And frankly that shits on the LGBT cinema history you’re trying to reference here vaguely, to which I point you to my entire LGBTQIA+ tag where I discuss a hundred years of queer cinema history and have a nagging feeling your head would actually spin for trying to break that out as an argument. Because you’ve got that backwards.

If the authors have intent to follow through on a romantic pairing, but do not give *your specific preferred thing* for *whatever* reason (in this case, from corporate interference snaring them back, for example), that is /not/ queerbait. It’s low visibility text and it’s still canon. There is no form of mental gymnastics this becomes anything else. If they have the intent to follow through and do follow through, it’s not queerbait. 

I don’t care how you cartwheel, how you reframe it, and how you try to nurse your mental wounds having to face that, perhaps, the alt right and terfy propaganda that has infested this fandom under the veil of being woke to get kids to repeat it has, also, influenced you. It’s hard to admit mistakes. But your entire statement here doesn’t even add together, it’s random assertions you’ve assumed are new, but actually fall contrary to what you think they add up to.

If, for example as I speculate, they can’t kiss, for example, but squeeze in a love you under limited parameters only to go off as a unit into eternity together on their own path, decided together, and that’s as far as the writers were allowed to go? Sorry, they still had intent to follow through, and followed through to what limit they have. Ergo, by your own definition, not queerbait.

Also, regardless of the ending, that doesn’t remove *text*. I can’t emphasize this enough. You can be dissatisfied with the ending, you can even feel baited if it does or doesn’t go to a specific landmark you set your personal faith on, but that doesn’t make previous text elements suddenly subtext, because that isn’t how it works, and never has been. 

Regarding unlevel social codes and how many ways this fandom has shown its own ass unwittingly, confusion over what is text, subtext, and how they all fall into a canon

https://occamshipper.tumblr.com/post/190728796970/were-gonna-try-this-again-canon-is-accepted

Being regressive and deleting your own stuff isn't helpful and often varies based on preferences rather than objective observations.