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#what was the reason jroth
bellamysgriffin · 6 months
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why do you think lexa wasn't? genuinely curious/asking
happy to answer this one actually! so this is in reference to my bold claim that lexa's death on the 100 was not part of the bury your gays trope and i stand by that.
so the 100 was a show in which main characters died every season. when adc decided to leave the 100 there was truly no other way to write lexa's character off than to kill her. again, this is a show where lincoln would die episodes later, finn had died the season previous, wells died, monty and harper would die, jasper would die, kane and abby would die, and im sure there are plenty more i'm forgetting. main characters died all the time.
lexa is actually as far as i can remember the only canon queer character who died -- clarke, niylah, and miller all survive to the finale. there was no way to have lexa walk off into the sunset for a season and pop in and out. she was too consequential as a character. when adc left, lexa had to die, and i don't think the way she was killed was particularly disrespectful. in fact, i would argue that her death was the most resonant in the plotline long after she was gone. it advanced the plot, advanced clarke's character, and was a rather beautiful send off scene. lexa was mentioned post-death more than any other character on the show. i know there are some people who have issues with the fact that she and clarke had just gotten together when it happened, but that's just a common writing trope -- the character gets what they want only to die immediately after. super common.
now, that said, i understand that she was one of several lesbian deaths on television that year, and i don't begrudge any queer woman who mourned that death in a deeper way. there is so little representation that when a sapphic character we love dies so brutally it can feel like more than just a television death. that said, i don't think jroth (a man of many crimes) did anything wrong by killing off lexa nor killing her off in the way he did. it wasn't offensive.
the 100 is a survival show. as a queer woman i personally find it just as dehumanizing to demand that the only queer stories we get are happy as to say that every queer story must be tragic. and queer people deserve well-written, resonant tragedies. lexa's arc/clexa's arc on the 100 was beautiful and well-executed, and it wasn't offensive to kill her off. "bury your gays" is not just when a queer person dies. it's when the queer character is seen as expendable, is usually the only queer person in the cast, and usually not on a show/film where characters die regularly. it has ties to the hayes production code in which homosexuality was seen as immorality and was required under the code's rules to be punished, often resulting in queer characters dying or committing suicide.
i don't think that trope describes lexa. i think her death made sense for a show in which there was a lot of death and carnage, i think her character was well-written, well-developed and honored long after her death, and i think we would be remiss to say that she cannot die merely because she is queer when there are truly no other compelling reasons for why it would be wrong to kill that character off on a survival show. and i would hardly call it shock value, which is usually what the bury your gays trope is.
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whitetrashjj · 2 years
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hi! so i've recently finished the 100 very late i know and ahh! i've gotten to love bob and eliza as well after watching interviews of them im so happy theyre married they look so in love (i say this like i didnt spend the last 3 weeks of my life obsessing over them LMAO) and i was rly surprised to see that they kept denying hating the romantic bellarke agenda? especially in the earlier seasons, but it was SO obvious, to me at least, that they were the main ship of the show... i scoured the internet for reasons why but all i could get was that the fandom hates jroth and the fandom would like to bury jroth alive SDJHFDSHJ but yeah! still rly curious and ik you were actively in the fandom during the time so if you could just briefly explain i would be vvvvv grateful
Okay... I'm gonna try and give a bit of a run down of the history of beliza and bellarke and jroth and clexa and how that all influenced things. Keep in mind I wasn't in the fandom from the start so the beginning is second hand recounts.
Okay so from the start bellarke was obviously intended, they were canon in the books but clearly with the Finn thing and everything else they were going for a more slow burn kinda vibe which was good obviously. Now this is where the bellarke denial started, but it was more casual there. Like a playfull not trying to give away the slow burn or surprise (this is very typical for slow burn ships and that's why I love the Pates for how they are handling jiara). So all was well in the house.
At this point Bob and Eliza were really good friends so that wasn't a problem. At one point apparently Devon kinda let it slip that they were actually in a fwb kinda situation at some point during the early season. I never saw first hand proof of this but it was a known fact amongst the fandom and I find likely given where they ended up.
Now, I'm not 100% on the order of event here but the following happened over s2/s3. Two major things that changed the fate and reception of bellarke forever.
The first being clexa. Now, from a story telling pov clexa was never going to last and Lexa's fate was always sealed. But I'm not going to go too much into that whole thing. But obviously there was alot of hype around Lexa and that ship. Which Jason loved, that man is driven by ego and having thousands of people up his ass fuel him. So he shifted his focus to them, knowing full well he was going to kill Lexa. And then when the backlash hit he kept pandering to them - putting little Lexa mentions in to keep the viewer ship, to keep people talking about his show. And by result of this the bellarke denial came in strong and their romantic development or story like was put on hold.
Now meanwhile it seems beliza had a falling out, Bob started dating his long term gf Aryn and they would not attend cons together. Also time to double down on the bellarke denial. Only this time it was legit (not that bellarke wasn't happening or intended, but they didn't like it and didn't want it to happen) we got the infamous 'bellake shit' quote from Eliza, which she insisted she actually said 'ship', even tweeted it (has since then once happily married admitted that she said shit lol) And yeah while we were still getting the on screen hints it seemed no one was rooting for it personally.
Then. The tide turns. Bob and Aryn has broken up. And we hear an announcement. Bob and Eliza are going to a con together?? Wait. what? And this con. Let me tell you. Changed the world. They were best friends again. Now, I am not an irl people shipper, there have been very few that I have seen and speculated before they were together and these two were one. I can't remember exactly why but there was something in the air before that and I was sus. And then there were a few things, like Eliza was saying how her favourite song was Ophelia and then she turns to Bob and says 'you must be so sick of hearing it i play it so much' and I was hmm because are they spending that much time together? Bob was wearing a bunch of mardigras necklaces and when Eliza said she wanted one and a fan overheard bob saying to her something 'you'll have to give me something later for one' and then after break Eliza had some ??? Which people freaked out about but not enough in my opinion. And then the fact that (actually this might have been a later con my timeline is messy its been a while) Eliza was wearing an engagement ring and straight up told people she was engaged when they asked. People assumed it was to the guy who play mccrery because there was rumours of them dating but they hadn't been seen together in ages.
And then most importantly they were now pro-bellarke. Talking excitedly about the scenes. Saying themselves are sometimes confused because the script will saying something like 'bellamy looks at her lovingly.' but then Jroth continues to deny things. they weren't to the level of it now but they were for sure making it clear that jroth was gaslighting a fandom lol.
Anyway moving on to one quite morning, I hadn't touch social media all morning as it did laundry and when I finally take a break the fandom is imploding - thankfully I had only missed it by like 15minutes. But Bob and Eliza has both tweeted that they had gotten married with a pic of their hands on their wedding day. Now I instantly believed it - oh yeah it's all coming together. But there was all this shock because it seemingly came out of no where. People thought they had been hacked, and then other cast would congratulate them and then they were hacked. Certain people were saying its a cover because Eliza and Alycia actually got married, and other were saying Bob and Eliza were homophobic for getting married during pride month. But at the end of the day it was all true, there were married and it was happily ever after.
But for some reason this seemed to piss off JRoth and he seemed to get so much worse. At one point during the filming of season 7 i think (i get confused about later seasons it could have been 6 or 8) Bob and Jason unfollowed each other and we though it was hilarious until we realised what it could have meant. Recently beliza revealed that the bellarke get together was actually written, in a place that so many people has speculated and it would have made sense but at the last minute it was taken out.
It seemed like Jason didn't like the beliza was together, he was having more and more issues with Bob and Jason just didn't do bellarke out of spite. Did that stupid murder out of spite and gave a pandering ending for clexas out of spite.
Once the show was over beliza have been very open about how bellarke was always planned from the beginning and they don't understand why it never happened.
Any way I've been out of it for a while so I'm a bit foggy on the detail these days but that's the guts of it. Anyone is free to add
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userlaylivia · 7 months
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god some people live in a permanent state of denial istg lol I've been down my bellarke rabbit hole again watching videos and a couple people are like "they were just meant to be friends and stay platonic" god their denial is strong lmao no they weren't supposed to stay just friends or platonic lol bob confirmed they were told to play them romantically and said they were supposed to be endgame, the ONLY reason they weren't is because jroth was a petty pos so no we weren't delusional and we didn't just see what we wanted to see because bob and eliza still talk about it and their still angry they weren't endgame and confirmed they were in love with each other like idc who hates them (though idk how people hate them honestly lol) and etc but we weren't delusional and we aren't crazy just because you saw them as just friends doesn't mean we're in denial or delusional and it definitely doesn't mean they were supposed to stay platonic because they weren't lol
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bellamyblake · 2 years
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HI! I've read some of your meta and headcanons and because I love them I have to ask, do you think Bellamy would've still been made bad even without Bob asking for time off? What are your thoughts on it? I saw you didn't chose the easy way out like most ppl and simply call him OOC but you understood some actions in a different way.
aw, hey! that's so kind, thanks for checking out my stuff. i haven't posted meta recently cause even when i have thoughts i don't always share them but debate about it in my mind so i wont be annoying.
the short answer to that is-yes. i absolutely think bellamy would've been made the villian of the story no matter what bob asked for.
i think the season 7 storyline absolutely copies the season 3 one where the same thing happened and i think that the path here was the same.
he would've gone through what he did in Etheria just like he went through everything he did in s3 A's episodes-something painful would've happened, he would've accepted the idea of transcendence and then after making a few mistakes in which I still think, no matter how much Bob had filmed, the other characters would've acted absolutely the same-
because guess what-
we've already seen in s3, absolutely the same thing.
so they would've still hated him the same way and blamed him for everything instead of reaching out to him. and then ultimately he would've seen things from within this broken system and realized Cadogan was wrong and this is bad and made the decision HIMSELF, then helped the others out, perhaps gotten hurt (like Levitt was in that finale episode, I remember i read somewhere it was supposed to be bellamy) and then ultimately maybe ended on the beach.
that's exactly what would've happened, i have about zero doubts about it cause as i said, we've seen it already.
the problem with bellamy was never that he was OOC. that is why i see things differently-it is the way the OTHER characters see him. or more specifially, how the writers write those characters seeing bellamy.
jroth has always admitted he had a hard time writing for bellamy. that his wife often asked him about it and questioned what he'll do with him and the thing is i dont think jroth always knew what to do and when he didn't, he opted for making him lean into his darker thoughts and trust his heart when he is hurt and alone otherwise making him bad because it was easier and because he knew bob wouldn't mind playing a bad guy as he had stated he liked that in earlier seasons.
the season 3 storyline follows the absolutely same path to the season 7 one (or the one it should've been had it been developed absolutely in the way jroth wanted it to be).
bellamy is a little lost and confused, he's trying to protect his family but then instead of doing things the right way, more death follows, so he decides to trust in to those who offer another option-PIke in s3 who speaks into his grief and absolutely into the guilt he feels.
the reason why pike wins bellamy over is because unlike Kane who keeps saying none of this was bellamy's fault, because he simply cannot read bellamy the right way and clarke isn't there, pike tells him the thoughts he falls asleep with every night-it's your fault, you killed those people, you didn't save gina.
a similar thing happens in s7-deucette and the others offer a way out. if we have to be honest with ourselves, clarke and bellamy's *doing better* never actually worked and especially not in s6.
bellamy is seeing more and more that the more he tries, the worse it gets, even when he's doing his best.
seeing his first sin-his mom, who was the death he didn't want to cause but did because he let his feeling show and wanted to make octavia happy, just speaks volums to him.
i also want to mention here that there are two more people who definitely play a role in his choice to trust what they're talking about here and that are Jasper and Monty.
Jasper because he saw there was no way out of their violent ways and opted to leave the world and Monty who too, separated himself from the clarke and bellamy world and decided to live a quiet albeit lonely life with harper because he realized that IS doing better or at least living better. partly both their reasons were selfish and ultimately don't help the entire group.
what deucette and cadogan offer, do. they safe everyone. that is what bellamy wants-to help them all, it was always his goal from the moment he adopted those kids on the ground. frankly, clarke lost that somewhere, but i dont think he ever did, especially not after season 4 when he spent all those years up on the ring with the others.
i dont find him OOC. i find the story shitty, yes, absolutely but i think and i will get yelled for that but that the City of Light storyline in all honesty wasn't at all that different from the lights and finding another form of eternal life-it was just underdeveloped and ofc jroth couldn't do something like CoL again in 7 as it already existed so he made it these weird beans of light.
do you know who the only character who never was invloved with CoL or that SL from the hundred was?
Bellamy.
Do you know why? Because I don't think Jroth knew how to do that at all. he had that chance here again, to try and indulge a SL where he could perhaps put bellamy into this world. the only problem was that he doesn't know how to write bellamy into a major storyline without making him a villain or making his actions a part of some redemption ark (e.g s2 and s4).
and in all honesty, the problem was never with bellamy. it was with clarke and everyone else. because the same thing that happened in s7 had already happened in s3.
no one, not a single soul, tried to undrestand what was happening with bellamy then. clarke argued but she wasn't there and didnt see him suffer-in fact she left him and said-they are your responsibility now, something he has lived for his entire life and now repeated for 48 kids he barely got there. octavia lashed out and just wanted to leave with lincoln, have her own life, miller, harper, kane, sinclair all worked against him without understanding him. kane preached the entire time how he's making a mistake but he never once tried to speak into what he feels the way pike smartly did. monty was somewhere in the middle, ultimately turned good.
in s7, clarke, o, raven and everyone else argue with bellamy. he tries to explain himself, tell them what he saw, how it all happened, that his mom was there, that he saw something. do you know what happens?
nothing. they bash him and tell him he's nuts.
let's see some examples of the opposite:
in s 2 ep 16 clarke says-I have no choice, I have to do this.
What does bellamy do?
he covers her hand and turns the lever with her.
in 3x16-she says i have to go into CoL after taking the chip.
what does bellamy say-I trust you.
in 4x01-she says ALIE said the radiation is coming for us all.
Bellamy said-we're looking into it, I trust her.
in 4x03 Clarke says-I don't deserve to live, not after everything.
Bellamy says-Yes you do and writes her name on the list.
in 4x13 Clarke says-I think I may be dying, mom had a vision of me dying.
Bellamy says-so what? You will be okay. AFTER SHE ALMOST SHOT HIM IN 4x11 MIGHT I REMIND YOU ALL.
the problem was never with bellamy. not in s7, not in any other season. yes he is flawed that is without saying, he did make mistakes, and that is why i love him and clarke and octavia because they make mistakes.
but don't let us make the same one-that the way he sees everyone else is the same they do because it isn't and never was.
and
that is the tragedy of bellamy blake.
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rivertalesien · 2 years
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Thank you for more Lexa I miss discussing her! SO MUCH of what went wrong because Jroth couldnt be consistent made such a mess after season 2 Lexa made no sense her world made no sense but haha heres a little romance for a hot min bye
You're welcome. I'm always up for talking Lexa/Clexa etc.
And you know, I'm not a hater on writers who want to world-build and dream up bigger scenarios and have fun, but that man had no idea how to keep anything together and I'm not sure it was entirely accidental. Did neither he nor his team pay any attention to each season as it went by and just kept writing themselves into one corner after another? Instead of world-building, they dug one hole after another.
Imagine just *throwing it out there* that the Grounders allowed themselves to be led by children who would fight to the death, when their blood type is the rarest there is? Who would just say, oh yeah, there's a thing in her neck and has been since day one but we forgot to mention that so just ignore it until we find a use for it.
The moron spent an entire season just passing it around and making a joke of it while affirming Lexa still lived within it.
And then, to get to the end, after all the places and people they meet with technology that was invented before the Ark went up (and remember how Becca never made the argument to the Ark crew that her "black blood" was just "blood alteration" to help people survive extreme environments and would have been beneficial to them? But JR hadn't come up with "blood alteration" at that point. It was just a cool black blood gimmick), with tech that would have allowed them to download the Flame's inhabitants to either new bodies or even a database, but no, at the last minute, it has to be shot and destroyed.
People were so happy about seeing "Lexa" in the finale they ignored that JR shot her a second time and it wasn't an accident.
Like he played with that little blue nugget for four years, did nothing meaningful with it except exploit fans' desire to see Lexa again (the real queerbaiting), then killed her. Again.
There was something really rotten about how the CW/Mark Pedowitz kept openly supporting him and giving him a full run with that show even after it fell off the ratings charts, even after the constant critical drubbing following season three. There was no reason to give this inexperienced ahole such a prime gig or keep him on after he'd blown it. They could have handed it to just about anyone else. Someone who actually gave a shit.
I think one of the reasons why Clexa fan fiction is, over all, so good, is that fan writers worked so hard to undo that incredible mess and create a story (ies) that would do them justice. It wasn't *just* for fun or sexy times, but a real effort to re-create something that could have been one of the great queer-centered shows.
That's why it hurts to see someone like Eliot Laurence with all he did to bring Motherland to life and he got short-changed by the network, no chance to prove how good it could be. Rothenberg gets someone else's work to run into the ground with more episodes, probably more money, and one renewal after another and he turned it into one of the most massive, depressing homophobic experiences.
With only a few episodes for one last season (and having to deal with one of his leads being off work due to an accident), Laurence has kept "Raylla" and to a lesser extent, "Talder" very much front and center and isn't messing with anyone. He gives a shit.
I really hope he gets another chance.
Rothenberg can vanish.
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euudaimonia · 3 years
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take me back to the week when bellarkes were so excited at the theory of bellamy hearing the radio calls. everyone obsessing over the promo of clarke in m-cap because we thought we were so close. we thought after 7 seasons they were finally going to be canon. literally just the energy of all the tweets and theories going around i miss it
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sassqueenblake · 4 years
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I'm just gonna say it..
BELLAMY BLAKE DESERVED BETTER
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orphicas · 3 years
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no bc i wasn’t gonna be back on my b*llarke bs but this one year thing has got me thinking again what was jroth THINKINF
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aadmelioraa · 4 years
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might just fuck around and become a the last kingdom blog.
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angieschiffahoi · 4 years
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Some of you guys have no concept of what queerbaiting is. 
Queerbaiting is queercoding characters without explicitly addressing their sexuality or giving them a love interest, but hinting in interviews that they could be gay without ever uttering the word and inviting audiences to stick around to “find out”.
Queerbaiting is queercoding a relationship between two characters, making it obvious that (had they been of opposite sexes) they would’ve gotten together sooner or later.
Queerbaiting is adding a token queer character, leaving them in the background only to kill them off/send them off once you’ve built the audience you were aiming for. 
Romances between wlw & mlm, explicitly stated on tv, that are treated with respect and even have the main focus, but that in the end do not work is not queerbaiting. It’s called shipping, like with any other ship.
Creators, especially queer creators, have the right to choose the journey their characters should undertake. If they don’t want a couple together, then it’s their decision. But a show with two queer leads, who have been in a relationship and may not be back in that relationship, is not queerbaiting. It’s still a show with two explicitly queer leads, who may or may not be in relationships. One person’s queerness isn’t defined by their relationship status in real life, why should it on tv? 
Stop throwing that word around. Let creators create complex stories and complex characters. Queer characters shouldn’t be excused from failure, from disappointment, from sadness, from heartbreak and from bad behavior just because they’re queer. They should be just as varied and flawed and at risk as any other character. If I wanted a show where everyone is constantly happy and there is no risk of anyone dying, getting hurt or being evil I’m going to turn to My Little Pony, honestly. 
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azhefa-moved · 6 years
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@wardrained is my witness, i’m calling it now. if dyoza’s kid is a scifi baby remember this post. i will fucking die laughing
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yiangchen · 6 years
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Jroth needs to watch Avatar the Last Airbender and take notes on how to portray/condemn abusive relationships in the narrative (of the 100).
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userlaylivia · 7 months
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all the quotes from other people regarding bellarke make me sob like a baby! because if they were never supposed to happen what was the reason???!!!! we all know they were supposed to happen and be endgame they were building towards that until jroth was a pos who did a total 180 ugh "kill the hostage taker and his girlfriend." even diyoza who didn't know them or their relationship thought she was his girlfriend!! he had way more romantic moments with clarke than his actual gf lol sorry but I'll never ship becho their the only ship on the show I despised with a passion!
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blakefreckles · 6 years
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holy shit the books are so much different than the show
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daemonsrhaenyras · 2 years
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Came across THIS ARTICLE today about JRoth's treatment of Ricky Whittle and I just... seems a bit familiar in retrospect doesn't it?
“It was my choice to go. Jason Rothenberg abused his position to make my job untenable. What he did was disgusting and he should be ashamed. A lot was made of what my mom said all over Twitter, but everything she said was true. He was professionally bullying me, cutting out all the storyline I was supposed to be doing, cutting lines, cutting everything out, trying to make my character and myself as insignificant as possible.”
“Every time a script would come through I would see literally nothing for Lincoln,” he said. “He’s not doing anything. It was never about screen time, it’s an ensemble cast … but it was why he had no screen time. I approached other producers [on set] and said, ‘What’s going on?’ because Jason always stayed in Santa Monica. ‘Why am I being treated like this?’ And the producer I spoke to just [said], ‘You need to speak to him. I don’t know what his problems are with you.’”
Ricky Whittle went on to explain that after he decided to quit, his character was initially going to have a fitting [ending?]. Then, at the final second changes were made so his character had a poor exit which made him feel like the change was made out of spite. “It kind of seemed settled that Lincoln was going to go toward the end of the season, and then a script came out and an amendment came out … where he went back and was executed. I mean, even that storyline — he was executed for no reason. It was very weak.”
It's like, we'll never really know what happened to cause S7 to be such a dumpster fire shitstain of a season, but, like, we totally know.
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euudaimonia · 3 years
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bellarke breakdown is commencing during spanish exam
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