#anyway I think about nanami anthy parallels all the time | Explore Tumblr Posts and Blogs

comradekatara · 3 months

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i am very curious about your thoughts on various utena/atla character parallels… every once in a while i see you offhandedly compare like.. korrasami and utenanthy and i’m like HOLD ON this is so true! if you have any further ideas about that i would LOVE to hear them. i honestly don’t know how big the audience is for rgu/atla analysis but i am definitely part of that audience. 😭

yesss i can't believe you're literally the first person to ask me this lately i've been making rgu references on like, every single post i'm shameless!!!!! over the summer i even wrote (like 95% of) an essay comparing sokka and nanami (tldr; they are meat) and i have yet to revisit it (bc i'm scared tbh) but i will post is eventually that is a PROMISE (for an audience of 5 people). also before we go any further my utena blog is @saionjeans and we have fun there. also, i have some utena/atla crossover art here and here, so check that out if you haven't already. the rest of this post will be scattered thoughts because my nanami-sokka essay will be doing a lot of the in-depth analytical work and i don't need to rehash that all now. but also, because i have never not once in my life heard of brevity, i did write a bunch of mini essays anyway, because of course i did.

korrasami and utenanthy: love and abuse

i compared utenanthy to korrasami a couple times, most notably in this post where i talk about how meaningful their relationship is despite being (arguably) underdeveloped, and then in the tags i still have to acknowledge that utena and anthy nonetheless did it better 17 years prior. but i do think that there is so much to be said for utena-korra and anthy-asami as two young women who are both set up to be "special" but in a way that denies and restricts them from their own humanity, cloistering them away from the outside world and making them more vulnerable to abuse. i talked pretty recently about how asami's abuse is really shrugged under the carpet in a way that pisses me off if i think about it for too long. rgu does such an incredible job of gradually exposing that abuse and its effects on society, not as a deviation from the norm (of the nuclear family, of the romance, of the school, etc.) but in fact a common symptom of it. lok does not critique the nuclear family in any meaningful way despite setting up so many different areas through which such a critique could be facilitated (made worse by the fact that atla sets such a fantastic precedent). but anyway, enough about lok (and how she disappoints me).

2. miki & kozue and katara & sokka: siblings and memory

in my sokka-nanami essay i talk about how various characters can be read to embody various analogues, but how my focus in that essay is primarily to draw a parallel between sokka and nanami by using the framework for gender/patriarchal logic rgu establishes. however, i also talk about how azula can be read as a nanami (or even an anthy) figure, as well as how katara and sokka can be read as miki and kozue (katara = miki and sokka = kozue, obviously) (and note that kozue and nanami are significant foils/mirrors too). i mean, they even have a similar light blue (to signify naïveté, innocence, childlike wonder) versus dark blue (to signify cynicism, jadedness, resigned subsumption into harmful norms) color scheme going on. the Special sibling and the afterthought. (although before going forward i do want to be clear that i am in no way alluding to any incestuous undertones wrt katara and sokka, and i would even argue that the allusions to incestuous desire between miki and kozue are more complex and nuanced than simply reducing it to mere perversion. but that's beyond the scope of this ask lol)

i know that some people might bristle at my comparing katara to miki (baby misogynist, little freak) but miki really exemplifies the trope of the "sunlit garden" in the same way that katara exemplifies that trope in atla. miki isn't the narrator of course (akio is), but the central motif of desire staked to an illusory formative memory since lost that defines a character's motivations and self-becoming is first properly introduced (not including the utena meeting dios intro) and defined through his obsession. in the same way, we are introduced to the world of atla through katara's formative memories, her desire that motivates her self-becoming also being an illusory formative memory, as well as a tale she longs to replicate ("the four nations living together in harmony"). katara, like miki, is defined by her naïveté and childlike innocence, her somewhat reductive desire to be noble and heroic, and her need to flatten everything into a clear-cut narrative wherein she is always its heroine. like miki, she resents her sibling for being transformed into a more cynical version of themselves in accordance with society's pressures (in kozue's case, it's the inescapability of patriarchy, whereas in sokka's case, it's... a lot of things), and longs for a time when they were "truly happy" and playing together (playing piano, playing in the snow, you get it).

both kozue and sokka heavily subscribe to patriarchal logic and comport and reduce themselves in accordance with the dictums of a world they consider truly inescapable. kozue seeks power within her limited frame, whereas sokka only seeks power insofar as it allows him to assume his very narrow role of protector, but they both assume those limitations to be ontological and fixed in a way that does not allow them to see past it. however, the lack of empathy both miki and katara refuse to attempt in understanding their worldviews, in no way making an effort to broach that misunderstanding instead of simply letting the chasm between them fester, nonetheless implicates them equally. after all, they too both adhere to their own limited worldviews, only in their worldviews they are fundamentally special and thus beyond reproach. sokka and kozue are both integral aspects of katara and miki's sunlit gardens, and their idealized return to a picturesque nostalgia involves a transformation (or regression) of sokka and kozue into their more innocent former selves. and sokka and kozue are in turn obsessed with katara and miki, the central figure around which their identity and actions revolve.

through this framework, aang thus becomes katara's anthy (aangthy, hehe), as the embodiment of katara's hopeful/nostalgic ideal of heroism, companionship, and the idealized promise of a distant irretrievable past. like anthy with kozue, aang "replaces" katara's longing for the softer, more innocent version of her brother with aang's friendship. like miki with anthy, katara possesses romantic feelings for aang despite his functioning as a replacement for sokka before he became a shell of his former self (or kozue before she became... sexually active). this is because katara, like miki, idealizes the patriarchal narratives that dictate that all significant relationships be either romantic or familial (or both). she wholeheartedly subscribes to this notion, hence why she attempts to subsume everyone who can meaningfully fit into her narrative framework as either a lover (aang, haru, jet, zuko for all of 2 seconds) or a pseudo family member (aunt wu, hama, pakku, toph, etc etc.), replicating those dynamics as many times as she needs to to make them fit within her two dimensional tapestry. and crucially, coming face to face with yon rha subverts that, because she recognizes the messy humanity spilling forth from the neat boxes she puts people in, and must thus contend with her own role in her narrative. of course miki, being a side character and not the narrator, certainly not the hero, does not get this luxury. and he must find a way to grow up anyway.

3. akio and ozai: patriarchy

there's something truly incredible about how both akio and ozai manage to inflict psychological harm upon every single character in their respective shows, even if they never interact with those characters directly. their reach is vast and spindly; it cannot be overestimated. and yet, ozai has only reigned for about six years. akio is only acting chairman of ohtori academy. they are not patriarchy itself, but merely its signifier. and obviously their modes of embodying patriarchy differ in many respects: a school is not a nation (despite the similarities), and a father is not a brother (despite akio being father-like). ozai is defeated by by being stripped of his technology of violence, whereas akio is not "defeated" in a literal sense (although i suppose anthy driving a car through his ghost and exploding him into a cloud of roses does make quite the statement), anthy merely leaves. and yet, in both instances, they are both forced to succumb to their own limited ideology regarding what constitutes power. if ozai lacks firepower, he lacks control over his subjects and the right to sovereignty. if akio's control is challenged, if people realize that they can just leave, that the ends of his world are entirely arbitrary, he no longer has the power to abuse and exploit and use others for his own ends.

the metonymic signification of patriarchy figured through both ozai and akio in dual ways further emphasizes their respective roles. ozai is both king and father, akio is both (acting) chairman and (acting) father. patriarchy dictates every aspect of [a patriarchal] society: from interpersonal dynamics to the nuclear family to the school to the state to the world. what makes both akio and ozai so brilliant in this regard is the fact that their influence is reflected in all these facets. ozai abuses every member of his family individually; controls them as a system; inflicts his (family's) propaganda onto the fn education system, rewriting history with (almost) no one to disprove him; inflicts his imperialist agenda both within the fire nation (ruining local economies through industrialization, forcing citizens to conform to restrictive roles, inflicting violence through occupation) and beyond it; he refers to the world as "my world," as if he is its creator, its owner, or its god. and in many ways, he is. akio similarly abuses everyone interpersonally (most notably anthy, touga, and utena); subsumes utena into his nuclear family system so that she cannot leave; uses the academy as a site of control in which adolescents are forced to comply with socially codified norms and thus made more vulnerable to the influence of adult authority figures (especially those who emphasize their individuality or inherent specialness when compared with the rest of the student body); operates ohtori as a sort of nation wherein patriotism is reified through the use of uniforms, affiliations, sociopolitical hierarchies, and an acting government (the student council); and defines himself as the creator/owner/god of his world. to be end of the world. to embody not an apocalypse, but a cage.

ozai and akio both fashion themselves the entire world, but it also makes them more vulnerable to resistance, to any mode of critique that points out the obvious: no, you're just one person, and the logic you use to dominate others is deeply, noticeably flawed. it's a logic that they exploit but that in turns exploits them, as they have so deeply internalized it that they can no longer immunize themselves against any kind of resistance. ozai claims that there is no room for an air nomad in his world, which is why aang defeating ozai through the pacifist values of his people and not through his greater power (which would nonetheless be subscribing to ozai's logic, and thus letting him win ideologically if not physically) is so crucial in shattering ozai's paradigm. just as utena, as someone who refuses to conform to the strict, arbitrary, and violently enforced norms of patriarchy, can so thoroughly disrupt akio's control by resisting him. just as anthy can by leaving. akio remains in his cozy little coffin, exerting meaningless control to uphold the hollow puppet of his ego.

people sometimes joke about how long it takes for zuko to recognize that the burning off of half his face was "cruel" and "wrong," but it's not that zuko didn't find it painful, it's not that zuko didn't fear his father, it's not that zuko idolized his father beyond reproach. he questioned his cruelty, in fact he did so constantly. he simply saw no other way to live. he had no conception of a world beyond ozai's defined limits, had no choice but to believe ozai's dogma and loathe himself for not sufficiently adhering to it. similarly, people often ask "if anthy could leave all along, then why didn't she?" because she, too, was trapped in a coffin of her own self-loathing. to leave an abuser is not as simple as simply stepping beyond the threshold and never looking back. first, you must locate the threshold. then, you must find the courage to look beyond it. i briefly touched on azula being an anthy figure before. well, i think that she is. just because she has yet to see beyond the threshold does not mean she does not find her limits. and yes, its not triumphant, and yes, her facade that masks her pain and fear is shattered, but ultimately, that breakdown is a good thing for her. because that's her first step to freedom.

4. the sunlit garden as mythmaking events

i talk previously in this post about the motif of "the sunlit garden" in rgu vs what i like to call "a mythmaking event" in atla, and i do want to elaborate on that slightly. i provided a link to a post on my utena blog going into what the sunlit garden "is" for each principal character, and atla has a similar mode of communicating these nostalgic desires and idealizations that motivate self-becoming, largely through flashbacks. for aang, it is quite obvious, as his memories of a before and after are (temporally, although not psychologically) fragmented by an entire century. that disconnect severs the two versions of himself quite neatly. those memories with gyatso and the other air nomads (as well as with child bumi, and with the mysterious kuzon) are his idealized past, his "sunlit garden," whereas the storm is his mythmaking event, the point in his life where his choices collide with his telos. there is no going back.

katara and sokka have a similar sunlit garden, their snowball fight being the last truly happy memory they have before the black snow falls and their childhood innocence is severed from them forever. kya's sacrifice and murder is katara's mythmaking event as she then chooses to assume the mantle of her mother who took her place, decides to become the greatest waterbender possible to compensate for surviving the genocide, and chooses to be a hero so that the collective memory and sacrifices of her people will not be in vain. like utena, she witnesses pain and suffering at a very young aged and is moved to become a hero so as to mitigate that suffering, even if her own formative tragedy can never be rectified. also like utena, she idealizes a seemingly utopian past wherein violence was more covert and thus presented itself as more ideal (the time of princes vs the time of harmony). her naïveté and persistent idealism are both her downfall and her greatest virtue. she refuses to accept the true state of the world to the point of blindness, but it is also that refusal to accept it that allows her to force the world into a kinder shape.

as for sokka, his mother's death was also a formative trauma, but his true mythmaking event is when hakoda leaves for war with all the other men of his tribe. hakoda tells him that "being a man is knowing where you're needed the most, and right now, that's here, protecting your sister." it's not a rose crest ring, but it may as well be. from that moment onward, sokka officially comports his identity into being his sister's protector, which is how he thus defines his manhood. and of course, being his sister's protector means being a martyr, because the precedent for "protecting katara" that has already been established is, well, dying for her. like aang being the avatar and the last airbender and katara being the last southern waterbender, sokka is thus defined by his necessity (ie, usefulness to others) as well as his isolation – not only the "last warrior/man" of the swt, but also via his own process of depersonalization and self-dehumanization as he attempts to fully embody his role as an eventual martyr.

zuko's mythmaking event is, of course, branded onto his face. in fact, zuko essentially assumes both katara and sokka's mythmaking events by first being irrevocably altered by his mother's sacrifice, and then being all the more transformed by his father's decree as he attempts to dictate what kind of man zuko needs to be. his "sunlit garden" is also shown to us in flashes: memories of a (literal!) sunlit garden, of turtleducks, of his mother's gentle guidance, of happier times on ember island, on his father's hand resting on his shoulder with pride instead of malice. it is unclear just how truthful these nostalgic memories are. obviously, his family was never actually happy. ozai had always been exerting control over them, even if his violence was once more obscured. we never see azula's sunlit garden, for instance (although i'd argue that she and zuko possess the same mythmaking events), and i cannot help but wonder whether it's because, like touga, she never actually had one.

finally, some honorable mentions must go to the following: toph, whose sunlit garden is also her mythmaking event, as she learns from badgermoles how to hone her gift and reject the rigid societal impositions that seek to limit, repress, and control her. hama, who never attempts to return to her sunlit garden in the swt with kanna, despite her freedom as established in her mythmaking event of teaching herself to bloodbend; she knows that she is irrevocably altered, and thus she can never go home again. appa, whose sunlit garden, of playing with the other bison at the southern air temple, occurs in conjunction with his mythmaking event of meeting aang and becoming the avatar's animal companion.

all of these events are depicted through flashbacks wherein the consecutive shots between flashback and present day mirror the character who is having the memory in the past and present, overlaying their younger face onto their current face with identical framing. i'm too lazy to compile a bunch of screenshots here, and i couldn't find the post i'd seen previously that had done so, but if you're as familiar with atla as i am, then you already know exactly what i'm talking about. this device is so effective particularly because it exercises restraint. every flashback in atla is crucial because it signifies either a sunlit garden or a mythmaking event that motivates the character its focalizing in the present day. atla is economical with its flashbacks, but not withholding. like with rgu, flashbacks in atla are used with a specificity of purpose, and illustrate their points in clear, precise ways. just because atla is not as overtly metatextual with its central themes of narrativization, nostalgia, idealization, bias, and storytelling, does not mean it is not present, and in fact, overt. ranging from katara's role as narrator to the fire nation propaganda aang attempts to correct in school, the use of memory and illusion is crucial in illustrating how atla functions as a narrative about heroism, legacy, and challenging dominant myths through preserving cultural memory under an imperialist regime.

5. final thoughts

obviously, i could go on forever. there is simply no limit to my ability to unpack and dissect these two shows (hence, my sideblogs dedicated to doing so). i haven't even talked about zuko as an analogue to saionji with regard to their latent homosexuality, misogyny, violence, and struggle to conform to a patriarchal ideal. and i barely touch on katara as an analogue to utena with regard to their naïveté, heroism, myopia, persistence, and somewhat misguided desire for justice (through her terms specifically), although like kozue and nanami as mirrors wrt sokka, her traits that i describe when comparing her to miki also map onto utena in many ways – except of course, utena, unlike miki, is also the "hero," and thus has the same destabilizing revelation regarding the banality of evil that katara undergoes in "the southern raiders." moreover, i only discuss one central motif in utena, because i think the sunlit garden is the trope that maps best onto the thematic work atla is doing, but i'm sure that there are many more frameworks i could compare. and yet, i only have so much time, and only so much space in which to ramble. so hopefully, for now, this suffices. however, if there any specific areas in which you would like me to elaborate, you know that i shall always be happy to do so.

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grlfriends · 3 years

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revolutionary girl utena review

ep 1-5

the plot is actually kinda different from what I thought ?? in my mind the plot was: utena was a girl in a princess school who each and every princess would be "conquered" (for a lack of better words rn) in a ceremonial duel by a prince who fancied them, maybe she didnt wanna wanna marry anyone or she liked Anthy already but anyway in my mind utena showed up in the ceremony with duel clothing and then, in a very brave tm like-scene, she would openly declare she refused to be conquered by anyone and tbh I'm not even sure how Anthy would come into the plot... but back into what actually happened in the episodes everything so far is very introductory and just showing what mechanics will be explored further down the line I think?? the op is really good too

also every boy so far reminds me so much of knights of the zodiac?? maybe it's just the design I guess...) and nanami can get these hands, jealousy is a disease and she's the sickest person on earth for all I know

dont ask me why bit I just feel like room of mirrors - gfriend has a very well fitting vibe for it but I'm not exactly sure why hm.... 🤔🤔

ep 6-12

ok so why does this school just have random animals around 😐 I could understand the horse but a bull and a kangaroo?? what ...

touga just says the most random dramatic things and then just casually says anyone who believes in friendship is a fool ?? the guy wouldnt last a day in the naruto universe tbh, he kinda irks me in some way but I'm not sure why so I'll live with this strange feeling for a while I guess

↳ okay so watching ep 10 made me especially kinda creeped out, I know I've watched only 10 eps so far but like can he fall downstairs and break a neck or something already ...

also haha what if I watched that bet on it fmv and gave myself a bunch of spoilers would that be funny or what 😍 this is why i cant have nice things yall.... hope my memory goes to shit when sleep so I dont remember about it this week while I finish it

I feel like the main thing on the episodes are parallels, one way or another I always feel like they're setting up parallels and giving me clues for a bigger picture and a deeper plot arc that is still to come and the bet on it fmv just made this impression stronger, also I wanna say it's done in a good way, one that is both mysterious (??) and "honey you've got a big storm coming" at the same time 🤔🤔 much to think about honestly

↳ just saw ep 11 and even though I already knew this was coming sooner or later it still felt like crap seeing utena lose to dick head, at the end of the episode when he says anthy was always just reflecting utena's own wishes for himemiya (in another way bc I dont remenber the exact words) it felt like 😐 bc yes I knew that (the way she was working her thoughts was simply a copy and paste of what utena was saying) at all time I kept those essays about anthy in my head, I dont think theyll be truly relatable to what I'm seeing rn but yeah anthy rights (even though I know you betray/cheat on utena down the line bc of the bet on it fmv but I'm sure you had your own motivation)

↳ saw ep 12 bc I just couldnt handle being in a cliffhanger and yeah it happened what I absolutely thought it would lmao not that it was that difficult to foresee but yeah, I kinda liked how utena did it for her instead of being like "oh I wanna save anthy from touga" and treating her like a damsel in distress (I know that's kinda her position as the rose bride for what I've been told so far and that this is a subject spoken about in many many essays on tumblr but yeah) bc so far she's been treated as a trophy and a way to get something else, for the green haired guy it was a way to see something eternal, for miki it was a way to hold on into his "shining thing" and for touga it seems (so far) like a way to manipulate (just like he does with nanami) and just mark his position as above everyone else as he seems to view himself?? man I might be saying random stuff rn but it kinda does makes sense in my mind with the information I've had to this point

ep 13-25

honestly 😐😐 through 9 whole episodes I felt like they were trying to make the side characters deeper and show their hidden face and motivations but it felt so shallow...... not even actually shallow, just not deep enough that it would make me care about these characters and the fact there was no actual build to showing us why we're getting to know these characters backgrounds was just kinda meh too, didnt really help that all episodes had all the same formula and the same timing just for the developers made in those episodes be forgotten at the end and also just that pink haired guy could be like "ah failure again", it felt like watching the same episode over and over again, it was really tiring and like?? girl help I do not care about these characters at all, I feel like it could have been done well (like the keiko ep in comparison to the furuba chapter that deals with the yuki appreciation (??) club president graduating.... the way this ep was done and setup didn't really bring me any emotions) overall not to my taste and tbh I feel like I could have skipped all those episodes except for maybe the miki and juri one so 😑

all nanami focused episodes are the worst so far, she's so boring and I cant stand now annoying she is, the diary episode?? the cow episode?? the episode when tsuwabiki fuels with utena?? honestly I know they're trying to show me a better and different side of her but it just doesnt!! work!! bc i feel no sympathy for her, my biggest wish rn is her and touga just disappearing and no more filler episodes🗣🗣

I thought akio was utena's prince?? but apparently he's just anthy's brother and like.. I'm do done with his little talks with utena and yadda yadda, I just wanna see their duel is that too much to ask I'm dying over here (if this lenga lenga continues until ep 25 i will be so mad bc why were so many episodes wasted on such boring and and not necessary side characters backstories?? idc about them at all man aaaaaaaaaa)

↳ ep 25 was good finally we got what we deserve boys 😭😭😭😭😭 can utena just beat up akio already I'm tired of his ass, he exhales both "I'm a feminist I even take women studies classes #herstory" and "if she breathes she's a thot" energy also he has 0 style that mullet is simply horrible I bet there's a hairstylist community who considers him a criminal bc like 😐 it is simply so bad (q bit less when it's tied up but when it's all lose jesus Christ)

also touga thinks he's suuuuch a genius, sooo smart like king, I do not care about you at all can you shut the fuck up please and can we tall about the pink haired guy episode?? wack. honestly thought it would be more emotional or something, I binge watched 12 episodes with his ugly haircut face and did not even feel a thing he can choke I guess ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

ANTHY TAKING A SWORD OUT OF UTENA'S CHEST??? OSCAR WORTHY KINGS❗❗❗and then her lame ass brother being like "oh ho ho idk idk" shut up no one cares no one cares I swear to you no one cares shut uuuuup

ep 25-39

first of all, ep 25 was good but kinda reminded me of the nine episodes (13 until 21) where absolutely nothing interesting happened so I hope I'm wrong also can I just say just seeing the preview of the next episode made me roll my eyes so bad I almsot saw my brain?? bc yeah I'm fucking tired of nanami fosuced episodes she's so annoying oh my god nobody cares about a goddamn egg and much less one coming from her let her die or something pls she's so annoying there's nothing I've learned about her that was not against my own will I'm basically rotting over here 🤒

↳ ep 30 has me thinking Akio has a foot fetish or something 😐 bruh leave utena aloooooone I already know your plans and schemes you're not fooling anyone that's embarrassing for u and also... utena you're not very bright are you.... you start seeing every duelist you face with the same exact car and then when you see akio has the same car you didnt even stop to think about it that 1+1 equals 2 ... girl help yourself 😐

↳ yet again another nanami focused ep 😐😐😐😐😐 even though I do understand her better now I still don't find her particularly enjoyable to watch, call me a woman hater but like. idk she's still a bit annoying to me (but touga is straight up evil and is manipulating her so I feel bad for feeling like that tho.....)

↳ ok last 2 eps to go but listen. I thought the akio duel would have happened much sooner, maybe on ep 33 max but well didn't this age well lmao ngl, it did seem a bit too slow paced for my personal taste but also I feel like there's a certain level of drama that comes with slowing the pace down....

↳ aaaaaa yall I'm kinda 😢😭 over the ending omg........... even though it took the best of me to keep going in some parts I still enjoyed the ending aaaaa I thought i wouldnt really like it bc I just usually dont enjoy this type of ending but stil 😢😢😢😢 wait for me utena 😭😭😭😭😭😭😭 girl I cried and then anthy walking in the end god utena and anthy holding hands 😭😭😭😭 akio can suck my dick

there's obviously many things I've missed or that I kinda didnt really pay attendance to so please dont take this serious, I was just writing as I watched the episodes so it's more like a thought compilation than anything, still I can see why there's many essays written about it and why it is held as a masterpiece by so many people

#g.txt

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ladyloveandjustice · 5 years

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Thoughts on Utena: Blooming Rose of Deepest Black (THE MUSICAL)

Saw the Utena black rose musical and it was great! did a ton of cool things and additions to the arc. Gonna list my favorites.

-They did this really cool thing where when the Black Rose duelists were on stage the person they took the sword from was on stage too and Utena would be fighting both of them (and sometimes they would cross swords with each other too). You’d have both duelists saying things and going into their issues at the same time, so you could see how they mirrored each other. This REALLY paid off at the end when Utena was fighting Mikage, Dios showed up and Mikage was able to see him and was fighting both of them. The theme of duality and parallels between people was just emphasized super well.

-It is WAY more obvious in the musical Shiori has feelings back for Juri (but is expressing them in a truly fucked up way because she thinks she can’t keep Juri’s attention unless she has power over her) than it was in the show. While she and Juri are fighting Utena near the end, they both just kind of have a breakdown and Shiori lets her vulnerability actually show, they pull close to each other and straight up kiss (!!) then they both break away frantically with Juri saying “I don’t believe in miracles” and Shiori saying “I believe in miracles”, honestly I’d have to watch the whole thing again to give a full breakdown, but it was really interesting.

-Shiori’s actress was SO GOOD, she could alternate between sickeningly sweet and truly unhinged, you could just always FEEL she was a second from losing it. Akio did really well at giving me the creeps in every single scene as well.

-Like in the last musical, Saionji’s dorkiness is amped up in a way that makes him pretty fun to watch despite still being hot garbage, my favorite bit was when Utena knocks on the door while he’s living with Wakaba, he just STRAIGHT UP IS TOO INEPT TO FIGURE OUT WHERE TO HIDE in his panic, and poor Wakaba has to frustratedly shove him into a hiding place. Also, he later pretends to be a statue when Juri sees him. Also at one point Miki and Juri just straight up shove him out of the way, such is their disdain, it’s great.

-during said incident where Utena comes to visit Wakaba, Wakaba not only does the “I’M PRAYING! I’M VERY RELIGIOUS!” thing but also pretends she was “practicing transforming like a superhero” and yells “HENSHIN!” Utena offers her Anthy’s casserole which she says “tastes like the inside of a kendo mask” wow how could she NOT want it when you sell it like that Utena.

- the musical also gets more into the fallout of Wakaba’s duel! At the end of it, Utena cradles Wakaba in her arms, sobbing and shouting “WHO WOULD DO THIS? UNFORGIVEABLE!” Afterward, she’s worried Wakaba isn’t coming to school and isn’t answering her when she knocks on her dorm door, and says “I’m sure like the others she doesn’t remember the duel, I wonder if it has something to do with Saionji coming back.” (WOW BABY MADE AN OBVIOUS CONNECTION! I’M SO PROUD OF HER! no i really am)

but then Wakaba comes to visit with her own (better than Anthy’s of course) casserole all cheerful and Utena’s like “oh i didn’t have to worry!” (oh honey why must you always accept everything at face value) and they sing this WHOLE CHEESY SONG about the power of friendship while Anthy just sits there with her empty glassy eyed smile CLEARLY DYING INSIDE but near the end Utena nudges her into participating and she seems to kinda start to enjoy it, because she keeps singing it even while going to sit beside Akio on the couch and he looks SO ANNOYED.

-THEY INCLUDE THE NANAMI COW PLOT BECAUSE HOW COULD THEY NOT. There’s a part where Utena asks Miki why he won’t just tell her and he’s like “well she’s so confident now!” and it’s a genuinely funny asshole moment from him, LIKE LACK OF OUTWARD CONFIDENCE WAS EVER NANAMI’S PROBLEM.

I guess the main nitpick I have about the musical(s) is Nanami’s role IS pretty much completely reduced to comic relief, and the cow thing is her only real plotline in this- I was kinda hoping they’d fold her first duel into the Black Rose arc since it’d be pretty easy to, just have her be Touga’s duelist, but alas (I can see why they didn’t, it’d be a time crunch). Her arc was one of my favorites in the anime, so its a shame. Like yeah, a large part of her screentime were the comic relief episodes, but even those often gave us a look at the underlying insecurities that drove her. Even the cow episode has that sequence where she dreamed that now that she was fully a cow, her brother was sending her to the slaughterhouse. It showed that she was (rightly) terrified her brother would discard her at the slightest provocation, and was well aware of how he was. But even that part wasn’t in the musical.

There WAS a great moment however, when she ascended as student council president and Miki’s like “uhhhh are you a duelist? since when” and she was like “yeah I dueled Utena Tenjou last time” and looked at the audience and is like “JUST BECAUSE YOU DIDN’T SEE IT DOESN’T MEAN IT DIDN’T HAPPEN” so that at least confirms her arc still takes place in the canon of the musical it’s all just offscreen lol. I love that Nanami has the ability to break the fourth wall, she also thanks the stagehand at one point. There’s also an ongoing arc between her and Wakaba of all people, she kind of bullied her in the first musical, but in this one she got jealous of Wakaba during the moment she was “special” and tried competing with her as she sang. Then Wakaba successfully berated her into CARRYING A SETPIECE OFFSTAGE so they could change scenes.

- Anthy remains fantastic, she still has that super-lowkey creepy laugh that she did when Utena asked if the projector was her brother. You could also just REALLY see how uncertain and guilty she was about the whole Mamiya thing, and at the end there’s this part where while Akio is talking to her about her role in all of it, Utena’s running around looking for her, and then Anthy finally runs to her, and Utena says “I’ve got you” while standing behind her and kinda cradling her in that possessive/princely pose and Anthy just has this thousand yard terrified stare that’s full of guilt and conflict and a million other things and it cuts to black and it’s SO UNSETTLING, I got chills.

Anyway yeah, it’s a FANTASTIC show uttely fully of love for the story and good understanding of its themes, and I can’t wait to watch it again, there’s a million little things I missed or can’t remember enough to post about here, so maybe next time I see it I’ll try writing down some more stuff right after.

#revolutionary girl utena #black rose musical #anthy himemiya #utena tenjou #wakaba shinohara #nanami kiryuu #kyouichi saionji #shiori takatsuki #juri arisugawa #miki kaoru #musicals

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iztarshi · 5 years

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Black Rose Musical 3

Ouch. Anthy gets included in the cute song about staying up all night to watch movies together, but still has to leave to spend her Saturday night with Akio. “Even if you chase a lie for love you can find comfort in your friends”... not Anthy, not just yet.

(Translator’s note: Keiyaku means contract)

Uh huh. We just had to get a Death Note joke in there.

At first I thought Akio didn’t have much presence outside the choreography, but he gains it as the musical goes on. He’s doing a good job playing mephistopheles in Mikage’s story.

Nanami finding out what a cowbell is being thrown in along with the other wrap ups to more serious stories is good comic relief, but it really does cement her as the comic relief.

Her anxiety about Touga seems to be forgotten... although I guess that can’t be wrapped up without a Touga actor, and she didn’t do anything related to it anyway.

Drawing the parallel between Anthy now and Utena in her coffin, as well as implying Utena can draw it, is an interesting choice. But it does explain why Utena’s looking for help for her. Come to think of it, Touga drew the parallel last time by telling Utena she was chasing her past self in Himemiya. It’s much more starkly said where the anime hints and lets Utena herself remain much more unconscious of where her own impulse is coming from.

#blooming rose of deepest black #actual liveblogging

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wlwkiryuu · 6 years

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nanami is a closeted lesbian

this was a theory of mine i used to have just minor evidence for, but after i tried to search up that evidence to compile i realized i actually have a LOT more than i bargained for! so heres ALL the evidence i have so far under the cut :’)

(also please note that i am adding my own personal experiences as a lesbian to this to derive this headcanon, so as they say: your mileage may vary! this is just for fun although i certainly wouldn’t put it past ikuhara + the producers of the show to hint that nanami isn’t straight.)

OK first off nanami seems to have a crush on miki waaayyy back in the sunlit garden prelude, when he's first introduced. but then she gets jealous when it turns out he’s too busy crushing on anthy.

she then decides to do everything she can in that one episode (snails. garter snake. octopus. you know the one) to get anthy out of the picture,

but then eventually it turns into her getting obsessed with utena and anthy themselves rather than getting them out of the way between her and miki.

compare nanami trying to humiliate anthy in front of miki vs her trying to ardently spy on utena and anthy to the point where she knows their schedules in order to sneak that curry into their class. it’s because of her own personal vendetta against them at this point. and THEN compare THAT to nanami trying to warn utena about akio in season 3 near the series finale even though there was literally nothing that required her to do that.

what's even more interesting is that nanami’s repeatedly been said to be one who never gets her own hands dirty when she’s up to no good; and yet in regards to utena and anthy?

she’s DEFINITELY more than willing to get her hands dirty. these two are just that special enough for her to be worthy of her attention.

(and even after touga is out of the picture—that is, once he’s basically revealed himself as the manipulative asshole that he was towards his sister all along—utena’s still deemed worthy of attention by nanami, who goes so far as to warn her about akio, which is...hmm! interesting!)

and what's even more worth mentioning on top of this is that whenever nanami humiliates someone? she usually succeeds in it! a prime example would be keiko in her black rose episode. even at the end, she just comes crawling back to nanami. but utena and anthy...they really end up testing nanami to the bone. and of course, that’s what makes their dynamics with nanami so interesting!

but more on that later. the main point here is that this is one of the first (if not the first) times nanami’s bullying has ended up hurting her rather than her victims. and it consequently opens up nanami’s eyes. she begins to regard these girls in a whole other way, on her own footing. which is kind of a major step in her making tensions with her brother reach a peak, until the season 3 arc comes crashing down on her. this makes her eventually realize she will never be able to see touga in/be with touga in the same way ever again, causing her to resolve to cut ties with one of the only men she has a eminent relationship with.

buuut back to the miki episode. notice nanami’s word choice when she praises miki! pride of the school. almost like she's inclined to like/settle for miki because of this, because she considers herself a pride of the school as well. she focuses more on his status and supposed superiority than anything; that’s the kind of thing nanami’s after/the kind of status she thinks makes her better than others as well. and you know who else she/the rest of the student body considers a pride of the school...?

yep! this asshole! and obviously she can't fulfill being loved that way with her brother bc a) she’s explicitly screamed and shoved him away when he tried to make an advance on her because she knows that kind of relationship is not right and b) her devotion to him to the point where she completely ignores other guys is a product of her idealization of men + compulsory heterosexuality.

(for clarification: touga is saying the top half after nanami pushes him away when he tries to advance on her, and nanami is saying the bottom half).

and here we have obvious proof that nanami does NOT want him as a partner and NEVER wanted him like that all along. so what am i trying to get at here? that she KNOWS touga kiryuu is unattainable. a significant aspect of compulsory heterosexuality is getting crushes on/idolizing guys who are idealized/unattainable. you can't get the guy anyways, so it's both “proof” that you're straight, and no one can say you never acted on that “crush” because getting that guy is impossible anyways.

this matches the theme in revolutionary girl utena surrounding the generalization/idealization of men by women forced into compulsory hetereosexuality perfectly (i mean miki’s literally called a “prince” because he has all these “ideal” noble qualities: rich, kind, good-looking, honest, talented, good grades/prodigy) and honestly provides a great parallel to utena and her “prince” (i say “prince” and not simply akio because touga toys with this idea as well in order to make utena lose her duel with him in episode 11!)

you know that scene where anthy’s wearing the dress nanami gave her and she watches it get wet and tear away at anthy’s clothes? you know, the classic introductory oh shit, nanami’s actually a huge asshole moment?

yeah, so upon rewatching that scene i realized the entire scene PLUS the part where utena rescues anthy and starts dancing with her is cut in between in various places by nanami’s commentary:

so its safe to say this whole scene is from nanami’s point of view.

...yeah. NANAMI’S point of view. and its ALSO worth mentioning that this is the first time nanami’s ever seen or heard of utena at all. thus begins our closeted disaster femme icon’s first taste of lesbianism.

oh and of course, the iconic scene from nanami’s egg where this happens.

ok WOW lots of good stuff here. yes, on the surface level, of course, the specific moment in context is where nanami confuses preferring to have a girl as a child to preferring girls romantically. but then again, it’s not like nanami actually laid an egg. revolutionary girl utena’s metaphor soup! there’s more to things than just face value.

what i’ve seen as the most universally accepted interpretation of this episode is that it’s about puberty, and specifically, the taboos involving menstruation. and of course, this completely makes sense! egg motif? check. tsuwabuki literally mentioning that nanami has to attend a health class? check. the episode starting out with a dream where nanami is a child, then paralleled throughout the rest of the episode with current, teenager nanami? check. touga talking about “eggs” disparagingly? check. the episode is about puberty, maturation of feelings, and adolescence, meaning that discussing sexuality is really not too far of a stretch in an episode that pretty much covers puberty in general! it totally matches the whole “coming of age” theme in both this episode AND the series (albeit it’s done in more serious undertones in the non-nanami bits of the show).

and you know what’s even more interesting? when touga hints that nanami liking girls is wrong, she doesn’t immediately jump to the fact that she likes guys as her defense. rather, she jumps to her specifically loving touga as her defense. and as i pointed out earlier, she knows she doesn’t want touga romantically. miki whom?

not to mention this gem:

...yeah. nanami’s first time seeing the “eggs” in question being put to use is by guys, and she’s visibly disgusted/horrified by it. not subtle at ALL, ikuhara.

and what’s MORE that i realized just from this one iconic episode? the alien motif.

ah, nanami’s incredibly absurd imagine spots. gotta love those! and they all fit a particular theme: alienation. and it’s honestly really odd to think about how nanami has this constant fear of alienation throughout this episode (and arguably throughout the series); she’s rich, popular, and consequently has the whole student body in the palm of her hand. and yet she STILL believes she’s not normal. really kind of parallels being closeted/”hiding something,” doesn’t it? and it’s cleverly referred to again upon nanami’s big arc in season 3, when her entire world comes crashing down as she believes her and touga aren’t actually siblings.

(the scene in question is right when keiko slaps nanami because she tells touga that “he shouldn’t go out with a girl like her [keiko].”)

ostracism/fear of ostracism seems to be a popular theme for nanami throughout the series.

so in this episode, nanami soon transitions from imagining being alienated to being behind her peers instead.

it’s constantly established that nanami only has eyes for her brother; the “only one she loves” is him. she’s never shown interest for any other guy, which is paralleled especially well in keiko’s black rose episode; nanami’s vicious attitude towards keiko manifests because keiko turns out to have eyes for the only one nanami has eyes for.

keiko’s the one acting “normally”; nanami’s the one seen as overtly possessive.

and, of course, knowing the nature of nanami’s character, her idolization of her brother is painted to such absurd extremes that she essentially shows she absolutely refuses to find another relationship. she’s in a “fairy-tale world”; she refuses to grow up, which even her brother admits at times.

another common aspect among closeted lesbians is the feeling that we’re “late bloomers” for failing to find any sort of interest in men. and so, thus, the line mentioned earlier that describes nanami’s fear, “being late compared to most people,” could very easily fit into this context.

and regarding tsuwabuki? yeah, this just sums it up perfectly.

miki’s so brutal in this episode, i love him. brutal but accurate!

and then, of course, we get that sweet, sweet confirmation again:

immediately followed by miki spitting out the truth yet again.

oh and interestingly enough, even with tsuwabuki, where she blatantly treats him like her personal servant, she still doesn’t want to let him go; particularly, she doesn’t want to let him go to other girls.

even with a (give or take) 10/11 year old child, nanami refuses to acknowledge him interacting with another girl. simply because he’s a guy.

an extremely common and integral part of nanami’s character is her constant desire for acceptance (lots of episodes showcase this! namely nanami’s egg and cowbell of happiness). she’s a “late bloomer” who shows no romantic desire for men whatsoever; therefore, she fulfills this criteria for “normalcy” by having literally every other relationship with guys except for romantic, as shown with touga, tsuwabuki, and even saionji and miki to some extent. but for the most part —it’s shown with touga and tsuwabuki, simply because they’re the most obvious examples of non-romantic relationships: siblings and a literal elementary schooler. it’s kind of funny, almost; it’s like nanami thinks “having relationships with guys” is just one of many things she’s obligated to cross off on her checklist for societal acceptance, and literally goes in the most roundabout way to achieve it without realizing what it even means (i.e., romantic relationships with a guy, not just a relationship in general), and completely failing.

and all of this leads me, of course, to the final aspect to analyze: nanami’s relationship with utena.

yeah, it’s pretty safe to say they don’t get along on the best of terms at first. nanami even tried to kill utena during their first duel!

so it’s incredibly interesting to see their relationship evolve after the events of that skirmish.

regarding their first duel in particular, the duel lyrics have a LOT in them to unpack.

My eternal self The eternal stranger Two relations Two births Scales of mystery Human constellation

“my eternal self” versus “the eternal stranger” brings up some interesting parallels. touga seems to be the eternal stranger, with whom nanami believes she is closer to than anyone else, and yet she seems completely unable to figure out his inner workings and who he really is as a person. no matter what she’d like to or not like to admit, touga is and always has been a complete mystery to her. this “human constellation” can thus never be truly connected. but you know who else is a mystery to nanami?

yep! the boy-girl of ohtori herself. you have to consider this isn’t only a duel provoked by touga; it’s a duel with utena. a duel between nanami and utena. their relationship is bound to be mentioned in the song as well. which is exactly why i believe nanami says this right after utena technically “wins” the duel by slicing nanami’s rose off.

nanami’s essentially setting herself up for a long, long rivalry spanning the rest of the series with those five words. it seems like nanami’s more interested in seeing what makes utena tick than her own brother, whom she claims to be the “only one she loves.” simply challenging utena isn’t enough; she has to understand her in order to defeat her. and this ideology is called back to later in nanami’s second duel with utena!

nanami ends up giving one hell of a fight the second time around. despite only fighting her once prior, she ends up knowing all of utena’s moves beforehand and dodging them. that’s how well she knows utena’s fighting techniques.

now lets look at the nature of the duel itself. what exactly makes nanami want to challenge utena a second time?

individuality! distinction! that’s what nanami wants. she dreads the thought of being “one more fly in the swarm.” now that she’s discovered her relationship with touga’s been lying on top of a foundation of lies the whole time, her world comes crashing down. she doesn’t want to adore her brother anymore. she wants to surpass him, and so, essentially, escape her problems. and so, in a sort of roundabout way since utena was the reason behind nanami’s meddling and tensions with her brother, she believes defeating utena will be the key to defeating all of her problems.

and, spoiler alert: it isn’t. the fact that nanami isn’t able to win this duel is especially important. even after she’s able to jump the hurdle of her brother, she fails to jump the hurdle of utena. she wants to “surpass everything,” that is, leave the old her behind. and at first it seems like she’s succeeding to leave everything behind...except for utena.

touga serves as the last link nanami has towards any sort of affection towards a guy. and in this duel, she straight up BREAKS it by admitting there was nothing between them at all.

and THEN utena asks if nanami feels better. even though she, like...literally just lost the duel. given utena’s character it’s probably just her naivete showing through, but given the underlying messages this series is ridden with, it probably refers to how nanami “defeating” touga was FAR more important than her actually defeating utena—that is, she never needed to defeat utena in the first place to feel better.

so, what we get from this is: a) nanami succeeds in breaking her bond towards touga, but b) fails to break that bond with utena.

🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔

and of course the lyrics here in this dueling song as well:

You, me, our nature Our nature, our nature Free will and existence

who’s it about? the nature of the kiryuu siblings? the nature of nanami and utena as they act as foils? the ambiguity of the song is what really makes it interesting. not to mention—free will and existence. nanami wants out of this oppressive system. and she believes utena is the key to it (and, well, she’s not wrong!). take of that what you will symbolically, metaphorically, ikuharaesquely, etc.

and that free will and existence line just leads me to believe that nanami’s a foil to anthy in regards to utena, since free will and existence is essentially what utena fights for anthy to achieve in the end, and what anthy desperately desires: autonomy. and, so, given that these two are foils in regards to utena...well, we all know what anthy is in regards to utena.

...yeah. exactly. imagery/parallelism they didn’t absolutely HAVE to do, but did regardless.

and, so, by the end, even nanami’s seemed to have caught that inescapable sense of fondness for utena. she comes entirely out of good will on her own accord to warn utena of akio, and doesn’t even consider giving up when utena brushes her advice aside.

she’s insistent on drilling into utena’s head that she should get out of that house—even though doing so wouldn’t benefit nanami at all. utena promptly points out how uncharacteristic of nanami this is:

to which nanami immediately snaps back with:

nanami’s essentially admitting that utena’s the one who’s permanently altered her character and made her much less of a selfish brat (although she still has a loooonnggg way to go, obviously) than she was prior to the series canon. utena’s the cause for everything, direct or indirect: clashing with touga, getting over her brief crush on miki, developing a sense of empathy while transitioning from a desire for social acceptance to a desire for social independence...it’s all been catalyzed by utena at some point.

so, in brief?

utena revolutionized nanami’s world (see, i can’t even look at that sentence without thinking about how gay it sounds).

OKAY, so first off: thank you so so much for reading this far! i want to get into my last point of contention now, which is a super subtle conversation between utena and nanami near the end of the series but speaks VOLUMES, but before i do, i just wanna show two marginally interesting screencaps that fit this theory suspiciously well because i really want to save the best part for last.

exhibit a:

nanami + physical contact’s only ever been shown in regards to her brother. and yet the second utena comes into the mix...well, despite how trivial this scene is, the reaction is pretty satisfying.

exhibit b: nanami’s reaction to juri in the video game.

just tattoo i love women onto your forehead next time, nanami.

now on to what is possibly my favorite exchange in the entire series—that’s how much i love the underlying subtleties in this scene. utena brings up having “blood type-B” when talking to nanami in said scene. why? because just a few episodes earlier...

nanami finds out touga’s blood type never correlated genetically with her family’s.

which, later on in the episode, she ends up telling utena (and the fact that at this point she’s trusting utena enough to even marginally tell her what this whole mess is about is gratifying in itself).

so basically, the importance of this conversation?

(for clarification: utena’s saying the first half, and nanami’s saying the dialogue on the bottom-most screencap).

it shows the COMPLETE 180 nanami and utena’s relationship has gone through. misunderstandings and petty arguments and hostilities into something that’s blossomed through adversity to a relationship of mutual understanding. and, it feels like, for the first time in either of their lives, they’re actually in the loop on something, rather than being hopelessly confused in a maze of the bells and whistles of student council, the mystery behind the eternity duelists seek at the arena, the end of the world, the complete enigma that is touga kiryuu, and can finally just interact in this sort of liberating way that shows both of them at their best with one another.

and what i love about this is that nanami doesn’t get mad at utena. she doesn’t snap about how she spoke too soon about the whole incident. it’s questionable if she even cares about the whole incident now, considering the ties she broke off with touga at the climax of her second duel. rather, she knows what utena’s jokingly pointing at, and the two are in a mutual understanding of how much they’ve been through together in the hellscape that is ohtori academy.

but, the BEST part of this entire exchange? the part that shows probably the first time nanami’s ever gotten actual happiness from someone, something that shows that she’s finally past the superficial happiness from her unwitting adoration of touga that’s essentially been crumbled to dust by the end of her character arc, allowing her to finally set aside pleasing others and end up potentially discovering herself, far from when she first met utena?

nanami’s final reaction to her.

#revolutionary girl utena #nanami kiryuu #utena #rgu #let nanami...........have a gf..........2k17 to forever...........#meta #my meta

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