#doctor who discourse

[gayleviticus]

as much as i do dislike the chibnall era on a fundamental level, i think that my problem w it is just that like... it's not well made? but i don't think it fails to be doctor who in any sense, which i feel like is the tack a lot of pro-rtd anti-moff (and to an extent anti-chib, but i think moff gets it worse bc ppl just did not watch the chib era) criticism takes. it feels like people just constantly criticise the moff era for not being rtd who (it's too focused on the doctor, we don't see companion families, the companions aren't as down to earth, modern earth is no longer a consistent setting w continuity etc). and sure, some of these criticisms are legit in themselves, and a degree of comparison is fair, i do it w the chib era, but i dunno, when it feels like there's a whole laundry list of moffat era 'problems' that boil down to 'its not the rtd era' it feels like a lot of feverent rtd good moffat bad criticism is implicitly pushing for a very narrow and limited view of what doctor who should be.

#doctor who #doctor who discourse #chibnall critical #pro moffat

[a-random-whovian7]

*Doctor Who Spoilers*

So the 60th Anniversary specials have just finished and, for the most part, they were pretty good. David Tennant was as good as ever, the villains felt far more threatening than in recent years and Wild Blue Yonder was pretty close to perfect imo. But something has been lurking in the back of my mind since the final scene of The Giggle. Something that just hasn't let me enjoy the specials as much as I could

My problem is they fucked up 10's arc.

Now, as a person who absolutely loves the 10th Doctor’s era and story arc, 14 felt like a complete smack in the face. 10 was the most human Doctor, and his story is a brilliant deconstruction of who the Doctor is. Yes, he always tried to do good, but his hubris, vanity and selfishness led to his downfall, all of which was spearheaded by him losing Rose, driving Martha away, having to wipe Donna's memory and in the end having to sacrifice himself for Wilf. Was it tragic and sad? Yes. But not everything needs a happy ending. The fact that 10's mistakes came back to bite him was one of the many reasons why I loved that era so much, as whilst he was redeemed by sacrificing himself, his regeneration still held such an emotional impact due to the fact that he'd lost so much and had fallen from grace. It was sad, but it worked. It had weight because it was permanent. It was a unique arc in Doctor Who that should have been left alone.

But then 14 and the specials came along and kind of undid that. Turns out Donna was fine, she just needed to let the Metacrisis go. Turns out all 10 really needed was a holiday. Now he's had a happy ending, just relaxing whilst 15 goes and does all the hard work. Plus, it now means we have an excuse to call back David Tennant whenever we like (look, I love David Tennant and hold nothing against him, it's more the fact that Doctor Who has been blatantly using him as a crutch since 2019). The bi-regeneration also kind of robbed 14 of accepting death and allowing Ncuti to immediately take centre stage. 10's arc just feels cheapened in hindsight, as the weight of his actions isn't really reflected in him getting an "everything was right again" ending.

Of course, it's not all bad, and I'm probably just being incredibly picky. People seem to be really happy that 10 had a happy ending, and I wish I could fully enjoy that too. If we absolutely had to have this ending, then this is the best possible way to have it, it could have been done far more lazily. After all, not everything needs to be depressing and serious. Plus, I did like the specials overall and the fact that David Tennant managed to add more emotional weight to the Flux arc and play a far more experienced and mature Doctor. RTD screamed trans rights, mocked modern Internet culture and gave us the creepiest episode in years, all of which is absolutely fantastic. I just wish that RTD hadn't added more onto 10's arc and tied up the loose ends that didn't need tying up.

#doctor who spoilers #doctor who #doctor who 60th anniversary #rtd #rtd2 #rtd2 era #10th doctor #14th doctor #15th doctor #david tennant #russell t davies #ncuti gatwa #donna noble #doctor donna #doctor who discourse #tenth doctor

[lealu]

i am CONVINCED that in the newest dr who special 'Wild Blue Yonder'…the ‘villains' are the the same, more advanced creatures as the one in 'Midnight' (s4e10)! the copying, the taking over…the feeding on evil. please tell me i am not the only one who saw this parallel.

#it’s so well written horror #dr who #doctor who 60th annivesary #10th doctor #14th doctor #dr who meta #meta talk #doctor who #david tennant #cathrine tate #dr who 60th anniversary #dr who fandom #doctor who discourse

[heres-the-marvel-tea]

Possibly unpopular opinion, but I don’t think the Doctor ever stopped loving Rose. He moved on from her, as people do, but he didn’t stop loving her. And quite frankly, I hate the idea that he stopped loving her in his eleventh incarnation because “that part of him died” because it goes against the basic tenet of regeneration—that he is basically the same man. If he can stop loving someone just because he regenerated, then he has become someone else, and I just—can’t deal with that. I think regeneration means his face looks different, and he likes different foods and dislikes other foods that maybe he used to like, and he has a different favorite color and wears different clothes, but his very core is the same—he loves the same people, has the same values, cares about the same things. Regeneration is so much sadder if the only thing the Doctor shares with his previous regenerations is a name, and it’s just as sad to me that people consider love to be so interchangeable—and that includes being able to fall out of love so easily. With this, please keep in mind that, as an asexual, perhaps my idea of being in love differs from others, but I am not talking about having that feeling of butterflies for the rest of your life—I’m talking about a steadfast commitment, a concept deeper than an emotion, and…just being soulmates.

(And yes, there is a deeper conversation about how feelings fluctuate but there is a core concept of love that remains steadfast, that being in love feels differently at different stages, et cetera, et cetera, but that’s a discussion for a different time)

#DoctorRose #tenrose #ninerose #tentoorose #doctor who discourse #doctor who

[thatbiologist]

I know this is controversial in the fandom to mention this. But I absolutely love the concept of looms. 

For anyone who doesn’t know, the looms are the asexual method in which Time Lords reproduce. Where multiple members of their Great House donate strands of their own genetic material which is then woven into a new person. Therefore, between Time Lords of the same Great House they are all “cousins” of one another. 

It’s such an alien concept and it makes the Time Lords actually feel alien, rather than just being two-hearted humans. But that’s just my opinion.

#doctor who #lungbarrow #looms #doctor who discourse

[of-monsters-and-werewolves]

Hearing latest Doctor Who discourse is like having constant deja vu. Like I'm sure we've had this conversation before. "Nobody ever talks about this in the RTD era, they just like to shit on Chibnall" and then nine times out of ten, it's something I've seen discussed several times over the last 17 years.

#doctor who #doctor who discourse #doctor who fandom

[rentalboos]

whenever a showrunner does something for their era, it's somehow an insult to the one before and the one coming after, and your favorite doctor and their mum and never has one of them complained (except chris Eccleston, for entirely different disrespect that people for YEARS didn't care about and instead shamed him for "not appreciating the fandom", I am getting so tired of it ngl

#sigh #doctor who discourse #ig #this fandom is awfully exhausting

[aquariusdeanw]

I won’t hear any discourse about Doctor Who being homophobic in 2005 when they had a gay show-runner / writer and when Jack Harkness literally helped so many young queers with how his character was represented on screen

#TIKTOK SHUT UP #IM GATEKEEPING #doctor who discourse #doctor who

[master-missysversion]

Controversial take but I honestly think a lot of people use "the writing was bad" as an excuse to hate on 13 without feeling guilty or people getting on their case. Like its certainly not everyone who says this, but the way so many people speak, it comes across like they didn't really pay attention to the episodes (if they watched them at all) and just say "oh but the writing was bad" because it's what everyone else says

#is there a tag for like #doctor who discourse

[discoscoob]

Personally I think immediately relating the word “skinny” to ED is more worrying than skinny jokes.

#people constantly try to equate ‘skinny shaming’ to fat shaming and it’s simply not the same thing #skinny privilege is a real thing #fat privilege is not #therefore ‘skinny shaming’ and fat shaming will never be equal #plus ‘skinny man’ is neither said in a positive or negative manner #it’s just used descriptively #she could’ve said ‘white man’ ‘tall man’ anything else descriptive #and this is a psa from someone who’s often been told to ‘eat more’ because they’re ‘too skinny’ #doctor who discourse

[butchthirteen]

okay the other thing is like. can we think about why, in-universe and out, one might choose to have the doctor return to a fan favorite regeneration and a regeneration where both the character and actor were reluctant to move on? and (especially in the context of new who being about the doctor's trauma) can we think about why one might then bring in the new exciting regeneration and have that regeneration extend comfort to the prior one?

like people keep treating it like tennant and gatwa are like. competing. but it's not a competition, it's a collaboration. it's a meeting of old and new, it's a passing of the torch. and it's honestly really really beautiful to me.

#doctor who #dw spoilers #fourteenth doctor #fifteenth doctor #meta #discourse #rtd era 2 #i'm not saying there's like. no room for criticism and i'm not saying everything was executed perfectly or anything #and i think it's fair to look at it and be like 'i don't like that' or 'that wasn't executed very well' #but i also feel like some people are seeing what they expect to see if that makes sense #i don't know if you just think about it as a physical manifestation of a system moment it makes perfect sense. hope this helps

[a-random-whovian7]

Me @ RTD and Moffat after seeing the Doctor make a heartfelt promise to keep Ruby safe in the new trailer:

#yep #she's a goner #doctor who #rtd2 #steven moffat #ncuti gatwa #15th doctor #ruby sunday #doctor who series 14 #doctor who memes #doctor who spoilers #doctor who discourse

[rosenkranz-isnt-dead]

Moffat was so real for this

#and jenna's name appearing in the credits first #that was a boss move #i wonder if he saw the 'clara who' discourse and did this just to piss off clara haters lmao #say whatever you want about moffat but i respect him for that #doctor who #death in heaven #clara oswald #jenna coleman

[leikeliscomet]

You think Martha deserved better because you think her being attracted to Ten is some moral failing she needed to correct I think Martha deserved better bc the misogynoir in S3 in the show and fandom was so rampant that Freema Agyeman, other Black and mixed actors and fans are dealing with the repercussions over a decade later we're not the same

#I do think Martha deserved better bc she did but it has nothing to do with the crush #i used think the crush was the issue but honestly how it affects “Martha discourse” is worse bc it overshadows everything #there are so many things from S3 to unpack but its everyday “she was obsessed with Ten” like there's bigger fish to fry abeg #martha jones #doctor who series 3 #doctor who series three #doctor who #doctor who fandom #fandom antiblackness #black representation #dr who fandom #dw fandom

[headcanonsandmore]

At this point, I feel like Thirteen's era got criticised no matter what happened during it.

Some fun standalone sci-fi stories? It wasn't being ambitious.

Some fun standalone stories with an interconnected season-long story-arc? This is too ambitious and no-one could follow it.

A serialised season with tons of interesting and fun plots, new characters as well as deepening character arcs? This is literally the most complicated thing ever; no-one could possibly enjoy this.

Characters of different ages from places outside of London and from diverse backgrounds and family dynamics? Pandering.

Canonically queer characters who fall in love steadily over time, as their friendship deepens? This relationship came out of nowhere and is also pandering.

#doctor who #thirteenth doctor #discourse #thasmin #yasmin khan #yaz #ryan sinclair #graham o'brien #dan lewis

[of-monsters-and-werewolves]

This current DW discourse about whether Thasmin counts as queerbaiting or not feels a bit... strange to me. Maybe that's the wrong word, but there's a couple of issues with it as it's being discussed atm.

Firstly, there's a severe lack of nuance and understanding in regards to why many of us feel baited after The Power of the Doctor specifically, and complete uninterest in exploring whether a reflection of the term could be beneficial to our understanding of queer representation. Secondly, there seems to be this idea pervading through that queerbaiting is like the worst thing that can happen regarding queer representation, and it just isn't. Regardless as to whether you call it queerbaiting, or erasure, or some other term, its handling as queer representation deserves to be criticised.

True, it's not the standard form of queerbaiting where it's never officially recognised in-text. But would the term apply if the ship went from text, in this case in Eve and Legends, back into subtext, for Power, and the paratext for the latter did tease, and there was no indication given prior to airing of the ship's absence? I can't think of any notable examples of this situation happening, and I suspect part of the discussion surrounds a lack of other examples to compare it to.

But I know many of us felt we'd been strung along. Fed scraps. We'd already been handed crumbs, but at least beforehand it felt as though there was some care put into it, even if somewhat misguided, on the part of the creators. Now I feel let down.

Call it queerbaiting or not. I'm interested in analysis, not getting bogged down and passive-aggressive as to whether something conforms exactly to one term's criteria cause it's seemingly the only metric that folks have decided matters.

#doctor who #thasmin #dw spoilers #the power of the doctor #potd spoilers #tpotd #potd #dw discourse #doctor who discourse #doctor who fandom