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the-judicial-assistants-notebook · 1 year

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You know, I think what really bugs me about the "Dadworth" dynamic applied to Kay and Edgeworth's relationship is that it usually makes Kay out to be this hyperactive, slight problem child (in the 'stealing and pranking' sense rather than the 'moody and abrasive' sense), occasionally with deep-rooted daddy issues like Edgeworth has, when that's... the opposite of her character.

(This post got away from me, so TL;DR: Kay is a quick-witted and independent young woman who has worked very hard to be both emotionally and practically intelligent enough to be seen as a legitimate successor to her father's legacy. Making her out to be the traits mentioned above, so she functions as Edgeworth's daughter rather than his investigative partner and equal, undermines her character and semi-conflates her with Maya [the deep-rooted issues bit]. Also I don't like it wksgskaj)

Kay is very, very sharp.

The thing about Kay is that she's not actually in the series as much as it feels like she is, which makes it easy for her character to be altered to suit the needs of the story (which I think happens in The Forgotten Turnabout, but I won't talk about that here). She turns up in two cases as herself in AAI (as in, teenager Kay whom we're most familiar with) and shares her role with Gumshoe, Ema and Franziska when she does, lessening her appearances even further. Nevertheless, there are still concrete elements to her personality that we're made aware of right from the beginning, and the first major one which I feel gets overlooked in favour of her hyperactive characterisation is this:

In terms of mainline assistants, I'd consider her the sharpest of all (maybe after Trucy? But I don't remember enough of AJ to comment on that). Yes, she's shown to be reckless and impulsive, but, when it comes to actual investigating and reasoning, she is solid. With Nick and Maya, you sometimes get the impression that they're both fumbling along until Phoenix catches on (most of the time with Maya's usually a little accidental help, and he still has to explain things to her near every time [not Maya's fault. Following Phoenix's reasoning is like being on a rollercoaster in a minecart]), but Kay is very rarely like that with Edgeworth. Within minutes of meeting him, she can predict what he's going to say (or 'steal his lines', as the game puts it), and there are several moments after he uses Logic and is about to explain what he's connected where Kay interrupts with the correct conclusion herself:

Edgeworth: A second Blue Badger that shouldn't exist... Clearly, the true identity of the person underneath is...

Kay: Oh, I know! It's one of the kidnappers, right!?

There's even a point where she tells him off for overexplaining things to her:

Kay: Yeesh, I told you I got it! Do you feel the need to explain everything!?

And, near the end of their first case together, he acknowledges that's she's generally quite quick:

Kay: OK, what should I re-create first?

Edgeworth: ...You haven't figured it out yet?

Kay: Heh, maybe I have, and maybe I haven't.

Even if you don't take these points into consideration, the fact that she comes up with a new way to use Little Thief, and knows how to use it at all actually, shows you that she's a really intelligent girl! Continuing on a bit from the point I made earlier about her being brash, Kay may be reckless, but she isn't irresponsible. Whenever she rushes into situations, she doesn't expect other people to come save her; she's quite assured that she can and will get herself out of them on her own, and, if she needs help, she asks for it in advance. She treats Edgeworth less like her guardian and more like her investigative partner:

Kay: I didn't get permission to enter Allebahst... so we're going to go gather whatever info we can over on the Babahlese side, OK!?

Edgeworth: Alright, I'm counting on you two.

Kay: Right, and I'm counting on you and Ms. von Karma to sniff out clues in Allebahst!

...

Edgeworth: A number of pieces connect in a very complicated way in this case... It's almost enough to make one completely mentally exhausted.

Kay: Let's not over-complicate matters, OK, Mr. Edgeworth? We've been so focused, like a laser, on only what seems strange and out of place... it's no wonder nothing's clicked and we haven't unlocked anything yet. But, if we think things through calmly, the answer should come to us!

There's an independence to her proactiveness that kind of forces Edgeworth to meet her on equal grounds, and this too is an element that gets lost when the Dadworth dynamic comes in because it involves making Edgeworth responsible -- or feel responsible -- for her actions and general wellbeing when Kay has never expected nor wanted that. She does things on her own terms, and she walks the path she's chosen by herself:

Edgeworth: Preposterous! On what grounds do you suspect her of such a thing!?

Shih-na: The fact that she calls the Yatagarasu. That in itself is a more elegant proof.

Kay: Ms. Shih-na.

Shih-na: Yes?

Kay: I... have no intention of taking back any of what I've said.

Shih-na: ...?

Kay: I am the Great Thief Yatagarasu. And I refuse to allow some imposter to claim that name as their own! The path of justice that my father pointed me towards... I will walk it the best I can!

Her relationship with Edgeworth works as an inverse to that of Nick and Maya's in the way that, where Nick and Maya have deep respect for one another beneath layers upon layers of playful insults and messing about, Kay outwardly respects Edgeworth first (and expects that respect to be returned) and razes him second -- that, too, never to an extent she wouldn't with anyone else or that crosses a certain boundary. Her messing with Edgeworth is shown to be more an attempt to get him to lighten up or not take himself too seriously than an act of (platonic) intimacy as it is with Nick and Maya (which makes sense because Nick and Maya have spent years together, while she's known Edgeworth for all of two weeks) or genuine obliviousness/silliness (although it definitely sometimes is). This is pretty obvious simply from the fact that she always calls him 'Mr Edgeworth', though she's perfectly comfortable calling Gumshoe and Badd, people whom she is more familiar and comfortable with, 'Gummy' and 'Uncle Badd' respectively. Also Kay, in general, is quite polite? Edgeworth calls something she said rude at one point and she gets insulted, and, when you ask for her opinion, she doesn't go 'What?' or 'What is it?', she specifically says, 'Yes?' (this changes in AAI2, which I promise I'm not discussing here) Upon meeting Oldbag, she has this exchange with her, where Kay chooses a more formal mode of address than what is actually offered:

Oldbag: My name is Wendy Oldbag. But you can call me "Wendy", or "Granny", or whatever suits your fancy.

Kay: Nice to meet you, Ms. Oldbag! I'm Kay Faraday.

She's also had moments where she calls Edgeworth out for being 'tactless', and she's shown to feel very strongly about rudeness throughout the whole game. I'm not saying she isn't mischievous or playful, she very much is, but the point is that she's really quite respectful, and this extends to her relationship with him. Her characterisation in Turnabout Ablaze, where she's considerably more excitable/high-strung than in Kidnapped, seems largely due to them chasing down Calisto Yew. Edgeworth even comments on this:

Edgeworth: Kay, you need to look before you leap. You tend to lose your cool when it comes to anything related to that woman.

Generally, though, you can tell that she was obviously raised with an adherence to certain formalities. She's not looking for another parental figure (because she doesn't need one, which I'll go into after this), but, if she was, she'd make that clear.

Kay's a very straightforward person at heart; she doesn't hide any part of herself, even the part that should be hidden (i.e. the Yatagarasu). There are points where she suggests that Edgeworth reminds her of her father, but, in AAI, she specifically mentions that it's both Edgeworth and Gumshoe who remind her of her father and Detective Badd. It's not about her seeing Edgeworth as a father figure; it's about their and her own dedication to the truth. Even in AAI2, where her comments could be read as leaning more towards the former angle, she doesn't get cut up about him not picking up on that or really paying it much emphasis at all, because it doesn't matter. The fact that he reminds her of Byrne is just that: a fact.

Returning to the point about Kay not needing/wanting another parental figure, I think it's pretty self-explanatory, but to put it succinctly: Kay has the guidance she needs without him.

To put it less succinctly, Edgeworth's possibly the worst candidate to go for for emotional support and guidance in the first place, and by the time she meets him again, she's basically processed her father's passing and has a better handle on herself emotionally than Edgeworth does (not a brag; most characters have higher EQ than Edgeworth); what she wants isn't necessarily closure for Byrne's death in the emotional sense but in the I-want-answers-to-this-mystery-that-will-restore-my-family's-honour sense. You could make the argument that Kay becoming the second Yatagarasu and shaping her entire future around continuing her father's work prove that she isn't over his death, but I don't think that's true and more of a result of conflating her with Maya a bit.

With Maya, becoming the Master isn't something she chooses; it's given to her by Misty and Mia. With Kay, it's the opposite. Kay's decision to become the Yatagarasu and pursue the truth is wholly her own, and her approach to that goal reflects that. While Maya uses her cheery, upbeat attitude to conceal a lot of self-doubt and vulnerability (and Franziska does the same with her hostility), Kay does not. Her cheerfulness is precisely who she is; it's not a mask so much as it is a distraction. It keeps people from looking at her too closely and realising exactly how capable she is, and, while I don't think it's fully intentional (again, she believes in living her life in a straightforward and upfront manner), she does imply that it's sort of her (or the Yatagarasu's) MO:

Kay: Well! By the time everyone notices, it's already gone! That's the Yatagarasu way!

Interestingly enough, this unintentional tactic of using humour and cheeriness as a distraction from her abilities makes her a mirror to Calisto Yew, who also uses her seemingly always light-hearted nature as a disguise for what she's actually capable of (Calisto's joviality is her true self, too, or at least as 'true' as she can get). The difference between them is that Calisto delights in ironically mocking the world around her, whereas Kay finds joy in life itself, and she's stronger for it.

The only part where we see Kay attempt to mask her feelings is when she's a child, and even then she admits that she feels better after crying, which, I believe, led to her becoming more open with her emotions later in life (see how her older self has a teary sprite which makes pretty frequent appearances where her younger self does not). In any case, to me, this shows that she has people in her life already who are helping, and have helped, her confront and process her trauma. She's not looking to Edgeworth to help her make sense of her father's death and she definitely isn't looking for a replacement (again, literally dedicated to continuing her father's [and Badd's] legacy). Whenever Edgeworth even gets close to becoming parental with her, she dismisses it, unless she acknowledges that she is in the wrong:

Edgeworth: ...Kay, it's not good for you to stay up late, you know.

Kay: Yes, gramps!

...

Edgeworth: ...I appreciate your sense of justice, however... I would appreciate it if you wouldn't go running into the heart of any more raging fires.

Kay: Nngh... Yes, Mr. Edgeworth... I'll try...

Despite her buoyancy and bright attitude, Kay is quite firm that she be treated as an adult (she doesn't see her cheeriness as a mark of youth; it's joie de vivre, it's who she is, and that's that), and, throughout the game, she gets annoyed when people don't respect that (her arguments with Lang are largely over how he calls Little Thief a toy and her crow-girl). She holds her own and relies on herself while being unafraid of asking for help.

Anyway, this post has gone on for long enough and I think I've addressed the points I wanted to. I should mention that I realise that a lot of how many people portray/interpret their relationship is validated by AAI2 but that's honestly a discussion for a separate post HAHA I feel like, when it comes to AAI, the father/daughter interpretation can maybe be argued with regards to the way Edgeworth treats her? Honestly, though, I think he'd treat any young lady who suddenly becomes part of his team/responsibility in pretty much the same way. And, like, he drops the ball almost every time he's supposed to give "fatherly" advice because he's just not that great with it/children!! It's actually hilarious HSKSDHSK

Either way, yeah! I just think Kay is actually given a lot less credit than she's due when the Dadworth card gets played and I just! Want better for her!!

#kay faraday #miles edgeworth #ace attorney investigations #EMBARRASSINGLY long post. i want to add that this isnt an attack on anyone who likes the dadworth dynamic!!! it's semi-supported by canon #and like. it's literally fandom wskdhdk do what makes you happy. i just feel like kay gets minimised a bit when it happens (including when #it's done in game) and i just want people to realise that she's not actually like that!! she's actually so smart and rly mature???#oh i want to add that i generally like both aai games i just prefer the first one. i know some people go for a sibling dynamic between them #rather than a father daughter one (which makes sense bc... they have 10 years between them hskddhk) but im an advocate for friendship being #just as important and valid as it would be if it did mimic a family relationship even if it didnt so that doesnt do much for me either #i just think she wants to be seen as an equal to him as any of his other partners would be #oh i didnt mention this in the post but i also feel like people mix her with ema a bit in the future versions of her?#like she becomes snarky and a little sarcastic (or suave/flirty in a roundabout manner if it's a ship post) when her whole thing is being #direct. she tells shih na to her face that 'those sunglasses dont do anything for her so she'll steal them next time' she's great #the snarky sarcasm thing is again ema. not maya or her but ema. and franziska #ok i need to shut up now im done thank u <3

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cassianandfenrysaremyboyos · 3 months

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I'm sorry but this just pisses me off (Not Hunt obviously, but Bryce)

Bryce rant incoming which you can just ignore and I'll probably delete later

But Bryce just puts all the blame on the Asteri. And yes ultimately they are to blame in the larger sense of things. But Bryce plays a direct role in leading them down the path that results in Hunt, Ruhn and Baxian being caught. It was her need to find out Danika's secrets with no thought to the consequences, her idea to go to the Eternal City. And she takes NO personal responsibility for it at all!

Hunt is blaming himself for everything that's happened. Even when it's not his fault at all. When we're in his pov he's constantly drowning in guilt, thinking about how he should of done more, he should of tried harder, he should of been better, how it's all his fault this happened and that his friends suffered.

And then Bryce does none of that. When we're in her pov she doesn't really show any major guilt. I can't think of any times when she blames herself like Hunt does. And I'm not saying she should be wracked with guilt. But a normal person, a good person, will usually feel bad and will feel guilty and blame themselves to some degree when something bad happens and people they care about are hurt, regardless of how big or small they're involvement is, or even if they're not at fault at all, case in point Hunt being wracked with guilt even when it's not his fault.

And to make it worse she acknowledges that Hunt warned them, warned her. But that she disregarded it and would of done it no matter what.

And then she has the audicity to say she doesn't regret it. And she thought they were on the same page. ON THE SAME PAGE!!?? Hunt made it clear in hosab that he didn't want to go down this road again, that he didn't want to get involved. YOU just didn't listen Bryce. And yeah Hunt's an adult, he can make his own decisions and he could of said no and not gone. But of course, OF COURSE!! he wasn't going to let Bryce go down that road alone, because he loves her, and doesn't want anything to happen to her, and wants to protect, so of course he would never desert her. But that doesn't mean he wanted to do it!

For Bryce to be that unaware of Hunt's feelings, when he explicitly stated them. For her to be that disconnected from her mate's feelings that she's surprised that he wasn't really on board is kinda unfathomable to me. Just that complete lack of awareness really does make her look quite selfish/self centered.

Anyway sorry, this post is a mess but I just had to vent

And then when Hunt mentions the consequences he and his friends faced, Bryce makes it about her pain. She's hurt that Hunt mentioned that they suffered. And the worst part is, Hunt then regret's it, he regrets saying something that hurts Bryce, because he cares about her and feelings. And she does not consider his feelings to the same degree

It just pisses me off

#honestly with bryce's lack of feelings of guilt her lack of consideration of other people's feelings and her lack of taking responsibility #for her actions i think sarah has unintentionally written her as kinda a bit of a sociopath #anyway like i said in a previous post *sigh* i miss hoeab bryce my beloved #hoeab bryce had gone through so much and had a lot of growth through the first book and had so much potential for more #but then it just stopped. went backwards even. in fact i think hofas bryce has gotten worse #she's had no development for 2 books now and the further i get into hofas more and more apparent it's become how flawed #and one dimensional her character is #her being in prythian and the acotar characters carried her early chapters but now that she's back in midgard her lack of growth and #maturity is starting to grate on me. literally every other pov character has had more development then her #in all the other character pov's they are constantly self reflection they feel guilt they blame themselves they consider the feelings #of those around them. they consider how their actions have affected those around them. they take responsibility for their actions #bryce's pov does not do that to the same degree. if at all #there's minimal critical thought. no self reflection. a lack of taking any responsibility for her actions and the consequences #she's really is a very flat character. what you see is what you get #and her 'sassyness' (that was fine at first when there actually was more to her character) which is supposed to come across as #witty funny badass who takes no shit ect. more and more is just comes across as annoying and immature #and often inflammatory in situations that require maturity sensitivity and tact #her disrespect for the ocean queen who is helping you and is super powerful and not someone you want to make #an enemy of was just unnecessary and not smart tactically #and this is super nitpicky but I'm getting so sick of bryce's clothes. please get her out of those ridiculous leggins and pink sneakers #they were fine when she was going to the nail salon and the gym but how am i supposed to take her seriously on a world saving #mission in those clothes. how am i supposed to take her seriously as a queen (ugh) conversing with the ocean queen #in those clothes #and I'm loath to say it because i love hoeab quinlar with my whole heart but hofas bryce doesn't deserve hunt #the devotion and consideration hunt has for bryce and her feelings is not returned to the same degree to him #anyway i was hoping to get my hoeab bryce back but it hasn't happened but hopefully the second half of the book #can turn things around for her #pleaseee

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mooseonahunt · 1 year

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Y'know I'm actually so curious about the decision making process of some people. Genuinely want to know how someone can look at a situation, see key details, take in that information, and then make an incredibly questionable decision based around what they learned.

And yeah this is about people in my Instagram DM's sending me links to hankcon fics (granted it's only happened 3 times but that's 3 times too many for my small account). I'd like to study these people. I understand that I've never outright said "I don't like HankCon," but I have mentioned being a big fan of Dad Hank so often that I didn't think I had to say it??

It's in my bio both here and on insta, and my banner here is also my pinned post on there. So it's really strange to me that people would reach out with fics containing the one ship I thought was the most obvious that I am not interested in.

Not mad. Just annoyed. But also so curious about these people. I'm not reaching out to them with Dad Hank fics or forcing Dad Hank onto them. It's literally their decision to follow me knowing what kind of content I post-- just like it's my decision to not interact with people who are fans of HankCon or anything else I don't enjoy. It's so strange to me.

#literally what part of me gushing about familial relationships makes you think i'd ever want to read a fic #where they're romantically/sexually involved??#thank you to everyone who isn't doing this #that's very mature and i appreciate it #although it makes me wonder why any hankcon shipper would want to follow me since i talk about #dad hank and rkbros so much it's all that's on my mind these days #very curious indeed #dbh #detroit become human #dbh hank anderson #dbh hank #dbh connor #moose posting

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blitz0hno · 2 days

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Me pondering: kids are capable of going through and understanding complex problems and their feelings should be taken seriously when it counts.

Me practically: who are all these annoying fucking kids in the milgram fandom and why are they posting the worst takes and most irrelevant bullshit I've ever seen ever???

I think these are valid to coexist.

#haterposting sorry lile kids like amane?#w ACTUAL maturity and intelligence? yes hear them out!!#some 13-year-old posting drivel about “ships” when it's completely irrelevant #or missing the point of very complex plot points bc they are Literally Not The Age Demographic and Actually Dont Understand It?#im SO SORRY i am not gonna b mean to anyone but I WILL HATE THEM FROM AFAR #GO BACK TO BNHA OR DANGANRONPA U ARE ACTUALLY MAKING THE SPACES LOWER QUALITY BY BEING HERE #like obviously it does not matter at all lmao kids will do whatever #i was watching bojack horseman at 13 thinking i was So Smart i don't get to talk #but to be fair i NEVER missed the point as bad as some milgram kiddies in the YouTube side of the fandom #like no “wrong” way to enjoy things but imo they legitimately need to enjoy something else #but literally if your only takeaway from this project is “omg ship cute characters silly”#but you still insist on joining discussion spaces? god please leave #I DON'T HATE MINORS I DON'T DISCRIMINATE i just think the minors who legitimately have nothing to add should shut the fuck up #sorry livechat got me wildin lmaooooo idc that much but like it's a weird contrast #cuz my general genuine feelings for most situations is “yeah listen to kids' perspectives wholeheartedly”#but like ONLINE kids who post about nonsense that has nothing to do with what others are trying to discuss? godddd they legit need to leave #nothing against shipping either long as ur not Gross #(coughbitchesshippingwholeadultawunderagecharacterscough)#but if that's ALL YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT there are way better fandoms for that leave the milgram creators aloooone lmao #minors who actually Think about shit this does not apply to you obviously lol #if ur smart ur smart if you contribute u contribute #but like try to let urself be a kid sometimes too lol

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skyloftian-nutcase · 2 years

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My head canons on the LU boys' ages that nobody asked for but I felt compelled to say anyway

Time: 30s. Can't peg an exact number or range, just... 30s.

Warriors: 25. He strikes me as being solidly in his 20s, so we'll just go with that.

Twilight: 21. Still quite new to adulthood but very much a Responsible Adult except when he isn't because he's dumb and I love him

Sky: 18. Technically an adult but still very much a kid.

Wild: 117. Pretty sure his age was specifically stated in the Lon Lon comic somewhere. But I figure he's getting close to 18 so he and Sky are age buddies. :)

Legend: 17/18. Somewhere in his upper teens, just look at his build he's an Almost Adult, *pats on the head*

Hyrule: 16/17. We know for sure he was 16 on his second journey, not a clue how long it's been but he still looks quite Young and I want to hug him he's such a cute bean oh no I'm getting sidetracked

Four: 15. I think Jojo put him in the "young teen" category, which is hilarious because Four acts like he's in his twenties and wants to be seen that way (snapping that he wasn't a kid when Twi mentioned piggyback rides for the kids in his village; telling Wind that he wasn't a kid even though he looked it). I want to give the poor guy some credit, but I can't argue with the Goddess Jojo herself, so there ya go Four. You're right at the mid-teen mark.

Wind: 13. He said he was almost 14 in the Lon Lon arc. Maybe he'll have a birthday during their journey! That would be cute. :)

#I mean technically some of them were thrown into adulthood by like age 10 #but still they're all kids in their own way #what is adulthood anyway #it's just knowing when to be responsible vs when to be a dork; it’s maturity and experience #with added brain development #so beyond the physiology there isn't an age for it anyway #the funniest part of this is literally all the boys view the others as Kids while They're clearly the Adult #Wind looks up to everyone and all that but sometimes he'll be like: honestly these children #Time always views them as kids and then will do something completely stupid that makes everyone do a double take #basically they're all gremlins #linkeduniverse #linked universe

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matoitech · 3 months

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it’s obviously important for ppl to criticize misogyny particularly transmisogyny in trans male communities since thats a trans community issue but if ur also tme and the only thing u ever exclusively talk about trans men for is talking abt us as bigoted misogynists (usually there’s a ‘binary’ slapped in front of it) i genuinely think you need to put the phone down go outside and remember that whatever insane misogynist guys online are saying is not a necessarily a reflection of like things adult men outside of a weird fringe group of freak transmisogynist dudes on tumblr who think the boys should get our own word JUST like the GIRLS or its NOT FAIR!! or whatever (and one coined by a fucking terf at that..) are saying, or justification for behaving weirdly about an entire diverse community of trans people.

again i do not say this to like dissuade ppl from discussing legitimate problems but like a couple points- 'binary' trans men r capable of talking about it ourselves, and we do, and we’re not the ones whose posts get shared about it. and second: if you’re only bringing us up to talk abt how shitty particularly TRANS men are you might have a problem you need to deal with? this is not a shocking statement. like at some point someone has to point it out to you and sit there and take the shit and patiently explain to you it’s that the problem comes when its literally the ONLY thing you bring us up for and act like we're not capable of talking abt this ourselves, and that its a problem how comfortable ppl r for letting ppl speak over/for us if the only similarity they share w trans men is.. an agab and not being cis (yikes!). or if theyre transmasc and male aligned in some capacity but dont have any interest in engaging with or considering themselves a part of like trans men, THEYRE the ones who need to talk abt it, bcuz the (usually 'binary') Trans Men wont (not saying those ppl cant or shouldnt but they may be treated differently for doing so)

first ppl liked using transmeds existing to throw up justification for treating us like a bigoted monolith you (uniquely) Just Dont Feel Safe Around and its normal to make assumptions abt us being transphobic especially if we don't identify by labels deemed 'safe' and Inherently More Radical, and now its pretending we all collectively cant recognize our privilege thru our intense blinding hatred of women and its up to you to save us from ourselves and beat some common sense into the inherently bigoted stupid about gender patriarchy dicksucker boys. like i dont know im tired of it when trans men being accused of only existing bcuz we want to be patriarchy bootlickers i guess is always what radfems have thrown at us, so its not like this negative perception of trans men filtered thru a supposedly progressive lense is new. a lot of adult trans men dont talk abt like particular hot shit thats discussed a lot on here rn (the 'trans misandry' shit for example) bcuz its was not a problem in the spaces we're in and we knew it was stupid as fuck right away and barely worth talking about to say 'yeah you know that thing we all know is stupid and bullshit? its stupid and bullshit'. bcuz we're not fifteen years old or weird misogynists. we have brains, don't hate women, and we dont all know and hang around the same people.

anyway dont take this post as a stand in for serious discussion and calling out misogyny (again especially transmisogyny) w other men, those posts do need to exist, i am not trying to say this stuff shouldnt be talked about. what i'm specifically pointing out is a frustrating pattern in the perception of and discussion of trans men that ppl probably dont realize theyre participating in. i do think it is very important to talk abt community issues and criticisms but if its literally the one thing you bring up trans men for i think being aware of that behavior has no NEGATIVES here. also do have to bring up i specified other tme ppl early on bcuz this isnt smth ive experienced or seen from transfems and their position as like the affected party of transmisogyny is automatically like .. if they have issues w trans men it is pretty inherently coming from a different place than like, a cis womans, or a tme nonbinary person, or a transmasc person with issues with trans men, or a cis mans, etc. tme ppl who are on a very different ground here, whose behavior is straight up different anyway

#this isnt @ anyone this is like . a common thing rn #its a seperate post but i think ppls just total unawareness that trans men have made any contributions to like #academic discussion abt transphobia along with trans women (sometimes literally discussing our experiences together!) is kind of bizarr #u know online discourser misogyny boys r not reflective of the actual adult intersectional (cant remember if thats the right word its 2 am #lol) discussion of our experiences that MUST be done in order to have like any solid understanding of how to fix this shit #you cant just ignore the experiences of trans men and think ur understanding of gender is good lol #there r many ppl who r invested in talking abt it in a way thats like normal and mature #and it DEPENDS on trans womens experiences and pov too to make a more fully realized understanding of trans ppls lived experiences #and how we can fix cisnormativity and sexism and shit without pretending like disappearing gender is gonna do anything #except be boring as fuck and not realistic. what if we all lived in someone elses fantasy utopia that is not a utopia for a lot of transppl #and believing online discourse misogyny boys when they tell you no one else cares abt trans men but THEM >:( is like. dumb as fuck #there have been ppl discussing their experiences in an actually nuanced and Gives A Shit way for decades. academically. go find it

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