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capillata · 3 years

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Honestly the fact that the DA fandom keeps being hell discourse and controversies wise is very much NOT GREAT even if it has some of the most talented writers and artists I've seen in more than thirty years of being in fandom spaces. But I'm curious, why do you say that DBH was weird in a bad way? I was very into it but mostly into Gavin9000 with a buncha friends, so I probably missed out on all the shitstorms

The weirdest comments I ever got on any fic was Eversion. The largest amount of people telling me how to write my fic and what I should do next was in the DBH fandom with Eversion. And the one time I joined a Hankcon server it was an unpleasant experience and I left pretty much three days later (most servers I get tired of I just leave on permanent mute, but that one I actually yeeted myself out of because it was uncomfortable. And as soon as folks knew I was writing a fic, they were telling me how I should write it, without asking me if I wanted that ‘advice’ lmao - it was a lot of people talking at me about what they wanted to see most, which is like, idk, I feel like some of the people I encountered in that fandom were kind of entitled? It wasn't that friendly either, it was very much a 'I think your fic would be worth reading if it did *this very niche thing I'm interested in*')

Like, that fandom, at least what I saw of it, was just like... unpleasant, alienating, cliquey and strangely competitive. But I didn’t join it with a bunch of friends. I was kind of alone in my interest, though I had friends who liked it, in a more general ‘we just enjoy the game’ or ‘this fanart is nice’ way, it wasn’t anything in depth. As soon as I finished the fic, I was like... I had no reason to stay.

Don’t get me wrong, the majority of folks who ended up commenting on Eversion were great, though the bulk of them were people who were already coming to my fic from other stuff I’d written, they weren’t ‘DBH fans’ they were folks who would try my writing (god help them) because they liked my older stuff. But I’ve also met like two or three really great folks from the DBH fandom, and chatted to some great fanartists too.

But yeah I don’t want to write fic for it again, I never saw a ton of hostile discourse or anything, though I know it’s out there (especially with folks who hate Reed and then bash anyone who ships him with any character, those people suck), and I did enjoy writing Eversion. But the fandom experience was just weird and I no longer follow anyone (I’m pretty sure) who posts DBH content because of it. I think there’s like a gif blog or something, but I haven’t seen anything from them in months.

Also I’ll be clear, I missed out on a lot of the shitstorms too, but deliberately. My encounter with the fandom in AO3 comments, on Twitter, and Tumblr, and joining a Discord server had me exiting all aspects of that fandom until finally all I was left with were the AO3 comments, and that helped, lol.

Obviously everyone has very different experiences of fandoms, and I think it’s great that you’ve had a good experience. I know a couple of others who’ve had good experiences too in DBH. I think once you can get that network of like, trusted friends in a fandom, you’re in a good space. For me it could’ve just been timing. I came to the DBH fandom when interest was kind of starting to even out, and I came to it via seeing some reverse AU fanart that inspired me to watch an entire playthrough and then write the fic (I never played the game), so some of it was also likely on my part - I just didn’t have like the hardcore passion for the characters or the game to see me through the weirdness, whereas other people can tolerate a lot of weirdness if they love the property enough.

So yeah, anyway, I’m not saying everyone’s experience in that fandom was weird in a bad way, I’m definitely just saying my experience was weird in a bad way. For a while, it had me wanting to quit writing Eversion, and I could only really keep going with it once I nixed out of all aspects of DBH social media, and just focused on the fic and went to the Wiki page for research.

#personal #things might actually be better now #that the fandom is quieter #or they might be worse for some people #also the gateway for learning all the different 'numbers' of the different connors #is really alienating and cliquey #and i noticed people 'testing' me by asking me what i thought of each different version of connor #when honestly #i had no idea people were even doing this #and didn't realise i was about to be gatekept #almost like 'you don't deserve to write fic if you don't know all this esoteric knowledge'#like god #so fucking tedious #Anonymous

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hamliet · 5 years

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The Faces Under Bai WuXiang’s Mask

Or, dissecting Bai WuXiang. I’m not going to get into whose face is actually under BWX’s mask (there aren’t spoilers in this meta), or into Lang Ying, but I instead want to talk about Bai WuXiang’s foiling with primarily Xie Lian and Hua Cheng, but also a bit of He Xuan and Qi Rong (fitting as BWX and the latter three are the Four Great Calamities).

Anyways. Mount TongLu.

The funny thing about Mu Qing and Feng Xin’s horror over Hua Cheng’s love for Xie Lian is that they think he’s a demon stalking Xie Lian with the intent of harming him.

Feng Xin was practically getting chills looking through those murals, “My fucking god… who the hell is he? He’s been watching you since eight hundred years ago?! And he is still, even now? What the fuck! This is terrifying! Is he bewitched? What the hell does he want? Normal worshippers won’t even do this much, just what the hell does he want??”

And Hua Cheng has loved Xie Lian and lived for him for 800 years. Yet, while there is a demon stalking Xie Lian for 800 years, it is not Hua Cheng but Bai WuXiang.

Bai WuXiang’s obsession with Xie Lian seems to be that he wants Xie Lian to become exactly like him, as a sort of forced empathy (I’m sensing a pattern among MXTX villains: see here for He Xuan and here for MDZS’s Xue Yang). I’m curious to see where this develops. Bai WuXiang seems to recognize Xie Lian’s terror and understand it, even, and he wants to see it drive Xie Lian into the same kind of crying/laughing despair that governs him.

White No-Face lifted his face to look at his eyes, and he said warmly, “Your highness, I think, you might have misunderstood. There certainly will be a Supreme who will emerge from this kiln, but, it won’t be me. It would be you.” ...

“Do you remember this cry-smiling mask?” White No-Face asked, “It suits you.” ...

Then, without giving him a chance to protest, that tragically pale cry-smiling mask melted with the infinite darkness as it was heavily pressed onto Xie Lian’s face.

This is, of course, a crucial difference when compared with how Hua Cheng sees Xie Lian. He never forces Xie Lian to do anything, and accompanies him even when he doesn’t want Xie Lian to make a particular choice. In other words, Hua Cheng gets real empathy and what it’s like, that it doesn’t mean becoming exactly like someone or agreeing all the time, but walking with them.

Xie Lian softly sighed a breath of relief and forced a smile, “Nothing, it’s just, in these past years, how I passed my earlier days wasn’t the prettiest sight, it was all muddled and very much a failure. I just thought if you had witnessed it it wouldn’t be good.”

Hua Cheng laughed, “How could that be?”

Xie Lian however, didn’t laugh at all, “It’s not a joke, it really was quite the failure.”

Hearing this, Hua Cheng withdrew his smile and turned solemn, “That’s okay too. Didn’t your highness already say it yourself?”

“Me?” Xie Lian was confused, “What did I say?”

Hua Cheng recited languidly, “To me, the one standing in infinite glory is you, the one fallen from grace is also you. What matters is you, and not the state of you.”

Bai WuXiang doesn’t understand this perspective at all. He tells Xie Lian, regarding Hua Cheng:

“it’s probably for the best that he doesn’t come in. Otherwise, even if he doesn’t think so now, later when he sees the state of you, who knows if he’ll still want to be with you.”

He’s preying on Xie Lian’s worst insecurities, the ones he mentioned earlier: that he’s a failure, that he’s trash. I’m pretty sure this is actually what Bai WuXiang thinks of himself: that he’s a failure, and no one wants to be with him (well, I mean, look at you BWX...)

We see these fears of being inherently bad in Hua Cheng as a little boy. Everyone seems to believe this about him, especially when the priest tells his fortune:

The Head Priest wiped his sweat and suddenly backed a mile away, “Your highness, you really picked up something you shouldn’t have up the mountain! That small child is toxic! His sign is borne of the most ominous star, the Star of Solitude*, destined to bring misfortune and destruction, the kind that evil loves the most. Whoever touches him will have misfortune befall upon them, whoever gets close will lose their lives!”

... Seeing that everyone was avoiding him like he was a poisonous snake, that child was shocked and started thrashing even harder, biting and screaming, “I’m not! I’M NOT!! I’M NOT!!!!”

Suddenly, a pair of arms wrapped him around the waist, encircling his small form. A voice came from above his head, “You’re not. I know you’re not. Don’t cry, now. I know you’re not.”

That young child pressed his lips closed tightly, grabbing on to that pair of snow-white sleeves around his waist with a death grip, forced himself to hold back for a long time but in the end he still couldn’t. A stream of tears suddenly rolled down from that round, black eye, and he burst out crying.

Xie Lian embraced him from behind and reiterated firmly, “It not you. It’s not your fault.”

This scene was also paralleled recently in the confession scene in 177, where Xie Lian hugs Hua Cheng from behind to confirm he loves him. But what Hua Cheng fears is being alone because he brings misfortune to the people he loves. He doesn’t want to be alone. Connection, as we’ll see, is vitally important to staying alive and to staying connected to humanity--whether mortal, god, or demon--in TGCF. He even asks Xie Lian in the confession scene not to tell him, because he’s so afraid of being rejected, yet Xie Lian embraces him instead.

i’m not in pain at all

When Hua Cheng is wondering what to live for, thinking he has nothing, Xie Lian tells him to live for him until he finds another reason to live for himself. This scene again emphasizes the importance of connection and the importance of empathy in connection as well, that a god would speak to a lone, desperate mortal worshipper. Live for their connection. The problem is that Hua Cheng needs to extend some of that love to himself too (like, he’s still drawing himself as exceedingly ugly in his art), but I think that comes through allowing himself to be loved by Xie Lian. So he’s on that path.

There’s another aspect to the BWX and Hua Cheng foiling that makes me slightly uncomfortable to discuss, but it’s there so let’s discuss it. Hua Cheng’s murals that so panicked Mu Qing and Feng Xin were pretty obviously, er, erotic (the ultimate self-insert real person fanartist; Hua Cheng and Dante could get along). Bai WuXiang is definitely giving off some... creeper vibes.

The next second, his hair was grabbed, forcibly yanked back then bashed into the ground!

His ears were ringing, his nose and mouth were filled with the astringence of blood, and his head concussed.

It was a while later before Xie Lian felt a hand pull his head out from the shattered ground, and a voice came from above, “So sad, so pitiful.”

Xie Lian choked out a mouthful of blood. White No-Face said, “Every time I meet your highness, you always look like this. Makes one ache. Makes one excited.”

It could just be the translation, but given BWX’s foiling with Hua Cheng, the scene two chapters earlier where Mu Qing and Fen Xin clearly think Hua Cheng is going to harm Xie Lian sexually and Hua Cheng assures him he has no such intentions (not that Xie Lian thought he would), plus what we know of Xie Lian’s utter commitment to abstinence does make me think that Bai WuXiang knows what he’s doing and is doing it to distress Xie Lian. I don’t think MXTX will take it very far (ie I don’t think anything will actually happen in a literal sense), thankfully, but I do think something metaphorically along those lines (ie something humiliating that denies Xie Lian humanity in a sense other than that one, BUT metaphorical is not the same thing) might have happened in the past.

There’s also the fact that Bai WuXiang slamming Xie Lian’s face into the ground and demanding he be like him at the ending of book 3, right before we dive into the past, is a reversal of the scene at the ending of book 1 right before we dive into the past, where Xie Lian slams Qi Rong’s face into the ground because he can’t get him to stop possessing an innocent father. Additionally, in this scene Qi Rong tells Xie Lian something similar to what BWX tells Xie Lian, except Xie Lian is the one in power then:

Xie Lian’s breathing was becoming more laboured, his head dizzy, his body shaking, his hands itching to crush Qi Rong’s skull, but he couldn’t do it. Qi Rong spread his hands, “Hahahaha cousin crown prince, what a failure, what an absolute failure!”

Xie Lian picked him off the ground, raised his fists and rained punch after punch on Qi Rong’s face, yelling with each punch, “SHUT UP! SHUT UP! SHUT UP!”

Yet, the more enraged he got, the happier Qi Rong became. To be able to drag the both of them to the same hell, Qi Rong was filled with rapture, his eyes shone brightly, “See! There’s your true face! Cousin crown prince, who knows you better than me in this world? You might look like a pathetic, drowned dog that anyone can trample now, but I know. You’re still proud on the inside; you couldn’t stand anyone calling you a failure! You must hate me for calling you a failure! Have I stabbed your heart enough to bleed? Hurry! Come! Or are you gonna tell me loudly that this body is innocent, so you won’t kill me in order to spare him? Come! Show me what you’ll do!”

It’s the same sort of temptation, except BWX has the spiritual power on his side whereas Qi Rong didn’t. Kill me, and become like me. If Xie Lian doesn’t give up, if he stands by his morals even though they’re being challenged because honestly his morals are kind of all he has at certain moments, then they themselves will be condemned, as they already know they are. But they want someone to empathize with them, to understand them. Qi Rong spent his childhood looking up to Xie Lian, wanting to be like him, and now he wants Xie Lian to be like him. He’s still a child, despite being an 800-year-old demon. I have hope Qi Rong will be able to grow a bit through being a parental figure for GuZi, I don’t really for BWX because I find him a terrifying baddie whom I love and despise at the same time.

What sets Xie Lian apart though, the whole reason Qi Rong loved him so much in the first place, the reason Hua Cheng fell in love with him, the reason He Xuan grew close with Shi Qing Xuan, is because Xie Lian can empathize. He has a sense of wonder about the world, and he doesn’t see himself as better than anyone. He’s naive and yes, proud in some ways, but when his priests tried to kick out a child because the child had a bad fortune, he protected that child. He dove off the ceremonial cart to save a falling child. He knows he failed epically to save Xian Le from falling, to save innocents from dying, but not for lack of trying.

He Xuan also tried to force Shi Qing Xuan and Shi Wu Du to understand his pain in losing all his loved ones. It backfired, and now He Xuan has lost the one person he still had. (I don’t think SQX is dead, but I doubt he is in a good state.) The meta I referenced earlier is entirely about this, and as @beneaththebrim wrote here, the whole Black Water arc “is a tragic mirror of the main plot.”

The faces under Bai WuXiang’s mask could easily be any of these characters, but they aren’t because they’re able to connect currently. Qi Rong has a genuine connection to Xie Lian, as twisted and torn as it is, and is developing one with GuZi. He Xuan is likely finding out that revenge on Shi Wu Du didn’t bring him the peace he wants, didn’t bring his loved ones back, and irreparably hurt the one person who loved him (Shi Qing Xuan). Hua Cheng and Xie Lian, of course, love each other, and through each others’ love, are hopefully starting, ever so slowly, to learn to love and value themselves too (Hua Cheng you don’t value yourself enough).

Bai WuXiang is likely terrified of facing the reality that he is alone (and if he doesn’t have the human face disease or some remnant thereof since he’s the mastermind behind it and it’s symbolic of society corrupting & also of loneliness, I’ll be shocked). So no matter how many faces he has in actuality, it’s really only his face under that mask, and that’s what he’s terrified of.

#tgcf meta #tian guan ci fu #heaven official's blessing #heaven official's blessing meta #hualian #hua cheng #xie lian #bai wuxiang #qi rong #he xuan #beefleaf

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crimsonbluemoon · 6 years

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Three Truths about FanArt/FanFiction...

1) It is not easy to draw/write

The fact that someone has enough respect and love for a fandom to put themselves out there with their work is hard enough. Even as a seasoned writer in one fandom, branching out to another can be scary. When they’re first starting, they don’t really know anyone. They see other friendships and they want to join in the fun, except they’re still new and haven’t gotten a name out yet. They worry that their story isn’t orginal or their art isn’t nearly as good as the person who they follow. The hours they spend creating outlines and brainstorming ideas can seem pointless at times. Maybe the first few pictures/stories don’t get noticed. It’s a tough time getting started in a world that has so many great people in it already.

But then they have the ultimate fear of being rejected by fans of the same universe that they love. Imagine trying to show your appreciation for something, only for others to shun you or state your love isn’t right? They point out all the flaws and show little interest in helping build that person’s skill. That’s just in the fandom; people outside of the Fandom may think they’re not creative enough to come up with their own thoughts or ideas. Most of the time that’s not true, as artists and writers get inspiration to make a fandom completely their own. There is more originality in these Fandoms that people get credit for, or want to recognize. And nothing is harder to swallow than for someone to call a creative mind ‘unoriginal’ or ‘boring’.

2) Ships are always going to have a backlash.

The most loved couple in the word is going to have a person or two that doesn’t think they should be together. And that’s fine; the point of FanArt/Fanfiction is to expand the world that these characters are living in. But that doesn’t mean we should spread hate. The beautiful thing about these worlds is that we can live in harmony without having to shame/hurt/yell/degrade others who disagree. If you don’t like what the person is saying, there are ways to say so respectfully. Or, maybe simply skip their piece of art. If you like it, there’s bound to be others who draw or write about it. And even if you don’t agree with what that person is making, they still have feelings. The way you feel about your couple is the same way they feel about theirs. Take the time that you would spend bashing on someone you don’t disagree with and use it to find others who love your ship just as much as you. I promise it’ll be better for everyone in the end.

3) They hardly get the support they deserve

It’s not intentional, either. Many people probably love the work that was created. But damn if it doesn’t hurt when it’s not noticed. It takes two seconds to like a piece of art or a chapter of a story. Maybe a minute to reblog it. But imagine if everyone took that time to show their favorite artist or writer love? How amazing would that person feel when they woke up the next morning? For a writer or an artist, it’s like Christmas morning. Even if they are writing because they love it or make a picture because they were isnpired, they post it because they want to share that creativity with others. They want to make friends in that fandom, share ideas and funny insight with the people who also enjoy the same things they do. And nothing encourages a person more than getting positive reinforcement.

Conclusion:

Fanartists and Fanfic writers deserve just as much appreciation as any other art. So make sure to leave them messages, ask them questions, show them love. Make it a goal of 2018 and every year after that to leave positive messages on a piece of FanArt/Fanfiction that made you feel something. Whether it’s once a week or every time. Make sure they know. Because these little facts I mentioned above came all culminate into the artist/writer stopping altogether. And it’d be really sad to see that passion go out, and your fandom to become desolate because nobody showed they were thankful for the beauty of that person’s work. So spread love, because if you don’t start the process, there’s a chance nobody will.

From,

A simple lover of art <3

#fandom #fanfic #fanart #writer #artist #appreciation #bbs #naruto #fairy tail #share the love #2018 goals #reblog and share #bbs squad

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