#anti vs proshipper

[coockie8]

this is a tweet, but it’s relevant here

#anti bs #just anti things #proship #proshipping #proshippers please interact #fiction vs reality #fiction =/= reality 1:1

[pelman]

Please reblog for more exposure! Also, this isn't an offer to start debates in my replies or reblogs. Express your opinions as loudly and perhaps violently as you'd like, but just to yourselves, not at one another. If you try to start an argument, regardless of what side you're on, I'm blocking you. This is just to gather Tumblr's general opinion.

Anyone on either side of the debate can interact with this post, given that this is a neutral space.

#proshipping #antishipping #proship vs antiship #shipping discourse #poll #tumblr poll #opinion poll #tumblr polls #opinion polls #to clarify my stance i think all ships have the right to exist even if i dont like them #i am not a proshipper and i definitely dont support all types of shipping but #i do believe 'problematic' ships can exist and be fine to ship in specific contexts #if youre not a survivor and you ship problematic stuff i dont trust you though. especially ships with minors. #then again i dont trust any minor/adult shipper or people who focus too much on the intimacy of minors #anti proship #anti shipping #hopefully adding those extra tags evens it out a littke #i feel like theres a bias here

[silverdragon128]

I don’t want any trouble, I really don’t. But I feel like I need to say this, need to make something clear. A lot of people have talked about how anti-shippers aren’t any safer than pro-shippers, and that anti culture can actually act as a shield for offenders. Well… just over a year ago I was raped. And, amongst other things, the woman who raped me was an anti-shipper. She had assaulted her boyfriend in high school, and immediately ran to morally “pure” groups in order to hide from that side of herself. She rejected everything she felt, refusing to admit it to therapists, refusing to channel it healthily. She couldn’t have done that, she couldn’t be like that. *She was good!* Or at least, that’s what she told herself. One day we met up irl, and she snapped. She’d been into me for years— the boy she assaulted in high school she’d done so because she’d grafted *me* onto him. She’d let the thoughts worm into her brain, and when she got the chance… she… she took everything she wanted from me. And then she went back to hiding behind the “moral purity”. Hid from herself, hid from consequences. The person who finally helped me, then, was a pro-shipper. She was the first one to hear my story and believe it. The one to get me away from this creep. She stood up for me when no one else would… So whenever I hear pro vs anti talk this is immediately what I think of. And yeah, they’re just individuals. It’s just two people. But it’s worth noting that they were, very openly, on their respective sides of the fence. And that being an anti-shipper helped protect my rapist.

As I said, I don’t want trouble. I will block anyone who questions my experience or defends my rapist. That’s the last thing I need right now. I just wanted to put this out there because maybe some people need to know my story. Idk, I hope this opens someone’s eyes

#tw rap3 #pro vs anti #proshipper safe #proship #antiship #god this is dangerous

[bewitchedmold]

Wait... PROSHIPPING DOESN'T MEAN JUST SHIPPING SOMETHING CANON WHAT THE FUCK DOES IT MEAN THEN I THOUGHT EVERYONE WAS JOKING ABT NOT LIKING PROSHIPPERS BC THE SHIPS THEY LIKED WEREN'T CANON OR SOMETHING WHAT ARE Y'ALL TALKING ABT😭

#what is an anti #What is a proshipper #Is it illegal #Should I put dni in my bio or something😭 #doesbuyingacarhelpwithtaxes #idk what that has to do with anything #Is #proship #a slur😧 #im scared #what is a #anti proshitter #is this an internet war dawg what😭 #this is so confusing #omg 😭 #whats an #Anti #Idk can we all just sit around the campfire watching the fnaf timeline vid or something #$19 fortnite card who wants it #Jfk vs dork diaries protag rap battle

[yomi-hellsimp]

Honestly, my entire problem with antis has to do with their constant callout posts and their inability to just block ppl and move tf on. Like I stg, whenever I see a callout post, it'll have some major trigger warnings on it. So you're thinking "Damn, this is serious. What the fuck" and then you start reading said call out post about how the person is a pedo because all the "evidence" is right there....and then you find out it is all about fiction. This happens 9 times out of 10, like I shit you not. I've gotten to a point where I don't even want to read callout posts because of how often I waste my time, reading through the whole thread only to find out someone ships, idk, Ruby and Aqua from OnK or something. Like seriously, who FUCKING cares??? You say you wanna help kids so badly, but you are doing nothing to help them. Calling out someone for shipping pixels does not help kids. And don't even get me started on the antis who go after CSA victims, saying they "deserved it" because they're a proshipper. Like??? Yeah, y'all really care about victims and kids' safety, huh? Antis are nothing but bullshit. They are not good people. And they never will be.

#Anti #proship #anti vs proship #proshipper

[weaselbeaselpants]

PSA but if you see someone say "I don't approve pedo/incest/ect go to jail" who still calls themselves 'proship' -bcuz Idk they like Lore Olympus or Twilight or some villain/hero shit- they are not a pedophile or an endorser of creepy shit just because you want them to be. You are not actually being critical, you are being petty and reactive and not listening to reason

Use your actual fucking reasoning skills, assess what it is they advocate for in fandom and if they clearly are into some Shane Dawson-type bullshit, THEN you can call them out for what they are. Which is a creep. They are a creep. But no a person who just really like Reylo has bad tastes is not an inherent racistpsycho incest lover just because you have decided that's what all the ppl who like that ship are.

This is why I hate the goddamn anti v proship debate; both sides' of this mandated battle line are ignoring the real problem at hand and prioritize their own feelings and trauma over what they're trying to fight for. Understandable? Sure, but that doesn't mean you aren't just running your wheels with other online twits at best:

Antiantis/Pro-shippers: "You're using progressive langauge to be aggressive and gatekeeping other people because of it; let people like what they want stopbeingsosenstive >:( " -> *proceeds to equate internet squabbles to purity culture of the 80s/spends all time shitting on other people's traumas/becomes fandom mom*

Antishippers: "We need to protect vulnerable people and minors and not let vile shit be romanticized! >:( " -> *proceeds to label anyone who don't subscribe to their exact internet standards pedophiles/misuses critical thinking skills to mean 'what I don't like'/becomes fandom mom*

meanwhile, are KiwiFarms or Shadbase or any of those nasty people who post literal csa ab*se and zoo being dealt with? No.

Minors are no safer and boundaries with or about fiction aren't being actually drawn or even discussed. It's just people putting up their own emotional/mental barricades WHILE they throw a nasty blanket on the other side. None of you are gonna believe me anyway and I'm probably gonna get more shit for just tagging both ur guys' tags anyway but I'm telling you:

I've had "antis" who totally admit to loving problematic ships and a lot and really don't like the absolutist dogpiling on Princess Weekes for daring to be a zutarra shipper.

I've known "proshippers" who will block you onsight if they see a hint of incest or legit underage-character advocacy. I know so many proshippers who hate Lore Olympus and Helluva Boss' shipping

You are ALL acting upon your experiences with bad people (probably people going through their own trauma, depression, selfcare, but still) and reacting as tho it's worst case scenario ALL THE TIME. Not cool. I'm not ur fucking mom or telling u how to cope with your own fantrauma and selfcare. What I'm telling you is this is not as mature or brave or empowering as you guys all think it is- you just sound sad.

#unironically why I don't follow Zena and Poppy #simultaneously why I don't follow any blog with 'anti' or 'i hate' in it's name #aggressive antis and apathetic proshippers are two kinds of bad people that I don't need in my life #I'd rather just protect fandoms from actual predatorbigots and MYSELF from Reylos if u don't mind #as a person with rage issues and fandom based trauma this is not productive #proship vs anti cw #anti anti #anti proshitter

[sunandmoonseisai]

I'm all for "ship and let ship" but proshippers need to get off their high horses. You're not brave and anti-comformist because you're turned on by stuff most people find disgusting. Noone deserve harassment for fictional content, but it is healthy and normal to be put off by incest, rape and pedophilia/zoophilia. You're pushed to the underground of your fandom for a reason.

And antishippers need to understand that the content they hate will always exist no matter how much they harass creators and wish them dead. You can block account and tags for a reason, stop obsessing over things that make you unhappy. It's not healthy. You're making the fandom experience toxic for everyone.

And ffs, 3 years age gap isn't pedophilia, just because you interpret two unrelated characters as siblings doesn't mean everyone has to. Get some nuances.

#fandom discourse #proship #antiship #anti harrassment #the antishippers vs proshippers discourse is the most obnoxious shit #both sides are extremely out of touch and self righteous #rant post #my hot takes

[www-sys-net]

Anyways here's yalls unfriendly reminder that despite how fucking stupid the proship/antiship discourse is, I would still entirely be on the side of pro!

Curate your own fucking internet experience. I do not care if I somehow trigger you because it's not my responsibility to cater to every single person on the internet.

Especially when the term "trigger" is being used so loosely. 7/10 times you're just uncomfortable, not triggered. A lot of you all are so engrossed in online spaces that it's degraded your knowledge of actual issues.

And that's entirely fine. Nobody should ever force you to interact with content that makes you uncomfortable or that could harm you.

But your trauma or your discomforts are your own. They're not mine. And hopefully, they never will be. I can only hope that you can get the help you need to move forward instead of wallowing in self pity because it makes people feel bad for you.

Blocking is a right that you have. Nobody should be telling you that blocking people makes you weak or that you've somehow lost some fight or argument for keeping yourself safe as best as you can.

But when it comes to it, that's that. You can't impose anything on anyone else because you dislike it or because it makes you uncomfortable.

Also, if you're going to use a legally definable term, I'm begging you all to actually understand what that term entails. Cause it really seems like quite a lot of you are throwing around words and terms that aren't actually applicable, and then you'll ignore anyone who points out you're being incorrect.

Your trauma does not give you the right to impose your thoughts onto others. Antishippers have no right to use their trauma to force someone to censor themselves. Proshippers have no right to use their trauma to force someone to interact with content that makes them uncomfortable.

Disagree? Congratulations, you have the right to block us and move on with your life.

#actually plural #endo positivity #endo safe #endo tag #endogenic #plural community #plural culture #plural pride #plural stuff #plural system #proship #antiship #proship vs anti #proshippers please interact #antishipping #median system #traumagenic median #proshipper safe #antishipper #proshipper #plural #plural tag #plurality #plural gang #plural positivity #plural things #pluralgang #endogenic system #endo system #endo friendly

[girlaph-lilyrose]

Antis, stop harassing Proshippers. Just block and ignore them.

Proshippers, block and ignore antis.

If you harass someone, you will get reported.

#antis #proship #proshippers #proship vs anti #ship wars #seriously #the block button is there for a reason #if you harass someone #youll get reported #harassers dni #psa

[purpl3qu33n]

That Hima like had some inspiration from Ikémen prince I mean come on!

They even got the same damn name and like the fur and messy hair and eyepatch. And I sure as hell can imagine Gilbert from Hetalia is similar to him personality wise if given a lady to claim of his own.

Like yes this checks out…

But that’s my theory—-

#realization #it’s hitting me hard #I knew and I KNEW SOMEHOW THERE WAS TO BE A INDIRECT CORRELATION AND REFERENCE #antis dni #self shipper #hetalia self ship #dni antis #hetalia selfshipping #pro shipper friendly #proshipper safe #proshippers please interact #hetalia #gilbert beilschmidt #HETALIA GILBERT #IM SCREAMING #otome #ikemen prince #Gilbert vs Gilbert #both are royals both are princes and both are Germanic #also I’m making a cult half seriously

[toadkatkat]

one thing i worry about is that as redacted asmr gets more popular, it will start to ‘leave it’s target audience’ and draw the attention of people who are incapable of distinguishing fictional scenarios that interest people from real life desires and beliefs. everyday, i worry that some rando is going to stumble across the regulus or ivan videos and next thing you know we have a 200-tweet twitter thread about why “redacted asmr is problematic and liking it makes you Bad and Wrong”

#to be clear i don't buy into the whole proshippers vs antis debate #but a lot of people are Very Weird about fiction that makes them the slightest bit uncomfortable #redacted asmr

[biceratops7]

Full disclosure,

I really hate the word “Proshipper” because when someone claims it I legit can’t tell if they see the value of problematic themes in media, or if they’re a closet p*do (aka I “think relationships between 14 and 20 year olds should be shown on screen for reasons”). Those things should definitely fucking not be under the same label.

Like seriously when tf did we collectively decide that you can either think every thing under the sun is worth representing in any light and all censorship is bad, or that everything anyone may possibly deem problematic must be censored? How tf did we make one of the most grey area, individualized dilemmas into binary internet teams??

#proshipper #antishipper #pro vs anti #proship #antiship #anti #antis #censorship #fandom #fandom discourse #ofmd #spn #good omens #sam and max #idk just tagging my fandoms #biceratops

[hottest-shipper]

I think antis have a sense of morals based in perpetrators instead of victims.

Example: They know that pedophiles are bad, and extend that to include anything that they could see appealing to pedophiles. Instead of focusing on why it's bad-- because of real children being hurt-- they focus entirely on the perceived audience.

It's easy to do. It's an extension of the same reason you'll see more posts advocating for violence towards terfs, or nazis, or other bigoted groups, before you'll see positivity and support for trans people, Jewish people, or other targeted groups. But it doesn't actually form a healthy, or reasonable, moral stance.

It others the group they're against, turns them into a homogeneous set of 'bad people', and prevents them from actually recognising the harm done. Antis will be so busy wishing death on pedophiles, stretching the definition to make sure they get all of them, that they don't support victims. They ignore the ways victims cope, or even just the huge amount of people they've decided are pedophiles despite not fitting any actual definition of the word.

#shipcourse #pro fiction #anti anti #profiction #proship #Dunno if I worded this correctly but I genuinely do think there's a distinction in how antis vs proshippers interpret morals

[starrbar]

Isn't it funny how when rad-antis do their cute little "PSA" thing, and their target tries to defend/explain themself, the ones doing the callouts take common, true, scientifically-backed statements and call them "red flags"?

I've seen so many posts going "Oh god guys, we'd better watch out for this dangerous person. 😨" and their evidence is just a screenshot of the "Fiction doesn't equal reality" bullet on their profile/Carrd, or a similar statement in a rebuttal against claims that they're a Literal Child Rapist™ because of their Pixiv bookmarks.

Like, "how DARE you say the most obvious response to the garbage I'm spewing that's been debunked time and time again?" Next, they'll be saying that citing doctors and professionals to back up their points is a "red flag". xD (I don't remember the exact wordings, but I 99% sure I've actually seen one of them say something like that.)

And okay... to play devil's advocate, this makes sense when you consider, for example, how phrases like "free speech" and "anti censorship" mean very different things coming from a Conservative vs. a Progressive, and those are also simple concepts that I think should be supported for their true meanings, but it still looks quite ridiculous when you start saying that phrases like "anti-harassment" and "fiction ≠ reality 1:1" are "proship dogwhistles", as if there is no context in which those statements have any merit.

(and then I started ranting)

❝ No, of course, only CHILD PREDATORS think that abusing and bullying people is wrong, because the ONLY time anybody ever gets bullied is when they've done something to DESERVE it, right?? There are no people on this earth who hurt innocents. Justice is always served. Therefore, "anti-harassment" is a pro-abuser stance! ❞ /s

❝ And obviously "fiction ≠ reality" is always code for "I just really like Stonetoss comics and drawing porn of child actors, but those are just pictures, so they don't mean anything!" It's definitely not like many people who make the former statement would immediately recoil in disgust and block anyone who uses it that way. Nah, we're all just secret predators who formed a club where we worship sexual abuse and bigotry. ❞ /sss

See, that, up there, is why I've started specifically referring to "radical antis" because they ACTUALLY embody these extreme stances, and they have repeatedly blown my mind with how exaggerated they can be, but they're 100% serious.

If you're an anti and the above obnoxious strawman doesn't apply to you, you may very well be just fine. But I'm really just tired of essentialist dickheads spear-heading one harassment campaign after another in the name of "reducing harm", and sadly those people take your genuine beliefs and warp them to create those situations.

I'm sorry you have to be associated with them tbh! /gen

I genuinely don't know how things ended up like this, but unfortunately there are people with genuine, valid concerns about fiction's affect on reality who aren't being taken seriously because a bunch of abusers take those concerns and mangle them until they're unrecognizable, probably on purpose so they can justify torturing other people for fun.

Sad day for survivors all across the board, huh? :/

#anti vs. pro stuff #rant #fandom discourse #shipping discourse #peacefic #neutralship #neufic #neuship #starrspeaks #profic #proship #Idk I guess I'll use all the tags unless I'm being super critical of proshippers in the post?? #ehehe extra sarcasm tone tags look like snake sounds

[itsbrucey]

“it’s glorification not exploration” OKAY. PERFECT EXPLANATION OF MY OPINION ON IT TOO. IVE ALWAYS FELT LIKE I COULDNT PICK A “”SIDE”” BUT THATS HOW I FEEL ABOUT IT TOO. PROSHIPPERS ARE GROSS BECAUSE THEYRE TRYING TO MAKE IT FUN AND GOOD. WHEN THATS NOT WHAT IT IS AT ALL. idk sorry for the yelling just. i agree so much.

I'm sorry for making a little stink on my blog but it's my blog and I get to have opinions sometimes. And yeah, that's my general thoughts on it??? Sorry for the cut but now I gotta talk. Also probably just. Trigger/Content Warning in general

I think it becomes dangerous when proshippers make content without meaningfully engaging all aspects of the content or they actively just. Glorify it. The content itself isn't critically thought about and it shows and then it loses me. And again, like I spat about, I support dark fiction and themes and ideas!! Extreme violence and all it's forms do exist in the real world. But to fetishize that violence against people is like being spit on.

And I understand that trauma is a difficult thing to handle and it can play a role in creation/consumption of certain media but not everything is a healthy coping mechanism, nor are you freed from responsibility because of trauma.

I'm thinking I'm especially pissy about this bc I used to be friends with people who made proship content and celebrated it. I was friends with them before they started to do this but I just watched them devolve. I saw how they treated subject matter and joked about it and didn't care about who got exposed to it. They actively relished in the fact they were making things that were upsetting or triggering. And a lot of proshippers have this attitude and victim complex while also straight up just posting child or rape porn.

It's a thin line to walk and there's nuances to how to ethically and thoughtfully engage with dark/taboo stuff. I don't think people are bad people if they like murder in tv shows or how a relationship depicting abuse was written in a book. It's bad when you sit there and get off on someone else's traumas without giving it a second thought.

#Brucey Answers! #wow. sorry about this one. idk if i even made sense #tw proship mention #tw rape mention #tw csa mention #idk. im not anybody's boss. I'll usually just block and move on if it's gross #unless its anything relating to children then i hope you off yourself. #And yeah i guess its another reminder. proshippers or proship supporters!! don't interact. i actively hate you #i DON'T. hate people who like dark content and are normal about it. i also don't agree with censorship just bc things are uncomfy #THERES NUANCE. i also think the entire debate with antis vs proship is kind of fucking stupid #but its way easier to tell proshippers to fuck off rather than give them the benefit of the doubt #im a normal adult person who thinks rape and CSA and abuse is Bad and shouldn't be attractive to people

[panicbones]

its kind of funny sometimes thinking abt kink scenes and then how online is and how i could prob be considered a hypocrite for being kink positive but not wanting proshippers anywhere near me. and i think the biggest difference is context and consent

#when im going to a dungeon for a munch and chatting with strangers #you sometimes broach topics that you may not be into but they are etc #and thankfully you can just say hey this isnt my thing may we change subjects #and its fine! its respected even! #and like. idk man its not like we're playing together. or im watching their scene #vs online where i have to put up those boundaries again #i cant control what you do. i dont care enough to even #but respect the boundary i put up #when i say do not interact if you have these kinks i mean it i dont want to discuss it #im not an anti im not a proshipper im an adult with a job #skeletal chatter #tmi #kink talk