I know I'm stating the obvious here, but it says a lot that the Stansas love the xenophobic, racist show ending and think it will be book canon whereas Key Five stans and other normal fans actually listen to GRRM saying the books ending will be different. Which would explain why Stansas originally hated the Ramsay plot in the show until they realized it could make her more important to Jon than Arya and they could use it to say Sansa is more victimized than Arya and Dany.
What gets me about the show is that there's just...no overall story being told. There are no overarching themes or points made, just us watching a series of events unfolding with no cohesiveness. There were plot points that went absolutely nowhere and no inconsistent characterization. Which makes sense, considering D&D's views on storytelling:
The story lines move forward and dig deeper as the episodes progress but rarely circle back and almost never pause for reflection. When I asked Benioff and Weiss if it was possible to infer any overall intentionality to the upcoming 10 episodes, they sneered. “Themes are for eighth-grade book reports,” Benioff told me.
They literally did not know or think about an overarching story. What gets me though is that all of the material was there in the books, they simply had to adapt it. Instead, we have them completely ignoring all of the book's themes for the entire show and then trying, poorly, to pretend like they cared at the end. The forced conversations about wanting to break the wheel and caring about the smallfolk were absolutely laughable. We had the one character who did the most to fight for the smallfolk, who was actually for systemic change, become a victim of character assassination. Then we had characters who actually show care and concern for the smallfolk in the books having that part of their character completely erased. They just wanted to shallowly trot out "cares about smallfolk" to make the characters they liked look better. Nothing actually ends up changing. The system doesn't get reformed and the people with the most power have never shown any indication of wanting to change the system. That's why people in this fandom praise conformity and demonize those who fight against the system. The only way their faves look "special" is if the staus quo ends up preserved. People will outright justify and defend classism because their favorite character is classist, and that's just where we are in terms of comprehension skills in this fandom.
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Also to put some context straight because I realise I might make it sound like Alex's writing Right Now is bad. It's not, it's been bad since Elizabeth's death.
It's not gross only because of the real world circumstances. Alex's writing is bad disregarding how the real world looks right now because turning your own character into a meme one-liner machine as soon as she's served her narrative high point in the story is just bad writing all around. (Not to say that she didn't have one-liners before but after Elizabeth's death it's been her Only narrative purpose.) And Alex being the (in-game context here, this is not true for Helena's canon where Anne has a broken family and Lisa is queer too, but I'm not giving SSE credit for what Helena has built and neither should you, because they're separate canons) only queer rep, working class rep, and character with an (actually shown) broken family dynamic makes everything about her flanderization gross no matter what. It reads incredibly fucking gross no matter what. Because it's really fucking interesting how SSE is so hellbent on turning their very (and only) marginalized character with some very real struggles into a fucking joke. The fact that we're currently in an economical recession and that SSE had the perfect opportunity to show a working class character having a very real struggle many young people (and also adults) face of hating their job and struggling with a system not made for them and also hates you and wants you to continue in your misery that often isn't your fault is just salt on the wound. (Which is another point, Alex is VERY easy to read as neurodivergent and the questline, as I've gotten informed, has some Really unfortunate "yikes you think Differently and not like everyone else?" dialogue that is already tired and unnecessary but is extra Yikes when you remember this.)
Alex's writing is bad because SSE refuse to treat her as a character, it's just even worse when you look at the real life circumstances.
Alex should not only be a character when certain people write her. Alex should not only be well-written when she's written by people who relate to her. She should be well-written all the time because some standard sense of character consistency is WRITING BASICS.
As I've been saying, calling it tone deaf doesn't even begin to cover it, but it is being nice about it.
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i am tired of the way people act like aromantics feeling other kinds of love is some kind of redeeming quality
every time there's a post about aromanticism the comments are flooded with people saying how aromantic people can still feel love it's just not the romantic kind and like yes it is important to point that out because it is true that some aromantic people still feel other kinds of love but not all!! and that's okay!! some aromantic people don't feel love at all and it doesn't make them any less valid! and i'm not saying people need to stop with those comments there's nothing wrong with that but the moment someone tries to point out that loveless people exist and are valid others start acting so fucking weird about it
i have a really weird relationship with love i use the word "love" to describe how am i feeling about people or pets or other stuff because it's the closest thing to describe how i feel but at the same time i'm not 100% sure what i feel is actually "love"
it doesn't probably makes sense but i just feel like i don't feel love the same way others do, the same way this society deems normal and how i am supposed to feel it and so having people act like me feeling other types of love or attraction that are just not romantic and sexual is something that redeems me from not feeling romantic love just makes me really uncomfortable
i don't want people to keep pointing out how i can feel other types of love as if it's the only thing that makes me valid
like and what if i don't? what if i don't feel love at all? does that make me less valid? it should not. i should be valid for being me for being who i am not for being able to feel any kind of love.
i am tired of the way love is treated as something that makes us human. i'm tired of people acting like people who do not feel love are suddenly terrible and inhuman. it's just a fucking emotion and not everyone needs to feel it. if someone told you they can't feel hatred would you suddenly tell them they're terrible and inhuman because feeling hate is what makes us human? no because that's fucking stupid. how is it any different with love?
i could write whole essays about how fucking stupid it is that people act like feeling love and empathy is what makes us human and good people. there are some absolutely vile and cruel people in this world capable of doing monstrous things and some of them do feel love or empathy. does that suddenly make them good people? does that suddenly erase all the terrible things they've done just because they feel certain emotions? no it really doesn't. so why should it be any different if it's the other way around. good people are good because they choose to be kind. people can be the kindest souls on this earth and don't need to feel love and empathy.
i know i'm rambling and probably don't make sense but i'm just really tired. i'm tired of people acting like me being able to feel other kinds of love is what makes me valid. like me feeling love is that one good thing about me. i want to be able to say proudly that i am aromantic that i am aroace that i don't feel romantic love without needing to clarify that yes i do feel other types of love as if that's what makes me better. i am not better or more valid than loveless people just because i "can" feel love or whatever other bullshit
they're valid too and i want to be valid without needing to "feel love" i want to feel like i would be valid and accepted even if i wouldn't feel love at all
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Aight, what you see above is an article that's getting passed around by proshippers. I'm making my own post separate from theirs to discuss the contents of this article and why I believe everyone *should* read it, while also I don't believe the article is correct.
The article was written by a Japanese artist who had been harassed for "proshipping" online, even though they themself did not partake in anything more than aging up 15-year-old characters to 19. As far as they claim, that was it (though the artwork itself is not provided).
Someone had DMed them, asking if they were a proshipper, or a "problematic shipper", to which they shrugged and went "I guess so?" and then that person-referred to as A- started spreading it to all their friends that A was a proshipper and to avoid them, leading to soft blocks, harassment, ect.
Something I'd like to point out that is correct about this article is the meaning of "proshipper." It doesn't mean "problematic ships." Instead, "pro" is the prefix, not an abbreviation. The meaning is in reference to someone who is unbothered by any specific type of ship, and/or supports the creation of problematic ships. This difference is, I feel, important, not because the definition is changed, but because how people view that definition changes substantially.
Keep that in mind.
Something else of note here is the cultural difference. The artist is from Japan, and according to them, Japan allows ships of any kind. Japan, as a country, is proship, which creates vast and varied artistic expressions. Any and everything is allowed.
And, according to worldpopulationreview.com, the age of consent in Japan is 13 (though articles are saying they're rethinking this law).
Again, I recommend reading the article for yourself to fully understand the artist's point of view, but I'd like to break down where the author was wrong about many things. A lot of them stem from cultural differences and are normalized, so you can't really blame them, but it's good to keep in mind when interacting with proshippers from all over the world.
Something they're right about is harassment. I don't think people should be being harassed for stuff like this. Blocked? Yes.
The first thing they got wrong was the general assumption that fiction doesn't affect reality, or that antis cannot tell the difference between fiction and reality. This (at least for a lot of us) isn't true. Using myself as an example, it's clear to me that fiction and reality are two different worlds.
However, to say that fiction doesn't affect reality is false. Both worlds influence each other. If an adult starts dating a 13-year-old in fiction, younger audience members who watch that will see that relationship play out. Depending on how it's portrayed, this can either help or harm that audience member. If this relationship is deemed bad in that piece of media, then the younger members of that audience will remember that, vs if they say it's okay, THAT'S where you've crossed into proship territory that is actively harmful towards your audience.
I am a firm believer that anything should be allowed in fiction, as long as the author is respectful, responsible, and considers the ramifications of their work towards a real audience. So like, having a relationship between a 19-year-old and a 13-year-old should be allowed to be portrayed, as long as it isn't positive. By not allowing these stories to be told at all, that's leaning into some book burning shit.
What the author did, aging up 15-year-olds to 19, is not inherently bad, especially since they say it wasn't sexual in nature (but again, the art itself is never presented).
The second thing they get wrong is calling us a minority. I don't believe there were any studies done on this, but I don't think the majority of Americans go around talking about shipping children with adults? Again, it's a cultural difference that was influenced on this specific artist BY other proshippers. It's a biased view from both sides. I do not believe any studies have officially been done on this subject, so you cannot call us a minority. But, we can't call you a minority, either. I'm not sure how many there are on either side.
But also, I don't think that really matters. Continuing my topic from before with fiction affecting reality, if someone in that audience can get hurt because of your story, then it doesn't matter if the majority don't. It's still harmful and can affect reality- THIS reality- in negative ways. By drawing proship art and saying it doesn't matter because it's fiction, you're helping to normalize this art for ACTUAL predators. It doesn't matter how many proshippers there are, this is STILL harmful.
Something else I noticed, but I cannot point specifically to this article as evidence for, but it may be influencing the author, is the idea of in-fandom vs outside-fandom. The author mentions this a couple times, though usually in reference to the cultural differences between Japan and America.
The author is outside the US fandom, and so doesn't fully understand its inner workings or why so many of us are anti-proship "purest"s. I don't know how else to explain this besides going up to your grandparents and asking them if they think proshipping is okay.
Upon hearing the actual definition- being unbothered or perpetuating any type of relationship between two or more characters in fiction- they might go "yeah I agree with that," because that does sound nice on paper. Freedom of expression.
But what antis have come to realize is that fiction DOES affect reality, and if you were to ask your grandparents if they thing a child should be in a relationship with an adult, they'd probably go "no."
This is purely because they don't understand the culture of being online, and the several, several subcultures that came to be. We know what proshippers are and what they represent, but someone outside fandom space wouldn't.
And now, to any proshippers reading this: first of all, thank you for hearing me out, lol. But then, I ask you to please re-evaluate why you're a proshipper. Is it for the freedom of expression idea, do you just not give a shit, or do you genuinely enjoy seeing kids and adults together? Maybe something else? I'm not going to tell you how to feel about that- you can come to your own conclusion- but I do ask that you re-examine that idea.
If the author is SOMEHOW reading this, first of all, thank you too. My goal here was not to harass you in any way, but to point out the core of why this article doesn't really work. I'm sure in Japan things are vastly different, and that's not your fault, OP. And although I don't stand by what A did to you, I do ask that you think again. Stuff like this does affect reality, even in small ways (but when it comes to p*dos, it can be FAR more harmful than good).
Proshippers help normalize unhealthy behaviors that can seriously hurt children for the rest of their lives. Do proships exist in reality? ...Yes. Not between fictional characters, but those characters can influence people in real life to go "oh yeah the incest ship was okay in this anime, which means it's fine if I'm like that, too." It's not fine. It's not okay.
Again, I'm not here to harass you, and ultimately it's up to you whether you choose to listen. I'm sorry for the harassment at all, that should not have occurred.
Back to my general audience, though, yeah. Again, read the article for yourself (which I do still highly recommend). It gives a good glimpse into the minds and ideas of some proshippers out there. I don't think OP is a bad person, just misinformed. And I believe the same of a lot of proshippers out there. We can't change their minds, but we can make sure misinfo like what is in the article is debunked, and spread correct information regarding the subject.
Some sources:
Again, read the article, do some thinking (on BOTH sides), and have a good one, guys.
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I know this is kinda random and probably won’t make sense… but there’s something really comforting and affirming in the love chris has for pretty. I have some fat on me and hated it for a while (saw myself as unworthy of love, no one wants to touch me, etc) but there’s something about the way you write that couple that made me think differently. Chris and pretty being so madly in love made me think that it’s possible for someone to love me like that… how you write over and over again about pretty being confident in her body (especially in this last piece about her dress) and how Chris was first attracted to her BECAUSE of her thick thighs idk it kinda just gives me comfort and hope and the belief that I am someone’s type and it’s okay to have some fat.. thank you for writing! The fluff is what truly helped me (though the smut is nice too ;) )
this ask warms my heart, for real. i do believe we're 100% worthy of love no matter how we look, yourself included.
i, too, have some fat on me (probably more than some lol), and it's part of the reason why i write pretty mum the way that i do.
most of the chubby/curvy/fat/etc reader fics i was finding out there focused so much on the insecurities that come with being a fat person (which is fine. it's great, this is an art form and we can use it to express whichever story we want, however we want ! but when it's the majority of what you see, it gets you in a very specific mindset that in the long run can give a warped perception on how a situation should or should not be, you know what i mean?), so i wanted to do something a bit different, not only to normalise being fat, but to also show that we can be comfortable in our own skin. it's not easy work considering the society we live in, and some days are much better than others, but we can.
i'm glad this detail in my work has given you some comfort. thank you for reading and enjoying and for sending me this lovely message💜
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