#-or reacted in a defensive or manipulative way when confronted on something shitty they did

[fightabear]

so some time ago, someone asked me to do meta about a scene in Injustice and i wanted to revisit that scene with the scene from Year Zero in mind. and then i ended up getting deeply into injustice damian, his relationship with his two awful dads, and it’s kind of a mini character essay?

so! here’s a warning for: tyrannical totalitariam regimes, child abuse, abusive fathers, emotional manipulation, evil superman, character death & also random he-man. please note that this is entirely about injustice and its characters, which are not a reflection on their mainstream counterparts.

there’s tension between damian and bruce from the get-go in injustice, and we’re never really told why. if we take cues from the game (though that entire scene doesn’t make sense) then it’s because bruce didn’t save jason, which fits in with my reordered robin theory in which tim and jason were switched, and jason has only recently died.

now, we don’t know whether jason is running around as red hood right now or not. but i’m inclined to say he isn’t, as his injustice 2 ending makes a big deal of him becoming red hood. and damian is close with jason in injustice 2, close enough that jason listens when damian tells him that he’s a lot more than bruce thinks he is and drops the shitty batman costume. close enough that during the (extremely weird, extremely out of alignment with the comic) scene in injustice 2 where damian betrays bruce for clark, jason is the name damian throws at him with the most vehemence. regardless of the robin ordeer, bruce’s failure to save jason is seems to be an incredibly sore point between them.

so it’s interesting that bruce is already counting damian out before injustice even starts. he’s comparing damian to jason - someone who he apparently no longer considers part of his legacy. 

the kicker is: damian in injustice is actually probably the most morally centered version of himself. he shows open compassion and care for other people more often than he does in most of the mainstream runs. damian’s sense of right and wrong is solid, but what he wants is to break the cycle that gotham is trapped in. which from his perspective, is something bruce doesn’t seem to want to do.

injustice’s version of bruce is someone who truly believes that the ends justify the means - which means he’s apt to do some heinous things to people until they see his side of things. he seems to view people questioning as an act of betrayal, so instead of ever explaining himself he resorts to things like installing viruses in cyborg, kidnapping hawkgirl and replacing her, beating allies within an inch of their life - all of it is fine to him so long as they’re not dead. 

but it’s not fine to damian.  damian is constantly horrified at the lengths bruce will go to.

damian is afraid of his father. 

so, this is about a specific scene.  let’s get to that scene. its just important to note the difference between them, and emphasize that he’s not going with any intent to fight. if he was going to do that, he wouldn’t be doing this:

or respond like this:

or this:

he’s there to make amends, or at least try to. he still loves his father and he wants to be forgiven, and this is something that will carry on ten years later in injustice 2. damian made the choice to oppose bruce’s controlling nature but damian didn’t choose to abandon him and the bat family permanently. that choice was made for him. damian wants to come home. 

and he’s terrified of his father. i cannot stress that enough. bruce at this point has already shown that he knows how to hurt his closest friends if they oppose him.

damian is a highly trained fighter, but he’s also a  thirteen year old boy who knows he can’t overpower a man twice his size and weight.

and bruce?

bruce’s entire argument really hinges on ‘you, my thirteen year old son, didn’t take my side in this argument’. because, i have to put this in bold, the league was not executing the criminals they were removing from arkham. they were just transferring them to a more secure facility. something which is actually sorely needed, especially given what has just happened to metropolis. arkham isn’t fit to house them. and as far as damian sees it, bruce doesn’t like it because it’s removing an element of his control.

now, bruce isn’t wrong about how things will escalate. 

but damian’s not wrong about his motivation here.  i think there’s a conversation to be had about how bruce’s methods in trying to stop the regime actually drove it to further and further extremes. bruce never tries to talk to clark - or anyone, really. he just starts playing mind games to make them do what he wants.

it harkens back to the conversation bruce and dick have in the batplane. that bruce doesn’t talk to people, he doesn’t explain himself. he’s either right or you’re wrong and he won’t explain his stance. there is never room for debate. he’ll just stop talking and leave until you agree.  there is no option where he sits and listens to an open and honest dialogue, no scenario where he entertains that he might be in the wrong or maybe things aren’t black and white.

and that’s why injustice bruce is not a good guy. 

even on prime earth, damian had to bend over backwards to prove to bruce that he wasn’t a monster. it was damian who spent months digging through the sewers for martha’s pearls. damian who had to prove he was capable of loving titus. damian who constantly had to show that he was capable of empathy and thinking of others - bruce did none of the heavy lifting in that father-son relationship, he made damian climb the entire hill and still continues to put little effort into it.

and injustice bruce is even less empathetic and expressive than prime bruce.  

which is why you get a confrontation like this:

this goes beyond dick’s accident and ties back into what clark said about bruce not tending to his son’s who are grieving because they lost friends in metropolis.  damian’s fed up with never meeting bruce’s expectations. but more than that, he’s fed up with his feelings coming second to bruce’s. 

bruce has already made a judgement on who and what damian is. damian has the potential to be dangerous and requires work to fix, and so he’s not interested in getting to know him beyond that. he tells dick that he’s “worried about  damian being seduced by darkness” but never talks to damian himself with him about it.

but clark has looked at damian and and decided that damian is good. damian has problems, clark can admit that and does, but damian is good. like bruce himself.

and ultimately why when dick dies, clark is the one that reaches out to him because he sees damian for what he is: grieving child who just made a terrible mistake. it was an accident. damian didn’t mean for this to happen. meanwhile, bruce feels as though he was proven right. damian was dangerous and now his real son is dead. bruce will later admit, once he stops trying to manipulate damian, that damian was dead to him the moment dick died.

going back to year zero for a minute, they subtly show that damian is doing his best to be like bruce. baby damian idolizes his father. so i imagine a lot of bruce’s own feelings towards damian stem from self-hatred. from bruce seeing himself in his son and not liking the reflection it forces him to confront. injustice bruce projects a great deal of his own insecurities and shortcomings onto his youngest. damian is his worst what-if.

even though damian doesn’t deal with his grief the way bruce does. there are similarities, he puts his feelings into his fists and hits. just like bruce. but unlike bruce, and most likely because of dick, he does try to communicate. come injustice 2 he even talks about his feelings.

that doesn’t justify any of the violent outbursts. and he has a lot of them. he has significant issues with controlling his anger and struggles with lashing out, verbally and physically. it both worsens and improves as he gets older.

damian knows that he’s more than his grief, his loss, his anger. he’s also compassionate and capable of incredible feats of kindness. we see that in the flashback chapter in injustice 2. people aren’t pawns for damian, they aren’t a means to assuage his own guilt and validate himself as a good person. he wants to be good for those people.

damian’s relationship with heroism isn’t built on an intrinsic need for control or power, nor is it a means of validating his self worth.

people just need him. they’re suffering.  and he wants to be there for them.

but again, we’re not there yet.

so, alfred reaches out to touch damian. damian asks him repeatedly to let go. when alfred doesn’t, damian tries throwing him off, not realizing how much strength he now possesses.

damian  has a thing about being touched when he’s wound up tightly. it almost always ends with him lashing out at someone. which, tying back into why he felt comfortable coming back here, probably goes into his expectation that he’s going to get the lights knocked out of him. because again, damian did not go to the cave to fight or hurt anyone. the pill is entirely for his own defense.

from what we know of damian’s childhood in both prime and injustice, violence is the expected retaliation for misbehavior. toeing out of line is grounds for getting the shit beaten out of you, and while things should be different here....

from how bruce reacts he’s not wrong to expect it.  note that bruce dodesn’t run to alfred to see if he’s okay, he goes after damian for hurting him. it’s damian who runs to alfred after he’s thrown bruce away from him.  

( granted, yes, he threw bruce into the penny and it almost crushes alfred )

damian apologizes and he means it.  alfred’s first question is to ask for bruce.  

“”hawkgirl”” intervenes to try to end this fight before it can escalate further.

damian deduces that this isn’t hawkgirl and blows some stuff up.  bruce calls after him probably - not to have a serious heart to heart with him about what just happened, or what happened in arkham, but to try to manipulate him into taking bruce’s side or in the very least stop his ruse from being uncovered.

this is a theme moving forward. bruce will dangle forgiveness in front of damian, but only when it benefits him and can be used to control him. eventually he’ll stop and will use the guilt he knows damian feels to wound him.

and here’s the second theme it introduces: damian is scared shitless of his father. he’s not afraid of bruce’s violence, as after this he charges straight for him time and time again, but he is utterly terrified of the lengths bruce will go to get his way.

this is also where he takes dick’s suit. i think this was his way of telling bruce that he didn’t deserve to use dick’s memory the way he uses his parent’s death - as justification for what he does.  this comes up in injustice 2 later down the road, damian will bring up that bruce uses his pain to justify how he brutalizes the people around him. damian does the same thing -- but we also see damian grappling with his conscience about it. he wants to be better. he doesn’t want to be all his violence and loss.

back to the topic at hand, damian doesn’t do anything with dick’s suit. unlike bruce, damian doesn’t wear his grief and guilt in plain sight. he puts it in a box and doesn’t look at it, he covers the wounds with anger and as he gets older, develops a death wish and basically begins seeking a noble death in order to make up for what he’s done. it isn’t until dick passes the mantle to him in an attempt to steer him back on the right path that he even looks at it again.

damian isn’t the one that ended his relationship with bruce. bruce did. damian is very willing to reconcile if bruce genuinely wants it, but bruce doesn’t bother with damian outside of combat or when he needs something. damian actually keeps up visits with alfred, he gets him birthday presents, they meet up often and despite their opposing viewpoints, they get along just fine. damian even listens to what alfred says. he still loves his family.

damian himself is a mess. this line resonates because damian, too, is afraid. afraid of bruce, afraid of being what bruce thinks he is. there’s only so far he can bury it under the anger.

by the next issue of year one, after the confrontation at the manor, damian’s discarded any notion that bruce is a good person or justified in anything he does. everything he says on this page is true.

he’s not wrong. he’s more than bruce has even given him credit for being. injustice bruce sorts people into boxes impossible to climb out.  damian made his attempt at reconciliation and instead, found out that bruce has kidnapped and replaced one of his friends to spy on all the rest. in that split second when bruce came at at him, he saw the disgust and anger in his eyes. he’s seen how bruce sees him and wholeheartedly rejects it. 

he doesn’t want to be bruce. he will not be bruce.

batman was supposed to be better than the league. it was supposed to be a new way. instead he just found a new, different means to brutalize and control, and a new way someone justifies causing harm. and he doesn’t want it.

this isn’t to say that damian is a saint. he’s a very flawed, very broken person. he went from one abusive parental situation, to another, to another, and has the damage to show for it. he’s got bad habits from all of them, many of which he isn’t aware of or doesn’t think are a problem. 

but unlike his two dads, damian doesn’t close himself off to what he’s feeling completely, nor does he decide to rush towards external solutions for his pain. he’s, again, very aware that something is wrong. he doesn’t hold to his convictions the same way bruce or clark do, he questions.  he’s deeply unhappy with who he is and what he’s doing. 

but damian is seeking answers using a very limited toolset, and there’s a very limited pool of people he can ask that won’t give him a biased answer or try to manipulate him for their own means. one of the people he confides in does just that.

the other gives him the honest truth.

his relationship with selina is fraught and she’s often one of the very nastiest people towards him, but it’s because of that  he ends up opening up to her. she isn’t going to bullshit him and just say what he wants to hear.

and this is what makes damian different from them. both of them.

because he stops, because he questions, he’s still connected to reality. to his own humanity.

injustice’s bruce is a bruce that has quietly let his humanity die. he’s completely given over to the cold logic of batman and the idea that whatever he does to the people around him, no matter how morally dubious, is justified so long as it means protecting lives. he might not kill, but he really stops just short of that. he just doubles down on his beliefs and takes anyone who doesn’t agree with him as a traitor. he will go out of his way to rationalize how a largely guilty person is innocent (harleen) and how a largely innocent person is guilty (damian). and so he uses damian’s “betrayal” - ie, damian standing with clark instead of him - as justification for icing him out. that way he can ignore all the people who have reminded him time and time again that it was an accident.  

bruce also can’t stand that damian won’t do what he says. bruce will ignore damian unless it benefits him. bruce will go on to frequently weaponize how badly damian wants forgiveness against him. there are multiple instances where he says “just do as i say and i’ll forgive you, son.”

and then in the next breath, he’ll tell damian that he “can’t forgive the deaths”, all the while he has harleen as his new sidekick.   it’s fine that harleen helped with the scheme to blow up metropolis, killed jimmy olsen, and countless others. it’s not fine that damian did something he did all the time to dick - something dick himself shrugged off, because the expectation for this behavior was that dick would catch the baton - and it ended in tragedy.

because harleen listens to him and damian doesn’t. bruce cuts damian neatly out of his life and only really cares about him again when he’s a corpse.

damian, meanwhile, never stops trying to earn bruce’s forgiveness. in the canonical bad end (or well a comic offshoot of the canon ending) damian essentially dies begging bruce to forgive him, admitting that he always cared. he launches an absolutely insane rescue mission to save his father from clark’s torture and it costs him his life.

( but it’s worth mentioning - it takes damian showing bruce an image of kara for bruce to acknowledge him. )

even before this, damian was looking out for bruce in other ways. he was the reason selina got involved with the regime. because he offered her the chance to join and save bruce. damian’s anger towards bruce is less that he wants him dead, and more that bruce won’t stop unless he’s killed.

and damian is willing to kill him if bruce poses a threat to his ‘new’ family. he’s not going to watch bruce hurt the people he loves.

but his new father sucks just as much as his old one.

talia and bruce were more obviously abusive parents. they were controlling and sometimes asserted that control and obedience using physical violence and intimidation. in obvious ways you can point to and see abuse. 

damian doesn’t recognize clark is using him until he sees clark discard kara, who should be everything to clark and is someone important to damian. before that, he has inklings that they’ve gone too far, but clark has been such a paragon of good that when he tells damian not to worry about it, he doesn’t. he hides all his darkness behind that  smile and tells damian he’s good and worthy of people loving him, that they’re saving people and they won’t let another metropolis happen. clark talks to him and still (seems to) accept him even when they disagree.

damian misses clark’s equally as abusive tendencies because they hidden under the guise of a fatherly concern. 

clark is manipulating him into divulging more than he wants to. a boundary damian set is being broken without damian even realizing it.  damian’s uneasy. his body language goes from very easy and relaxed to overtly uncomfortable and almost submissive. it’s also very subtle but clark actually rises higher off the ground to intimidate and loom over him.

damian, who has only known bruce’s stormy silences in moments of disagreement, doesn’t recognize this for what it is.  clark doesn’t take the slight out on him. clark doesn’t stop talking to him because he dared to question.

instead, he loops an arm around damian and praises him, rewards him for being honest and makes it seem like this is an open dialogue and not an interrogation. which it is. i wouldn’t call it gaslighting, but i would call it lovebombing. damian doesn’t realize that there was anything off about the encounter, or if he does, he’ll tell himself he’s just being paranoid.

after all. this ended amicably, not with him standing alone wondering what he did wrong, or being thrown across the room. clark basically stops just shy of ruffling his hair and calling him sport. 

he was rewarded for honesty. and so any discomfort he felt was imagined.

 i think a thing that a lot of fans miss is that injustice’s damian is a forthright person. he doesn’t lie or deceive much, and later on it will bother him that he’s keeping secrets from kara for ‘the greater good’. he loathes that bruce does it and works hard to not fall into that trap. he wants to be honest. he’s glad when he’s rewarded for that honesty. 

because injustice’s damian doesn’t want to be batman. he wants to be superman. he wants to be good.

but injustice’s superman is not a good man. 

clark keep secrets, many terrible secrets, and often hurts people and justifies it to himself. he just hides it far better than bruce does.  clark is even more controlling and cruel, but he leans harder into his humanity and emotions to hide it. it’s easier to see bruce being cold and calculating and miss the way clark subtly uses what you want to get what he wants out of you. and you never really see it coming when he lashes out. he’ll apologize for it, of course, and if you’re not dead you’ll forgive him, because it’s clark. he didn’t mean it. right?

bruce manipulates overtly and grandly using intimidation, clark manipulates subtly using emotion. damian only recognizes one of these things when they happen.

so clark gives damian what he wants - a parent who loves him, someone he can talk to and even show a little vulnerability with - and then uses that against him. 

the worst thing -  the very worst thing - is that bruce and clark love damian. he knows this. both seem to genuinely consider him their son. and he knows this.

in injustice vs motu, bruce snaps fully into awareness just as diana snaps damian’s neck. he’s awake just in time to watch his son die.    and when clark is brought onto the scene, clark falls to his knees and mourns damian and laments his role in driving him to this.

but they weaponize this parent-child bond he wants against him and each other. frankly, neither of them were very interested in him for who he was. nor for helping him be better and master his anger. damian’s body isn’t even cold before bruce uses it against clark, failing to acknowledge his own part in damian’s all too early demise.

he’s another chess piece on their board. one clark can use to wound bruce. one bruce can use to wound clark.

the person damian is when away from both of their influence is a more complete damian. he’s the very best of both of them.

the damian here is still curt and sometimes rude, but he laughs and bonds with the people around him. he values people’s freedom and seems to strive for honesty and communication. meaning no one is in his war to reclaim the world doesn’t want to be, and he makes no move without everyone knowing.

when he recruits adam,  he tells them their story and what they’ve gone through and gives adam the choice to join them or stay in eternia.

anyway, all of this is to say that even all these years later, i continue to be so sad about injustice damian wayne. 

edit:

now, there’s actually one other thing i want to bring up because i totally forgot about it.

so. issue 8 of injustice 2.  

if we’re going with the idea of the reordered robin theory, which is what makes the most sense to me considering jason’s age and the friction between bruce and damian, this before jason dies. and if i’m wrong and the robins don’t have a different order, then this is before some enormous event that broke the slowly building trust.

there’s none of the undercurrent of hostility and distrust that shows up in year 0, which is immediately before year 1. we’re not given a timeframe for when this occurs, either, it’s just happier times.

but what’s really hard to ignore is that the dynamic between bruce and damian is completely different here. maybe tom taylor’s just settled more into writing the two of them, but i don’t think so. year zero comes after this. 

he even acknowledges damian’s anger earlier in the chapter. but it’s less of a condemnation of his character and more a concern that he might not be ready to be on his own. alfred is the one advocating for caution, asking if he’s ready, bruce is the one saying yes, he is.

it’s a complete reversal.

and his trust is rewarded with a night of damian abandoning the “”mission”” he was given (get home from the furthest point of gotham in three hours) to help everyone along the way. which was the real goal all along, it was a test to see if damian’s compassion would win out over his want to win. and it does. bruce is proud of him.

so... what happened between them? what caused that shift? 

i’m kind of worried we’re never going to know. like, i’m so glad that tom taylor is dc’s new golden boy and they’re just letting him build a million different aus. i buy every book he writes. 

but also i’m dying because IJ2 was clearly planned to go on a lot longer than it did and i have questions that i know netherrealm doesn’t care about answering.

#damian wayne #injustice #bruce wayne #dick grayson #alfred pennyworth #jason todd #clark kent

[johannas-motivational-insults]

Catra’s refusal to admit mistakes

Something that seems to baffle much of the SPOP fandom is why Catra can’t just admit her mistakes and try to do better instead of continuing to dig herself a deeper and deeper hole. To be fair, the situation is very baffling. It’s complex. There are a ton of psychological issues in play, and when they interact things can get very messy. I’m going to do my best to explain Catra’s thought processes and hang ups and hopefully not write a fucking novel in the process. (But if you do want a novel that analyzes these concepts in a lot of depth, go check out my fanfic Demons. Shameless self-promotion, whaaaaat?)

I have already gone into how Catra’s external locus of control comes into play, so I’m not going to break it down in as much detail here. To sum it up, though, Catra has an internalized belief that she can’t really control anything and isn’t responsible for her behavior since it’s not her fault she was put in a shitty situation in the first place. She doesn’t believe she had any choice but to be the villain. This is deeply rooted in her fearful and abusive upbringing where she had little to no control over what happened to her. A large part of that is how consequences didn’t match behavior, i.e. she wasn’t rewarded for being good and her punishments were overly harsh as well as inconsistent, affected by external factors.

There’s also the sunk cost fallacy to consider. That’s the idea that you have to get something out of your investments (of time, money, effort, etc.), even if the costs keep piling up. (In terms of money, think of people who gamble larger and larger sums of money out of determination to win back their initial bet.) For Catra, this fallacy has convinced her that if she changes course and gives up on her goals, then everything she suffered in the Horde and all the effort she put into moving up in the ranks would be for nothing. She thinks getting to the top and proving her worth/winning respect would be the ulitmate triumph. Of course, we see her struggle with disillusionment over this in season 4, which helps set the table for what we hope will be a redemption arc.

These are only two examples of the ways Catra’s abusive upbringing affected her ability to admit her mistakes. The effects of abuse (especially in one’s childhood) are pervasive, affecting your thought processes and perception of the world in a million little ways that are hard to undo. I’m going to dig deeper now into some of the other reasons Catra struggles with this. They include an authoritarian environment, scapegoating, toxic leadership, poor behavioral modelling, an exaggerated fear of punishment, and the resentment of injustice.

(Please note: in this meta I’m not trying to make excuses for Catra and say she should not have to accept responsibility for her mistakes because she was abused. My aim here is to explain why it’s so difficult for her to shoulder blame in hopes that people will better understand her.)

Also under the cut, I’m going to finish this meta by examining how Angella and Glimmer are foils to Shadow Weaver and Catra, how Glimmer had a better example set for her and has now set an example for Catra.

Authoritarianism, injustice, and fear

It’s important to understand that Catra was raised to believe that apologizing or changing course makes someone a weak person or, worse, a bad leader. As Adora says, displays of weakness are strongly discouraged in the Horde. And in an authoritarian, militarized environment like the Horde, admitting mistakes is seen as a sign of weakness. You will very rarely, if ever, see authority figures admit they were wrong, let alone try to make amends for it. And since rank/pecking order is so important in these environments, that behavior filters down because no one wants to be at the bottom.

Fact is, no one who was raised in the Horde is good at admitting they were wrong (except maybe Scorpia, but she’s Scorpia). Even Adora is bad at this. She takes on responsibility for everything and blames herself when things go wrong, but that self-flaggellating catastrophizing is not the same as critically evaluating one’s actions and their effects on other people. That in particular is something she struggles with.

This may be a problem in the Horde at large, but it’s even harder for Catra to admit her mistakes because she has been blamed for a lot of things unjustly, as well as bullied by her peers and abused by her superiors. Accepting blame for anything feels unfair because she has already suffered the consequences of many things she did not do. In her mind, hasn’t the world punished her enough already without humiliating her over the mistakes she has made? Her defensiveness makes sense, in this regard.

Not only do abuse survivors tend to be defensive and angry at the world for the unfair lot it gave us, we have a very hard time being vulnerable with anyone. Because what if they hurt us too? Admitting mistakes and accepting their consequences puts you in a very vulnerable position, and when you are used to being punished unnecessarily harshly and/or undeservingly, submitting yourself to someone else’s judgment is terrifying. These experiences (especially when they occur at a young age) wire people a certain way, make you constantly afraid even when there is no need.

Toxic leadership and poor behavioral modelling

Returning to the environment factor, where do you think Catra learned this behavior of shirking responsibility for her actions? Fact is, Catra never had anyone model to her how to say, “I was wrong, I’m sorry, and I will try to fix it.” Militarized environment or not, Shadow Weaver and Hordak aren’t the type of people who are willing to admit their own mistakes and failures. They come up with excuses or pass the blame off to other people, usually Catra. Whenever something goes wrong, Hordak blames it on Catra and all her “failings.” Whenever Adora disappointed, Shadow Weaver assumed it was because Catra was holding her back. Catra is their scapegoat. They do not apologize to her, acknowledge any harm they’ve done to her, or make any attempt to fix it.

This is especially true of Shadow Weaver, who raised Catra and was the main adult in her life throughout her childhood. Even when confronted with the damage she has done to Catra, she refuses to accept responsibility or acknowledge any wrongdoing. We have seen this in literally every season in which they interact. Catra is rightfully salty about her unjust treatment but Shadow Weaver brushes off her anger, making excuses or sidestepping the accusations.

In 1x10, Catra throws Shadow Weaver a bit of shade while comforting her after Hordak gives her a scathing lecture. Shadow Weaver immediately deflects with an insult before acknowledging her own behavior but not its detrimental effects or her responsibility for it.

Catra: Don’t worry about that thing with Hordak. I've got loads of experience being yelled at. Mostly by you, actually. You get used to it.

SW: I will not get used to mediocrity like you, and I certainly don’t need your pity! ...I was hard on you, I won't deny it, and I won't apologize. I just wanted to prepare you for the world. I wanted you to be strong.

In 2x06, Catra flat out confronts her about it, and she offers a justification for her behavior, still refusing to show any remorse. When Catra persists, she sidesteps it by responding to another part of her outburst.

Catra: Why did you treat me the way you did? Why was I never good enough for you? Really, I wanna know.

SW: Because you remind me of myself. You always have. Nothing was ever easy for me, either. I wasn’t born to power like Adora and... others. I had to earn my power, fight for it. Why should it be any different for you?

Catra: I was a child when you took me in! What could I have possibly done to deserve the way you treated me? I am nothing like you! You are old, and bitter, and weak!

SW: Ah, but you are like me. And just like me, you’re losing your position with Hordak, I can see that even from my cell.

In 3x04, Catra has all but lost hope, throwing shade and heavy accusations at Shadow Weaver. But she does make one last desperate plea for acknowledgment of the harm done to her, right before she’s hit by the crushing realization that she has once again been pushed aside for Adora. Here, Shadow Weaver doesn’t even react to the emotional content of Catra’s statement.

SW: Catra, there’s no need for us to be enemies. I can help you. I can offer you a way out.

Catra: So, what? You’re on the side of good now? You made me this way, and you get to be the good guy? Do you know what happened to me after you escaped? Do you even care? You couldn’t wait to get away from here, from me! ...But you came back for Adora.

SW: I came back to stop Hordak. I will make sure he’s destroyed. Don’t make me destroy you too.

Saying she came back to stop Hordak is sort of an excuse, but Shadow Weaver doesn’t say it like she’s trying to appeal to Catra, unlike the two earlier conversations. Once Catra rejects her offer (which we know is disengenuous, to boot) she doesn’t even bother pretending to care. Catra’s resisting her manipulation and is no longer someone she can use, so why bother?

Notably, this is right before Catra learns about the dangers of the portal (i.e. that she made a mistake when she resolved to open it) and tasers Entrapta for trying to stop her, then immediately doubles down on that mistake by sending her to Beast Island. She got one more example of refusing to acknowledge her mistakes or accept accountability right before she does it herself. The statement “Adora was right” definitely gets to her too, but she was already in an unhinged state after being tortured by Shadow Weaver, once again with no apologies. Just something to consider.

So, Catra came from this environment where she got blamed unfairly all the time yet never got any sign of remorse from the people who hurt her. As I alluded to above, in this kind of situation it’s really easy to slip into the mindset of “why should I apologize when no one ever apologized to me?” (Especially if you’ve been through a lot of forced apologies, which are always humiliating, but particularly so when you are being unfairly blamed.) This is not an easy cycle to break. When you have this constant sense of injustice weighing on you, it’s easy to fall into the trap of thinking the world owes you something as payback and therefore you shouldn’t have to try to better yourself or move past it.

This also ties into Catra’s obsession with getting a win when she is someone who seems fated to always lose, no matter what she does. It’s not just about getting back at Adora, it’s about settling her score with an unjust universe that has always given her the short end of the stick. It’s pride and indignation and pain all mixed up in one toxic soup that pollutes the minds of the abused, and it is not easy to get over. Watching Catra hopefully start to do that in the final 13 episodes is going to be incredibly cathartic.

Glimmer and Angella as foils and examples

Full disclosure, I am writing this meta partly in response to people shitting on Catra and acting like Glimmer is so much better than her after I made a gifset contrasting their reactions to realizing their mistakes. So, I want to finish by comparing all of these observations about Catra’s upbringing with Glimmer’s upbringing. Angella is by no means a perfect parent, but she loves her daughter and tries to do what’s best for her. Most relevant to this discussion, she’s willing to admit her mistakes or change her mind when presented with new information.

For instance, Angella flips at Glimmer over the invasion by the Horde soldier in 1x03, but once she learns said soldier is She-Ra she listens and puts faith in Glimmer’s judgment, despite her misgivings. In 1x10 (in a great parallel scene to the Catra/SW one mentioned above), Angella surprises Glimmer by caring more about her well-being than her mistakes, and she admits some of her own: she ordered the battle that got Micah ‘killed’, and she gave up on the first alliance. She literally says, “I am the one who failed.” And in 3x06, she sacrifices herself in an attempt to make up for all the times she failed to act and protect people she loves.

Angella has enough humility to admit her own flaws and consider other viewpoints, and she’s not afraid to change her mind or say she’s sorry. That set a much better example for Glimmer growing up than Shadow Weaver did for Catra and Adora. And now, Glimmer has set an example for Catra. When Catra is at her lowest in 4x13, drowning in her mistakes and self-hatred and wanting to die, Glimmer shows her that she too can change course and try to correct her mistakes.

Like, did you all see the look on Catra’s face when Glimmer says she can’t use the weapon and needs to try and stop it? When Glimmer gets up Catra follows her, because this is such a compelling sight to her, something she’s never seen before. It was almost like she was thinking, “Wait, you can do that? You don’t have to double down on your mistakes?”

This is something Catra has to see, not only for its novelty but because it could give her guidance, and hope. If Glimmer can change course and atone, maybe she can too.

#spop #she ra #catra #child abuse #meta #she-ra #catra and shadow weaver #catra and hordak #locus of control #sunk cost fallacy

[batricide]

i’ll drop this on my blog here too actually bc it’s Important to how i play damian and also let me yell about the fact that ij’s bruce is not a good person and the reason why so many people hate damian is because they somehow miss that.

so! here’s a warning for: tyrannical totalitarian regimes, child abuse, abusive fathers, emotional manipulation, evil superman, character death & also random he-man. please note that this is about injustice and its characters, which are not a reflection on their mainstream counterparts or how i view them.

there’s tension between damian and bruce from the get-go in injustice, and we’re never really told why. if we take cues from the game (though that entire scene doesn’t make sense) then it’s because bruce didn’t save jason, which fits in with my reordered robin theory in which tim and jason were switched, and jason has only recently died.

now, we don’t know whether jason is running around as red hood right now or not. but i’m inclined to say he isn’t, as his injustice 2 ending makes a big deal of him becoming red hood. and damian is close with jason in injustice 2, close enough that jason listens when damian tells him that he’s a lot more than bruce thinks he is and drops the shitty batman costume. close enough that during the (extremely weird, extremely out of alignment with the comic) scene in injustice 2 where damian betrays bruce for clark, jason is the name damian throws at him with the most vehemence. regardless of the robin ordeer, bruce’s failure to save jason is seems to be an incredibly sore point between them.

so it’s interesting that bruce is already counting damian out before injustice even starts. he’s comparing damian to jason - someone who he apparently no longer considers part of his legacy. 

the kicker is: damian in injustice is actually probably the most morally centered version of himself. he shows open compassion and care for other people more often than he does in most of the mainstream runs. damian’s sense of right and wrong is solid, but what he wants is to break the cycle that gotham is trapped in. which from his perspective, is something bruce doesn’t seem to want to do.

injustice’s version of bruce is someone who truly believes that the ends justify the means - which means he’s apt to do some heinous things to people until they see his side of things. he seems to view people questioning as an act of betrayal, so instead of ever explaining himself he resorts to things like installing viruses in cyborg, kidnapping hawkgirl and replacing her, beating allies within an inch of their life - all of it is fine to him so long as they’re not dead. 

but it’s not fine to damian.  damian is constantly horrified at the lengths bruce will go to.

damian is afraid of his father. 

so, this is about a specific scene.  let’s get to that scene. its just important to note the difference between them, and emphasize that he’s not going with any intent to fight. if he was going to do that, he wouldn’t be doing this:

or respond like this:

or this:

he’s there to make amends, or at least try to. he still loves his father and he wants to be forgiven, and this is something that will carry on ten years later in injustice 2. damian made the choice to oppose bruce’s controlling nature but damian didn’t choose to abandon him and the bat family permanently. that choice was made for him. damian wants to come home. 

and he’s terrified of his father. i cannot stress that enough. bruce at this point has already shown that he knows how to hurt his closest friends if they oppose him.

damian is a highly trained fighter, but he’s also a  thirteen year old boy who knows he can’t overpower a man twice his size and weight.

and bruce?

bruce’s entire argument really hinges on ‘you, my thirteen year old son, didn’t take my side in this argument’. because, i have to put this in bold, the league was not executing the criminals they were removing from arkham. they were just transferring them to a more secure facility. something which is actually sorely needed, especially given what has just happened to metropolis. arkham isn’t fit to house them. and as far as damian sees it, bruce doesn’t like it because it’s removing an element of his control.

now, bruce isn’t wrong about how things will escalate. 

but damian’s not wrong about his motivation here.  i think there’s a conversation to be had about how bruce’s methods in trying to stop the regime actually drove it to further and further extremes. bruce never tries to talk to clark - or anyone, really. he just starts playing mind games to make them do what he wants.

it harkens back to the conversation bruce and dick have in the batplane. that bruce doesn’t talk to people, he doesn’t explain himself. he’s either right or you’re wrong and he won’t explain his stance. there is never room for debate. he’ll just stop talking and leave until you agree.  there is no option where he sits and listens to an open and honest dialogue, no scenario where he entertains that he might be in the wrong or maybe things aren’t black and white.

and that’s why injustice bruce is not a good guy. 

even on prime earth, damian had to bend over backwards to prove to bruce that he wasn’t a monster. it was damian who spent months digging through the sewers for martha’s pearls. damian who had to prove he was capable of loving titus. damian who constantly had to show that he was capable of empathy and thinking of others - bruce did none of the heavy lifting in that father-son relationship, he made damian climb the entire hill and still continues to put little effort into it.

and injustice bruce is even less empathetic and expressive than prime bruce.  

which is why you get a confrontation like this:

this goes beyond dick’s accident and ties back into what clark said about bruce not tending to his son’s who are grieving because they lost friends in metropolis.  damian’s fed up with never meeting bruce’s expectations. but more than that, he’s fed up with his feelings coming second to bruce’s. 

bruce has already made a judgement on who and what damian is. damian has the potential to be dangerous and requires work to fix, and so he’s not interested in getting to know him beyond that. he tells dick that he’s “worried about  damian being seduced by darkness” but never talks to damian himself with him about it.

but clark has looked at damian and and decided that damian is good. damian has problems, clark can admit that and does, but damian is good. like bruce himself.

and ultimately why when dick dies, clark is the one that reaches out to him because he sees damian for what he is: grieving child who just made a terrible mistake. it was an accident. damian didn’t mean for this to happen. meanwhile, bruce feels as though he was proven right. damian was dangerous and now his real son is dead. bruce will later admit, once he stops trying to manipulate damian, that damian was dead to him the moment dick died.

going back to year zero for a minute, they subtly show that damian is doing his best to be like bruce. baby damian idolizes his father. so i imagine a lot of bruce’s own feelings towards damian stem from self-hatred. from bruce seeing himself in his son and not liking the reflection it forces him to confront. injustice bruce projects a great deal of his own insecurities and shortcomings onto his youngest. damian is his worst what-if.

even though damian doesn’t deal with his grief the way bruce does. there are similarities, he puts his feelings into his fists and hits. just like bruce. but unlike bruce, and most likely because of dick, he does try to communicate. come injustice 2 he even talks about his feelings.

that doesn’t justify any of the violent outbursts. and he has a lot of them. he has significant issues with controlling his anger and struggles with lashing out, verbally and physically. it both worsens and improves as he gets older.

damian knows that he’s more than his grief, his loss, his anger. he’s also compassionate and capable of incredible feats of kindness. we see that in the flashback chapter in injustice 2. people aren’t pawns for damian, they aren’t a means to assuage his own guilt and validate himself as a good person. he wants to be good for those people.

damian’s relationship with heroism isn’t built on an intrinsic need for control or power, nor is it a means of validating his self worth.

people just need him. they’re suffering.  and he wants to be there for them.

but again, we’re not there yet.

so, alfred reaches out to touch damian. damian asks him repeatedly to let go. when alfred doesn’t, damian tries throwing him off, not realizing how much strength he now possesses.

damian  has a thing about being touched when he’s wound up tightly. it almost always ends with him lashing out at someone. which, tying back into why he felt comfortable coming back here, probably goes into his expectation that he’s going to get the lights knocked out of him. because again, damian did not go to the cave to fight or hurt anyone. the pill is entirely for his own defense.

from what we know of damian’s childhood in both prime and injustice, violence is the expected retaliation for misbehavior. toeing out of line is grounds for getting the shit beaten out of you, and while things should be different here....

from how bruce reacts he’s not wrong to expect it.  note that bruce dodesn’t run to alfred to see if he’s okay, he goes after damian for hurting him. it’s damian who runs to alfred after he’s thrown bruce away from him.  

( granted, yes, he threw bruce into the penny and it almost crushes alfred )

damian apologizes and he means it.  alfred’s first question is to ask for bruce.  

“”hawkgirl”” intervenes to try to end this fight before it can escalate further.

damian deduces that this isn’t hawkgirl and blows some stuff up.  bruce calls after him probably - not to have a serious heart to heart with him about what just happened, or what happened in arkham, but to try to manipulate him into taking bruce’s side or in the very least stop his ruse from being uncovered.

this is a theme moving forward. bruce will dangle forgiveness in front of damian, but only when it benefits him and can be used to control him. eventually he’ll stop and will use the guilt he knows damian feels to wound him.

and here’s the second theme it introduces: damian is scared shitless of his father. he’s not afraid of bruce’s violence, as after this he charges straight for him time and time again, but he is utterly terrified of the lengths bruce will go to get his way.

this is also where he takes dick’s suit. i think this was his way of telling bruce that he didn’t deserve to use dick’s memory the way he uses his parent’s death - as justification for what he does.  this comes up in injustice 2 later down the road, damian will bring up that bruce uses his pain to justify how he brutalizes the people around him. damian does the same thing -- but we also see damian grappling with his conscience about it. he wants to be better. he doesn’t want to be all his violence and loss.

back to the topic at hand, damian doesn’t do anything with dick’s suit. unlike bruce, damian doesn’t wear his grief and guilt in plain sight. he puts it in a box and doesn’t look at it, he covers the wounds with anger and as he gets older, develops a death wish and basically begins seeking a noble death in order to make up for what he’s done. it isn’t until dick passes the mantle to him in an attempt to steer him back on the right path that he even looks at it again.

damian isn’t the one that ended his relationship with bruce. bruce did. damian is very willing to reconcile if bruce genuinely wants it, but bruce doesn’t bother with damian outside of combat or when he needs something. damian actually keeps up visits with alfred, he gets him birthday presents, they meet up often and despite their opposing viewpoints, they get along just fine. damian even listens to what alfred says. he still loves his family.

damian himself is a mess. this line resonates because damian, too, is afraid. afraid of bruce, afraid of being what bruce thinks he is. there’s only so far he can bury it under the anger.

by the next issue of year one, after the confrontation at the manor, damian’s discarded any notion that bruce is a good person or justified in anything he does. everything he says on this page is true.

he’s not wrong. he’s more than bruce has even given him credit for being. injustice bruce sorts people into boxes impossible to climb out.  damian made his attempt at reconciliation and instead, found out that bruce has kidnapped and replaced one of his friends to spy on all the rest. in that split second when bruce came at at him, he saw the disgust and anger in his eyes. he’s seen how bruce sees him and wholeheartedly rejects it. 

he doesn’t want to be bruce. he will not be bruce.

batman was supposed to be better than the league. it was supposed to be a new way. instead he just found a new, different means to brutalize and control, and a new way someone justifies causing harm. and he doesn’t want it.

this isn’t to say that damian is a saint. he’s a very flawed, very broken person. he went from one abusive parental situation, to another, to another, and has the damage to show for it. he’s got bad habits from all of them, many of which he isn’t aware of or doesn’t think are a problem. 

but unlike his two dads, damian doesn’t close himself off to what he’s feeling completely, nor does he decide to rush towards external solutions for his pain. he’s, again, very aware that something is wrong. he doesn’t hold to his convictions the same way bruce or clark do, he questions.  he’s deeply unhappy with who he is and what he’s doing. 

but damian is seeking answers using a very limited toolset, and there’s a very limited pool of people he can ask that won’t give him a biased answer or try to manipulate him for their own means. one of the people he confides in does just that.

the other gives him the honest truth.

his relationship with selina is fraught and she’s often one of the very nastiest people towards him, but it’s because of that  he ends up opening up to her. she isn’t going to bullshit him and just say what he wants to hear.

and this is what makes damian different from them. both of them.

because he stops, because he questions, he’s still connected to reality. to his own humanity.

injustice’s bruce is a bruce that has quietly let his humanity die. he’s completely given over to the cold logic of batman and the idea that whatever he does to the people around him, no matter how morally dubious, is justified so long as it means protecting lives. he might not kill, but he really stops just short of that. he just doubles down on his beliefs and takes anyone who doesn’t agree with him as a traitor. he will go out of his way to rationalize how a largely guilty person is innocent (harleen) and how a largely innocent person is guilty (damian). and so he uses damian’s “betrayal” - ie, damian standing with clark instead of him - as justification for icing him out. that way he can ignore all the people who have reminded him time and time again that it was an accident.  

bruce also can’t stand that damian won’t do what he says. bruce will ignore damian unless it benefits him. bruce will go on to frequently weaponize how badly damian wants forgiveness against him. there are multiple instances where he says “just do as i say and i’ll forgive you, son.”

and then in the next breath, he’ll tell damian that he “can’t forgive the deaths”, all the while he has harleen as his new sidekick.   it’s fine that harleen helped with the scheme to blow up metropolis, killed jimmy olsen, and countless others. it’s not fine that damian did something he did all the time to dick - something dick himself shrugged off, because the expectation for this behavior was that dick would catch the baton - and it ended in tragedy.

because harleen listens to him and damian doesn’t. bruce cuts damian neatly out of his life and only really cares about him again when he’s a corpse.

damian, meanwhile, never stops trying to earn bruce’s forgiveness. in the canonical bad end (or well a comic offshoot of the canon ending) damian essentially dies begging bruce to forgive him, admitting that he always cared. he launches an absolutely insane rescue mission to save his father from clark’s torture and it costs him his life.

( but it’s worth mentioning - it takes damian showing bruce an image of kara for bruce to acknowledge him. )

even before this, damian was looking out for bruce in other ways. he was the reason selina got involved with the regime. because he offered her the chance to join and save bruce. damian’s anger towards bruce is less that he wants him dead, and more that bruce won’t stop unless he’s killed.

and damian is willing to kill him if bruce poses a threat to his ‘new’ family. he’s not going to watch bruce hurt the people he loves.

but his new father sucks just as much as his old one.

talia and bruce were more obviously abusive parents. they were controlling and sometimes asserted that control and obedience using physical violence and intimidation. in obvious ways you can point to and see abuse. 

damian doesn’t recognize clark is using him until he sees clark discard kara, who should be everything to clark and is someone important to damian. before that, he has inklings that they’ve gone too far, but clark has been such a paragon of good that when he tells damian not to worry about it, he doesn’t. he hides all his darkness behind that  smile and tells damian he’s good and worthy of people loving him, that they’re saving people and they won’t let another metropolis happen. clark talks to him and still (seems to) accept him even when they disagree.

damian misses clark’s equally as abusive tendencies because they hidden under the guise of a fatherly concern. 

clark is manipulating him into divulging more than he wants to. a boundary damian set is being broken without damian even realizing it.  damian’s uneasy. his body language goes from very easy and relaxed to overtly uncomfortable and almost submissive. it’s also very subtle but clark actually rises higher off the ground to intimidate and loom over him.

damian, who has only known bruce’s stormy silences in moments of disagreement, doesn’t recognize this for what it is.  clark doesn’t take the slight out on him. clark doesn’t stop talking to him because he dared to question.

instead, he loops an arm around damian and praises him, rewards him for being honest and makes it seem like this is an open dialogue and not an interrogation. which it is. i wouldn’t call it gaslighting, but i would call it lovebombing. damian doesn’t realize that there was anything off about the encounter, or if he does, he’ll tell himself he’s just being paranoid.

after all. this ended amicably, not with him standing alone wondering what he did wrong, or being thrown across the room. clark basically stops just shy of ruffling his hair and calling him sport. 

he was rewarded for honesty. and so any discomfort he felt was imagined.

 i think a thing that a lot of fans miss is that injustice’s damian is a forthright person. he doesn’t lie or deceive much, and later on it will bother him that he’s keeping secrets from kara for ‘the greater good’. he loathes that bruce does it and works hard to not fall into that trap. he wants to be honest. he’s glad when he’s rewarded for that honesty. 

because injustice’s damian doesn’t want to be batman. he wants to be superman. he wants to be good.

but injustice’s superman is not a good man. 

clark keep secrets, many terrible secrets, and often hurts people and justifies it to himself. he just hides it far better than bruce does.  clark is even more controlling and cruel, but he leans harder into his humanity and emotions to hide it. it’s easier to see bruce being cold and calculating and miss the way clark subtly uses what you want to get what he wants out of you. and you never really see it coming when he lashes out. he’ll apologize for it, of course, and if you’re not dead you’ll forgive him, because it’s clark. he didn’t mean it. right?

bruce manipulates overtly and grandly using intimidation, clark manipulates subtly using emotion. damian only recognizes one of these things when they happen.

so clark gives damian what he wants - a parent who loves him, someone he can talk to and even show a little vulnerability with - and then uses that against him. 

the worst thing -  the very worst thing - is that bruce and clark love damian. he knows this. both seem to genuinely consider him their son. and he knows this.

in injustice vs motu, bruce snaps fully into awareness just as diana snaps damian’s neck. he’s awake just in time to watch his son die.    and when clark is brought onto the scene, clark falls to his knees and mourns damian and laments his role in driving him to this.

but they weaponize this parent-child bond he wants against him and each other. frankly, neither of them were very interested in him for who he was. nor for helping him be better and master his anger. damian’s body isn’t even cold before bruce uses it against clark, failing to acknowledge his own part in damian’s all too early demise.

he’s another chess piece on their board. one clark can use to wound bruce. one bruce can use to wound clark.

the person damian is when away from both of their influence is a more complete damian. he’s the very best of both of them.

the damian here is still curt and sometimes rude, but he laughs and bonds with the people around him. he values people’s freedom and seems to strive for honesty and communication. meaning no one is in his war to reclaim the world doesn’t want to be, and he makes no move without everyone knowing.

when he recruits adam,  he tells them their story and what they’ve gone through and gives adam the choice to join them or stay in eternia.

anyway, all of this is to say that even all these years later, i continue to be so sad about injustice damian wayne. 

edit:

now, there’s actually one other thing i want to bring up because i totally forgot about it.

so. issue 8 of injustice 2.  

if we’re going with the idea of the reordered robin theory, which is what makes the most sense to me considering jason’s age and the friction between bruce and damian, this before jason dies. and if i’m wrong and the robins don’t have a different order, then this is before some enormous event that broke the slowly building trust.

there’s none of the undercurrent of hostility and distrust that shows up in year 0, which is immediately before year 1. we’re not given a timeframe for when this occurs, either, it’s just happier times.

but what’s really hard to ignore is that the dynamic between bruce and damian is completely different here. maybe tom taylor’s just settled more into writing the two of them, but i don’t think so. year zero comes after this. 

he even acknowledges damian’s anger earlier in the chapter. but it’s less of a condemnation of his character and more a concern that he might not be ready to be on his own. alfred is the one advocating for caution, asking if he’s ready, bruce is the one saying yes, he is.

it’s a complete reversal.

and his trust is rewarded with a night of damian abandoning the “”mission”” he was given (get home from the furthest point of gotham in three hours) to help everyone along the way. which was the real goal all along, it was a test to see if damian’s compassion would win out over his want to win. and it does. bruce is proud of him.

so... what happened between them? what caused that shift? 

i’m kind of worried we’re never going to know. like, i’m so glad that tom taylor is dc’s new golden boy and they’re just letting him build a million different aus. i buy every book he writes. 

but also i’m dying because IJ2 was clearly planned to go on a lot longer than it did and i have questions that i know netherrealm doesn’t care about answering.

#ooc. #tl;dr dick grayson raised a good boy who needed support at a critical time and instead was taken in by cruel god wearing a kind smile #and damian doesn't realize it until it's far too late and he's done so much he can't take back

[alastors-wife]

i c.

#its almost 2am n i feel like im abt to have a panky attack LOL #****** rly fucked me up. like more so than i was in the first place #and it really makes me wonder... just how conditional are my relationships with the people around me? #will i be abandoned again? if i were to disagree? if i were to speak up? if i were to be honest and not hide my emotions? #i don't want to have to be afraid of myself and everything i do out of fear that if I'm not perfect I'll lose everything #it isn't fair. this isn't fair. why don't i get to be a person too? #and there's been soooo many times I've been around people who supposedly ''loved'' me #until i showed i was disabled. until i was visibly autistic / went nonverbal / couldn't function from pain or some other disabling thing #yknow...things entirely out of my control & that aren't my fault #or until something harmed me or the people in my community #i always doubt it when ppl say they love me. i never fully believe it. because i know it's temporary #it makes me wonder if they love ME or if they love the part of me that's too afraid to speak up #and too afraid to show when I'm hurt or afraid and too afraid to really be my whole authentic self #this isn't.. about anyone. im just triggered and deeply upset lol #and esp the ppl who I've been previously close to who lashed out in anger- #-or reacted in a defensive or manipulative way when confronted on something shitty they did #or the ppl who refused to talk to me like a normal person. don't...fucking pretend everything is just find and then snap lmao #and then thats what especially scares me #I've made progress. I've started slowly getting better. but i know for a FACT if someone hurt me again i wouldn't do anything #I'd just panic and cry and try to fix a problem that i never even created #i don't know what to do and i just wish someone actually did love me without it being fake and super conditional #abuse tw

[millicentthecat]

Leaders, Not Heroes: Some Meta about Kylo and Snoke in TLJ

This post contains spoilers for The Last Jedi.  It is also a Dark Side Positive post.  It was posted on 12/17/2017 after seeing the film twice, so there may be errors.

In their first scene together Snoke acts as if he feels betrayed by Kylo.  I didn't transcribe the dialogue, but it communicated something very much like... "I had faith in you to be more like Vader.  I know some part of you isn't really in this.  You failed me, and I'm angry, but I'm giving you pretty much infinite second chances, so...pull it together?"  It's like a tough-love pep talk.  And also some amount of "damnit Tiffany, I believed in you!"

Snoke uses force to discipline his right-hands.  I compare that to the moment when Rose stuns Finn.  To prevent him deserting?  Or when Leia shoots Poe for disobedience?  Snoke challenged his people and pushed them in a way that was definitely controlling and high-pressure.  He was a leader.  Snoke was the leader of the First Order.  I know I'm eulogizing.  If you don't want to read a eulogy, please scroll by.

Instead of responding to Snoke's pressure / pep-talk by committing himself, Kylo breaks.  He snaps in half under the pressure.  Kylo is very distressed by two forces: his desire to please others and his desire to protect himself.  Those things shouldn't have to be mutually exclusive, but they are, and they have been ever since his mom and dad left him in an unsafe place.  Maybe even before he was born.  Because Star Wars isn't a safe world.  It's an extreme, competitive world where you fight for your life unless somebody loves you and you're willing to die for them.  If you're willing to die for someone, you do.  That's what really happened to Kylo Ren.  He grasped this conflict, probably at a very young age.

When Snoke confronts Kylo in that first scene, Kylo shifts hard into self-protect mode.  He spends the whole rest of the movie there, with his fear.  The Kylo who's committing all that violence against everyone, all that violation, is acting in defense and in fear.  Even his interactions with Rey are geared towards turning her and neutralizing her.  What he's doing is reasonable for someone whose priority is to stay alive--but only half of Kylo wants to be alive.  The other half wants to do what others' want him to do.  And people want him to die.  For Kylo, loving others, giving them what they need, that means death.  Luke Skywalker looked at him and wanted him to die.  THE Luke Skywalker!  Kylo can't be in a mutually loving, mutually trusting relationship because nobody is looking out for him and what he needs.  (What does he need to be safe?  No Jedi or Sith.  No Leaders, No Gods, No Masters.)

Which brings me to Snoke.  Overall I think Snoke trusted himself and his people kind of a lot.  He didn't mind telling people his plans.  He could listen to dissent.  He could tell his people everything in a grand monologue and then hear them and respond and say, "hmm, your ideas are shitty and you're wrong."  Or, "hey that's actually an amazing idea."  I think this is very much the Snoke we saw.  He was honest about his plans and clear about his feelings.  He announced them.  He gave praise and admiration when he saw something he respected (a lot!!!!) and he expressed displeasure and disappointment in things he didn't.  When you look past his scars and his “creepy” tone and diction, that’s what’s there.  The awkward metaphor about “rabid curs?”  It literally communicates, “weak and damaged people are still useful, necessary, and important.”

Snoke builds a bridge in the Force between Kylo and Rey and manipulates Kylo's emotions surrounding Rey.  This, he confesses to.  It was part of his plan to draw Rey in.  Now, there isn't a single good goddamn reason why Kylo would have killed his Master AT THE PARTICULAR MOMENT HE DID if it weren't for hopes of building something with Rey.  Snoke nursed those hopes (not secretly!!! from "bring her to me" in TFA, we know what he's about).  "Snoke ships it" is usually a Kylux tag, not a Reylo tag, but I remember writing about Tempest AU and mentioning that Snoke, like Prospero, might bewitch his apprentice into loving an adversary for political reasons.  If I knew Snoke was capable of that, Kylo almost certainly knew.  I think the part of Kylo that wants to love and help others was probably very willing to be a part of such a plan.

But TLJ Kylo is self-defending Kylo.  So rather than go along with Snoke's "bring the girl to me" plan, he makes his own.  "Renperor" actually turns out to be a pretty effective plan for him--if his goals are to self-preserve.  I don't blame him for going that way and I definitely don't blame him for resisting a favored cultural narrative that demands he submit to people who don't respect him and don't treat him how he needs to be treated.  

I also don't blame Snoke for failing to give him the support he needs.  I'm not sure anyone could.  I think Snoke did his best as a leader and I don't blame someone who trusts his allies for their betrayal.  His plan was ambitious.  The monologues the movie gives him--"I know everything my apprentice thinks!  I cannot be betrayed!"--approximately--are self-confident and invoke the idea of hubris.  "Hubris" is a religious concept which, like vanity, is mostly used for victim-blaming anyone with aspirations.  Because really: Icarus flew too close to the ground.

Conclusion: Snoke's death hurts me.  It hurts me even when the movie tries to make betrayal seem silly and casual.  I understand Johnson's desire to subvert tropes, but sometimes you have to stop seeing tropes and patterns and see people.  Vader destroying Palpatine was intense for a reason.  

Snoke’s death also hurts because I feel the story tries to blame Snoke for it.  And like.  Nobody can control everything.  Trusting your team means giving them rope to hang themselves--or YOU.  And nobody's a perfect leader.  The whole movie is full of "how to deal with failure" type stories.  Luke, Rey, Finn, Poe... they all have these stories like "it's ok to be wrong sometimes!  you can fix it!"  But Snoke screws up with Kylo and Kylo kills him.  He makes mistakes--building a bridge in the Force, manipulating Kylo's feelings about Rey, presuming he has any idea how those feelings work--essentially, failing to anticipate needs--and that's it.  That's the ballgame.

I have feelings about that.  I feel The Pressure.  The "don't screw up or you'll die" pressure.  The victim-blamey "don't screw up or you'll die and it'll be your fault for being too vain and proud and flying too close to the sun" pressure.  Demonstrations like that just strike the chord in me that's mortally insecure about taking charge or using my voice to try and help.  But failure doesn't make you a bad leader and Snoke's not a bad leader.  He just failed to anticipate how Kylo would react.  Sometimes people need things you can't expect.

#snoke #kylo ren #reylo #the last jedi #tlj spoilers #dark side positive #dark side positivity #meta #supreme leader of my heart #kylux mention #general hux mention #i changed the title for spoiler reasons

[fictionplumis]

Alright, I want to talk about Ilvermorny houses today. 

I’ve been thinking about this for awhile, the differences between Hogwarts and Ilvermorny. For people who haven’t done much digging into it, Ilvermorny is like Hogwarts in the way that they have four houses, Horned Serpent, Wumpus, Thunderbird, and Pukwudgie. Their sorting ceremony, however, is a lot different. Students step onto the school crest in front of four statues representing the houses and the statues choose the students by reacting and moving. It’s apparently very rare for more than one statue to react but if it happens, the student gets to choose their house. 

Interesting concept but it takes a lot of the choice out of the matter that the Sorting Hat at Hogwarts gives, you know? People have argued with the Sorting Hat, convinced the Sorting Hat to put them in other houses, we don’t get any of that with Ilvermorny and that’s probably because it’s not as necessary. 

We all know the Hogwarts houses, but let’s look at Ilvermorny for a moment. They’re all more physical attributes, representing a physical “part” of the wizard. Horned Serpent is the mind, Wumpus is the body, Thunderbird is the soul, and Pukwudgie is the heart. So the houses tend to pick students with similar interests. Horned Serpent is more for scholars, Wumpus for warriors, Thunderbird for adventurers, and Pukwudgie for healers. 

So here’s the reason why I feel like arguing with the statues isn’t necessary. Ilvermorny houses are based on physical things, on actions. Hogwarts houses are based on values and concepts. 

Students argue with the Sorting Hat because the houses aren’t about how the student acts, it’s about what they value most. Harry can act very cunning to reach his end goal, a Slytherin trait, but he values bravery over everything else and wanted to be in Gryffindor. Herminone is incredibly smart and loves learning, but valued bravery over knowledge and was put into Gryffindor. Now both of them are obviously still very brave but then we have students like Neville, who started out meek and skittish. But he valued bravery and found it within himself throughout the books. And Peter Pettigrew, who you can’t deny is a complete coward that hid as a rat for fuck all ever because he was scared, he was in Gryffindor. Definitely not brave, but he valued it. 

Values are one of those hard things to judge because they’re constantly changing and even if you can see into someone’s head, what someone really values is still very complicated. Complicated enough that most people have to really think and defend their own values to themselves. 

But Ilvermorny is all about action. When confronted with a problem, what’s the first thing you do? Do you fight through it? Do you try to get to the root of the problem and fix it? Do you research about it so that you can help teach others how to deal with this problem? Or do you wing it and see where it takes you? 

That’s why it’s so rare for more than one statue to pick a person. Sure, every situation is unique and each are going to be approached slightly different, but for the most part everyone has an initial go-to response for a situation that doesn’t often change. 

So Horned Serpents, the mind of the wizard and a house for scholars would react to a situation by gathering more information about it first. An unknown situation comes up, how do they react? Maybe they go to the library and start researching about it. They go to friends and ask for advice to get different perspectives on it. This house would probably be known for the more manipulative students, not necessarily in the bad way. They’re just the students that mess with the variables of a situation to see what effects it has so that when they go to actually deal with it, they know the easiest or most effective method. They’re the ones you would want to go to for advice because if they’ve been through a similar situation, they know what to do and they’ll be more than happy to teach you because the spread of information is always important to scholars. It’s not all about research, it’s also about teaching. If someone comes to them with a problem, they’re the ones that instruct and tutor, they’re first suggestion would be to learn about the problem and find the root cause. They’re the ones that want details and facts and any little thing, even if it seems unimportant.

Seraphina Picquery is Horned Serpent. I’m going to assume she’s more a single-minded person in the way that if she’s being information about a situation that doesn’t pertain to the one she’s currently investigating, she doesn’t want to hear about it. That’s why she dismissed Tina in favor of talking to Percival about their current case and then suddenly what Tina had is related to that case and she’s upset the information wasn’t brought to her sooner despite it being her own fault. She doesn’t like not having all the variables and knowledge on a situation. 

Thunderbird, the soul of the wizard and a house for adventurers would react to a situation by shrugging, saying to hell with it, and doing whatever they wanted. These students would probably be more carefree and laid back. Everything going to hell around them? Cool, let’s see how this plays out, it might make an interesting story later. Situation is really stressful or is holding them back? Time to go out there and find something else to do. New things wouldn’t be as scary to a Thunderbird, it’s just a chance for a new adventure and they’ll find some way to make it work out. They probably get restless easily when they feel like something is holding them back. Probably brush off responsibility like it’s nothing because there’s something bigger and better out there for them to find. There’s always a new opportunity in their minds. They’re the ones that will suggest you break up with your boyfriend when you’re having a problem because there’s plenty of fish in the sea. Your job sucks? Quit and find a new one. Thunderbirds are probably more hands on so if they’re having trouble in class, they go out and do whatever it is they’re having problems with so they can learn it. Or that’s what they suggest when someone else is having a problem because Thunderbirds would probably be likely to just ignore the work and focus on what they’re passionate about instead. 

Tina is a Thunderbird and while she’s not laid back she definitely fits the bill. She acted in Credence’s defense without thinking of the consequences and when she wad demoted, she ignored her duties in the wand department and was instead roaming the streets, looking for trouble. She doesn’t think before she acts, she just does because one way or another, she’ll make it work out. She doesn’t come across as very bold but she has no problem arresting someone and marching them straight to the President when she knows she’s not supposed to be out around that area investigating, which is a pretty bold move on her part. It’s something she’s passionate about so she’ll damn well do it. 

Wumpus, the body of the wizard and a house for warriors would react to a situation by fighting it. They’re probably the more stubborn house. They’re the workaholics and also probably the ones that are the easiest to become victims or get taken advantage of just because they believe they can power through every terrible situation and see it through to the end. They’re the ones that think calling it quits means admitting defeat and defeat is not an option. Their fight or flight is permanently stuck on fight. So say they get into a terrible relationship with someone? They’re more likely to stay and work to make things better, even if in the end it’s worse on them. Shitty job? They’re going to work their hardest at it regardless because giving up isn’t an option and they’re stronger than this. They take challenges personally and they work to prove themselves in any situation. Like Thunderbirds, they probably don’t consider the consequences as much as they should and while they want to prove themselves, they’re too busy putting 200% of their energy into the things that challenge them that their priorities aren’t exactly in line and some things get ignored. Their study habits vary, it all depends on what’s going to get them the result that they want but if school is really important to them, you can bet they’ll have like three study groups lined up in a day, a shit ton of notes, and be surrounded by twelve different books on the subject with absolutely no free time and they’re dying inside because they’re exhausted but they’re gonna get that A, they will.

And finally Pukwudgie, the soul of the wizard and the house for healers. They would react to a problem by looking for a way to fix it or at least fix their part in it. What happened to cause the situation? Okay, now we repair that and everything is all good. I did something I wasn’t supposed to do and fucked things up? Okay, I’ll fix it. Relationship problems? They’re the ones looking at both sides and the motivations, then probably suggesting better communication to avoid misunderstandings in the future. Shitty job? Why is it shitty, what’s causing you so much stress? Maybe if you do things like this and maybe add a more competitive element on it, you can have more fun with it. They see someone that’s upset and they want to help, they want to make things better, they want to talk it out and find a solution for the problem. They’re study habits are probably more methodical. If they know they have a problem with something, they’ll study that harder to make up for it. If they’re bad at hands on magic but good with text, they’ll practice more with their hands on magic. If they’re bad with text, time to break out the highlighters to make this shit a bit easier to get through. They’re the problem solvers and the people always willing to listen and give you gentle advice on how to fix your problems. They’re the ones always trying to cheer people up. They’re the ones that probably sometimes make a situation worse because they’re completely consumed with fixing a problem they have no business getting involved in. They’re compassionate but sometimes in order to really fix a problem or repair a situation, you have to get a little rough with people and they’re not afraid to do that as long as they think it’s going to fix everything. 

Queenie is in Pukwudgie and you can see her do things like that all the time. She reads minds which probably makes it even harder for her because she’s constantly hearing other people’s problems and she has to comment on them, to at least try to make the person feel better even if it’s not her place. She’s very kind and caring but there is that one scene where she threatens that dude because there is a problem and in order to solve it, he has to go. She does what she has to in order to repair the situation.

Honestly, I kind of love this because I’ve seen so many people trying to relate Ilvermorny houses to Hogwarts houses and claiming that a character in Ravenclaw would be sorted into Horned Serpent because both of them deal with knowledge but you just can’t do that. Some of the themes may be the same but values are so much different than actions. You really can’t relate Ilvermorny to Hogwarts houses at all.

The concept of bravery and being a warrior go hand in hand but Herminone would have probably been picked by Horned Serpent at Ilvermorny, not Wumpus. When she’s confronted with a problem she automatically thinks of the knowledge she has on it, she’s educating Ron and Harry about why what she’s doing works and her first step with anything unknown is to research it as much as possible. Harry, as much as he would hate this, would probably be in Thunderbird. While he doesn’t go out and look for adventure and he probably craves peace, when a situation comes up he acts on it regardless of consequences. He sneaks out of bed all the time, jumps into these dangerous situations because he knows he needs to, because it’s the right thing to do. I don’t say Wumpus for him because Harry doesn’t do those things because they’re a challenge he has to fight through, he just kind of does them because they happen and he knows he has to act on it because no one else will. Neville would probably be in Wumpus, though. He’s constantly fighting through his fears, facing them every day and unwilling to back down from them. It’s that suck it up and power through it attitude that would get Neville in there.

In conclusion, I’ve been thinking about this a lot.

#ilvermorny #hogwarts #harry potter #fbawtft