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southshrouded · 9 months

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starter city snacks! where are you gonna do a snack run?

#ffxiv #ffxiv art #ff14 #snacks #gridania #ul'dah #limsa lominsa #it's older art but it checks out sir #ton art tag

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45liza109 · 4 months

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New Gridania (12.4 , 12.1)

#illustration #ffxiv #ffxiv art #final fantasy xiv #ff14 #starlight celebration #gridania

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morgana96 · 8 days

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FFXIV players who want their WoL to kill the Elementals: "My WoL would be applauded for freeing the Shroud of their evil and their death will fix Gridania's shortcomings, prejudices, and xenophobia."

The actual likely consequences of that scenario:

#Final Fantasy XIV #FFXIV #Warrior of Light/Darkness #Gridania #Elementals #like gridania is in desperate need of more visible growth/development in the storytelling #but killing the elementals would NOT fix that #because they aren't “evil”#they're temperamental nature spirits with only semi-intelligence #they are the scapegoat for the actual issue #and not only would their death NOT solve that issue #it would also more than likely cause an ecological disaster XD

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graha-stan-account · 3 months

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#ffxiv #gridania #final fantasy xiv #final fantasy 14 #i only listed ones we've been to so far #ul'dah #limsa lominsa #eorzea #ff14 #poll

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pilinonia · 2 months

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kan-e senna doodle

#kan-e senna #kan e senna #a realm reborn #ffxiv #ff14 #final fantasy xiv #final fantasy 14 #final fantasy #gridania #ffxiv art #ff art #illustration #artwork #digital painting #art #digital art #drawing

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radiantlightxx · 3 months

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"This one is strange...but a friend to the forest, nonetheless." 🌿

A young Xel'ia taking a nap with her sylph friends, because I just love her relationship with all things fey and wild 💖

#final fantasy xiv #ffxiv art #ffxiv #the black shroud #gridania #not quite the warrior of light yet but she will be #xel'ia

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4threset · 1 year

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Foods of Eorzea :)

#ffxiv #ishgard #art #food art #ff14 #gridania #uldah #limnsa

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lookbluesoup · 1 year

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So while I get that Gridanians live under these.... essentially toddler-gods who can afflict the entire territory with horrible plague, who will severely punish well-intentioned children that were manipulated by adults instead of the adult, and can't communicate their desires clearly, which leads the community to adopt a lot of hostility to change, paranoia, hate and even violence toward outsiders, etc...

Unless there's more explanation for this I haven't found? I know I'm not 100% up to speed on everything Gridania, especially pre-ARR....

Keepers of the Moon were living in the Black Shroud outside of Gridanian authority, for generations, presumably not being laserbeamed out of existence. There would have been a lot going on outside of the Seedseer's effective reach, and there aren't Moonkeeper Padjal to make up the gap there, only Hyur get to be Padjal.

Miqo'te are described as traditionally being far more in tune with nature and eschewing things like major city developments and whatnot. They're predators, yes, but predators have a place and function in the natural balance of the world.

"Beast Tribes" are a made up word from Ul'dah to protect trade monopolies in Thanalan, and Miqo'te could easily have ended up on the wrong side of that label if the rich elites had wanted them barred from the city. Historically, they're a lot more "feral" than a lot of the other spoken races.

I mention all this because it's unlikely the Elementals divide people into Beast Tribes and Human Races. Sylph's aren't being deleted by the Elementals, either, despite certainly having no inclination to live like the Gridanians do and being fairly mischievous.

My point being... I wonder if maybe the Gridanians kind of brought the Greenwrath on themselves. A lot of the time. The same way that some IRL religious institutions preach hate in the name of a deity and stir paranoia and fear of eternal condemnation. They create sins where there didn't need to be... Justifying division and destruction and isolation out of fear (and thus a need for control), and actually creating their own problems.

Elementals might not care about a lot of the stuff Gridania does, its clear a few times when something bad happens to someone, even just getting sick, panic strikes that the Elementals are behind it and people act irrationally out of fear, like the IRL Salem Witch Trials.

If you look at places like Haukke Manor... a country living in balance with nature does not need massive monuments to vanity like that. And there's apparently a whole quarter devoted to mansions for nobility in Gridania (which the npc says we're not allowed to visit.) Why do you have that. Why do you think that promotes peace with the natural world.

There's Wood Wailers who talk about wanting to kill Moonkeepers on sight, just in case they're "poachers." That's sort of like killing wolves because they're predators. Outside of some genuine bad apples, though, a lot of what seems to drive actual Moonkeeper poachers AND Duskwight Elezen to banditry is a straight up need to survive. Gridania's essential demand that they have dictatorial rights over management of the forest leads them to disrupt these group's lives, sometimes with exceptional cruelty.

I know that "central authority" is kind of... not super really a thing for Gridania, power is pretty divided up and a lot of it seems to run on an honor system. But that seems to have led to a lot of Process Loss and enabled a lot of prejudice and abuse to run rampant. Especially now that the Elementals are weaker than pre-Calamity.

I guess basically I wonder if the reason Sylphs and traditional Moonkeeper clans managed to survive out there was because, unlike Gridania, they don't have social systems built from the ground up on fear and condemnation. They're not constantly LOOKING for reasons to think the Elementals hate them and someone to blame for it.

They just live "natural" lives, that aren't inherently dangerous to the overall balance of the forest ecosystem, and they don't have an entire religious/government body dedicated to trying to interpret vague impressions from the Elementals (this is a HORRIBLE system of government and EXTREMELY susceptible to personal prejudices/bias), so these non-Gridanians run into conflict with the Elementals far less often.

i.e. Moonkeeper kills a rabbit, uses the meat, skin, and bones, is behaving like a hunter, Elementals don't care. VERSUS Gridanian kills a rabbit, uses it the same way, but then a villager gets sick and their friends panic and they turn into a mob and punish the Gridanian, Elementals didn't care but now they're a little pissy bc you're disrupting the forest with your insanity.

Basically... Gridania is the real affront to the Elementals, their very infrastructure and their culture of micromanaging the forest and constantly looking for scapegoats, kind of flies in the face of actually living in balance with nature. The Elementals aren't omnipotent or a unified group, and seem to struggle to understand human minds anyway, so they're trying to work with this city-state and have established some kind of partnership, but Gridania is really its own worst enemy.

#ffxiv #ff14 #miqote #gridania #keeper of the moon #elementals #padjal #sylph #seedseer #duskwight #lore #meta #shower thoughts #text #long post

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autumnslance · 1 year

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Gridania vs the Elementals

Had a bit of a grouse on Twitter after seeing a decent take with a buncha of real not decent replies. Transcript of the tweets:

ARR inherited the mess in Gridania from the 1.0 team, no idea how to fix it, so ignore it.

It's also clear it's mostly a People problem, not the utterly alien blue-orange morality Elementals the folks who live in the Shroud adapt to living with (& corrupt folks use as excuses).

The Elementals are obviously not policing every detail of folks' lives & barely comprehend mortals as seen several times. When they lash out it's cuz they sense a threat they don't understand. Hence the need for Padjal & Hearers. Who are people & make mistakes or are corruptible.

Assuming the Elementals are evil or cruel for the hell of it is grossly misunderstanding the alien horror aspect of the Shroud & the druidic story of the Padjal. Nature isn't all kind & fluffy. The Elementals aren't even personified nature; they're aspects of it that can react.

The trouble in Gridania always comes from people mistreating each other, & sometimes that includes making claims about the Elementals. It's the same as corrupt priests in Ishgard or Monetarists in Ul'dah. Using authority for personal gain. It's explicit in the StB LTW quest.

I'd love to see Gridania get a glowup the way the other city-states have. I don't expect it to happen. Mostly I wish for it so maybe a fraction of folks would grasp slightly better the concepts of corrupt authorities vs alien nature elements.

I also once wrote a lot more about "why doesn't Kan-E just fix it?" as if it's that easy. https://autumnslance.tumblr.com/post/625180125899669504/the-seedseers-privilege

What happened in the EW Tank quest was cuz the Elementals couldn't tell who was at fault or why. They do not understand mortals or their reasons. They just knew something was happening. Removing padjal aspects instead of killing the boy too likely was their idea of mercy.

Meanwhile I'd side-eye any Hearer who claims "your kid specifically can't be cured cuz the Elementals say so."

If you don't trust an Ishgard priest making such claims of Halone telling him the same Herself, you shouldn't believe that Hearer, either. Why would they care or not?

Anyway. Not everything's a nice neat black & white easily understood & fixed situation. And the Elementals don't actually need fixing. Gridania does, but that's gonna take longer & isn't necessarily the WoL's job, but it's peoples'.

#Final Fantasy XIV #Gridania #Elementals #Padjals #Hearers #Corruption #Blue and Orange Morality #alien mindsets #grumpy old lady hours #Twitter

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mimble-sparklepudding · 24 days

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Lalapril 2024.

Arrival.

Well, well, what have we here? A wide-eyed and wondering young adventurer, come to put your name down at the guild, I assume?

#lalapril2024 #ffxiv oc #lalapril #gridania #mother miounne #ffxiv wol #mimble sparklepudding #final fantasy 14 #ff14 #ff14 ffxiv #ffxiv #final fantasy xiv #ffxiv lalafell #lalafell

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wine-dark-soup · 23 days

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Re: what in the seven hells are the elementals

The nature of the elementals has been the source of GREAT confusion and, in my opinion, it always felt like the writers tiptoed around it because the twelveswood went through great changes after 1.0 to try and correct gameplay and lore issues... which they succeeded to do... although... partly.

The elementals went from terribly potent entities who could curse you with the greenwrath (meaning. death. plain and simple) to mostly passive entities that lost their power and can only voice their discontentment.

So like, seems quite simple, right? powerful thing lost its power. but if it stopped there i wouldn't be writing that post. the elementals were feared as much as they were respected, and since they became passive forces... this fear... remained. you must not anger the elementals. not just listen to their counsel through the conjurers and padjal. you must not anger them. but then: why don't gridanians take action? i mean, technically, they do, there are plenty of quests done in the name of the elementals. but if the elementals call to you to kill invasive beasts, why don't they do just that to solve the rampant injustice - racism, inequalities, etc - existing in the twelveswood? surely injustice means the balance of the forest (which they are the wardens of) is disrupted? surely the elementals should be mad?

and so players were left with this for uuuuh a solid decade with no real explanation as to why things were that way. the elementals were mentioned here and there as happy or sad or angry, depending on your actions. and you know, that's fine. nice fantasy tool and all. AND THEN.

Nophica tells you, in the quest The Heart of the Myth:

"Tell me, have you ever met an elemental? Many hold that they were born of me, and as I mentioned, they are the voice of those who abide in the Twelveswood. At times, they may seem excessive in their actions, but it is out of an abundance of love. So pray be good to them, and heed their warnings!"

THEY ARE THE VOICE OF THOSE WHO ABIDE IN THE TWELVESWOOD.

I REPEAT: THEY ARE THE VOICE OF THOSE WHO ABIDE IN THE TWELVESWOOD.

The natural-considered-divine entities and the common people were ONE AND THE SAME ALL ALONG. It's like the writers finally gave closure to that plothole in a single sentence.

It makes perfect sense: the elementals from 1.0 were dangerous creatures because the world was full of madness and on the brink of destruction (and also gridanians were more hostile to the outside world, which is why the elementals didn't welcome strangers and cursed them with the greenwrath).

The elementals from 2.0 onwards are thus less powerful because the will of the people got broken after the calamity, and, as the plot goes on, you can interpret their silence as a sign peace is coming back to the world. or their massive fear as a sign a threat is looming.

This is great! I love that! Just like the Endwalker tank rolequests have stressed, balance in the black shroud is actually actively maintained by mutual concord between its inhabitants. So retroactively, this is why people were finally allowed to dwell in the woods and leave their caves: the elementals - the people themselves - were ready to work together to make this place their home.

That makes the elementals mini-primals, sort of, i guess.

OK, it's all well and good, BUT IT DOES RAISE MORE QUESTIONS.

number 1 being: what are padjal exactly then?

i'll make a tentative answer: it's established that the will and faith of the people can alter the appearance and very nature of things. so if the first dwellers of the twelveswood decided - albeit unconsciously - they needed people to decipher their own will, they manifested them. babies were born with distinctive signs (horns and long lives) and powers (the ability to listen to the elementals).

that implies one can't always listen or understand their own desires, wants, or fear, and needs an interpret. which is great imo. i sure don't know what i'm doing a lot of the time. the padjal thus became the living symbol of the forest's balance - and you turn to them if said balance is disrupted. And if they are balance itself, it stands to reason the elementals would grant them and only them the power to wield white magic.

of course, that also implies padjal are just vessels, just like ysayle was to shiva, for example. and we know how bad that was for one's humanity and sense of self. there could be a whole thing about that and how damaging it is or how, conversely, it could be a sign of concord, but we have to content ourselves with the guardian tree speaking through kan-e-senna turned oracle as a symbol of union.

number 2: SPEAKING OF, what is the guardian tree then?

I have no real answer for this one. It's made of aether and it's very ancient; it may be the Ultimate elemental. The will of the forest and its people made visible.

(there could be questions about why the elementals were seemingly made of aether if they are mostly manifestations of dynamis, but after all, primals are born of a mix of aether concentration AND prayers - dynamis - so if we accept they're a sort of primals, here is that. but why are their aether differently aspected? because people can, too, shape their aether so it bends towards a particular element?)

number 3: OKAY. BUT THEN, IF THE ELEMENTALS ARE THE PEOPLE ARE THE ELEMENTALS, WHY DON'T THEY STILL SOLVE ALL THEIR PROBLEMS? WHY DON'T THE SEEDSEERS ACT? HEH?

yeah. yeah. that's still strange. but i think it boils down to what i said earlier: the will of the people may not necessarily lead to good things - e.g racism creates the need to go through a ritual to prove the elementals you're worthy of living in the forest. and the people don't necessarily know how to interpret what they feel and see. and the summoning of primals didn't solve the problems the beast tribes faced.

In short the elementals are a symbol of balance but themselves - the people - disagree about the way to reach balance. this shows the limits of the padjal's role. they still have to serve everyone... but everyone disagrees on what makes them happy... but the padjal see the balance (or hear it, i guess) in their mind and know they can't let it tip one way or the other...

i suppose this is why we mostly see individual actions in the game: we have to treat one problem of the woods at a time. the closest we get to a real manifestation of balance is again at the end of the EW tank rolequests. everyone agrees to work in unison and recognizes kan-e-senna's efforts, even if they're not enough. so now the forest is more peaceful, though not completely, but if everyone works towards achieving a longlasting peace, the elementals are pleased, because that peace is what the people wants.

one can imagine they're now working on solving their systemic racism and class issues... but ok, that last part is wishful thinking. the way they treated this was clearly a bad writing problem that they never recovered from. they could, if they wanted, we KNOW how good the writing team is now, but i think they're off to new horizons and have been for at least five years. the "the elementals are the voice of those who abide in the twelveswood" was intended, in my opinion, to give us some answers before moving to the game's next arc for good.

unless one day they come back to developing the city states (and gridania most of all, maybe through the void plotline?) again but who knows.

#lore #gridania #black shroud #post brought to you by my chronic black shroud obsession #AND NOW IM GONNA GO AND EAT LUNCH BECAUSE ITS LATE AND I FORGOR

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dreisseaux · 1 year

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