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chirpsythismorning · 3 days

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Fun fact: In the original pitch for Stranger Things, El had a little brother.

After being rejected by almost 20 studios for the Montauk pilot, the Duffers were finally green-lit by Netflix. It was at this time that they began casting and then writing the first season officially, which included reworking a lot of that first episode.

This led to the removal of the brother reference, and with it, removing any sort of arc El could have had about her apparent brother.

But the thing about this moment, is that it might not have been scrapped entirely...

Going into the final season, no one can explain why or how El recognized Will back in 1x02. And while there are plenty of things on the show that are left unexplained, with a small portion likely left that way with the intention to uncover it later, what sets this moment apart from the rest is that there are very few possibilities here.

Because for starters, the story presents El's ability to see people in the void in s1 as requiring either a picture of that person for reference, or having met that person before.

But when El see's this picture of Will, she's never met him before. Or maybe she has, but we wouldn't know because they never showed us. They could have just not done this scene at all, given that it's clearly a copy/paste/edit of something scrapped from the pitch. Or they could have even still included it, but explained it.

One explanation could be that the lab had shown El a picture of Will before, similar to what they did with the Russian agent they wanted to spy on. But then that begs to question, why would the lab show El a picture of Will? Why would they want to see what he was doing? That alone is incriminating in and of itself, implying that Will is more connected to the lab than we realize.

The only other, and frankly most likely explanation, would be that El stumbled across Will at some point on her journey between escaping the lab and Will going missing. This is actually something that happens in The Other Side comic, which explores all the things Will may have experienced during his time in the Upside Down.

Though it’s worth noting the comics aren’t technically canon, and I highly doubt they would outright spoil everything in relation to Will’s time there, years before it was intended to be revealed. But still, let's humor this for a moment given that I do think Will's time in the UD is going to be very relevant in s5, which means it's highly likely they will finally address how exactly El saw him.

Basically, in the comic, Will see’s El walking through the woods, almost apparition like, glowing as she passes by, while also sporting the Benny’s burgers shirt. This means they would have crossed passed within a short span of time, between when El escaped Benny’s when the agents arrived, but before she was found by the boys.

Though it’s worth noting that we’re seeing this all from Will’s perspective. This means from the UD, Will was capable of seeing El on the other side, despite them being on different sides. And not only that, but she also looks back at him.

What confuses me about this, is that it doesn’t make sense for El to be in the woods, only to randomly decide to pop in to the void for a moment. She was trying to escape the lab and everything that came with it. I doubt she had any desire to lurk back there for some reason, not until someone encouraged her to. Not to mention, it would make no sense for her to go there and see Will if she wasn't even looking for him in the first place. And so this would mean Will and El could see each other, with Will being in the UD, and El being on the other side.

While it does seem pretty far off, given that you would think Will and El wouldn't be able to see each other from different sides, it is true in the story that El not only recognizes Will, but knows that he is in danger. She mentions that he is hiding specifically.

Which means she has likely seen him within the last 24 hours regardless.

This, in combination with Will being able to respond to El in the void at the end of the season in Castle Byers, when no one else outside of Terry and flayed-Billy have been able to, seems to imply that there is indeed something special about Will that makes him capable of communicating with El from the UD. Not only that, but El also seems to have an ability to be in this constant knowing state of how Will is doing, without even checking again to confirm. She's just certain of it. And she seems terrified about it.

Going forward, El never uses a picture of Will to find him. She never did. And more often than not, they don’t show us what she see’s either, not until the very end. And that’s the moment they reveal that he was able to communicate with her.

Again, there was really no reason to have El recognize Will. If anything it complicates things. But the fact that they chose to introduce this concept, with a scene from the original pitch that was related to El’s younger brother, with her pointing at his name cryptically, startling Benny, only to revamp it and have El not say anything at all while pointing at the picture of Will, startling Mike… It just really makes you stop and think.

Which brings me to the other aspect of this that might have people doubting, which is that El’s brother was originally younger than her.

We know Will is not younger than El, so how could this apply to him?

Well, it might be helpful to consider that in the original script, El was actually 10 years old, while the boys were always 12. Meaning that for some reason, they decided to age her up to the age of the boys, aka the same age as Will…

Ever since @erikiara80 shared this brother discovery with me, I have been sort of reeling. It then led to other little discoveries of changes they made between Montauk and Stranger Things.

It’s important to understand that the Montauk bible and the original script precedes what we ended up with in the final product, with it finally changing and evolving months, maybe even a year since that original vision. Even casting occurred before writing started for the first season. We know this because casting announcements were made in June and August of 2015, with writing not starting until August going into early 2016, simultaneously while they were filming.

And believe it or not, what I've discovered is that a lot of the changes they made between their original plans and what we see in the final product, have to do with not only Willel, but also Byler.

If you've read the original script for Montauk, you'll know that Mike's crush on Jennifer Hayes was focused on right from the jump, along with the birthmark on his face being focused on, which was the main cause of the bullying he experienced.

This has actually been talked about recently, and some of the claims people make do fit with what I am genuinely starting to consider here, which is that the initial plan for what makes Mike an outcast shifted.

I think when they completed casting, and started actually deep diving into what they wanted this world to look like, both from a short-term and long-term standpoint, they were presented with some pretty interesting discoveries, arguably already hiding in their initial plans without realizing it.

And this is where it sort of becomes a 'chicken or the egg' situation. Because which one came first? Byler or Willel?

I can't say for certain, because obviously this is all just speculation. But in the case that Willel came first, I think Byler would come very naturally after that.

The Duffers themselves are twins. Then they hire Noah, who is a twin. Then they're thinking and planning for El's past and how her family all fits into this, and they're thinking... wait a damn minute... We could totally Star Wars this bitch!

And then when they think it couldn't get any better, they uncover another layer that they hadn't planned or really considered in their initial plans.

While Will was always going to have sexual identity issues according to the Montauk bible, meaning that the writing process for him likely involved sitting down imagining scenarios that encapsulated this arc for Will from the beginning, they were simultaneously now finding very interesting aspects of Mike's character that made it hard not to at least consider the possiblity that Mike is not exactly straight.

Just think about it. The Byers and Wheelers are basically polar opposites on the spectrum of what a family looks like. While Will's discovery and acceptance of his queerness is interesting to explore because he comes from a low-income, single-mom household, all while having been bullied for years based on his perceived queerness, he also has a mother and brother constantly reinforcing that they will accept him no matter what. They've been sort of hitting us over the head with it for years, and so it wouldn't be very satisfying for his entire arc to merely lead up to something we've known all along. It's pretty much a given at this point.

On the other side of the spectrum, Mike comes from a more upper-middle class family at the end of a cul-de-sac, more aligned with what a nuclear family looks like. Mike's family is also presented as being more conservative, and while Karen does give that very queer-coded speech to Mike in s1 (I'm convinced they only wrote this after deciding to explore queer-coding more heavily with Mike), it also comes with comments from Ted and even still Karen that hint that they are probably not as open-minded and accepting as Will's family is to him. Which means Mike's arc would be a lot more about acceptance around him from his loved ones who we have been led to believe might not be as accepting of his queerness in contrast to Will.

And so as they're putting this story together, and they're being presented with something very interesting. Two similar experiences that play out in different ways because of the characters circumstances.

Will goes missing, and his twin sister with a buzzcut pops up and has the ability to help them find Will.

This leads to several moments where El is being compared to as not only a boy, but Will as well.

Now suddenly, their initial plans to have Mike's arc be about having a girl be interested in him and to hopefully have his first kiss and feel like less of a loser, starts to look a lot like what the experience a queer kid in his position might encounter growing up in the environment that he did.

And if you don't want to take my word for it, just hear the Duffer's themselves hinting at what they initially planned for Mike and the fact that it changed.

The changes don't stop there.

Believe it or not, 'It was a seven', did not exist in the initial pitch. When the boys went outside bickering over Nancy, they leave right after that.

Another thing that changed from the first script, was Scott Clarke's introduction:

And so you might be thinking, who cares? What does that have to do with anything?

Well, it's interesting because the line we end up with on the show is arguably one of the most on the nose Twelvegate proofs to date. Mind you, this is from the first episode:

Why chuck the original version, which was arguably more interesting and fascinating in terms of it hinting at the mysteriousness surrounding this story, only to replace it with him listing off tips about their upcoming test?

Well, I think it's the irony of it all. Here Mr. Clarke is practically telling us where to look to figure stuff out for ourselves what is going on, with all the kids filing out and ignoring him...

I relate to Scott a litttle too much in this shot here, any time I try to drop Willel evidence.

And the changes go on, as they obviously would.

Things like Terry Ives not even being El's mom, but actually a man who more so aligns with the characterization of Murray.

And one very interesting one I almost overlooked was in Hopper's introduction, where instead of a kids drawing done by who we assume to be Sarah, we actually see a picture on the wall of him and his wife and daughter... Interesting that they decided to switch it something that is a lot less definitive in presenting what Hopper's past looked like...

If you've made it this far, congratulations.

If you still think I'm out of my mind, just remember that El was going to have a brother in the original script, but they scrapped the scene and gave a near identical one to introduce her connection to Will instead 😘

#byler #stranger things #willel twins #twelvegate #montauk #as you can see #i am out of my mind #and i'm okay with that #i've spent the last couple months trying to make a video going over all the willel twin evidence #and i can't decide if it's even possible to do without going over an hour #like there is just so much shit that fits too perfectly into this family being ripped apart by mind control and time shenanigans #i hope to have it done soon #trying to make it less than 20 minutes #but it's probably going to end up being closer to an hour #especially with this stuff from the montauk pitch being added to the mix now #anyways #willel and byler are the curtain behind the curtain #if you are open to one of them #you are bound to stumble across the other #and they don't want that to happen #stay tuned for the inevitable twin imagery to continue in s5 related to willel leading up to the big reveal #bc it's arguably the most consistent thing about this damn show #and tbh this all just makes the queer-coding for mike in s1 a lot more concrete to me #them exploring will's queerness through his dad's expectations for him to do more 'manly' things like play baseball #and jonathan saying he shouldn't like things just bc people telll him he's supposed to #how they connect that narratively with the boys being at a baseball field when mike's being pressured about his supposed feelings for el #with the bullies showing up and literally being homophobic seconds later #the fact that jennifer hayes did in fact exist in the original pilot and was the girl mike had a crush on #only for them to scrap that and just make it about her having a crush on will...#never once introducing this idea of mike liking her...

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mari-lair · 9 months

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quick sketch of a mood swings AU where the body wasp was a little different (Teru in Aoi's body, Akane in Teru's, and Aoi in Akane's)

#tbhk #toilet bound hanako kun #teru minamoto #aoi akane #akane aoi #jshk #jibaku shonen hanako kun #mood swings au #idk if I'll explore this swap but the idea was haunting me i had to get it out of my system

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rathologic · 3 months

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I've always found Alexander Saburov interesting, especially P1 Rubin's take on him where he tells how Alexander in incognito saved people from burning house and went unrecognized for the deed (nor flaunted it). Wonderful and easy to miss characterization.

YES saburov's fucked up sense of performing duty by putting himself at risk... my favorite... have had thoughts brewing in response to this that aren't quite cooked enough yet but it's very much a gendered standard that he holds himself to IMO, of idealized masculinity as a responsibility. as an active role and as the way things must be done. making the choices that he thinks need to be made regardless of how bad they are for him. pairing beautifully with katerina's self-destructive attempts to conform to the extremely feminine-gendered role of mistress, pairing wonderfully with the two of them's catastrophic attempt to conform to the heteropatriarchal nuclear family archetype by adopting the changeling :^) and especially how this is a function of how saburov relates to his Job, a role that's been passed down in his family and Actually Is critical to the function of the Town, inescapably so as long as the system of rulers exists

#it Is a little funny to me that p1 showed this family structure being flawed so extensively (with all three rulers!) and now p2 is a You #Must Get A Wife And Kids Then Everything Will Be Fine simulator (...more or less w/ all three rulers but mostly re: the player).#alexander saburov #asks #anonymous #also stream ee's song Big Climb. I have no idea how it wasn't previously on my ee exclusive saburovs playlist but it's very them #further: I do think gender is a factor in saburov's vitriol towards peter/the architects (in this view of masculinity as self-discipline #/moderation. They Don't Do It Like That) and I think that's a fun field to explore in several directions. and to contrast with rubin who ha #a similar outlook about his own gender ('perfect valor' etc.) but is an outcast and out of the spotlight in a gay coded way; whereas #alexander and his wife are under the utmost scrutiny wrt being held to Gendered Positions in the town AND are bound by duty and history to #uphold its traditions. like. saburov has no escape that could result in a healthier relationship with gender #and if you're a wise-minded saburovs t4t enjoyer... well... The Layers Only Deepen #pathologic

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bonnies-bowling-alley · 4 months

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I like to think Sun has less patience for the player in hw2 assuming they're an adult. Becuase he expects them to know better compared to how he is with kids? I feel like he has more patience towards children, even more so if he knows they have a learning disability and a lot more friendlier towards them than to Adults. And Given the fact that he probably wasn't exactly treated well by the staff [gestures at the state of his room, the lack of maintenance on his model, etc].

Hence why he is more agitated and sasses the player. I don't believe he would be this aggressive if we are playing as a kid especially with how he was in SB.

plus not to mention…we are playing in a simulation which appears to be post SB but PRE-Ruin perhaps?…so there is the possibility of exaggeration in the simulations part. Especially the simulation is based off of things the staff has to put up with…

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dragonanon · 2 years

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With Grafaiai being a thing now, I can't stop thinking about a scenario with the Submas where they're investigating a string of random graffiti appearing through out the subway tunnels and stations.

Ingo is convinced it's just some dumb kid who thinks they're being funny, but the cameras never pick anything up that would indicate that, and even then graffiti seems to happen when no one is around. Emmet is pissed because not only has this been going on for weeks and they've had no luck whatsoever finding the culprit, but he's also now having to keep his poor Galvantula inside because he's mysteriously drawn to the graffiti and keeps trying to lick it which results in him getting sick and unable to move. This has happened to Crustle too, who also seems drawn to the graffiti, so Emmet believes it's not a coincidence that the graffiti keeps happening and it makes pokémon sick.

Finally, one night by SHEER accident, they find the culprit. And instead of being some kid or angsty teen, it's this little fucker.

Emmet's immediate response is to basically go "what on God's green earth is that ugly little thing?!" Ingo thought it was a very dirty Pansage at first till Emmet pointed out it's fingers were FAR too long it to be a Pansage, or any other monkey pokémon they could think of. They'd never seen anything like it before and were almost in awe.

But before either of them can get close enough to try and catch it however, the small primate hissed and sprayed some toxic "paint" from its mouth at them, before skittering away far faster than they thought it'd be.

This leads to the equivalent of a Benny Hill chase sequence, with the Submas trying to catch the little creature and failing because not only is it extremely fast, but anytime they manage to corner it, it sprays more "paint" at them and manages to escape. After several failed attempts to catch it, they finally lose track of the creature and have to call it a night. Ingo is exhausted, covered in "paint", and frankly has given up hope that catching it is even possible. Emmet though, who is just as covered with "paint" as Ingo is, is bitter af and VOWS to capture it because now it's a matter of pride. He refuses to be bested by some smug little gremlin monkey with freaky long fingers.

Several more attempts were made to capture the pokémon with no success, and Emmet, now covered in even MORE "paint", FINALLY admits defeat. Of course as soon as he does, you appear. You explain that you're a tourist from the Paldea region, and you're looking for your little companion pokémon as he got separated from you. You remark that the "paint" that covers Emmet after his latest failed capture attempt looks JUST like the stuff your pokémon uses.

Emmet is incredulous, insisting that the pokémon who made the paint is a terrible little monster who can't be caught, and there's no way anyone would willingly live with such a creature. Ingo doesn't believe it either, having witnessed his brother's several failed attempts to catch it. Sure enough though, you whistle and shout "Grafaiai! Comere' baby!" and the little creature comes running in out of nowhere and leaps into your arms, crooning and making sweet little monkey noises as you kiss its little head and cuddle it. "There you are! I've been looking EVERYWHERE for you, you little stinkpot! I missed you~ Yes I did~ Yes I did~"

Ingo is in complete disbelief that this is the same creature that's been running amok around the station for weeks and combating any attempts to capture it with utmost hostility. Emmet looks like he's going to have a stroke as he congratulates you on the reunion in a hollow voice. Ingo asks you what the pokémon is, remarking that he's never seen anything like it.

You giggle, and explain that "this little ball of mischief" is a pokémon called "Grafaiai". You explained how it's a poison and normal type pokémon native to the Paldea region, and it's known to be very moody and fastidious so they tend to live alone. But it's mostly known for its habit if painting its colorful and toxic saliva on trees and rocks as a way of marking territory and capturing prey. "Yeah this little guy has a mischievous streak, but he's also very sweet. I hope he didn't cause too much trouble for you both."

Emmet proceeds to laugh hysterically and walk away, probably to go have a mental breakdown somewhere. Leaving Ingo to explain to you how they'd been trying to capture your "sweet little baby" for weeks, because he kept painting on the walls and trains. "Yeah that sounds about right. He's a little menace, I wouldn't be shocked if he thought you both getting angry and chasing him was funny. Which of course would only encourage him to paint everything even more." The smug little grin the small primate gives Ingo confirms your suspicion that he was mostly doing everything on purpose.

At least now they don't have to clean up anymore graffiti.......Until you start dating the Submas, and now they have to deal with the mischievous little Grafaiai everyday. They love you though, and eventually Grafaiai grows on them. Now when Ingo cooks dinner, Grafaiai hangs out on his shoulder and Ingo sneaks him little pieces of food as he cooks. And Grafaiai will curl up on Emmet's lap if he's sitting on the couch as a way to get ear scritches.

#shitpost #lmfaoooo #this ended up being WAY longer than i intended #pokémon #tl;dr awful little graffiti monke torments local train men for weeks and ends up introducing them to their future gf #ingo warmed up to grafaiai pretty quickly after learning more about it and finding out he actually quite likes to explore #emmet held more of a grudge but softened after one day he was sad about something and grafaiai brought him a bunch of sweets and berries #because grafaiai likes sweets and berries and they make him happy so he decided to bring some to emmet as if to say #'don't be sad i brought you treats! please eat them. 🥺'#it was obviously a very sweet gesture and it was the first time emmet realized that you were right about him being suprisingly sweet #he bonded more with him after that and now when he gets home from work grafaiai will bound up to him and scream until he pets him #pokémon scarlet and violet #grafaiai #submas #ingo #emmet #ingo and emmet

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voluptuarian · 1 month

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idk I really love the ideas explored in cosmic horror and I think those ideas could be used in non-horror genres, or in less straightforward combination with other genres to create really interesting fiction. Cosmic horror is like: an event happened. It was terrible, and beautiful, and utterly beyond previous understanding. Like trauma it can only be lived through, not told or explained, and so surviving it is the ultimate isolation for those who see it alone, and a supreme bond for those with shared experience. It has destroyed your previous worldviews, changed your understanding of everything, altered your mind, changed perhaps even your body. You are different and you cannot explain why or how. You have been cast adrift from the old world and are now at least eternally on the edge of a new one. You can choose to turn away from this new reality but you cannot leave it behind, no more than you can change the neural pathways in your brain or the pattern of your cells.

And like, maybe this is horrible for you. Or maybe it was once. Maybe this is only the temporary anguish of growth and you will emerge transformed into something else. Maybe this horror is only the fear of unfamiliarity and inexperience, and like a first taste or a first sexual experience, fear will give way to something strange, but desirable. Maybe you will come not only to enjoy the new, but prefer it. Rather than isolate you, maybe you will be joined to a new community. In losing your old understanding, reality, self, maybe you have found freedom.

Wouldn't a caterpillar fear change if it could understand what would happen to it, that it would first be unmade in order to be made anew? Wouldn't the cocoon be a place of total horror, the future butterfly self a nightmare scenario? And then, after all, when it has changed-- it's a no more an immature crawling thing, but something more profound, with avenues of movement and understanding beyond anything it's old self could have conceived of. Would that still be a horrific reality for the butterfly, or what it had been meant for all along?

Even if the moth could be warned that the fire would kill it, wouldnt there still be an attraction in the flames, even as they burned it?

We are frightened of many things that pose no danger to us, and no ill will. And anything frightening, looked at long enough, will lose its fearfulness, become mundane, absurd, attractive. If you look into the abyss long enough, what will look back at you? What do you bring with you into the abyss, and how will the abyss itself be changed your influence? And will the abyss, altered intimately by your presence, experience horror at the change and fear of the one who brought it?

#not even sure exactly what I'm talking about #but like #I think there is so much that can be done with cosmic horror concepts that goes beyond the confines of horror #that explores those ideas outside the bounds of simply negative or positive experience #or that turns the scenario around to explore it from other angles #like is that pact with an outsider entity ever not evil? can it be a satisfying relationship for either or both parties?#was that eldritch abomination actually as afraid of you as you were of it?#sure the extra dimensionsal reality you've encountered is bizarre alien and grotesque but so is the human body and we deal #also-- so is human genitalia and we want to fuck it anyway so maybe that's not just revulsion you're feeling but something more interesting #and like that line from annihilation where she describes reality in the shimmer as “dreamlike”#and then the guy goes “so nightmarish”#and she says “no”#even if it is horror straight out-- is that all there is to it? Nothing more??#annihilation (the film) really is a good example of what I'm talking about (one of so many reasons I love it)#also call of the sea-- the other characters are having a straight up horror experience #while the mc is having a very different and much more layered experience-- the euphoria or horror really varying #by who encountered it and how

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