#technically i can only speak for the original the english and spanish dubs | Explore Tumblr Posts and Blogs

motsimages · 3 years

Text

There are a couple of things that bother me when there are “universal translators” in works of fiction (specially on TV). Let’s use Star Trek as an example because it is well known enough so that people have a reference.

First of all, it doesn’t translate: it interprets. There should mistakes, misunderstandings and mistranslations but for the sake of the story and for simplifying the work of the writers, etc. let’s say it doesn’t and it interprets as human do. And because it also translates text, we’ll go with “translator”.

Second: if I speak in my language and the translator translates, I speak in my language. My lips shouldn’t match the audio, even if (technobabble) it is my voice. If you wanted to portray this accurately (I have a chip that translates, there is a something in the ship that translates, etc.), you would even hear my voice underneath the translation. But fine again, we don’t. I should at least looked dubbed and this is something that could be shown in a film (but we don’t because it bothers people, it looks weird which in this case: it should). Why and how don’t I have a voice over? Is there an AI that makes it look like voice and sound match?

Third and related to second: if I speak in my language, I gesture in my language. When I speak Spanish, I gesture in Spanish, my face looks Spanish. When I speak in another language, I make my very best to gesture in that language, to copy what native people do. Often, I don’t succeed (specially if I get emotional about something, angry, sad, relaxed...). I gesture weirdly in English and Russian, I’m inaccurate in the way I move. You could tell I’m not a native just by looking at me. This is something a translator cannot do.

Fourth and related to third: All humans in a spaceship gesture the same, regardless of their country of origine. Fine. They spend years working together in a small space, they end up copying each other. But why aliens gesture the same as humans? How come there is a Klingon ambassador coming for a week, a Klingon who lives amongst Klingons and left only for this mission, gesturing the same as a human? Nah, impossible. (And this can be portrayed with acting, you don’t need extra technical work as you would if you were to dub everyone).

And last but not least: there is a limit in how many languages the translator can accurately translate. Most common languages are the ones that get the best translation and the rest... Look at Deepl. How many languages does it have? Which are they? English-Spanish you find good translations easily but Thai-Punjabi??? Good luck with that. Even in the EU they have relay for interpreting difficult combinations. With English you’re safe, Croatian-German? Not so sure (and so they go through English or French, like Croatian-English-German). So even if the translator has 1000 languages at a good level, it may not have 1000 language pairs and even if it does, it stops there. There are languages that aren’t included.

There is a character, Saru, who is the only one from his planet. He left, never found another one like him (well, he finds his sister at some point, they go back to his planet but mainly, he’s all alone). He is also the only one who bothered to learn languages. No wonder. If he doesn’t speak one of the most common languages, the translator can’t help him.

In this regard, there should be a team of linguists aboard to work with the AI creating a database, updating languages, vocabulary and idioms. Saru is probably working on his own language, given that only he speaks it and that he is a polyglot. I mean, how do you think Google Translate or Deepl work? (and I know because I have translated for AI and I have worked for WordReference). Someone has to, at least, develop a program to create linguistic databases, if not manually entering whatever texts you need. Ideally, each spaceship has a team of linguists and everytime the meet with another ship, they exchange databases. They are way too far to be sending emails.

As I said, I wrote this mainly thinking of Star Trek but it applies to any science fiction that relies on a machine to interpret languages. I also think of the movie “I am mother” in Netflix where a girl raised by a robot speaks the same English as a woman raised by humans. That shouldn’t be the case but that is for another essay.

#star trek #universal translator #saru #languages #translating languages #interpretation #linguistics #science fiction #i am mother

16 notes · View notes

jacearthereal · 3 years

Text

Written panel of Guillermo Rojas (Dean Winchester’s voice actor):

Note: I’m not fluent in spanish, but my native language is portuguese and I could understand a lot from what he said. I hope this clarifies more things in this fandom, because everyday a new thing comes up and we try not to panic.

What it’s not here, it’s because I didn’t understand enough to write something coherent, but I tried my best. I hope y’all like it.

Ada: He's been a voice actor from season 12 to episode 15x18. He tells us that unfortunately he got covid in the last 2 episodes and he understands that he will have to record the [last] episodes again. Let's start with the easier questions, because I don't know if you guys know, but the Mexican dubbing ‘broke the internet.’

Guillermo: Yes, I’m sorry I couldn’t answer all your questions, but I was in the middle phase of covid, with a tracheal symptom that didn’t allow me to speak. Now I’m working with therapy. Apparently, I have two sequels. One is bad and the second is not. So I couldn't answer everyone I was looking on the internet. On insta, facebook, youtube — A channel that I never updated — on the situation that happened with Dean and this other companion, right.

Ada: but let's start with other questions. Because you've worked on a lot of series, live-actions and animations. And the first question is “how different is the process of directing live-action and directing animation and which one do you prefer?

Guillermo: The process for each other is somewhat similar. Because we have a quality that we have to respect and give in this case.

Ada (translating what Guillermo said): The dialogues are given by the production house or as we call “the client”.

Guillermo: And in this case we have to pay attention to the alignments that they ask us, which depend a lot on the production we are working with.

(Ada repeats in English)

Guillermo: Yes, none of them are the same. It would be lying because we could have two live-actions and they’re not the same alignments. These are basic points that we need to follow.

Ada: (speaks very similarly and says): When you're acting, that's when the change comes.

Guillermo: The big difference that I can tell you would be the technical points to follow in each one of them. The question would be authorial, in this case. And what gives 100% of each one of us.

Ada: Ok, next question. What is your favorite role you've played and why?

Guillermo: I believe that the first one I can tell you — today it’s not the most and I will say why — It remains Kiefer Sutherland / Jack Bauer 24h. First, because it has a very beautiful story of how I stayed with (Jack Bauer?). Basically, I was directing the dubbing in the country and the idea was that I shouldn’t do it because I had many directions, but in the end we continued to record through the years because the people listened to me. And then I worked extra hours.

(Ada says in english that they managed to organize themselves).

Ada: So they paid you more?

Guillermo: No.

Ada (About Guillermo): They pay me more because I work more, but not for extra hours. It was my first leading role. It was not worth losing it.

Guillermo: I have worked for 25 years with voice acting in all areas. I'm an audio engineer. I work as an audio engineer, as a post-audio producer, as a talent director and as a talent.

(Ada repeats in English)

Guillermo: [...] very complicated content because it was a lot. Record, edit, direct and be there.

(Ada repeats in english and congratulates him)

Guillermo: Yes, it will be many years for me. I do audio production and post production of audio and video. And a friend one day; and it was because one day we went to eat. I don't remember the day, and he said “You don't work, you play(?)—” and it's true, I like what I do. But if you ask me which character I liked the most, today, it would be the 911, the Fox series that is just being produced if I'm not mistaken for the fourth or fifth season. A team of firefighters, and just from recording, my tears fall with the empathy that the production brings, but the acting has an impressive ending.

He says something about authorial issues to feel empathy with Peter Krause.

And he talks about the director having an impressive drive not only to direct, but to adapt dialogues and there’s a synergy working on this TV show.

He says something about the director supporting him and giving him characters and that he really enjoy doing because the director gives him a certain freedom to act and that allows him to feel the character and that he loves to work with him.

Ada: In the dubbing process, do you try to get clues or directions of performance from the original script and if you do it do you feel limiting or try to get your own inspiration from the dialogues?

Guillermo: I think there is a bit of both in that last question. Original alignment would be to follow what we are seeing as performance. Remember that dubbing has been a part of it— we must make a parallel alignment with the language.

Ada (repeats): A parallel work with the original.

Guilhermo: So the initial alignments we try to expand all the possibilities and all the alignments that authorially they allow us to practically give 100% of us. So the limit wouldn't always exist, I mean here in Mexico, at least.

Ada (referring to what Guilhermo said): We follow the instructions, we follow the original voice, there are no limits, as long as we don't — as we say here in Mexico — don't pee outside the toilet. The instructions are very clear.

Ada: Since you mentioned the paths and as I mentioned at the beginning, I have a question. What was the guide in this latest supernatural dialogue that broke the internet?

Guillermo: It’s a curious thing, because no director or server had so much idea of the trend that was there because in the information they said previously, we didn't know that something like this could happen.

Ada says something about his birthday being last week because Guilhermo is eating a cake (?) and she asks us to say congratulations to him and he thanks her.

Guillermo: So it was sincere when we recorded. So we were like, "What happened?" We did that, but we saw nothing of the others in the production. (I think he's referring to nobody saying anything) and not even after the recording that this could happen.

Ada: And here I have to make a change because it’s obvious that we are referring to Castiel declaring himself to Dean after twelve intense years, but the question is Dean's answer, because everyone heard very clearly “Y yo a ti”.

Guillermo: Y yo a ti. Yes.

Ada: Where did that “Y yo a ti” come from?

Guillermo: The adaptation was entirely from my director. The adaptation lineup was his and I said what he asked me.

Ada (about Guillermo): I asked him about the “i love you”, I know that Tumblr was waiting for this moment. It was the director's adaptation, he gave me the instructions, it was his fault.

Guillermo: But we all love it. Everything enchanted us. We have never heard it come so directly. If we remember well, throughout all the seasons, we hardly see a story in which Dean finds himself really in love with a woman. It didn’t happen. Unlike his brother.

Ada: I will say more. A little bit ahead of his time.

Guillermo: Yes, but never able to separate from empathy in general. It never conflicted.

Ada (About Guillermo): It wasn't his [...]. We can compare Dean with his brother. We remember the relationship he had (Sam) the past two seasons. Eileen.

Guillermo: And it was quite intense and painful in the end. Dean basically didn't suffer that. (and he says something like the closest thing to Dean was when he lost his mother).

Ada: More than once. We have a question. So it’s not a rogue translator, but a rogue director?

Guillermo: [Adrian] Fogarty has a tendency, he has very intense skills. And one of them is to adapt dialogues. You see Fogarty's work when they translate it and you have time to do it. Even if you’re not directing [...] in spanish. And in the script, if I don't forget, it said “también yo” or something like that and then we changed to "Y yo a ti".

Ada (about what he said): Because of the movement of the lips and other things. I can explain as a translator, my absolute hatred for lip sync.

Guillermo: This part is an important topic, but nowadays with the speed of production we have, it’s difficult to pay attention to this part, but we should. And in that sense, specifically, we don't have this ability to adapt like that. When we put our skills together [...] Fogarty does his job. There’s a Fogarty in every company.

(Ada talks about her cat that showed up).

Ada: This is my cat. He's a huge Dean Winchester’s fan. But he gets irritated with Sam.

(Guillermo asks why).

Ada: I don't know.

She talks about muting (?) the episodes (in spanish and english) in Sam's parts or the cat gets irritated and that he already stole Sam's Funko arm. She talks about getting funkos for Guillermo. He didn't know about them.

Ada: They are asking a lot if you know what Dean said in the original script before Fogarty changed it?

Guillermo: It was something like that. It was totally correct, clearly. It was something “Yo también, también yo” something like that.

(My note: I have to say that I think Guillermo thought it was about the spanish script here).

Ada: Did you hear the original when you were dubbing?

Guillermo: Yes, of course.

Ada: And do you remember hearing in English "I love you too"?

Guillermo: No.

(Ada says that supernatural has a very intense and real fandom, as he can see).

Ada: What was your favorite dubbing episode?

Guillermo: With my short-term memory, the latter.

(Ada repeats in english)

Guillermo: It's because it says a lot. In one scene it said it all. So it’s impressively very beautiful. I will never forget.

Ada tells him that in the episode after Castiel, Dean finally has a dog. Guillermo is surprised and says "He finally has one" and Ada says that the dog is called Miracle.

Ada: We have a question. Before you started working with supernatural, had you seen the TV show?

Guillermo: Yes. Before I started working with supernatural, I was watching between season 5 to 7. I watched at midnight and I was scared. I lived in a house that was kind of an abandoned house so there were some strange noises.

(Guillermo says he heard the original Dean's voice actor from that time).

Ada: They’re asking if the original script said anything about Dean's feelings for Cas or was it all put up by Fogarty?

Guillermo: In the original we received there was no indication that Dean was in love, or that he corresponded, that I know of. That line was what launched the whole series. We didn't see it coming.

Ada (adding): It was the director because that was what made sense.

Guillermo: I looked on the internet so many questions about what happened. And yes, both the director and the writer decided to take a very hidden trend between the two of them in various takes and very sensitive dialogues, to satiate that ‘we’ have feelings for each other’, but it was so tenuous that they hardly noticed anything.

Ada says that it was the director in English, who took this sensitive and subtle path. And he says that this brings to the fact that he’s a heller.

(My note: Who didn’t notice? Warner? All of them? And I also think Ada said “in english” by mistake).

(Guillermo goes back to saying that he was taken by surprise).

Guillermo: Because all we saw was that to be a real man you have to be like Dean Winchester.

Ada: You’re going to break the internet again with this. (she repeats what he said and adds) And Dean Winchester is in love with Castiel.

Guillermo: And to me, it was beautiful. Because it's not about gender, it's about feelings. So it was a wonderful move by the writers. I didn't see it coming and still liked it.

Ada: I believe it was very beautiful. It was a play by the original american writers. That you didn't see it coming, but when you saw it, you liked it.

(My note: She said american writers, but why? Guillermo was talking about Fogarty’s script, wasn’t him?)

Ada: We have two questions. Was anything left out of the translation? (And Ada herself answers with) No. Nothing was left out of the translation.

Ada: Have you ever been called back to re-record the “Y yo a ti”?

Guillermo: No.

Ada: He was not asked to redo the dubbing.

Guillermo: It was clear to me that the director understood the perfect texture of this text.

Ada: I have a question. From experience, because at some point I wanted to dub, but also to translate dubbing, and I noticed a couple of very complicated dialogues [...]

Ada talks about how they had to change a line (the original was in Japanese) but they said it was for children so even if it was what the character said in the original, the company didn’t accept it.

Ada: So my question is, do you know if supernatural has quality control by Warner?

Guillermo: I would lie if I said yes. But I have worked for many years as a director and actor. Some materials like superheroes and things like that would fit in a title like this, but not supernatural. So the decisions and directions are all up to the director.

Ada: Did you act Dean like he was in love with Castiel all this time?

Guillermo: No. It was a surprise. I will be very sincere. For me to say to a very dear friend, to a very dear person, I’ll say "I love you."

Ada (adding): I have no problem.

Guillermo: So I didn't feel that way, I'm sincere.

Ada: You went that way, then said no.

(My note: Strange, uh?)

Guillermo (laughing): Yes, what happened?

Ada: Are you going to voice Jensen on The Boys?

Guillermo says nobody told him anything. That he’s practically being a month just virtually. So they don't have all the invitations.

(My note: I don’t know if this part is entirely correct, but that’s what I got).

Ada: He didn't receive the invitation because he had to spend a month away because of the covid. So he cannot speak to you.

Ada asks fans to write that they want Guillermo Rojas to dub Jensen Ackles on The boys.

Ada: You can do it. Start writing now.

Harlequin: Is Dean Winchester your favorite character to voice or is it another one?

Guillermo: No, no. [but] he's one of my favorites, of course.

(He talks about it being a spectacular job).

Ada: Are you on twitter?

Guillermo: Yes, but I don't use it very much. I like facebook more.

(My note: He scaped from us).

Ada: What is your opinion, now with everything you know, about Dean's declaration to Cas?

Guillermo: I love how they did it, because none of us saw it coming. And we recorded it. And I believe that of all the personality from what we have of the character, we can know that if there’s someone who keeps his feelings reclusive it’s Dean Winchester.

Ada asks about his coworker, Castiel's voice actor, if he knows his opinion.

Guillermo: I didn't see him. We don't see each other very much because the companies we work for don’t coincide much. He has already recorded with me in productions that I directed, but I haven't seen him in four months or more.

Ada says someone asked if he can do a “Hello, Cas” like Dean Winchester, to ease the pain of the finale.

Guillermo: Sure, why not. (he says “Hello, Cas”)

Ada: There you are, girls.

Guillermo says he has a friend who loves Dean, and she said he killed the character she loves most, because Dean has a thicker voice [in the original].

Guillermo says that if she doesn't like it, she should watch the original.

Carolina, friend of Guillermo, appears and Ada repeats the question.

Carolina says Dean Winchester is her boyfriend. And she says that after hearing the dubbing, she will never be able to see or hear Dean as her boyfriend anymore.

Guillermo playfully pushes Carolina off the screen.

Ada: Have you seen the end of the last episode?

Guillermo: No, I want to see it when I record it.

(My note: #PrayforGuillermo)

Ada starts talking about him recording a “Hola, Cas” and Guillermo asks “In what sense” and Ada says “When they meet after the declaration” Guillermo thinks it’s a spoiler and goes “They meet again?” and Ada says she will not give spoilers. Guillermo thought that Dean said "I love you" to Cas and Cas didn't come back from the empty and if Cas comes back, that's how he would say "Hola, Cas".

And Ada reminds him that in the first few seasons, Dean said to Cas “It's not for nothing, but the last person who looked at me like that, I got laid.”

Then she said that someone asked him to tell Cas the whole declaration of love, but Ada reiterated that they wouldn’t break the internet anymore.

Ada: They are asking you to be godfather of the fandom.

Guillermo: Of course.

Ada tells him that he’s the godfather now and asks him to leave a message for fans who are now discovering the mexican dubbing. He thanks us for being part of this. He says that they do this work with passion. And he thanked all the people from all countries who are watching this project.

Ada: With that in mind, as you didn't see the ending of supernatural, What’s your ideal ending for Dean Winchester?

Guillermo: I believe that for everyone, since they sacrificed their lives for their families once again, for the well-being and happiness of everyone, I believe that if someone deserves to be well, peaceful and happy, [it has to be] at least one of the three.

(Ada talks about Jack)

Guillermo: Jack has joined, but he can achieve his happiness at another nest.

They say goodbye. Guillermo wishes ‘Merry Christmas’.

The end.

#supernatural #guillermo rojas #panel guillermo #dean winchester #voice actor #destiel #deancas #spn 15x18 #Sam Winchester #castiel #jack #spn #spn 15x19 #spn season 16 #spanish dub

28 notes · View notes