#are u really about upset about misogyny or do u just hate a character so much ur projecting onto them ??? | Explore Tumblr Posts and Blogs

stuck-in-the-ghost-zone · 5 months

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walks into ur inbox and sets up a big conspiracy board. hi mac :3 do u wanna hear about the hs epilogues and hs2??? well i'm gonna learn u a thing about homed stuck post canon!!!! here we fucking go

ok so idk how much of the epilogues u have read, but basically to sum it up: it was made as a way to make the fans of canon hs angry. like that's kinda the whole point. and it worked because honestly!! they are quite terrible!!! and i do like them a lot but there are a lot of things that were done in bad faith with very little care to original canon, such as: raging misogyny in the form of making jane a hashtag girlboss who sexually abused jake, jade who has no concept of sexual boundaries and was literally framed to be the girl who got in between the gay couple, and like. a lot more. so it's. very far from perfect. honestly a lot of the character writing isn't even that good

but something to keep in mind is that while yes, part of the reason a lot of it is written that way is because hussie just wanted to piss people off, there is kind of a canon reason for it??? dirk went kind of off the rails and absorbed the knowledge of all of his splinters and alternate timeline selves (which for a person who hates himself that much!!! not great!!! would drive a guy a little nuts!!!) and he got a little. bro strider-ish. very manipulative and Not Nice. and he also grabbed control over the entire narrative in the meat timeline so!!! he was just messing with people and trying to convince himself he didn't feel bad about it. sad!

and the candy timeline is controlled by alt!calliope who wanted to make the entire timeline nice and perfect and domestic, a war broke out between trolls and humans, shit hit the fan pretty bad, but the narrative only focuses on the romantic and family drama which says sooooooo much about how alt!callie views the world and these characters. she grew up obsessing over them and now can't process that these are real people who are friends with the alpha timeline version of herself and it drives me bonkers and fucking yonkers GIRL YOU ARE MESSING WITH PEOPLE YOU ARE NO DIFFERENT THAN YOUR BROTHER!!!! since ultimate!dirk absorbed the knowledge and memories of lord english through his absorption of arquiussprite he is basically lord fucking english so him and alt!calliope arguing over the timelines is literally just. two siblings who never grew up pulling their toys/friends back and forth and being upset because they can't get their own way IT'S INSANE

also the prose slaps sometimes. meat page 39 is an especially good example, like the way it capture's ult!dirk's character voice is. AAAAAAUGHJGHGH. god. the feelings of that part. the way he's clearly trying so hard not to care..... but he DOES. and you can TELL. honestly it really captures the tragedy of dirkjake so well. also candy page 14 is just. woagh. idk if you read that part but dirk dies in candy and it's just.... holyyyyy shit dude. it's a bit gorey and it is a suicide so maybe not the best part to read if you're in a bad state of mind but GOD. it just. there's something about it that somehow manages to capture dirk so well in a way. like of course his death would be self inflicted while feeling like he's doing something "right." jesus christ. i can give u links to my favourite pages if u wanna read any of em

ummm ANYWAY. hs2 is a continuation of BOTH timelines. john died in the meat timeline (sad) and got incredibly depressed in the candy timeline (also sad) but also he had a son with roxy in candy!!! his name is harry anderson and lemme tell u i love all of the kids in candy. there's harry, there's vrissy (an ecto clone of vriska adopted by rose and kanaya), tavros crocker-english (jane and jake's kid, the most tragic little guy ever tbh) and um. yiffy. yiffany longstocking lalonde-harley who was born when jade wanted a kid. i'm not gonna get into the whole ordeal of yiffy rn it was so balls to the wall insane if i explained everything i would be here all day. but also VRISKA IS THERE 🎉🎉🎉 and she is the highlight of the candy timeline lemme tell u. she's gonna end the troll/human war maybe. or maybe she'll just fuck around. who knows!!! it's vriska!!! i love her silly unpredictable swag :3

the meat timeline is where i go especially crazy because there is soooo much to analyze here in terms of prose and imagery and just. stuff in general. basically dirk and rose blasted off into space to go create a new intelligent species and introduce them to sburb and make their universe "relevant" again because something just feels Off about their current story, and they can't quite tell what it is so they're fixing it any way they can think of. also terezi tagged along because she was there when john died and she still hasn't found vriska and so she is also depressed so hey why not tag along on this death trip to the stars!!! also a bunch of others are trying to chase them down in their own spaceship, including: dave and karkat, jade, callie, and roxy (who is transmasc in the meat timeline!!!) also davekat is canon in the meat timeline and they have some lovely existential discussions about dave's immortality and karkat's mortality

anyway thats all i got for now. i feel insane about these guys and i'm hoping the new writers for hs2 can maybe improve the story a bit AND THEY ALREADY KIND OF HAVE!!! they brought sollux back, they made jake less of a punching bag and more of a character, they have vriska shenanigans, and jane is less of an Evil Girlboss and actually more of a homestuck villain if that makes sense!! AND THE ART STYLE IS BETTER TOO the hs2 style kind of devolved a bit and looked a bit terrible after a while (they might have just had new artists on at the time) but now they've got different artists!! and the guy heading it now worked on some of the original homestuck stuff!! so they're trying to slowly fix some of hussie's bad writing choices and expanding on the cool stuff that was already there!! i love hs2 it is my deeply flawed very fucked up baby :3 sorry this was so long. the demons got me u understand <3

I UNDERSTAND I UNDERSTAND. OMG THANK YOU. i actually did start reading candy/meat when they first came out (<< 17 yr old who was so so so excited for new homestuck content) and ended up. giving up on them REALLY quick. i actually got to the part where dirk died in candy and that was what made me put them down entirely bc i was SO upset . also like u said yes the way jade was characterized was so so so uncomfy for me. so those r like the two main factors that made me totally give up on meat and candy. and i kind of openly was super super mad about the epilogues for a while after that and then i realized. oh no. im a fool. im exactly the kind of person they were written to make angry HHFDBSJS. so i backed down and learned to appreciate them for what they were from a distance <3

i appreciate u SO MUCH for the deep dive bc holy shit. every once in a while i have the internal struggle of "god i miss homestuck. maybe i should go back and read the epilogues" and then i Dont hFBFSJDK . i actually do not know SHIT about hs2 in general !! i know there is. ult dirk who looks like an anime villain and i think thats great for him. aaaaand. the davekat laundry room scene which i have only seen panels for and not dialogue and i love them so much forever. and thats about the extent of my knowledge.

#IM GLAD U ENJOY THEM BC I ALSO LIKE TO KNOW EVERYTHING ALL THE TIME. i am avsorbing your knowledge #i think i would like to go back and read meat and candy again some day and give them another chance #((mainly so i can then read hs2 bc thats what i care about))#but i think i need to be in the correct headspace to do that and it has never really felt like the right time i guess #unfortunately the first time i consumed them i was a super super hyper depressed lonely college freshman #and they kind of scarred me a little hBFHDJSKS #I APPRECIATE THEM NOW THOUGH.#THANKNU THANK U THANK U i love whiskey inbox time #friends!!!#asks #anachronistic-falsehood

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thevalleyisjolly · 1 year

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for the fandom of your choice/whatever is more applicable (although if u have any spicy d20 takes 👀👀): 3, 5, 7, 13 and 18

Ooh, thanks Jack! Had curry for lunch today so I'm full of spice and ready to let loose!

3. screenshot or description of the worst take you've seen on tumblr

I stay out of the general tags for a reason, but my top 3 all fall along the same lines - the idea that K is a "toxic" person to pair with Evan because they don't really "see" him for him (...which is exactly the flaw and the room for growth that Erika built into the character), the idea that Ricky was "bullying" Cody because he was upset about Cody's cultural appropriation, and the whole non-consensual brain surgery thing with Norman.

(The common theme is people accusing Asian PCs of being mean to their white faves and therefore deserving of all sorts of bad things. Funny how that's happened not once, not twice, but thrice, huh)

5. worst discord server and why

As most of my friends and IRL classmates can tell you, I'm not super active on Discord and am horrible at answering messages in a timely fashion, so I don't actually have a server that I particularly dislike!

7. what character did you begin to hate not because of canon but because how how the fandom acts about them?

Keradin, Limon, and Evan Kelmp are the first ones that spring to mind. Keradin actually has some interesting character beats and flaws but I've never seen anyone try to engage with him as his own character, they just interpret everything he does as part of a relationship dynamic with Lapin. Limon is a fucking background comedic NPC and I am still annoyed that during and after the season, people were willing to credit him with so much complexity and interiority while downplaying/outright shitting on the actual PCs.

With Evan, I'm not a huge fan of the character concept to begin with but I'm even more livid that in one of the most diverse D20 seasons, fandom actively sidetracked and ignored and even denigrated every other character in favour of the sad white boy played by the sole white player at the table. To be clear, Brennan is great, nothing against the man, but I was in the tags when the season aired live and about 95% of the posts were Evan-centred. Sam, Whitney, and K barely showed up unless they were interacting with Evan or did a particularly funny bit. And that's not even getting into the hate and criticism that got thrown at K for daring to be in a mutual romantic relationship with Evan.

13. worst blorboficiation

See previous question, but oddly enough, I also feel like Emily gets this treatment sometimes? It's complicated because there's one portion of the fandom that acts like she's a terrible chaotic player who keeps trying to fuck up Brennan's plans for shits and giggles (which is outright wrong and misogynistic) and then there's another portion that acts like Emily's characters can do no wrong and Emily may in fact be the only player at the table who knows what she's doing at any given point in time while the rest of them are just comedic yahoos fumbling their way through dice rolls and jokes. Which, placing women on a pedestal is in fact also sexist, and it's not any better than the misogyny you're responding to. It's a huge disservice to the cast and it's especially a huge disservice to Emily - she creates incredibly complex and well thought out characters who have their strengths and their flaws, and acting like they're all perfect girlbosses who are right even when they're wrong erases so much of the depth that Emily put into them.

18. it's absolutely criminal that the fandom has been sleeping on...

I mean, we all know my answer is of course going to be Cumulous Rocks, but as per a recent post of mine (and many posts in the past), the answer is also more broadly applicable to Zac and pretty much all of his PCs.

#thanks jack!#someday d20 fandom is gonna have a reckoning about the superficial progressiveness in our fan spaces #and how despite lauding the show for its diversity #the actual fandom treats characters of colour (and honestly players of colour) as accoutrements to the white characters and white players #praising white characters for breathing and holding characters of colour to unreasonable double standards #pigeonholing and diminishing players of colour while uplifting white players as the ultimate gods of roleplay and gameplay #oops there's some bonus salt in the tags for ya

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bookofmirth · 2 years

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i know feyre stans hate it when u hate on feyre becoming a mother but i feel like in this situation it’s so justified!

i don’t think i even need to explain the fact that she’s literally like 22 ???? it’s just insane to me that she’s immortal but had a child at 22

99.9% of books with lead female characters end with them being pregnant and having babies so it’s not like that trope needs any more representation in the slightest

i wouldn’t care if it was at the end of the series and everyone had settled down but smack down in the middle of a series with a whole ass war coming and they’ve had a baby? it just looks really silly

and the fact that all the next books are going to have so much space taken up by fawning over the most gorgeous, perfect, smart, genius, most powerful baby in existence (it’s rhysands kid i just know sjm is about to take up pages describing how magnificent baby nyx is)

and honestly the last thing this series needed was a baby and the next books being about baby daycare and characters babysitting nyx

already so much space was taken up in acosf with this baby plot line from hell and i’m crying in the club thinking about how much of elains book is going to be taken up by feysand, nyx and daycare 😀

i know it’s just a baby or whatever but it’s literally renesmee 2.0 but 10x worse

anyway i think that when people hate on the nyx storyline it shouldn’t just automatically be labelled as misogyny or whatever because i think readers have the right to be upset about a baby plot line in a fantasy series

i really was expecting to read about nesta and elain conquering their powers and figuring out what their purpose in life is and finding a court thay they love and nesta’s book was already made 1000x worse with the pregnancy plot (especially the end which was absolutely too focused on feysand like let me read about the valkyries after the blood rite!!!) and if elain’s book is taken up by the worlds most powerful baby i’m going to cry!!!

the world's most powerful baby aslkdjaskldjakls I snorted, she *would* write that story

I definitely think you can be a Feyre stan and dislike that story line, just saying! I love her and it's not just that I hate the pregnancy thing in acosf, but it does feel like... just narratively it wasn't a good choice because like you are annoyed at, it distracted from the main story and was such an obvious "I need something to happen to bring Nesta and Feyre together" and I wish feysand had had time to just EXIST because I love them too and I wanted that for them.

idk if Feyre is happy then that's fine, I personally just dislike the fact that her pregnancy was used as a tool to create conflict and then bring the sisters together, rather than a natural, organic step in Feysand's relationship. There's just a lot going on in that story that's a whole mess, and it's not just about disliking that type of story. I'm sure people have misogynistic arguments about it, but that's what the block button is for. However it's possible to critique that story fairly and have that critique have nothing to do with being misogynist. If the story were done well and were believable, that would be one thing. I could get on board. The fanart of the family that I've seen is super cute! But then I remember how the story actually happened in acosf whomp whomp

#sjm critical #acosf #feysand #ask #anon #okay i'm back to loving feysand #idgaf about what happened in acosf #i just don't see it anymore #i've been craving an acotar and acomaf reread #feeling nostalgic

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koreandragon · 3 years

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sorry to unleash this on u but I finished ep11&12 of the devil judge and went into the tag (against my better judgement) and it’s just….crazy how as soon as a Ship gets involved in a show ppl just lose all their chill like ppl actually getting mad that ga on ‘betrayed’ yohan and that he ‘chose’ soohyun or just acting hella nasty towards her for no reason like??? Everything that happened in both episodes made perfect narrative sense and if anything, added so much to the character’s complexity and the complexity of their relationship ESPECIALLY ga on and yohan. Are we really going to get upset over ONE bump in the road happens in their relationship?? This is a thriller political drama not a coffee shop AU tension is supposed to happen it’s not supposed to be sunshine and rainbows all the time. I love ga on and yohans relationship as much as the next person but like. Plz relax it’s going to be fine. It IS fine. (What’s not fine is what they did to my man K I was sobbing it was done in such a tragic heart wrenching way and that actor fucking killed it in his performance)

for real like as much as we want a queer ship in this show, there's not going to be! we joke and make posts but what i think everyone should know is that it's not gonna happen and save yourself the frustration like it doesn't matter how much homoerotic context there is, a major network like tvn is not gonna allow a mlm relationship between the leads, and it's still gonna be soo hyun and gaon at the end. and no amount of misogyny will change that. just fyi.

people really acting like they've never seen a drama in their lives, they thought gaon and yohan will team up and it will be smooth sailing and gay shenanigans from here like i hate to break it to you but every well written drama has to have a conflict for the climax and the conclusion to happen this is like writing 101. what happened was totally expected and needed but people are getting their panties in a bunch because "uwu my ship is fighting" like no susan, it's a plot device to show yohan how his methods lead to people dying and don't actually do any good and that he needs gaon to change that and if you thought further than 2 seconds maybe you would realize that. gaon didn't betray anybody, if you honestly think him setting his boundaries is betrayal then i have some news for you. he will come back anyway and it will go on as planned because we still have 4 episodes of this show and they're not about to turn yohan into the antagonist of the show.

#ask #anonymous #the devil judge

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evilponds · 3 years

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why do u 👉👈 not enjoy shadow and bone, if u care 2 answer? + what problems did u see in six of crows? maybe ive just not seen any crit but it shocked me to see a lil !

so i never read the original trilogy and probs never will just cos i feel like first person has to be done REALLY well for me to want to read it. that's more of a personal preference thing though. most of my issue with the show was just like. the racism. it didn't need to be there, it was honestly just upsetting to watch, and it kind of started to feel like the only reason they cast an asian woman to play alina was to subject her character to racism. which isn't to say that i don't think they should have cast jessie mei li as alina - she was great, and also it was nice to feel like they were maybe kind of recognizing that white slavs aren't the only people who live in russia, but i just wish they'd allowed her to just like. be alina without then introducing racism that isn't ever really.. challenged in the narrative. frankly i also just wanted them to be nicer to jesper? i love him dearly and it was frustrated to see him essentially reduced, in my opinion, to how fans would simplify him or whatever, im sleepy, you know the phenomenon im talking about

also the whole nina and mathias thing is just like. ok if it's like, person who practices magic meets person who hates magic and eventually they fall in love that's one thing and i think that can be fun but to also make misogyny part of it is just uh. not great! uncomfortable, even. ive said it before i think but it felt like watching one of those yt videos by a white liberal woman about how her boyfriend is a trump supporter but *~somehow~* they manage to get along and love each other. i think if bardugo wanted to show a character unlearning prejudice and harmful beliefs that's something worth exploring, but seeing that explored through that characters relationship with a person from a group that he's spent his life prejudiced against + persecuting just leaves a bad taste in my mouth for reasons im too tired to articulate but that boil down to like, you should learn to care about people because they're people, not because you want to date someone. or whatever. also i just feel like all the characters were like. too young for the things that were happening to them but that's like, The Way YA Is, so i guess like. whatevs

also. can't stress this enough. grisha is just.. greg. she called a bunch of people with magic powers greg

#fun worldbuilding tho. and i love the dregs minus mathias

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jesstinsource · 3 years

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Trigger Warning: I talk about rape and season 4. Please delete this and don’t read it if that will hurt you or affect you negatively. 🥺😥 I’m just so upset at the writing, like why have Jess tell Justin “your shit is my shit” and that she’d go into that dark place with him and then when he gets back from rehab, taking beautiful steps to improve himself and get better (and eventually be back with her again!), she plays such cruel mind games on him with Diego and tells him that ofc everything has to be all about him. Like what?? I do not recognize Jess in season 4. She was his biggest support and then, all of a sudden, she’s emotionally tearing him down and trying to hurt him and make him jealous. They’re both SA survivors; I wanted them to begin to heal in season 4 and yeah, maybe take a break romantically, but come back stronger; boost each other up, mutually supportive besties, always. I’m just really sad. And how fucking messed up is that Justin **** thinking he may have given Jess HIV? Why did Jess wait to get tested? And why did no one tell Justin it wasn’t his fault, 😥 , that storyline was so upsetting and really triggers me bc I always believed my rapes were my fault too and it’s like they’re saying bc it’s in the context of sex for pay, the assaults are shameful and nasty and all his fault. I’m sorry for this, I’m just depressed again and you’re the only person I know that might understand.

gawd im so sorry!!!! that season was a giant face-punch for everybody who has ever struggled with depression, with sexual assault recovery or addiction.

I feel like the sensationalisation and romanticisation of trauma (esp in that stupid show) is so gross!!! like oh no, lets just pile on trauma in the name of drama and never acknowledge the lasting effects of it. it almost feels as though 13rw is a show for the mentally healthy to look at our lives and be entertained, to cry and feel for us, like we're animals in a zoo for their entertainment.

but jesstin was 100% supposed to heal, they were supposed to be that couple that's broken up but everybody thinks they're still secretly together because they're just hanging out all the time. Where was the scene of jess letting justin into HO? or showing the affects of bryce on jess's grades instead of just one (1) scene?

Imagine the final shots of the show where we actually get to see justin in a scene that shows his development??? i mean i hate his de*th but even if we just got to see him talk to hannah in clay's vision and BOOM hannah and justin are actually friends, or he apologises to her and she's like 'i never blamed you for what happened to jess, i'm sorry i didn't get to tell you, i'm sorry i sent out that tape' like??? they could have done so much. they needed katherine for ONE scene and like???

i was reading some character opinions on insta bc i like to torture myself as we all know 🙄 and people HATE jess???? she talks about her assault too much?!?!? this is what happens when a show has 12 male characters in all 4 seasons and ONE female character!!!! how does a show about sexual assault and a girl's suicide fuck up that badly??? and they used s3 to make her look bad (which i loved her in s3 idk what crack the fucktards were smoking) and then s4 they make her worse??? i call misogyny!!!! this writing is fucking awful and alisha boe my love u deserve better and brandon..... is brandon..... he's ok i guess

always here !!!! whenever y’all need to rant or complain. u feeling down? vent. it’s all good. u can just type ‘pls don’t post’ if its too personal or send me a private ask <3 or message me any time!!!

#anyway #<3 take care of urself anon #ur assault is NEVER ur fault #i've found that since justin died i don't watch shows like that anymore #i watch sitcoms and i watch horror movies.....#i will never watch another show with suicide themes or SA themes or drug themes #bc while im better than i was #its still too upsetting #nobody ever gets it right

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phoenix-downer · 5 years

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Hello! I haven't played KH III yet but I plan to. I have come across some really hateful posts on tumblr and even twitter about Sora and Kairi being together. It appears some people are really upset that Sora and Riku didn't become a thing and have downplayed Sora x Kairi's relationship as something as forced and not having chemistry. I had no idea this was even a thing. Can you tell me where this hostility came from? I thought it was obvious that they had feelings for each other.

Hello! Thanks for the ask! There’s a lot to examine here, but I’ll do my best to try to tackle the whole issue with tact and empathy. Light/very vague spoilers for K/H/3, E/ndgame, and F/M/A follow (with slashes so they hopefully don’t show up in the tags).

First of all, I’m so sorry you’ve stumbled across those kinds of tweets and posts. If I could, I’d shield everyone from having to deal with such hatred and negativity about something they enjoy. Doesn’t matter what you ship; no one deserves to deal with that level of toxicity.

Imagine going into a room and hearing people talk loudly about something you love, talk about how much they hate it and how much it sucks. Doesn’t make you feel very welcome, does it? But that’s exactly what’s happening here - you’re not the only one who’s noticed this. I have had to block or mute so many people because of the kind of bashing you describe. People purposely tagging their hate so that fans can see it, saying nasty things and picking fights in a way that makes you wonder what they get out of being so cruel and vicious.

I’ve seen it so much that I’m extra sensitive to it now too; I block much more quickly than I did in the past. And I would advise other people to do the same. You don’t owe anyone access to your social media. They’re not entitled to your time or energy, either. You don’t owe it to them to read their hate. By blocking them, you take away part of their audience, you take away their attention. And the thing is, they want that attention. They want to make other people angry and miserable because they’re angry and miserable. And you don’t have to give them the satisfaction.

Sadly, because twitter and tumblr have such poor moderation, no one running these sites is doing much to stop these people. In fact, the platforms even encourage that kind of behavior, because the loudest people get the most attention. So that encourages and emboldens the kind of nasty behavior you’re seeing.

Now, this is not to say there is never room for criticism, because there is, but that is a very different thing from what you’re describing, which is plain old bashing. Criticism and critique are offered in the hope that something will improve; bashing is done to express pure vitriol, and it isn’t productive for anyone. It might feel good in the moment, but in the end it just leaves people bitter and empty.

There are plenty of people critiquing K/H and how the games went and how the various character arcs unfolded and how the relationships developed, and there’s nothing wrong with that. Shutting down all criticism isn’t healthy; it should be allowed and encouraged, as constructive criticism leads to healthy dialogue, both with other fans and with S/quare E/nix. And Square has listened to fans in the past; they’ve fixed issues with gameplay that occurred when 1.5 and 2.5 were ported to the PS4 and converted to 60 fps, for example.

Neither is there anything wrong with venting to a close friend in a private setting - DMs, PMs, on your personal blog or twitter account with the ship you’re criticizing censored somehow so that everyone who likes it doesn’t have to stumble across your venting. Heaven knows I’ve had to vent a lot to stay in the fandom without lashing out. The issue is when someone thinks it’s okay to force their anger and negativity onto other people who don’t want to see it or hear it.

So the question is, why are we stumbling across such strong feelings? Because it’s clear people feel pretty strongly about all this.

I don’t think there’s an easy answer as to why this is happening, but I’ll take a shot at explaining what might’ve happened all the same. I’m sure if you asked someone else, they might give you a different answer, and it’s worth getting multiple perspectives. This is just my two cents, and naturally, it’s going to be biased towards my experiences and preferences.

The shipwars in the K/ingdom H/earts fandom have been nasty for years. From what I can gather, they got really bad when KH2 was released, though I’m sure there was probably drama before then. S*kai fans and S*riku fans did not see eye to eye on how that game went, and it’s all been downhill ever since. People on both sides have been mean and nasty, I’ve seen them be nasty, hurling insults and slurs and accusing each other of awful things to the point that the question of “who started it” is pretty much moot at this point. A more productive question would be, “how can we end it and get along, or at least start treating each other better?”

Now, since I ship S*kai (obviously), I’ll share why this is such a touchy subject for me personally. I’ve been in fandom for a while now, and something I’ve noticed is just how much fans tend to hate female characters because of sexism and internalized misogyny.

I was in the M/C/U fandom before this, and Sh*ron’s actress got death threats around the time C/ivil W/ar came out from angry shippers. And then P*ggy’s actress has likewise been harassed after E/ndgame came out by, again, angry shippers. I was a big F/M/A fan back in the day, and W*nry got so much hate from, you guessed it, angry shippers. I remember a friend back then rolling her eyes and bashing W*nry, and when I asked her why she hated her, she couldn’t really give me a clear answer other than that she was “whiny.”

Heaven forbid a female character not be completely perfect.

Over and over, I saw this pattern repeating. A female character gets hate because there is a popular alternate pairing that she “gets in the way of.” Even before I had the vocabulary to talk about it, the hatred just struck me as very gendered. I never saw that level of hatred for any of the male characters unless they were written to be hated (hello Shou T*cker). And I was likewise harsher on female characters than on their male counterparts. It took me years to realize what I was doing and to try to put a stop to it.

So then I came to the K/ingdom H/earts fandom with all that background and baggage, dealing with years of people hating characters I liked and looked up to and identified with, and I saw the same thing happening again. Yet another female character getting nasty hate because of her gender, because she dared to like a boy who was shipped with another boy. Because she dared to fall in love. How dare she have feelings, how dare she be feminine, how dare she wear pink and have a flowery Keyblade. How dare her strength of heart be stronger than her physical strength. There is only one kind of strength that matters, and it’s how hard you can kick someone’s ass (wrong, wrong, wrong, and one look at the whole power of friendship thing this series revolves around would tell you that).

How dare K*iri not be an instant expert at fighting, which is cruel and ironic because if she was an instant expert at fighting, everyone would be crying Mary Sue. How dare she sass and tease S*ra, she’s such a bitch. Oh, she doesn’t tease him as much in K/H/3 and is more gentle and supportive because he’s going through hell and nearly loses everything and she knows he needs her support now more than ever? She’s a complete pushover!

See what I mean by how hard people are on female characters? K*iri can’t win no matter what she does. She could have the best character arc ever post K/H/3 and people would still find something to complain about. That’s not to say I don’t have issues with how she’s written, I just think the criticisms against her tend to be way overblown. There aren’t enough discussions about how she could improve moving forward (though I have seen them, and thank you to those of you who do have them!), instead people just write her off completely as useless and worthless and want to improve her character by… dropping her out of the story completely (and yes, I’ve run into someone who actually thought this would be a good thing and always felt the need to talk about it, and it absolutely drove me up the wall).

And worst of all, she can’t win because S*ra fell in love with her. Really, it’s ironic that she gets as much hate as she does for something S*ra did. She had no control over S*ra falling in love with her, and yet she is absolutely despised by people because he did. She isn’t “good enough” for him apparently, whatever that’s supposed to mean.

I share all this to explain why I was so sensitive to the issue coming in. I saw the same thing happening I’d experienced time and again and I was so exhausted. So tired of it. I didn’t want to deal with it again, and I was on my guard right from the start. Especially because it’s so normalized in online KH communities to bash K*iri and S*kai. The major ones, too, with lots of people and a wide range of (or lack thereof) of shipping preferences, not just dedicated shipping groups. Try to go an entire discussion without seeing it come up… it’s a lot harder than you might think.

At first I tried to be patient and understanding. Other people have different tastes, and I wanted to be understanding of that. But after years of watching the bashing happen, my patience ran thin. I was sick of seeing it enabled in major K/H communities, sick of seeing mods refuse to put a stop to it, or worse, low-key join in with the bashing, sick of having to put up with so much negativity when all I wanted was somewhere to discuss something I enjoyed. Some people seemed almost gleeful, almost eager in their bashing; any time K*iri was brought up, they felt compelled to express their hatred for her. They were more obsessed with her than her actual fans were; felt more passionately (albeit negatively) about S*kai than some actual S*kai shippers did.

When I reached that point, the point where I was tempted to be negative and snappy and rude, I knew I couldn’t engage with certain people anymore. So I stopped trying. I searched for S*kai fans here on tumblr and stuck with them. I didn’t want to add to an already tense situation, and thankfully, there are other people who feel the same way (but more on that later).

And on the S*riku side of things, some of them have shared that they have been told nasty homophobic things for shipping S*riku. And for many of them, I’m sure S*riku is a way of expressing their identity, a way of exploring their feelings and expressing them in a safe, welcoming way with fellow fans who get what they’re going through. Representation has gotten better in recent years (though it still has a long way to go), but back when the K/H games were first coming out, things were different, and people had to take what they could get from canon and run with it if they wanted to see more content that represented them.

I’ve also seen a few people say that certain S*kai fans went out of their way to message them and rub what happened in K/H/3 in their faces. That kind of gloating is bound to upset anyone, yikes. Canon has become the new gold standard for shipping in the last decade or so, and it has sadly been weaponized in the ever-nastier ship wars, when really, a ship’s value shouldn’t be based on how “canon” it is but on the joy it brings to people.

So yeah, we have a situation where enough people on both sides were treating others poorly that everyone got defensive, because how could you not when people keep attacking something you love, especially if you feel strongly about it/associate it with your identity? And that made people more likely to lash out, and when they did, people got even more defensive, and the cycle repeated, over and over and over again.

And you know how I mentioned I sought refuge with likeminded fans? I think that happened all over the fandom. People seek out those who will support them and support their beliefs and form identities and communities based around them… and that’s a double-edged sword.

On the one hand, it’s great to get so much support, especially if you’re seeking refuge from a particularly nasty ship war. Having a safe place to vent and unwind and finally get to talk about what you love without fear of getting hate over it is awesome.

On the other hand, things like echo chambers, confirmation bias, groupthink, and the false consensus effect flourish in those kinds of situations. If all you hear is that XYZ pairing must be canon or will be canon in a future game from the group of people you’ve surrounded yourself with, and everyone enthusiastically agrees because everyone ships the same thing you do and of course no one is going to rain on that parade, it can come as quite a shock when a new piece of canon comes out and doesn’t align to your expectations. Especially if you’ve spent years expecting canon to align with your expectations.

We lose something when we can’t engage in healthy dialogue with people who disagree with us. Our perceptions get warped, our memories might even get warped, and what we could’ve sworn was canon… we might be surprised to see wasn’t, when we revisit the source material with a more critical eye or listen to someone who sees things differently than we do.

But how can we have that healthy dialogue when there’s been so much bad blood? How can we listen to each other when there’s no trust? It’s nearly impossible, so instead we reinforce the beliefs and ideas our own communities already hold fast to, and the cycle continues. We draw lines in the sand separating “us” vs. “them” and don’t give each other a chance. Not only does this alienate people on opposite ends of the shipping spectrum, it also alienates multishippers because they’re considered “traitors” to both sides, and that is an uncomfortable place to be.

I think that’s why you find the whole thing so jarring. I’m guessing you might not be as heavily involved with the fandom as I am, and have thus been largely immune from the perils of echo chambers and confirmation bias. So for you it must seem really weird that something that seems clear to you is so contentious to other people. I don’t say this to throw shade at anyone, because I know the same thing would’ve happened if the pairings had gotten switched around. It’s more of an observation of a phenomenon I’ve seen happen over and over again throughout the years.

So all of that is to say, things are tense because of all these backgrounds and experiences and histories people bring into the fandom. No one exists in a vacuum, and things were already tense before K/H/3 even came out. K/ingdom H/earts has been such an important part of many people’s lives and growing up experiences that they feel a deep connection to it and almost a sense of ownership of it. It’s a shared story, a shared experience. It belongs to all of us, in a way, and yet it’s still N*mura’s baby.

And that’s where we run into more issues. How much say should fans have in a work of art? Does the creator get the final say in interpretation, or should she accept that once her creation has been released into the world, it’s up to other people to interpret what she meant? There are no easy answers to these kinds of questions, and they’re widely debated and discussed (see: the whole death of the author debacle).

However, while I think feeling a sense of ownership and investment in a piece of art is totally fine, it crosses the line when it gets into the realm of entitlement. By this I do not mean asking for more representation, because that is a perfectly good thing to ask for; I mean demanding that the creators cater to your whims… or else. I mean contacting people who worked on the game on twitter and demanding they change the story to make it “right.” I mean directly telling one of the VAs you want her replaced because you thought she did a bad job. And yes, I am talking about actual stuff I’ve seen happen in this very fandom. All of that has also left me with a bad taste in my mouth, and other people I’ve talked to have felt the same.

That being said, shipping in and of itself is not the problem. For every nasty tweet and bashing post out there, there are plenty of kind and good people who are just there to enjoy their ships. Lovely artists and talented writers and skilled gif makers and editors creating a wealth of beautiful content for something they love. People who would never harass others for their shipping preferences and are disgusted by those who do. Unfortunately, they’re not the ones getting the attention, and they’re probably not the ones you’re going to run into if you ship a different ship, as they tend to stick to their own spaces out of courtesy and respect.

This means that the people you are more likely to run into are the ones who want to pick fights. The ones who bash and stir up drama and tell people to kill themselves for shipping XYZ. While there are plenty of people being cruel and nasty and toxic, there are good people in the fandom too. Kind, caring people who will see you as a person first and not an XYZ, even if they don’t agree with you on everything. They’re quiet(er), because kindness isn’t usually flashy and showy, but they’re here. You just have to know how to find them.

Thanks for the ask! I tried to answer this as fairly as I could, based on my observations and things I’ve been stewing over for a while now, so I hope it sheds more light on the situation.

#answer #kagome1991 #long post #i don't usually participate in the discourseTM but these thoughts have been on my mind for a while and I wanted to get them written out #kh discourse #kh3 spoilers #fma spoilers #endgame spoilers #no super heavy spoilers or anything I'm just tagging them to be safe

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kae-karo · 5 years

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things i’m grateful for

okay preface: i hate the reason thanksgiving was invented ofc but i do love the concept of taking a day to sit back and remind myself of the things in my life that i’m grateful for so here we go (and pls i encourage y’all to take some time and do the same) anyway feel free to read below the cut if y’all want way too much insight into my personal life lmao

my friends

without question, my experience both in the phandom and like in life in general has so massively improved thanks to these lovely people and i can’t say i’d be as happy a person as i am without them

of course my incredible gcs (jolly best friends and dickmates, “moderate sex references”, we have goldfish memories, katashen, and the gc that always changes names lmao) and the lovelies in them @thereisnobearonthisisland @philsroots @uselessphillie @daliensgrandads @severaltortillascollector @dnptrqsh @dip-and-pip-trash @transhowell @dreamdilddy @hey-itskxt @dreamdilddy @freckliephil @philsdrill @phloridas @lovestillaround @legdabs @amczingphil @phantasieslide @maanjha @manialester @sleeplessnightwithphan @phandumb @imnotinclinedtomaturity @auroraphilealis @ineverywordisay @glitterydanandphil @kerasines @workinprogress91 @merridewhoo @natigail @swissfuckingcheesegdi @phastelpink @stick-it-to-the-phan @phanarchy

my dearest friends irl with whom i never spend enough time and often bail on bc i’m tired of existing around people, but who never fail to be lovely and kind and wonderful friends anyway. i’ve known them for eight years now and i am so lucky to have found them and to still be friends with them

a very good friend of mine who taught me everything i know about customer service and just being a diligent person (she’s also literally the reason i link everything so uhh thank her lmao) who i consider my lesbian big sister and who i’ve been so so lucky to get to reconnect with and will get the opportunity to work with starting in december and who even remembered one of my fave bands like after literally two years when i only mentioned them one time i love her

my family

whomst thank fuck are not on this hellsite but i love them all dearly

my sister who’s like still figuring her life out and doing a way better job of deciding what she enjoys doing than i ever did and like she’s younger than me but it’s a constant lesson that hey look it’s good to be true to yourself and do what you want. and i’m so grateful that we don’t fight the way we used to, that we’re like partners in crime and that she actually likes spending time with me and thank god she’s not gonna see this bc she thinks i get too sappy sometimes but i gotta make up for hiding her glasses when we were younger and literally forgetting about them for two weeks okay <3

my parents who have always been steadfast supporters even when they don’t love my choices. without them, i wouldn’t be where i am today, i wouldn’t have the level of independence i do today, and honestly i wouldn’t have learned to find the strength to follow my own path. i also can’t thank them enough for supporting even when they don’t understand, like they literally do not understand dnp but my dad found out they were doing ii and asked if i would want tickets for christmas and my mom always asks about my writing

my grandma who, bless her soul, has been completely alone without my grandpa for two years now, after having been with him since she was sixteen, who reminded me (unintentionally) that people who are suffering from mental health issues (she’s had depression for years now) can so greatly benefit from having someone reach out. i’m grateful for our weekly calls where we just catch up, because sometimes i go for a year without seeing her in person (usually just for the holidays) and it’s good to know how things are going with her. i’m also eternally grateful to her for reminding me that people are just people. my parents often talk about her as if she’s some one-dimensional character who only has a handful of (negative) personality traits, and it’s nice to get to know her on my own

the rest of my extended family, who, although i’m not nearly as close to, are still always fun to see during the holidays, and i’m immensely grateful that i don’t have the kind of family that i dread seeing. there’s always entertainment, overflowing alcohol (not that i partake, but everyone else has a fuckin blast with it), and laughter and although i occasionally feel a bit outside the circle (lots of cousins getting married/in relationships/etc and uhhh can’t relate lmao) i never fail to look forward to seeing everyone

y’all

yeah ik it’s cheesy but i do really appreciate y’all so much? like. i just read this note i made to myself abt something unrelated a year ago but i’d offhand mentioned that i was so so thrilled to have almost a hundred people following me. like it just blew my mind that so many people were interested in what i had to say, in my writing at the time, etc. and now,,,,,i mean. jfc i can’t even begin to fathom what i must’ve done to deserve all of y’all, and to deserve you all being so kind. like since the minute i joined tumblr i saw/heard horror stories of mean anons, of people being rude for the sake of it, etc etc. and like. of the literal thousands of asks i’ve gotten, i can count on one hand the number of even vaguely unkind ones. it just makes me so immensely happy to know that such lovely, kind people want to participate in this blog. so please know that i appreciate the existence of every single one of you not just uwu bc u follow me and that’s what i’m supposed to say or w.e but bc you’re out here making a positive impact on the world and on me, and you’re the kind of lovely person that i’m so glad i have the pleasure of existing alongside

dnp

¯\_(ツ)_/¯ u knew it was coming, but honestly i am grateful to them as people

they set such fantastic examples for how to be good humans, constantly donating their time to good causes, reminding us to take care of ourselves, and doing their best to figure themselves out which yes is so incredibly important bc it’s this amazing example of how people aren’t any perfect shiny version of themselves, they’re real and raw and imperfect and that’s why we love them???? and by extension, that teaches us self love and love for others

that’s another thing i really didn’t realize at first - how much self-hatred i was harboring, how much internalized homophobia (toward myself! never others) and how much i just accepted about the world (heteronormativity, misogyny, the lack of diversity in media, the list goes on) and a lot of things said by both dnp and by the phandom have helped open my eyes to things like that. and dnp helped me realize that being ace isn’t a bad thing??? which was such a horrible thing i’d held onto for years and years

so i’m so grateful to dnp for existing, for being who they are and how they are and for encouraging the wonderful kindness and acceptance that they want to see in the world

my therapist

and to daniel and depression for convincing me to see one. i’ve let go of a lot of the baggage i was holding onto over the time i’ve been seeing my therapist and i’m grateful to her for, well, doing her job. and for doing it well, and for asking the questions that i didn’t think to ask, to get at things i didn’t think about before. and for reminding me (not directly, but by virtue of her existence) that honesty is one of the most important things to me

my job

or just generally the jobs i’ve had over the years that force me to interact with people, because it’s taught me that nobody’s ever angry or upset for no reason, and that people who are angry or upset and mean are not mean because they’re actually trying to be vicious but because they’re suffering in some way. so it’s a daily reminder to treat everyone with kindness and not take things personally, because ultimately most people are not intentionally vicious people. and i’m grateful to my job for reminding me how meaningful it is to me to help others

#privilegecheck

i think it’s important at this point that i stop and remind myself that i was born with a lot of privilege that makes my life immensely easy compared to others. i’m grateful for my upbringing and the ways that i’ve benefited from my privilege, but i need to acknowledge that i have benefited. not everyone is as lucky, and i need to be mindful of that in the things i do and say, and in the actions i choose to take, and - when i can - i should be using my privilege to help others

and finally, my greatest of thanks goes out to the fic writers, the gif makers, the edit makers, the phan artists, and all the other lovely people who make this community so wonderful

#thankful #kt

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jaeheekangisimportant · 6 years

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Reasons I dislike Zen: He treats MC like a 'weak' woman, constantly whining for a gf, the womanising, he brushes off any attempt for someone to help him, he's very 'me me me' (nothing wrong with loving yourself just don't make it about u), and most of all- the game totally pushes Jaehee×Zen, fuck no buddy, Jaehee's mine, move on. Wbu? (I like Zen, and I have self confidence, but he acts like everything is about him +the reasons stated above, so I can't help but dislike him a little).

I feel you on most of those reasons tbh but the main thing for me is just… Zen honestly just makes me super uncomfortable? It really does feel like he was designed to be everything I wouldn’t like hhhhh like from the moment I started playing I was really put off by how overtly flirty and forward and just really overly familiar he is with you? And like, the casual (and sometimes not so casual) misogyny is something that every character has to some extent but it is a bit more… noticeable I guess? in Zen. He just seemed like the sort of guy who would make me SO uncomfortable in real life so it was hard for me to like him at all. I did try in the beginning to like him, but I couldn’t get past my gut reaction of “oh god please leave me alone” and even so the more I played the more I thought Zen is just… really not someone I would ever click with in real life, probably not even as a friend so yeah. Also I really hate the way he treats Jumin. I mean seriously Jumin barely has to do or say anything before Zen starts snapping at him and it’s always so unnecessarily vicious and it upsets me like can Zen just shut up ever thanks

And then yeah I really don’t like the game pushing Jaehee/Zen especially when they push it in her route so that he basically acts as a buffer for the gay…….

Anyway I just don’t like Zen at all lmao he was my least favorite for a while but then V took his place. It’s not that Zen is entirely bad and like, if I put aside my salt and try to be completely objective, I can see why other people could like him. But as I said it’s like he was explicitly written to rub me the wrong way so just none of it works for me

#ask #anon #anti zen

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mysticmessengerincorrectquotes · 7 years

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mod rika explains why they love rika

okay someone sent an ask asking why i love rika, and they asked me to answer it privately so i’m just gonna put it all here then send them a link!!

SPOILERS FOR V’S ROUTE UP UNTIL DAY 10 CAUSE THAT’S AS FAR AS I AM!! READ AT YOUR OWN DISCRETION

The first thing I want to say before I start gushing about her, she has done horrible, inexcusable things. But that doesn’t mean she deserves to die/rot in jail/whatever you want her to do.

Now onto my list

1) Rika is kind. She had a horrible child, from the verbal abuse from her adopted parents and the bullying from kids at her school, but she still is kind and compassionate and wants to help other people, hence her founding the RFA. Of course, as time went on, her way of helping people became distorted and harmful for the people she wanted to “save”.

2) I can relate to her. We both got dat bpd or at least that’s what i think she has lmao. With everything she went through when she was younger combined with her mental illness(es), she wanted to kill herself and V treated that as a sort of “art” and tried to be the hero and save her. I’m not blaming V, don’t get me wrong, but it upsets me as a neurodivergent person.

3) She’s just?? really gay??? Like have u played v’s route SLAMS EMBRACE RIKA OPTION

4) The scene where she breaks down crying because V said it was an obsession and not love. It really resonates with me. Even if you hate her, it would be hard to not at least pity her in that moment. She breaks down saying if V didn’t love her, then that would mean no one has ever loved her. Again, I can relate cuz the bpd makes me freaked out that no one actually loves me rippp

5) She’s such a complex and interesting character. I’ve always loved her as a character (even if the fandom originally made me despise her and think she was completely to blame for everything wrong that happened in mysme). I could make a 100000 point list of things about her (as a character) that I love, but the main ones just being her past i’m a slut for that tragic backstory and her progression as a character. Starting from a person just wanting everyone to be loved and cared for by hosting charity parties, slowly escalating to her “devil” taking over and forming Mint Eye, creating an all around toxic environment.

6) I just..... want to protect her. With how the fandom treats her, calling her a bitch and a snake, I just feel bad for her and want to hug her. And y’all know she wouldn’t be nearly as hated if she were a guy. Internalized misogyny yayyy

If any of you guys have seen Death Note, I kinda like to relate my love for her in a similar way to how I love Light. They’ve both done horrible things that originated with good intentions. They’ve been corrupted by their internal demons, and I just want them to be happy and go back to the way they were before everything started.

So there’s the main reasons why I love her. I think she deserves happiness and help, and if she were to get those things, she could become a person that everyone loves.

#mod rika #i think i phrased this all well??#i reread it through i think it makes sense lmao #rika #mystic messenger rika

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elfyourmother · 7 years

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kunstpause replied to your post: “fam i am rly not trying to tell you who and who not to like but can...”:

yeah you are right. I was so focused on the comparison to Celene that I completely glossed over the addition of 'it's misogyny bc ambition' when I shouldn't have

i’m not saying people should be forced to list out Every Problematic Sin every time they talk abt why they like someone, because that’s unfair and it’s shitty and people should be allowed to say why they like someone without constantly having to apologize for it

and i’m also not saying a lot or even most of the antipathy aimed at her isn’t ultimately rooted in misogyny (blaming her for trying to keep her throne, blaming her for things her father did, etc). ppl are extremely shitty and unfair to her

but it’s like...this happens a lot in fandoms, this attempt to shame ppl who don’t like various white women w “this is just female character hate/internalized misogyny, if she was a man you would love her”. ppl can’t just like them, they have to cast aspersions on everyone who doesn’t, painting with the same broad brush, ignoring how race factors into ppl’s viewpoints

i think i’m feeling extra salty abt it bc i’ve been seeing this a lot lately with star wars, with j*n erso. but it’s upsetting. defense posts for an*ra always come down to that and that’s why i can’t deal with them, no matter how measured they seem on the surface there’s always that ugly undertone to them that comes out sooner or later. the shitting on the Warden if they do anything but put her on a pedestal or mistrust her in anyway because to them there’s no legitimate reason for a Warden not to trust her. nvm that she has racial privilege over many of them, nvm that the “betrayal” argument is entirely beside the point because asking an elven woman to go to prison in order to save her is heinous in the first place given the way elven women are brutalized in this setting. and on and on. All Wardens must defer to The Rightful Queen of Ferelden at all times and trust her implicitly or else they are Wrong and Incompetent and Power Hungry (oh the fucking irony of this), even Female Wardens of Color, and you, their player, are irredeemably sexist and just hate her bc u love Alibear and want to be his queen.

a certain person did this constantly to the point where i had to basically pretend i didn’t feel a way about this character just to keep the peace. i had to swallow these feelings for a long time.

my feelings toward An*ra are really complicated in large part bc Gisele’s relationship w her is really complicated, and ppl can never understand this bc obviously the Mac Tirs are a package deal and you either love them both and think they did no wrong or despise them both and want them to suffer and/or die, there’s no room for nuance or complexity at all

i’ve had to do a lot of really hard character development w her (and her dad for that matter lol pls don’t think he gets off scot free here) to get to the point where i’m ok with her having a biracial black elf blooded half brother as her heir. Gisele has had to force both of them to confront their blinders and biases and it’s ugly and brutal and not fun. mostly bc even if i didn’t gleefully stomp all over canon there is very little opportunity in these games to hold any human ever to any kind of accountability over how they view or treat elves. that 1 conversation w Leliana early on in Origins might be the only time you call someone on racism and they apologize and learn from it. but it’s taken a lot of hard and painful work for me to get this scenario to a point where i can feel good about her role in the story, and even then there is a reason i rarely talk abt her. it’s painful. it dredges up a lot of bad, racially charged memories of the way various white women have treated me as a black woman.

and there needs to be room for ppl to feel that way, without being shamed or told that there’s something wrong w us or that we’re contributing to the toxic atmosphere against female characters or wevs

#kunstpause #replies

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