#I don’t even want to engage with ship war discourse in this like at all but some of the things I’ve had to read are Testing me | Explore Tumblr Posts and Blogs

redheadcyd · 8 months

Text

anyone else noticing the pattern here? 😃

This is my messy attempt to offer some clarification regarding this war between NineRose and TenRose, which is causing some strangeness and confusion, especially among Doctor/Rose shippers.

It isn’t weird how all of these people feel comfortable labeling themselves as NineRose enjoyers whilst they blatantly, simultaneously bash TenRose/TentooRose? Even when they show all their true colors and aim the animosity towards Rose, they claim to love NineRose in the end of the day.

Why do these self-titled Rose/TenRose/TentooRose haters feel so comfortable within NineRose fandom, though? It’s almost like they don’t even consider you guys to be Rose fans as well. I wonder why.

Also, another thing I have noticed it’s that the “same ship” discourse is only ever aimed at TenRose stans, only brought up to guilty-trip people who have a clear preference for TenRose and/or TentooRose into loving/supporting NineRose just as equally. Because they are the same, or so you say. But it is seemingly fine for the people who have a preference for NineRose to say shit about TenRose/TentooRose, even claim to be haters... And none of you will bat an eye. The double standard of it all.

I’m not trying to generalize all NineRose fans, nor am I trying to give the fandom a bad name, I ship NineRose myself, but I am not going to pretend that I don’t see a bunch of you guys daily interacting and engaging with blatant anti TenRose/TentooRose content. And finding excuses to dismiss people’s frustrations and criticisms on the nasty, misogynistic remarks of these self-titled NineRose enjoyers towards Rose and her relationship with Ten and Tentoo.

TenRose/TentooRose fans aren’t the ones who initiate and instigate these wars and they’re definitely not the ones who separate NineRose from TenRose/TentooRose. As you can see, NineRose fans are the ones who do that themselves. If anything, TenRose/TentooRose fans have been just trying to make you all see the picture, yet they have been ignored each time because you don’t want to hold your fandom’s actions accountable. Not to say TenRose/TentooRose fans are saints, but they were actually right all along.

#i worded this so badly.. i promise i’ll elaborate it better later #english isn't my first language #it’s missing some points #but i’m tired now #btw if you want the usernames hit me on priv #discussion #rose tyler #tenrose #ninerose #tentoorose #tentoo #metacrisis doctor

130 notes · View notes

longing-for-rain · 4 months

Note

i'm curious,what way you ship Tyzula 👀

I’m glad you asked! I really do like this ship and exploring the dynamic. The short answer is that I think they definitely had feelings for each other in childhood, but ultimately the relationship becomes mutually toxic and is something Azula needs to let go of as part of her journey to true healing. So I see Azula’s relationship with Ty Lee as an important part of her story, but not the end, if that makes sense.

I mean, there is clear attraction here:

And I’m pretty sure Ty Lee is the only person Azula genuinely apologizes to:

Like, there are definitely some strong feelings here. It’s just that people change—especially people like Azula—and sometimes that closeness turns into more of a codependency and becomes toxic for both characters.

I feel like I don’t need to delve much into Azula’s toxic traits because those are fairly obvious, but I think Ty Lee’s (often overlooked) toxic traits would play a role here.

Honestly, this could be a whole post by itself, but the summary is that Ty Lee’s ultimate toxic trait (and what enables her to be a villain) is her selfishness. It might be hard to recognize at first because she’s such a follower, but if you examine her actions and choices, Ty Lee ultimately does what makes her feel good without really caring about how it affects anyone else. She doesn’t question the war or what she’s fighting for because it doesn’t matter; all that matters is what best serves her.

Ty Lee likes everything to be happy and carefree and fun and overlooks problems in order to uphold that illusion. Azula would initially be very drawn to that because she probably would want to engage in that escapism early in her redemption journey, because she doesn’t want to think about the past. But the past doesn’t just go away, and ultimately Azula needs someone who is able to confront that with her and be able to support her emotionally. Ty Lee just wouldn’t, in my opinion.

From what we see in the beach, Ty Lee is very wrapped up in her own world and problems. She wants to feel unique and stand out, and I think she’s attracted to Azula because she gets that validation from Azula; Azula values her for her talents in a way most people don’t. But I don’t think on a deeper emotional level, Ty Lee could really be there for Azula. What I envision is Ty Lee talking Azula’s ear off, Azula getting exhausted from it, then in turn, Ty Lee gets upset because she feels like Azula isn’t giving her enough attention. And attention is definitely something Ty Lee demands a lot of. I also see Ty Lee getting uncomfortable when Azula tries to open up about something and ultimately leaving Azula feeling like she can’t open up, which is definitely not a healthy dynamic.

So basically, even though they have history together and some things in common, their personalities fundamentally clash and they can’t really support what the other needs. Azula at the end of her healing journey needs a woman who is kind and compassionate, but who also has a strong backbone and is willing to stand up for herself and others. Ty Lee just isn’t that person. She’s too much of a follower.

But that’s just my opinion on their dynamic, not trying to start discourse or anything. Ty Lee doesn’t have that much screen time so I recognize there are lots of ways to read her; this is just my interpretation.

#tyzula #anti tyzula???#not really though because i do enjoy writing them #azula #ty lee #atla #avatar: the last airbender #ask #anon #meta

27 notes · View notes

olderthannetfic · 1 year

Note

I grow weary of the HP/JKR discourse.

Honestly HP - Dramione to be exact - is my first fandom, and my oldest. I’ve read for it for 20 years, over half my life. I used to be more involved, and when I was younger I bought some merch, but I haven’t bought anything new for HP in over 7 years, and I won’t in the future because I don’t want to monetarily support JKR.

But I bought the films 10 years ago. My books are older than that. JKR doesn’t get any money from me re-reading once every 5 years or watching physical media I have owned for decades. HP got me through some really rough points in life, when all I wanted was to escape. I grew up with Harry and the rest. My best friend, who is the 1 person in my life that I trust to share every part of myself with, we became friends at first because neither of our friend groups were into HP and we could talk about it with each other. We’ve been best friends for 20 years now, and I wouldn’t have her without all the bonding we did through our shared love of HP at first.

I get why people cut it out entirely, I can understand why some people choose not to engage with it at all. However, I don’t agree that creating or engaging with fan works means implicit support of JKR or her beliefs. Sorry not sorry, but me reading fic and leaving kudos and liking fanart of a non-canon ship gives nothing to JKR. The argument that free fan works are keeping HP alive and giving JKR money simply through “exposure” doesn’t ring genuine for me, not when there’s literal theme parks and public channels play the movies and businesses pay for licensing to make HP costumes, and mugs, and bedding, and dishware, and watches, and everything.

There are plenty of fandoms that survive and thrive that have no or very little merch available, it isn’t necessary, and people can really just stop buying HP stuff - like I did. And some companies have stopped their HP stuff, and I’m sure that trend will continue, but I doubt they will ALL stop, because in the end JKR isn’t the only person with shitty beliefs.

HP isn’t my only fandom, it’s not something I give 100% of my attention to, and I fall into new stuff all the time, but this whole idea of recommending other things to replace HP in peoples’ lives? Regardless of how many other books I read or shows I watch, HP is irreplaceable in my life. That ship has sailed. It sailed over 20 years. I don’t go on about it all the time or even recommend that people read them now, I tend to talk about more relevant media on a day-to-day basis (House of the Dragon, superhero stuff, Star Wars, Doctor Who, The Queen’s Thief books, All Souls books-and show, etc). But none of those can replace what HP was for me, and still is to a degree. I have to scroll down to see all the Ao3 bookmarks when I open a new tab because I have so many, but nothing else will ever comfort me like a fluffy Dramione one-shot after a truly awful day. Because they were the first ship I really fell in love with, and it’s been 20 fucking years.

I’m just tired of seeing posts about how people should read The Magicians instead (which, there was a rape scene and pedophilia - in the show at least - so not something I would put in the same category as HP) or Warrior Cats (please). By all means, recommend media you like to people, recommend new things and don’t engage with HP at all if you don’t want to. But please stop acting like it’s as simple as liking something new will make people stop liking HP, or that they’ll get the same things out of them. Sorry, this turned out way longer than I planned.

80 notes · View notes

daycourtofficial · 1 month

Note

Honestly the acotar community discourse baffles me cause like have people never been exposed to conflicting perspectives before? Like just ignore the ones you don’t agree with and continue enjoying your favourite (can’t believe I have to highlight this) FICTIONAL characters/ships! Like why are people mean to content creators and blogs over this - I rly don’t get it

Love you btw and sorry for the rant :)

You’re absolutely so right. It’s so weird. I totally get why people like the ships I don’t, and I respect it. I get it, the ships just don’t really work for me and that’s okay. Just because I have a preference doesn’t make yours invalid :) I did start tagging ship fanarts for anyone who wants to filter their tags.

It’s really weird because I’ve been in other fandoms and I’ve never seen shipping wars like this. Truthfully, even if my ships don’t happen, as long as the characters are happy and it makes sense that’s all that matters to me.

For anyone familiar with Avatar: the Last Airbender, I shipped Zutara, so I’m fine with my ships not sailing. Would I prefer them to be canon? Yes. Will I still engage with non-canon ships if my ships were sunk? Absolutely.

The fun of shipping is looking at two or more characters and being like “wow - they have these things in common, I think they would make an interesting relationship dynamic.”

#ask

5 notes · View notes

corvuserpens · 1 year

Text

I cannot believe I’m writing this in the year of our lord of 20-fucking-22 but here we go ig.

Let people ship whoever they want to ship and mind your own damn business. Repeat after me:

Let people ship whoever they want to ship and mind your own damn business.

I am honestly SO disappointed at the Sandman fandom to learn Dreamling shippers are attacking Corintheus shippers. I am an exhasperated grandma who has seen countless fandoms be torn apart by shipping wars and I know, I know it’s naive and even stupid of me to expect this one to be different from the others, but that does literally nothing to temper the fact I am thoroughly disappointed over it. Shipping wars are the Dumbest form of discourse.

Look, I’ll be real with you: those who follow me know I’m a die hard Dreamling fan. Obsessed wouldn’t be too out of whack, and I don’t particularly enjoy the Corintheus ship, I prefer to see the Corinthian and Morpheus dynamic as father/son. So you know what I do?

I bloody ignore it. I see it often on my dash because I have friends here who love it, but I don’t even bother blacklisting it, I just scroll right past! It’s literally that easy, and with the blacklist app, it’s even easier!! There is no excuse whatsoever for attacking and cyberbullying the fans who enjoy that ship except out of pure vanity, spite and boredom. It’s a motherfucking ugly look to make someone feel bad for liking a ship and y’all should be ashamed.

If anyone who reads this practices abuse over ships, I urgently advise you to look within yourself and ask if this is really the kind of person you want to be. Is making someone sad over who they do or don’t ship really going to bring you happiness? Is it going to take away the joy you feel by engaging in your own preferred ship? Is it going to make you proud to have unnecessarily acted like an asshole? If the answer to all that is no, then just stop. Again:

Let people ship whoever they want to ship. Mind your own damn business. And blacklist that ship’s tags so you don’t have to see them. PLEASE. This fandom has been so sweet and chill, so help me try to keep it that way. Don’t ruin someone’s day to make yourself feel better. We should be united by our love of The Sandman’s universe, not fighting over niche spaces. You can discuss what you like or don’t like in a polite, calm and respectful manner. And if you still disagree at the end, it’s to each their own and we all go to our favorite corners and stay friends. Okay?

You like the Corintheus ship? Good.

You like the Dreamling ship? Good.

You like the Corinthian-Hob-Dream ship? Good!

Just chill and have fun. That’s all. Rant over or wtv.

#The Sandman #a Crow's rants #Gosh Dream would bring down a deluge and flood the entire Dreaming if he was real and saw y’all at each other’s throats over ships.

18 notes · View notes

muffinmonstah-art · 1 year

Text

Do you ever feel like you’re talking to a wall?

It started with some account sending me an ask today, very offended and hurt by me tagging my art as #dickjay and #jaydick instead of just #jaydick, because of who’s bottom and who’s top on the art. Pretty frivoulous and stupid take in my opinion (and in the opinion of everyone who liked my public response to that “change the tags!” demand)

I don’t know how that escalated to that person accusing me of being an arrogant western that thinks herself to be the center of the world...

But it happened. They sent me a new DM in that same tone, very angry and hurt because one of my followers responded to them on the comments by agreeing with me over the overly dramatic scandalized reaction to my tags.

This person kept repeating they were an inexperienced person on online discourses and they got to check my Patreon to see the commentary over the characters’ roles to make their mind if my art truly was misstagged. They also said I should check on how they do thing on the Asian fandom and how they use tags the proper way... very out of nowhere lecturing, if you ask me.

I just thought “maybe this is a minor”, you know... the natural assumption when you read something like “I’m new to fandoms” or “I have no experience in any of this”. Just the nomal protocol, when you have some years engaging on fandoms online and you have dealt with minors pretending to be adults, or by the nature of the complaint. Let’s face it, being mad about tags does seem just like your everyday Twitter troll.

I told them in case they were a minor they shouldn’t be talking to me and even less be exposed to NSFW art. I told them just in case you’re a minor I’m not going to continue this conversation, I suggest you to block the people you find unconfortable and move on. I told them it’s not worth it to pursue discourse online over this things. That creators and people in general are here to have fun, they don’t appreciate strangers coming out of nowhere lecturing them about how to do stuff. That blocking is a rightful tool.

What did it serve for? They came after me for a third time even angrier, called me an arrogant western because I was assuming they were a minor when they were not, that they’re Asian and I was being disrespectful to them as an Asian by responding to them publicly the first time and by not wanting to follow the Asian fandoms’ way to use tags and that now they saw it’s true we western people believe ourselves to be above everyone else.

That last thing was said to me especially after I defended one of my followers on the public response’s comment box. This person called my follower an ignorant by just agreeing with my views over blocking the posts you don’t want to see in the tags. I got defensive because I don’t like to see people that have been supporting my art for years getting attacked like that on my posts. I was not nice in the responses by pointing out how ridiculous it is to make a big deal and to antagonize people over this stuff online. I did call it a Chronically Online behaviour and that, from all the problems in the world that really matter, such as inflation, wars, xenophobia, violence against children, etc, spending your time online fighting strangers over TAGS does look like a stereotypical “First World” thing to do. I didn’t assume anything about this person’s nationality. I was describing a behaviour and maybe I made the mistake to mix the Twitter culture I carry on with me with Tumblr discourses.

See, it’s normal to respond to antis and puritans on Twitter with stuff like “Fighting over fictional relationships is frivolous, such a First World thing, we people that are not Chronically Online are more worried about getting food on our table and paying our rent and have no time to worry about harassing artists over ships”

Oh boy they missunderstood everything I said and started to explain to me how they were not a minor and not everything of I just implied again and everything became about how I’m some kind of western bully.

I suddenly was in the position of explaining everything related to how internet and fandom online culture works. How me thinking they could be a minor for the way they approached me was nothing personal, that it’s not rude to respond in public and that what I said wasn’t personal against them for what their nationalitiy was. It was really frustrating, like everything I said was offensive to them and everything was intepreted as me thinking myself to be better when it was the opposite, I respected their views on the tags matter but I had my own opinion (and judging by my post with +200 notes, everyone was chill with my view on the matter except them) just as valid to exist on this platform as theirs. I just suggested them to block me and to stop fighting everyone to avoid being hurt by not getting everyone around them to think as them.

And why would my way of tagging be invalid when they’re the ones that decided to join a western platform such as Tumblr with western people that use tags diferent than them? If they find us western fans of DC comics (An American property, by the way) so annoying why would they even be here? In my humble opinion, they were too stubborn to accept other way to use tags or do things in general, They kept repeating they were being nice while explaining to me why this as a problem in their eyes but never awknoledged that maybe my point of view is also valid? I don’t know.

I decided to delete my first public reaction, understanding that they were hurt by being exposed and by the cynical tone of the conversation. Because I truly have nothing against this person nor about where they come from (I told them that my native language is not English either). I’m not sure if that serves as a good faith act from my part, but I tought at first it was part of the game on internet interactions. And once I saw that this person was really out of touch with every subtlety and code surroinding online international English-speaking fandoms, it wasn’t fun anymore for me either.

I’m so tired right now. Emotionally too. I just wanted to post some catharsis post because it was too much, even for me.

I need to rest and log off the social media for a few days. Thank you all who still support me and don’t think I’m a horrible person. I try to be a better person day by day, even if I don’t seem like one sometimes. I try to learn about people, about how to respond, what to respond, where, with what words. Try to not get into trouble. but sometimes I just offend people even when I try not to. Thank you for reading to the end :)

#personal post

17 notes · View notes

emblazons · 1 year

Note

The heteronormativity is bad but it’s not even just that. I think the bigger problem in the Byler vs Melvin ship war is that since mlm fandoms have a reputation of being misogynistic and hating the female character for “getting in the way” everyone automatically assumes that Bylers fall under that category too (I’ve had sapphic friends who don’t watch the show tell me that they hate Byler because they think that the fans hate women even though most of us are queer women ourselves) and so we have to be extra nice and accommodating and apologize every time anyone even mildly criticizes El on here otherwise we’re labeled misogynistic (and even ableist even though El has no canonical disabilities). Which I think is so dumb because El is a flawed character and that’s a big part of what makes her interesting. Discussing her mistakes doesn’t mean that we hate her, in fact I would go as far as to say that people who recognize her flaws and love her for them care about El more than fake-woke Twitter feminists who try to strip her of all her less than perfect qualities. And don’t even get me started on how acceptable homophobia is in the Melvin fandom. The way that they shit on Will all the time and want to erase him and have him die in the name of “supporting women” is disgusting and idk why Bylers try so hard to cater to these people and just get along. There is no need and there shouldn’t be any desire to get along with homophobes. It’s okay to just hate things and it’s not morally wrong to dislike Melvin and want to stay far away from it.

Mmmm. Well first off I appreciate your honesty and want to (sorry for phrasing it the therapist way lmao) hold space for your irritation with how ignorant people can be in fandom spaces, because it is very real—and especially given the complicated history mlm ships carry in fandom historically, I can see how byler being pigeonholed into the same "you just want to get rid of the girl for your mlm ship" space is frustrating as hell, especially now that it's officially semi-canon.

Also, to your point about El: I agree that there are far too many people who behave as though acknowledging that characters (especially female ones) can be multi-faceted + make mistakes / be imperfect is somehow tantamount to a misogyny, even though good characters (male or female) must have internal challenges and conflicts so they aren’t one-note in the narrative. Too many people act as though their personal resonance or projection onto a character should define everyone else’s understanding and analysis of that character, and that’s something that happens a lot with El, especially in the case of the space she occupies in relationship to Byler.

Personally, I've avoided most of that discourse by not engaging with Byler "versus" Mlvn conversations for the most part, but that I still notice and react to myself when it comes into my space—particularly the "you're misogynistic or ableist" conversation, considering almost all of that is rooted in headcanons and projections, and not El's (or Mike's...or Will's) canonical characterization. You’re completely right to want to stay far away from that kind of discourse/energy—staying away from how I’ve kept myself sane and enjoying st in spite of how chronically online some of the fandom's takes can be.

I don't think there is any solution to it (people are like that in every fandom space, and I don't think they're gonna stop being willfully ignorant or heteronomative now), but...it helps that I know most of the argument surrounding "byler is trying to get rid of El" is based on either not knowing the show, unchecked emotion, or poor media comprehension, because media literate analysis makes it clear that all three characters involved are deeply complex, growing individuals whose stories all have their own purpose—El's is just moving independent, while Mike & Will's are moving toward each other.

People who don't understand or can't see that—or who want to start arguments over byler based on nothing but their understanding of other mlm ships, or their need to posture solely for the sake of being "right" on the internet—are, quite frankly, not people I'm trying to converse with if I can help it. I don't need to be an advocate for byler badly enough to put up with any of that lmao.

Thanks for the ask!

#I'm really sorry that people are saying shit like that to you tho anon!#its wild to me that people have decided byler is just 'another one of those irritating mlm ships' without even seeing the show???#people are wild lmao #asks

3 notes · View notes

sersi · 2 years

Note

hello elysia, i just wanted to say, as someone else who weathered the post-endgame anti-steve clown circus (which has continued far longer than it should've but lemme not rant) and suffered psychic damage from the worst takes possible, i am SO thankful for the steve content you've provided. like i'm not that into steggy but the care you put into your sets is so amazing and you illustrate the importance of their relationship in a way that fandom seems to either not get or willfully misunderstand. thank you so much for all you do and i hope you have an amazing rest of your day/night <3

Hiiiiiiiiii 🙋🏽‍♀️. This is honestly one of the nicest, most mentally rewarding asks I've ever gotten. And it is also got stuck/forgotten in my inbox because I was like “Oh I don’t have time to answer this properly right now”, mentally filed it as a Thing to Do Later, and then didn’t look at my inbox for a week.

So, that said, I’ve been stanning Steve for a literal decade and have been Through It™ multiple times because of him. Civil War era had me eagerly awaiting the day I would follow Chris out of the MCU and while that obviously didn’t happen, having already spent most of 2015 - 2018 engaging in increasingly aggressive curation of my online fandom experience really impacted my post-Endgame experience. It’s why I wasted no time in blacklisting aggressively. And why I was kind of already primed to communicate my love for Steve and his arc and some of the characters around him through gifset. I’ve seen so many wonky characterizations of Steve and his arc over the years that, rather than writing 1000 words about why I like some aspect of Steve’s arc only get told that something that definitely happened in canon didn’t actually happen, I prefer to have my visual Here It Is Happening In Canon references right there, in 268px or 540px widths.

I obviously don’t expect everyone to agree with or like my readings of canon--our taste in media is deeply personal and I absolutely get why Steve’s Endgame ending was never going to work for some people. But Steve is my favorite character EVER. I have thought about that man so much, for so long. I have, at one point or another, shipped almost all his popular ships. As a multishipper, I even have slightly different, not always fully compatible, readings of canon for my different Steve ships. So, one of the things that really bugged me back during peak Endgame discourse (and inspired/drove more than a few gifsets) was this notion that none of this had been set up in canon or that no one who liked the ending understood Steve’s character or his arc. Thankfully things have calmed down a ton since then, but, both with Steve and with my Other Faves, I still tend to put a ton of thought into how best to communicate the ideas behind my sets because, while impossible to fully control for, it is always my hope that my intentions (and love involved in the making of these sets) will be clear enough to break through whatever more fandom popular preconceptions people might have 🤷🏽‍♀️.

#and at a bare minimum i hope that the love involved will be apparent enough that people will realize they should Angry Yell in a new post #elysia's inbox

17 notes · View notes

historywench · 2 years

Text

Babel by R.F. Kuang

I am generally underwhelmed by hyped new releases, but rarely does the popularity of a book baffle me as much as this one. The tone of this book is that of sitting through an undergraduate lecture in a combination course on the history of the British Empire and linguistics delivered by a professor who thinks they are very clever but are actually boring as hell. The author’s understanding of the history is shallow, sometimes incorrect, and often oversimplified. She knows which names and events to drop to sound informed, but has no interest in examining their relevance or influence with any depth or in engaging in the historiographic debates. Kuang’s history is black and white. No room for nuance here. This book is desperate to deconstruct colonialism, but it never gets beyond the level of simply saying imperialism is bad. There is no insight into the mechanisms of power or resistance. Of our main cast of wunderkind students, the lead, Robin Swift, is boring and painfully naive to the very end. Yet we are asked to believe that Robin, who can't put together that Anthony faked his death even though Griffin specifically told him how he did the same thing to join Hermes full time, prevented the Opium Wars. It’s absurd. His fellow students are one dimensional characters who exist only for the author to make certain rhetorical points. The discussions between them are excruciating in their obviousness. Their relationships feel forced and unnatural. Kuang doesn’t build up to their friendship, she just tells us it exists and expects us to go along with it. What’s worse though, is these characters—who are all born in the early 19th century—talk like Gen Z kids discoursing about politics on the internet. One of the characters refers to India as a “narco-military state”. Someone else says there is a “non-zero chance” of something happening. A news headline reads “DRUGGY MCDRUGGY”? Really? A 19th century person said or wrote that? Putting the words and ideas of the 21st century into the mouths of the early Victorians is not just discordant, it’s a misrepresentation of the attitudes and rhetoric of the period. And it’s a strange choice for an author who clearly cares a lot about language since she batters us over the head with dictionary definitions on every page. Meanwhile, all of the English characters are sneering racists so cartoonish you keep expecting them to twirl their mustaches and say something about those meddling kids. All of this ignores the very real anti-colonial movements that existed in India, and China, and Haiti, and in Britain itself. Empire always had opponents and critics, but Kuang doesn't want to give them credit for that. In fact, she specifically dismisses anti-imperial British people as motivated by literally any factor other than a sense of right and wrong. An ahistorical representation to say the least. There is a resistance society at work in this novel, but it is toothless and its purpose and plan are never elaborated upon. So much for anti-colonialism. And then there is the so-called magic system which is really just nonsense. There is no magic in this book to speak of. It makes absolutely no sense that the entire industrial revolution is somehow reliant on silver bars with words engraved on them. Ovens won’t bake bread without it? Carts can’t be pulled? Modern technologies only work if the silver is present? The basics of mechanics just don’t exist anymore evidently. Seems like silver is more of a liability than an advantage. The author doesn’t explain why the British seem to be the only ones using silver either, or why the previous empires who used it failed if the silver is so all-powerful. Or why, having access to this incredible supernatural power, all they do with it is make ships sail a little faster and….make flowers look brighter? Put on special light shows? I don’t even know. What is clear, is that whatever they are doing with it, it doesn’t make a damn bit of difference since in Kuang’s supposedly alternate reality the entire history of the empire carries on in exactly the same way as it did in the real world. Some of the faults of the book could be glossed over if it were at least entertaining. Unfortunately, it isn’t. The plot of this book is as dull as its characters. It is tedious and bogged down by repetition. The second half of the book strains suspension of disbelief well past its limits. The ending is ludicrous. Robin's decision to both commit suicide and convince several other people who had been part of this resistance for about five minutes to do so as well? Unlikely. The much vaunted footnotes don’t add anything to the story the reader couldn’t already infer for themselves. There’s nothing like having your intelligence insulted every other page to make a reading experience special. All in all, this left me wondering who in the world is this book for? It wants to be Les Miserables but it doesn’t have the heart, the skill, or the courage.

#babel #babel an arcane history #book review #long reads #reading

1 note · View note

phoenixyfriend · 3 years

Note

Re; Ahsoka and Quinlan being the same age, now I'm picturing Ahsoka, Quinlan, and Rex eventually ending up in a weird sorta thruple where Quinlan comes in and out of the relationship but the door is kinda always open for him? And Rex spends a lot of mornings eyeing the tangle of orange and brown skin on the other side of the bed like he has no idea how he ended up here but he's (mostly) okay with that tbh

Context: Commander Buir in chronological order

YES okay so this is wild to me that people are invested in this but like half the time-travel fics with Ahsoka in the same age-group as Quinlan have me wondering if I should ship them. Let me just. Ho shit.

So, okay, I've explored a lot of possible dynamics but there's something really engaging about how Quinlan, trained as a Shadow before the Sith came back, could react to a War Padawan. Ahsoka isn't really infiltration material yet, she's very much a frontline fighter, but she's got a lot more experience with a kind of consistent dark atmosphere that most Jedi don't. They get exposed to plenty of dark stuff, sure, but not the kind of all-encompassing "this is my life for the last two years" thing that is usually reserved for the long-term field agents like Shadows and Watchmen.

The War Padawans, for all that they were supposed to be just normal Jedi Padawans, were living in the kind of consistently negative environment that's normally experienced by those Knighted Sentinels.

So Ahsoka, while still generally pretty young in these AUs, is a very odd kind of person to be around, because she's spunky and vivacious and snippy and affectionate and snarky and knows how to break every bone in your body from harrowing experience as the only thing standing between death and thousands of brothers.

And Quinlan, I imagine, really likes that about her. She gets it, and she's still an energetic and loving and trying to do her best to be a good person despite everything. He gravitates towards her and she... well, she's not blind. She can tell he's interested. And she's not upset about that.

ANYWAY, ONTO REX

So, Rex is... technically twelve. He hasn't exactly got a whole lot of experience with romance. He is also, up until the point of time-travel, legal property of the Senate and the Jedi Order, which means that Ahsoka, or at least her community, owns him. He was indoctrinated to serve her and that community. She also outranks him, for all that she usually lets him take the lead in the field due to experience. He's older than her physically and maturity-wise, but she's also had a grow-up-faster-than-you-should adolescence, and she has superpowers.

What I'm saying is, the power dynamic is fucked up.

(Unironically I spent hours last night realizing that it balances out a lot more than C*dywan does, which I'm censoring because by god do I not want discourse on this post. I like both ships, and don't want to argue about what's the most problematic. It's Star Wars. The only unproblematic ships are Bail/Breha and Owen/Beru.)

Here's the thing, though, because the main thing people seem to argue here is the age/maturity difference as a problem area:

The age difference in actual time is four years, which is smaller than the two main ships of the franchise (Han/Leia and Padme/Anakin, to be clear). The age difference in maturity is ??? We'll say that the clones started aging normally after they hit twenty, so the age difference in maturity is six years... which is still normal for SW ships.

(This is why I don't have any issues with the ship in a post-O66 context, once they've had a few years to move past the traumas and whatnot. The age stuff all evens out with time, they're a good team, and neither was grooming the other. It's not objectively any more problematic than most SW ships at that point, and I'm okay with that. They deserve to be happy if they want.)

But they get yanked away from all that structure of who owns what, who reports where, who has which rank, who's legally a person in the eyes of the Republic when they end up on Dagobah. Once they've registered when they are, the only remaining complications are:

He grew up in a cultlike environment and was indoctrinated to serve her (but has been replacing that indoctrination with genuine respect and affection for her as a person because they've worked together for two years).

She has superpowers (contextually not a big problem: we see several Force-Sensitive/Non-Sensitive ships that don't consider those powers a complicating element)

He's several years younger than her (canonically less of an issue than it could be: Cut got married and has kids) and has next to no experience with what a normal romance looks like except for hanging out on the edges of whatever the fuck his General has going on with the Senator

She's several years less mature than he is (...something of an issue)

So a lot of this is mostly okay. She feels weird about the fact that she's got more knowledge of romance and all that it entails. He feels weird about the fact that, despite her being older, he looks at her and sees someone that's still a little young, not quite a shiny. Except she is older than him, and he's seen her behead four people in a single move, and they've saved each other's lives more times than either of them can count anymore. He respects her, and the fact that she's babyfaced doesn't change the fact that, in terms of who they are as people and warriors, they're on a level playing field.

She still looks at him and mourns his lost childhood, and he still looks at her and takes a moment to see past the too-big eyes and adolescent proportions.

But they really, really care about each other, and maybe part of them is starting to recognize that there's a bit of a crush before they time-travel, but neither one wants to make a move. There's a lot of baggage on both sides, a lot of "but they're a child" and "but they're (literally vs functionally) below me in the chain of command, I can't take advantage of that" and all that fun stuff. It's the kind of situation where two people circle each other for ages without making a move, because actually making that move is terrifying on account of not knowing whether the other party knows they can say no, on top of the usual "what if it ruins our friendship?" thing.

What happens on Dagobah, though... is very tropey. They're sort of stranded until Ahsoka can fix the ship, and that takes time. The area is also very heavy with the Force, dense and heady with the energy it carries, and it's... actually really not great for Ahsoka. She keeps feeling like she's back on Mortis, and has nightmares from the trigger there, but also keeps hallucinating because she wasn't ready for the thickness of the energy (like Yoda) or still new enough to the Force that she couldn't feel how dense it all was (like Luke). She can't work on the engines as constantly as she'd like to get them out of there, and while Rex is a competent mechanic, he's not as skilled with it as the girl who jumped headfirst into lessons with Anakin.

Rex spends a lot of time holding Ahsoka and wiping her brow with a wet cloth while she's feverish and out of it. Yes we're going full Florence Nightingale romance here, let me have my fun.

They get the communications relay working earlier than the engine, find out the year is wrong, panic a bit. All is well. (It's not, but they're holding it together for now.)

Ahsoka keeps working on the engine when she's lucid. Rex keeps hunting up game and edible plants for them while she does. They cuddle at night, because it's not cold but it is empty of the people they care about, and they kind of want that reassurance of someone they trust and love at their back.

(Morai visits.)

(Daughter shows up in the nightmares, tells Ahsoka that age will not come for her beloved until the time is natural for it. The phrasing is dumb but she does manage to convey that the accelerated aging is no longer an issue, if it even was after they hit adulthood. Ahsoka is relieved.)

And, you know, emotions happen. She takes his hand while they're leaning up against each other. He kisses her forehead while she's having a bad spell. They cook together and tell jokes to keep sane and spar. They hug each other through nightmares and panic attacks. There is much blushing. There is much cuddling.

Once, they kiss.

They break apart, flushing and stammering and being very awkward about the whole thing, and make excuses to leave and panic about the fact that they!! Kissed!!!!!

A couple hours later they find each other again, and have a long and complicated discussion about why they like each other (war makes bedfellows, there's trust and affection and all that fun stuff) and why they're hesitant (age stuff, maturity stuff, prior indoctrination), and make the decision to take it slow. They cuddle, and kiss, and blush a lot because both of them are basically just dumb teens having their first real relationship.

They eventually leave the planet, make it to Coruscant, etc. It takes a bit for anyone except Obi-Wan to realize that something's changed between them. Most people didn't know them before, and Anakin's observation skills are currently at a very low ebb. But they sit together and hold hands, and flirt when they spar, and once or twice people find them kissing (both standard and Keldabe) in a corner while holding hands and then just smiling at each other like loons.

They end up rooming together because nobody has the heart to separate them after hearing about all the war stuff. Like yes attachment's bad, but these two do seem to understand loss of loved ones and recognize that they could lose each other at any time and death is natural and they won't lose their entire shit about it, and if even General Kenobi is anxious as hell about being separated from the people he fought side-by-side with for two years, then maybe it's just... really normal for those two to want each other's company, and everyone can just turn a blind eye to the romance happening.

They share a bed, but they only ever sleep in it. Like, there's some goodnight kisses and cuddles, but everything is very G-rated until they've had time to settle into being true equals instead of just the "well, I guess the power dynamics balance out? Maybe?" of before.

And just... yeah. Rex does not believe that he's in this good of a position whenever he has the time to think about it. He's got a girlfriend! A really pretty, smart, strong, skilled one! Who thinks he's a cool dude! How the fuck did a clone like him manage that? He wasn't even legally a person a year ago, how did he end up in bed with one of the most amazing people he's ever met? He spends multiple nights just staring at her while he tries to fall asleep, asking himself how he got here and just like... marveling at her. She's worth marveling at. He's in love and she's amazing and he has no idea how to handle it at all.

...yeah no I have a lot of feelings now.

#Rexsoka #Ahsoka Tano #Captain Rex #Quinlan Vos #time travel #Commander Buir #Phoenix Posts

272 notes · View notes

neon-junkie · 3 years

Text

Hey everyone,

This will be my final post addressing the fandom conflict that has quite frankly gotten out of hand. Although it’s very likely this post will be picked apart, no matter how well intended it is, I will no longer be addressing, interacting, or responding to any further accusations made against me. Of course, if people have questions from a genuine place of interest, I will be happy to clarify anything for you, either via DM’s or non-anon asks. I will not be answering anonymous asks on this, as I do not want anything else posted on this topic.

As a side note: For anyone tempted to wade into the debate, I sincerely ask you not to get involved. Do not make yourself a target, do not feel you need to ‘pick a side’, and please do not think you have an obligation to reason with either side. It seems to be well past the point of that, so please find people you get along with in this fandom and curate a space for yourself away from all this conflict.

Warning: This post will contain uncensored slurs, mentions of racism, paedophilia, transphobia, LGBTQ+ phobia, death threats, threats of violence, targeted harassment, and abusive language.

To start off, I want to apologise to everyone who has somehow gotten drawn into this mess by either defending me, following me, or interacting with my content. This whole situation with me began well over a year ago when I wrote a crack-smut fic featuring Javier/Micah, posted back in August 2019. A crack fic is defined as “a work of fan fiction that is absurd, surprising or ridiculous, often intentionally.” It was inspired by a camp interaction between Micah and Javier, and like many other fanfiction writers, I decided to write smut about it. The fic was titled ‘Dirty Fucking Greaser’, and if that shocks you, I’m sure you can imagine how shocked I was to be informed afterwards that ‘Greaser’ was in fact a very serious 19th century slur for a Mexican individual. My first encounter with this word as insult was via RDR2, where it was used like a very casual insult. My only prior knowledge of this term was in regards to the greasers youth subculture, so the severity was lost on me. This obviously does not excuse my ignorance, and I should have researched the term better, but this is just again to apologize for that oversight, the insensitivity, and to highlight that my use of this term was not meant maliciously. Following this being pointed out, I proceeded to make 3 separate apology posts [Unfortunately I can only find the third one: HERE], renamed the fic, and added slur warnings in both the tags and the fic description. When I continued to receive complaints and increasingly aggressive abuse (which included being told my apologies weren’t good enough and I should delete my account and even kill myself), I attempted to delete the fic and mistakenly abandoned it instead. I contacted AO3 to see if it could be removed, but they said there was nothing they could do. I contacted their DMCA takedown team, who also said they couldn't remove it. Please note that all this happened 7-8 months ago, and has been dragged on for almost a year.

So, from this one unfortunate incident, I’ve been branded a racist, and someone who attacks POC, when all I have done is tried to defend myself and correct my past mistakes. I could have done this more gracefully in the past, but frankly when you’re suddenly the target of unrelenting callout posts and nasty anons, it’s very hard to be open to criticism of this sort, but this is what I’m trying to move past.

Over the course of the year, this one mistake has spiralled, and the crusade against me has somehow coincided with moral conflicts over certain characters and ships. This has devolved into dehumanizing abuse, witch hunts, death threats, doxxing, anon hate, and much more unpleasant behaviour.

I have been in fandom for a very long time, and at the heart of all fandom circles is the fear of censorship and subsequent purges, so the ‘ship and let ship’ mentality was more or less the pinnacle of fandom philosophy. And yes, this can be problematic in some contexts. People have their right to be uncomfortable with content, have a right to be offended by content, but that is not content meant for you. This argument has devolved into ‘what material is morally right to engage with’ and that is a mentality in which fandom will not survive, because for every person who is telling me I’m an awful person for writing about Micah, there are three other people telling me how much they appreciate me making that content. For every fic in which I characterize Javier and Flaco a certain way, some people are made uncomfortable by it and others tell me they enjoy it. And this isn’t just white people, but POC too, which makes it very difficult to know whether I am genuinely in the right or the wrong, especially when it comes to the concept of ‘fetishization’ which I have been made aware I need to educate myself on. I intend to do so, but I disagree with the common accusation that finding non-white men romantically and sexually attractive is inherently fetishistic and makes me racist. It’s pushing a catch-22; don’t find POC sexually attractive? Racist. Find POC sexually attractive? Racist.

I am always willing to be (politely) approached about anything my readers may be concerned about, but if it’s something I’ve specifically tagged for (such as themes, scenarios, etc.) I’m afraid you consented to reading it and with that I cannot help you. You are just as responsible for curating your space and what you see/read just as much as I am responsible for tagging it appropriately.

On the topic of racism, I want to bring up my prior use of ‘white racism’ which has obviously been a point of contention among both white and people of colour. The (literal) black vs white concept of racism is incredibly American-centric, and as someone from Europe, which has a history of oppression against white cultures and those of people of colour, it feels inaccurate. However, this has recently been discussed with me and I came to the realization that while growing up, especially in the UK, ‘xenophobia’ and ‘racism’ were marketed as one and the same. So, with this little revelation in mind, I will no longer be using ‘white racism’ (Or ‘reverse racism’) to identify the abuse I have been receiving, but will instead call it by what it really is; dehumanizing, debasing, xenophobic, puritanical.

Very briefly, I will also touch on the NewAustin situation, which has also been dredged into this. I did not ‘chase a POC from tumblr’. NA was a minor who for some reason was on my 18+ blog and took issue with me, likely from the ongoing discourse regarding my fic and initial mistake, as well as my interest in Micah. They were subsequently harassed into deleting their account by anonymous hate following various conflicts with other users for their support of me or their ships in general. I have never encouraged my followers to target anyone, and have always asked to be blocked and blacklisted by those who do not like me or my content. When NewAustin messaged me following the deletion of their blog, I was admittedly indifferent to the point of being unkind, and accused them of sending the hate themselves. This was based on the anon hate being racially-driven without there being any prior knowledge or publication that NA was a person of colour. This aside, I should have at the time, whether I believed it was my followers or not, condemned this behaviour. Regardless of the issues I’ve had with these people, it is never ever ok to send hate to anyone, no matter the motivation behind it, and that should have been stated at the time.

All I can do at this point is acknowledged and apologize for my past mistakes, and try to improve myself going forward.

It is not my place to dictate the morals of the character/ship-aspect of this argument, and I am not interested in waging a war of opinion. This post is simply to clarify how I am involved in this, and why I am so viscerally targeted. You can draw your own conclusions, but I am no longer interested in this endless back and forth.

To my mutuals/followers, I stand by my request to not interact and to block and move on, as this is what I’ll be doing too.

Thank you for taking the time to read this, and I hope it makes things from my perspective a little clearer.

-RAT <3

EDIT: Just after this post was made, the fic in question was finally removed. I had to go through a DMCA take down, which can take months, since I originally abandoned the fic, thinking that meant delete. I explain this in more detail above. Said fic is gone, and has been gone since this post has been around.

#the tea #apology #long post

161 notes · View notes

forbiddenship · 3 years

Text

just a disclaimer to my fellow portwell shippers, this post has basically just turned into a rant about you know what. it’s just something i needed to get off my chest. not my usual content and a little heavy in negativity so please please please keep scrolling if you don’t want to see that. trust me, there are some days when reading a post like this is the last thing i need.

whew okay. i will say this once, and i’ll say it loud and clear. i don’t wanna hear any more r*nas complaining about what we discuss over here. first of all, the portwell fandom likes to use tumblr to communicate our thoughts and post our analyses because y’all have turned hsmtmts twitter into no man’s land. ever wonder why that app - particularly stan twitter - has such a reputation for being toxic? it’s because things like ship wars get out of control to the point where sometimes people stop wanting to even associate with the fandom. because, as unfortunate as it is, the rina fandom phenomenon isn’t one that occurs in isolation. many fandoms have that one subsection of the fandom that tries their damndest to make the experience unbearable for everyone else. portwell shippers have seen it, we’ve accepted it, and we honestly don’t give a fuck anymore. we just stay in our lanes - be that on instagram, tumblr, tiktok, wherever.

not to mention that portwell shippers are - generally speaking - very polite and respectful in the way that they address the other ship. and notice another thing: when we talk about our theories and give our takes on the storylines, we do just that. we stick to what’s happening on the show. we don’t make posts slandering the ship, and definitely not its shippers.

meanwhile, a quick glance through the ‘portwell’ search on twitter will tell you that rina shippers do not extend the same courtesy to us. not only do you “refuse to keep our names out of your mouths,” as you all love to put it, but you literally take content from another platform and transport it over to twitter so you can start discourse about it. because the portwell shippers aren’t willing to engage with you on twitter. and why is that, again? oh, right. because you shit on anyone who disagrees with the great rina dogma. because you say things like an 18 year old boy deserves to go to jail, or an actor deserves to lose his job for supporting a fictional ship. because you started acting like the moral police just because you couldn’t stand that your ship was losing traction - which is a very generous way to put it. you’re not the moral police, by the way. and even if you wanted to be, putting out statements like “everyone in xyz fandom is nasty and sick in the head” is not a good way to go about that. it says a lot more about you guys as people than it does about us or our ship.

as for the whole “portwells mention rina unprovoked” thing - talking shit about portwell is literally the only thing that has kept the rina fandom alive on twitter. i’m pretty active on twitter, and whenever i type ‘portwell’ or even ‘ej’ and ‘gina’ into the search bar, the same things come up every time. there is a small but very vocal part of the fandom over there that literally does nothing with their accounts but talk about a ship they don’t like. this is a just a tiny, tiny slice of representation of what goes down on twitter.

so don’t come at us for talking about rina within the context of the show’s storylines when you haven’t been able to shut up about portwell since june. god, the hypocrisy is insane.

#hsmtmts #portwell #anti-rina

51 notes · View notes

sanktyastag · 3 years

Note

genuinely so confused with people who hate show!darklng. show!darkling is as much of a part of oppressed minority as book!darkling is but with even more 'validation' for his purpose, and i see people still hate show!him saying "oh but he is very bad in book" but then i see them rooting for book m*l LIKE HOWWW [i do kinda understand with those who dislike book!darkling but im still as baffled when when they root for book m*l]

ah, the good old darkling vs mal debate, lol.

in all honesty, i think whether someone prefers mal or the darkling when they watch/read SaB really comes down to how different fans like to engage with media.

i really enjoy politics, moral ambiguity, and fiction as a tool to examine real world oppression. as a result (and incredibly predictably to every single person who knows me) my favorite character is the darkling, because his character is a great lense to examine those different aspects of the series from. but, let's be honest here - both the books and the show only engage in politics, gray morality, and discrimination and oppression against minorities in like... the most surface-level way possible. if you're not already prone to getting over-invested in those fictional aspects, there's very little incentive to do so - because both the books and the show only set the darkling up as a focal point to examine those concepts in book 1, when alina thinks he could possibly be a good person. as soon as the darkling is revealed to be an eViL mAnIpUlAtOr, quite literally all of the nuance is stripped from his character, and we no longer engage with any valid points he may or may not have.

which means, if you're not super interested in socio-political worldbuilding, or you don't really want to examine war from a philosophical or moral standpoint, the books and show won't make you, and so it's nice and easy to just view the darkling as the amoral antagonist who needs to be taken down. i honestly don't blame fans for not liking him in the books, because the books don't... really want you to. and the show does pretty much the same thing. the show stops sympathizing with the darkling the second baghra lets the truth drop, and so every single thing he was previously shown to care about is now framed as the manipulation of an evil, calculating villain. so if a fan looks at the darkling, sees all the evil shit he does, and doesn't want to look past all of that, in order to critically examine his character, and the biased way he's viewed... i mean. yeah. then they wouldn't be a fan of his. they're more than justified in that, in my opinion. "this character is interesting, you just have to look past all the nonsensical extremist, stupid bullshit he does that harms everyone around him" isn't going to be a universal opinion, and i don't blame them for not wanting to go out of their way to sympathize with an uncompromising, murderous bastard who doesn't really respect anyone else's opinions other than his own (which, i think, is true even of show!darkling, although he feels worse about the fact that he's screwing people over. like he might cry about it, but he's still going to go forward with his plan, regardless of who objects). there's a reason darklina fans spend so much time writing about what they think would have been a more satisfying or interesting character arc for the darkling to go through - because canon absolutely doesn't do him any favors. like at all.

and on the other side, there's mal. i actually like both show and book mal, even though i don't think book mal was always handled incredibly well. i think he's a fairly sympathetic character with phenomenally bad coping mechanisms, and that the story spends essentially no time actually exploring his negative character traits in a meaningful way, which means, again, that we're given a character who the audience is tasked with doing most of the legwork for, if they want to like him. just like darkling fans very rarely excuse every single thing he's ever done, i don't actually see mal fans defend all the shit he pulls - beyond when both sides are baiting each other, in which case everyone seems to say the most black and white shit i've ever heard. but that's just kind of how online discourse works, so i won't judge people based off that, lol.

i think most fans of book mal seem to take his character, examine his negative traits and where they stem from, pick how they, personally, would like to see those issues addressed, and then put in the work to give him and alina the breathing room to do go through that character growth together.

so, by and large, i think fans of book mal and show mal just have different concepts that they find interesting or satisfying to explore in the media that they like. i obviously can't speak for others, but generally with mal and alina, i do think it's an interesting coming of age story, and has a smaller-scale, trauma-focused approach to the over-arching, wide-scale moral dilemmas that i focus on when i think about the darkling and alina. they're two flawed characters, thrust into a horrible situation, and they're desperately trying to get through it together, while fighting for the happy, peaceful lives that no one else has ever cared about them achieving.

so, yeah. in the end, i think it's really about what a fan wants from the media they consume. there's not really a wrong answer, in my opinion. it's only when people start judging each other over their fictional preferences that things start getting rocky, which is something that both darkling/alina shippers and mal/alina shippers could probably be better about, as needlessly antagonistic posts are prominent in both ship tags.

#djafljkdalk i'm sorry if this isn't the answer you wanted anon. but it was an interesting chance to explore both ships!#even though trying to word my thoughts on them was... very difficult lol #because i have very strong opinions - both good and bad - on both #like at the end of the day there IS a reason i ship one of these ships more than the other #but it's an entirely personal preference that has to do with me liking certain tropes more than others #i think they're both equally bad in canon tbqh. i just have more fun exploring darklina stuff than i do mal/alina #but in general i think the romance focus of this series kind of ruined an otherwise interesting story </3 #say it with me folks. we're not anti the ships. we're anti the writing that never fully explored anything satisfactorily #and also we're anti the fans that make hating other ships like half of their personality #shadow and bone #darklina #anti leigh bardugo #mostly for my tags i guess lakdjflak

74 notes · View notes

oyedeng · 3 years

Text

Loki 1x04 Spoilers

Preface: I don't even really go here for shipping, and I have no strong feelings one way or another, but y'all are being really horrible right now, and it's impossible to go into the tag for a character I really enjoy and just have content for that character, or talk to people about plot developments, character revelations, *anything*, because everyone's just vomiting their shit into those tags... So I'm gonna piss a lot of you off right now, but I need to get this off my chest, and you're always welcome to block and/or unfollow...

Biphobia: By and large, most of y'all are just biphobic as fuck. And I know this because I've seen the posts going 'What was the point of making Loki bisexual if you don't give him a male love interest' and 'If they don't give him a male love interest, they should just not give him any love interest'. You're transparent, you're gross. This is unrelated to Sylvie/Loki, because the complaint here isn't related or limited to Sylvie, but purely about a male vs female love interest regardless of other factors. Note how no one cares about Sylvie, or shipping her with anyone, it's purely about Loki. I've been in fandoms long enough to know that most of y'all don't care about actual representation - you care whether or not your white fave kisses another (white) boy. None of you give a shit about the fact that we'll get an actual gay ship in The Eternals (but that's between two poc men, so I bet many of y'all will ignore it in favour of shipping the white GoT actors together, because you're transparent af). You're pressed because the first canon on-screen representation doesn't happen on your terms in the exact conditions you've set. Let me be clear: Bisexuals do not owe the gay or lesbian community same-sex relationships in order to be valid, and it's so insanely, stupidly hurtful to be reminded once again that we'll never be queer enough for queer spaces. A bisexual person dating anyone regardless of gender or sexual identity, is in a queer relationship. Full stop.

Sylvie/Loki: It's not incest, y'all. I understand not shipping it, not vibing with it, etc etc, but it's not incest, and I'm gonna need you to stop pretend that it's gross when it's not. It's not even really purely selfcest. They're not the same person. Variants are not all necessarily the same person from different points in time, like skinny Steve vs Serum Steve or Infinity War Loki vs D+ Show Loki would be. Sylvie and Loki are more like Tobey Maguire's Peter Parker vs Tom Holland's Peter Parker - different people who occupy the same role in the narrative of the universe, not all of whom make the cut. For all we know, Sylvie's Frigga, Odin and Thor are different, too. The Loki Variants in the post-credits and in the trailer shots prove that further - we have other female presenting Lokis there, two black Lokis, at least one east asian Loki... they're not all the same person. That's why the question is "What makes a Loki a Loki" and not "What makes us us/What makes you you?". They occupied the same role up until their nexus event, that's all.

Let me break this down for you: Thor + Hela = Incest Thor + Loki = Not Incest by blood, but they grew up thinking themselves siblings so YMMV on the levels of incestuous here (it squicks me out personally, but there's no blood relation.) IW Loki + D+ Loki = Selfcest, since they're the same person from different points in time. Selfcest isn't Incest - it's a fictional concept. Sylvie + Loki = None of the above. They're different people who play the same role in the universe. And even if you do consider it Selfcest - see above. It's still not Incest.

Also hello MCU fandom, Comics Bucky had a Threesome involving a version of himself, Deadpool is all about that stuff, the mythology Loki is based on has weirder shit. Please sit down and take a breath.

I fully understand not liking the ship for any reason including if it reads platonic to you instead of romantic, but stop trying to make purity discourse happen when the ship isn't incestuous.

Learn to tag your shit: Oh my god this is my biggest pet peeve right now. I just wanted to go into the Sylvie tag to find people talking about what we learned about her character, I wanted to find out what people make of her and Loki (regardless of whether you find them platonic or romantic), if anyone ships her with B15 like I do, to find gifs etc. I did not need to see all of you fail to grasp what incest is in her character tag, and I did not need to see you crying about Lokius in the Sylvia tag either. I'm sorry that your ship didn't go canon this episode, and I wanna tell you not to worry, we don't know if he's dead, it could still happen, and even if it doesn't, you can still ship it, but I've lost all patience because it's not about shipping wars, it's about being unable to engage with any show related content right now without being flooded with bad takes, rampant biphobia, discourse and drama. Screw this fandom. I just wanted to enjoy the bonkers story and awesome new characters.

Learn to curate your experience: And finally, if you don't like it, don't go there. Block the ship tag, it's as easy as that. Stop posting your salt into main tags. Let people enjoy what they enjoy. None of this is harmful, none of this is what you're trying to cry into existence,

#loki #loki show #loki spoilers #cw: biphobia #loki 1x04 #spoilers #fandom salt #fandom discourse #you guys really made me hate everything today #I don't even really care about the ships in this show #but the fans are acting gross #I hate it here #I think I'm gonna take a tumblr break #it's the casual biphobia that's actually getting to me hard #I'm gonna sit in my sambucky corner where it's nice #loki fandom is not a good place to be

55 notes · View notes