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quietwingsinthesky · 1 month

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Hiiiii! So, a few days ago you were talking about the whole thing with Amy, Rory, and River. And when I saw those posts a thought arose in my head and I wish to share it with you.

Since River grew up with Amy and Rory as Mels. And Mels was Amy's best friend do you think that they ever talked about children? Since I know that it can come up when talking with friends, and like... do you think that Amy might've ever expressed whether or not she wanted children?

And if she didn't, that Mels would've had to listen to her mother say that she doesn't want children? The idea is so heartbreaking and sooo interesting.

What do you think about it?

no, no, see, you're so right and this drives me wild.

because, the way i see it, i don't think amy wanted children. she's somewhere on the 'hasn't thought about it' to 'vaguely negative feelings about it happening' range to me, which falls sharply into 'Not Happening Ever Again' post-s6. (specifically, in terms of having a kid herself, even if she could, i really don't think she would. i do love that she and rory end up adopting a kid later, because that does make sense, for amy pond who grew up alone in one universe with her family swallowed by cracks in time before the doctor helped her set it right again, for her to want to make sure another child won't be alone in the world like she was. getting off-track here.)

and that's so. because the first real memory river/mels has of amy is of amy shooting at her. and depending on how well the silence fucked up the rest of her memory, it might be one of the very first memories she has at all. that's how she met her mother, crying for help and getting a bullet instead. her mother tried to kill her, so of course, you have to think. she must have needed to hear that she was wanted, right? even if she was taken away, even if amy shot her, at some point, melody must have been wanted?

river is good at getting people to do what she wants, but she is very, very bad at subtlety. and mels is younger, has less practice, so when she wants to know this, she's just going to ask. blunt and quick, easy enough because amy's used to the way mels will open her mouth and you just have to be ready to roll with what comes out if you want to keep up. it's why they're such good friends (like mother, like daughter.)

they're nine, and mels asks if amy wants kids, and amy wrinkles up her nose and says she won't have time for children, obviously, once her raggedy doctor finally comes back. they're fifteen, and amy and rory dance will they-won't they in a way that makes mels twitchy to watch, and taunting amy about wanting to have rory's babies is a good way to get on her nerves. but amy calls her gross, tells her she's got more life planned than children would leave room for, and besides, imagine her, a mom? it'd be a disaster.

mels does. a lot. she looks at her mother and just sees her best friend instead. she's not even sure what she wishes was there, but. maybe amy's right. and besides. imagine her, a daughter, instead of the ticking time bomb she really is? it'd be a disaster.

they're sixteen, seventeen, eighteen, and on. mels stands on the outside of a love story that births a universe. and her. how do you compete with that? not that she would know, not yet, she hasn't been there. but it doesn't make her feel any less alienated when amy and rory talk in whispers about a half-remembered world that's bled through to this life, about roman soldiers and boxes and the big bang of belief.

all these memories, they never mention children. on amy's wedding day, she's different, not like someone remembering a dream but someone who lived it. rory stands straighter, won't leave her side, and they're both so much older than they were yesterday. maybe now, right? a wedding's as good a time as any to decide you want kids.

mels not being at amy & rory's wedding is such an obvious lazy way of them trying to explain why they totally didn't just throw this plot twist together at the last minute that i'm not even going to acknowledge it. of course she was at their wedding. she's their best friend. there's too many people around the doctor, and she wasn't ready today of all days, so despite this horrible burning need under her skin to strike, she stays her hand. doesn't let him dance with her because she might just tear his throat out if he gets too close. stays with amy and rory as the maid of honor should. she must have been there for the awkward questions that always gets asked, 'so, any plans for a baby?' 'when am i getting grandkids?' 'oh, you two are going to have gorgeous children together.' standing a few feet from amy in her wedding dress and watching her mother tense and grit her teeth and brush off the questions. watching her look nervously at rory but never ask if he means it when his mom asks him if he'd prefer a son or a daughter, and rory answers 'either one, some day, not anytime soon.'

god i'm just going on and on, aren't i. but really, what's it like to know that amy never changed her mind. the next time she sees them, she's already been born and stolen. i don't like let's kill hitler for. so many reasons. but there is something compelling about how recklessly river lashes out at the world, at the doctor. even her sacrifice at the end is almost suicidal, throwing all her regenerations into this man without knowing if that will even work or if it might kill her to do it. but it makes more sense in the context of someone who has reached the end of a long, long wait for some kind of indication, any kind, that her mother wanted to have her. and finally been told, no. she didn't choose melody.

#like. to be clear also: i don't think the fact that amy didn't want kids and really didn't have a choice in giving birth to river #means that she wouldn't love river. i think it would make their relationship Complicated but i do think amy loves her. so much.#that's her daughter but it's also her best friend.#but like. god. to spend your whole childhood hoping you'll hear about some little glimmer of yourself.#a dream. a passing mention. a debate on baby names. anything. and to hear nothing.#and river is. like. she is really really bad at relationships right? we know this.#the person she's closest to is the doctor and she spends most of her life believing *he doesn't even love her*.#we're talking about someone whose base assumption about everyone is that they will try to hurt her at some point so she should always keep #one hand armed.#and her mother. didn't choose to have her. didn't have that choice. that has to fuck her up a little.#(and also serve as proof that river is. so so bad at knowing when she is loved. because maybe amy didn't choose to have her but she named #melody pond after mels her best friend. she has been choosing river every day for the past however many years since mels decided to come #here and be near her mom and dad even if only as kids. but river still can't see it.#and. given the nature of how the ponds disappear from her life. and we never get any closure about them and river.#you have to wonder if she ever did. river song do you know your mother loves you?#having the melody-as-river reveal be so close to the end of the season and then getting rid of amy & rory before they can actually do #anything with the three of them as a messed up little family unit is the show's biggest crime. because i don't know! i don't know if river #knew her parents loved her! i don't know if she *ever* came to terms with how she was born and how they didn't need to choose her then to #choose her now! i don't know if river ever really felt comfortable thinking of them as her parents rather than her friends?#according to the transcripts. river calls amy 'mother' twice. (and 'mummy' once jokingly.) she calls rory 'father' once. and 'dad' in angel #in manhattan. and it just. it drives insane right? it's almost weirdly formal. like the words aren't right but she knows she should say the #and. and. i don't think i'm ever going to get over river song.#i think that's the takeaway here.#ask #doctor who #river song #amy pond #rory williams

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rainparadefromhell · 2 years

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My thoughts on season 3 of Never Have I Ever

SPOILERS AHEAD !

* author's note : it's long what can you do, i have an obsessive personality

• Things I disliked in no particular order

1. The pacing of this season.

The pacing of this season

The pacing-

I don't know what happened this season but it felt like someone pushed my head into a blender. Many things were so glossed over, I was actually baffled. People kept getting into relationships and breaking up like it was nothing and all sense of direction was lost. Everything felt like a fever dream. Ben and Aneesa break up. She cries one time, kisses Fabiola and now they are in a relationship only for that to not work out and Fabiola gets into another relationship (at this point i forgot Eve existed). No one reacts to anything, things just happen so there is no chance for the viewers to get attached to any new storylines/couples. Just borderline bad writing in terms of pacing.

2. What they've done to Aneesa's character

At the end of the show, the person I felt bad for the most was Aneesa. The writers just would not give her a chance. She wasn't a real character. She barely had any personality beyond being a plot device for multiple characters and getting into meaningless relationships every 5 minutes (the show does have a problem with doing this to all characters tbh). I wanted to know Aneesa better (I hoped for a pov episode) but all I've got was her getting left for another person in not one but TWO relationships? And they made her kinda not even care about it. It just wasn't realistic and I hated it.

3. Des.

Listen, I don't have anything against his character. Because his character doesn't exist. Des got, as well as all the new characters - Aneesa'd. His sole purpose was to give Devi an Indian boyfriend (which is fine). But he was just so.....unnecessary?? I'm sorry but while watching every scene him and Devi shared, I was begging for literally any other character to show up. Same with his two friends (extras) that had about two lines each. His and Devi's relationship, in my opinion would've been just fine as a fling not a real relationship. And it lasted SO. FUCKING. LONG. Why, just why were they wasting time (that could have been given to flesh out old characters) on something everyone and their mother KNEW wouldn't work out or have any meaningful addition to the show. Other things got sidelined, that's why I hated this storyline.

4. And save the worst for last. All of Devi's romantic relationships in s3

Oh God, here we go.

I understand that Devi is a teen girl that just wants to date boys, have fun, be in love. I really do. But as writers, it is the nhie showrunners' job to make this enjoyable for the viewers. And it worked, the past 2 seasons it really did. Team Paxton, team Ben, team Devi.... We've all had something to enjoy. So throwing in another boy - no, two actually (the guitar player she kissed isn't a big part of the show so I don't really care) made me so angry. They've disturbed a sort of a balance between silly/fun the show had with like 3 or 4 love interests all in your face at the same time so they all started to look kinda.... unimportant (except for Ben, but I am biased lol). It looked painfully unrealistic as well.

The show yet again suffered because of its format. you simply can't throw in a bunch of characters in a 30 minute, 10 episode long comedy show and just hope for the best. It felt messy, rushed and fleeting. Like there was no room to breathe, I felt so anxious watching the middle part of the show.

• Things I did like in no particular order

1. The adults' storylines

I found them much more tolerable and cohesive. I am a Nalini stan first and a human second. I just love her. I love watching Poorna be so brilliant in this role. I was thrilled they gave her a friend and quite sad that friend was taken away later on but oh well. Also, possibly my favorite moment in the show was this quote from Nalini : "You are never too much and always enough." This show was the first time I've truly seen my relationship with my own mother represented in a way that isn't black or white and just simple or complicated. For me this scene meant a lot - showing that no matter what may happen, Nalini will always love and support her daughter.

I also liked Kamala's storyline. Tbh I didn't like Prashant all that much. He felt like a more mature Paxton. I'm glad Kamala didn't rush into marriage, especially if it's something she does not want. I really liked the relationship between Kamala and Mr. Kulkarni, I just wish we saw more of them.

2. Trent and Eleanor ??

I totally predicted this!! I said they will be that odd couple that somehow works very well and I was right. They were really entertaining and I'm so glad we get to see more of them.

3. Trent and Paxton ??

I adored Paxton and Trent's friendship. You can tell they love each other in their weird ways. This totally made me like the characters more and I love love LOVE seeing healthy male friendships in media.

4. Paxton

And everybody gasped. (Hell, I gasped, too). Here it comes Paxton/Daxton stans....

I did really like Paxton this season. And he had his moments last season as well, I'll admit that. Is he my favorite character in the show? No. Do I still think he's kinda boring and overrated? Yes. But I did like him. My favorite Paxton moment this season was in the hospital with Ben (as well as his friendship with Ben as a whole). Not only was it very kind of him to stay with Ben and make him feel better, I also loved him admiting he doesn't really know who he is. How incredibly honest of him. I liked that he apologized to all the girls he hurt and that he was friends with Haley again. I also loved him telling Devi she can't love anyone until she loves herself (someone's been reading my posts 👀). He finally started to care about things (school) and even if his storyline is a simple one, it worked. I'm glad he grew as a person. For me, Paxton finally became a full-fledged character with a unique storyline. It took only 3 seasons but we got there.

5. Benjamin Gross

I could write novels about Ben Gross. I could write about him until my hands hurt and then some more. He is easily one of my, if not my favorite fictional character of all time. He is one of the few characters that, in my opinion, isn't written in an episodic way. Jaren Lewison has this great ability to carry all of Ben's emotions in his pocket and whip out what he needs in a scene with such ease. The character doesn't forget his lessons, he remembers his past feelings and what they taught him which makes him develop and make progress so naturally within the show. Ben Gross isn't just a douche at the beginning of season 1 and a nice guy at the end of season 3. You can see all of his flaws as well as how caring and emotionally intelligent he is at the same time throughout the entire show. I'm so happy he learned to relax and not care as much about grades.

This kinda falls under Ben, but just 3x06 being the best episode (with the finale) for me. I don't know what kind of crack Mindy Kaling puts in the Ben episodes but she gets is right every damn time. Those 4 words being "I'm proud of you" from his dad made me so emotional. I wouldn't want them to be anything or for anyone else. Also I fucking loved Ben being into drawing?? We need more of that.

6. Devi Vishwakumar

My girl. I really liked Devi this season. I loved how they showed she's still grieving. Maitreyi's performance in the scene when Paxton tells her she doesn't love herself yet was so heartbreakingly beautiful. She knew he was right. Also can we talk about the best version of Devi aka post time jump Devi??? I love that girl! You can really tell she matured quite a bit. She's not as hot headed anymore. The only "bad" thing she did was throwing that book or whatever it was in the trash and honestly...? I didn't see how that was such a big deal at all. And the other team kinda cheated, too. Who cares? They're not in a courtroom. I really hope that in season 4 we see her growing even more.

7. The whole gang

One thing I also liked was that everyone was friends with everyone this season. We saw the Paxton-Trent-Eleanor group, Paxton and Ben's friendship, Paxton and Fabiola, Ben-Devi-Fabiola and so on.... I reallllly liked the different dynamics.

8. Ben & Devi

And finally - this is what (some of) you have been waiting for. As you can see the pacing and new characters really messed with how much I loved (or rather didn't) this season. But honestly, now that I had time to think about it, the character development and just the finale really saved the whole season for me. And yes, this includes Ben and Devi. This season we've seen Ben and Devi be mostly, friends. They didn't share many moments until the last few episodes which did frustrate me but that is exactly what made all of them feel so special later on. It was important for them to not spend as much time together then slowly be close friends for the finale we got. I really wasn't expecting it. For all my criticisms about the writing not being the best in some aspects of the show, the writers did such a good job with their storyline and it's safe to say that s3 is my favorite when it comes to them.

Last season we've only seen hints of them pining for each other. This season they were much more honest and comfortable with each other. I cannot stop thinking about how perfectly their little romance was sprinkled over the seasons, with season one's introduction and teasing of their feelings, season two's big conflict and hurt and finally season three's rekindling of feelings and big realizations. None of their storyline felt like sudden big explosions (like with Paxton), just a natural evolution of caring for each other. A sign that it wasn't just a crush (quick and overwhelming) but a first love kind of a situation. Realistic, messy, beautiful, simple. There isn't a doubt in my mind that these two will end up together in some way at the end of season 4. Truly one of my favorite on screen couples all thanks to the brilliant and talented Jaren and Maitreyi.

Overall, I still think the show's best season is season 1. It was almost perfectly set up. However, in terms of characters and our main couple, I have to say season 3 feels the most open, vulnerable and grown up. The last episode felt super special and teased season 4 in which we will see the gang prepare for college. I have huge expectations for season 4 and I really think it could be one of the best ones (best one?), but who knows...

Maybe I'm just a sucker for closures.

Also, I can't believe the finale??? Like they were evil evil for that one, not letting us see what happens! On the other hand I can't be mad bc as a writer that is such a me thing to do. Like, I can totally see myself be that much of an asshole and sadist so I kinda get it. Idk what I will do until s4.

#never have i ever season 3 #never have i ever #nhie #nhie spoilers #never have i ever netflix #devi vishwakumar #nalini vishwakumar #kamala nandiwadal #ben gross #fabiola torres #eleanor wong #paxton hall yoshida #trent harrison #aneesa qureshi #des nhie #benvi #can't believe i've been with this show for almost 3 years #i criticize it a lot but it really is very special to me and i do love it a lot #will be so sad when it's all over

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