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nansheonearth · 4 months

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Is lesbian separatism possible in 2023?

Posted by By Lesbian Herstory December 20, 2023No Comments

Q&A style posts on LesbianHerstory.com are an opportunity for readers to ask questions that serve as prompting topics for LH to write about. Questions can be advice-based, about our hot takes, asking whether we’ll cover a certain event or figure from history, or about lesbian news and media – you name it. Send your questions/prompts to [email protected] or DM them to the Lesbian Herstory Instagram.

Reader’s Question: How do you see lesbian separatism in the current age of hyper-individualism? Do you believe in it, what can it look like?

Separatism, at its core, is about independence. Cambridge Dictionary defines separatism as “the belief held by people of a particular race, religion, or other group within a country that they should be independent and have their own government or in some way live apart from other people.”

In 2023, when it’s cool to be fluid and non-specific, lesbian separatism can be as simple as defending the definition of lesbianism. The lesbian sexual orientation is an independent, defined class of female homosexuals who should not be appropriated. Only female homosexuals should govern lesbianism. But beware – saying that will get you classed as a gatekeeper.

Dictionary definitions describe differences. Difference is great. In a way, dictionaries practice separatism. Language separates things from one another by naming how they’re different: the very core of what makes things things is what makes them unique from other things. Lesbianism’s uniqueness, what makes a lesbian a lesbian, is being both a female and a homosexual. A lesbian is a female who is exclusively attracted to other females. We don’t abstain from any dormant attraction to males – it doesn’t exist.

Defining things accurately increases the distinctness of their outline. Like a muscle that’s been worked repeatedly, or a TV with all the technological bells and whistles to make the images crisp and clear, definition is about quality and clarity. Quality and clarity require separation, whether it be sifting flour before baking, or filtering water to make it drinkable. Separation is essential to navigating the world. Separation is a normal part of life.

Lesbians require separation to make sense of themselves.

We define what exists so we can communicate reality. Acknowledging that bisexuality, heterosexuality and homosexuality are separate sexual orientations with separate definitions does not create differences. It refers to differences that already exist. We didn’t separate ourselves, nature did. It’d be pretty boring if we were all the same.

You will hear people say the anti-separatist mantra “sexuality is fluid.” It is convenient for the powerful–those who gain power for being opposite-sex attracted–to leave homosexuals without distinction. Without distinction, without a unique language to pinpoint and explore that distinction, oppressed groups cannot articulate their treatment. Their treatment, ironically, is because they are different to what’s expected and everybody knows it. Even the anti-labellers.

Reproduction is still considered humanity’s main purpose. Forced reproduction is the root of both misogyny and homophobia. Patriarchal religion did a number on us. A homosexual body doesn’t want to fuck the opposite sex, no matter how many times we’ve wished it would… or even forced it to do the act without desire. We’re considered defective because of this lack of reproductive attraction.

A bisexual is redeemable to heteropatriarchy because they are attracted to the sex they can reproduce with. Hallelujah, at least you have ‘normal’, child-producing desire! Heteropatriarchy doesn’t mind same-sex attraction as much if you’re capable of attraction to the opposite sex: the sex you’re “supposed to be” attracted to.

The homosexual experience is different. The female homosexual experience threatens the foundation of heteropatriarchy. *Gasp* females can have sexual and romantic desires independent from the existence of males? Females can be born with the trajectory NOT to desire males at all? ONLY desiring other females? *Faint*

Oppressors deny the oppressed separation because they expect us to assimilate to the larger powerful body for a sense of belonging–which is very important to tribal creatures–or else we are considered a threat to be punished. We can pretend to be what’s demanded of us, even to ourselves. That is how some lesbians date and sleep with men, despite their true nature, before acknowledging their lack of attraction to them. But we cannot change our nature, even by force.

When it’s argued that sexual orientation isn’t innate, that it’s a spectrum–that we’re all bisexual with preferences–then homosexuals are denied themselves. It’s ironic, considering our difference–our attraction ONLY to the same sex–is the exact thing targeted by homophobes.

Politics is defined by the way different people interact. Our interactions are influenced by power, culture, history, context, authority, institutions and environment, among other things. Pretending we aren’t separated into classes, often hierarchised into powerful and disempowered people, keeps rulers dominating. It’s gaslighting.

Naming differences shouldn’t hierarchise them. That’s why it’s imperative we simultaneously remember we are, whether we like it or not, always part of the larger human body regardless of how remote we live with our own kind. We are different. But we are all humans. Separatism and integration can coexist.

Separatism can be as simple as advocating for lesbianism’s definition: female homosexuality. Unfortunately, people go as far as to accuse us of being exclusionary, as if we’re bullies for being female, being homosexual, and defending lesbianism as the word to describe female homosexuality. There is a huge difference between oppression and hurt feelings.

The decision of when to separate and when to integrate should be class-based and/or personal. But the lesbian’s choice is consistently made public. We’re guilted for not crossing our boundaries and integrating when it’s demanded of us. We’re guilted for wanting a room of our own.

The expectation that lesbians never separate, never outline the definition of our sexual orientation–and are punished if we do–is symptomatic of our oppression. Disempowered classes of people need space away from the powerful. Is it shocking that there is so much resistance to lesbian separatism when we’re both homosexual and female? I don’t see male-only gay clubs getting the same reaction.

What does lesbian separatism look like?

Most lesbians (86%; 1200 responders) on the Lesbian Herstory Instagram believe that lesbian separatism should look like a series of approaches and levels of commitment, rather than an ultimate destination (such as a remote lesbian commune).

Some approaches to lesbian separatism that people mentioned:

Creating, supporting, defending and engaging with lesbian-only spaces

Questioning society and how suitable it is for us, not the other way around

Building and prioritising lesbian community and connections

Being respected and accepted as a separate, unchangeable sexual orientation

Living with only lesbians

Learning about and supporting the most disempowered lesbians

Deliberately choosing lesbians over and over again

Lesbians making, enjoying and celebrating our own culture

Consuming lesbian media, especially made by lesbians

Learning our history and passing it down

Standing up to lesbophobes, including female homophobes

Buying from and supporting lesbian business owners

Uplifting, investing in and donating to lesbian charities, organisations, websites and initiatives

Just over half (56%) thought lesbian separatism was necessary, the same percentage thought it was possible.

One person critiqued lesbian separatism as “not caring about the rest of the community by caring about self-identity and safe places.” Lesbians do not self-identify as lesbians, however, we’re female homosexuals whether we identify as one or not. We are oppressed by the rest of the community, meaning our seeking safety and encouraging resistance is not the root of the issue but a reaction to it.

Another said that lesbian separatism is about “removing men (and their culture) from your life, centring your life around women.” The glaring problem with this take is that it equates lesbianism with feminism. As if lesbianism is the feminist choice to centre women: the very concept of “political lesbianism.” Unfortunately, political lesbianism has strong ties to feminist land separatism and its history. When I say “lesbian,” I mean female homosexual. When I say lesbian separatism, I mean female homosexual separatism.

I believe in lesbian separatism as an adjective to describe a range of choices more than an absolute noun. We don’t have the power to slice ourselves off from the body of humanity, becoming a fully separate chunk of flesh living untethered to our natural core. But we do have the power to advocate that our natural differences are not problematic. To be respected and kept safe from hate-motived violence. In a world that erases lesbianism, any meaningful lesbian-centred action is separatist.

We ostracise lesbians from living a more lesbian-centred life by suggesting integration and separatism are mutually exclusive. Suggesting they are an either/or proposition creates two camps of lesbians: lesbians crossing their boundaries to integrate into harmful homophobic monoliths for a sense of belonging, versus pariah lesbians who are outcasted by the aforementioned homophobic monolith for defining themselves separately.

Many lesbians “queer” themselves, desperately avoiding the same fate of the pariah lesbians who acknowledge lesbians are a distinct class of female homosexuals. Everyday kinds of separatism, like refusing to call yourself “queer” and opting for specifics, requires confidence. Confidence is stolen from lesbians. Instead, our female-socialised accomodating nature is preyed upon so we feel too guilty to build a community of our own. Lesbian separatism is not only possible but absolutely necessary.

We keep these articles free so they’re accessible to all lesbians. But we don’t have much money ourselves, which is why we don’t post much. Support Lesbian Herstory by buying merch or donating

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virgo-dream · 11 months

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One of Their Own 🏳️‍🌈✨

dreamling / queer joy / fluff / first kiss / 3,6k words

summary: Hob Gadling invites Dream to a meeting of the uni's queer clubs at the New Inn. Dream learns more about his own gender identity, and that he's very much in love with his best friend.

author’s note: this fic, this pairing and this fandom all mean the world to me, so I thought it was fitting to bring it back for pride month!

I’m incredibly thankful for finding Sandman when I did. Since joining this fandom, I’ve made wonderful friends and became part of a community of bright, kind, loving and loyal queer people that I would not trade for anything. I’ve learned more about my community and about myself, and I wave my ace/agender flag proudly now. This fic was written in a moment in my life where I felt hopeless and alone. Now, things couldn’t be more different. Happy pride sandfam! 🏳️‍🌈✨

read here or on ao3

Dream doesn’t get it at first. He never really did get it, but only attributed it to the need humanity had for labels, for packing things into boxes and saying this goes here and that goes there. Sometimes, it leads to this goes to heaven and you go to hell. It seemed to be a very common one, too. He was beyond that; his name said it all, Dream was endless. Not he nor she, not man nor creature, he was all there was to be and the nothingness beyond it. Gender and sexuality need not apply.

Still, it meant so much to Hob, that he’d have dreams about it. Nightmares too, for nights on end, and even if Dream begged Hob to allow him to take them away, Hob always declined, always braving through them. “If you take them, I’ll forget how much it all means. I’ll forget why I’m still fighting.”

They sat at the New Inn one afternoon, while Hob graded papers and Dream had a cup of chamomile tea, but his eyes couldn’t help but focus on a shiny pin on Hob’s jumper shaped like a flag, the shades of pink, purple and blue a spot of proud colour in Hob’s otherwise earthy colour palette.

“It’s the bisexual pride flag.”

“Hm?” Dream’s eyes darted up to meet Hob’s, tilting his head slightly. He wasn’t sure if he should feel bad for being caught, because he wasn’t sure what he was looking at in the first place.

“The pin. I wear it for my students, but also for myself. The kids feel safer I guess, knowing they have at least one of their own in the faculty. Can’t say it doesn’t make me feel good too.”

Hob has a particular tone to his voice that makes Dream’s heart sing in tune to its melody. It’s a fuller sense of self, maybe more than Dream ever had in regards to his own identity. “…one of their own?”

“Oh, I– Sorry, those are pretty recent.” Hob straightened himself up (ha) on the chair, his lecturing posture taking over. Dream liked when he did that. He liked to hear Hob speak of things he had deep knowledge of and passion for. “This one was created in 1988 by a queer activist called Michael Page. Had the pleasure of being there when it was first unveiled, but clearly it took a long time until I was able to wear something like this out in public and not be decked by some bloody homophobe.”

It was starting to sink in.

“…I’m afraid I was not present for these developments.” Dream saw the look on Hob’s face, like he was ready to apologise. He raised a hand to stop him, waving his concern away. “As far as I can remember, queer was not a form of self identification, but only a way to shun out those outside the established norm.”

“Ah, yes. We reclaimed it, though. Or are reclaiming it. The 80s were crazy. All of them were, for me.” Hob smiled at Dream, at their shared secret and at their years of now reestablished friendship.

“I think you’re lonely.”

Could it have been….? Could he have meant…?

“What does it mean for you, then?” Dream asks in a way he hopes sounds inconspicuous, pointing at the pin. He was hesitant to ask, afraid to be getting it all wrong.

“For me? It means I love whoever I love. Man, woman, either or neither.”

The pride coming from Hob’s words filled Dream with hope, something he had not felt in a long, long time. The look in his face then shifted onto something else, something he didn’t quite understand. “…what about you? That is, if you’re okay with talking about that. I don’t want to overstep. Last thing I want is for you to walk out–”

“I won’t, Hob.” Dream knew Hob had reason for feeling that way. “I don’t believe the terminology you have could define my experience. I have laid with mortals and gods alike, and have worn many faces and names. It is beyond human comprehension.”

Hob seems to take a moment to think about what he’d just heard. Dream feels like he might have thrown too much at his human friend. “…I think I get it. But, and tell me to bugger off I’m wrong, do you prefer to be a particular way? To be with a particular sort of being?”

Dream. Didn’t have an answer.

He never thought of what he preferred. He’d never felt in need of any sort of outside validation, but. That was a lie. He needed it. He just never cared to look for it.

Hob’s smile was what broke him out of the spell of his own self doubt. “It’s okay if you don’t have an answer. It takes people a long time to get it, it took me nearly 600 years! Ah! You know what? I’ve got an idea–” He reached inside his brown messenger bag, pulling out a colourful piece of paper, handing it over to Dream. A pamphlet for a meeting. “We’re having a meeting for the uni’s LGBT clubs here at the Inn. I want this to be a safe space for the kids, and to get them to connect with other folks in the community, share their experiences. It’s tomorrow, and I’d love it if you could make it. I’m sure they would too.”

Dream took the pamphlet in hands, looking at the bright colours and bold fonts, taking in every bit of information Hob was giving him and trying to fill in the gaps of the questions he wouldn’t dare ask. After a moment, he looked up at Hob, allowing himself a small smile. “I shall be in attendance, then.”

—————

Dream stood outside the New Inn, hands tucked safely inside the pockets of his coat jacket. He watched as groups of young adults arrived, greeting each other cheerfully. The hair colours and outfits reminded him of his sister, Delirium, but they all seemed to be more in line with her previous self; delighted to be there, happy to meet their friends. A flag danced in the light summer breeze on a pole next to the window, the stripes of colours brightening up the already lively scene. A rainbow, Hob had told him the day before, was the most recognizable symbol of the queer community. It now was accompanied by stripes of light pink and blue, white, black and brown. Dream enjoyed good symbolism, and he could feel the meaning of those colours to all who were present from their daydreams alone.

He, however, still felt like an outsider. Like he wasn't really meant to be there, save for Hob's generous invite. Dream was not defined by the same standards humanity aligned itself with; in fact, he wasn't defined by anything at all. He was not an individual, but the safe arms in which those dreamers rested every night, the common thread in their hopes, in their restful slumber. It would be silly to think that he'd need to identify as one thing or another, really. He was there for Hob . Because Hob invited him. Because he wanted to know more about the everyday life of his dearest friend. Because he wanted to hear him talk, see him inspire others with his tales, wanted to hear the sound of his voice, the gentle way in which he made people feel welcome, cared for, loved, he wanted–

Dream thought it best to wait it out, at least until most people had already arrived, until he had an idea of just how many young, hopeful minds would be in the vicinity. After escaping the Burgess Manor, Dream was faced with a considerable raise in the amount of dreamers under his care. He would not admit it to anyone but himself, but at times, it became too much even for him to bear. The idea of willingly walking into a space with so many people was daunting, to say the least. So he waited, watched as the New Inn became packed with dreamers, feeling his palms dampen inside the pockets of his coat.

Taking the first step towards the door was difficult. Pushing it open was even harder. Dream stepped in, careful not to bump into anyone or to even get too close. The sound of the little bell that was supposed to announce his arrival had no effect, as it was overtaken by the sound of chatter inside the Inn. It was better that way, Dream thought. Not having Hob rush to greet him. That way he could take a moment to adjust to his surroundings, maybe even blend in, become invisible. In hindsight, his usual choice of attire did anything but blend in there. He was a dark little cloud in a sky full of bright colours, like a multi-coloured sunset on a tropical beach. And of course, every sunset had its monarch, shining brightly, commanding the attention. That, of course, was Hob.

"Hello there, kids! Glad to see most of you could make it!" The cheerful, gentle register of Hob's voice filled the room, filtered by the small but potent speaker he'd rented just for the occasion. Dream could hear his voice clearly, and it helped him tune out everything else that wasn't his beloved friend. "This is the first of hopefully many meetings of our beloved Queer Clubs here at my beloved New Inn. I want you all to know this is a safe space for you all no matter what part of the gender and sexuality spectrums you fall on. The only things I won't accept here are discrimination of any kind, and anyone that thinks Lawrence Cheney shouldn't have won season 2 of Drag Race UK. Are we clear on that one?"

Laughter filled the room, and Dream couldn't help but allow his lips a small smile. Hob truly was a marvel. How anyone could shine so brightly was beyond even the dream lord's knowledge, but he was glad to be able to bask in that glow from time to time. He wished he could do it more often.

Hob was saying other things, Dream thought. Instructions on seating arrangements, subjects to be discussed, discounts on food and drinks. All Dream could do was watch as Hob did more than just make everyone feel welcome, but inspired them with hope and joy, a gentle breeze of acceptance, the embrace of a parent, the empathy of an equal. There was much to work with here, much to inspire new dreams. Dreams of comfort and love, of community and pride.

"Dream? You in there, love?"

Hob's voice broke the spell he himself had cast over Dream, who could now see his friend's palm waving in front of his eyes. He'd become lost in thought, it seemed. Dream's nose scrunched up at the interruption, looking at Hob with his usual look of curiosity. There was still much he needed to catch up on when it came to non verbal communication. "Aye. I'm here. Have I not fully manifested my presence?"

Hob chuckled, and his eyes wrinkled at the corners. "Oh, yes. Physically, at least." Dream's brows furrowed in worry, and he was glad Hob was quick enough to notice when something had gone over his head. "Just a joke– hey, I'm glad you could make it. The kids will love meeting you."

"Meeting me? There are far too many people here for you to make introductions. Besides, I know them all, and they all know me. They just do not remember it during waking hours."

This felt like a plausible enough explanation to keep Hob from actually introducing him to everyone in attendance. But Hob was far too optimistic to be dissuaded so easily. "I'm not talking about introducing them to Morpheus. I'd like them to meet my friend, Dream."

"I do not see the difference." He shouldn't say why he couldn't bear the idea of being introduced to so many people. Shouldn't burden Hob with his problems, that wouldn't exist had he just not been captured in the first place. Dream had been good at hiding his discomfort so far, and he'd continue to do so.

…well, maybe he was not so good at it. Not when Hob's eyes so clearly conveyed the worry that had just settled in his heart. It was difficult to deny Hob the truth when his warm, calloused hands took Dream's into his own so carefully, squeezing gently, as if saying you can trust me. I've got you. "It's okay if you'd rather not. I know it can be overwhelming sometimes."

"...thank you." Dream replied with a murmur. Hob gifted him with a smile. It seemed a lot could be said with just the eyes.

————

Even if Dream didn't intend on actually joining in on the conversations being held, he was glad to follow Hob along and listen to the discussions. It was amazing seeing just how bright the kids really were: they spoke of justice and equality, of inclusivity, of respect and love, of family and religion and sex and responsibility. It was a wider range of topics than he'd expected, an awareness of self he didn't think humans would ever possess, and now, he was glad to be proven wrong. He listened to their shared experiences, to the kindness in their eyes as they lifted each other up, the melody of their laughter and the bravery in their voices as they spoke of injustices they'd lived. It was fascinating, really.

What Dream was truly surprised to find was that people had, after all, an understanding of self that went beyond just physical. Hob brought him closer to a group of kids who were in a long discussion on gender identity. Some of them felt comfortable with the gender they'd been "assigned with at birth", others did not feel any affinity for it. Some of them had changed their bodies to fit with how they felt on the inside, and Dream couldn't help but feel enormous empathy for them, for the way they had to fight to exist in a body that didn't feel like a trap. It was something Dream always took for granted, until he himself felt the horror of having no agency over himself. The pain they went through to guarantee they'd have the right to live authentically. Dream's body had never been limited to an exclusive physical manifestation; he was as he felt like. Fluid , as one of the bright colour haired people had pointed out while explaining their own experience. They reminded Dream of his own sibling, Desire. Someone else brought up how they didn't particularly feel like they had a gender, and that the language surrounding it didn't particularly bother them. Agender, the girl said proudly. Dream wondered if there was any right or wrong way to declare oneself fluid or agender. Then he realised the tightness in his chest when the thought occurred to him.

"Are you alright?" Once again, Hob's voice brought him back to the Waking. Dream could now feel Hob's hand on his own again, but he wasn't sure what exactly had warranted it.

"Your hands were shaking."

Once again, Dream's physical form betrayed him. It was also clear how the conversation surrounding them had gone quiet, and more eyes than he would have liked had landed on their linked hands. He didn't like being watched. Like that.

"Oh, Mr. G, is this your boyfriend?" one of them asked, teasingly. "Would have never guessed you had a thing for goths!"

"Marissa, stop!" someone else said, poking the girl on the shoulder apprehensively. The next thing they said was soft as a whisper. "They are clearly not feeling well."

They.

Dream had never considered himself as they. But this person, whoever they were, preferred "not to assume" his gender. And the empathy displayed for his discomfort was something he wasn't expecting either. Hob seemed to be about to say something, but Dream was quicker.

"There is no need to worry for my well-being, but I thank you for your kindness." Dream allowed himself to smile once again. These children were going places, he knew it. "You may address me as he , if necessary. I would not oppose her or them either." It felt liberating to say it, and Dream didn't really know why. He did know, however, that he suddenly felt brave. "I am not Professor Gadlen's boyfriend , but I am honoured to call him my dearest, most cherished friend."

Dream looked at Hob, who seemed to be awestruck by his words. It was amusing to see him like that, and it lit something else inside him. This meeting was making Dream experience a range of feelings he'd forgotten about. He showed Hob a smile, and Hob smiled back at him, warm and gentle as ever. Their hands were still linked together. Dream had no intention of letting go. "Ah, yes. This little prick here is indeed my dearest, oldest friend. I did want them to meet you guys. I'm glad I was right about it."

When Hob said it, it made Dream's heart sing.

"...so you're fuckbuddies?"

" Marissa! "

————

After a few hours and many, many rounds of different conversations, Hob gathered the group once again, thanking them for coming and congratulating everyone on the success of their first meeting. Dream couldn't help but notice how Hob seemed unable to stop smiling. He could feel the pride and relief radiating off of his tanned skin and kind eyes. Dream wished he could have it all directed at himself, that gentleness.

Hob's boyfriend. Now that would be something.

Dream sat on the booth table behind the bar where he and Hob usually held their meetings and waited for everyone to leave. He wanted some time alone with Hob, even if just to hear what his beloved friend had to say about what he thought of the meeting, just to hear Hob's voice, the only music suited for Dream's ears.

He also had so many new feelings inside himself to explore. Those he could tend to later.

"Hey there, handsome stranger." Hob said as he sat across from Dream on the table, taking Dream's hand in his as if it was just the way they always did things. Maybe it could be. It wouldn't hurt (too much) to hope, would it? "Come here often?"

"Only when I'm in search of an epiphany." Dream couldn't bother to hide the fondness in his own voice, nor the relief he felt to have Hob's hand cradling his own again. "I am impressed, Professor Gadlen. You have gathered a group of exceptionally bright minds. It gives me hope for a better future for humanity."

"Wow Dream, that is… that is really high praise, especially coming from you." Hob seemed flushed, and Dream wondered what else he could do to cause that reaction, to see Hob shy and pretty like that again and again. "I learned a long time ago that I have to build the future I want to live in. But in all honesty… I'm more interested in the present right now."

"Oh, is that so?" Hob's optimism was infectious, it seemed. Dream too could only focus on the present moment. "I am glad to be able to share it with you."

There was a short silence shared between them after that. It was as if neither of them were ready to say whatever it was they clearly needed. Dream tried to take comfort in the feeling of Hob's hand in his, rubbing the back of Hob's hand with his thumb.

His mistake was looking up to meet Hob's eyes.

"There is much I have learned today." Dream decided he'd be the one to break the silence. He'd be the one to take the leap, because he knew Hob had made sure he'd make a safe landing. He knew that no matter what happened, no matter how much he could get hurt, he was safe. He could trust Hob with his heart, even if there was a chance that he would break it. "I often make the mistake of thinking there is nothing more to my existence than what I have already discovered. I contain all conscious minds throughout the universe, their lives, hopes and dreams. Yet, I forget that the tales of others cannot substitute one's own experience, only enlighten it."

Hob listened to Dream's words attentively. He looked anxious, but would not interrupt. Dream knew he wouldn't. He knew how much Hob cherished the moments where Dream felt ready to share something new. "Today, you have once more shown me there is much I have to learn. For that, I am grateful, Hob Gadling.”

How could Dream not fall in love with someone that treated him like he was the moon? How could the moon not love the sun?

"I'm grateful for you too, you know. The kids loved you. I'm sure I'll be getting asked about you for the rest of the semester. Maybe even longer." Hob's eyes were so fond it made Dream want to cry.

"And how would you like to answer their inquiries?"

"What do you mean?"

"Would you like to tell them of your dearest, oldest friend…" Dream leaned in, bringing Hob's hand to his own cheek. He pressed a soft kiss to Hob's palm, and watched as Hob's eyes followed his every move. There was no turning back from this. "...or would you prefer to tell them about your lover, Hob?"

For a moment, time stopped. Their eyes met, and before Dream could get anxious or regret his words, Hob was already standing and leaning over the table, locking their lips together.

Dream thought he'd heard the sound of people cheering outside one of the windows of the New Inn. Hob would certainly be getting many questions from his students come next monday.

#virgo dream writes #dreamling #the sandman #dream of the endless #morpheus #hob gadling #dream x Hob #Morpheus x Hob #pride fic #dreamling fic #the sandman fic #remember when I used to write?

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hadesoftheladies · 2 months

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One of the biggest reasons that I know majority of current transgender ideology is faux-oppression is because of how copy-paste it’s analysis is, which makes its lack of serious academic thought that much more obvious. it’s activists use buzz words from other activist movements like the black liberation movement and feminism (“black trans lives matter”/“cis women can’t identify as transwomen”), co-opt terms from other oppressed groups like the intersex community (AFAB/AMAB), and when it comes to creating their own language, the words are utter nonsense, like “transmisogyny”, which is a nonsense word that pairs two charged words together without considering the internal meaning of either.

what oppression do trans-people face for being transgender? being trafficked (that’s usually black, homosexual people in poorer areas), refusal of hormones or surgery (which are damaging to your body), perception of transness (usually homophobic or misogynistic hatred), being killed (black people again), being the wrong gender (gender is made up you can act and wear whatever you like, and if it is harming you, is it not more helpful to reject gender than redeem it?) And yea, there can be issues of intersection, but what about transness is specifically targeted or resisted on a structural level? The analysis has to keep borrowing from other struggles (being a woman, homo/bisexual gnc person in a patriarchal misogynistic world, being black, the taboo of being intersex) and then labeling those issues as “trans” or “gender” issues. Dysphoria is disorder brought on by existing in a sick social environment, much like dysmorphia and depression can be (because gender isn’t innate). It isn’t about “female” or “male” brains. These are very real issues that women, gnc LGB and intersex people have gone through. Is it a coincidence that these demographics are where dysphoria most thrives? but they’ll never analyze that. gender has to be innate. they won’t analyze how consumeristic trans culture is. they’ll cry about how awful the trans genocide is, but the black trans-identified people dying in brothels won’t push most of them to criticize porn culture or criticize the pro-porn trans icons in their group. interesting.

which is further evident in the huge absence of internal diversity of thought. the rise of micro identities and the way a lot of “queer” activists speak (the endless virtue signaling and verbal diarrhea) shows that this is an “oppression product.” they popularized oppression olympics. having a micro identity is a fad. who is being denied a job for identifying as greysexual? mom and dad I’m so sorry I’m sapiosexual please don’t kick me out.

most prominent trans icons are from the rich white upper class. and also mostly male. they are product influencers, convincing women and children to please buy thing so they can finally be satisfied. isn’t being part of a niche underground “oppressed” group cool? when your oppressed people listen to you, and doesn’t that just feel so good? it’s so white. it’s so capitalist America. it’s so MRA in how it trivializes historic, academic and global human rights movements. like listening to a porn-addicted man ramble on about how feminism is actually just about hating men, and anti-racism is about hating white people.

devoid of any true social analysis, because then we’d actually have to talk about the underlying rot which real activist groups are being killed and censored and disrupted to stop addressing.

#oppression olympics #feminism #radblr #trans #discourse #gender #politics #racism

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rotationalsymmetry · 5 months

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Ok, but also: there aren't bi spaces.

I mean, there are now, online, you can follow exclusively battleax bi tumblr blogs if you really want to for some reason or hang out in a bisexual Facebook group that spends most of its time yelling at people for not talking about non-binary people the right way or go to r/bisexuality and post about lemon bars and movies that have hot actors and actresses.

But in person?

Just over ten years ago, in San Francisco (the city whose flag might as well be the rainbow one) I ended a five year relationship and decided that I needed to figure a few things out about myself, and that one of those things had to do with being bi, so I looked over the LGBT Community Center's calendar and found one bisexual event, a monthly support group. When I went to the support group (a few times, until I stopped going when I decided it wasn't really what I wanted or needed and they didn't even have tea) I found out about a casual social group of bisexuals who met for I don't remember, brunch or dinner or something at a particular time, and went, but that was under six people typically and they were significantly older than I was and somehow significantly even less cool, and I stopped going. That, and a bisexual contingent at the Pride march, are the only in person bisexual events I've ever been to. Or heard of.

(The kink community has "pansexual" play parties. But, that doesn't mean play parties for pansexuals, it means play parties that are open to people of all sexual orientations. In contrast to the queer men's and once in a blue moon queer women's/eh people in that ballpark parties. The vast majority of the play at these events is between men and women, although that doesn't necessarily mean the people playing are straight and quite a lot of them aren't.) (just for clarification; I have never heard of any events or spaces specifically designated for pansexual people. Granted I haven't looked recently? But I'd be surprised, bisexual is still by far the more popular/common label.)

While there can be a lot of informal social groups that have a high percentage of bi people in them, there just isn't a bi culture that wasn't just made up by someone on the internet in the past ten years.

And god if you've had different experiences please argue with me, I would genuinely like to hear about it. But yeah, that's my experience. That spaces that might create some sort of bi culture, that offline bi spaces, are rare and spread out enough to essentially not exist. Not in the way that "lesbian culture" (the bars the bookstores the dating scenes the robust social groups the printing presses the significant chunk of "gay and lesbian" spaces) (in quotes because "lesbian spaces" never have and never will exclusively contain women who like women and don't like men) exists. Bisexual women get straight land and lesbian land. We're binational. We don't have our own land.

#bi discourse #bi bitterness #this is in response to someone talking about lesbian culture and bi culture having overlap #like I hear you but also what bi culture? what bi culture?#there is. no. bi. culture.

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spongebobafettywap · 2 days

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From my experience with the fandom, most of the folks I've seen who don't like the mutant group idea introduced in the 2000s (a majority) was because of the weird names given to them and because "creating distinctions between those mutant groups and other mutants is just gonna inject discrimination amongst mutants who are already a discriminated group in Marvel so what ? there's gonna be discrimination amongst THE discriminated fictional group ? doesn't make sense"

When I heard this the first time, I came to the conclusion that those who said and truly believed this are both oblivious to the world AND to the X-Men lore

Discrimination is possible within real minority groups : If we have to use X-Men as a race allegory, there are people who'd turn their backs on long time friends or their own family members if they chose to have an interracial relationship (how many mutant villains look down on humans and any relationship with them that goes beyond stick necessity or play things ? A LOT). If we have to use X-Men as a disability allegory, there have been documented cases of deaf people completely turning their backs on other deaf people who chose to get cochlear implants or other hearing aids (sounds a lot like the Cure storyline doesn't it?). If we have to use X-Men as an LGBTQ+ allegory, the amount of erasure bisexual and asexual folks get from the entire community is a sight to behold (human looking mutants vs very mutated ones, mutants with a passive barely noticeable mutant ability Vs those with a very powerful one, ...).

We've already seen mutants getting discriminated against by other mutants before the 2000s : Telepaths aren't trusted in general because "they will invade your privacy and read your mind whenever it pleases them", Kitty Pryde was uncomfortable around Kurt Wagner just because of his appearance and didn't get close to him until way later into knowing him, the Morlocks went after the mutants from above and many normal looking mutants look down on the Morlocks, Fabian Cortez doesn't value mutants with physical mutations, Apocalypse kills those he consider weak and useless due to their mutations, ...

And even after the 2000s, we had other things that would count as discrimination with Toad getting a low paying job as school janitor even tho he is scientifically gifted enough to teach there, mutant students getting bullied by other mutant students, the entire omega level label that makes some mutants feel like everyone should owe them something or they should look down on others weaker than them, ...

"Mutants discriminating against other mutants because of labels or powerset" is not a new idea, it's always been there because mutants are just like people : They don't inherently like other mutants just because they're also mutants or agree with each other on everything

There's a reason why the greatest and trickiest villains of the X-Men franchise are not the humans but the mutants who use their powers for evil, personal gain and conquest and are ready to throw their own kind under the bus to reach said goals.

Exactly anon you really countered that line of ignorance well. Its so obvious at times X-men readers and writers are really sheltered people. I'm assuming most of the ones that have takes like this are cishet white people or just really ignorant about how discriminiation works.

#Maz answers #X-Men

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slut-for-sarah · 1 year

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So you think that “Bi lesbian” , “Pan lesbian” and “Demi lesbian” are valid labels? (Hint: they are not. The clue is in the part where a non-lesbian label is tacked onto the word lesbian.)

Asking so I know whether to block you or not. Because your whole “language and labels are fluid” does not apply to the lesbian label. The lesbian label has a very long and rich history, of which actual lesbians fought for and carved out so that current day lesbians could exist openly.

As a lesbian elder, I am telling you that the lesbian label is not fluid. Your personal sexuality may be fluid, but that does not mean that everyone else’s is. If your sexuality is fluid then the lesbian label is not for you. Lesbian has a very specific meaning, for a reason, and is something that is incredibly important to be respected and accepted.

I have been ignoring the majority of the hateful anons, but this one at least presents an opinion to discuss that isn’t unfiltered rage, so here it goes:

I made it incredibly clear that my opinions on bisexual lesbians are utterly insignificant. The reason I sent that ask was to confront the fact that aggressive anons are being directed to writers’ pages like a pitchfork-wielding mob, and for what? Does the identity really upset you so much that you feel the need to attack other queer people, and solely behind this cowardly shield of anonymity? Are there not much bigger issues for us to face as a community than one queer faction borrowing the label of another?

The irony of saying that the lesbian label has a rich, cultural history to combat the idea of it changing, when its history is that it has changed meanings and shifted as all words do is just mind-boggling. The etymology of the word comes from Sappho, a woman who had sexual attraction to men and women, and developed in myriad ways from then onwards. Language does change, even when you try to gatekeep it (just ask the habitants of Lesbos, who have always strongly petitioned against the word’s usage).

My sexuality isn’t fluid, as it happens. I identify as a lesbian in your desired version of the word, but simply have a fluid enough mindset to acknowledge that there are parts of other people’s identities which I do not understand. If somebody feels that it gives them a more specific identity, fine. If somebody feels that the word lesbian has traditionally excluded non-binary people and they no longer feel comfortable with it, fine. If somebody has a connection with the word lesbian for its connotations on gender, culture and politics but not entirely its sexuality, fine. We don’t need to fit into the neat boxes we’ve created and I don’t need total ownership of a word.

As a ‘lesbian elder’, I would have thought you valued your queer siblings far more than engaging in this mob mentality, and would have expected more open discourse than the unwavering condemnation that has been taking place. I’m afraid your age carries very little weight when you won’t even approach me off anon.

#protecting language over people is just a really foreign concept to me #and if you felt that strongly about it then BLOCK THEM #don’t send queer people endless hate in the interests of protecting queer people #???#like this is the nicest of the anons I’ve received #protecting lesbians by sending angry anons to a lesbian that disagrees with you? okay #bisexual lesbians #you do you honestly

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a-frog-in-a-bog · 2 years

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you dont actually hate pan people right. right?

This ended up being longer than I expected but I didn’t want to have to clarify a bunch of stuff later in the replies. The only thing pansexuals have done is spread biphobic and transphobic misinformation. Bisexuals have been saying forever that we’re attracted to all genders (bi= attraction to 2 groups of people: those with the same gender as my own and those with a different gender than my own), but some people who couldn’t be bothered to learn a single thing about LGBT history decided “well bi means 2 so that means that bisexuals are only attracted to cis men and women, so we’re gonna create a more inclusive label.” Unfortunately, it took off. And I’m not just making shit up. this is the first modern definition of pansexuality, and two examples of what kind of comments were under the post:

Notice how they classify trans people as separate from men and women. For the majority of its lifespan, every single definition of pansexuality revolved around a biphobic stereotype. pansexuality exists only to paint itself as a more progressive and inclusive version of bisexuality. And yes, the mere existence of pansexuality spreads harmful stereotypes, bc when you recognize “attraction to all genders (even trans people)” as different from bisexuality, it enforces the untrue stereotypes that 1) bisexuals can’t be attracted to all genders, 2) bisexuals have to have a gender preference, 3) only people of a certain sexuality are attracted to trans people. so I won’t be listening to anyone who says “let people ID how they want, it’s not hurting anyone, everyone is valid!” A personal anecdote: I’ve noticed that the “attracted to two or more genders” definition of bisexuality only started being used as pansexuality became more popular. Meaning… we didn’t pick that definition ourselves. At the very least, it wasn’t a popular definition.

Every pan person I’ve known irl has had a biphobic reason for choosing pan over bi. “I love all genders, not just two!” “Bisexuality enforces the gender binary.” “I don’t have a gender preference!” “All the slutty girls in high school were bi, and I didn’t want people to think I was like that, so I picked pan.” and my personal favorite: “I’m pansexual bc I’m attracted to women and trans women!” But if that’s not enough to convince you, here’s some numbers:

Not to mention the creator of the pan flag used the bi flag as a template but couldn’t even be bothered to learn the meaning behind each stripe. Here’s the meaning of the bi flag:

And the pan flag:

Yeah. Literally blue for boys, pink for girls, and yellow for trans and non-binary people. The only reason pansexuals modified their definition and color meanings was bc they were getting a lot of (justified) criticism from the bi and trans communities, but that doesn’t mean pan people themselves changed their way of thinking. So many trans people have talked about the fetishization they deal with from the pan community.

All that being said, I do recognize that a lot of pan people are just misinformed bisexuals with internalized biphobia. So no, I don’t hate them. But the people who knowingly throw the rest of us under the bus and pick a holier-than-thou label to distance themselves from biphobia instead of standing with their community? Yeah, I hate them.

Btw, everything I’ve said also applies to all the other bullshit mspec labels like omnisexual/polyselxual etc. I only focused on pansexuality bc that’s what the question was about. there’s no one way to be bisexual, and saying shit like “I’m attracted to women and non-binary people” is stupid bc non-binary isn’t a third gender, it’s a wide spectrum that includes transmascs, he/they AMABs, intersex people, and genderfluid people who are men some days and not others.

#pansexuals you can only comment on this post if you’re apologizing #bisexual #bisexuality #pansexual #pansexuality #mspec identities

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watermelon-converse · 1 year

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I posted 5,224 times in 2022

That's 5,224 more posts than 2021!

682 posts created (13%)

4,542 posts reblogged (87%)

Blogs I reblogged the most:

@gayfrogcoven

@imjustvibingyaknow

@daughter-of-night

@rosytickles

@spike-the-goblin

I tagged 2,533 of my posts in 2022

#the owl house - 419 posts

#fave - 376 posts

#toh - 368 posts

#toh spoilers - 210 posts

#amphibia - 153 posts

#the owl house spoilers - 151 posts

#tangled the series - 148 posts

#koolio mc swaggers - 115 posts

#tts - 113 posts

#save - 95 posts

My Top Posts in 2022:

Pride Ask Game

its time to introduce ourselves! Put in your name, pronouns, and labels, and tag at least three people you want to know better! 🌈

name: melon

pronouns: she/they/he

gender labels: genderfluid; bigender, transmasc, queer

attraction labels: bisexual, omni, sapphic, queer

relationship labels: ambiarmorous (you dont have to follow the same method of listing that i did btw)

tagging: @gayfrogcoven @queercoded-disney-villain @daughter-of-night @insaneillusionist @pieces0fconsciousness

1,106 notes - Posted June 6, 2022

yeah. you cant escape him

2,078 notes - Posted June 16, 2022

“Join tumblr you’ll never be bored again” yeah well you lied. My mutuals haven’t posted in three minutes smh

2,801 notes - Posted April 12, 2022

Dana Terrace.

Dana Terrace, who works so hard to make sure the LGBTQ+ community feels seen.

Dana Terrace, who fought, so long and hard, for what little she got to do with her show.

Dana Terrace, who tried to keep good faith even when it was hard as hell.

Dana Terrace, who had all of her plans sidetracked just when they were coming true.

Dana Terrace, who up until recently has been doing her own promotional art because Disney isn’t.

Dana Terrace, who does not just sit aside and let people dictate who is and isnt valid and worthy of representation.

Dana Terrace, who trooped though anyway. who is doing what she can. Who is standing up for what she believes in. Who is risking her job by telling the world that she believes in LGBTQ+ kids and adults when no one else will.

Dana, you’re my hero. I don’t think you realize how much this means to us. Or maybe you do; and that’s why you’re working so, so hard. I’m proud of you. You’re a superhero. You deserve to breathe, to let us help. You’re not doing this alone.

But you’ve carried us such a long way. Thank you.

Fans, let’s please do what we can! Dana’s charity auction is TOMORROW and im sorry im late, but lets get this going! Make this viral! Get Dana to see this! Get fans over there at 3 PM EST!!! You have no reason not to reblog this! Reposts are welcome! Get this to Twitter if you need to!

https://mobile.twitter.com/DanaTerrace/status/1502437623905746946

4,899 notes - Posted March 12, 2022

My #1 post of 2022

Most of the tumblr trends are pretty self contained - I don’t go around telling everyone about horse plinko or referencing the live slug reaction too much, or saying “eeby deeby” or anything like that around non-tumblrinas. So why is it that I keep wanting to turn towards everyone I know and say “hey have you seen the 1973 Martin Scorsese film Goncharov yet”

14,507 notes - Posted November 24, 2022

Get your Tumblr 2022 Year in Review →

#tumblr2022 #year in review #my 2022 tumblr year in review #your tumblr year in review

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robotpussy · 1 year

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"identity you don't like"

...is that person aware of the actual real harm of bi lesbians. like its way more than it being stupid as hell it also still harms people just as much as it did when it was created. and reclaiming it is influencing the harm and also muddling the history and meanings of being a lesbian and bisexuality. people are so obsessed with trying to look more superior and inclusive than other labels that its actually fucking up this community.

sorry idiots are finding your post and being stupid mx robotpussy you are literally so right

so inclusive you just end up creating something bigoted is so common today it's ridiculous. reinventing the wheel is not needed. words have meanings and these people are afraid of the word bisexuality!

I said earlier today that I feel like this stuff happens because alot of ppl don't bother to read about LGBT history and that's why there are still these discourses going on. I'm kind of tired of it.

#asks

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bi-sapphics · 2 years

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would you mind explaining why you arent a battleaxe bi anymore? /gen

i just think exclusionists are unnecessarily mean and wasting their time building up all of that anger. i think we have bigger things to focus on. at the end of the day, pansexuals aren't hurting bisexuals as much as the power of the real world is.

i'm still critical of pansexuality's origins and the community's behavior sometimes, but like... it's unfair to make that judgement towards every individual.

it's not even just being anti-pan, really. i'm moving away from exclusionism as a whole. i'm finding my true identity and pride in labels that are frowned upon in such communities (i.e. aspec stuff). i'm also studying all perspectives and realizing that, actually, the more and more inclusive you go, the better argument you have, and my personal philosophy is that it's rooted in letting go of anger you don't need to have. i understand why exclusionists are angry, but i think they're misdirecting said anger towards their own kind and not our oppressors. yes queer is a slur, but it's definitely more widely-reclaimed than not and you can use it regularly while also respecting individual boundaries and knowing when to avoid using it in their personal spaces.

if i'm going to run a blog mostly focusing on bi+ topics, then it's only right to include all labels under the bi umbrella. after all, i totally agree with people who use multiple mspec labels at once, as if they function as more specific descriptors for their preferences (i.e. bi/pan, bi/omni, bi/poly - i myself am feeling a newfound connection to bi/omni). every book you'll read studying mspec sexuality includes these subcommunities and welcomes them with open arms. maybe some of these people do have internalized biphobia, but if they have a community that is technically the same thing identity-wise, so what?

and speaking of books, i think material reality and its physical sources of written history speak louder than random 14yo's carrds online. the books that promote bi revolutions? they're anti-lesbian-separatism. the more i look into it, the more i think it's harmful to bi women and realize nothing would have changed, positively or negatively, if it had never happened. radfems never would have had the power they do, lesbians would be much more accepting of mspec wlw participating in their own rightful culture, and pretty much all of this "lesbians vs. bi women" discourse wouldn't exist present-day. "lesbian" used to belong to us, and it was never supposed to be taken away from us in the first place. if there is no harm in bisexuality and other mspec communities existing in harmony, then there is no harm in mono and mspec lesbians existing in harmony, exactly as they did once before. lesbophobic invasive men are gonna be lesbophobic regardless of the label. i was actually reading a carrd last night that made a great argument, about how chronically-online lesbians always push for mspec lesbians to create their own label, when it should be the former who does so. lesbian was inclusive before it was exclusive and it was never supposed to be exclusive at any point in time. if lesbians can accept that bi women have a rightful access to butch/femme & dyke, then they should be able to understand where i'm getting. you can't take something from someone and then claim it was never theirs. it's literally immoral theft. so yeah, in case it wasn't obvious yet, i'm starting to lean radinclus to the point where i understand and find community with lesbianism. it just makes more and more sense as you delve deeper and deeper into what all sapphics have in common, as opposed to how we think of each other currently.

^^ i'm really scared to post that. i'm afraid of harassment before questions, but i promise you i have done so much more research on the topic than exclusionists have and could debunk pretty much any argument you (respectfully) throw my way. i'm afraid of getting called a lesbophobe by people who don't want to think differently and understand that the idea is different than what they imagine it is. if you must unfollow me then go ahead, but there is a reason i'm keeping this on the down-low. just because i'm confident enough that i'm right doesn't mean i'm confident others will be reasonable. but, there ya go, i've officially said it now. if anything, i really only plan on mentioning it on this blog (as opposed to the main purpose of @tribadeism as a sideblog of mine) for emphasizing posts regarding the history and/or relatability of sapphics, but i guess we'll see.

so, i used to be exclus-leaning, but i no longer am. i am now pro-mspec, pro-aspec, accept aces/aros who say they're queer, and am learning about and starting to lean towards radical inclusionism (with some critical thought to remain naturally, of course, don't worry - the lack of that ruins the credibility of any stance imo).

#chase answers #lgbt discourse #ex exclus #exclus mention #radfem mention #anti radfem #radinclus #radical inclusionist #inclus #inclusionist

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greggorylee · 1 year

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Wait are you okay with asexuals??? I found out that you're against ace inclusionism :(((

Yes, i’m okay with ace/aro people. Yes, i’m against “ace inclusionism”

Honestly, these asks are so exhausting because ive made myself clear for nearly a decade now my stance on whether or not being ace/aro makes you lgbt. I’m going to put all the points ive gathered into one place, so this post can simply be referenced if you’re curious.

Keep in mind these thoughts are in no particular order, but altogether represent the problems with ace/aro inclusionism and the behavior of the inclusionist community over the past years

Asexuality and aromanticism are valid identities

Allow me to get this out of the way. The experience of being aro/ace not being the same experience as an lgbt person does NOT mean that these experiences are invalid. If the label of asexual or aromantic fits you, thats awesome. The ace/aro community as a whole is its own resource, and support and understanding is deserved for people who fall under these ids.

However, that does not mean you are oppressed for being ace/aro, especially not in the same way the lgbt community is oppressed for being gay/lesbian/bi/trans. When considering peoples oriantations and identities, cishets have different experiences than lgbt people, and ace/aro people have different experiences from both.

The straight ace/aro fallacy

If being gay and ace doesn’t make one any less gay, why would being ace make straight people less straight? Asexuality/aromanticism is about whether or not you feel sexual or romantic attraction to your partner, not WHO you are attracted to generally.

To emphasize, what a cis straight ace/aro person experiences is NOT the same as what an LGBT person experiences. The fact that they are cis and straight does not change with the amount of sex or intimacy they have, just like the amount of sex and intimacy of a gay/bi/lesbian person does not affect whether or not theyre gay, bi or lesbian. LGB orientations are about WHO you are attracted to, not HOW.

Sexualizing the LGBT community

Treating asexuality or aromanticism as lgbt orientations assumes that every other orientation is sexual by default, which is not only wrong, but dehumanizing. terms like bisexual/homosexual etc do not literally mean Horny Only. these labels were coined back when sex (as in genitalia) was often used for gender, but these terms have evolved in meaning beyond “who you have sex with”.

asexuality and aromanticism arent orientations, theyre modifier identities. The fact you can be gay and ace but also straight and ace should end the inclusionism argument altogether, but the ace/aro community have developed such a victim fantasy that even suggesting our experiences are different is somehow oppressing them. Which its not.

Even worse is treating microlabels like demisexual as LBGT orientations, because it assumes that not only are the other orientations sexual by default, but they are careless in their intimacy / sleep around / are “easy”. It doesnt matter if ace and demi people arent literally saying these things–by acting like their ace/demi identity makes them LGBT, that by default is saying “i dont have sex / i dont have casual sex and therefore i am different and separate and special from you”.

Let’s talk about the term “allosexual”. Its insulting and degrading for the ace/aro community to refer to LGBT people as “allos that contribute to our oppression because they Have Sex and dont want us in their club”. seriously think about the implications of creating a term that is supposed to represent an oppressive group, and applying it to LGBT people that have sex. Especially since that cis/straight ace/aro people have been given the understanding that their sex drive or desire for romance is something theyre oppressed for, even oppressed by the “sex havers” that include lgbt people. Which they are not.

Think about that, and stop using it.

Bullying vs oppression

Oppression requires massive, widespread cultural AND systemic power imbalances that target a group of people for a harmless trait or behavior. For these cultural and systemic powers to be oppressive, they must force the oppressed into changing or hiding. To be oppressed is for religious masses, entire governments, and thousands upon millions of people wanting you dead for something you cant control, for simply existing. To be oppressed is to fear being yourself at the cost of your life. Not a life of constant terror, but living with the reminder that you are always in potential danger and always at a disadvantage that was set up against you on purpose because of who you are.

This is not something that asexuality or aromanticism faces. Do ace/aro people face stigma? Absolutely. Even targeting bullying based on their identity. And to live in the hypersexualized, hyperromantic heterosexual hellscape that is pervasive through most of the world is stressful for anyone who doesn’t fit that mold. That is real, and that struggle and hurt is real. But it is not oppression.

ace/aro people are not being targeted as groomers like lgbt people are. ace/aro people are not the victims of hate crimes and murder because of being ace/aro, like lgbt people. ace/aros do not have specific laws taking their rights as humans away because of being ace/aro, like lgbt people have for our entire existence and still are. To be LGBT is literally deadly because we are hated for who we love, who we are attracted to. To be ace/aro is NOT deadly, not oppressed, because there has not been a campaign to eradicate them from public life for not feeling romantic or sexual attraction

This is not “oppression olympics”. This is what oppression really means and is. Microaggressions are a PART of oppression, a SYMPTOM. Real oppression is defined by generations of systemic abuse. Facism and bigotry hate ANYTHING that is different. ace/aro people inevitably will be stigmatized for their identities by facism, and that is fucked up, and can even be traumatic, but the source of that trauma is bigotry that already exists, not aphobia.

Your sex life and romantic life are intrinsically linked to your gender and orientation. If you’re a straight ace/aro person, you’re going to be under the pressure to have sex because of sexism/cissexism. If you’re a gay/trans ace/aro person, you’re going to be under the pressure to start having sex in a cis straight relationship because of homophobia/transphobia. Oppressive actions that ace/aro people face are because of oppression that already exists, and happens to overlap with characteristics of their ace/aro identities.

For example, furries are notoriously bullied and harassed. On a surface level, it is because “cringe animal person”, but beneath the hatred is genuine bigotry. Furries are always compared to being gay or trans, mentally ill, or it means youre a sexual predator because of your “deviant” behavior. That’s not furryphobia, that’s facism, specifically ableism and trans/homophobia. Cis straight furries are also subject to ridicule, but that is because of their proximity to the “dangerous deviance” thats lgbt or “insane/autistic” coded. The reason that there have been actual gas and shooting threats at fur conventions is because of the diversity of body and identity that the fandom is known for. Furries are not oppressed for being furries. There simply happens to be a lot of furries that also fall into oppressed communities. The same goes for asexuality and aromanticism.

“But the bigots say they hate LGBTQA+ now! That includes us!”

The very fact that trans/homophobes are even thinking to complain about ace/aro people is because the ace/aro community has pushed their oppression fantasy into the public eye so hard for literal years, demonizing anyone who pointed out that a cis straight person who doesnt fuck is not “queer”.

It is quite literally self inflicted bullying. ace/aros are only ever targeted by bigots because of their proximity to the lgbt community, or like mentioned previously, the punishment of any kind of deviancy under facism. Bigots dont understand or care that our experiences are vastly different, they just want victims to target. And the ace/aro community stood in front of the lgbt community for nearly 10 years and screamed “look at us! We’re just as weird as them!”. You think that some reactionaries arent going to take advantage of that?

Blue’s clues including ace/aro and other microidentities does not actually “confirm” theyre lgbt somehow. The very idea that someone would be targeted for not wanting intimacy in the same way someone is targeted for WANTING intimacy, and how they perform their intimacy, is insulting. The idea that being called “weird” or “broken” is in any way comparable to literally fearing walking down the street being yourself, is insulting. The idea that struggling with oversexualized media is in any way comparable to being killed for who you have sex with, is insulting. Remember what i said about microaggressions and how they do not add up to oppression without literal legal and cultural abuse of power?

The redundancy of microlabels

labels such as demi or grey romantic/sexual are even more insulting to pretend like they are lgbt orientations. There is literally no abnormality to being demiromantic or demisexual. The need to develop intimate feelings for someone else is an experience that is MUCH more common than feeling no attraction at all. Despite what the hypersexualized media may tell you, your experience of needing a friendship before romantic attraction is not rare

Its so common, in fact, that demirom/sexual identities are in essence the same thing as going “i need to get to know someone before i can be intimate with them, and that makes me queer.” really? The experience of making friends and falling in love or sexual desire is not exclusive to being LGBT, nor is it something that is even remotely stigmatized in the way LGBT people are, or even ace/aro people. A LOT people are demiromantic and demisexual without knowing what those labels even are. Treating demirom/sexual as lgbt orientations is treating a cishet person that doesnt kiss on the first date as an lgbt person.

And yeah, there are LGBT ace/aro people. But what makes them LGBT is the LGBT part of their identity. Once again, the fact you can be ace/demi and gay OR straight means these identities are not orientations

This redundancy and ignorance applies to most of microidentities, such as pan/omni which were only made under the misunderstanding that bisexuality wasnt already inclusive of nonbinary people or that bisexuality hasnt meant “many or all” for DECADES, but thats an entire other post

Ignoring trauma

Another thing that is harmful about treating asexuality as an lgbt orientation is that not everyone is asexual in the same way.

What i mean is, there are some people who simply dont feel attraction to others. Thats absolutely cool, deserving of respect and its own unique support. However, some people are ace/aro because of trauma, mental illness symptoms, inexperience, dysphoria/dysmorphia, racism, disability, and internalized hatred and fear. These things are NOT an lgbt orientation, OR an identity, and treating them as such dangerously ignores the possibility of recovery.

Im not saying “ace/aro people are all just traumatized” or whatever because thats literally not true. But a large amount of them are. I was one myself, and im close with several people who also went through this identity because of some form of trauma and/or depressive symptoms and/or dysphoria. For all of us, labeling these symptoms as “ace/aro” kept us from truly examining our problems with intimacy, because we had simply accepted said problems as “being ace/aro”. After self exploration, we discovered we were in fact not ace or aro

AGAIN. Being ace/aro does NOT inherently mean you have problems to work through with your intimate life. My point is that when people see symptoms of things that ARENT inherent to asexuality or aromanticism and so readily misdiagnose them as a sexual or romantic orientation instead of, yknow, literal trauma, it leads people to misunderstand themselves or simply not try to explore their feelings toward intimacy.

And that doesnt even mean that you have to or will automatically change from ace/aro if you examine why you identify that way. Plenty of people are ace/aro because of trauma and know this and their identity helps them in their recovery. But things like dysphoria, internalized homophobia, and trauma symptoms that are genuinely distressing NEED to be addressed beyond the concept of “being ace/aro”. Healing is what’s important, not using your personal distress as a public identity

TMI / no one asked

The thing that’s strange i find about the push for ace/aro inclusionism is the seemingly complete lack of awareness of what you’re actually telling strangers when you say you’re asexual specifically

When you introduce yourself as LGBT, for example, it’s because its an intrinsic part of your identity. Gender and orientation are face level facts appropriate in all situations. Introducing yourself as trans is saying “hey, i’m not cis”. Introducing yourself as LGB is saying “hey, i’m not straight.” as i mentioned before, both of these things can be exclusive to peoples sex lives, and even if they arent, mentioning their identity is not bringing up anything sexual whatsoever. (again. If you hear that someone is lgbt and your first thought is i wonder how much sex they have, maybe youre the problem)

However, when you introduce yourself as asexual, you are specifically bringing your sex life into the conversation. “I dont feel sexual attraction to anyone” is not usually something you’d bring up to a stranger when introducing yourself. Like, idk, no one asked how much you’re not fucking, yknow? Especially not the underage people that you may be around. This oversharing is worse for asexuality since you’re directly mentioning your lack of sex drive.

By NO means is it anything like sexual harassment or whatever, but seriously please just imagine yourself meeting a stranger and “im not really into sex” is one of the FIRST things you tell them. Is that necessary?

Sexualizing minors

One of the most dangerous results of specifically asexuality being pushed as an lgbt identity is now minors are being open in public about their sex drives. Under no circumstances do strangers online need to know how much sex a child wants or doesnt want to have. I have seen predators that draw CP label themselves as ace, and i can all too well see a scenario where a minor is groomed under the pretense of asexuality, seeing that they share a sexual identity with an adult and trusting them because said adult apparently doesnt want sex either. These predators obviously are NOT a part of the ace/aro community, nor is being ace/aro somehow predatory, but my point is that its become incredibly normal for kids to make their sex drives public knowledge, which can EASILY be taken advantage of

“But being ace is about NOT wanting sex! Isnt that the opposite of sexualizing?”

This argument is still astonishing to me. Not only is asexuality specifically about how much SEXUAL attraction one feels, but ive seen people insist that asexual people can still feel sexual attraction and have sex. This identity is ABOUT sex, whether or not the identifier wants sex or not. It is literally a description of your sex drive.

Which is also why adults making asexual headcanons about minor characters actually IS borderline predatory. No adult should be thinking in depth about whether or not a child feels sexual attraction. Period. There is no reasonable explanation for looking at someone underage and going “i bet that literal 14 year old doesnt want to fuck anybody. And i bet theyre really proud of it too and want to tell everyone else.” is there seriously nothing uncomforatable about adults making headcanons about how much sex a minor has?

Stealing from other communities

The biggest one to talk about are cishet ace/aros who, by all accounts, do not experience the oppression that lgbt people do. Therefore they do not need our resources. Our community is for our own support. Its not a “fun diversity club” that anyone can join just because theyre a ~little different~ than ~normal cishet people~. This is the biggest example of the acearo community laying claim to experiences and resources that arent theirs. Look me in the eyes and tell me that a straight cis person deserves a spot in the lgbt community because they feel weird for not wanting to have sex. Meanwhile the lgbt community are at the same time hypersexualized and punished for their sexual partners by straight and cis people. What about that to you isnt stealing?

“Aspec” was being used for the autism spectrum well before asexuality was popularized, being autistic myself i had known it as part of our community before 2014. “Allo” sounds suspiciously close to “allistic” which is the term used for people who are not autistic. Also, if the aro flag came first please correct me, but its weird that the agender and aromantic flags both were made in 2014 and the aromantic flag is just the agender flag cut in half

Also, as a rape survivor, i do not even want to touch on the fact some inclusionists have co-opted corrective rape as a part of aphobia, even though corrective rape has specifically and historically been targeted towards trans and LGBT people, lesbians in particular, to turn them cishet. i'll just say it really pisses me off and move on.

Really Evil Gays

One of the ugliest behaviors of specifically the inclusionism movement is to compare and conflate lgbt people and survivors of abuse with our abusers and oppressors. Any lgbt person who does not want cishets pushing themselves in our community and claiming our suffering as their own is “aphobic”, or using “terf rhetoric” (which some of yall really need to learn what that actually is) and are now a bigot. “Exclusionists” are listed right next to trans/homophobes, predators, and racists in DNI lists and banners as if literally being bigoted is in any way comparable to going “the amount of sex you have doesnt make you queer”.

Like, it is genuinely revolting to act like lgbt people explaining the differences between our experiences is not only oppressing you, but is just as bad treatment as us experiencing hate crimes and abuse. Like the “radical exclusionary” sex having gays and transes are gatekeeping you out of the Fun Club. being progressive does not always mean “validating uwu” people’s compulsion to find ways to feel ostracized for oppressed points, because once again, stigmatization alone not oppression. and the validity of these experiences can be mutually exclusive

I as a marginalized white person suffer under capitalism. however, i’m not about to cry racism when someone reminds me that i have objectively different experiences and advantages under capitalism over people of color, because capitalism is inherently tied to white supremacy. Some of what we go through under capitalism may overlap, but my whiteness is not a factor in my suffering under capitalism like how anyone elses race is. Asexuality and aromanticism suffer under the hypersexual patriarchy, but that does not mean that aphobia is a system of oppression, and certainly not one that lgbt people are somehow perpretrating by literally just not wanting cishets acting like they belong in our community because they dont have a sex drive.

Also, claiming that “your sex life doesnt define your orientation” is “terf rhetoric” is SO insulting to your transfem sisters. Please look up what a terf even means and where that description is applicable, instead of throwing it around at things that are not even about something that affects trans women in particular

The damage of the split attraction model

Now, correct me if im wrong, but i had never seen the split attraction model be popularized before ace/aro identities were pushing for inclusionism. They are also inextricably linked to and encouraged by the aroace community. For anyone who doesnt know, it is the split of romantic and sexual attraction between different orientations. For normal people, that would mean “gay ace” or something. However this normalization of “romantic attraction wholly different than sexual attraction” (which while can be true in the sense of being ace/aro, but is inherently untrue in the fact that WHO youre attracted to cannot simply be split between sex and romance)

This has lead to nonsense such as “bisexual lesbians” or in other words, biromantic homosexual, which does not exist. If you are femme and are attracted to anyone other than femmes, you’re not a lesbian by definition, and so on. The reason people seem to think that your sex life and romantic life can and do cancel each other out is, again, the push for ace inclusionism, and the idea that being asexual somehow makes a person less straight. Remember: a cis straight person who doesnt feel sexual attraction is still cis and straight.

ace/aro: not straight but not gay (a secret third thing)

What about people who are both ace and aro, some argue? I definitely agree that they are not straight and it’s not fair and insulting to label them as such. However, they aren’t any form of LGBT either if they are cis. Being lesbian, gay, and bi are specifically about intimacy and attraction to gender, and being trans intersects with this intrinsically. We connected as a community because of our shared persecution of who and our sexual partners and self presentation outside the gender binary, not who we DONT love or have sex with. Stonewall was not about asexuality or aromanticism.

No one is being oppressed for not having attraction to anyone at all. Once again, i direct you to the section comparing stigma to oppression, and ask if there are laws making it illegal to not be in a romantic or sexual relationship. If there are people being killed for the sole reason of not having an intimate partner. I will repeat myself: the struggles aroace people go through under an entirely too sexualized and romance obsessed cishet culture are VERY real and absolutely deserve understanding, support, and a community of their own. However to compare said experiences to the active oppression and lets, be real, ongoing genocide of the lgbt community is frankly ignorant at best and actively insulting and degrading at worst.

Accept that your experiences as aroace people are unique, and push for understanding on your own instead of hijacking the lgbt community for validation. If you’re not trans, you do not experience what we do.

Dont try to change my mind

The reason replies and reblogs are turned off is because i have literally been talking about this for 9 years and i have so many better things to do. My stance will not change by being discoursed at online by strangers with a victim complex. I’ll be blocking any discourse asks as well. If you made it here (or didnt) and feel compelled to argue, just block me instead, go take care of yourself and be with friends and reflect on what ive said.

However feel free to screenshot and share or reference back to this post. Obviously i cant stop anybody. But hopefully this will be helpful for anyone left with questions about whether or not im “okay with ace people”. (hint: i am, and just because i dont think being ace makes you lgbt means i’m against ace people existing)

#literally this is the last time im answering an ask about this #just search ace or whatever on my blog #anyone sends an ask like this again ill just reblog this post #000 #<- unique tag so i can find this shit later

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inter-bellum · 1 year

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I posted 304 times in 2022

26 posts created (9%)

278 posts reblogged (91%)

Blogs I reblogged the most:

@its-tea-time-darling

@not-your-typical-jay

@persnickett

@itsthemxze

@anaisanais-stuff

I tagged 222 of my posts in 2022

Only 27% of my posts had no tags

#fic rec - 18 posts

#!!! - 8 posts

#tmr - 7 posts

#lol - 6 posts

#soral's shit - 6 posts

#gif tutorial - 5 posts

#skam fic rec - 5 posts

#incorrect tmr quotes - 4 posts

#tmr fic rec - 4 posts

#personal - 4 posts

Longest Tag: 107 characters

#this is giving me soo much nostalgia and reminding me of the pictures in the books i used to read as a cild

My Top Posts in 2022:

to parents

My parents were almost as kind and accepting as any lgbtq-kid could wish for. When I came out as non-binary, my mom gave me a hug and my dad a pat on the back. That however did not mean they started using the right pronouns, or later when I told them about a new name that I wanted to try out, then did not call me that. There was never really rejection/unacceptability, but rather a lack of awareness and the actions that came with it, sometimes felt like rejection.

For my generation, when you tell someone about a new name, the next obviously logical step is for them to start calling you by that name, it’s like a built in habit. But not with my parents, like i said, there was just a lack of awareness and knowledge and so they just continued referring to me by my old name. Only when I explicitly told them that I wanted to be called by this new name, they actually started using it. Though my father didn’t at first, his reasoning being ‘but she also listens to her old name, so why should I?’ Now that feels like rejection. But that was just from the lack of awareness, he didn’t not realise how important it was for trans people so see the new name get accepted (and with that, eventually being used as well)

So to parents, regardless of the fact if your child is out, or part of the lgbtq-community, please educate yourself. Get some basic knowledge groundwork so to speak and know the meaning of ‘standard’ lgbtq words like homosexual/heterosexual/bisexual and cisgender/transgender.’ My parents didn’t even know what transgender meant precisely, let alone the meaning of a more specific term such as non-binary, that alone adds a whole new layer of difficulty, that combined with that everyone expresses their label(s) in a different way, like I’m a very masculine non-binary person whilst others are more feminine or more androgynous.

My parents didn’t understand me, they still don’t understand and I don’t think they ever fully will because cause this is such a unique, personal experience

(Even as fellow non-binary/trans person, you will probably understand out of everyone but still it’s slightly different from person to person) but they understood even less because of that lack of awareness and knowledge. So to parents, please educate yourself on themes like these as they are becoming more prevalent in todays society, keep up with those things, like one would keep up the news.

There will I think always be this gap of understanding between generations, later in life I might find myself in a similar position like my parents now, but I hope at least that with every generation, the previous one will be outfitted with more tools to gain understanding and knowledge and have the knowledge lead to acceptance. Because giving a hug or a pat on the back isn’t enough, with acceptance must come action.

11 notes - Posted November 12, 2022

Gally: youre very annoying

Thomas: what can I say, its a lifestyle

13 notes - Posted May 29, 2022

Gally: *begrudgingly hands Thomas his jacket, as his complaining about being cold annoys him (or so he tells himself)

Minho: why'd you do that? Thought you hated him *eyebrow wiggling ensues*

Gally: there's a fine line between hate and-

Minho: *crows* LOVE

Gally: *deadpan* vague feelings of affection

@its-tea-time-darling in light of the thomally week, of which I only see snatches, here's my humble contribution

51 notes - Posted April 30, 2022

Minho: *eyeing Thomas*

Newt: Oh, for bloody god's sake, Minho, at least make sure he can still walk once you're done with him.

Minho: What do you mean, still walk?! They can always walk

Newt: *tsking* they hobble, Minho! They ho-

Minho: *loudly speaking* they can get from point A to point B!!

86 notes - Posted February 28, 2022

My #1 post of 2022

Thomas: *presenting some wild, dangerous plan*

Gally: what's he on?

Newt: some highly addictive drug called idiocy

95 notes - Posted August 13, 2022

Get your Tumblr 2022 Year in Review →

#tumblr2022 #year in review #my 2022 tumblr year in review #your tumblr year in review #hehe lovely angel number there #222 and 2022 :))

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cyrenesavage · 2 months

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"Those who adopt lesser-known or newer sexual identity terms because they view “standard” orientation terms as “boxes” actually just choose to sit inside boxes that more closely resemble their body. Arguably, applying more specific descriptions to oneself decreases their mobility within their identity. If someone (mis)understands bisexuality as “attraction with gender preferences,” a pansexual who bases their sexuality on the lack thereof may face internal conflict if they ever develop preferences down the line, as they may now feel like they must re-evaluate their entire identity even though who they’re attracted to has not changed.

It’s often unhealthy to hyper-analyze your sexuality to the point where how you experience your attraction pattern(s) changes where you belong. It often distresses the person trying to examine themselves and can leave them worried over if they’re in the “right” category, which is enough of a problem with labels with significant wiggle room.

This is why the idea that broader terms are somehow more restrictive is baffling. Continuously breaking labels down and creating terminology for each facet of one’s identity shrinks communities until it’s just one person convinced that they’re the only one who relates to their experiences. It isolates people and ignores the importance of individuality within a collective identity. Both of these elements are what make a community a community.

Many people think LGBTQ liberation is achieved when people have a plethora of options to choose from to perfectly fit their being, but this is nothing more than capitalist market logic: “more options for the consumer = happier consumer” (which isn’t actually true). Such microlabeling (with sexuality specifically; neogender labels are a different story that I don’t see much issue with) is very reminiscent of arguments that having fewer brands for a product rather than a bunch for the same thing — even if all those brands are owned by just one company — is a threat to freedom.

In reality, this sense of freedom is illusory. Sexualities shouldn’t be commodities, and buying into the branding distracts us from change. Liberation involves dismantling our society’s sexual and gender hierarchies; then, the categorization of people’s behaviors to this extent is no longer considered relevant on any larger-than-local scale."

“At first glance the main thing would seem to be the choice of the ‘consumable image’. The housewife-who-uses-Fairy-Snow is different (and the difference is measured in profits) to the housewife-who-uses-Tide. The Labour voter differs from the Conservative voter, and the Communist from the Christian Democrat, in much the same way. But such differences are increasingly hard to discern. The spectacle of incoherence ends up putting a value on the zero point of values. Eventually identification with anything at all, like the need to consume anything at all, becomes more important than brand loyalty to a particular type of car, idol, or politician. The essential thing, surely, is to alienate people from their desires and pen them in the spectacle, in the policed zone. Good or bad, honest or criminal, left-wing or right-wing—what does the mould matter, so long as we are engulfed by it? Let those who cannot identify with Khrushchev identify with Yevtushenko—and the hooligans will be kept well under control. And indeed it is only the third force that has nothing to identify with—no opposition leader, no pseudo-revolutionary leader. The third force is the force of identity—in the sense of the identity in which each individual can recognize and discover him-or herself. A sphere where nobody decides for me, or in my name; where my freedom is the freedom of all."

“The fact is that identification, like all manifestations of inhumanity, has its roots in the human. Inauthentic life feeds on authentically felt desires. And identification through roles is doubly successful in this respect. In the first place, it co-opts the play of metamorphoses, the pleasure of putting on masks and being everywhere in every guise. Secondly, it appropriates mankind’s ancient love of mazes, of getting lost solely in order to find one’s way again: the pleasure in simply wandering and changing. Roles also lay under contribution the reflexive search for identity—the desire to find the richest and truest part of ourselves in others. Play then ceases to be a game, and is reified because the players can no longer make up the rules. The quest for identity degenerates into identification.

Let us reverse the perspective for a moment. A psychiatrist tells us that ‘Recognition by society leads the individual to discharge his sexual impulses in pursuit of cultural goals, and this is the best way for him to defend himself against those impulses’. Read: the aim of roles is to absorb vital forces, to exhaust erotic energy by means of permanent sublimation. The less erotic reality there is, the more abundant sexualized forms in the spectacle become. Roles—Reich would say ‘armouring’—ensure orgastic impotence. Conversely, true pleasure, joie de vivre and orgastic potency shatter body armour and roles. If individuals could only stop seeing the world through the eyes of the powers-that-be, and look at it from their own point of view, they would have no trouble discerning which actions are really liberating, which moments are lived the most authentically—lightning flashes in the dark night of roles. Real experience can illuminate roles—can x-ray them, so to speak—in such a way as to redirect the energy invested in them, to extricate the truth from the lies. This task is at once individual and collective. Though all roles alienate equally, some are more vulnerable than others. It is easier to escape the role of a libertine than the role of a cop, executive, or priest. A fact to which everyone should give a little thought.”

Excerpts from:

On Hyperpersonalized Sexual Identity | Kravitz Marshall https://aninjusticemag.com/on-hyperpersonalized-sexual-identity-f3736d15928d

The Revolution of Everyday Life - XV - Roles | Raoul Vaneigem

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regard-luxury · 1 year

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korasonata · 3 years

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I think this is just what my blog is now. Model streams have taken over. Sorry, not sorry. Favourite moments of Joe and Cleo paper model streams part 5! (Featuring a heavily sleep deprived Joe)

—

Cleo (talking to her cat): Ok. You have had attention. Are you— are you going to go? *pausing* This is the sort of thing I ask Joe. Umm… *laughing*

Joe: Constantly!

Cleo: *laughing* You’ve had your attention, can you go now?

Joe: Can you just not be here. *both laughing*

—

Cleo: Yeah, I have to start gluing things to other things. Badly. And, uh, realizing where I’ve messed up. Which is EVERYWHERE!

Joe: Uh oh.

Cleo (totally not fine): Its fine. It’s fine. I’m fin— how are you Joe?

—

Joe: It makes about as much sense as anything else I do? So…

Cleo: I mean yeah. I mean, I wasn’t gonna say it cause I’m not rude. But, you know.

*both laughing*

Joe: Now you’re just lying to me!

Cleo: *laughing* WOW!! Joe!! My heart is just hurting! Now.

Joe: Mhm.

Cleo: You can tell can’t you, I’m deeply— intensely wounded by that statement that you just made.

—

Joe: I was gonna say, we’re gonna have to call whatever the British version of an ambulance is.

Cleo: Um, I think— and I could be wrong here, the British equivalent of an ambulance is…an ambulance.

Joe: oh, ok that’s really good to know. Cause like, not that I’m planning on getting injured while I’m over there, but like—

Cleo: I mean, if you carry on talking that way you might.

Joe: I mean if I meet you, then there’s a chance that somethings gonna get shoved in my eye or something.

Cleo: Somethings gonna get taken off.

—

Joe: I mean, they say it’s the shotty carpenter that blames his poor tools, but I mean look at this.

—

Cleo (about her bisexual tags on twitch): Hold on, hold on, I need to explain what “visibility” means to bisexuals. Bisexuals are often— um, hidden in the community. They are often, um, not treated as either part of the gay community and the straight community doesn’t really appreciate them either. So, having visibility for bisexuals is very important. As it is for any other place. Also having those tags on your stream show that you are a safe place for those people to go. So, you know, actually labeling those things is important because it shows people that they are not alone. And not being alone? Really important. (To Joe) Sorry, am getting frustrated.

Joe: As somebody who’s been alone for the last year and a half with this stupid isolation, uh, yeah.

Cleo: Yeah! Being alone and not feeling alone is really important.

Joe: If you need to be explained at this point in the pandemic why feeling alone is not good, like I don’t know what to say.

—

Cleo (reading chat): What’s my favourite minecraft mob? Do people have favourite minecraft mobs?

Joe (very tired): Just say whichever mod’s here. Who’s got a sword *scrolling through Cleo’s chat* umm… yeah it’s AnnaBomBanana. Is everyone’s favourite minecraft mod.

Cleo: …moB.

Joe: …MOB! OH!

Cleo: *continuous laughing*

—

Joe: This is gonna go off of the rails further and further. There’s no— there’s no rails anymore! It’s just, somebody has scrawled “here there be dragons” on the ground.

Cleo: I mean, isn’t that pretty much how you live your life anyway?

Joe (high pitched squealing): It kind of is. *laughing continues*

Cleo: You know. Here there be dragons— Sometimes it’s not dragons. Sometimes you might be lucky.

—

Joe: So, like, one thing you can do is after this project you can build tiny dollhouses. And create like a bedroom for each of your tools. And so the knife can just be in the knife room. In the dollhouse. And it can have a knife day.

SILENCE

Cleo: Umm…I’m gonna pretend like what you said made sense.

—

Cleo: I could have said something really nasty then, but I’m not going to. See? I’m growing as a person Joe.

—

Joe: You know what? Hold on, we’re gonna— we’re gonna— at the point where NJ is concerned about my caffeine intake, I’m gonna go get a red bull and I’m gonna take my headphones off before anybody can tell me otherwise, byeeeeeeeeeeee!!!! Be right back!!!! *leaves*

Cleo (calling after him): Well done Joe! I believe in you! *narrating* She did not in fact believe in Joe, and was very concerned.

—

Cleo: I know when there’s a bad idea. It’s when Joe has made it. Joe has suggested it, that’s— that’s when you know it’s bad.

—

Joe: I know that there are ways to have computers automatically send invites, but that’s a good way, like, I know there’s a saying like, to error is human, but to screw up like a hundred thousand things all at once—

Cleo: That’s the Joe Hills Difference.

—

Cleo: Ugh, I feel like poop today.

Joe (genuine): I’m sorry.

Cleo (tiredly): No, that’s ok…(groggy) I’ll torment you…later…it’ll make me feel better…

Joe (equally as tired): Yay!

—

Joe (about Cleo and Xisuma): But Cleo, you’re the responsible adult in this scenario, so yeah you probably should have some answers.

Cleo: X is almost as old as I am.

SILENCE

Joe: …it’s a maturity gap?

Cleo: *laughing* Is that why I’m here with you?

Joe: …no.

Cleo: *laughing*

Joe: I say very confidently.

—

Joe (teacher voice): Quantum mechanics is a fundamental theory in physics that provides a description of the physical properties of nature at the scale of atoms and subatomic particles—

Cleo: *flipping him off*

Joe (blissfully unaware): Now classical physics! The collection of theories that existed before the advent of quantum mechanics—

Cleo: *trying to ignore him*

Joe (carrying on): Quantum mechanics differs from classical physics in that energy, momentum, angular momentum, and other quantities of a bound system are restricted to discreet values—

Cleo: *fingers drumming impatiently*

Joe (still going): Now! Quantum mechanics arose gradually from theories to explain observations which could not be reconciled with classical physics—

Cleo: *physically going through all 5 stages of grief*

Joe: (insert continuously long string of rambling science here)

Cleo: *mutes Joe*

—

Cleo (responding to her partner in chat): You have the movie poster for Dora the Explorer? Cam, I’m suddenly questioning our relationship now.

Joe: Uh oh.

Cleo: *laughing*

Joe: Yeah, I knew I was gonna get blamed for that eventually.

—

Cleo (frustrated): I’m gonna kill someone. And since the person who made and designed this castle isn’t here…(trailing off) Hi Joe.

Joe (accepted his fate): Hello.

—

Joe: Have you ever officiated a wedding?

Cleo: No I haven’t. Why, do you want me to?

—

Joe: Oh! Oh! I found my cross stitch the other day!

Cleo: Oh cool!

Joe: *rummaging in the background* Yeah, so, I don’t know if you’ve seen this before—

Cleo (excitedly): ShowMeShowMeShowMeShowMe!!!

—

Joe (reading chat): Am I excited for Minecraft Live? Umm…

SILENCE

Joe: You know, so much of life is minecraft, but you know, maybe this is just a step too far. You know? Um, I think Mojang asked if they could and never stopped to ask if they should. Um, you know, I think their decision in particular to clone dinosaurs at the event as part of their Jurrassic Park, uh, map thing that they put out— which, also, it’s not even like the Jurrassic Park movies are really for kids, but here’s— here’s Minecraft with Jurrassic Park in it, and also we’re gonna clone a bunch of dinosaurs for this livestream, it’s like *groaning*. I dunno. I’m dubious. I think it’s gonna backfire. Ya know, there’s like 4 cautionary films about why you don’t clone dinosaurs. And they’re just jumping in feet first. So…but, you know, I’d like to be wrong about this. Maybe it’ll go great.

Cleo: …are you having a moment Joe?

—

Cleo (reading chat): “when the arts and crafts streams become Cleo with a scream mask” I am not X. I am not X, I promise you I’m not X. I just don’t have a face.

Joe: Heh

Cleo: And if I was— hang on I’ll be back in a second.

Joe: …wait, did you just realize that you do have a scream mask?

Cleo: No, I have a better mask. *leaves*

SILENCE

Joe: *watching Cleo’s stream intensely*

—

Cleo: Are we seriously doing guillotine jokes right now? I’m not saying I disapprove, but

Joe: yeah, we say “Giatine”

Cleo: That’s ok, you can be wrong.

Joe: …It’s a french word.

Cleo: And? You’re allowed to be wrong.

Joe: …*deep sigh*

—

Joe: It’s funny too. Because people will tell me that I don’t seem like a very— like, mostly my coworkers. Like, would tell me that I didn’t seem like a particularly emotional person.

Cleo: *bursts out laughing*

—

Joe: Yeah, I feel like I didn’t make a lot of…visible progress today…but…it’s fine…

Cleo: I made progress for both of us Joe.

Joe (tiredly): Thank you Cleo… (resting head against the ring light)

SILENCE

Cleo (tenderly): …You’re welcome.

#hermitcraft #hermitblr #zombiecleo #zombie cleo #joehills #joe hills

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