#or like post s17 and stuff

[akalegos]

my friend server r doing a secret santa so i sumbitted these 2 losers 

#bkanvas' art #bkanvas' oc #Lavernius Tucker #Brick Ong #Red vs Blue #rvb #rvb oc #i asked for ship of them because i need them being losers #all i draw of them is just being cute #i need to draw them being big losers again #i need to i need to i need to aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa #i wrote there their s1 ages (hcs obviously) but their designs are like s11 ish #i feel so insane i think i just forgot #cause everytime i draw them i draw them post s11 #or like post s17 and stuff #idk i think im insane #or going mad #actually its bioth #im gonna get lemon tea after i finish queieng some posts grrr #i LOVE LEMON TEA #RIPS SHIRT

[the-team-sucks]

They deserved to be so happy together, they deserved to hug eachother and kiss eachother, and bonk their helmets together affectionately. They deserved to live in an apartment on earth/chorus and have a cat together, they deserved to run the joke into the ground that they didn't love eachother but held eachother in their arms every night. They deserved it so much after 21 years, we had one final chance and THEY DIVORCED????

I'm fine with doomed yaoi, im fine with obliterated yoai, but this was downright nuclear yoai. 7th circle of hell yoai. rapture yoai. multiversal implosion yoai. an all powerful deity came down and teased me with my dream ("come with me") then when i thought it was safe and my dream would manifest they threw me into The Pit for eternity to ever contemplate that the idea even crossed my mind yaoi.

My feelings will likely pass with time and I'll remember that im taking Restoration as a simulation (with parts taken from Restoration as post-s17 stuff), but im still REELING from how a celebration, swansong, love letter to the fans, didn't give us--dare i say--the biggest and most widely known "FAN-BASED THING" (heavy quotations bc we all know its cannon) from Red vs Blue. I get it was their thing, Grif leaves military, Simmons leads. BUT IT WAS ESTABLISHED GRIF COULD LITERALLY NOT STAND BEING AWAY FROM THE REDS AND BLUES AND SIMMONS HAS NOBODY TO LEAD RRRRRRRR.

Tune in next week for Jay being angry about never being able to get actual official confirmation of Grimmons outside of a scrapped script. (not to insult Rooster Teeths grave, im just salty bc Grimmons is my biggest OTP from any thing ever and I genuinely thoughts it was gonna happen finally >:'[ )

#YES IM STILL TALKING ABOUT IT #NO IM NOT OVER IT ILL NEVER BE OVER IT #grimmons #rvb grimmons #rvb grif #rvb simmons #rvb restoration spoilers #restoration spoilers #rvb #red vs blue #jays rambles

[zeravmeta]

Thoughts on RvB Restoration Finale

not really that long just my 2 cents

I wanna say I liked the movie because I did enjoy myself watching it, but honestly I'm very much gonna stick to the RvB17 open ended finale

Overall the movie was... ok? It wasn't unwatchably bad the way RvB Zero was but it also just made a lot of choices that I disagree with fundamentally both with the writing and the core themes of the series as a whole. I've had this take ever since RvB14 on the fanbase and the writers but this movie flat out says it:

The writers are fucking unable to let go of PFL and Chorus in a meaningful way.

For a series thats core message is about saying goodbye, they literally dont let that part of the show die. They are functionally unable to let go of the past peaks of the franchise and write something new. And I get it: RvB fundamentally cycles with its storytelling, but what was so refreshing to me about RvB14-17 was that it actually progressed itself Past those peaks of RvB10 and 11-13 (and honestly people REALLY dont appreciate the good in those later seasons). It felt like a natural (if wacky) progression, and it definitely wasnt perfect but it gave the extended cast more opportunities to shine in ways we didnt appreciate before

This movie just doesnt do that? Honestly the fact that they KILLED Sarge and Doc was so... disrespectful to me? Like not in the sense that it was as bad as how RvB Zero (fake) killed Tucker, but more like it felt like the writers killed them off because they were following a book titled "How To Write Story" and saw 'killing off characters is good writing'. Sarge got a dramatic send off that also didnt feel that impactful? And I did see it coming from the start but having Doc be Washs' guilt haunting him just left a bad taste in my mouth.

Its a really self contained story, a whole bunch of characters outside the main 3 reds and Caboose felt ooc, a good chunk of characters dont even show up (dude where was DONUT??? youre telling me he only has 5 seconds in Simmons' mind in a cheerleading costume?), it was composed of like 3-4 sets total, Carolina, Tex and 479er all just kind of Show Up to be badasses in the way The New Person would show up in an MCU movie...

Honestly watching this movie I kind of felt like it would have a twist ending. Like the credits would play and then itd zoom out to show the Reds and Blues post S17 in a movie theater watching this dramatic finale, because thats honestly what it felt like: The whole movie was a cheap facsimile of RvB as a whole. The fact that Trocadero wasn't allowed/signed on to make the music for this finale really does influence this movie, since they used a whole bunch of songs and osts that felt out of place (though I will admit Vale Deah softly playing as Grimmons said goodbye to each other did make me choke up a little)

Despite my negative review, I do still recommend watching it, since there was stuff I did like: Simmons in a leader role, Tex and the fun reveal during her fight with Tucker-Meta, Grif FINALLY getting to retire, Caboose as a whole was really well written, there IS good in this movie! And again it's not unwatchable bad, it just... kind of leaves a somber, sour taste in my mouth. This movie threw a whole bunch of stuff to the wall not to see what would stick but to break it all and leave for the insurance money. Just a "hey since we're sinking might as well make all these callbacks and break a bunch of stuff along the way."

Welp. Goodbye, RvB. At least this way I know that RT dies without riding your coattails any longer. And hey given that RvB technically has 3 endings (RvB17, Zero and RvB19) you can just take your pick on what you like best anyways. Quick edit no jutsu I forgor to mention there is the sequence at the beginning of the movie where it is implied RvB19 COULD also be one of the simulations in and of itself so. yeah you can in fact just take it as you will

#my thoughts are mostly negative but there Is some good in this movie. whatever #rvb #rvb19 #rvb restoration #rvb spoilers

[pariskim]

i wish i had the words to like. talk about my opinions and analyze it without feeling crazy i just . ughh. i hope in sunny s17 they dont treat jack like a joke. id say just kill him off but they probably aren't going to do that. i know apparently some people find his character funny but its just like. ouhh boy. its like hard to rewatch some eps knowing hes in them and knowing he's still in the show and allowed tp behave the same way. idk! maybe its having gone through similar stuff to joyce but especially after his appearance in s16 i just cant take it anymore of him showing up as a joke im just over it! hes overstayed his welcome as a joke and either i need sunny team to treat him as a serious character and deal with what they imply or stop having him show up and i dont care how. have him move away or something. i have a lot lot lot of notes on things joyce has said about her childhood and i just cant deal with seeing any more posts of people going well hes a funny character lol. not to me! to be real guys! not really!

#ask to tag #? tried not to delve into anything triggering.ive just been thinking about the topic a lot #ok to rb #if you want #iasip

[snarkylinda]

Ok I know I have made a bizzlion of these posts already but these ideas are too short for a one shot and I just think it's funny as shit so they'll keep coming: ok basically imagine that in s17, Emily has had enough and decides to actually call Reid- not only because he is genius and shit but because with all the stress over her she needs her confort sidekick, her traumatized right hand, her poor little meow meow that confessed to her he wanted to committ crimes- that one.

And when she calls he is all "oh hi Emily! Hadn't heard of you guys in a while, how are things going?" And she is all "that is....what I wanted to talk to you about but....first tell me, how are you doing?" "Actually really good! For the first time in almost 20 years I don't wake up screaming in the middle of the night! You were right, I needed some distance from the team and stuff..." "...that is....great Spence....but-" "It's amazing, my therapist said I was on the verge of a psycotic breakdown before the pandemic! But now it's like I am cured! Anyways, what did you need?" And Emily just throws the fucking phone out of the window lmao

#i know he is still with the FBI but let's be real- it's the BAU #criminal minds #spencer reid #emily prentiss

[heloflor]

Cartters and why it grew on me as the show went on

Aka “A recap/analysis of the evolution of Cartman and Butters’ friendship, mostly seen from Cartman’s angle, and why it eventually led me to ship Cartters despite their incredibly rocky beginning,” but that’s too long of a title.

THIS POST WAS WRITTEN BEFORE “STREAMING WARS” CAME OUT. AS OF YET, I HAVEN’T WATCHED THOSE SPECIALS SO NO MENTION OF THEIR EVENTS WILL OCCUR. Let’s see how well this post aged in the span of one special, shall we ?

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Tl;Dr : Like every Cartman relationship, his friendship with Butters is a very interesting relationship to explore, especially on Cartman’s side given how much he grew to appreciate the blond and let him get close to him, on top of slowly learning how to be a “decent” friend to him, leading to them becoming best friends starting with S17.

Though, the relationship still has tons of baggage from all the trauma Cartman subjected Butters to. And while Cartman has been shown to become a better friend towards Butters, it does leave the question of how much is Cartman capable of changing for a friend and, as a result, how healthy can their friendship become.

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First things first, as said in this post, I’ve known South Park for years, watched the full show almost two years ago and recently got back into the fandom as a lurker, looking up meta.

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So, when I got back into South Park two years ago, I found myself starting to ship St//yle and Cartters (and for some reason I really like those relationships as one-sided, or as I like to call it “Stan and Cartman pining after straight guys” but that’s not the topic here).

While the former didn’t surprise me since I love the “best friends to lovers” trope, the latter really did. I mean, I don’t like Ky//man due to how abusive it is, and yet here am I shipping Cartman with the kid he had tortured the most throughout the show.

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Although, I actually don’t want Cartters to be canon, or at least not now. I’d much rather see them focus on growing a healthy friendship, or at least as healthy as someone like Cartman is capable of, before even considering the idea of a romance.

Fun fact about that actually : when I got into SP back then, I didn’t look up Cartters stuff because I felt weird about shipping it. But back in February, when the interest for the show came back, I jumped right into that ship.

And after seeing many posts about this relationship + thinking about it a bit, I realized that they do have a meaningful relationship (that has no right being this wholesome for someone like Cartman but I digress). That’s what we’re going to talk about here.

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Btw, I hope I’m not stepping on anyone’s toes with this post since I don’t intend to actively participate in the fandom…

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This post will be cut in three main parts :

Firstly, the evolution of their relationship throughout the show, specifically how Cartman grew fond of Butters, with a few precisions on some episodes. This part is the longest and literally makes for about half the post

Secondly, a few words about what I interpret their sexualities to be, in particular talking about Cartman and his obsessive behavior.

Finally, what the two currently think of each other with a few ideas on how their friendship can develop + one last part about my opinion on other Cartman and Butters ships in case people are curious.

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Oh yeah and because I don’t want to make too many SP posts, some stuff won’t be that related to the topic but it’s still stuff I wanted to infodump about. So expect this post to be a bit off-topic at times.

Btw, a lot of stuff here was already said by other blogs before, but I still wanted to “compile” all I learned about these two and their relationship, on top of adding my own views on it.

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Have a Google Doc version since it’s probably much easier to read

VERY, VERY LONG POST AHEAD ! I’m talking close to 20k words !

(Oh and for those asking, the dots in-between paragraphs are due to my blog theme doing weird shit with spaces. Since this post would be way too bothersome to read without spaces, I’m not taking chances.)

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1. The evolution of their friendship

  Alright so, despite being a show that prides itself on comedy and satire first and foremost, South Park has quite some character development there and there (Stan and Kyle’s friendship, the 4th grade going from the whole class being bullies to only two of them, stuff like that). And one of the things that evolved is the relationship between Cartman and Butters, which was also impacted by Butters’ own character development.

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Speaking of which, a quick side-note about Butters’ character development to make it shorter afterwards (yes we’re starting off with something off-topic, that’s how much this post derails 😓) :

- In seasons 1-3, Butters was a non character. He was just prop that could be used there and there. Sometimes he was a bully, sometimes a victim. His name wasn’t even Butters back then.

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- Season 4 and especially season 5 is when Butters’ personality started to take form, with him being at the bottom of the social ladder, being viewed as the lamest kid in class and being bullied by everyone else.

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- Seasons 6-11 are basically the “Butters torture” seasons, with Butters being the punching bag of the show and always getting in trouble or suffering due to others. We could see him try to stand his ground there and there, but he always immediately fell back to being compliant. A good example of that is the phone call in “Majo//rine”.

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- Seasons 12-15 is when Butters starts standing up to himself, with the best examples being “Butters Bottom Bitch” and “Super Fun Time”. He’s still a victim that gets taken advantage of by the others, but he’s slowly growing. He’s also starting to be more of a douche/bully like in “The List”.

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- Season 16, more specifically “Butterballs” and “Going Native” is when Butters became the kid we now know him to be. A gentle and sweet kid who’s also an unhinged piece of shit that can go apeshit at any point. He’s also the only bully the grade has left along with Cartman, and grew to be quite the corrupted businessman. Like, compare him trying to do telemarketing in “Kenny Dies” (S5) to his ability to copy Cartman’s tone perfectly in “Go Fund Yourself” (S18).

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Now, onto the relationship between the two :

So, when the show started, their relationship was absolutely horrendous, there’s no denying that. Cartman was constantly messing with Butters for shit and giggles and got the kid tortured and almost killed quite a handful of times. Seriously, if I were to make a “top 10 worst things Cartman has ever done”, most spots would absolutely be stuff related to Butters (not the first 3-4 spots tho. Stuff like using Cthulhu, the Tenorman incident or the therapist’s wife murder are in my eyes much worse, especially the Cthulhu stuff).

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At that time though, there are already three notable things about Cartman :

1. The way he’s constantly thinking about messing with Butters specifically, plus the way he always seeks his help despite having kids like Clyde who’s just as easy to manipulate, does show that Cartman already had an unhealthy obsession with the kid. Yeah, Kyle isn’t the only one Cartman’s obsessed with.

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2. While I don’t consider “Awesome-O” to be a Cartters episode per say (Cartman was only being nice out of desperation for the tape, Butters had no idea it was Cartman and expressed anger towards the kid at the beginning), it is worth noting that Cartman never tries to get back at Butters for showing the tape to everyone.

And yes, the show doesn’t have that big of a continuity, but Cartman doesn’t even threaten Butters about it at the end of the episode. He just accepts defeat, as if capable of feeling some sort of “respect” when someone is doing something vengeful and clever, at least enough respect not to get revenge for it.

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3. In “Douche and Turd”, there’s that moment when the kids are in the gymnasium and Cartman insults Kyle, with Butters quickly parroting Cartman’s words before the two share a glance. In that scene, Cartman raises an eyebrow while smiling, as if thinking “I can use this”.

Makes me wonder if this is the moment Cartman realized Butters would always help him with his schemes, hence why he started latching onto that kid instead of asking any other gullible kid.

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Then, a few seasons later, we get to “The Death of Eric Cartman”, the episode with the ending that made me go “sigh…I’m going to start shipping these two, aren’t I…?” (although, despite seeing potential, I was barely into the ship at that point)

In this episode, Cartman thinks he’s dead because everyone is ignoring him, but Butters didn’t get the memo. As a result, the two spend the whole day together with Butters helping Cartman “move on”.

By the end of it, there’s that speech Cartman gives Butters about how the two of them became friends. And while Cartman immediately takes it back upon realizing he’s alive, it doesn’t change the fact that he seemed sincere when he gave that speech.

As a result, it really feels like this episode was the key moment when Cartman realized Butters isn’t that bad and can be kind of fun to be around. It feels like it’s past that point that Cartman starts softening up, at least a little bit.

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Following on this, you have “Smug Alert”, in which Cartman ends up trusting Butters with his life…sorta. Cartman goes into San Francisco with Butters being his only contact and way out, trusting Butters to pull him back once he reaches Kyle.

Btw, about that, can we take a second to appreciate Butters in this episode ? No because we always talk about Cartman saving Kyle, but not only did Butters help as well, he was just as much in danger as the two when the storm hit ! And Butters didn’t even particularly like or care for either of them at that point. He could’ve easily left them both to die, but he didn’t !

But yeah, long story short, between Cartman trusting Butters with something so important + him asking Butters to keep secret at the end, it seems that this episode really cemented Butters as Cartman’s sidekick/second-in-command, with Cartman not only going to him for any task moving forward but also letting him know the important details of his schemes, growing his trust for the kid.

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Then you have “Tonsil Trouble”. It’s not that big of a moment but it is worth mentioning how Cartman doesn’t immediately kill Butters right after the boy kisses him on the cheek in public. And on top of that, later on, Cartman asks Butters’ help to get inside Kyle’s room despite Cartman himself admitting he’s done it many times, meaning he doesn’t actually need help.

Tbh, I could definitely see Cartman feeling lonely at times during his schemes, and since Butters is quick to agree to help, he’s probably using it as an excuse to have some company. “Jewpacabra” is another good example that further fuels this headcanon.

Oh and after that, when Kyle says that Butters told him about sneaking into his room, Cartman gets mildly annoyed about it and doesn’t try to get back at Butters for it.

Again, not really big moments but it does seem like Cartman is at the very least seeing Butters as useful enough to tolerate and keep around, even if he gets annoyed with the kid.

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After that, you have “Super Fun Time”, another episode that’s pretty big when it comes to their relationship. This episode is the first time Butters really stands up for himself against Cartman, tho it’s a bit sad he’s only doing it in fear of punishment.

In this episode, there’s one moment I especially like : when they arrive at the “Phun Time” place, Cartman tries yet again to pry Butters off in fear of people calling them gay. After some struggle, Cartman lets out a “Jesus Christ” while having an expression showing that he’s actually understanding that he’s not getting out of there. And after that, he stops arguing about the hand and even tries to include Butters in his activities.

Basically, Butters sets a boundary in this episode and sticks to it, forcing Cartman to work around it instead of blasting his way through it like he usually does. That’s why I like this scene so much, it’s the moment we see Cartman realizing he has to compromise this time around if he wants to have his fun. In other words, Butters holds a bit of power over Cartman, as little as it might be, and it’s great to see it.

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There’s also the moment when they get back and see the police. Butters starts crying about how much trouble they’re about to be in while Cartman tries to calm him down so that they can sneak back in. What’s interesting here is that Cartman seems to feel genuine guilt about making Butters cry. Or at the very least he seems to be aware that he’s responsible for Butters’ tears and isn’t happy about it.

In any case, we see Cartman being capable of feeling some sort of regret after hurting another person.

For those asking : what makes me say Cartman shows regret is the sad expression he has after Butters “punches” him + after Butters explains why he’s not letting go of his hand.

Hell, while you could say that the first face is out of surprise from Butters punching him, Cartman was arguing about the hand in the second moment but immediately stops and caves to Butters’ demands, really making it seem like he feels guilty.

(Btw, it’s off-topic but Butters is the absolute MVP of this episode. Him throwing Cartman at the armed guy in frustration was especially delightful to see ! Stan showing off his dorky side was great too !)

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Last thing about this episode : I’ve seen people make jokes about how Cartman spends the entire episode bitching about holding Butters’ hand, but then the very next episode is “The China Problem” which has Cartman holding Butters’ hand while the kid is taking a bath. And joke aside, I do find it interesting that Cartman went so quickly to Butters and even trusted him with a gun.

Basically, despite SP not being about character arcs, if you view it from a “character development” point of view anyways, the fact that those two episodes are back-to-back really makes it seem like Butters’ badass actions in “Super Fun Time” left an impact on Cartman, hence why he would trust the kid with a deadly weapon or why he’s so disappointed about him shooting guys in the dick.

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Following this, in seasons 12-14, you have a few moments that aren’t particularly big but show Cartman being more chill. For example, you have his reaction to the “hickey” in “The Ungroundable”, which was pretty tame coming from Cartman. There’s also him being the one holding the gift in “Eat, Pray, Queef” when the 4th grade boys visit Butters, or Cartman being more sad than angry in “The Tale of Scrotie Mcboogerballs” when Butters tells the main 4 off.

Along with that, you have Butters growing more confident but also becoming more of a bully, which likely brought the duo closer by making Butters not be at the bottom of the social ladder anymore, all the while getting on Cartman’s good side (obviously him always being present in Cartman’s schemes helps as well).

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Then you have another important episode : “Poor and Stupid”.

Thing is, while Cartman can be very pathetic at times in front of the other kids, he’s also a very prideful person. But in this episode, there’s that scene where Cartman ends up in the hospital due to his own stupidity. And while he’s here, Butters is by his side, still encouraging him and comforting him, not once showing any negative judgment for what happened.

As a result, it feels like this episode is when Cartman realized that he can open up emotionally to Butters, which is seen later on in “Cartman finds Love”.

On top of that, there’s the fact that Cartman got rid of his plushies in “1%”, and said episode cemented that the plushies were Cartman’s emotional support. So once they’re gone, he needs another way to get support.

And yes, I know in “The Return of Chef” we see Butters at Cartman’s house to comfort him, but he barely approached the guy + Cartman didn’t confide much in him that time around.

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And finally, starting with seasons 16-17, especially 17, Cartman and Butters became best friends, with Cartman especially showing a lot more appreciation for the kid than you’d expect from him.

Btw I say especially S17 because, while Cartman is nicer in S16 as well, this season also ends with “Obama Wins”, in which Cartman tries to kill Butters for betraying him so that’s a big yikes. The fact that it was the last time he tried killing him doesn’t make it any less ok.

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Now, since their relationship hasn’t evolved that much since S17, let me give a compilation of moments from post-S16 episodes in which we see Cartman being a softie for this kid :

- Informative Murder Porn : The kids learn about their parents playing Minecraft through Butters explaining how his dad killed his mom. As he’s talking, he’s crying on the ground, with both Kenny and Cartman by his side putting a comforting hand on his shoulders. So we get to see Cartman trying to comfort Butters, aka trying to be there emotionally for him.

What’s also interesting here is the facial expressions. While Kenny is looking at Butters with a saddened expression, Cartman has an eyebrow raised. My interpretation of this, especially compared to the crying scene in “Super Fun Time”, is that the reason why Cartman is raising an eyebrow is because he doesn’t feel bad for Butters.

After all, Cartman is either a narcissist or a sociopath. Either way, it means he has incredibly limited empathy/sympathy/compassion. In “Informative Murder Porn”, Butters is crying due to something his parents did, aka something that has nothing to do with Cartman. So Cartman is physically incapable of feeling bad for Butters. Hence the mention of “Super Fun Time” since Cartman was responsible in this case and felt guilty.

But despite not feeling bad, Cartman still cares about Butters, so he puts a comforting hand on his shoulder nonetheless because he wants the kid to feel better.

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Another thing about this episode I’ve seen people point out is the fact that Cartman only takes the lead after seeing Stephen losing it, making it seem like he’s doing it for Butters (and possibly Stan since we see Randy messing around as well). But tbh it feels like a bit of a stretch ?

Idk, Cartman’s a bit weird being so helpful in such a situation in which he has nothing to gain from (the kids are worried about their parents killing each other. Cartman only has one parent, and as protective as he can be, I don’t think he views the men his mom sleeps with as any more threatening than usual in this scenario). Maybe he just likes the feeling of being in charge, especially since in this case he’s taking the leadership away from Kyle ?

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- The Magic Bush : While from an “episode” standpoint, I’m neutral on this one, I absolutely adore it from a “Cartters” standpoint. The entire episode is just Butters getting angry at Cartman, shoving him against a bathroom stall twice and in general yelling at him, and not only does Cartman let him get away with it, he also keeps helping Butters up until the end !

Hell, throughout the entire episode, Cartman tries to get himself out of trouble. But at the very end, Butters is still unsatisfied. And Cartman, who just spent days trying to wash his hands off, is willing to put himself right back into trouble just to make Butters happy.

And, again, Butters spent the whole episode yelling at Cartman and getting violent ! So this ending shows how Cartman’s “this is the last time I’m helping you” lines were all empty threats.

All-in-all, this episode is just Butters being the one taking the reins of this relationship for once and it is incredibly satisfying to see him able to get away with being so angry at Cartman !

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Another thing I find very interesting about this episode is the fact that, on a regular “Cartman and Butters” episode, Cartman gives orders and Butters follows without much questioning. But this time, Butters actually gets angry at Cartman’s scheme and starts doubting him.

That’s another fact about this episode I love : Cartman doesn’t just keep his scheme going to protect himself, he also has to prove that he’s trustworthy.

Sure, Cartman does his thing and when Butters questions it, he explains himself and tells Butters to trust him. But the important part is that Cartman does make things better for Butters. He tells Butters to trust him and then has to deliver on that trust. I really, really like that this episode took that direction.

In a way, I feel like this episode could be a step leading Butters to trust Cartman a little more when things go wrong in their schemes.

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Btw, it’s worth noting that at any point Cartman could’ve thrown Butters under the bus like he did so many times before. But he didn’t. And I think that’s also why him proving himself trustworthy works so well here. Instead of trying to screw over Butters, he’s trying to keep the kid by his side and help him, even if it means getting his hands dirty again right after getting away with his dumb idea.

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Oh and something very important I almost forgot : around the beginning of the “third act”, when Butters shows up at Cartman’s house to make demands, he points out how miserable the whole thing is making him (probably as a way to scold Cartman since, again, Butters’ here to make demands).

And when he does, Cartman asks Butters what’s wrong and listens when Butters starts ranting, quickly caving in to his demands. Cartman actually tries to be there for Butters on an emotional level, despite Cartman himself being terrible when it comes to emotions on a non-manipulative level.

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- Grounded Vindaloop : While there aren’t that many interactions between them as it’s more of a “main 4” episode, we do have quite a handful of moments in which Cartman shows actual concern.

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First of all, there’s the prank itself. Cartman in the past has been absolutely horrendous towards Butters and used to have a kick out of torturing the kid in the worst ways. As a result, the prank he pulls in this episode is very tame in comparison (hell even Stan points it out).

All Cartman does is make Butters believe he’s in virtual reality to have a laugh and make him do a few chores. And yet, Cartman refers to this prank as “the height of Butters torture”. To say Cartman toned it down with his pranks would be an understatement.

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Then, you have the scene when Butters goes apeshit.

Side note : A funny thing I noticed about Butters being unhinged is how the main 4 realize it one after the other. Stan finds out in “Butterballs”, Kenny in “Going Native”, Kyle in S20 and, in this episode, we learn in the cafeteria scene that Cartman has known for a while now given how he says the prank is a way to put Butters back in his place.

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So when Butters punches his dad, Cartman doesn’t find it hilarious or laughingly thinks about how much trouble Butters will be in. Instead, he understands that Butters is about to go apeshit and immediately tries to calm him down and bring him back to his place.

Also, while Cartman is obviously worried about getting himself in trouble, there is some concern for Butters as well :

When Butters says he hit a lamppost, Cartman tenses up in fear, only calming down when Butters says he’s back up. Same when Butters screams, which also has Cartman calling Butters’ name twice with the second time being in a very small voice.

Then, the next scene is in the hospital. But since Butters was in “the bad part of town” and only Cartman knew about it, it gives off the impression that Cartman was the one to call an ambulance.

On top of that, when Cartman shows up to scare Butters into silence, literally the first thing that comes out of his mouth when he appears is “are you okay ?”, showing concern for Butters’ well-being.

Then, a few minutes later in the episode, you have Cartman being pissed off at Butters by thinking he’s an AI messing with him. And yet Cartman still talks about helping Butters out.

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But more importantly, there’s that scene near the end of the episode. Stan, Kyle and Cartman are in Butters’ room with Stephen being furious about their presence. Stephen then proceeds to take his belt off, implying he’s going to hit his son with it.

When this happens, the other three look for a sec before Stan goes back to his phone call and Kyle follows suit immediately. But Cartman doesn’t. For a few more seconds, Cartman looks at the Stotches with worry before finally getting back to the phone call.

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Compare that last scene to that one episode in S6 in which Cartman prank calls the Stotches parents to get Butters beaten up for shit and giggles.

In the span of 12 seasons, Cartman went from making Butters suffer for fun to showing genuine worry seeing the very same action he once happily caused.

That, right here, is growth. Cartman at some point stopped seeing Butters’ suffering as funny and even starts showing concern at the thought of Butters living in an abusive home.

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- You’re Not Yelping : There are only two moments in this one but the first is pretty big.

Basically, we see Cartman abuse his power as a yelp reviewer to get free food. And early in the episode, we see him give food to Butters.

But the thing is, in their dialogue, there’s no indication that Cartman is asking for any money or service in exchange. Cartman here is straight up being a good friend to Butters for the sake of being a good friend, going through the trouble of going to a restaurant to get food Butters genuinely likes without asking the kid anything in return. It might be a small moment, but coming from Cartman, this is big.

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As for the second scene, you have the fact that he goes to Butters for emotional support and listens to the kid’s advice, which in a way shows that he values Butters’ opinion on top of seeing him as someone he can confide in.

(And it makes me realize I didn’t mention in “The Magic Bush” how, at the very beginning, Cartman insulted Butters’ bird video but was still able to catch the “drone” part, showing that, to a certain degree, he was listening)

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- Safe Space : There’s just a small moment at the beginning I want to talk about. When the episode starts, we have Cartman playing victim and asking PC principal to get a kid to filter the comment section of his social media. Cartman probably knows it’s a very mentally draining task to do.

At first, you have Kyle, Cartman’s worst enemy, who is asked to do it. Then, you have Wendy, who Cartman also butts heads with quite a lot. Finally, you have Butters, who can’t refuse due to his trauma with punishment.

Two things worth noticing here : 1. When Kyle shows up, Cartman tells him he thought about him first. When Wendy shows up, PC Principal says Cartman mentioned her quickly. When Butters shows up, there’s no indication on who called him here.

2. When Butters is asked to do the task, Cartman continues to cry and protests, saying he wanted a smart kid to do it. Now, Cartman did mention with Kyle and possibly Wendy that he knows they’re both organized people who as a result are fit for the job. But at the same time, this is Cartman we’re talking about. He’ll take any opportunity he can to get someone to filter his comments. So him protesting at first about Butters definitely feels a bit odd.

So with both those info in mind, it makes me wonder : who asked for Butters to be in the room ? Did they go through a conga-line of students who said no ? Did PC Principal just go “alright since two refused let’s go with your best friend, see if he agrees” ?

No because the fact that Cartman protests with crocodile tears still in his eyes shows that he’s unhappy about the choice. And given the task at hand + his first two choices being people he despites, it looks like Cartman is trying to defend Butters, to protect him from the task. Coming from Cartman, this is definitely big.

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And yes, I know Butters ends up doing the task and Cartman acts shitty towards him. Though, as weak of an argument as it is, Cartman isn’t as bad towards Butters here as he used to be in former episodes. His biggest flaw here is being too self-absorbed to notice Butters’ distress. On top of this, PC Principal being the worst to this poor kid makes Cartman look better in comparison in this specific scenario.

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- Tegrity Farms : The last time we’ve seen Cartman and Butters do a “get rich quick” scheme together so far, which gets me very curious as to how their dynamic will be in future schemes (“City People” doesn’t really count since Cartman wanted to do it alone and was more focused on one-upping Liane).

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Thing is, aside from the punch at the beginning, Cartman and Butters are the closest we’ve ever seen them to being equals here. Throughout the whole episode, they work in tandem, with Kyle awkwardly following them while trying to stop Cartman. Hell, when Butters confronts Cartman after the punch, he outright says that Cartman referred to the two of them as partners !

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Another interesting point is the context behind how Cartman acts here. A while ago, I remember seeing a few people point out how Cartman was the one who told Kyle about Ike smoking, giving off the impression he wanted Kyle to be involved.

Another person pointed out how Cartman relies on Kyle at the end to come up with a plan. So it’s likely he did half-blackmailed half-manipulated Kyle into helping them because Kyle’s a smart cookie.

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With that in mind, think of the context we’re given in the episode. Cartman and Butters are apparently in debt. Cartman is the head of the operation, meaning that he’s the one trying to think of a way out of this. And when you think about it, there’s three ways he can go :

1. Continue the same direction, which is risky. Cartman doesn’t like risk if he doesn’t have a way out.

2. Bail and let Butters take the fall.

3. Have a third person in the team, preferably someone smart to help, who could take the fall if it came down to this.

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Cartman could’ve gone either solution 2 or 3. But from the looks of it, the beginning of the episode explains why solution 2 isn’t an option unlike in previous episodes. Because, when Cartman throws Butters under the bus here, the kid gets absolutely furious and, were it not for Cartman taking a dumb, he probably would’ve punched him.

And it looks like Cartman realizes it. By that point, Cartman seemingly stopped taking his relationship with Butters for granted and clearly values his help. He also realized that Butters isn’t going to let himself be walked all over anymore, meaning Cartman could lose his friendship if he messes up too much.

So when Cartman finds himself in the situation we see here, instead of dumping every issue on Butters, he takes a third person to throw under the bus, making sure both himself and Butters have a way out.

(This kinda makes me think of how someone also pointed out that, when Kyle confronts the duo at Mackey’s house, Butters admits how Cartman told the 6th graders that Kyle was around. And as he’s talking, Butters is smiling. I’ve seen people question why he’s smiling and all I can imagine is Butters thinking “I’m not the scapegoat this time around !”)

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Honestly, this really makes me question how Cartman will act next time the two of them work together to get rich. Is he going to throw Butters under the bus when things get too complicated ? Or is he going to find a third party to use as scapegoat in order to keep Butters happy ?

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- Shots : There’s just one very small moment that I still want to point out : after we see the issue of Cartman refusing his shots and how it’s going to cost him public school, we get a scene in the cafeteria with Butters telling the other boys about the first third of the episode.

Basically, Cartman gets homeschooled, hates his new teacher and the first thing he does once the teacher’s gone is calling Butters to bitch about it.

(Which reminds me of S20 with him disliking the GhostBusters movie and warning Butters about it, but in that case it felt like the only reason he texted Butters was due to Butters’ importance this season with the whole “Weiners out” movement. He probably would’ve texted Kenny otherwise)

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I guess another thing worth mentioning here is how, within the adults, Stephen is the one taking the lead when it comes to vaccinating Cartman. While surprising to see him step up, it does make sense in the context of the parents being worried that Cartman carrying a disease could affect their own children. Since Cartman and Butters are best friends, Butters is the most at risk.

Although Stephen can go fuck himself with his “no parent wants to see their child hurting” line, given how horrible he is as a parent. And on that note, Liane’s punch was absolutely fantastic (and the only good thing she did in this episode).

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- Let Them Eat Goo : Probably the second-best episode from a Cartters POV only, behind Magic Bush. The whole episode just has Cartman being “Butters :D” the whole way through. Seriously.

(Fun fact : I actually saw some random scenes there and there before watching the whole show, one of which being from this episode. So when I stumbled across a clip of the two singing about Sloppy Joe’s, with my only show experience being the first 8 seasons, my first thought was like “So…when did Cartman and Butters become best friends exactly ? How’d that happen ?!”. But then I watched the whole show and yeah, it made more sense.)

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The kids’ plot opens with the two of them happily singing about lunch together, which also shows that they don’t just hang out for schemes, they’re actual friends.

Then, when Cartman has his heart attacks, Butters is the only kid who shows genuine concern about it, especially the second time (I’d say it’s pretty sad that only one person cares but at the same time it’s Cartman so fuck him). He’s also the one taking care of Cartman, with Cartman never protesting about it.

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In general, Cartman directs all his anger towards the girls and I’m pretty sure he doesn’t insult Butters once here. All he does is wanting to have lunch with the kid and sing about food together.

Even after learning from Butters that the whole school lied to him, he never gets angry at him directly, despite Butters clearly being terrified at the thought of Cartman screaming betrayal at him, which makes sense considering the last time he betrayed Cartman was in “Obama Wins” with Cartman trying to kill him for it.

I could say more about Butters’ fear in this episode but I’m keeping Butters’ POV for the third part of this post.

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Lastly, this episode has the third scene of “Cartman trying to be there for Butters emotionally”, and I’d say this one is even bigger than the previous two.

While in the first one (“Informative Murder Porn”), Butters was crying on the ground so it was evident he was suffering, and in the second one (“The Magic Bush”) he explicitly tells Cartman he’s miserable, here, in “Let Them Eat Goo”, Butters doesn’t say a thing. He’s just less enthusiastic than usual.

So not only does Cartman notice, showing he’s been paying attention to Butters and how the kid expresses himself, Cartman also asks by himself if something is bothering Butters !

Cartman, Eric fucking Theodore Cartman, was capable of noticing that something was off about another person, realizing it could be emotional distress and asking the other person about it, very much willing to listen to that person’s problems and see if there’s something he could do about it. Eric Cartman !

Imagine being someone Cartman tries to comfort and being there to listen vent. Let’s just say you gotta be pretty special for this kid to be like that.

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And another thing about it, though it could just be due to the camera moving from one character to the other at each line : everytime Butters is done talking, Cartman seems to take a second before replying, as if making sure Butters said everything he wanted to say/trying to avoid interrupting Butters. But again, it could also just be due to the camera shifting from one to the other.

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In any case, we get to see Cartman noticing emotional distress and being willing to lend an ear without being judgmental/mocking or using it as future blackmail. Coming from Cartman, this is really big.

And when you think about it, Cartman actually hasn’t ripped on Butters in quite a while, or at least not to the same extent he used to.

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- City People : Not a lot to say here aside from the fact that, while their interactions are short, they’re pretty wholesome (way too wholesome from someone like Cartman).

First off, Cartman shows up at Butters’ house with a saddened expression, telling Butters he needs his help as if asking “do you have time right now ?”, or at least it can be read that way.

Also, compare that to the Christian band episode or “Go God Go”. In both those instances, Cartman shows up with a serious expression, tells Butters “I need you for X right now so do Y” without giving him the choice and then expects the kid to do the task without question. In “City People”, he’s being a lot softer and opens up very easily.

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Then, Cartman doesn’t mind the physical contact as comfort (until Butters says something that bothers Cartman) and is quick to tell Butters everything, trusting him to keep it secret.

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He also compliments Butters’ photography skills, which is a pretty big compliment coming from someone who sees photography as an art (as we see mostly in “Cartman Sucks”. Yeah I know, not the best episode to talk about in a Cartters post but you gotta do what you gotta do).

Btw Cartman had literally no reason to compliment Butters, the kid was already willing to help him. He just gave out a sincere compliment because he felt like it.

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Finally, you have the commercial filming scene. When Cartman enters Clyde’s house, he comments on the size and asks Butters’ opinion on it. Thing is, I feel like, was this episode made in an earlier season, Cartman wouldn’t have asked Butters’ opinion or would’ve told him to shut it had he spoken. But here, Cartman wants Butters’ opinion in the video. He wants to include Butters.

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- Credigree Weed St Patrick’s Day Special : Not a lot here either aside from two small moments.

First, you have that scene with Butters being the only kid giving a shit about the holiday. But despite visibly not caring, Cartman still says something positive about it to Butters, possibly to make the kid happy instead of ruining his enthusiasm.

In a way, it reminds me of “Nightmare on Face Time”, with Kenny and Cartman stumbling across Butters and Jimmy, Cartman taking interest in Butters’ clothing and, despite clearly finding the costume shitty, Cartman still says something positive about it. And when he says something sarcastic to Kenny about it, it doesn’t come off as mean spirited or mocking, like he's not saying it and then laughing about it. He’s playing nice to Butters, just like in the St Patrick’s Day episode.

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The second moment is the prison scene with the main 4 using the opportunity to visit Butters. Here, Cartman’s the first one to talk, asking Butters how the holiday’s treating him (I guess Cartman doesn’t want to ask “are you okay ?” in public out of pride or something) and lets out an unconvinced “cool” after Butters answers him.

Also, it might be just due to them being closer to the bars but Stan and Cartman take a second longer to turn around in comparison to Kyle and Kenny. Also also, Cartman spends the whole episode sounding dead inside, and him asking Butters how he’s doing is the only time there’s some emotion in his voice.

(Side note : I kinda love how Cartman clearly doesn’t care about the holiday but still dresses up for the occasion. He’s just that extra)

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On top of this evolution with Cartman softening up over time, I’ve seen people point out how Cartman is a lot more patient towards Butters than towards any other kid.

There are many instances in the show, I think mostly starting around S12-13, where Butters says something and Cartman reacts with mild annoyance, sighing and rolling his eyes before moving on

Examples include the deleted scene of “The Tale of Scrotie Mcboogerballs” (or at least I think it’s from this episode. It’s the thing with the main 5 + Jimmy and Ike making a sentence with random gross words), the garden of betrayal scene in the Black Friday trilogy or their exchange around the middle of “Dead Kids”, to name a few. Were it any other kid, Cartman would be yelling in those scenes.

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Along with that, Cartman lets Butters get away with a lot.

The best examples are the kiss from “Tonsil Trouble” or literally everything about “The Magic Bush”, the latter also showing that, whereas Cartman tends to yell back when someone angry is confronting him (unless the person is visibly stronger/more dangerous in which case he knows to be careful), when it comes to Butters specifically, all he does is gently repeat Butters’ name until the kid calms down.

We see him do it in “A Song of Ass and Fire” and “Where my Country Gone” as well. Btw in that last episode, during the whole scene of Cartman trying to find a Canadian girl for Butters, Cartman acts in a very gentle manner and it’s pretty sweet.

In that last episode, it’s also pretty funny how Cartman, who has been shown to be quite the romantic (“Cartman Finds Love”, “Tweek X Craig”) suddenly doesn’t have time for a slow romance when Butters is involved in it.

Oh yeah and fun fact, in “Let Them Eat Goo”, we see Butters trying to calm down Cartman by gently repeating his name, copying what Cartman does with him.

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Another good episode showing Cartman being a softie is the beginning of “Going Native”, which is honestly very funny.

First off, you have Cartman seeing Butters beat the shit out of Scott before locking himself in the bathroom, and Cartman goes on to tell the other boys about it, as if asking them for help.

Then Butters goes home and has a talk with his parents and, when we go back to the kids after school, they’re all playing outside until Cartman shows up, yet again talking about Butters. This implies that, when school ended, the first thing Cartman did was check on the kid (I mean they were next-door neighbors back then so I guess it wasn’t that big of a trip). And again, he seems to be asking the others for help.

It’s also worth noting that Butters apparently called him fat, which is something that not only usually makes Cartman go berserk (Tenorman, the therapist, that one kid he locked to a pole etc) but is also something Butters almost never says, unlike for example the “fatass” insult Stan and Kyle used often enough for Cartman to now let it slide. After all, we know from early seasons that he clearly hates the “fatass” nickname. He only lets it slide because he’s used to it despite hating it.

But yeah, despite the “fat” insult, Cartman still wants to help Butters.

And the funniest part of this : when Kyle tells Kenny to go help Butters, Cartman gets all passive-aggressive about Kenny’s help, calling him “mister perfect” and telling him to “rescue Butters”. It makes Cartman sound so jealous ! And even Kyle then raises a curious eyebrow, as if wondering what the hell just went through Cartman’s head ! I love this moment and how dumb it is !

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Yet another random thing I didn’t mention in the episodes list is “Sarcastaball”, with Cartman being supportive of Butters and going to him for advice.

And no I’m not including the cum joke as proof of them being close. Sure, it’s a sex joke between the two, which are kinda starting to pile up when you think about it, but in context neither of them knew what it was. Also the other kids drink it as well so…

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To finish up with this part, here’s some of my thoughts on Post-Covid Cartman + a few interesting things about his interactions with Butters/Vic :

First off all, know that I have no pity for Cartman. I know he’s a child raised in a bad environment and whose mental illnesses make him highly struggle with empathy/sympathy/compassion.

But at the same time, literally one of the main jokes about SP is the kids being the smart ones, especially compared to the adults. When Cartman commits a crime, he knows what he’s doing, he just doesn’t care. Hell, why do you think he’s always making sure to have a way to escape consequences ?

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Ultimately, the only thing I feel bad about when it comes to Cartman is the one thing he has no control over : His family life.

Him being raised by a single mom who should have never been a parent to begin with, on top of not only having an absent father but also losing the only father figure he ever had (Chef). After watching “City People” (and being disappointed by Liane’s final choice), I actually wanted to make a post about the Cartmans. Not sure if I’ll ever write it but in any case I’d rather wait until I watch “Streaming Wars” anyways in order to have more to talk about.

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With that in mind, regarding Cartman’s fate in Post-Covid, I don’t feel bad about him being homeless. Sure, I was surprised that someone like him wasn’t able to become successful since Cartman’s the kind of person who will succeed, no matter how little he deserves it (we sure live in a society), but still, I don’t feel bad.

It’s actually pretty interesting tho how a show that usually goes with the “realistic approach” in how characters are handled suddenly decided to give Cartman what he deserves, not what someone so corrupted would realistically have.

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Oh and don’t go telling me Cartman redeemed himself, because he sure as hell didn’t ! If he was reformed, he would’ve acknowledged all the horrible shit he did as a kid, especially to Kyle, and then apologize for it. But instead, he swept it all under the rug and acted like a victim when he was rightfully called out on it.

And he kept that victim mentality throughout the entire special, changing the narrative to make Kyle look bad, and some people actually bought into this act and talked shit about Kyle after the special aired ! Like guys ! This is Cartman we’re talking about here !

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And let’s not forget how he spent the entirety of the first special messing with Kyle by bringing up his Judaism at any chance. Also, while his family do seem to be good people, it’s obvious that they’re not that great.

I mean, first off Yentl seems to have a bad impression of Kyle right off the bat, showing that Cartman lied to her about his childhood to make the guy look bad.

Then, when they show up at Kyle’s doorstep, Yentl tells the kids that everything’s going to be alright before Kyle agrees to house them (btw Cartman using his family to make Kyle feel bad and house them).

The kids are also shown to have a victim mentality, likely spread by Cartman, and are all shown to swear, including the baby. And sure, all the kids in SP swear, but still.

Plus, one of the kids is overweight which, most of the time, is a sign of negligence, especially for a kid that young (he seems to be around 7-8).

Again, I do believe that Cartman’s wife and kids are good people. But they’re definitely not perfect and we can see Cartman’s influence on them.

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Oh and another thing I’d like to point out because it bothers me a bit : no, Cartman technically did not sacrifice his family. Cartman’s family sacrificed themselves.

Cartman was still arguing about saving them and killing Kyle, and it’s Yentl and the kids who convinced him to give up on this plan.

They’re the one who told Cartman it was okay, they’re the ones who promised that there was still a chance for them to meet in another timeline. It wasn’t all Cartman’s idea to sacrifice them, it was Yentl and the kids who stepped up and told Cartman that things were going to be alright, no matter what changes could be brought to the past. Had they not convinced Cartman to agree with Stan and Kyle, Cartman would’ve gone ahead with his original plan.

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Long story short : Adult Cartman is still the same monster he was as a kid, he’s just better at hiding it.

Ultimately, the only genuine thing about him is his love for his family. It’s the only part where he seemed truly honest. Everything else, he was just using people.

Heck I’ve seen people point out how his conversion to Judaism could be due to his former views on Kyle that might have led him to fetishize the religion or use it as a way to cope after “losing Kyle”, things like that.

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Now, with the “Cartman is the worst” rant out of the way, here’s a few interesting things about how Cartman and Butters/Vic interact in the bathroom scene :

1. The fact that Cartman was able to find Vic more easily than Stan and Kyle despite searching for a shorter time actually makes a lot of sense. Stan and Kyle just went where the destruction happened and tried to follow the general direction of where Vic was last seen.

Cartman on the other hand is a con artist, just like Vic. So he probably asked himself “If I wanted to scam people easily, where would I go ?” and immediately knew where Vic was.

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2. I’ve seen people point out in a youtube comments section how Cartman is the only one who was able to “break” the persona Vic created of himself and bring back the old Butters, shown by the “Oh Hamburgers”.

I think the explanation suggested was that Cartman was able to see through Vic’s mask due to being a liar with a fake personality himself.

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3. Kind of a side note really but looking at this scene, I feel like this is the moment Vic recognized Stan and Kyle. Like, earlier in the asylum, he went over their names very quickly and probably wasn’t much interested in them to begin with anyways.

But in this scene, he very much recognized Cartman, and there’s only one Kyle that Cartman is obsessed with. So I feel like Cartman mentioning Kyle is when Vic made the connection between the “Stand and Kyle” guys who knew his child nickname and the Kyle Cartman hates so much and wants to kill.

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4. Something pretty funny : the fact that Cartman at the very least knows that Vic was in an asylum, meaning he’s dangerous to a certain degree, and yet Cartman has no issue immediately telling him about how he’s trying to save his wife and kids.

Like, Cartman, buddy, the guy in front of you is incredibly dangerous and possibly holds a huge against you from all the shit you did to him as a kid. Why are you telling him your weak point you absolute moron ?

Idk, it just amuses me that Cartman still confides in Vic so easily despite how long it’s been since the last time they saw each other.

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5. Throughout both specials, we see three sides of Cartman : his “love my family” side, his “nice rabbi persona” side that he uses to manipulate others, and his “true selfish” side, which is when he acts like he did as a kid.

For most scenes, he plays nice until pushed to a point where his true side comes out, the best example being his fight with Kyle in the church. But in that bathroom scene, Cartman doesn’t hide behind any persona.

When he confronts Vic, he talks exactly the same way he did when they were kids. It’s the only time in the whole episode where he doesn’t even try to pretend to be anyone else but himself. And sure, it can be seen as a scare tactic, bringing back Vic’s trauma to scare him into helping. But at the same time, it is pretty interesting how the only time Cartman acts without a mask is when alone with Vic.

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Alright, that was all I had to say about the evolution of their friendship and whatnot. If you’re still here and reading, I promise the other two parts aren’t as long and I’m sorry this turned out to be so big. I like rambling and get too passionate about stuff ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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2. The duo’s sexualities and genders (and how Cartman is obsessive)

  So, let’s start off by talking about Cartman’s sexuality.

Basically, I’m pretty convinced that he’s bi/pan, and I’m pretty sure it’s canon at that point ?

Like, you had several instances throughout the show of him showing attraction to both guys and gals, with my favorite example being “Le Petite Tourette” due to him admitting in the same scene that he has a crush on a girl and touched dicks with one of his cousins (though the latter does raise the question of how old was the other cousin and as a result how consensual the action was…).

And then you have “Tweek X Craig” with a whole side plot of him denying his attraction to guys, only to cave in at the end. So doesn’t that mean he’s canon queer ?

(btw I’d like to point out that in this episode you also have Stan being pretty focused on Tweek and Craig’s relationship. While the other boys were just surprised but then moved on, Stan spends the whole episode asking questions like “what make people gay ?” and “if it happened to them, can it happen to me ?” Due to that, I tend to believe that Stan’s canon sexuality is questioning)

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Something else worth pointing out in this episode : in general, Cartman is a huge bigot. We all know that (and looking at the episodes he shares with Tolkien, I sometimes wonder if he even views Tolkien as a human being. That’s how much of a bigot he is).

But in “The Hobbit”, we see him partly defending Lisa Burger after the boys made fun of her for her weight, though he follows by insulting her looks. So from this, we can assume that Cartman is a bigot towards everyone but fat people, because he himself is fat.

Well guess what about “Tweek X Craig” : After the first montage, we see Cartman think about their relationship, with Cupid him showing up, and Cartman proceeds to say something along the lines of “Just because I don’t understand it doesn’t mean I have to be against it”. Carmtan. Eric fucking Cartman said that !

So the fact that Cartman isn’t intolerant towards gay couples, the same way he isn’t intolerant towards fat people, does raise questions as to how he feels towards guys.

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Although, to me, the biggest proof of Cartman’s bisexuality/pansexuality is his obsession with both Kyle and Butters. But I’m going to develop it a few lines down.

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Ultimately, I feel like Cartman is either bi or pan.

He’s aware that he’s attracted to guys, though he tries to deny it. At the same time, I don’t think he realizes that the way he acts towards Kyle and Butters could be due to some form of attraction, though I can’t really bring myself to see his current “attraction” to Kyle and Butters as romantic. But it’s still a form of attraction nonetheless.

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As for Cartman’s gender, I do think he’s cis, though he absolutely enjoys women clothes. But thing is, whenever he cross-dresses, it’s for show (the “insufferable teenage girl” thing in S6, the clip in “Butterballs”, a persona in “W.T.F”, him singing and dancing in “Awesome-O”). So I’d say he’s more of a drag queen rather than genderfluid, tho I do like the genderfluid headcanon.

Furthermore, in “The Cissy”, Cartman pretends to be a trans girl for bathroom privileges. And in that one occasion where he has to pretend to be a girl on a daily basis, he only does the bare minimum, putting a bow on while continuing to show his masculinity.

The fact that this instance in particular is the one time he doesn’t put any effort in his appearance is what leads me to believe that he’s cis, though gender non-conforming for sure.

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Now, for Cartman’s obsessions with Kyle and Butters, because this is honestly something I find incredibly interesting but I don’t want to make too many posts so you’ll have to suffer through reading about it here. I’m going to try keeping this as short as possible by just explaining how Cartman expresses those obsessions and some differences I find interesting.

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- Cartman’s obsession with Kyle is mostly shown through him being a stalker.

He once said he sneaks into Kyle’s room on the regular (tbh “kid shows up uninvited into another kid’s bedroom” is pretty common in SP), in a deleted scene of “Naughty Ninjas” he admits to having recorded every discussion he has had with Kyle for a whole year in case he gets blackmail material, and there are three scenes in which we see him being able to predict what Kyle is going to say (“Kenny Dies” I think when he sends Butters to talk to Stan and Kyle, I think “Obama Wins” with Cartman calling Kyle while he’s talking to Ike and guessing what Kyle was talking about, and a deleted scene from “Grounded Vindaloop” with a phone call between Kyle and Butters)

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A result of that which we often see is Cartman’s ability to manipulate Kyle. If Cartman wants Kyle to do something, he will get Kyle to do it. Cartman knows exactly which buttons to press to get Kyle to act a certain way and is capable of using this on the regular.

I could say more about this but this post is already way too long so I’m putting it in the Ky//man part of the “my opinion on other ships” bonus at the very end. Expect negativity though.

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- When it comes to Butters, there are three things that could be related to Cartman being obsessed with him. From least creepy to most creepy :

1. Butters easily comes to Cartman’s mind. Like in “Fishsticks” when he keeps imagining new scenarios in his head and, whenever someone who wasn’t on the scene shows up, it’s always Butters first. Or how in early seasons he was already often asking Butters for help despite kids like Clyde being around.

(btw, just wanted to say I’m always surprised when I see people say that Butters is the kid who acts the most like a kid when Clyde is right there. I mean come on ! Clyde is the definition of “awkward, impressionable and kind of a loser” kid. Especially in newer seasons in which Butters is a lot more unhinged and corrupted)

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2. Sort of a continuation but in early seasons, Cartman was very focused on pranking Butters specifically. Compare that to Scott Malkinson, who some people call “the new Butters” due to his status as bottom of the social ladder. Cartman doesn’t give a shit about Scott and never goes out of his way to prank him.

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3. Cartman has a huge fixation on Butters’ body, in particular his dick. We can see it through not only his tendency to have Butters either naked or cross-dressing during his schemes, but also a few instances of him trying to take a peek of Butters’ dick like in “Proper Condom Use” or even more recently with “Return of Covid” with how he interrupts Vic mid-piss. Another good example is “T.M.I”.

Then you also have some creepy behavior like him smelling Butters’ underwear in “Stunning and Brave” (btw last time I watched this scene I noticed that Cartman bites his lip while sniffing. Like, please don’t ever do that again kid) or “Cartman Sucks” in which, while I agree that Cartman was doing what he did to humiliate Butters, given his track record, I’d argue it says something that the first thing that came to his mind was putting Butters’ dick in his mouth of all things.

On that same note, when talking about how privacy is gone in “The Magic Bush”, he mentions “your wiener, my balls”. And given how often he talks about his balls (especially when negotiating) + his track record with Butters’ dick, it does make me wonder if the choice of words here was deliberate.

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I’ve also seen a post half-jokingly theorize that Cartman might find Butters’ body attractive, and honestly it does hold water.

The idea is due to the episodes “Douch and Turd” and “Canada on Strike”, both of which have a scene with Cartman using Butters’ body as a way to attract people to his cause. I’d say “Canada on Strike” especially due to some naked shots in the “What What in The Butt” clip + the fact that at some point during the clip we see Stan and later on Cartman sitting on a chair in front of the computer. Compared to Stan, Cartman is really leaning towards the screen.

And yeah, between those two instances and the way Cartman in general tries to get Butters naked or look at his dick, it does give the impression that he finds Butters attractive.

And in the case of the two episodes mentioned, maybe he assumes that everyone finds Butters attractive since Cartman is still struggling with his sexuality. Basically, he may not realize that he’s physically attracted to Butters so he simply believes that Butters is good-looking.

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Btw, I insist on the “physically attracted”. I’m not calling it romantic love in any way. If anything, it’s Cartman liking Butters body but being too much of a mess to know how to express this attraction in a healthy way. All he knows is that he likes looking at Butters’ body, so he tries to do it as often as possible.

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(And I have to be honest, for a while I thought he had calmed down on that aspect. But looking at the Covid special, he really didn’t. It’s just that now that he and Butters are friends, he can’t go around asking the boy to strip. Hell, Butters has enough confidence now to say no and even maybe tell him to fuck off.)

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- On top of those, both kids were victim of sexual harassment and sexual abuse from Cartman, showing how far those obsessions can get. And while you do have instances like “Cartman Sucks” and “Imaginationland” in which Cartman doesn’t seem to realize he’s doing something sexual or at the very least isn’t doing it with sexual intent in mind, it doesn’t excuse the fact that he’s sexually harassing and assaulting those kids.

Then there’s also for example Cartman’s journal in “Fractured But Whole”. From what I remember, there are four sexual drawings and every single of contains either Kyle or Butters in it. I think one of them also depicts Butters with a large dick but I’m not sure and I don’t really want to check that detail, for obvious reasons.

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Another thing he possibly does with both is physical contact. Like, in general Cartman is a pretty touchy person, but he kinda feels extra touchy towards Kyle and Butters specifically I think ?

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As a result of all that, I tend to interpret Cartman’s views on them as some sort of non-sexual lust, if that’s even a thing that exists.

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- Finally, I find it very interesting how, despite both being kids Cartman obsesses over, the way he views them and acts towards them is incredibly different.

To keep it short : when Cartman wants someone to mess with or to blame for his issues/be paranoid about, he goes to Kyle. When Cartman seeks emotional support and someone he can trust and confide into but also work on good terms with, he seeks Butters. Basically, he thrives off of Kyle’s negative attention and Butters’ positive attention. Idk, I just find this interesting.

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Oh and one last thing that I’ve seen being mentioned for Butters in a few fics and it’s incredibly fucked up but at the same time very much in character coming from Cartman : the fact that Cartman is a n*zi, Kyle is Jewish and Butters is blond with possibly blue eyes, aka what a n*zi would call an “aryan”.

So the two kids that Cartman is obsessed over are what he considers to be the worst in humanity and the best in humanity. I both hate this info and find it really interesting from a characters’ POV.

And on a side note, this could also explain his fixation on Butters’ body, in a very, very messed up way.

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Now, a few words about Butters’ sexuality because we’re here to talk about a relationship after all : Tbh, I’m not really sure if Butters is straight or bi/pan ? Like, he absolutely finds women attractive, that’s not even a question.

But when it comes to guys, I see people say that he has bi tendencies but they don’t bring up any examples and the only thing I can think of are the “bi-curious” jokes, in which I’m not even sure Butters knows what he’s talking about ?

Does anybody remember any instances of Butters showing a liking for guys, aside from calling himself bi-curious/bike-curious or looking gay due to Cartman being obsessed with him ? I’m genuinely curious here.

And no, the other characters calling him gay as an insult doesn’t count. That’s not even something I’ll use to justify Stan’s sexuality despite thinking he’s questioning it.

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(For those who are likely confused as to how I can ship Cartters if I don’t see Butters as bi/pan : basically I’m the type to stick with canon, probably a little too much, so I like when my headcanons are backed up by canon. But if Butters turns out to be straight in the show, it won’t stop me from seeing him as bi in fanon even if it’s not canon-compliant)

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As for Butters’ gender, I believe he’s cis.

Speaking of which, because I feel the need to talk about it : my biggest pet peeve about the fandom has to be how popular the “character” of Ma//jorine is.

Now don’t get me wrong, I get it. Butters is a popular character and people project their own gender euphoria on him because they have a golden opportunity to do so. Trust me, I’ve been there (*cough* trans Vin//nie Dako//ta *cough*). On top of that, I’m sure many people simply enjoy her design.

And even without all that in mind, in terms of trans headcanons, I absolutely love the idea of Princess Kenny being a trans woman in a SOT AU. So I’m really not one to talk and can’t blame people for simply having headcanons.

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But it doesn’t change the fact that there are things about Ma//jorine that bother me and even make me uncomfortable, though that’s very much a “me” problem.

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Let me explain (this whole part is going to be in italics so it’s easy to skip if you don’t want to listen to a negative rant about her. And yeah I know this could’ve been its own thing but I’m not making a post just to talk shit about a harmless headcanon) :

- Starting with the biggest problem and the one thing that makes me genuinely uncomfortable : Cartman.

To put it simply, Butters has cross-dressed on three occasions in the show. In “Douche and Turd” with Cartman making him dance the hula, in “Ma//jorine” with the boys sending a spy amongst the girls due to Cartman thinking they have a future-telling device, and the Superheroes trilogy with Cartman forcing Butters to dress up as Courtney Love and take suggestive pictures with a naked homeless man.

You might notice a pattern.

Every single time Butters cross-dressed, it had to do with one of Cartman’s schemes. Worse, the last one (Courtney Love) had Butters protest about it on top of having the other boys calling the plan “taking naked pictures of Butters”.

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To keep it short and to the point : we know Cartman is fixated on Butters body + Cartman struggles with his sexuality. In other words, it’s not Butters who enjoys wearing women’s clothes, it’s Cartman who enjoys seeing Butters in those.

And that’s why it’s making me uncomfortable. When I see art of Ma//jorine, instead of thinking about Butters expressing himself, all I can think of is Cartman preying on this poor kid.

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Also, regarding the episode “Ma//jorine” itself, I’m part of the “Butters was uncomfortable the whole time” crowd.

Like, 1. He was clearly stressed and uncomfortable with the plan.

2. The line “You don’t know how hard it is to be me” doesn’t have to do with his gender (tho I can understand why people resonate with it) but with the fact that this is early seasons Butters. He’s a victim to everyone else. So of course it’s hard to be him ! Imagine having such a childhood !

3. Him having so much fun with the girls yet again comes from the fact that literally nobody likes him, so of course he’s going to latch onto the very first group that’s kind enough to accept him.

4. Once he leaves the party, the first thing he does is throw the wig away.

Ultimately, the only time Butters expressed desires to wear feminine clothes is in “The Cissy” with the tutu at the end, plus the fact that he casually mentions how he’s holding his pee now because the bathroom situation confuses him. But I don’t think those instances are ever brought up again ?

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- Something that isn’t an issue exclusive to Butters and can be found in pretty much any fandom anyways : character feminization.

Basically, the fact that people still try to put heteronormative ideas into gay couples, causing one of them to be the “man” and the other the “woman” of the relationship. As a result, some characters get their personalities completely messed with in a very bad way, especially the characters who end up feminized.

Again, that’s not an SP-exclusive issue. Literally every fandom has this problem. And while the SP fandom is old and apparently knows better nowadays, there are still posts circulating about the feminization of Kyle, Butters and Tweek.

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Basically, for Butters, you have the issue of “Kenny and Cartman are much manlier than Butters so surely he’s the woman in the relationship !” As a result, some people seem to use Ma//jorine as an excuse to make Butters be even more of a girl, which is pretty messed up.

Tbh, I don’t blame the fans of Ma//jorine for this, as this is clearly a minority. Plus, a while ago on the main SP tag, there have been a lot of Bu//nny posts that had both Kenny and Butters wear women’s clothing, in which case I don’t see any issue since both are shown as more feminine.

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All-in-all, I think the biggest issue with Butters is the fact that both Cartman and Kenny had been seen willingly wearing women’s clothes and enjoying it. And yet Butters, the kid that was forced into those clothes, is the one who gets feminized. Again, it definitely stems from heteronormativity, with those people not understanding that guys can be both masculine and feminine.

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Also, guys, a man can take the lead in a relationship and be more masculine while at the same time being gender non-conforming or even being a bottom. Because that’s another issue people have with heteronormativity (I’m talking generally with that last one. I’m not one to age-up characters so I don’t want to think about SP kids and sex stuff . I don’t care that the show itself put those kids in sex situations, it’s still uncomfortable to watch).

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- For those who like her mostly due to her design : there’s that background girl character in the show called Kelly Pinkerton-Tinfurter. It’s that blonde girl with two pigtails, a pink shirt and a scarf.

For the longest time, before learning her name, I called this girl “Ma//jorine-haired girl”. Because let’s be real, while not identical, the hair is pretty similar. You can probably guess where I’m going with this.

For those who like Ma//j for the design only, what about Kelly ? Heck, you can give her more than the one pair of clothes she has in the show. And you can draw her without her pigtails as well (hope this doesn’t come off as condescending since that’s not the intention here…I’m very much aware that using Kelly isn’t the same as using Butters. But at the same time, I find it to be a good compromise).

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Another good thing about using Kelly as Ma//jorine would be the personality.

Whenever people draw Ma//j, it kinda feels like they’re taking Butters’ early seasons personality and add a feminine touch to it. But Butters has gone through major character development throughout the show and is now very different from the kid he used to be in S8-9.

(Imma be honest, I never read a single fic with Ma//j in it, so I really can’t speak for how she’s characterized in fics. But looking at fanart, she does tend to give a “Butters’ pre-development self” vibe)

Oh and Butters also turned out incredibly misogynistic, which I should’ve point out earlier when talking about him not being comfortable with cross-dressing but anyways.

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So yeah, Kelly as a character is a blank slate. All we know is she’s a girl and likes board games. You could easily give her Butters’ early seasons personality and make it more feminine. And that way, you can even have both Butters and Ma//j exist at the same time.

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(also, hope it doesn’t come off as rude but isn’t it usually a fandom thing to focus on side characters, using the fact that they’re a blank state to flesh them out and make them actual characters ?)

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Lastly, regarding the trans headcanons, because I’m very much aware that the main appeal of Ma//j is the trans rep : what if Kelly was a trans girl as well ?

At some point while thinking about Kelly, I looked up the boys at school and found out about “unnamed blond boy with red shirt”

Remember the early seasons episode with the kids in the bus stuck on a cliff ? That boy is the kid who leaves the bus and gets eaten. Apparently, that was his only appearance in the show. But since the whole episode turns out to be a dream within a dream, maybe he’s still alive ?

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On top of that, I found out that, while Kelly’s first appearance was in “Stupid Spoiled Whore”, which was one season before “Ma//jorine”, she had very little background appearances between her first appearance and “Ma//j” and shows up a lot more afterwards. Oh and she’s conveniently not there in “Ma//jorine”, which I’m guessing is due to design similarities.

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So here’s my idea for Kelly : she’s amab who never felt like she fit in with the other boys, hence why we never see her. Then “Ma//jorine” happens and seeing Butters in those clothes give Kelly major gender envy. So she starts growing her hair more, feeling also confident about “imitating” Ma//j due to the fact that the girl mysteriously disappeared after a few days, so it’s not like they’ll run into each other.

Once she feels confident enough in her looks, she starts trying to socialize with a few girls who accept her. You could also imagine that she already had a few “unpopular” girl friends (by unpopular I mean “not part of the main girl group we usually see”) with who she felt a lot more at home than with other boys. Plus, those friends encouraged her to express her gender.

Eventually, she introduces herself to the more popular girls as Kelly and becomes part of the group. Though, it’d be funny if some of the girls thought she was Ma//jorine who came back after a few months, with Kelly playing along because Ma//j was only around for like a week max so it’s not like she pretends to be the girls’ life-long friend or something. This idea of using the Ma//j nickname does feel a bit like shitting on Ma//j tho.

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(You know, on one hand, this is low-key making me consider writing a oneshot about Kelly. But on the other hand, I’m not very big on side characters, including Kelly, so it would feel more like something written to spite people who like Ma//jorine rather than an actual desire to flesh out a side character. So I doubt I’ll ever write anything about her transitioning. If I ever make a long story that has several side characters, I’d absolutely include her as part of the side cast tho.)

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So, very long story short : my main issue with Ma//j is that the way she’s used feels like Butters’ core personality is taken away for a more shy and feminine version of the character, on top of “validating” some of Cartman’s fucked up views. And the fact that there’s a side character that could perfectly fit the mold makes this impression worse.

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3. How the two view each other and how their relationship could evolve

  Alright, so with sexuality and gender out of the way, let’s talk a little more about how the two currently see each other and how it can evolve (not me just realizing now how useless the second part of this post actually is…).

As of right now, the two consider each other to be best friends.

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First off all, I actually really like how their relationship evolved in a “natural” way, if I can say.

What I mean is that, usually, relationships reach a point where they have to talk things out in order to move in a better direction or understand each other’s boundaries. Just look at Stan and Kyle for example and how their relationship grew resentful as the two kept sweeping everything under the rug (please do yourself a favor and go read some analysis about Stan and Kyle’s friendship. There’s tons of interesting stuff !).

But with Cartman and Butters, their friendship grew without much talk. They’re just two guys who kept hanging out and eventually grew attached to each other. Butters is competent for schemes so Cartman kept him around. Then Cartman started opening up to him and Butters proved himself trustworthy. And now, Cartman is trying to return the favor.

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Although, I do think that at some point, these two will hit a wall and will need to talk things off. Because when you look at their relationship on an emotional level, it’s actually pretty one-sided, on Cartman’s end.

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Cartman puts tons of faith into Butters and trusts him pretty much blindly. I’m not sure if this is due to him being paranoid that leads him to trust one specific person, but in any case, the trust is here. Cartman confides in Butters, trusts him during their schemes and goes to him for emotional support.

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But Butters on the other hand…he just doesn’t. Hell, looking at the three scenes of Cartman showing emotional support : “Informative Murder Porn”, Butters is crying on the ground so he didn’t ask anybody to try and comfort him ; “The Magic Bush”, Butters told Cartman he was miserable as a way to scold him ; “Let Them Eat Goo”, Butters didn’t say a thing and it’s Cartman who notices that something’s wrong.

Honestly, the more I think about it, the more it looks like Butters trusts Cartman the same way the other boys do, which is “Cartman is absolutely incredible at coming up with schemes and knows what he’s doing, so if you need a leader/schemer to help you, you should  seek his help. But for anything else, fuck him.”

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Now obviously, Butters does consider Cartman to be his best friend and his attached to him. Just look at his reaction to the heart attacks in “Let Them Eat Goo”. There’s evident concern here (especially compared to like the ending of “Pee” or that one moment in “Stick of Truth” where you have to heal Cartman and Butters is like “how about we let him suffer a little longer ?”).

Also, smaller moment but I never saw anyone point it out : in “Naughty Ninjas”, when the boys want to get rid of Cartman and make a vote, everyone move their heads while agreeing, except for Butters, who as a result likely decided to side with Cartman instead, hence him not moving during the vote.

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Another thing regarding Butters’ side and him being attached to Cartman, as weird as it is to say : him being around Cartman is a pretty good thing for the kid. Because Butters is unhinged and full of rage from his parents’ bullshit (to put it lightly). As a result, hanging out with Cartman not only gives him an outlet to express the mean/angry side of him, but Cartman is also able to prevent Butters from going apeshit, at least sometimes.

And I think that’s also why Butters considers Cartman his best friend. Cartman is someone Butters can be at his worst with. Given his family situation, it’s probably freeing for him, making him feel a bit more in control of his life.

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But while Butters genuinely cares and likes Cartman, he still doesn’t trust him (rightfully so honestly). More than that, Butters is still terrified of Cartman. Recent examples show that, like the second half of “Let Them Eat Goo” and his scene in “City People” (when Cartman pushes Butters’ hand away, Butters keeps his hand close to his chest in a defensive way, before dropping it since Cartman doesn’t show any sign of aggressivity).

Tbh, I absolutely adore that we get to see Butters be so scared of Cartman still. I think it has to do with the fact that obviously Butters should be scared of Cartman after all the horrible shit the boy put him through.

And what I like about it is that, being a comedy show and all, Matt and Trey could’ve easily just gone “well they’re best friends now so Butters isn’t scared anymore”. But instead, they acknowledge that Butters was traumatized and, as a result, is still afraid of Cartman.

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On that note, I really hope that “Butters is scared of Cartman while Cartman keeps acting friendly towards him” is a thing we’ll keep having in future episodes.

It’s honestly really great in “Let Them Eat Goo” to see Butters being so worried about Cartman calling him a traitor, only for Cartman to spend the entire episode being friendly with him. I just really like the evolution of Butters’ fear in this episode and how he slowly calms down the more he realizes that Cartman won’t hurt him. It’s very endearing to see.

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But yeah, going back to that “they’ll need to sit down and talk at some point”, this is what I mean.

Butters was heavily traumatized by all the horrible shit Cartman put him through (made worse when you consider that what led Butters to get so close to Cartman in the first place is the fact that his parents are incredibly controlling, so of course an authority figure like Cartman would allure him).

At some point, Cartman will have to realize that what he did wasn’t ok, and that Butters isn’t going to just forgive him like that. Cartman is on a good path right now but he needs to keep going if he wants that friendship to be healthy. Cartman also really needs to be called out for his creepy predatory behavior.

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This whole thing is also why I like to imagine Cartters as one-sided on Cartman’s end. As someone who isn’t particularly fond of portraying abusive relationships, I’m really not a fan of the idea of Butters liking his bully without the bully actually acknowledging his actions. I feel like it also undermines Cartman’s abuse by having Butters forgive him every time in the name of love or something.

(Don’t get me wrong, I can still genuinely appreciate Cartters fics that don’t really go there, but I do feel like Cartman is let off a little too easily most of the time. Then again, most fics take place in their teenage years so I can sorta understand that feeling of “it’s all behind them now”, tho I still wish there was more acknowledgment.)

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Oh yeah and a few other reasons why I like one-sided Cartters with Cartman being in love :

- I like portraying characters as disasters and Cartman being a bi disaster who also struggles to accept his sexuality is very endearing

- Cartman liking someone who doesn’t like him back makes him miserable. I like when Cartman is miserable

- Butters doesn’t strike me as being in love with Cartman in the show, especially due to the episode “Scause for Applause”. In this episode, Butters acts as Stan’s hype man and pretty much acts the same way he does with Cartman, save for having a bit less admiration. So if he views Stan in a platonic way, he views Cartman in a platonic way. And given all the hurt Cartman caused him, it would take quite a few years for romantic feelings to grow.

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All of that is also why I said in the intro that I don’t want this ship to be canon as of now and would rather see their friendship grow healthier. Especially since I do believe it could get better if the show wanted to go that direction.

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After all, if you were to show someone who doesn’t know shit about SP the seasons 17-25 and asked them to describe the duo’s friendship, they’d probably say “they’re best friends. Sometimes Cartman’s an ass but when is he not.” Because, as of right now, Cartman and Butters are in a pretty good place. BUT that’s only if you ignore all the trauma from the early seasons.

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As of right now, there are two steps that they need to take in their relationship, which both boils down to “Cartman needs to keep getting better so that Butters can learn to trust him”.

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The first step is that Cartman needs to stop throwing Butters under the bus during their schemes. This, to me, is the most important part right now.

That’s also why earlier I mentioned how curious I am for their next “get rich quick” scheme given how “Tegrity Farms” turned out, with Cartman making Butters the scapegoat at first but then blackmailing Kyle into helping to use him instead. It does give the hope that Cartman may start using a third person in most schemes.

But then again it is Cartman we’re talking about. Plus, the show isn’t always consistent with its characters. So we’ll just have to wait and see.

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The second step is just Cartman continuing to be nice to Butters like he’s been since S17. That’s where the “Butters being afraid of physical violence” comes in, and why I want it to continue.

If Cartman keeps going the way he’s currently going, I hope we’ll get to see Butters slowly learning to drop his guard around Cartman, because Cartman would have deserved it for putting actual effort into this friendship and proving himself to not have any desires to hit Butters at every turn like he used to.

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Then, once those two steps are done, it would be time for them to unravel all the trauma from the past seasons and work through this. It’s at this point that they would hit a wall and need to talk things out in order to keep their friendship growing.

Obviously this would never happen because this is SP, I know. But if this was a show that focused on character development, this is how I could see it work.

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There is, however, one last issue with this. That issue is Cartman’s desire to change.

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I mentioned earlier when talking about the Covid specials how the only thing that was true about Cartman was his love for his family. And that brought me to learn one thing about Cartman : he is capable of love.

Cartman can love someone, he can bring himself to care about someone else other than himself, or at least to a certain degree. Like some have pointed out before, Cartman could have easily destroyed the time machine or time-traveled to kill Kenny or something. But instead, he let his obsessive hatred for Kyle consume him. He didn’t just do it to save his family, he was also being selfish.

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But this aside, we do see Cartman capable of being nice to one person specifically, while remaining a manipulative asshole to everyone else. Now the question is, can he do the same for a platonic relationship ? After all, Yentl was his wife. Butters is only a friend, obsession or not.

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Don’t get me wrong, Cartman did become nicer to Butters as the show went on. Hell, comparing obsessions and love interests, I tend to say that Cartman with Heidi = Cartman with Kyle and Cartman with Yentl = Cartman with Butters.

What I mean is Heidi and Kyle are people Cartman is incredibly manipulative towards and tried/tries to change for the worst, while Yentl and Butters are cases in which Cartman is the one changing for them.

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But still, as much as Cartman might care for Butters and want to be a good friend to him, how much is Cartman capable of caring for Butters ? And as a result, how much is he willing to change ? That’s the main issue here.

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Cartman can’t change unless he wants to. You can’t help someone if they don’t want to be helped. Cartman is a narcissist/sociopath. He’s capable of affection, empathy and even love, but to a limited degree.

And because of that, when it comes to his friendship with Butters, while he has shown huge progress as the show went on, there’s no telling how much this progress can continue before hitting a limit. And there’s no telling how much this limit will prevent their relationship from being healthy.

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Ultimately, I don’t think their relationship could ever be 100% healthy. Cartman is a huge control freak and I don’t think he’s that capable of change.

That being said, Cartman and Butters could become equals, or at least as close to equals as Cartman is capable of.

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As of right now, the closest people to be equals to Cartman are Kenny and Wendy, mostly due to them not being afraid of him. Wendy especially knows how to avoid being manipulated by Cartman and I do think the two could become equals if Cartman had any sort of respect for her (which he doesn’t).

As for Kenny, it’s a mix between not being afraid and Cartman himself having some form of respect for Kenny, and I think that’s what gives me hope that Cartman and Butters’ relationship could be better.

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Cartman grew to respect (to an extent) and care for Butters. So if Butters were to grow out of his fear of Cartman’s actions, while Cartman keeps being a softie to him, they could have a better relationship.

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Although, such a relationship still wouldn’t be 100% healthy, especially if you imagine them growing up to become con men or CEOs together.

But the main difference would be that, while Cartman could still screw up Butters, Butters could also screw up Cartman and get away with it without Cartman trying to get revenge, and as such without Butters having the fear of said revenge.

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It would be far from perfect, nor would it be completely healthy. But given their personalities, this is the best they could have. It might also make their relationship have a more casual feeling to it while still having genuine care for each other. But in any case, I think this is a relationship they would both be content with.

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Before finishing with the “other ships opinions”, here’s a few other things I wanted to talk about but didn’t know where to put, in no particular order :

- Despite Cartman being closer to Butters, he seems to still consider Kenny his best friend. Regarding this, I don’t think Cartman has fully realized just how close he and Butters became.

For example, take the scene from “You’re not Yelping” when he gives Butters free food. I feel like, had anybody pointed out to him that he just gave free food to Butters, Cartman would’ve gone “Hey you’re right ! Butters you asshole come back here you owe me money !”

Looking at their recent interactions, it does seem like most of what Cartman does for Butters is “subconscious”, in the sense that he knows that he’s being nice to Butters but probably doesn’t realize just how much he’s doing for that kid, especially compared to literally anybody else.

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- When it comes to Cartters, I don’t think it’s enough for Cartman to be nicer towards Butters. Butters also needs to become worse, embrace the darker “fucked up and corrupted con artist” side of him.

I honestly don’t believe in Cartman redeeming himself and becoming a better person overall. But since he is capable of love, I do think that their relationship could work if Butters was on the “unredeemable” side as well. Their relationship wouldn’t be 100% healthy and would have a few hiccups, but it’d work for them. Kind of in a “they deserve each other” sort of way I guess ?

That’s actually something I really like about Cartters : In order to ship it, you need to acknowledge how much of an asshole Butters actually is.

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- Cartman’s friendship with Butters is like a double-edged sword to him and I find that very funny. Episodes like “The Magic Bush” or “Tegrity Farms” portray that very well.

On one hand, Cartman now has an incredibly loyal and trustworthy ally. But on the other hand, Butters isn’t taking any of his shit anymore, so Cartman better act like an actual friend if he doesn’t want to lose him.

On that note, that’s also why I really like how much nicer Cartman has been since S17. It’s obvious that he realized how Butters’ growth changed their dynamic, and he’s willing to play nice instead of taking their friendship for granted. And looking at episodes such as “Let Them Eat Goo”, it seems that this dynamic is actually bringing them closer, which is pretty sweet.

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- Now that I think about it, this post barely had any mention of the romantic and sexual jokes between them, which are honestly pretty numerous and present across the entire show. But that’s because I’m more focused on their characters and possible chemistry, especially how they evolved and how they could evolve in the future.

While the jokes definitely influenced/shaped my perception of this duo and can absolutely be used as a reason to ship it, what I’m ultimately looking for in a “shipping mindset” are the genuine moments and interactions.

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- Speaking of “romantic jokes” tho, I’m still not over the fact that, in the Vaccination Special, Cartman makes a drawing of the “Qties” group in front of the school + the adults that joined. And in that drawing, you can’t recognize any of the kids aside from two :

Scott Malkinson, mostly recognizable due to him being in the center with a jacket and what seems to be his tongue being visible, since the drawing has characters with their mouths open and said mouths are colored in, unlike said tongue.

Butters, seen by his short blonde and kinda-spiky hair + the fact that he’s holding a flag like he did during the fight earlier, showing that Cartman was paying attention to what Butters was doing, either during the fight or while watching the news, since he drew some of the adults accurately which shows he watched the news.

But yeah, it just kills me that Cartman fucking took the time to draw Butters accurately while not giving a single shit about the rest of the Qties. For example, Clyde and Red were part of the group. Good luck seeing them on the board.

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- At some point, thinking about the two got me thinking about Scott Malkinson, who some call “the new Butters”. Mostly, it got me thinking about the possibility of Cartman using him for schemes and eventually getting attached to him. But I doubt this would ever happen.

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This also led me to realize that, while people call Scott “the new Butters”, there are actually three main differences between them :

1. Scott is morally good. Butters is morally ambiguous.

2. Scott already knows how to talk back to bullies, it’s just that nobody cares. Butters on the other hand had to learn to stand up for himself, which apparently left a much higher impact on the other boys (just look at their reaction in “Going Native”).

3. Scott is very visibly lonely, as we especially see in “Basic Cable”. When he’s alone, he seems to suffer from it. Butters on the other hand never seemed lonely like that. Even in early seasons, when nobody liked him, whenever he was alone he could be seen playing with costumes or drawing or being on his computer etc. While I’m in no way doubting that Butters was lonely back then (and might still be), he was capable of hiding it.

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And regarding their relationships with Cartman and why I don’t think Cartman would ever care about Scott : The main reason is that Cartman isn’t obsessed with Scott. Like I said earlier, he doesn’t go out of his way to bully him like he used to do with Butters.

Then you also have the fact that Scott agrees to help Cartman because he’s the most terrified of Cartman + he’s so lonely that he’ll accept any form of acknowledgment. Butters on the other hand is in the schemes because he enjoys it.

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You could also say that, with Cartman being paranoid, he only wants one confidant. But then again I don’t know shit about paranoia and couldn’t find something on the internet so take this idea with a grain of salt.

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Oh yeah, and also I like comparing the two with Cartman in “Board Girls”, with the scene where they complain to Mackey and the scene in front of the assembly.

In both scenes, Butters speaks unprompted while Scott waits to be asked to talk. On top of that, when Butters interrupts the first time, Cartman just gets mildly annoyed. But when Scott answers Mackey’s question, Cartman gets angry and yells.

As for the scene with the assembly, seeing Butters speak and Cartman glare at him, causing Butters to cower and walk back to his spot reminds me of that one Halloween episode with Satan throwing a sweet 16 party (around S9-10). When the boys try to summon Biggie Smalls, Cartman is hesitating and Butters insults him, causing Cartman to glare at him and raise a fist.

Makes me wonder if Cartman not raising his hand in “Board Girl” was due to them being in front of an assembly, due to him knowing Butters would back away from the stare alone, or due to Cartman simply not having any intention to hurt Butters because he grew to care about him. In any case, Butters cowers due to fear and trauma.

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One last thing about comparing these kids is that it made me wonder if there’s any chance for Butters and Scott to be friends. And honestly, I don’t think so. While Butters can be very sweet, he’s also a bully, and Scott is a victim of bullying. On top of that, I could definitely see Butters feeling bad for Scott and Cartman dismissing those worries, which with time would cause Butters to stop caring.

So long story short, I think that, as long as Butters is friends with Cartman, he and Scott won’t be able to be close.

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- Episode ideas, one that could help their relationship and one that would be very satisfying :

1. Cartman throws Butters under the bus yet again, Butters is mad and doesn’t want to be his friend anymore, Cartman’s like “That’s fine ! I don’t need you anyways”, Cartman realizes that he’s been relying on Butters for so long now that it’s pretty impossible for him to scheme alone, Cartman tries to get other people to help but doesn’t have the same patience he showcases towards Butters so he can’t stand them when they don’t understand stuff or make mistakes (also they’re not as competent as Butters), Cartman eventually begrudgingly apologizes to Butters and promises to stop throwing him under the bus, Cartman actually has to hold this promise for the rest of the show and starts using other people as scapegoats without growing meaningful friendships with any of them.

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2. Cartman has a scheme idea and goes to Butters’ house to ask for his help, Butters is grounded and insists that he can’t leave, Cartman finds a way to convince the Stotches to let the kid out, the whole episode would have Stephen calling Cartman to be like “alright it’s been long enough now bring Butters back” but Cartman keeps delaying it until his scheme is complete, oh and Butters is having the time of his life being away from his parents.

Basically, I just want an episode of Cartman playing mind games with the Stotches parents, with Butters getting no bad consequence whatsoever. Because let’s be honest here, both Stotches parents have mental illnesses, which would make them weak in Cartman’s eyes and incredibly easy to dominate. And while physical violence against horrible people is cathartic, mental games is where the good stuff’s at.

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To wrap up, here’s my views on a few other Cartman and Butters ships, for those who are curious :

 Cartman

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- Stan//man : completely neutral on that one. Don’t particularly like it, don’t particularly dislike it. I tend to find their friendship pretty interesting due to how Cartman doesn’t really have anything against Stan since he isn’t part of any sort of minority (aside from possibly sexuality but it has yet to be canon).

On top of that, Stan doesn’t react in a way that Cartman finds funny. Stan also doesn’t get roped into Cartman’s schemes easily, unless it’s a group effort. So it seems that they could become closer friends. But the issue is Kyle, due to how horrible Cartman is on the poor kid that Stan is incredibly attached to.

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So yeah, I’m neutral when it comes to shipping it, meaning I don’t ship it but don’t mind seeing ship art of it. And I do find their friendship interesting in canon, though I don’t think they could grow closer unless Cartman stops being such an asshole towards Kyle, which I doubt will ever happen given the need of a status quo (sort of, the show does have character development).

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- Ky//man : possibly my least favorite ship and one that makes me deeply uncomfortable, which probably isn’t helped by the fact that Kyle’s my favorite character and I don’t want to see him suffer like this.

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Okay, positive things first, I’ll admit that I do believe that Cartman’s relationship with Kyle is the most interesting Cartman relationship, and the show absolutely wouldn’t be the same without them butting heads all the time.

Another thing I consider more positive : I can’t say I really see much of a possibility for the two of them having a healthy relationship. But tbh, we are talking about fictional characters.

Not every relationship has to be 100% healthy in media. So as long as you’re aware a relationship isn’t perfect and don’t try to romanticize or fetishize the fucked up elements in it (looking at you, proshippers), honestly you’re good to go. If you believe Cartman can be redeemed and Kyle can find it within himself to forgive him, good for you and have fun making your stories !

(Tbh I do believe that one can talk about anything in their story, including fucked up elements. But if you want to write it with a narrator finding it positive, write it from the POV of the perpetrator or a “brainwashed” victim. I do think it’s possible to have a narrator view abuse as “good”, as long as the story is meant to make the reader uncomfortable about it and/or have elements making it very obvious that the narrator has a messed up POV. Oh and obviously please put a disclaimer in the summary or notes to warn about the messed up stuff)

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Now, onto the negative (yeah, sorry, this pretty much turned into a rant) : Tbf, when I first heard of the ship, it didn’t surprise me in the slightest because this is like, shipping 101. So when I started re-watching, I was basically “I understand why this exists but it’s not my thing”. And then I reached the episode “Gin//ger Cow”…yeah, let’s just say I went from “not my thing” to “NOPE” very quickly.

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So, first things first, my issue with the ship is NOT just the fact that the relationship is inherently toxic with many instances of Cartman being the worst. I mean, I ship Cartters, it’d be hypocritical of me. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

My issue is the fact that, not only had the relationship not gotten better, it got worse. In early seasons, Cartman saw Kyle as a rival to take down, someone he enjoyed for his reactions. But in newer seasons, with episodes like “Gin//ger Cow” and “Human Centi//ipad”, we see that Cartman is fine with Kyle not fighting back as long as it means that Kyle is an object or a trophy that Cartman owns.

That’s my issue with this relationship. It has gotten to a point where it’s just too fucked up for me to enjoy (I mean, I didn’t enjoy it in the first place because enemies to lovers isn’t my thing, but those episodes made my views on this ship worst).

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On top of that, you have stuff like Cartman being so much of a stalker that he knows exactly what will make Kyle react in which way, leading to him being able to manipulate Kyle into anything. Like, seriously, look at episodes like “Cr//ack Ba//by Association” or “Tegrity Farms”. If Cartman wants Kyle to do something, he will get Kyle to do that thing, to the point where he even mocks Kyle like in “Le Peti//te Tour//ette” or “Oba//ma Wins”.

Then there’s also the way Cartman swoops in and plays nice with Kyle every single time Stan and Kyle fight, which makes my skin crawl because taking someone when they’re at their most vulnerable and playing nice to gain their trust is incredibly abusive and, as interesting as it is to watch, god does it makes me feel bad for Kyle.

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Another thing that doesn’t help is the way Kyle clearly hates Cartman but also sort of needs him due to his desire to be a good person, since Cartman is so obviously the bad guy that it makes Kyle the good guy everytime they fight.

Also Kyle is just so used to the abuse at this point that he kinda normalized it. Which actually makes me think that, if the two were to be separated at some point, Kyle would at first be incredibly happy but then have a phase where he misses Cartman, not only due to the change of status quo that feels weird but also because, without someone who is so obviously the bad guy, it makes it harder to argue with people who actually have a point in their reasoning. Ultimately though, Kyle is much better off with Cartman as far away from him as possible.

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All that being said, there is absolutely no denying that Cartman has some sort of unhealthy obsession with Kyle, which has gotten sexual on a few instances. Like said earlier, I don’t consider it love but it’s definitely there. Though, I don’t think Kyle could ever reciprocate, and for his own good, I hope he doesn’t.

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Another thing that I’ll agree with is a post I remember reading that had two ideas for how a relationship between them could work. First idea was Kyle being at his most vulnerable and Cartman managing to manipulate him into a relationship, tho obviously it would be toxic. And the second idea is them never seeing each other for years and, once they reunite, Cartman is a better person and Kyle is able to heal and forgive him, which would bring a healthy relationship that works.

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Though, about that second idea, looking at “Post Covid/Return of Covid”, I’m not sure how realistic it is. Thing is, like I said earlier, Cartman was only being genuine towards his wife and kids while being an asshole to everyone else. And if he and Kyle were to be in a relationship, I don’t think Kyle would be okay with that. He’ll probably want Cartman to be nice to everyone. Problem is, I don’t think Cartman is actually capable of that. : /

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And in general, as much as I love Kyle, I’ll admit I can’t help but think that he’ll be the kind to nitpick or complain about little things a lot, and I doubt Cartman has the patience to deal with someone like that, not helped by the fact that Kyle seems to be pretty fatphobic so he might try to convince Cartman to do something about his diet, enraging the guy.

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So yeah, all-in-all, it’s just not my thing.

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- Ken//man : neutral-positive on this one. I don’t ship it but I kinda like the idea. Again, I’m a huge “best friends to lovers” person so of course I wouldn’t mind this one.

Besides, it’s interesting how Kenny is one of the kids that are the least afraid of Cartman, possibly due to his immortality. Speaking of which, I’m guessing that Cartman being able to remember Kenny’s death or having some sort of connection to him must be a pretty interesting thing to develop in order to bring them closer for the ship.

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Another thing about them that kinda makes me laugh is how one-sided their friendship is, with Cartman clearly considering Kenny his best friend while Kenny doesn’t care about Cartman all that much.

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But yeah, in any case, pretty cute friendship with them being close to being equals and you do have the hope of Cartman being nicer towards Kenny as they grow up, since he clearly cares for him. It’s not enough for me to ship it but I definitely like the idea.

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- Can//dy : my second favorite Cartman ship. Fun fact, when I first heard of this ship, I had an ironic enjoyment of it because the idea of these two together amused me a lot. Then I read a fic with them being friends + thought about it a bit more and, honestly, I kind of love it. Actually, this is probably one of if not the healthiest relationship Cartman could have, at least when only taking into account the people Cartman knows and had hurt.

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I mean, thinking about how people at times compare Kyle and Wendy for being rather similar in their self-rightfulness, I’d honestly go ahead and say that Can//dy is basically Ky//man but better, due to 3 major differences between those two relationships :

1. Cartman doesn’t have an unhealthy obsession towards Wendy the same way he does for Kyle and Butters, which already sets this relationship as healthier than both of them

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2. Wendy doesn’t have as much trauma related to Cartman as Kyle and Butters do.

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3. Unlike Kyle who’s very gullible and often tries to be the bigger person while fighting Cartman, Wendy doesn’t easily fall for Cartman schemes and doesn’t mind playing dirty. Take the Smurf episode for example. Not only did Wendy not react to Cartman’s taunts for most of the episode, but in the end, she played directly into Cartman’s narrative, getting down his level in order to beat him.

This actually makes their dynamic incredibly interesting and gives their ship tons of potential. Wendy is the one person who not only doesn’t fear Cartman but also knows how to play him.

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Then there’s also other things like Wendy in early seasons falling for him that one time, or even episodes like “Pajama Day” with Wendy’s idea being complimented by Cartman for being incredibly manipulative.

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Honestly, Can//dy is a girlboss couple with a lot of potential and it’s a shame this ship isn’t that popular, because it’s honestly really good on top of being one of the few Cartman relationships in which Cartman is on almost-equal terms with someone. All Cartman needs is to learn to respect Wendy on a more personal level.

Overall, their relationship has some serious fun and interesting potential.

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Butters

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- St//utters : neutral-positive. Their friendship in the show is very cute and honestly underrated. Plus, it’s very sweet how protective Stan can be towards Butters at times, like him calling out Cartman in “Grounded Vindaloop”, his anger at the beginning of “Butterballs” (making it seems like he’s the one who wrote the anonymous letter) or him using Butters’ distress in the Pandemic Special, which in a way could be seen as him caring for the kid.

As for Butters, you have him hyping Stan up throughout the entirety of “A Scause for Applause” or him comforting Stan at the end of “Band in China”.

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Though, at the same time, it seems that they’re not that close and are willing to bicker for the people they care more about.

For example, Butters being nice to Stan for most of “The Cissy” but then bullying him when Cartman asks him for support. Then there’s also SOT, in that one scene with all the kids arguing at the beginning of the third day (when you’re tasked with recruiting the girls), with Stan speaking up to defend Kyle and Butters speaking up to defend Cartman. You also have Stan telling Butters to shut it in “The Big Fix”.

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So yeah, like for Cartman and Kenny, I don’t ship it but don’t mind the idea and can find fanart of it cute.

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- Kyu//tters (apparently that’s the name) : neutral. I was gonna say neutral-negative due to their canon interactions but I actually don’t mind the ship in the slightest, even with their canon relationship.

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Because yeah, the thing between these two is that they don’t like each other, and by that I mean Butters has continuously been a huge asshole to Kyle and had been shown to bully him on his own on the regular.

Tbh, as much as I love Kyle, I actually find this hilarious. There’s just something about seeing Butters clearly considering everyone to be an asshole but still acting nice with literally everyone else but Kyle. Like Butters really went “fuck this one guy in particular !” and I love it.

Though, I do think that the reason why Butters acts like that is due to his friendship with Cartman. Since Cartman is always the worse with Kyle, it probably made Butters believe that Kyle is an acceptable target.

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But this aside, I actually wish we could have more interactions between these two.

Thing is, they’re the two people Cartman is obsessed with. As a result, they’re also the two people who know Cartman the most, or at least they think so.

Gotta be honest, I’d love to see a situation of Kyle talking about how to take down Cartman because he knows everything about him, mentioning a preference Cartman has, only for Butters to be like “actually, Cartman likes X more”. Cue a talk revealing that Butters knows Cartman on a much more personal level due to him being Cartman’s confidant. Also, this could probably lead to Kyle having yet another existential crisis.

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Another thought about them and Cartman that could be interesting would be them talking about what they think about the guy.

An idea that came to mind was Cartman ending in juvie/prison and, after a few weeks of happiness, Kyle realizes that he sort of misses Cartman due to how used he is to have him around to oppose. And I feel like, in such a situation, Butters would be the best person Kyle could talk to, because Butters would also feel strange about Cartman not being there. Also, Butters would probably go apeshit on the regular out of boredom because of course he would, I mean c’mon !

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So yeah, I don’t really ship it or even see their canon relationship as a friendship, but despite that I don’t mind the ship and can find fanart of it being cute.

That being said, if I had to make a fic with this ship, it would absolutely be the two of them pretending to be in love in order to drive Cartman crazy. I mean, these two are his worst enemy and his closest confidant, both being kids Cartman’s obsessed with. He would not be okay with it and it could be hilarious.

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- Bun//ny : neutral-negative, though neutral-positive if it’s Bunn//yman. I don’t ship it, don’t mind it for the most part but is a bit annoyed from how popular it is, especially since this fandom is really into monoshipping (each character has one popular ship that +70% of the fandom sticks to, leading to other ships having little content).

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Simply put, my issue with this ship is that I just don’t see any chemistry between them. The only things they have in common is being Cartman’s closest friends and being huge pervs towards women, which isn’t the best approach for a gay ship, even if the characters are bi/pan.

Like some people have said it before, Kenny and Butters are the type of guys who only hang out because they’re both invited by Cartman. And when Cartman leaves the room, they just sit in awkward silence until he comes back.

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To explain a bit more my view on them not being compatible, I just feel like Butters is too extreme for Kenny. While Kenny can be a little shit at times, he’s still one of the best people in South Park and has sacrificed himself on several occasions. So I feel like Kenny wouldn’t be okay with someone like Butters, who takes things up to eleven so easily.

Tbh, I’m still surprised that Kenny in Post-Covid agreed to get money through Butters selling NFTs that ruined hundreds if not thousands of lives, especially since Kenny was working for the better of humanity. Also, I’m surprised no-one ever brings up the fact that Kenny was okay with NFTs, unless Butters/Vic never told him.

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So yeah, their personalities just feel too different on that front. That’s also why I think they both work better with Cartman, including as a trio, since Cartman can be more or less extreme depending on the situation, making him a good fit for both.

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As for their friendship in the show, they’re honestly not that close, and it’s pretty surprising that what seems to be the official SP wiki singles out Butters’ friendship with Kenny (along with Cartman’s) instead of Stan’s, whom Butters acts closer to.

On a shipping POV though, it is pretty funny to see this page call Kenny’s views on Butters “big-bro instinct” in a sense, even comparing how Kenny acts towards Butters to how he is with his little sister. But this aside, they just barely interact in the show unless Cartman is involved.

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One last thing about them, though it’s a headcanon, is the idea that Kenny feels some resentment against Butters.

Basically, it’s due to the fact that, in early seasons, it was always the main 4 together. And with Stan and Kyle being closer friends, Cartman and Kenny kind of latched onto each other as best friends.

Then Kenny died and Cartman tried to replace him. And even after Kenny came back, while Tweek went back to being a minor character, Butters stayed in the front line, mostly because Cartman wanted him to. Which even led to episodes in which Kenny isn’t with the group at all but Butters is, like “Canada On Strike”.

So basically, there’s this headcanon that, for a long time, Kenny resented Butters for taking his place not only in the group (sorta) but also as Cartman’s best friend. Though I like to imagine that, after “Going Native”, Kenny grew to accept Butters and that’s when he started having that “brotherly protectiveness” towards him.

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If you’re still here, thanks for reading such a long-ass thing ! 😅

#South Park #SP #Eric Cartman #Butters Stotch #Cartters #SP Buttman #hey look I'm finally posting again ! #just took me like three months AFTER announcing I would post another two months since the last post #actually it was four months because of course it was #fun fact actually : I already moved on to another fandom #THAT'S how long this thing's been sitting in my computer ! #anyways #I REALLY hope it's not too hard to read #I really went full essay mode with this one #meaning many MANY words are repeated 😓 #Flor talks #long post #REALLY long post #(probably my longest to date outside of fics)

[tellthemeerkatsitsfine]

Fucking finally! I haven’t watched the new Champion of Champions yet, I’ve had a weirdly anxious weekend and I want to enjoy it so I might save it for tomorrow night and hope I feel better by then, though I do have to balance that with wanting to avoid spoilers so maybe I’ll just watch it tonight. However. The important thing is that now that COC3 has happened, they have finally announced the season 17 cast! So we’re all allowed to stop pretending we didn’t see the names that leaked all over the internet months ago! Hooray! Here are some unsolicited opinions.

I mean, obviously I won’t pretend that one of those names didn’t jump out at me significantly more than the others. I sure know how to get on a bandwagon. Last year, when the s16 names were leaked, I took that as my sign to do what I’d been sort of meaning to do at some point eventually, and watch all Sam Campbell’s stand-up stuff that’s on YouTube. Meaning that by the time the names were officially released, I got to look like I’m really well informed on the less TV-famous comics because I already knew his stuff. When in fact, I didn’t know anything about him beyond his name and reputation until I saw he was going on Taskmaster.

The same isn’t true in this case, it’s almost entirely a coincidence that I happen to be getting really really into John Robins’ radio show in the run-up to his Taskmaster season. I’d had those radio shows on my list for ages, of things to eventually get to, sometime, when I’ve knocked everything off my list and have several hundred thousand hours to spare. I got into his stand-up early last year, long before any Taskmaster s17 names appeared, and this made me even more sure that I want to hear his radio show someday. So I tried it out at the same time as a few others, and then it did just happen to become the one that had a few really compelling episodes in a row early on, which hooked me and made me really want to hear the next one instead of mixing it up, and now I’ve abandoned all the other ones and reached episode 102 of their XFM/Radio X stuff in a few weeks.

I say it’s almost entirely a coincidence because I did see those names in September, and vaguely thought I’ll probably enjoy Taskmaster even more if I’m even more into John Robins by then. But it was going to happen anyway.

This one really is right at the top of my dream Taskmaster contestants. Not just that it’s a comedian I really like, but specifically a comedian who’s exactly the type of Taskmaster contestant. Hyper-competitive, but not in a jock way, more in an anxious obsessive controlling way. I made a post a while ago about how I’d read some people on a different website talk about the possibility of John Robins on Taskmaster, and they said this would be bad because his pedantry and competitiveness would be annoying, and he’d ruin the show with his tendency to not let a single thing go. And I said, God that sounds great. Please, Alex. Please let your angry golf buddy come ruin the show with his pedantry and competitiveness and refusal to let a single thing go. And then he did!

…I had an audio clip from a recent radio episode that I was going to post to expand on this, but I’ve decided to save that for another post, actually, and keep this one focused on the s17 lineup in general. So I will say: obviously, John Robins will be my favourite going into it, and if his approach to the show is at all consistent with the persona he’s displayed for the last 10+ years of his comedy career, he’s in a with a shot of rising to one of my favourite Taskmaster contestants ever. I can’t wait to see how he ruins the show. And how big he goes on the Freddie Mercury costume that he’s definitely going to wear.

Having said all that, I’m going to be honest about the fact that I wasn’t that excited when I first saw the full list of names. This is because there were already significant rumours about John Robins, even before the definite names linked, so while I was pleased to see his involvement confirmed, I’d been hoping the full list would have an additional name for me to get excited about. Which it didn’t, really, but that doesn’t mean it won’t be good, quite possibly very good. It just means they happen to have grabbed people from sides of comedy that I don’t know much about.

The League of Gentlemen people are a weirdly large hole in my Britcom knowledge, and I’m not sure why, but I’ve never had much of a desire to change that. I’ve had their stuff recommended to me lots (Psychoville and Inside No 9 and I know there’s other stuff), but I’ve vaguely looked at it, and have always thought it doesn’t really look like my thing. Though I have no good reason for this. I have some sort of vague negative association with that group of people in my mind, and I don’t know why it’s there.

The only guess I have is that I watched BBC Sherlock as it came out, and that became a bone of contention for me at the time. I thought it was a well made and good show with some glaring flaws – a few “this plot isn’t a clever or watertight as they think it is” flaws and a bunch of “this seems like it was written by men who think that as long as they can convince other men they’re really smart it doesn’t matter if their portrayal of women is fairly misogynistic”. And that latter opinion was backed up by my brother, who thought it was a work of impenetrable genius and anyone who was a word against it was just a bitter feminist who wasn’t smart enough to understand it, and sometimes we’d fight about that. This caused the name “Mark Gatiss” to be marred in my mind.

So it’s possible that that’s what happened. That a few years ago I looked up the League of Gentlemen things to decide whether to add that to my list, the name “Mark Gatiss” left a bad taste in my mouth and made me think I don’t like the look of this, and that made me decide I’m not interesting in finding out about Steve Pemberton or Reece Shearsmith either. Which is, of course, a terrible reason to write off some very accomplished comedy people. Because they worked with a guy who wrote a show ten years ago that I used to fight with my brother about.

The point is that I know very little about Steve Pemberton, but I am open to letting him win me around. I did recently hear a radio episode from 2015 in which John Robins was listing people who’d be at some event he was about to attend, people whom he considered famous at way beyond his level so he was excited about the idea of being anywhere near them, and one of the people he listed was Steve Pemberton. Reminds me of that 2007 radio episode where Russell Howard talked about Liza Tarbuck in similar terms. Hope he has a good time getting to share stage with him. I have no more than that to say about Steve Pemberton, because I really know absolutely fuck all about Steve Pemberton. I shall watch with an open mind and hope he’s great and changes my mind about all of this.

I know only slightly more about Sophie Willan, and that’s only because a couple of years ago she went on The Russell Howard Hour and was an entertaining enough guest so she stuck in my mind. She’d just won a BAFTA for her sitcom Alma’s Not Normal, and she spoke endearingly about the stories behind it and what it was like to write and make and then have it go so well, and the interview made me really like her and think that show sounds good. Though I’ve never actually seen any of Alma’s Not Normal. She was also quite good on WILTY last year. And those are all the things I know about Sophie Willan.

Nick Mohammed I guess I have a similarly unfair reaction to as I do to Steve Pemberton, in that the thought of him immediately puts a bad taste in my mouth simply due to his association with something else that isn’t his fault. Specifically, the third season of Ted Lasso was so absolutely fucking awful that I’m not sure I want to look at anyone from it ever again. I think it doesn’t help that there are suggestions that Jason Sudeikis being possibly terrible in real life may have been a small part of the cause of season 3 being so terrible, which has caused my brain to associate the actors with the bad writing. Even though Nick Mohammed did not write any of it. And I did hear some Brett Goldstein stand-up last year that I really enjoyed and he seems cool, so it’s possible that not every person who got cast on a bad show (or in this case, a good show that turned bad) is also bad.

I did watch Nick Mohammed’s filmed comedy special when I first saw his name on the s17 list, called Houdini. It was… not really for me, but I can appreciate that it’s well made if you like that sort of thing. It’s Nick Mohammed in character as Mr. Swallow, acting out a comedic biopic (but also a genuine biopic, it took me until about halfway through the show to work out that this wasn’t some parody or fictionalization, they really were trying to tell his life story) of Harry Houdini. Which I guess Nick Mohammed picked because he also does magic and admires people who have previously done magic to a legendary level. If you’re into magic and/or character comedy, then definitely check out Nick Mohammed’s special Houdini. I just happen to not be much into either of those things.

Although, I am curious to see whether Mohammed’s skills might come into play in Taskmaster. Because he does sometimes do actually magic when performing stand-up as his character Mr. Swallow. I’ve seen him do it in some short TV spots, where he’ll do a card trick, and he’s doing the trick for real, which you can tell because it doesn’t always work perfectly. But it usually works well. Those tricks involve a very impressive ability to memorize positions of lots of cards at once, and to do some other fiddly sleight of hand things, and that’s a real-life skill that Nick Mohammed has and most don’t. It reminds of Paul Sinha’s season, when he mostly performed terribly, but every once in a while there would be a task that tested one of those skills in which Paul Sinha is leagues and leagues more advanced than the average person due to his quizzing experience. Like that studio task where they had to name all those bird species, or the house task where they had to memorize the positions of cards. Paul Sinha was incredible at those, it was so cool to see. I’ll enjoy it if Nick Mohammed gets a similar chance to show that off.

Beyond that, I don’t know a lot about Nick Mohammed because I haven’t seen him be himself much. He sometimes turns up as a guest on TV shows, but normally as the character Mr. Swallow. And of course I’ve seen him in character on Ted Lasso. I don’t know what he's like when he’s not doing that.

I do know he was absolutely hilarious on the latest Catsdown Christmas special, which aired a few weeks ago. I think that show was running out of steam even before Sean Lock died and should definitely be respectfully put out to pasture by now (also, Jimmy Carr is getting harder and harder to be someone I can just tolerate in the background, as he throws his lot in more and more clearly with the right wing), but I’ve watched every episode they’ve put out and I will keep doing so until they stop (and I have to admit the one the other night with Lee Mack and Harriet Kemsley and DO’D was pretty good). And I thought Nick Mohammed absolutely stole the show on that Christmas special. I watched it with my parents and the Mr. Swallow routines from Dictionary Corner had all three of us laughing really hard. So that bodes well for Taskmaster s17.

Finally, I’ve saved Joanne McNally for last because I know almost nothing about her, and I’m probably being unfair by judging her based on this. I think the only things I’ve seen her do are a few guest spots on Joe Lycett’s Got Your Back (where she wasn’t doing stand-up or anything, just following the script, so it’s hard to get a read on her from that), she was on the Katherine Ryan Backstage but didn’t make much of an impression and I don’t remember what she did on there, and she did an episode of Alan Davies’ As Yet Untitled.

I watched As Yet Untitled a few years ago now, and thought she came off badly enough on there to make me dislike her even though I knew pretty much nothing about her. That’s because she told this story:

...I don't want to be all killjoy feminist "actually this comedy story told on a fun comedy show isn't funny, it's stalking and harassment and a component of emotional abuse", but this comedy story told on a fun comedy show isn't funny, it's stalking and harassment and a component of emotional abuse. I've known several people who have been in this situation with an ex-partner, and it's not funny, it's terrifying.

Now, I'm aware that not every single story on As Yet Untitled is 100%, down to each detail true. (I learned this last year, when I got probably disproportionately indignant about seeing that apparently you're allowed to steal someone's stand-up story just because they didn't like your penguin in 2002.) So I assume that Joanne McNally's story has, like plenty on stories that get told on panel shows, been wildly exaggerated or (hopefully) even made up completely.

But even if that's the case, even if none of that story really happened, it still doesn't make me like Joanne McNally to think that she considers that to be a quirky and funny story, rather than one where it looks like she's bragging about committing harassment. That's not great. And unfortunately for her, it's just about the only thing I know about her, so it has shaped my entire opinion.

I will hope she was just making up a wildly over-the-top story to get attention on a panel show, and it does not speak to her underlying character, and I will try to watch her on Taskmaster with an open mind. But I will be going in with some level of bias against her.

#Youtube

[wooshofficial]

hi woosh i hope i'm not too late for blorboposting. see at first i was like "woosh you already know who my blorbos are" but i still wanna talk about one of them because i don't talk about him enough. i think barry burkhard needs more love. he's just a guy and he played blaseball in an alternate dimension where he was besties with alt seb telephone. and then he watched his bestie die TWICE. all of this was before he officially joined blaseball (he was the steaks postseason birth in s17 but the lore is that he did all that stuff with alt seb telephone back in discipline.) anyway now he's in tokyo, where his other bestie (cory ross) used to play and one day i'm gonna write a fic about cory showing barry around. also he singlehandedly made the s24 steaks rotation look SO FUNNY...he was like the mike townsend of the group. just there. the sim did my guy dirty but i love him so much for it.

I MEANT TO ANSWER THIS A FUCKIN WHILE AGO AND THEN LIFE HAPPENED AUGh please imagine Wybies 40k post here

Barry Burkhard has somehow avoided plot in his entire time being in the game even though he’s lored to be smitten with the most Plot Guy Ever and I find that so funny. Barry fucking Burkhard man

#woosh answers #lenasai #blaseball #barry burkhard #ITS SO FUNNY OK #he’s like Jacob Haynes except he actively keeps trying to get involved in plot and the plot goes **no.** #anyways please write that fic

[televinita]

TV I Watched In 2023

Before I can even begin to answer survey questions about it, I have to remember what I actually watched. I have been tracking it month to month, but since I rarely finish an entire series or even a season within a month, all that data is stretched and scattered throughout the year and it takes a post like this to bring it all together. Does this need to be public? Probably not. But it is anyway!

Broken down by categories that are not, for the most part, genre:

INSTA-QUIT

Animal Control: 1x01

The Terror: 1x01-02

Quantum Leap (2022): 1x04

The Triangle (2005 miniseries): pt 1

SAMPLED, WILL COME BACK SOMEDAY

The Ranch: 1x01-02

Trinkets: 1x01

What If…?: 1x03 & 1x07

CURRENT SHOWS (SCRIPTED)

Abbott Elementary: S2

Night Court (2023)

That 90s Show

Ghosts (CBS): S2

Poker Face

Daisy Jones & The Six

Loki (full series)

Alaska Daily

Good Omens: S2

Big Sky: S2-3

La Brea: S2

Goosebumps (2023)

NEW TO ME

The Exes: 4x17-22, finishing what I started last year

Scott & Bailey: S3-5 (and a rewatch of S1)

The Night Manager (which I completely failed to reblog anything about because I was overwhelmed with joy; so good)

The Essex Serpent

Return to Cranford

Litvinenko

Slasher: S1

REALITY & GAME SHOWS

Survivor: S44-45

The Amazing Race: S32 & 35

The Chase: S3

Celebrity Jeopardy

Celebrity Family Feud: Chenoweth vs. Najimy

Celebrity Wheel of Fortune: Abbott Elementary cast

Cook at All Costs

Snack vs. Chef

Best Leftovers Ever

Pressure Cooker

The Traitors (both US and UK)

Snake in the Grass

Squid Games: The Challenge

Special Forces: World's Toughest Test: S2 (and 2 of S1)

Dallas Cowboys Cheerleaders: Making the Team: season 15

(I can't explain why I will watch 7 junk food reality shows before I watch one genuinely good series when I have sooo many of the latter on my watch list. It used to be because I wrote about every episode of TV, and it's always hard to articulate positive feelings well, but now I guess I just have an emotional block about processing Great Stuff without even having something to show for it afterward.)

RANDOM REWATCHES

Various episodes: 30 Rock; Seinfeld; Friends; The Simpsons (S7 & 12 mostly); Community (S1-2 mostly)

That 70s Show: 1x01-19

Survivor: Gabon (S17)

The Amazing Race: S32

The Office: S9

CSI: 4x12

Primeval: New World: 1x01

Doctor Who: 4x01-02; 4x06; 4x12-13

#a more talented person than me would make cool graphics about it #but that's just beyond my capabilities #year in review #tv watched in 2023

[plaidbooks]

Making Gingerbread House with the Carisi Clan. Also if you're interested you can add in a fake dating trope where Carisi asks y/n to come coz his whole family is bugging him. P.S: Can't wait for all the amazing stuff you will come up with for this bingo challenge. 😍😍 #the christmas bingo you posted. I forgot the name. Sorry

Building Blocks

A/N: This prompt is so cute! And of course, I had to take that idea of a fake dating trope! All the Italian translations are done by google, so I hope they're sufficient--the translations are in the beginning. This covers the Xmas Baking square in @storiesofsvu holiday bingo. I hope you enjoy!

PS: this takes place around the end of s17, back when Sonny was a tad overdramatic 🤣

Tags: none outside of food mentions

Words: 2064

Taglist: @witches-unruly-heart @beccabarba @thatesqcrush @itsjustmyfantasyroom @permanentlydizzy @ben-c-group-therapy @infiniteoddball @glowingmess @whimsicallymad @lv7867 @storiesofsvu @cycat4077 @alwaysachorusgirl @glimmerglittergirl @joanofarkansass @caracalwithchips @beardsanddetectives @reading--mermaid @averyhotchner @mrsrafaelbarba @detective-giggles @crowleysqueenofhell @dreamlover31

Italian translations:

Perchè no = why not

Non dirmi che siete solo amici, voglio dei nipotini = don't tell me you're only friends, I want grandkids

Un giorno, prometti = one day, promise

**********************

“Please, please, please come over for the weekend with me! All my sisters are going to have a plus one and my parents keep askin’ me when I’m gonna bring a woman home with me. Please!” Sonny begged. He was on his knees on the carpeted floor of your living room, hands clasped together like a prayer.

“Sonny…” you started, but you stopped when he bent forward, head on the ground.

“I’ll do anythin’ ya want! I’m already grovelin’ at your feet, doll! Please!”

You leaned down, touching his shoulder gently. “What I was going to say was that you don’t have to beg me, Sonny. I don’t mind going to your parent’s place for a weekend.”

He popped up to his knees, giving you a smile of disbelief. “Really? You’ll come?”

“Of course; we’re friends, aren’t we?”

His grin solidified, taking up his whole face. “Best friends,” he agreed. “I owe ya.”

**************

When Sonny pulled up in front of his parent’s house on Staten Island, you quirked an eyebrow. There was only one car in the driveway, but otherwise, the street was deserted.

“Are we here early?” you asked. When Sonny gave you a confused look, you continued, “I don’t see any cars…unless your sisters took public transit.”

“Nah, they’ll be here tomorrow. I always come a day early ta help ma with the baking,” he explained. You found that incredibly endearing, and you smiled softly as he guided you up to the front door.

He knocked and you waited with bated breath before the door opened, revealing an older woman with a smile brighter than the sun—you finally understood where Sonny got his smile from.

“Sonny,” she muttered affectionately before holding her arms open. He wrapped her in a tight hug, and even though she only reached his chest, she leaned fully into the embrace.

“Hey ma,” he whispered back, ducking his head to kiss her cheek. He finally let her go and introduced you. Mama Carisi greeted you the same, pulling you in for a tight hug and kissing your cheek.

It was easy to feel at home in the Carisi household; it was warm and full of love. You shook hands with Dominick Sr., who towered over even Sonny. And then you followed Mama Carisi into the expansive kitchen, Sonny on your heels. He rolled up his sleeves and went to wash his hands, and you followed suit.

“I thought you said we were going to be making gingerbread houses, Sonny,” you asked, voice hushed so his mom wouldn’t hear.

He turned the water off and grabbed a towel to dry both your hands. With a grin, he said, “we are. Tomorrow. Gotta make the gingerbread, first, doll.”

You quickly learned that the gingerbread house kits that most stores sold were seen as blasphemy by the Carisi’s; it was fresh or nothing. There were two separate ovens—a relic from raising such a big family—and Mama Carisi started to preheat them both.

You weren’t quite sure what you were supposed to be doing, so you just followed the instructions given to you. Mama Carisi made the dough—by hand, mixers were not allowed, and even with her older body, her forearms proved years of making food by hand—and Sonny rolled out the dough, cutting shapes and designs into it. Your job was to take the finished dough from Mama Carisi and pass it to Sonny, then take the cookies he’d finished and put them in the ovens. You set the two timers and took the cookies out when they chimed, letting them cool for a bit before taking them off the sheets and refilling them with new dough. It was a well-oiled machine, and once you found the rhythm, you found that it was so much fun.

“So, how long have you two been together?” Mama Carisi asked. She had planned this: in the kitchen, neither of you could escape her questioning. You looked to Sonny, wondering if you should correct her, tell her you’re not dating, or if he would just play along.

“Um, we met a few years ago while in line at Starbucks,” Sonny explained. Not a lie; you had met when the barista called out an order and you both reached for it. You both argued over who should take it, and you had been friends since.

Mama Carisi clicked her tongue in disapproval. “And you didn’t bring her over earlier, Sonny? Perchè no?” You didn’t understand Italian, so you just continued kneading dough, your face burning.

“Ah, we haven’t been dating for years, ma! We’re only—”

“Non dirmi che siete solo amici, voglio dei nipotini, Dominick.”

“Ma! Un giorno, prometti! Now please, don’t, not now!” he said.

She gave him a look, and when her eyes connected to yours, you swallowed and paid super attention to the cookies you were transferring to the cooling rack.

**************

That night, you slept in Bella’s old room after Mama Carisi not-so-subtly told you both to sleep separated. Your face was on fire in embarrassment while you sat on the bed. There was a knock on your door, and you called out, “uh, come in?”

Sonny quickly opened the door, squeezed in, and closed it again. “Hey, sorry about my ma—she’s just...she really wants me to settle down, ya know?” He was shifting back and forth on his feet, wringing his hands.

“Um...it’s fine. I don’t know what she was saying, anyways,” you explained, smiling sheepishly.

He looked down at his feet, refusing to make eye contact. “Yeah, that’s probably for the best. But, um....”

“What is it, Sonny? You know you can tell me.”

He finally looked up at you, and you could see his nerves all over his face. “Is it...I mean, would it be okay if we.... Tomorrow, could you just...maybe pretend we’re dating? To appease her?”

“I—I—” you sputtered. Now you were really curious what it was she was saying in the kitchen. But Sonny looked so desperate, and you found yourself saying, “yeah, sure. Won’t be a problem.”

“Really? You mean it?” he asked, a smile pulling across his face. “Ah, you’re the best! Thank you so much—I’ll never forget this!”

After a few more thank you’s, he left your room and you collapsed onto your back. Was it too late to tell him that you didn’t want to fake date him? That you wanted to date him, for real?

*****************

Breakfast was delicious, but tense. You and Sonny sat across from each other and you caught him giving you long, linger looks, looks that made your face heat. You would give him a small smile, eyes connecting, before looking away. But you couldn’t tell if that was part of the façade or not. What made it more awkward was when you’d catch Mama Carisi watching you both.

The chaos started before Dominick Sr. finished washing the last dish. Teresa and her daughter Mia showed up first, followed closely by a very pregnant Bella and her new husband, Tommy. Gina and the guy Sonny referred to as “the boyfriend of the week” arrived about 20 minutes later.

You had dutifully been next to Sonny as he greeted his sisters, niece, and brother-in-law warmly, and you tried not to look embarrassed when he introduced you as his girlfriend. But the title made you smile sincerely—you only wished it wasn’t fake. Which is why you pretended it wasn’t.

Sonny, Dominick Sr., and Tommy started moving the tables together, and you, Bella, Teresa, and Mia started bringing out the cookies. Gina, her boyfriend, and Mama Carisi began arranging the cookies by what they were: the walls and roofs together, doors and windows together, people together, etc.

The girls had brought over the icing and decorations, and those got laid out, too. Once everything was out, you were unsure where to even start. So, you waited. Mia, being the youngest Carisi (not in name, but it still counted), picked her starting piece, a wall, first. And then, it was simultaneously a free-for-all, and a collaboration.

“Gina, can ya pass two roof pieces, please?”

“Hey Tommy, can you hand me that tube of red icing?”

“Mr. Carisi, could you please pass me that bag of gumdrops?”

Everyone worked on their own house, but would help each other if asked. At one point, you held Sonny’s walls up as he placed his roof on top. And everyone was talking, laughing, telling stories that happened between now and the last time they were all together.

“This gingerbread smells so good,” you commented to Sonny. It was true that the smell was overwhelming while it baked yesterday, but now it was more muted, and smelled delicious. Your mouth was watering as you build your ramshackled house—it wasn’t about who made a better looking house. It was about the tradition.

“Here,” Sonny said. He broke a leg off the gingerbread man he was currently decorating and held the leg up to your mouth. “A warning, though—once ya try my ma’s gingerbread, there’s no goin’ back ta the store bought crap.”

You smiled and bit into the leg he offered. At first, you thought he had been over exaggerating, but he wasn’t; you could never go back. “Please tell me you know the recipe—”

“I do; I’ll teach it to ya,” he replied. You gave him a smile, and he noticed a bit of frosting on your lip. Without too much thought, he leaned in and kissed you, licking the frosting from your skin. You melted into that kiss, but too soon he was pulling away from you. The look on his face though...if you didn’t know better, you’d think that kiss was intentional and not a ploy to trick his family.

****************

The gingerbread houses lasted long enough for pictures, their makers standing proudly next to them, before they were devoured. By the end of it, everyone was waddling around like Bella, happy and full.

Everyone helped with cleaning up, Dominick Sr. taking his place at the sink, washing the dishes as they came in. You and Sonny had collected garbage into bags and were carrying them outside, and you figured there was no better time to talk than now.

“Hey, Sonny?” you asked as he lifted the garbage can lid.

“What’s up, doll?”

You placed the bag in the can, then stood there awkwardly next to him. You could feel his eyes on you, so you just let it out, “you know how you said you’d do anything if I came this weekend?”

“Uh, yeah?” he replied sheepishly, curious about where you were going with that.

“Well, um...I’d like to cash that in now.” You finally looked up at him to find his blue eyes scanning your face. “May I have a kiss?”

His cheeks turned a bright pink and his eyes widened. “Oh! Uh, I’m sorry about that kiss earlier—we, uh, we don’t haveta pretend out here—”

“I meant a real kiss,” you blurted before a hand flew up to your mouth. “I’m sorry, I mean...if you didn’t want to, then that’s okay, too.” I’m so fucking stupid, you thought, turning back towards the house.

But you didn’t get too far before a hand enclosed around your wrist, pulling you backwards. You turned and Sonny was kissing you, his lips crashing to yours in a desperate kiss. You had a moment to be shocked before you closed your eyes, kissing him back with passion. His hand came up to cup your cheek, tilting you to give him more access to your mouth.

“Was that real enough for ya, doll?” he muttered against your lips, a small smile on his face.

You let out a soft chuckle before kissing him again. It was only your first “real” kiss with him, but you already knew that you didn’t want to stop. His lips were so soft against yours, his hands gentle has they held you to him.

“Would you two lovebirds hurry the hell up?” a voice called.

Sonny grinned against your lips before pulling away. “Shuddup, Gina, we’re comin’!” he yelled back. Then he reached down and laced his fingers with yours, leading you back into his family’s home, and into his life as a real girlfriend.

#sonny carisi x reader #law and order svu #law and order svu fanfic #my writing #storiesofsvuholidaybingo

[bookgeekgrrl]

My media this week (12-18 Dec 2021)

📚 STUFF I READ 📚

🥰 Itsy Bitsy Yoga (wearing_tearing) - 59K, Stucky AU - single dad Steve takes his toddler to a yoga class taught by Bucky - warm, fluffy goodness

😍 I'll Light Your Way Home series (BeaArthurPendragon) - Stucky, 61K (series) - "Two lost Vietnam vets find each other in a Hell's Kitchen gay bar one hot September night. This is how they find their way home." - stunning series set in 1969/1970 - reread with newest holiday installment

🥰👂 Wanted, A Gentleman (K.J. Charles, author; Greg Patmore, narrator)

😍 sundown starts at half-past six (halfdesertedstreets) - 62K, the Check Please/PB&J Practical Magic AU - I'm not a KP fan so it took me a while to read this and MORE FOOL ME because it was INCREDIBLE.

😊 All I Want For Christmas (Is For You To Stop Talking) (Femme (femmequixotic), noeon (noe)) - 162K, Drarry xmas kidfic that embodies the 'less of a slow burn and more two dumbasses standing around on fire" (affectionately). for me the tropes/things I liked outweighed the things I didn't; I suspect this is a YMMV story

🙂 There Arose Such A Clatter: Tales From The Naughty List (C.M. Nascosta) - monsterfucking PWP with Krampus

😐 The Prince and His Bodyguard: A Queer Fantasy Erotic Romance Short (Surra City Siege Book 1) (Mika Lark)

💖 +228K of shorter fic so shorter work shout out 💖

Gravity and Time (AidaRonan) - MCU: Stucky, 8K - had to reread last year's Marvel Trumps Hate auction gift; I fall in love more each time I read it.

[Podfic] Workplace Hazards (quietnight) - MCU: Stucky, 33K - great podfic of a great series where awkward Peter Parker joins the Avengers just in time to witness Steve & Bucky working through their relationship issues

[Podfic] Fluff (quietnight) - MCU: Stucky, 15K - another forever fave wherein my two fave dumbass emotionally constipated supersoldiers get over themselves with some help from a tribble-like Asgardian mammal that basically exudes xanax

[Podfic] Drive It Like You Stole It: A Bodyswap (quietnight) - MCU: Stucky, 28K - aka Peter Parker's Terrible, Horrible, No Good, Very Bad Roadtrip - always hilarious

Binomial Coefficients (DevilDoll) - Teen Wolf: Sterek, 20K - a forever fave classic HS AU

📺 STUFF I WATCHED 📺

Station 19 - s3, e16

Station 19 - s4, e1-16

Greys Anatomy - s17, e1-2; e6-7 (Station 19 crossovers)

🎧 PODCASTS 🎧

Shedunnit - The Dispenser

The Atlas Obscura Podcast - Post Office Bay

Strong Songs - "Babylon Sisters" by Steely Dan

Shedunnit - The Hay Poisoner

Richmond Til We Die: A Ted Lasso Podcast - Ted Lasso S2E3: We're A Team Ain't We?

The Atlas Obscura Podcast - The Naica Cave

Strong Songs - "Hide and Seek" by Imogen Heap

Shedunnit - Bedside Manner

Shedunnit - The Collectors

99% Invisible #470 - The Three Santas of Slovenia

The Atlas Obscura Podcast - Shipwrecked Doritos

Shedunnit - Cui Bono?

Shedunnit - Dorothy’s Secret

Shedunnit - Mary Westmacott

Howl's Moving Castle [BBC Full-Cast Dramatization] (available until 23 Jan 2022)

Shedunnit - E.C.R. Lorac

Shedunnit - Murder On Holiday

The Atlas Obscura Podcast - Happy Holidays from the Atlas Obscura Team

Song Exploder - Danny Elfman "What’s This?" (from “The Nightmare Before Christmas”)

Shedunnit - A Room Of One’s Own

Shedunnit - The Detection Club

Shedunnit - The Lifelong Fan

Shedunnit - Locked Room

Shedunnit - The Telephone Call

Fireside Mystery Theatre - Yours Truly: Prologue

Fireside Mystery Theatre - Yours Truly: "The Archives of H.A.N.D. — The Liz B. Situation"

Shedunnit - The Psychology of Anthony Berkeley

Shedunnit - The Butler Did It

Shedunnit - Peace At Last

Shedunnit - Death Sets Sail On The Nile

Shedunnit - Spoiler Warning

Shedunnit - The Christie Completists

Shedunnit - A Christie For Christmas

Shedunnit - Poison Pen

Shedunnit - The People’s Pathologist

Shedunnit - The First Whodunnit

🎶 MUSIC 🎶

Chill Mix #2

Strong Songs playlist

Ultimate Collection

My Mix #3

My Christmas playlist

All I Want for Christmas Is Pop!

#sunday reading recap #bookgeekgrrl's reading habits #bookgeekgrrl's soundtracks #fanfic ftw #still hyperfixated on station 19 and on the shedunnit podcast #no regrets #that bbc radio adaptation of howl's moving castle is very enjoyable #i adore any version that puts howl back in the welsh rugby jersey #and has him speaking welsh #shedunnit podcast #strong songs podcast #richmond til we die podcast #99% invisible podcast #song exploder #tried out the fireside mystery theatre podcast #it was perfectly fine #just didn't grab me enough to make me add it to my regular rotation #now that my birthday is over i can listen to xmas music #atlas obscura podcast #fan makers are a *gift*

[onlyhereforangst]

I think Emily made the decision last minute to leave. One thing I noticed is that Katrina laws character was introduced as a mother with a stay at home husband in all the reports in March. Originally she was cast to replace Maria Bello so she did not need to be a potential love match for Torres. I think in this time from when her character was first introduced in the press(March) to when she stepped foot on set Emily made the decision to leave.This is why the writing team changed the premise of Jessica Knight to form a replacement for the Ellick ship because it was at this time they knew it wouldn't be happening anymore as Emily would be leaving. Thus, they decided to make Jessica knight a possible love match for Torres to replace the void from Ellick. It seems to be too much of a coincidence and also her first episode her and Torres were very flirty. Also, Wilmer did a ton of interviews about the finale saying grab your tissues and this is the closest to a friendship or a relationship they are ever going to have so he hinted prior to the finale that the Ellick ship was doomed. It is driving me mad that we had no clear picture of what their relationship was after the elevator talk. I think they got together as Ellie said 'I never meant for us to happen' but then she felt guilty because she knew she was leaving and 'blew him off' as he said without reason. That seems to be the most logical assumption. What do you think?

ok so i've let this sit for two weeks, i apologize. i still have a hard time digging into this stuff specifically because i like to live in denial that Emily isn't returning. i can bargain the remainder of the finale away if i forget that Emily isn't coming back. but i'm having a particularly depressive day in regards to her exit so why the hell not twist the knife a little harder and clear out my inbox 🙃 imma put it under the cut though for aesthetically-appeasing dash purposes and long posts

first- i 100% agree that Emily's decision to leave was a last minute *announcement* and i clarify that because i have to genuinely believe that Emily wouldn't take this decision lightly knowing her fanbase. i of course could be wrong about that, but even if i come off as a bitch to people i do like to give people the benefit of the doubt, always. so while I do think Emily didn't come into this decision willy-nilly (and i'm not going to speculate on her reasons for leaving- it's her own life she can choose to live it however she pleases), it does feel as if she didn't announce it to the show until, IMO after they wrapped all filming.

the finale was certainly more akin to a multi-episode arc for a character and plotline, not a final exit episode. Wilmer boasted great cliffhangers and a tear-filled episode because yes, they thought Ellie was ditching and betraying the team- that's heavy angst stuff! And yes we got a taste of ellick being *real* and even got a kiss- of course in his interviews he thought this was going to be good stuff for the fans. all the actors (Wilmer especially though) and the main social media accounts of the show did a shit-ton of promotion for the episodes leading up to the finale and then after 18x15 aired, the week prior everyone and i mean everyone went radio silent. i'm sorry but who THE FUCK does that when you are supposedly airing this big action-filled, cliffhanger, "true" finale that we deserved because s17 didn't get to have one??? NO ONE. the answer is no one. shows that want ratings (aka all shows, it’s a business) promote their fucking finale. they fucking do. my theory? in between that last week, Emily announced to the cast/crew/EPs that she wouldn’t be returning for s19. and then that leaves them with a WTF finale because that’s a shitty write off for a character who spent 8 years on the show. and now, suddenly, the show would prefer as little as viewership as possible to help minimize the backlash. Wilmer does absolutely zero promotion, zero farewell to his co-actor and good friend of 5 years. so yeah, i think her last minute exit was a last minute announcement and it had everyone reeling, understandably. hopefully one day we’ll get answers on the why because between me and you- that’s what absolutely fucking destroys me. for both the actress and the character; not knowing why Ellie did what she did and feeling a little betrayed Emily left and we got so little why and acknowledgement and heads up for it. 

anyways, so i don’t think Wilmer was lying in those interviews, i think he was truly excited about the arc and what that meant for their characters. he could have been just as blindsided with her announcement as we were 🥺

as for Katrina Law’s character- that is a little intriguing because you’re right, when she was initially introduced it was as a married woman with an infant child and stay at home husband. zero of this has been mentioned and Katrina Law herself has taken to twitter with Diona to support a Kasie/Jessica ship. so i’m not sure what her background is, if they writers changed it at all or what. BUT i don’t see them putting Jessica and Nick together. I actually didn’t see those scenes as them flirting at all- more of falling into step as good pals, very reminiscent of Ziva and Nick’s relationship frankly. If Emily’s announcement of her leaving truly was last minute, to everyone including the show, I don’t see the writers and EPs putting them together. I see them scrambling to fix their destroyed cliffhanger arc they had teed up and likely writing a desolate Nick or a vengeful swan Nick. I do not see them giving him a new love interest *unless* they decide to go 2 for 2 with character assassinations and have him regress so far and erase all his growth. but you know who the fuck knows with this shit show 🥲🥲

ok and finally ahaha this is why i did a cut. can y’all imagine what will happen if/when i ever do a wwr? 😅 i’m in the boat that they were *not* a thing, ever. i’m in the boat that that was their first kiss. and i’ll probably break this down more at a later date, TBD because when the fuck will i be strong enough to rewatch the entire finale i almost cried this morning watching 13x10. BUT her “i didn’t mean for us to happen” to me was more of a i didn’t mean for us to slowly fall in love and go from partners to best friends to almost lovers. because i think they both acknowledged their feelings during The Talk™️ but i feel like they both mutually agreed that they needed to take it slow or weren’t sure how to take that next step and they sort of tabled the discussion and stalled in their relationship. then, (since i’m in the camp that Ellie did none of this fully willingly, and instead Odette is holding something over her) Ellie “blew him off” after Odette decided it was now (”now...wasn’t my choice” aka i think Odette got worried about Ellie having strings attached and weaknesses) by saying they should definitely take it slow because of the nature of their jobs (”if we had a normal 9-5″...”i get that, i do”). i think Nick accepted that excuse at the time and then when the pieces clicked at the end of the finale, he realized this whole stupid ass mission was the reason she tried to slow them down/push him away. all that to say, i’m still believing that was their first kiss until Ellie turns up pregnant with Nick’s kid because WHY NOT REUSE OLD STORYLINES WHY THE FUCK NOT WE’VE ALREADY COME THIS FAR. 

#ellick #if you can tell #i'm going through shit today #is it too early to down a bottle of wine #asking for a friend #once again sorry for letting this sit i needed time to actually write this all out #ask #anonymous

[thedefinitionofendgame]

18- amelia with scout

prompt is from this list - “It’s okay. It’s fine. I’m here. Everything will be alright.” (post s17 finale...sorry in advance)

Amelia needed her son. She couldn’t be here anymore, at this wedding celebrating love when hers had just washed away with the waves of the beach. She had waited for Link to get up, to realize that when she said she didn’t want to get married, she meant it. But he kept staying on one knee, looking so hopeful that all Amelia could do was watch. And to get Zola, Bailey and Ellis involved? She almost wanted to say yes for their sake. Although she couldn’t do that, not to herself. Not after everything she had fought internally with herself for the past half year. If her AA meetings taught her anything, it was that she had her own voice and needed to do something with it. If she wasn’t going to confront others, then she should at least be able to say no when it applied. This was her first time saying ‘no’ and it hurt more than anything else in the world.

She told herself as she stood there, that she wasn’t saying no to the man she loved. She wasn’t say no to the life he wanted with her; the forever they both craved. He wanted another kid, and marriage was the first step to that, but it wasn’t a second kid Amelia was scared of. If necessary, she could’ve said yes to the proposal, but told him she didn’t want another kid. Instead, Amelia was saying no to the laws that would bind her to Link, good or bad. Maybe it was partly her bad associations with marriage, or the fact that men seemed to think that a wedding ring solved everything. She and Link had jumped straight to the “baby in a carriage” part of the stupid childhood song and hadn’t even discussed anything else before then. Amelia really didn’t want to rush anything else. Wasn’t simply loving the other person enough?

Growing up, Amelia learned that from an early age that people always wanted more. Her father’s death was an example. The men who came into the store didn’t just settle for the cash box. They wanted more, and more happened to be her father’s watch that he wasn’t willing to give up. As a brain surgeon, Amelia’s skills were tested every single day. There was always a new case and people always expected her to improve. But in reality, Amelia was just barely holding on.

The only person who didn’t care what Amelia looked like, or acted like, was her son. Scout was her pride and joy and it was hard to imagine him not being here with her. She finally got to be a mom, and understand what her own mother felt. Scout didn’t expect anything new from her; only love and food. If anything he was going to be what kept Link and Amelia talking. Otherwise, they would just be another lost love case, like the ones they dealt with day by day at the hospital. There were so many break ups and showdowns that each day felt like a mountain of love to climb and here Amelia was, not even packed for her own journey.

Scout had been left with Alison at the hospital daycare during the wedding. Amelia was already supposed to be the one to pick him up in case Link had had something to drink at the wedding. So when Amelia showed up hours earlier than expected for her son, the daycare staff were surprised but let Scout go without fuss. Everyone knew her anyways, even if she had barely been at work since having Scout and the pandemic starting. Amelia just needed to hold her son and he was happy to feel her embrace.

“Mama,” he cooed, grabbing at the neckline on her red dress. The one that Link had told her looked hot as they left for the wedding. The one he had tried to feel her up in in the car, before she swatted his hand away and told him “later” with a wink. So much for that happening now. Red wasn’t normally Amelia’s colour, but even she knew she looked good. Scout was wrinkling it and Amelia wasn’t bothered anymore. She was just going to dump it on the floor when she got home.

Where was home even after today? Was Link’s apartment, where half of her stuff resided, her safe place? Was it Meredith’s house because her sisters were the ones to love her no matter what? Amelia had so many questions, although she had zero answers. That wasn’t new to her, she typically felt like she was living in the unknown. No one told her anything and she had to fight to find things out for herself. In the end, Amelia felt overwhelmed because she was surprised with news that required a reaction. A reaction that was “appropriate” but sometimes she just wanted to scream and cover her ears.

In the end, Amelia decided to head back to Link’s apartment. She had a feeling he would go see Jo, his best friend, and Amelia didn’t want to shuttle questions from Meredith or see her nieces and nephew after scaring them about proposals for the rest of their lives. With Scout in her arms, she gathered up his things and drove them both home.

Luckily the apartment was empty. Link hadn’t come home and Amelia settled Scout down to bed, before she stripped out of her dress and threw on a t-shirt and sweatpants. Out the big window in her bedroom, was the sun setting over the horizon. On the beach where Amelia imagined Maggie and Winston’s wedding was still taking place, the view would be spectacular. She would’ve gotten the cutest pictures of her and Link, to finally give him a profile picture in her phone (she regrets not giving him one sooner). Why did she have to ruin everything?

Amelia was ready to collapse on the couch, when she heard her son crying. Amelia had never liked the concept of letting babies “cry it out” since becoming a mom, so she went into Scout’s room and scooped him into her arms. “It’s okay. It’s fine. I’m here. Everything will be alright.” Amelia felt Scout press his little face into her chest. Tears slipped down her cheeks as she cuddled her son. His hands hung onto her shirt and he began to calm down in her embrace. The words she had told him were more for her than anyone else at this point. They didn’t help her worries about what the next morning would bring, or the weeks to follow. But they calmed Scout down and maybe would work magic on her internal struggles.

Amelia was destructive and she knew it. Hell, she had been told that on many occasions by people she still loved to this day. That didn’t mean she was unloveable, right? Then she had to go and ruin the one real case of love she had felt for a guy who was good for her. Link was so damn good for her and it hurt her heart to think about what she had just ruined. Destroyed, because she couldn't keep anything together for long. God, why was she such a mess?

These questions would never have straight responses. Amelia wasn’t sure what was next and even though it might be scary, deep down she realized she made the right choice. It might not have been the best one for all the parties involved, but it was the choice she needed to make.

And now she had to deal with the fallout.

Written by @thedefinitionofendgame (aka me)

#prompt #grey's anatomy #amelia and scout #amelia shepherd #scout derek shepherd lincoln #the definition of endgame

[heartachebf]

16, 17 (Tweek), and 25 -Batz 🖤💜

fandom asks

16. favorite behind-the-scenes insight ive actually got 2 answers for this !! first off, i love the fact that kenny is based off a Real Life kid trey knew growing up, who was Also named kenny n wore an orange coat that nobody could hear him over And was the poorest kid in town. and i rly love that kyle is blatantly based off matt stone ^_^ i have a big gay crush on matt so obvi that makes kyle one of my favs

17. 3 things you love about [insert character]

1. the fact that he can play piano And sing And act ^_^ i love that artsy little dweeb so much 2. the fact that his tics slowly got better over the years... sobbing n wailing.... AND the fact that he barely tics when hes around craig.... love wins 3. i love that he can kick ass should he choose to ^_^ he could maim someone so easily and i think he deserves to bonus number 4 bc i love him so much. i love that he can bake ^_^ i like to think that he stress bakes and will try out new recipes n then he'll take what he baked to school to let his friends try ^_^ hes god tier actually

25. favorite episode of [insert season] u didnt specify which season, so ill give my favs of each season (below the cut bc this post is getting long) (id also probs do this even if u Did specify which season bc. peace and love)

s1: i cant pick between episode 7, black friday (bc i Love the feel of all the early halloween episodes) or episode 10, damien (bc damien supremacy ^_^ im forever obsessed w the fact that he, the son of satan, has a super high pitched voice)

s2: EPISODE 17, GNOMES !!!!! i think that was tweeks first introduction and as such, its my fav ^_^ i rly love his voice in that ep <3

s3: episode 5, tweek vs craig, bc duh ^_^ the beginning of an era <3 plus its proof that tweek is tough n doesnt need protecting

s4: either episode 6, cherokee hair tampons (bc i love how fiercely stan tries to help kyle + its revealed that kyle has diabetes ^_^ i will forever cry over the fact that stan didnt hesitate to offer his kidney to save kyles life) or episode 8, something you can do with your finger (bc i love their silly little boy band + i love wendy joining their boy band + kyle wanting to be the tough one of the band + randy backstory/him being a lil insane but in a funny way)

s5: episode 3, super best friends ^_^ the origin of stan n kyle being super best friends ^_^ i also kinda love episode 10, how to eat with your butt, bc kenny is very endearing in it And we finally get to see what kyles hair looks like <3

s6: either episode 9, free hat, or episode 11, child abduction is not funny bc theres so much excellent tweek content ^_^ i also like ep11 bc of how dumb the parents are in that one, thats always amusing

s7: either episode 8, south park is gay (the fact that everyone was acting a lil fruity ^_^ gay rights ^_^ and also kyle rejecting dressing fruity and getting made fun of for that. so funny considering the fact that he Is gay, i prommy, kyle told me himself) or episode 14, raisins (bc butters was very sweet that episode + goth stan was introduced ^_^)

s8: omg this ones so hard to pick. i love episode 4, you got f'd in the a, bc stan having to get in a dance battle??? comedy gold. i love episode 6, the jeffersons, bc we stan n kyle being dads to blanket, gay ptide. and then i also love episode 11, quest for ratings, bc i love the guys having their own news team And i love that craig had a show dedicated to just showing cute animals. dork craig rights

s9: episode 10, follow that egg ... more silly little stan n kyle content ... stan gets rly fruity here and im obsessed w it. that whole episode gives me silly little au ideas ^_^

s10: episode 14, stanleys cup. froths at the mouth. that one anon of mine, hockey fic anon? theyre writing a silly little fic based off an au of That episode ^_^ that ep is so quality

s11: goes insane. episode 8, le petit tourette bc i loved seeing cartman in anguish + dork craig content. episodes 10, 11, and 12 aka the imaginationland trilogy bc. god. just so good. i cant even explain it. episode 13, guitar queer-o bc it gives me Another great au idea + stan n kyle are fruity in it. and finally, episode 14, the list, bc there was lots of good wendy content And kyle got a little unhinged ^_^ as he deserves <3

s12: this is another one where its so hard to pick... episode 1, tonsil trouble, bc kyle got to go in attack mode again. episode 3, major boobage, bc we got silly little kenny content ^_^ episode 9, breast cancer show ever, bc thats when wendy beat the shit out of cartman <3 episodes 10 and 11, pandemic and pandemic 2, bc. craig content ^_^ and also ive already talked on my blog abt how its the best 2 parter ever. and episode 13, elementary school musical, bc stans gang was particularly goofy n their musical number was so fun ^_^

s13: episode 8, dead celebrities, bc kyle and ike content!!! i love them so much!!! and also episode 11, whale whores, bc stan Attacked And Killed all for the love of animals, n i love him for it

s14: episodes 11, 12, and 13, tha superhero episodes ^_^ i loved getting to see everyones superhero costumes in action And we got to learn more abt kennys immortality, which was so exciting !!

s15: episodes 7 and 8, youre getting old and ass burgers. starts sniffling and crying and collapses on the floor while sobbing. thats all i have to say about that, peace and love

s16: episode 5, butterballs (bc stan is so! hes just so !!! yknow. the anti bullying song in it is So good, And i live for butters standing up for himself ^_^ also the song at the end is god tier), episode 6, i never shouldve gone ziplining (its so fuckn funny, and i live for the live action bit at the end), and episode 11, going native (bc of that sweet, sweet butters n kenny content ^_^ i also live for butters Attacking in it)

s17: episode 4, goth kids 3: dawn of the posers. probably my fav goth kids centric episode ^_^ its so good n funny

s18: episode 3, the cissy. starts sniffling and crying again, but this time in transgender mode. i also love episode 6, freemium isnt free bc we get another Glimpse into stans issues w addiction ^_^ peace and love on planet earth

s19: episode 6, tweek x craig. love wins, gay ptide, etc etc

s20: um. i actually kinda hated this season. but ig if i Had to choose one, itd be episode 10, the end of serialization as we know it, bc it finally ended that season ^_^ no offense to any s20 stans out there, i just thought it was so boring

s21: episode 2, put it down. tweek n craig content, gay ptide ^_^ this is also the one where we learned that tweek can sing, play piano, And bake, and we also got to see craig learn how to support tweek better, which was very sweet ^_^

s22: episode 10, bike parade. i didnt super love this season either, so its kinda a case of picking the one i wasnt bored with. plus in a way it kinda felt like one of the original episodes, it was like a lil blast from the past !

s23: episode 2, band in china ^_^ we got stans band, crimson dawn !! it was great learning more abt how stan felt abt having to move to a farm, plus butters ripping it on a guitar was so funny. and then randy did stuff too idk

s24: this season has just been the 2 specials so far, but i liked the vaccination special, episode 2 the best ^_^ bc 1, the brovorce arc started, n im rly excited to see what happens with that. and also the way it ended left me hopeful that maybe the shows gonna go back to the way it used to be a little bit <3 i also liked how we saw stan gettin really mentally ill with freaking out over the pandemic, but that mightve been in the first episode instead...

#collapses into a heap. it took me forever to write this #but thats ok bc ur worth it dude ^_^ #honestly i dont super remember s20 and onward so. my favs might change when i get to rewatching those #but oh well ^_^ peace and love #craig.txt #asks #south park tag #baz/ezra/magnus tag

[glassesandkim]

Jake was non existent on social media yesterday. Usually when it's an episode he likes my feed is filled with his posts. All he did was tweet about pink scrubs and a good bye to Jesse Williams then he logged off. If you follow live tweets during the show you'd know this is very odd for him.

👀👀👀👀

I wouldn’t be too happy either if I were Jake IF this is all Levi gets all season after being promoted as a season regular. 

It’s kind of a slap in the face to your craft and ability. Jake is an actor first and he just gets script after script of lazy writing and comedic filler. He was promised something (to have a bigger role and to represent lgbtq+ people). He did that in s15 without the pay upgrade and now in s17, he’s whatever the hell this Levi is. 

I’m not asking for a happy ending for schmico or demanding that only picture perfect “healthy” relationships are represented when it comes to queer couples in media (I’d explain more on this maybe in another post if anyone is interested), but I’m really just asking for every action that Nico and Levi make to be framed in comprehensive, thought out and planned ways. 

The premise of their storyline is FINE (where one person is more committed than the other and then they just keep missing each other with that) but the way this story is being told is terrible and lacking backbone. It’s not enough to have a million bench scenes and have these characters say one or two lines to completely explain WHOLE entire mental crises and thoughts. Grey’s doesn’t SHOW us stuff anymore. All they do is TELL TELL TELL through monologues, through dramatic hooks right before these monologues, and through awkward conversations that would never happen in real life.

Cristina and Meredith had that. They talked at each other without acknowledging each other’s stories but that’s them. That’s THEIR dynamic. Taking that dynamic and applying it to MULTIPLE characters is crazy????? (A good example to this clip where both Levi and Taryn start talking in that really specific odd way that every grey’s character talks like now)

I’ve really only seen Owen and Jackson being written in a way that showed their turmoil and their pain (the ep where he finds out teddy is cheating and last last last ep where he starts crying in the stairwell breaking bad news to a patient’s family. Jackson with the goddanm meat grinder.). Otherwise everyone talks the same and is psycho.

These characters are husks of what they used to be. They serve only the purpose of forwarding plots that the network or writers want to preach instead of doing real character work.

#so ya i don’t typically read into what celebs do on their social media but LOL @ Jake being petty af #I Iove to see it #schmico #gk asks #grey's anatomy #anonymous

[d-pennants]

Through the Moon Instagram Live

Partial transcript of the Instagram Live with Justin Richmond and Aaron Ehasz. It was only posted for 24 hours and a lot of stuff was talked about. I tried to copy the answers as close to what was actually said, but I won’t guarantee I didn’t mishear or miss stuff. I just focused on the stuff about tDP.

No S4 announcement today.

Do you have a favorite character? Are you allowed to play favorites? JR: Yeah. I definitely have characters that I like more than other characters, but I’ll never admit who they are. [laughs]

Fine, how about hints about S5 then?

AE: Justin and I were working on a scene this morning, a scene in which someone makes a sacred promise to Bait. Hope that’s not to big a spoiler.

[Explaining about Through the Moon which is out today (Oct 6th) Shout out to Xanthe Bouma & Peter Wartman, who will be there for the AMA on Friday. And shout out to the team at Scholastic.]

[Technical issues made the audio break up while JR was relocating. I couldn’t catch what the actually questions were for this little bit, but I caught some of the answers.]

Question about Zuko’s VA Dante Basco

AE: He’s amazing to work with. I’d definitely be happy to work with him.

Question about Callum’s Mage Wings

AE: I’d just get mage wing out even just to go to the bathroom at night if I were Callum.

Question about Runaan

AE: I don’t know. That’s a mystery. Runaan is certainly in the magical cursed coin in some form. But I don’t know what he’ll do or if he can survive it. But that’s a story we’ll be certain to tell.

[JR relocated & AE had to log out and rejoin, which fixed the issue.]

Are there other graphic novels coming? Is Through the Moon part of a series with an over arching plot?

JR: Hopefully yes. Hopefully we get to do some more with Scholastic. This is a standalone. It is part of the core story of the Dragon Prince. It counts as canon. But there’s not a sequel to Though the Moon.

AE: We would love to do more graphic novels. We are actively talking about and planning it. Definitely in the cards. But not necessarily an over arching story.

Asking about Janai’s brother?

AE: We’re going to find out about Janai’s brother for sure. He’s a really cool character, a lot of fun.

What do Moonshadow elves do during a full moon? Do they just become invisible.

AE: It’s not just invisibility. It is a stealth mode. I think we talk about it as like they’re almost partially slipping into a “Moon dimension” that partially obscures how visible they are. But also their physically is maybe changed at bit so they can partially materialize for a split instant to do damage, then they’re phasing out. I think they’re phasing in and out of some kind of Moon dimension. So it’s partially invisibility, but there’s also some defense and fighting stuff that happens.

What does Moonberry juice taste like?

AE: In my mind the things that are conjured are some kind of juice blend. Mulberry juice, pomegranate. Justin talked about a bit of cran involved? But I always think mulberries.

JR: Try mulberry juice. Mulberries have like the weirdest, coolest taste. If you haven’t tried it you should do it.

AE: Not ignoring S4 questions, but we just don’t have a good answer. We are working on it. But we don’t have a S4 date. We getting things moving in a good way and we’re excited but we won’t have the information on a date for S4. We really appreciate you being patient for that. Don’t have any age criteria that we can reveal right now.

Will there be outfit changes for the dragon squad?

JR: There’s already some in the graphic novel. Rayla gets some pretty great pyjamas.

AE: They’re just going to rotate outfits. They’re just gonna trade clothes. You should see how great Soren gonna looks wearing Claudia’s clothes. How Callum’s going to look squeezed into some of Ezran’s outfits. Everybody’s just gonna try on each other’s stuff.

JR: I like it. Too bad that actually 3D doesn’t work like that, where you just trade outfits. Because it’d be hilarious. Yeah, of course, people are going to change outfits. There’s going to be some cool new stuff to see. Absolutely going forward.

Is Callum close to obtaining any other arcanum / going to learn any other arcanum in the future?

JR: No spoilers, but there’s little bit of a hint of some of the answer to this in this graphic novel, so you should check it out. I don’t want to spoil anything. I think Callum fascinated by all the arcanum. He’s not just limiting his interest to Sky.

AE: If you’re a betting person, isn’t Callum’s going to be the first human archmage. A little bit trolling, but yeah, he loves magic. He’s fascinated. But he’s groundbreaking. He’s doing things humans haven’t done before and his potential is limitless. May not be S4, may be S17 at that point.

Will there there be more Sarai? I really want Callum and Ezran to visit her memorial statue.

JR: That would be a beautiful moment. That’d be great, that’d be pretty cool to see. There will be some more Sarai, we’ll find out more about their family. I’m not sure how much we’re aware, but Sarai is certainly not gone from the series. You’ll see Sarai again.

Is the Key of Aaravos actually the key of where he was imprisoned?

AE & JR: We can’t tell you.

JR: We don’t even know. We haven’t even discovered the answer yet.

AE: We know! Actually, that was one of the first things we knew at the very beginning. We’ll get to it.

Is the Sun arcanum the only one that can heal? Or maybe the Ocean arcanum can heal as well/or to?

AE: Great question. Yes. I suspect there are healing abilities possible through different primals. Ocean is a perfect example. I think it’s likely different kinds of healers that call on different energy to restore life and health to those who are injured or sick.

Could original characters introduced in the graphic novels potentially make it into the show?

JR: Absolutely. It’s a huge universe, so we won’t hold back if we think somebody from a graphic novel or the game will fit into the show in the right way, of course we would do that. One of the cool things about working with all the same team is that stuff like that can happen, because we can control all of it. Which is amazing. It’s a great feeling.

AE: There’s a character we’ve talked about for a while from the video game and recently that character finally had their moment in the show. We wanna see different ways to access the world and characters.

JR: Also we’re working with Fandom on a tabletop RPG so that can go another way. You can see characters coming into the show.

Do we have to read the graphic novel before we watch S4?

AE: I don’t think we should say too much. You don’t have too, but everything that happened in the graphic novel happened before S4, it really happened. So can probably infer some of it, but best experience will be read the graphic novel. Get yourself up to date.

How will Zym progress throughout the seasons? Will he grow up and learn to talk and how to manage his powers?

JR: I don’t want to say too much. Zym is going to grow along with the other characters. He’s not static. He’s a puppy, he’s a little baby, and he’s growing up.

AE: We’ll see Zym growing up more for sure.

Will there be more Gren content?

AE & JR: Yeah! [Laughing] AE: Of course. JR: How could there not be? AE: Didn’t we announce already that season 5’s Book 5: Gren? JR: Books 5 through 14 is all Gren. Then we’ll come back around to the other arcanum.

Will we ever get to see Ellis and Ava again?

AE & JR: Maybe? Probably. JR: Not 100%

How did the idea of making the graphic novel come about?

JR: Couple of things. We were talking to Scholastic and they were saying “what if we did this thing together” and we were fascinated by that idea. We’ve always been interested in comics. It sorta came up very naturally with them. And then we started talking about the story, Aaron and I, that could fit in here with the writers and stuff. I felt like a natural thing. That’s how I remember it - Aaron may have other memories of it.

AE: I think that the whole dream of this partnership with Scholastic has been to serve the community by being able to continue tell stories in the wider world of Xadia, through graphic novels, and novels and other books. That part of why we’re so excited about this partnership. It’s so much more depth and insight into different characters parts of the world that we may not have time for in the 22 minutes on Netflix. So the partnership with Scholastic is perfect for deepening and expanding those stories. That’s what it comes down to.

JR: They introduced us to Xanthe and Peter, who just absolutely crushed it.

AE: Yes. [Name?] is still at Wonderstorm if someone asks. It’s still happening. JR: Yes, I talked to him yesterday. He absolutely still here. Xanthe and Peter, we got introduced to them through Scholastic and they just absolutely knocked this out the park. It was a joy to work with both of them and what an amazing job they both did on this. We’re super excited to have gotten to work with them on a graphic novel.

AE: More shout outs to Xanthe Bouma and Peter Wartman.

What did Aaravos say to Khessa?

JR: We can’t say. AE: We can’t, but Janai is wondering that too. And we’re excited about it. It’s weird - I’m not being helpful, but it’s a good question. I may not be giving a satisfying answer, but it’s a good question.

How does Janai know Aaravos spoke to Khessa?

AE: She might not have seen it, but she’s going to find out about it.

Someone asked about the Orphan Queen.

AE: We love the Orphan Queen and there are more references coming seasons 4 and onward. It’s a story I’ve always wanted to tell. We think it will be a great movie someday, maybe. The story of the Orphan Queen is certainly relevant to the story and the saga as it’s unfolding now. It’s a cool story we wanna tell.

We know only some Skywing elves have wings, and not all Sunfire have fire-mode, but what about Moonshadow elves. As they can only use their powers once a month, rather than at any given moment, is it an ability all (or at least most) of them have or is it just some of them?

AE: I think it’s one of those things where Moonshadow elves are in tune with the Moon primal, and one of the very powerful skills that a Moonshadow elf being in tune with that arcanum can master is moonshadow mode, that makes you an excellent assassin, so they evolved this culture that does some of this stealthy, assassin work. It’s certainly possible that there are other powers and abilities that come from connecting to that arcanum that can be directly realized - that a Moonshadow elf might be able to manifest. So you may see some of that in the future. Maybe you have some ideas for your fanfiction or your cool art to show some of those powers, but the powers and abilities really come from them being attuned to these primals and some of it comes naturally and some it comes with training and bringing out the ability to do the special thing. I don’t see why it’s limited. In learning, for example, that Sunfire elves have at least two abilities that can connect to the arcanum is part of what may help understand that.

Do we read fanfictions?

AE: Yes and no - not so much. We highly encourage it and we love people do it. Every once in a while we get someone saying “you gotta look at this, it’s so charming” or “oh, this is so cool.” Or someone will bring something to our attention. There is some really amazing work out there and there’s some writers who are terrific. But as a rule I don’t think we do it regularly when someone says “check this out”.

Will there be more dark mages?

JR: Yes. You will see more dark mages, 100%. But I don’t want to say any more than that. AE: It’s interesting too. This is one of the great things about Scholastic partnership again, that there’s this sort of interplay about things you find out in the show and I think at least one of the dark mages is very significant. The first time people will hear about that person will be in Book 2: Sky the core novel. That’s someone who plays him in the story, in the saga, once the series comes back. But yeah, there’s a very important dark mage who will come up in that book.

Did Aaravos create dark magic?

AE: No, it was discovered not created. Did Aaravos turn them onto it or help them discover it? That’s very possible. Whether Aaravos played a role in developing their ability to do dark magic. Exploring the possibilities of dark magic.

Will we meet other types of dragon and/or archdragons?

JR: 100% yes. Dragon’s in the name. We’re bound by oath! AE: There will be dragons.

Is it possible the dragon king will unfreeze?

AE: Should we not answer that? I feel like it’s possible, but I don’t want to encourage or get anyone too excited. I think being turned to stone is a pretty dismal fate.

Can elves do dark magic?

AE: Can we just say yes? JR: Absolutely. Elves can do dark magic. Totally possible.

How do you go about populating Xadia with cities and landmarks? Do you have the landmarks and find places that fit or did you have the shape and find things to fill it? Or mixture of both? JR: A bit of both. There were some places we’d talked about and generally knew where it is or what this place is going to be. But some of it, when we saw the first version of that map, and the details, we were like “oh my goodness,” there were some obvious things we wanted to put in there. Then there’s some easter eggy stuff that just fun.

Do we think Claudia deserves a redemption arc?

AE: Why does she need a redemption arc. Why are you judging her? What has see done that requires redemption? She’s pretty much in the clear. JR: I’m insulted for her. (laughs)

Is Corvus’ middle name Dennis?

AE: Do you want it to be Dennis? JR: It can absolutely be Dennis. No reason it can’t be. I think I know where this comes from. There was a running gag in the writers between Devon and myself where we call Corvus “Dennis Trackerman.” There was a whole thing. It went on way too long. AE: We hadn’t named him yet. JR: We were talking about if there were a whole family of Trackerman, cousins and it went on way too long. I think his middle name could absolutely be Dennis. AE: Seems right to me. JR: So it’s official - Corvus Dennis Trackerman.

Is there a certain reason Rayla is scared of water and if there is will we find out more about it in the show?

AE: I think there may be. We may find out more about it. Part of it is because of the way she’s wired. I think she’s great at running through the trees and balancing and doing the things she does, is she senses the stability of the earth beneath her, the amount of stability or flexibility of a tree limb or side of a cliff. She’s very sensitive and in tuned. I think when you take someone like that and put them in the water, I think it - whoosh - overwhelms them. It alarming. Some of it’s a little physical, but I suspect there may have been something that happened. She certainly brings a sense of emotion around it, feels like it’s beyond discomfort. JR: I feel like there was a tra-

[There was a bit of a pause so they ending up talking over each other. AE starts asking the next question while JR gets cut off].

Someone asked if we can learn the backstory on Ethari?

AE: I know that there’s a beautiful story about Ethari’s birthday on our website that can give you a glimmer. But I think that’s something I would love to hear. I’m sure it’s something that Devon and Ian - perhaps Neil has thought about.

Do you think you’ll explore Callum’s dad or is he not important to the story?

AE: I think it’s possible we’ll learn more about Callum’s dad in the sense of the role he played in Sarai’s life and Callum’s own life. Hopefully in one of the books that comes out. JR: Yes, he is important. He’s foundational to how Callum became Callum.

Will the Dragon Queen in more involved in Season 4?

AE & JR: Yes. Dragons.

Is Rayla the main character of the story of Through the Moon?

JR: It’s Rayla focused, but it’s like the show, there’s various non-Rayla bits. But if I had to pick a main I’d say yeah, Rayla. AE: Probably ask Xanthe what she thought about that question.

Do we see more Crow Master?

JR: We can never get enough Crow Master as far as I’m concerned. If the show was just the Gren and Crow Master show I feel like we can make some stuff happen. We’ll definitely see more of him.

AE: Yesterday we were working on a Crow Master scene, and the writers were like, do we need it, and like, It’s a Crow Master scene!

Is it canon elves have 6 toes?

JR: I think they have 4 toes, right? AE: I’m not sure what happened there. I think that’s an oops someone made. I suspect they have 4 digits per hand or foot.

[Side note: I think Jack DeSena was talking about 6 toes on Zoom into Xadia]

“Gren” is that the main spinoff?

AE: We were gonna a have a spinoff that was just Gren, like the character’s life. Even if it was just mainly Gren enjoying the morning and getting ready for work and winding down at the end of the day and possibly waking up in the middle of the night, thinking about things and going back to sleep. Cause, things will be fine.

Will the history of Xadia’s splitting be important in the future?

JR: Yes, absolutely. That event is crazy important in terms of the history of the continent. You may not see more of the actually event of it, the getting split, but it’s a huge deal that matters a lot.

Soulfang serpents feed on the souls of their prey, does that make them a Moon primal creature?

AE & JR: I think that’s right. JR: And they’re terrifying.

Does Bait have a middle name or a glowtoad tribal name? They’d love to see how Ezran found or got Bait?

JR: I think we’ve said Ezran got Bait from Harrow. Harrow gave him Bait. Glowtoad tribal name is some sort of grunt noise that’s specific, it’s pretty funny to think about. Also, how would you know which is the tribal name and which is the middle? I guess they’d know. It’s only for glowtoads.

Will we see how people react to Rayllum or elf/human relationships in general?

JR: Yes. It could be a huge thing in the show. Human and elf relationships are a big deal, absolutely we will see that stuff going forward. Yes, you will definitely see that stuff.

How long did it take from conception to production for Through the Moon?

JR: I think it was about a year / nine months. To go from story idea all the way to finished. AE: If we’re talking story idea it’s almost a year and a half. It’s a lot of work. We worked with Peter on a number of drafts and outlines and scripts. Then with Xanthe for quite some time.

What is the time gap between the comic and season 3?

AE: Couple of weeks? JR: It’s pretty short. It’s almost immediately following season 3.

Is Opeli actually Soren and Claudia mom, but they  don’t remember her?

JR: No, she’s not. But that would be kinda funny. AE: Do you maybe ship Opeli & Viren a little bit. JR: That would be a pretty funny relationship.

The time gap between Through the Moon and Season 4?

AE: Can’t say. JR: You’ll find out in season 4. Lots of weeks.

How long does it usually take to animate a scene?

JR: That’s a pretty variable answer. The way it works is; we write a script, it gets recorded, there’s a bunch of 2D passes where we do storyboards and animatics and those are all hand drawn, and that takes weeks and weeks of time. At some point that’s approved and it gets handed off to the animators. In our show we do 3D animation with a sort of 2D sheet or look to it. So 3D animators would get that animatic, and they’d be handed a shot. Sometimes, depending on how complex the shot is, there’s sometime multiple animators will work on a single sequence. If there’s a lots of stuff going on with multiple characters you’ll get more than one person working on a shot. But it totally depends how much facial animation there is, how much action, how much running around, if they’re standing or talking. It totally depends. There’s a sort of variable number of seconds the animator can do a week. There’s not like a hard or fast answer here. Sometimes if it’s simple they can animate maybe 20 seconds a week, if it’s crazy complicated they may be doing half that. On average, it on the 20 seconds a week range. But wildly variable depending on the shot and what happening.

Is there a bigger world out there or is Xadia all there is?

AE: There’s some stuff on the periphery of the map that is part of a bigger world. But the main focus is this continent. It’s where the key action is. I think there are things on the periphery. We sometimes do jokes the Avatar world is on the other side. JR: If you flip the world over.

Are the elven face marking henna tattoo or are they permanent? JR: They’re more like henna tattoo. AE: Depends on the culture. There are probably some elven cultures where they more permanently tattoo some of the marking and they’re some where they’re more temporary makeup. But I think we’ve said for the Moonshadow elves it’s more like henna. Semi-permanent tattoos.

Will there be more Queen Aanya?

JR:  Yeah. AE: I hope so too. JR: I love Queen Aanya. She’s awesome and a very exciting character. Also she has the coolest bow ever and I want to see more of that not matter what.

Aanya/Ezran friendship?

AE: I want to see that. We talked about that. JR: We can’t talk about that yet, but yes.

Who is the best fighter in the show?

JR: I don’t know if there’s a best fighter. There’s a lot of awesome fighters in the show. AE: Rayla and Soren both have different fighting skills. Corvus has different set of fighting skill. They’re all great fighters. Amaya’s incredible. Actually, the answer might be Amaya. If I had to put an answer on it. Just fundamentals. That be my answer. JR: That makes sense. I agree. I bet Soren would disagree.

Do you guys ever play D&D after work?

JR: Yes, we have a whole D&D crew after work. We love Dungeons & Dragons. We love Tabletop RPG We play all kinds of board games, not just Dungeons & Dragons. We had a whole series of board game nights - when we can be at the office - that were really fun. Continue that when we can all get back together. Played some virtual version too since Covid.

Will we ever see Villads again? JR: I don’t know if we should answer that one? AE: I think so, yeah. JR: Also, Villads is the name of a person who worked on the show - he’s an amazing director. AE: Not just a person, the supervising director of the show. Wonderful leader. Inspirational. JR: And a big sailor.

Then they wrapped up. Thanks, shout outs, reminder of AMA etc.

#the dragon prince #through the moon #tdp lore #Q&A