#and neither does Nie Mingjue

[wishthefish]

I was tagged by @thebansacredbanned for Seven Sentence Saturday:

"Give me that!"

"What-no DA-GE WAIT STOP SERIOUSLY-"

The sheets cascade to the ground, falling face first so Meng Yao and Nie Mingjue are afforded a full view of Nie Huaisang's drawings.

Oh. My. God.

It's just Meng Yao, again and again and again.

It appears Huaisang had taken his porn collection as inspiration for his illustrated Meng Yao. Nie Mingjue blushed furiously and swiveled his head sideways as though the real Meng Yao standing besides him was also naked.

#uhhh so like this was my first time getting tagged and called somebody's mutual #I didn't realize it was a real thing??? #like i thought being mutuals was a thing of legends #I'm actually evaporating with excitement #You don't even want to know how Meng Yao punishes him afterwards #and neither does Nie Mingjue #NMJ pov because he doesn't lnow what's going on and neither do I! #im sorry NHS #please don't get revenge on me for this new form of torture #nie bros #nie huaisang #nie mingjue #meng yao #wip wip wip #sangyao #kinda?

[frodo-of-the-nine-fingers]

i think the actual disconnect between nie mingjue and jin guangyao is that nie mingjue is dying and knows he's dying and has to stick so so so closely to his morals and virtues or else it'll have been for nothing and then he'll have to come to terms with the fact that maybe he didn't actually have to die after all vs jin guangyao who wants to live, he wants to live and be safe and have all the things he was told he could never have-was told he was never good enough to have-and will do almost anything to make it so. and these are two like irreconcilable point of views right (and both Correct and Wrong at the same time) and so they can't understand each other because they aren't even having the same argument and neither of them can see that

#nie mingjue #jin guangyao #nieyao #it's good!!! #i think nmj never expected to survive the war against the wen too maybe so after he's both floundering and STILL dying #characters that didn't HAVE to die like that but did anyways because societal/family/narrative pressure etc >>>>>>> #⚰️ #I've been told it's real sweet to grow old #i think there's also this disconnect between the two of them in the story as a whole re that steinberg quote i posted earlier about kleos #nostos (glory seeking vs home coming) #where jgy is the kleos or glory seeker and nmj SHOULD be the nostos (@ #(and he IS to an extent) but also he ISNT because again he is dying-he knows hes dying you cant extract that from his character #and so there SHOULD be this conflict here from that but there just isnt because nmj isnt filling that role properly and i think that's part #of why jgy cant understand him #jgy is the kleos but nmj isnt a glory seeker (not outside of like the war and he's not doing that for glory etc) but he's also not nostos #he's theseus in the king must die #(sorry for referencing a bunch of shit in th tags pls pls pls ignore my rambling to myself about characters that are barely ever on page/ #screen and so we can never actually fully contextualize them because we dont actually know them but oh boy oh boy can we try) #so like what does a guy who will (allegedly) give up anyone and anything domestic to gain/retain status do against a guy who otherwise #would be the opposite and unwilling/unable to sacrifice anyone for these things do when said guy does neither 🤷‍♀️ #mine

[lgbtlunaverse]

Modern au genderqueer nmj but they talk about it in a way that makes them sound transphobic. What he means is "I use any pronouns/honorifics and I don't have a preference" what she says is "Oh I don't care about that stuff. Don't know why people make such a big deal out of it. 🙄"

#mdzs #mdzs headcanons #nie mingjue #unfortunately just as in canon in this au ppl look at nmj and are like sure yeah stereotypical masc cis man #and then make a buttload of assumptions from there #huaisang help the other kids at the queer art collective think your sibling is a bigot #nmj has had several conversations to the tune of 'but how does that work??? are you a man AND a woman or neither??' and is a little bit don #and does NOT realize how this 'don't ask me about my gender i don't give a shit and neither should you' atitude is being received #btw i say honorifics here because in mandarin 'he' and 'she' are pronounced exactly the same (though written differently) #but terms of adress can be very gendered #whether someone is comfortable being called -jie is gonna matter a lot more than their pronouns in spoken language

[whetstonefires]

Very fun thing actually about Jin Guangyao is he spent so much time and energy passing himself off as normal. The Normalest Guy, Look How Normal I Am. The Very Best And Most Skilled At Normal Things, Like Being Normal And Having Normal Opinions.

Which is great because on the one hand it reflects how he was kind of aware he absolutely was not. (And that by default this isolated him and this was Very Unsafe.) But on the other you see, with all the times he falls into the typical mind fallacy under stress and projects weird shit onto people, he also on some level believed everyone was doing this.

That being a Normal Person who had Normal Reactions to things, like being appalled by brutal violence, was an elaborate social lie everyone had to maintain to keep up the facade of civil society, and actually everyone was basically the same as him deep down. He was just better at it, and also the smartest.

Which is a very long way to say his character arc is heavily tied up with his evolving relationship with and skills at masking. I'm not gonna armchair diagnose him because that's beside the point, the point is that he is trying so fucking hard to be normal, but without a particularly well-developed definition of what's abnormal about him to begin with, resulting in some misfires.

And then you contrast him to some other characters and it gets more fun. One of his direct foils is Nie Mingjue, who literally does not know how to mask at all, not the slightest bit, but is fortunate enough to have been born the exact kind of weirdo his position in life demands, with special interests in 'saber training' and 'destroying evil.'

(He explicitly, per narration from wwx being inside his head, has no other interests and doesn't really understand the idea of having more than one activity you care about, do not tell me Nie Mingjue is walking around with a normal brain.)

So he is (jgy has a point about this, although he actually makes it about the luxury of having moral compunctions) free to totally embrace the conviction that everyone should basically be their authentic selves at all times, and just not do evil things about it.

On the other hand, and this really illuminates their relationship for me, Lan Xichen is absolutely trying to be normal. Like, he does try to excel, he wants to be best and he knows he's good, but as a person he is also trying to be as normal as circumstances allow.

He understands 'being normal about things' as a goal not in jgy's terms as an elaborate social fiction but as aspirational shaping of the self; if everyone is normal about everything then there won't be needless conflict. Living as normally as possible will optimize your mental health and your respect for others, and it's just a good baseline from which to be good.

Which is fine as far as it goes, but means harmless eccentricity (including gay) is to be tolerated and swept under the rug rather than really supported, and prejudices him to instinctively side with Jin Guangyao and anyone else who is pushing for Let's Be Normal About This, even when the people being weird are in the right.

(This is also to a non-zero degree a trauma response behavior; what Lan Xichen experienced as the largest existential threat to him growing up was something along the lines of being perceived as a selfish disruptor of norms, like his father.)

And then contrast that to Jiang Cheng and Lan Wangji, who are both very concerned at least initially with how things and people and they themselves are supposed to be, and feel some responsibility for ensuring this supposed-to is reflected in reality.

But neither of them makes any particular attempt to be normal about it.

And then ofc Wei Wuxian, another jgy narrative foil, never attempts to pass himself off as normal. He will sell 'I'm better than everyone ever' and 'I'm scum of the earth' in the same breath before he will try for normal.

Except that he genuinely seems to think his most virtuous traits, his throw-himself-between-victim-and-weapon impulses, are basically normal. If not everyone (who isn't a total shithead) does it, it's because not everyone has his insane confidence they can pull it off.

Which in a good mood he would say is fair, because he is in fact awesome and really good at winning. (In a worse state of mind he would definitely hate on all the selfish cowards.)

Nie Huaisang is probably the most genuinely normal human being in the main cast, probably even more normal than Jiang Yanli, and he's very happy to play that up and present himself as actually even more normal and average than he is, in order to keep expectations down.

Up until his whole life gets fucked and this little pretense turns into the most elaborate and successful mask in the entire book.

#hoc est meum #characterization #meta #masking #mdzs #everyone makes my posts about jgy anyway so i'm just starting with him out the gate #he's such a fun characterization study ngl #jin zixuan is more normal than nhs but i can't honestly call him a main character

[wutheringskies]

The Twin Jades

dude sometimes I just come across such bad meta. it's even worse if it starts off good and turns bad.

Good Meta Points:

• The Lans really love younger child Wangji (no pets allowed, but wangji can have them. Wangji wants lotus pod seeds and gets them etc.)

• Instead of giving agency to his actions and thoughts, they think he's being influenced or corrupted by others to act in such ways (especially Lan Qiren.)

Bad Meta Points

• Lan Wangji is spoilt, similar to Nie Huaisang or Jin Zixuan.

• Gets the lowest punishment at all times (pfft.)

• "I get it you waited 13 years but you fucked off into the sunset with your husband leaving your emotionally unstable brother and duties"

• "Good to see people talking about Lan Wangji's flaws" - mentions him being spoilt and demanding instead of his actual flaws.

Like... you cannot seriously point out how he gets to have rabbits as a point of him being spoilt. Lan Wangji has made like one error in his life in his studies. He's assigned himself punishment for stuff that wasn't even done by will (coughs, wwx). He's made his decisions and lived with the consequences.

Despite what you say, Lan Xichen isn't a terrible brother to Wangji. Neither is Lan Wangji a selfish brother.

Sibling relationships are complex, and between two individuals with their own set of values. Lan Wangji is totally righteous, even more than Nie Mingjue. He can't stand exaggerated, political loopholes and unrighteous acts. He does what he can do, working on the ground level.

Lan Xichen isn't Lan Wangji. He knows the world is filled with corrupted people, and challenging each and every one of them would lead to your own devastation (read: Wei Wuxian's biography). Thus, he tries extending his sympathy to all, and draws conclusions that allow the least possible damage. He does think Lan Wangji made a dire mistake with Wei Wuxian, because if not, he will have to face the fact that the world punished his brother for his righteousness and it would shatter his whole foundation (like it does).

But despite that, both of them share similarities. They both want the better of the world. Lan Wangji is brave enough to challenge the whole foundation of the cultivation world. Lan Xichen is brave enough to lay down peace even when it's so painfully obvious there's no option of it.

Lan Wangji trusts his brother enough to bring Wei Wuxian back to Cloud Recesses after getting stabbed at Jin Tower. Lan Xichen lives up to this trust and helps them investigate the matter. Lan Wangji even assures Wei Wuxian that his brother would not stand for Jin Guangyao if his crimes were true.

See, you don't have to completely have the same sort of sets of beliefs to be siblings. Sibling relationships are complex. Both these brothers know each other, their strengths and their weaknesses well. They may be exasperated at each other's insistence, yet they are well aware that they both have to walk their own paths.

Lan Xichen could never take away Lan Wangji's pain or fix him. Neither can Lan Wangji fix Lan Xichen.

But both of them will always have each other's backs. They are each other's families. Each other's brothers for life.

But at the same time, they have each their own paths to walk. People need to understand that it's not about a lack of sense of responsibility on Lan Wangji's side, but the realization that if he went back home, he may lose Wei Wuxian again. His uncle wants to take him back, lecture him and lock him into seclusion. His uncle wouldn't accept his proposal to be married to Wei Wuxian.

He doesn't give his uncle the chance to "accept" or not.

And he literally returns three months later.

I can't help but feel that those who say he was selfish do not have siblings. Or have bad sibling relationships. I'd say Lan Wangji and Lan Xichen have a perfectly good relationship if despite their differences, their terrible parentage, their opposing personalities, the roles they both played in each other's life (with Lan Xichen being sworn brothers to Jin Guangyao who played a major role in Wei Wuxian's fall, and Lan Wangji being Wei Wuxian's husband, who in turn, set the case back onto Jin Guangyao, thus hurting Lan Xichen), the things they couldn't help each other out of, but yet, they do trust each other and love each other.

And I trust that Lan Xichen will one day figure stuff out. There's a lyric in this MDZS song called unfettered. It is like:

The past is akin to dew in the morning. Even if it can be comprehended, it lays under layers and layers of fog.

In the end, hatred, love, resentment, debts and regrets all come to pass.

Just like how Lan Wangji is not his father, Lan Xichen will also not be his father. I don't think both of them had hurtful intentions towards the other at any point.

It's not like "Yunmeng bros" where JC intentionally wishes to cause pain to Wei Wuxian. It's not like the Nie bros, where NMJ has to be super over-protective of Huaisang.

It's just two siblings with their own lives choosing to be with each other, in happiness and in grief (mostly in grief uhm) in a terrible world where the road to hell is paved with good intentions.

#Lan wangji #lan xichen #twin jades #twin jades of gusu #my meta #mdzs #mo dao zu shi #mdzs meta #mdzs essay #my essays #my thoughts

[poorlittleyaoyao]

It’s so weird that Nie Huaisang decided he absolutely had to resurrect Wei Wuxian. Wei Wuxian’s personal investment in Nie Mingjue’s death is no greater than that of any other member of their generation save Lan Xichen; if anything, it’d be less, given that Nie Mingjue came down firmly against pardoning the Wen remnants. Even when he does have a personal stake in the mystery (as he does in CQL with his final curse mark), none of his skills make him uniquely suited to revealing the mystery. Nie Huaisang has no reason to think that Nie Mingjue’s spirit is too restless for a standard Inquiry session, and while Wei Wuxian is clever, it’s not like he’s the Benoit Blanc of the jianghu.

What Wei Wuxian is uniquely capable of is the ability to raise the dead and restore their cognition. Nie Huaisang would definitely have heard about the Ghost General! He would also likely have heard that the Ghost General was capable of behaving like a totally normal guy, given the several people in his peer group who observed this firsthand!

All of this is to say that I don’t think Nie Huaisang resurrected Wei Wuxian because only he could expose Jin Guangyao. Nie Huaisang does most of that work himself anyway, and neither Wei Wuxian nor Mo Xuanyu has a reputation that lends credibility to any potential accusations. He needs Jiang Cheng and the Twin Jades for that.

Rather, I think the main point of bringing back Wei Wuxian was the hope that he could restore Nie Mingjue the same way he restored Wen Ning. After all, Nie Huaisang’s pettiest acts of vengeance don’t kick in until after it’s clear Nie Mingjue’s soul is beyond repair. This is probably not how Nie Huaisang envisioned this whole thing going.

#I’m sure someone else must’ve had the same idea #but I’m just SAYING #and tbqh it makes more sense than ‘NHS needed someone super smart and savvy and decided on the war criminal he went to summer camp with’

[untamedmetablogiguess]

finally got around to watching Fatal Journey and honestly the most devastating part of it is not how it gives us adorable baby Nie brothers ( though that does hurt), nor how it makes Huaisang accidentally implicated in the music poisoning (though that hurts, too) - it’s how it deepens Huaisang’s character from merely a harmless pleasure-seeker to a genuinely good person.

the version of Huaisang we see in the show proper isn’t particularly interested in being moral! He’s not a BAD person, he doesn’t want to hurt anybody, but neither does he particularly care to be GOOD. he leaves that, like all the tough parts of life, to his da-ge to take care of. Surely Mingjue is righteous enough for both of them! Huaisang’s no good in a fight- surely he’d just get in the way! Huaisang’s tragedy, originally, is his descent from a lovable goofball, a harmless fop, a perpetual baby brother, into a hardened, ruthless, desperately lonely man hellbent on revenge no matter how many people he has to destroy on the way. And that’s a pretty good tragedy!

but with the material introduced in Fatal Journey, Huaisang appears to be a genuinely good person- a much better person than anyone ever gave him credit for. He sees something he believes is morally reprehensible being done by the people he loves and respects- especially his brother, who is regarded as a paragon of righteousness in their society- and he stands up and says ‘no.’ I don’t think ANYONE else does that, at least where we can see it. WWX’s whole DEAL is doing the right thing in the face of people who have waaay more power than him (Wens, Jins….), but he’s never put in this specific situation because the people he loves and respects aren’t the ones doing morally reprehensible things! The closest parallel we see is maybe LWJ fighting the Lan elders in defense of WWX, but that is much less a principled stance based on moral virtue and much more an act of tremendous personal love and sacrifice. He’s not doing it because it’s there right thing to do, he’s doing it because he loves WWX and doesn’t CARE whether that’s right or wrong anymore.

NHS is put in a fairly unique position where he is directly exposed to some of the basest hypocrisy of the cultivation world, and instead of saying ‘well, da-ge’s doing it so it must be okay, I guess it's not really that bad,” he says ‘No, this is unacceptable.’ He says ‘You’re better than this. WE are better than this. We HAVE to be better than this.’ He is not, ultimately, able to change anything about it, because he doesn’t have that kind of power, but he SAYS it, he makes it clear, directly to NMJ’s face, that he is disappointed in him, and ashamed of what he is doing, and he thinks it’s wrong.

and the fall from THAT, from someone who argues that exploiting the corpses of the dead is wrong EVEN if those people were criminals, into someone who would deliberately desecrate the body of a woman he KNOWS is innocent because it’s the best way he can think of to hurt the person he wants to hurt, a person for whom the ends justify any and all means, and who ignores or disregards the collateral damage of any other lives destroyed - that’s SO MUCH WORSE. That hurts SO much more.

#meta #my meta #nie huaisang #nie bros are fascinating #the untamed #fatal journey

[jiangwanyinscatmom]

I still don't feel bad for Nie Mingjue's fate. He was just the other extreme side of how claiming to be "righteous" can make a person evil too. Jin Guanygao is scum of base humanity while Nie Mingjue is the scum of hypocritical righteousness. Self-serving and sanctimony, are one and the same. To love an evil, does not make that evil any more sympathetic. As is the lesson of Lan Xichen and Nie Huaisang.

Neither of those men, are any more "valid" in their revenge or sorrow than the other for who they put their trust in when the ones they cared for where simply the same side of a coin.

#mdzs #mo dao zu shi #i hate jin guangyao #jin guangyao stans block me (｡･ω･｡) #I hate nmj too #or his fanbase makes me with trying to ask sympathy for him proxy of NHS

[hannigramislife]

I had literally never given much thought to Jin Guangyao before, except for the fact that the man has had all the audacity and more–

But as I am mostly done with the second book, I feel a burning hatred towards him.

How fucking dare he? Who the fuck does he think he is?

His heart is a nasty, shriveled, and blackened piece of useless coal because how does he bite the hand that reached out to him and held him up when he was nothing?

He truly had no shame, absolutely none, and neither did he have a human soul because what he did to Nie Mingjue was sickening. I can't stand him. I would personally like nothing more than to run a sword through him, then rip him apart.

#mdzs #mo dao zu shi #the untamed #cql p #cql #nie mingjue #i find that mf repulsive #and oh #poor lan xichen #he was so blind #so naive #everything about them is so tragic

[jaimebluesq]

Oooh, I just saw your prompts post. I have two prompts that you could combine or not: aspec and 3zun. IDK, I'm in the mood for more fic like that...

Thank you for the prompt! I was torn between writing a long diatribe about so many potential Aspec headcanons and how they are either reinforced or contradictory to the family messages/environment each member of 3zun had growing up... but instead I thought I’d go for a touch of humour and fluff :D

~ ~ ~

The Unclean Realm on an average night when Nie Mingjue’s ‘sworn brothers’ come for a visit:

Nie Huaisang walked through the corridors on his way to his room, looking at the walls around him. The fortress itself was constructed with thick external walls built to withstand considerable impact from rams and boulders slung from trebuchets, and it was rare that the sounds of wildlife from the surrounding areas were heard within. The internal walls, however, were much thinner – much much thinner, almost paper thin in some places – and tonight was one of many nights Nie Huaisang wished the internal walls had been built as thickly as the external ones.

“That’s it, right there Da-ge!” Lan Xichen’s moan filled the hallway.

He resisted the urge to stick his fingers in his ears as he tried to rush past his brother’s quarters.

“Just a little more, I’m almost there!” Nie Mingjue shouted.

A servant who had been lingering in the hallway jumped and blushed when she realized she wasn’t alone – Nie Huaisang shooed her off. Just because his brother couldn’t keep his activities silent, it didn’t give people the right to listen in.

“Perhaps if Da-ge is tired, this one could assist – your hands must be getting quite sore, and we may still have use for them yet,” Jin Guangyao teased.

With a pout and a groan, Nie Huaisang no longer resisted his previous urge – he clapped his hands over his ears and ran the rest of the way to his room, slamming the door shut behind him.

That’s it! The next time Er-ge and San-ge come over, I’m going to stay in Yunmeng until neither I nor Jiang-xiong can walk anymore. It’s so unfair that Da-ge gets laid all the time but I have to wait!

Nie Mingjue’s quarters on an average night when his ‘sworn brothers’ come for a visit:

Lan Xichen sat awkwardly on his chair, his arms folded over the back of it as his sleeves hung down to the floor “That’s it, right there Da-ge!” he moaned as Nie Mingjue’s fingers dug into his back through the fabric of his inner robes, working at the knot in his muscles from the group training session they’d had earlier that evening.

“Just a little more,” Nie Mingjue insisted, feeling the knot finally loosen, “I’m almost there!”

The pain in Lan Xichen’s back suddenly became pure bliss as his tension was released. He let out a long, exhausted sigh, and was thankful when Nie Mingjue pulled away.

“Perhaps if Da-ge is tired, this one can assist.” Jin Guangyao picked up a pot of ointment and, taking Nie Mingjue’s hand in his, began rubbing some into his skin – Nie Mingjue gave the best massages, but his hands always cramped up afterwards. “Your hands must be getting quite sore, and we may still have use for them yet,” he teased with a straight face, but received a mock glare from Nie Mingjue for his efforts.

“You’re just saying that because you want me to do your legs tomorrow before you head home.”

“Well, it does make the journey by sword that much easier.”

Lan Xichen stood up and stretched himself out, a relaxed smile upon his face. “Thank you, A-Jue. Nobody’s hands are quite as skilled as yours – not that I would ever allow anyone else to touch me so intimately.”

“You know we are always at your service,” Jin Guangyao replied, letting go of Nie Mingjue’s hands. “Will you be staying the night?”

Shaking his head, Lan Xichen reached for his outer robes. “I’m afraid this was the most intimacy this one could withstand in one day, and I will be most comfortable sleeping alone. My apologies-”

“What did I tell you about apologizing?” Nie Mingjue grimaced. “Never apologize for telling us what you need.”

Jin Guangyao faced Lan Xichen with a fond smile. “We love our A-Huan, and would do so even if you asked to never again embrace us or hold our hands.”

Lan Xichen nodded – he did trust these two men he adored, but at times he felt the need for reassurance that he was not placing undue demands upon them. “I do not know what your plans were tonight, but... if I may, I would like to remain until the both of you have prepared for bed.”

His words prompted a lifted eyebrow from Jin Guangyao. “In other words, you simply wish to watch A-Jue disrobe – you and the majority of the cultivation world, I imagine.” Logically, he could understand the aesthetic appeal, but the sight of naked bodies had never really done that much for him.

Nie Mingjue, however, smirked as he began pulling off his belt.

Soon enough, Nie Mingjue was naked – as he preferred to sleep, particularly since his body ran so hot – and Jin Guangyao had changed into another full set of sleeping robes. Lan Xichen wished them goodnight before retiring to his guest room.

“What do you need tonight?” Nie Mingjue asked as he blew out the lantern and slipped under the sheets with Jin Guangyao.

“It’s been a rough few weeks,” Jin Guangyao admitted. It was still difficult for him at times to verbalize what he wanted, so used was he to pushing down his own needs in favour to catering to someone else’s. But no matter his occasional issues with Nie Mingjue, few respected his word more than he did. “I just need to be held tonight.”

“That I can do.” Nie Mingjue pulled Jin Guangyao into his arms and held him tightly. In truth, he had very few needs of his own, other than to be allowed to show his affection to those he loved in some way. It didn’t matter if it was a word of affirmation for Lan Xichen or physical affection for Jin Guangyao – who usually just needed to be held, but on rare occasions needed the passion of sexual intimacy to reinforce their relationship. They were his family as much as his brother was, and he was more than happy to do what he could for them. “Night, A-Yao.”

“Goodnight,” Jin Guangyao muttered, his mind for once at ease as he settled into Nie Mingjue’s embrace.

#3zun #nie mingjue #lan xichen #jin guangyao #nie huaisang #3zun + nhs

[mxtxfanatic]

Let’s call this game: How Many Times Over Does Jiang Cheng Owe His Life to Wen Ning?

Before half an hour had passed, with someone on his back, Wen Ning really did silently walk outside.

The person was covered in blood. His face was ashen and his eyes were shut, motionless on Wen Ning’s back. It was Jiang Cheng indeed.

—Chapt. 59: Poisons, exr

Jiang Cheng had given chase only to be held down by the weight of Sandu. Two female corpses surrounded had Jiang Cheng as he raised his sword, shouting in anguish, ready to fight. A pair of hands then swiftly crushed the two corpses into dust as Wen Ning called out, “Sect Leader Jiang......”

—Chapt. 81: Loyalty—Corpses of the Burial Mound, chiaki_himura

Nie MingJue’s heavy fist struck right through a body.

But the body was neither Jiang Cheng’s nor Jin Ling’s.

Standing at the corner, in front of both of them, Wen Ning clutched Nie MingJue’s iron-strong arm and slowly pulled it out of his own chest. A large, empty hole was left in its wake, high on his chest. There was no blood. Only a few chunks of blackened pieces of organs fell out.

—Chapt. 107: "Concealment" Part 1, boat-full-of-lotus-pods

That makes three!

#human reads mdzs: take 2

[roseclaw]

WIP WEDNESDAY MDZS BB edition

Another @mdzsbigbang Nie Bro phone call!

“Is something wrong?” Nie Mingjue asked anxiously. “These calculations make no sense,” Nie Huaisang said. “…How drunk are you?” “I will never be drunk enough for this,” Nie Huaisang muttered. “But these don’t make sense.” “How?” “Do you really want to hear me go on about it?” Nie Huaisang asked grumpily. “No,” Nie Mingjue said. “I don’t. I want to know if you can fix it.” That’s what Nie Huaisang thought. He continued to frown down at the numbers and the omens. His brother was right, things were becoming more exponential, and if Nie Huaisang extrapolated from there. “There are less than two weeks before the Hellmouth opens and brings about the end of the world,” Nie Huaisang said, hating every word that came out of his mouth. “A bit more than ten days to prevent everything.” “Fuck me.” Nie Mingjue whispered. Louder, he said, “I want you to calculate everything again when you’re sober.” “I don’t need to be sober for this. I don’t want to be sober for this.” He glowered at the papers, especially the star charts. “But you’re sure?” “Da-ge, how can I not be sure?” Nie Huaisang whimpered. Nie Mingjue sighed. “I want you to meet with Lan Qiren tomorrow. No more running away to get drunk.” Nie Huaisang sat down in the chair heavily. “I didn’t ask for this.” “No one ever asks for it,” Nie Mingjue told him gently. “I don’t want it.” “Neither does the Slayer, and this is ultimately her responsibility,” Nie Mingjue said. “How is this the responsibility of one person?” Nie Huaisang demanded. “This should be something for heads of state and – and people like that. They ask for that responsibility, not sweet girls like Yanli.” “We both know how unfair the world can be,” Nie Mingjue reminded him. Nie Huaisang scoffed. “I hate this. How can one girl prevent this?” “She’ll have backup,” Nie Mingjue said. “You? You’re going to—Da-ge, you can’t!” “I’ve done it before.” “You’ve fucking what? How did I not know this?” “It’s part of the gig,” Nie Mingjue said plainly. “It’s part of being a journalist?!” “What—no! It’s part of being part of the Watcher’s Council.” “Fuck them, spying on me from the UK, making you risk your life for the apocalypse. How many apocalypses have you prevented?” “Don’t know,” Nie Mingjue said. “At least three.” “…What? How often does someone want to end the world?” “A lot. It’s a fairly standard power grab.” Nie Huaisang had absolutely no idea what to say to that. He didn’t like any of this, and he had mad that inescapably clear. “How am I supposed to sleep now?” he grumbled. “Go find your Supermodel Cheekbones,” Nie Mingjue suggested. Nie Huaisang sighed loudly. “I’m too drunk.” “Text him. Booty call.” “Did you just - Did you say…?” Nie Huaisang burst into a fit of uncontrollable giggles. “Isn’t that the equivalent of inviting him over? Didn’t you say I shouldn’t do that?” He glanced at the clock, trying to control his giggles. It was nearly one in the morning. During the normal workweek. He wasn’t going to text Jiang Wanyin. Wait. Did he even have Jiang Wanyin’s phone number? He didn’t think so… Ugh. So a booty call wasn’t even an option. Even if it wasn’t the middle of the week. Wait. No. Was it a Friday night? He didn’t even know how time worked anymore. He must be too drunk for that. “Meet with Qiren tomorrow,” Nie Mingjue said. “And drink some water.” “I’m drinking water,” Nie Huaisang mumbled, staring at the glass sitting on the table next to the star charts. “Fucking stars.” “See what the stars say about you and Cheekbones,” Nie Mingjue said. “And actually drink the water. Don’t pout at it.” Nie Huaisang sighed. “Fine.”

#nie huaisang #nie mingjue #sangcheng #wip wednesday

[littlesmartart]

(Hope it’s okay that I come in with an askbox and say something). Your most recent NieYao drawing gave me all the feels. I liked the tags too, especially the “what’s your rage hiding” with Nie Mingjue. Even if he’s relatively straightforward he’s not necessarily a simple character, and his whole attitude toward Jin Guangyao especially probably requires multiple essays and diagrams to sort out. So yeah. I liked what you drew and it gave me thoughts.

ah, I'm so glad to hear that!!

oh boy, "what is the rage hiding" is actually a character starting point that I got from @ellethinthewoods whilst we were writing our AU @greenhills-woodtoburn-fic! NMJ is such an interesting character... whilst it is true that in a sense he wears his heart on his sleeve - bursting into tears at the slightest emotion, god bless you wang yizhou for your acting choices - I think he also uses rage to hide a lot, not only externally but also from himself! NMJ is not a person prone to introspection or self-reflection (and neither is JGY lmao but for different reasons), and I do believe he is exceptionally good at duping himself by slapping anger over whatever he doesn't like and pretending like he has no clue there's anything else under it. and obviously this gets less conscious and more uncontrollable the closer to qi-deviation he gets, but this is a tendency he exhibits from earlier in the story, when he is still more or less stable, so I definitely see it as a key character trait.

like, people enjoy hating on LXC for willfully ignoring stuff, but... hello, NMJ also uses anger to do that too???? he deliberately chooses to ignore a whole BUNCH of shit!!! so often he takes one look at a situation and goes "this is my opinion and I have decided that it is objective truth, and if anyone or anything disagrees it will be easier to simply Get Big Mad About It(TM) rather than consider that I might be wrong or whether there are more complicated emotions to address". he does it with Huaisang. obviously he does it with JGY. NMJ is really really good at refusing to see things - only in his case, he is usually refusing to acknowledge things that might refute his negative opionion.

so yeah. not sure where this is going, but I love NMJ's character! I think it's really interesting how he can be both our beloved self-sacrificing, loving, cares-so-much-he-cries da-ge, aaaaand also a big fat stinking pull-yourself-up-by-your-bootstraps hypocrite who is sticking his fingers in his ears going "lalalala can't hear you" when an emotional situation might require something more complex than getting pissed off because feeling angry is easier than feeling pain or remorse.

#nie mingjue #the untamed #ask #eastofakkala #thanks for giving me the opportunity to ramble!!! #NMJ haters can get fucking lost I love this terrible man 😌

[morethanwonderful-archive]

Thinking about the cycles of dysfunction in MDZS, and the different brands of misguided that crop up in every clan.

The Nie family curse is single-mindedness. Nie Mingjue is too black and white in his view of the world, which makes him cruel to Wei Wuxian and unable to cope with the truth of Meng Yao. Nie Huaisang is relentless in his quest to avenge his brother's death, willing to endanger anyone and everyone in order to get his way. Once a Nie has decided what is right, he will do anything, hurt anyone, to achieve his view of justice.

The Lan family curse is too much love for people they cannot stomach. The Twin Jades' father falls in love with the woman who kills his teacher, and he can neither accept her deeds nor let her go, so he chooses to lock her away. Lan Xichen swears brotherhood to a man who does not hesitate to commit heinous acts to get his way, but he chooses to brush aside those heinous acts and assume they are justified, because he cannot bear to look at them more closely. Lan Zhan falls in love with a man who would rather die than follow a rule he disagrees with, and it takes him years—takes him until it's too late to save his life—to learn to accept Wei Ying on his own terms.

The Jin family curse is self-centeredness in the extreme. Jin Guangshan assaults countless women, abandons countless children, all for the sake of his own pleasure, but refuses to help out an old flame because it's "too much trouble." Jin Guangyao lies constantly and kills countless people, including his own young son, all for the sake of furthering his ambitions. Jin Zixuan is famously arrogant as a young man, rejecting his fiancé because he feels she doesn't deserve him. Jin Ling, even as a teenage boy, sets up countless nets that ruin others' night hunts, feeling no sympathy when confronted with how unfair this is.

And the Jiang family curse. The Jiang family curse is the inability to suffer without taking it out on those around them, even when it is deeply undeserved. Jiang Fengmian and his wife both act out their frustration with each other via their treatment of Jiang Cheng. Madame Yu also takes out her anger toward her husband and her situation in life via the abuse of Wei Wuxian. Jiang Cheng clings to his brother as a scapegoat when he's desperate, blaming him for the deaths of his parents and sister (and helping kill him for his crimes), and he raises Jin Ling to do the very same thing. And even Wei Wuxian, when he's pushed, comes to assume malice from everyone around him, lashing out at people like Lan Wangji and Jin Zixuan that genuinely want to help.

#mdz #mo dao zu shi #and people like Jiang Yanli or Jin Zixuan that overcome their family curses? #well they don't tend to live very long #especially not in the era before Wei Wuxian's death #it's just not a society that responds well to goodness and kindness #but through wangxian's efforts and the new generation. it's getting better #lan sizhui feels an instant (familial) connection with Wen Ning (who he knows killed his good friend's father among many others) #but he copes with it quite well #and Jin Ling comes around to wwx and wn much more easily than Jiang Cheng does #the kids are alright #the grandmaster of demonic cultivation #english major hours #also yeah I know this is a little reductive #and most of these characters have a lot more going on than just these problems #but I still think that the familial patterns stand

[admirableadmiranda]

Hello again. I wanted to ask a question. I don't think I asked you this before but I may have. Do you believe Wei Wuxian's cultivation pathed harmed him or was inherently harmful? I think Wei Wuxian had gone through trauma after trauma and was never given time after the war to heal. Then, with the whole Wen situation, he was pushed into a corner. I believe the resentful energy exacerbated his already shitty mental health but I don't think it caused it. Do you believe Wei Wuxian cultivation is harmful? Do you think it was the reason he lost control? Or do you think it was just trauma and unfortunate circumstances coming to a head?

Thank you for your time and efforts. I hope you are well and healthy.

Hello! I have already answered this question for others and written some other meta on this and adjacent topics before, but it's been a while, so I'll go ahead an answer this again.

Wei Wuxian's cultivation is only as harmful as any cultivation is. Qi deviation is a risk for any cultivator and while the Nie cultivation is much more risky, there is no form of cultivation that is entirely without risk. It does seem to require a certain amount of emotional stability, which makes sense when you're working with the negative energy out there in the world, but again, that's not entirely unique to his guidao.

I am a firm proponent in the everyone who went through the Sunshot Campaign has some level of PTSD theory, Wei Wuxian included and I very much agree that it definitely exacerbates what comes.

But really it's also the nature of making your own enemy, if you push and push and push and push and cut aside every option and force someone to be your villain, eventually they will snap, no matter how kind and good they are. It may not be permanent, it may be the sort of thing that they can recover from with good time and care and not being horribly persecuted by everyone around them, but very much there is a limit to how much anyone can take. Wei Wuxian reminds us twice in the story that even he cannot be a stone and he can be hurt by things. This is very important and relevant to what happens because really from 17-22, Wei Wuxian's life was a dumpster fire with a few bright times scattered here and there and the circumstances that led to him losing control at Qiongqiu Path were the culmination of literal years of the Jin Clan antagonizing him until eventually something broke, combined with incredibly powerful cultivation and a little PTSD. It's as simple as that.

It's very relevant that in the present day that Wei Wuxian never has a single moment where it's even hinted that his control over his cultivation is slipping no matter how much or in what circumstances he uses it. He goes through some pretty intense stuff through the course of the present day, including all the stuff in the Guayin Temple Hostage Party, but when it comes to his cultivation, he's fine and completely safe. The only things that challenge him are the things controlled by the Yinhufu and Nie Mingjue being on a murdered corpse murder spree and even then, neither of them negatively effect him, just make him have to adapt to what's going on differently. If his cultivation truly were that dangerous, then we would have seen something in the present day, or had some mention of it. But instead he and Lan Wangji carry on merrily with not a hint of concern no matter what's happening when there's guidao going around.

It's the twist of the novel really, Wei Wuxian was always right about his cultivation and the things that people either blamed on his character or his cultivation run much more differently than the popular narrative is willing to admit. CQL in particular really muddies the waters by both giving him health troubles in his first life and doing weird things with his guidao, but in the book itself, his cultivation is only as dangerous as any cultivation.

As a last note, resentful energy is dangerous, yes, but it's almost more of a metaphor at times for resentment of any kind being dangerous. Think about how many people were hurt and killed based on the resentment of men who wanted things they felt they deserved in some way. Think about how the three big antagonists (Xue Yang, Jiang Cheng, Jin Guangyao) all are characterized by the resentment that they bear proudly and take out on everyone around them.

Then think about what Wei Wuxian took from his mother, the words that he passes on to Lan Wangji at the end of the novel. "“My mom said you have to remember the things others do for you, not the things you do for others. Only when people don’t hold so much in their hearts would they finally feel free.”"

Resentful energy is dangerous. Resentment is dangerous. Wei Wuxian knows this, so he doesn't hold on to either, and thus he and the spirits trapped in resentment who listen to him, all fly free in the end.

#mdzs #wei wuxian #asks #mdzs meta #resentful energy #guidao

[allthelittlecreepycrawlies]

SangYao Fluff and Stuff Ideas, Part One

SangYao where both of them are having a bad chronic health day at the same time.

Winter storms have rolled in and the cold is aggravating Nie Huaisang's lungs and joints like it does every year, and Meng Yao hasn't had time to adjust to the weather so the place in his back that never fully recovered from the fall down the stairs is acting up bad.

Da-ge's off taking out a monster that was too strong for one of the minor sects to handle, so Nie Huaisang declares Meng Yao is taking the day off and drags him off for a nap by the fire for their mutual miseries.

------------

With all the art of Meng Yao as a fox boy and Nie Huaisang as a squirrel boy, size difference included, imagine Meng Yao just... very gently trapping Huaisang between his paws and nomming on him.

Just a tiny bit.

He'd never actually eat him, or even risk seriously hurting him, but Nie Huaisang is so cute when he's scared and it's so rare that Meng Yao gets to be intimidating to anybody.

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Someone trying to love potion Nie Mingjue without realizing he always lets Nie Huaisang "steal" the first cup of wine at dinner. 

Jin Guangyao realizing Nie Huaisang's behavior towards his brand new "beloved" is very, very familiar and struggling to pretend he's not jealous now that it's not aimed at him.

(And when he finds out Huaisang's affections are being artificially induced and the person who potion'd him doesn't actually want him and might even be trying to get rid of him... well, let the games begin.)

-------------

Jin Guangyao gets split into two people, but rather than being a good/evil split, it's an outward presentation/inner feelings split. 

Both Jin Guangyao and A-Yao still get their clothes from the same closet, but somehow they look a little more pristine and expensive when it's Jin Guangyao wearing them. Jin Guangyao has the hat and wears his hair perfectly straight, A-Yao still has the Nie braids and the guan Nie Huaisang gave him years ago.

Jin Guangyao: a tiny bit taller and sturdier, as if he'd grown up never having to do without. Not a bruise nor a scar to be found on him. He looks so perfectly put together that it comes off a little bit fake. A little Uncanny Valley. Even when he starts to lose his temper at A-Yao, his expression never changes from a placid smile, but literal cracks start forming on his face, like it's a porcelain mask about to shatter.

A-Yao: the same height he's always been, but a little skinnier, more visibly underfed. Carries the bruises Jin Guangshan and Jin-furen have left, and they seem to get darker and more prominent the more upset he gets. Much more expressive, fidgety even, but moves in a more unnatural, awkward manner almost like a toy puppet. 

Mortified, Jin Guangyao tries to keep A-Yao locked up in his room until he can get this sorted out, only to later find an escaped A-Yao clutching a very surprised Nie Huaisang in an almost-full-octopus hug and quietly begging him not to leave. 

This results in an argument that dissolves into a screaming match that leaves them brittle and exhausted, so after having had to grab them both to keep them from physically attacking each other, Nie Huaisang manages to talk both halves into a sort-of compromise and takes them to talk to his brother.

Neither of them wants to go, knowing the sorts of things that might escape their mouths, but Nie Huaisang is adamant.

Once the discussion resumes, it's barely a minute and a half before Jin Guangyao and A-Yao are loudly at each other's throats again. When Nie Huaisang has to resort to the squishing hugs again to calm them back down, the difference is even more visible: they're both shaking, but

A-Yao is clinging, face buried into Nie Huaisang's neck as he sobs, while Jin Guangyao is staring up at the ceiling in an effort not to look at anyone, but he's also definitely not trying to pull away.

Nie Mingjue, a bit too rattled by all of the things he's just seen and heard to hold on to his anger at some of the things he’s just seen and heard, tells Nie Huaisang to find them somewhere to take a break while he contacts Lan Xichen to see if the Lan library has any ideas on how to fix this, since he already knows there’s going to be little helpful information in their own.

Both halves seem even more uncomfortable with this idea than they were with meeting Nie Mingjue, which doesn't go unnoticed by Nie Huaisang, who mentions it once he's brought them to a room (one with two beds, so they can each have some space to themselves) to get some rest.

"Why didn't you go to Er-ge first? He's the only one of our group you still like."

That gets a surprised "What?" from both halves.

"Why would you think-"

"Of course I-"

Nie Huaisang shrugs. "I figured it out when you went with me to the Cloud Recesses. There's a big difference between the way you look at someone you want to spend time with and the way you look at someone you're obligated to spend time with, and it’s pretty obvious who's in which category."

The two halves glare at each other sidelong, and again they talk over each other. 

"He kept me locked up around y-"

"He escaped that one ti-"

Nie Huaisang stops them before they can get into another fight. "Nevermind! Nevermind. It's not important and I shouldn't have brought it up. Let's just focus on finding a way to get this fixed, okay?"

They both agree.

But they're still glaring at each other when he leaves to get them food.

"You made him think we were in love with Er-ge."

"You made him think we were only putting up with him because we had to!"

This is gonna be awkward as hell.

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Modern AU SangYao where they haven't had a proper date night in over a year because of their work schedules (let’s be honest, mostly Meng Yao's).

Nie Huaisang has everything planned, starting with dinner at one of their few mutually-favorite places, but just as the waiter comes to ask if he's ready to order, he gets the kiss of death text from Meng Yao that Jin Guangshan has suddenly dumped another "vitally important" project on him.

Nie Huaisang sighs and orders their meals to-go, with extra dessert.

Meng Yao doesn't get home until almost 2 in the morning, and he just looks so exhausted and miserable that Nie Huaisang can't be mad.

Not at him, anyway.

He helps Meng Yao get out of his work clothes and into a hot shower, then reheats the food. When he goes to check on his boyfriend again, he finds Meng Yao practically asleep slumped against the wall of the tub, so he pulls him out and wraps him in towels, and it's off to their bedroom to eat nice food out of disposable bowls while cuddled up together and sleepy.

It's not date night, but it'll do for now. 

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Sangyao combining the “Huaisang only goes to brothels for gossip/writing inspiration and occasional art models” and “Meng Yao didn’t manage to escape the brothel before being pressganged into taking up his mother’s contract” ideas into one timeline.

War hasn’t happened yet, but Nie Mingjue knows his brother’s good at information gathering (he has an entire network of gossip buddies/spies among the jiejies and geges in the Qinghe brothels) and asks him to start getting eyes closer to Qishan as long as he can do it without putting himself in danger.

One of Huaisang’s informants came from the Yunping brothel where Meng Shi worked and recommends it to him when he asks her about it. “The madam and owner aren’t worth much, but you'll get along well with the girls and boys,” she teases.

When he decides to take her up on it, she sends a letter to one of her former coworkers she knows is particularly trustworthy to give them a gentle heads up about a new client.

Naturally even with the recommendation, they're still a bit suspicious (Teenage sect heir from the other side of the country? What is he really up to?) but by the end of a week most of the ladies and a few of the men have practically adopted him.

Despite himself, Meng Yao can’t help being curious as well, and after taking time to observe, he subtly hints he'd be available if Huaisang needs any models closer to his own age. It'd be a decided step up from his usual clients.

#mdzs #cql #nie huaisang #jin guangyao #nie mingjue #sangyao #ideas #long post