#antisteverogers

[salty-ironstrange-shipper]

Stephen: I think the sensible thing for us to do is clear the air. Steve: Ok- Stephen: I hate you.

#ironstrange #stephen strange #incorrect-ironstrange #the divorce was rough #antisteverogers #anti steve rogers #source: dinosaurs #incorrect quotes

[bombshellsandbluebells]

Thanks for answering!! I loooove Peter and John and Emori and well most characters on your list really! While we're at it, which characters are your least favorite in MCU/the100? And which characters do you think are overrated or underrated?

Hey, awesome! And no problem! I love talking about the characters I like. You can come talk to me about them anytime! Or even characters you like that I don’t pay enough attention to.

Okay, this was a GREAT question, and I basically wrote you a novel in response.

The 100 – Clarke Griffin (if that wasn’t already obvious)

I used to love Clarke Griffin, but at this point, I just get annoyed whenever she comes on my screen. Clarke was a much stronger character in s2, when the writing committed to portraying her as flawed and morally grey and kind of ruthless in a way that was necessarily but also kind of concerning.

Now it seems like they always want to remind me she’s The Most Important – she’s almost become a version of the Chosen One trope in a narrative where that really shouldn’t be a thing – and a hero and just, like, suuuper pretty (the staircase scene was ridiculous). They’ve made her The Popular, Pretty Girl trope and I hate it. They might tell me in dialogue over and over again that there are no bad guys, but even when Clarke does bad, selfish things, they refuse to commit to it. She doesn’t face consequences and the writing is too concerned with making us side with her than actually calling her out. Even this season while other characters have been listing why they’re angry with her, everything is framed in a way to make us sympathize with her.

Letting a character do flawed things but trying to sway the viewer to ignore those flaws and loudly tell me that they’re still a good person rather than showing it is the easiest way to get me to not like a character. They’ve written Clarke as incredibly selfish, arrogant, and unwilling to listen to anyone else, unwilling to truly apologize or learn from her mistakes – but they just won’t admit to it or let her grow. OR commit to an actual downward spiral arc. Either would be accepted.

Plus, she’s just boring now. Everything comes too easily for her – people she’s hurt forgive her too easily, and the nightblood is basically a superpower at this point. The writing of her is just lazy and it’s not compelling.

MCU – Steve Rogers

I also used to like Steve. Whedon’s characterization was always off (and I think AoU really contributed to the problems in his overall arc), but I liked him a lot in Cap 1 and Winter Soldier is still one of my favorite MCU movies and the best handling of his character overall.

I need to rewatch the MCU before I really dive into just what went wrong with Steve’s character, but I just never really found him as compelling a character past WS and I was mad at him more than I liked or sided with him. Even with Endgame, I was just indifferent to how his story ended.

I think he suffers from a lot of the same problems as the writing for Clarke does. Steve has flaws and that’s great – it makes him interesting and human – but even while the narrative shows you his flaws, it tries to push you to ultimately ignore them because he’s a hero and we’re supposed to side with him because they already established he’s a good man. The problem is that Steve’s flaws ultimately get shown a lot more than his heroic, moral side as the movies go on. And despite not showing us that heroic side, they keep loudly telling us over and over again that Steve still is a selfless hero who will lay down on the wire – something he actually hasn’t shown he will do (for anyone but Bucky, maybe) for several movies now. In fact, he’s the only one in Endgame who really doesn’t do “whatever it takes” or have to sacrifice ANYTHING.

What @gamorazenwhoberis says in this post really explains it better than I am right now.

In short, starting with AoU (the root of so many characterization issues in the MCU), the writing starts telling us that Steve’s a selfless hero and a shining example of a good man while only really showing us his flawed behavior. It’s hard to keep buying that Steve is the “lay down on the wire” type when he doesn’t do anything to prove it. I also really struggle to side with him in later movies because I find him, in the wise words of Rhodey, “dangerously arrogant.” Steve’s intentions are always good, but he never believes he can be wrong, and that’s a problem. And again, that could be a really interesting character flaw if portrayed as a flaw – but I think too often the narrative ultimately expects us to side with him because…I don’t know, he’s Captain America, you know?  

It’s not necessarily Steve’s fault, because I think he IS meant to be portrayed as an ultimately heroic man who wants to help people but still has realistic human flaws – it’s the writing’s fault, because they way they end up framing it makes it look like Steve is all talk when it comes to heroic sacrifices but, unlike his fellow Avengers, unwilling to sacrifice or compromise.  

Also, I’ll be honest - I relate so much with Tony and project so much onto him that a lot of his actions in Civil War felt like a personal betrayal and I had a hard time liking him again after that movie. I still like him just fine in the first few films and I actually did enjoy a lot of scenes in Endgame, but a lot of his actions bother me and never feel like they’re actually addressed in a way that calls him out and the writing of him REALLY bothers. And when I’m not mad it him in later movies, I’m mostly indifferent. I do love him in other universes though.

Underrated

1. JAMES RHODEY RHODES DOES NOT GET ENOUGH APPRECIATION!!! He’s fantastic and I love him and I really wish he was given a bit more room to shine in IW/Endgame, even though I get they’re juggling too many characters. They just handled him SO WELL in Civil War that I wanted to see more writing that showed how much conviction and sense of duty he had. Also the brief moment where he talked about being paralyzed and how they have to “work with what they’ve got” was so good, I wanted so much more of it.

2. Maria Hill! The writing has really wronged her. I didn’t like her writing in Age of Ultron at all (she’s not a secretary, Whedon), and she’s been such an afterthought in the MCU since then. I’m so excited to see her come back in FFH, because I think there’s still so much cool stuff they could do with her. I’d actually love them to write her with a bit more 616 characterization, because in comics she’s kind of both The Worst and The Best all at once. She’s just MEAN. But she also helps run a massive intelligence agency with an iron fist and has a strong sense of duty and right and wrong and she’s more than a little terrifying. She’s just great. I’m glad to see her back. I love that she’s still been doing her part to help protect the world even with SHIELD gone.

3. NEBULA!!! She has such a good arc and she was wonderful in Endgame and this whole fandom sleeps on her and it’s unacceptable.

Overrated

1. Wanda Maximoff. :/ I really, really WANT to like MCU Wanda, and Elizabeth Olson does an amazing job with what she’s given, but her character bothers me a lot. I like the concept of her arc going from villain to hero. She’s really similar to Nebula in that way – her turn to villainy was born from trauma, but over time she learned to repurpose that trauma into a way to help other people.

The problem is that….it just kind of doesn’t work for me. Part of it is that she also suffers from the Clarke Griffin Problem – aka, she’s flawed and she makes mistakes and the dialogue tells me this, but she either avoids consequences or she fails to apologize for them. In theory, I like her arc about mistakes and atonement and doing better (which is exactly why I love Tony and Natasha and Nebula), but the writing of it doesn’t work for me. And her relationship with Vision is just so boring it’s hard to be invested. I think they did such a disservice to her by killing off her most interesting relationship, even though I know it was for legal reasons. (I do like her relationship with Clint, though.)

2. Carol Danvers. :( Again, I WANT to like her so badly. I love comics Carol so much. I bought a Captain Marvel shirt for the premiere. I have a Captain Marvel coffee mug. I’ve been looking forward to her movie for YEARS.

But I just find MCU Carol incredibly bland. There isn’t much depth to her even after her own solo movie, and I think Captain Marvel did a terrible job of developing her – especially in comparison to how well other MCU heroes have been developed in their own solo films. She has a lot of surface-level qualities that are fun – like being headstrong and snarky and a badass (I AM delighted that there’s no question she is the strongest hero) – but there just isn’t much emotional depth to flesh her out. I still feel like all I really know about her are basic facts and not anything about what she believes in or feels, and I feel like I was more emotionally connected with Maria in one scene than I ever was with Carol. I’m really hoping her next movie fixes that problem for me because I want to love her.

Thanks for asking!! I’m not kidding. You can always come yell at me about fictional characters. :)

#ask #anticlarkegriffin #anti clarke griffin #antisteverogers #anti steve rogers

[laufire]

i’m sorry i know this is a dumb question, but what do you mean by agents of shield being like “hold my beer” to endgame?

More "in reaction to Endgame" than to Endgame.

Basically, I still find it hilarious how they went about Sousa and Sousa/Peggy. They basically turned what was, post-EG, a pretty humiliating plot for him into a big ass win.

First, he clearly won the breakup. Daisy >>>>>>>>>>>> Steffie the Second (Steffie the First is TVD's Steffie because he was at least more entertaining). And they made sure to let us know he was NOT, AT ALL, pinning over Peggy, strongly implying in addition to that that the breakup wasn't because of Steve but because of job/time mutual issues. They also reversed and turned on its head several actions made by Steve in the MCU, like having him fully embrace the future. I know I drew more anti-parallels as I was watching but it's been a while xDD.

Another comparison I immediately made with the film was Fitz and Simmons getting to have the idilic rural retirement raising a cute daughter as a couple. You know, unlike certain couple in the MCU. Now, in s5 and 6 I can barely stand FS -hell, I quite s6 halfway through an episode because of them-, but in s7 they didn't bother me and I find this to be a raised middle finger towards EG tbh.

I'm sure there were more, but I have no desire to rewatch EG ever, in my life (AoS, probably. A mutual here watched s7 and I rewatched some scenes to have them fresh. Timequake scenes, specifically, because they're amazing <3. I'm very glad they brought Sousa in because Enver Gjokaj is an excellent actor both in terms of range AND as a Romantic Hero, and this show finally utilized at least the second part).

#anonymous #replies #talking to the void #my thoughts #marvel thoughts #antisteverogers for ts #jic #agents of s.h.i.e.l.d. #daniel sousa #timequake

[salty-ironstrange-shipper]

Steve: I asked you a question. Stephen: And I ignored it and moved on. Keep up.

#ironstrange #stephen strange #incorrect-ironstrange #incorrect quotes #anti steve rogers #antisteverogers

[salty-ironstrange-shipper]

I am turning into anti Steve Rogers real quick reading your fics. Honestly your blog opened my eyes.

happy to be of service *salutes*

#anti steve rogers #antisteverogers #asks

[salty-ironstrange-shipper]

Stephen: Hurt Tony again and I'll drop a mountain on your head.

Steve: Figuratively?

Stephen, eyes glowing: Geologically.

#ironstrange #tony stark #stephen strange #incorrect-ironstrange #incorrect quotes #marvel #mcu #source: supergirl #antisteverogers #anti-steverogers

[salty-ironstrange-shipper]

Steve: As some of you may know, I took a bit of a sabbatical last year-

Harley: Do you mean when you shacked up with your ex from the 40s, but then she dumped you?

Stephen: Harley, please!

Stephen: ... *approving smile* Raise your hand if you want to ask a question.

#supremefamily #strangefamily #ironstrange #stephen strange #harley keener #doctor dad #incorrect-ironstrange #incorrect quotes #marvel #mcu #antisteverogers #anti-steverogers #kinda #it's mostly funny #source: derry girls

[salty-ironstrange-shipper]

I need help, and I think you're the only one who can help me. I want to read Ironstrange/Supremefamily fics, with maybe some time travel and not that friendly towards Steve/Rogues.

I've found some on AO3 but are not what I was looking for or are incomplete.

Can you please help me? Pretty please?

I can't think of any specifically antiSteve fics that are also time travel fics (though I have recced antisteve fics in general in the past, check my #fic recs or #ironstrange fic recs tags to see that), so any recommendations from the crowd?

#ironstrange #asks #incorrect-ironstrange #antisteverogers #antirogueavengers #ironstrange fanfiction

[laufire]

sometimes I worry about whether my reaction to some fictional development makes me a hypocrite (I like to know for sure that I'm being a hypocrite!), and then a new fandom comes along and proves I was right all along lol.

for example, I always thought that if I were a mcu!Steve fan, I would've hated his ending. as it is, I went through "somewhat unsure how to feel about this, but wtf the intent is terrible" to "trololol that's hilarious" to indifferent/forgetful.

then, my main worry about Black Sails' finale was that Flint's ending might come across as Steve's to me. I would have hated that. but it didn't because of one (1) key difference that's exactly why I think Steve's ending was so awful for his character: Flint's lack of agency in his demise.

without that element, if Flint had abandoned the war willingly to be with his old flame, you bet your ass I would have hated it. it would've killed my love for Flint for good. as it is, I can enjoy that he got that respite BECAUSE it was forced upon him (and ofc, you can imagine all the ways he would have tried to claim that robbed agency back, and none of them are exactly "peaceful uneventful domestic life" if you know Flint at all, sns).

#talking to the void #my thoughts #black sails #black sails thoughts #james flint #antisteverogers for ts #just in case #black sails spoilers #also jic lol #black sails 4x10

[laufire]

Look, I don’t want to be the one making an argument in favour of Steve and/or Peggy/Steve, of all things, and I promise I won’t (I don’t think I’d know how xD), but--

What makes a relationship like Pepperony or Iron Husbands (and maybe other shippers are making the same complaint but I haven’t seen it, so), so, SO important, isn’t the exact counter of decades/years/minutes they knew each other. it’s what intrinsic between them as INDIVIDUALS. Pepper and Rhodey, the way they are as PEOPLE, is what makes them so important to Tony, and it would’ve been like that even if they hadn’t known each other forever.

Using the “Steve and Peggy knew each other for only two years at MOST, how can you say they’re more important than two people that have known each other for 30/40 years??” makes them sound like they’re generic relationships, like just ANY people could’ve become so poignant to Tony by virtue of being there, WHEN THIS IS FACTUALLY NOT TRUE. Time and endurance is far from the only thing those ships got going for them (though yeah, I love that part too as much as any of you).

Like it or not, in the MCU Peggy is obviously The Most Important Person for Steve, and knowing her for basically a hot minute is irrelevant on that matter; people say it messed with Steve’s relationship with other people and yes, THAT WAS THE POINT. It was to show that, despite barely knowing her and not talking to her for years, getting to be with her still mattered to him more than Bucky, than Sam, than Peggy’s own lived life, than his own past self in the ice, than everyone in the real timeline. You can think whatever you want about him for it (I myself have a few choice words lol), but it is 100% canon.

And you know what? Pepper, Rhodey, the Iron Fam, etc. THEY ARE THAT FOR TONY. Time and again we’ve seen Pepper is The One, that Rhodey is his soulmate, that he loves his children with all his heart. That is not about the amount of time they managed to stay together, it’s about who they ARE. And seeing this argument again and again for why Pepperony/Rhodeytony should have its own feature instead of Peggy/Steve feels like it’s doing them a huge disservice, IMO.

Also like, I’m just gonna say it: yes, I rolled my eyes when I read the special features; obvious bias is obvious lol. But you THINK I would want a Pepperony or Iron Husbands feature from directors that obviously prefer another ship? Hell no (and I’m not one of those people who think they ruined either of my ships; I just think they could never do them justice as an OTP so lol no, the less I have to hear about them from them the better). They can keep their feature, it’s not like they’re making me watch it xD I have all the films my ships are in AND the rest of the MCU keeps paralleling the characters with them, I’m covered even if nothing else they produce may measure up anymore.

#iron fam #pepperony #ironhusbands #mcu #tony stark #marvel #my thoughts #marvel thoughts #fandom nonsense #bitter lau tag #marvel fandom problems #antisteggy for ts #antisteverogers for ts

[laufire]

agent carter

lowkey otp: I literally just met Dubious Scientists Jason Wilkes (I saw 2x01 two days ago), but I liked how flustered Peggy got around him, so for now, he goes here (no-one spoil me ANYTHING istg). And Mr. and Mrs. Jarvis are really darn cute. And I’ll never forget the idea of Gabe/Peggy.

high-key notp: I did just say my MCU notp was Steve/anyone, so.

[softly] don’t notp: eehhh… I wouldn’t call them notps, but I’m not really into Angie/Peggy or Peggy/Sousa, tbh (mostly because I’m not passionate about either of those characters).

high-key otp but i’m scared of saying it because it’s not a very popular choice: I don’t ship it, but I very much think there’s a (plausibly deniable) somewhat romantic undercurrent between Peggy and Howard –thought I doubt the show would’ve ever gone there–, and I feel that’d be the type of thing fandom wouldn’t want to talk about.

high-key otp and anyone on my tumblr knows it: this is the first time I really talk about this show, so I very much doubt “everyone knows this”, but my new ao3 icon is the scene in 2x01 where Peggy uncuffs Dottie, so um. Yeah. Dottie/Peggy (carterwood, apparently) is the closest I have to an OTP in this show. Am I being queer-baited? Most definitely. Am I still falling for it? You betcha.

#agent carter #carterwood #marvel #marvel tv #peggy carter #since unsurprisingly this reply revolves around her lol #howardpeggy for ts #antisteverogers for ts #antisteggy for ts #my thoughts #talking to the void #marvel thoughts #thanks for asking about this show tbh ^.^ #Anonymous

[laufire]

@missbrunettebarbie replied to your post: @missbrunettebarbie asked:��and �� Fave season ...

Ah, yes, a character’s arc can make me love or hate them! It is the main thing that drew me to Caroline in TVD (I started watching is S6) and to book!Dany in Asoiaf

yup. to me, if an arc ends up letting me down, as much as I love the character, it’ll make me less invested/withdrew from canon (for example, Allison Argent from Teen Wolf would’ve had a good shot at #1 if her arc hadn’t been butchered, and then she’d gotten killed...), and I think sometimes you don’t fully know who a character is/what you feel about them until the end of their story, because endgames have the power to reframe entire shows (which foreshadowing was straightforward, which one was ~twarted and subverted --like, often people say things like “we should’ve seen it coming” and point out instances of “foreshadowing”, but IMO until it’s watched it can be read either way. Schrodinger foreshadowing lmao).

for example, it didn’t click in my brain that I couldn’t stand mcu!Steve until his very last scene in Endgame lmao. I often thought he was a prick and a hypocrite*, but I kept thinking in 616!Steve, who I love, and kind of superimposed his image over the MCU version? idek. then EG came and I was like. what a fucking dick get him out of my face RIGHT NOW xDD

* this section is here because I saw gifs of the scene and I want to get this out of my chest. the moment that has pissed me off the most with him is probably in TWS, where he gets all uppity at Fury because he hadn’t known Hydra was inside S.H.I.E.L.D. at NICK FURY, aka the one (1) person who DID notice something was wrong, said “hey, this whole strike project is suspicious, maybe I should dig into this”, and such became such a torn on Hydra’s side that they sent their best assassin against him. sure, Steve. I hope you said the same to your dear exes when you saw them again in the 40s, since a.) they enabled those Nazis by letting them collaborate with S.H.I.E.L.D. in the first place (or put them in prisons where Hydra easily reached them later on, like Nazi Mr. Dominic on AOS), and b.) in Howard’s case, worked so closely with them that he was calling Zola by his first name in EG. ANYWAY, yeah, I needed to say that xDD

#missbrunettebarbie #talking to the void #my thoughts #replies #marvel thoughts #antisteverogers for ts #writing