#batman 1940 416

[kittykatninja321]

Obsessed with this interaction. The way Bruce lied twice before telling the truth and the way Dick sees through it immediately. The way “I needed to take him in otherwise he’d die” is something Bruce tells himself about Jason but doesn’t really believe

#Also according to this chapter it had been 18 months since they’d last talked #Bruce Wayne #Dick Grayson #Jason Todd #Batman #Batman 1940 416 #Dc #long post

[mintacle]

I have this little gripe with any reading of Batman 1940 #416 that ends its analysis of Bruce and Dick's conversation by concluding that Bruce took Jason in to replace Dick. Because yes, but more importantly no. Let's break it down.

The panels that lead to the abovementioned conclusion are these:

Bruce admits to having missed Dick and to having felt lonely. This can to some extent be read as in Jason replacing Dick. But I think a reasonable argument can be made that being lonely and missing one specific person doesn't mean everyone new you let into your life is just an attempt to fill in the exact position of the former person. More on how Jason is not Dick later.

But first let us consider the fact that Bruce also gives Dick a whole 4 other reasons for taking Jason in.

1. Jason seemed like the right guy for the job.

2. Bruce sympathized with Jason.

3. Bruce wanted to help Jason

And Dick calls "Bull" on these (literally), which prompts Bruce to give another reason:

4. Bruce needed another set of hands on the job.

Only after Dick calls Bruce out again does Bruce admit to having missed Dick.

Now I believe you have to give all these former reasons just as much credit as the final one. The final one isn't last because it's more true, it's last because it is the one reason Bruce doesn't want to admit to Dick. In support of my theory to all being true in different ways, we have the parallel of Dick and Bruce unmasking.

Dick begins the conversation by unmasking.

And then insists upon Bruce unmasking as well.

(I'm not gonna rave about the significance of the background color changing. I'm not gonna rave about the significance of the-)

In the same way Dick asks Bruce to reveal more and more about his reason to take Jason in. The interpretation if these panels hinges vitally on understanding that Bruce is Batman. That part of his identity is true. Ergo, his reasons related to Batman for taking Jason in are true. His reason as Bruce to take Jason in (sympathy, wanting to help, missing Dick) are equally true. Bruce is still himself with the mask on, he is hiding behind the truth (I am Batman) and just in the same manner he is hiding behind the truth when Dick confronts him too. All the above mentioned reasons for Bruce taking Jason in are true. Saying it was only to replace Dick is reductionist.

Now let's get to the part of my alternative interpretation of Bruce admitting he was lonely and he missed Dick. Some people have chosen to see this as meaning that Jason was there to replace Dick, but again, I think that is reductionist and simplifies the complex human connections we have with one another. There is no such thing as one person replacing another.

I'm going full death of the author with my headcanon (based on canon argumentation though) that I'm about to give, since this issue was written by Starlin and it's probably safe to assume he intended to portray Jason as a mere replacement of Dick, but less skilled at the job. (Ffffuck you Starlin.)

Dick and Bruce have a.. non-conforming realtionship. They matter a lot to one another. They are partners, the dynamic duo, but it's hard to justify labeling them as any specific kind of relationship. Bruce was too young and inexperienced to take Dick in as his son and while he did ultimately raise Dick, their relationship was too equal to really be considered as a one-way father-son relationship. Dick has left (been fired) and Bruce is left missing him. Not only missing Dick, but also mourning the opportunity he had to become a father to a young boy and he now feels he has lost. He meets another young boy. Just as parentless, just as burning with a sense of justice and willingness to fight for it. Jason and Bruce's dynamic has always been far more of the parental-child nature. Starting with the fact that Jason was actually legally adopted, but also simply going from their interactions. Bruce realized he wishes to be a father and nurture someone through Dick and he is fulfilling this desire with Jason because he feels it is too late to be a father to Dick.

And full disclosure, this last part is 100% my own wishful thinking, however there is nothing in canon that would contradict my interpretation and enough supporting evidence for it to be a possibility.

Final conclusion: no Robin, Jason, Tim, Stephanie or Damian can or should be reduced to being a replacement for the one who came before. While there will always be that aspect at play that Bruce operates with a Robin, there are always more reasons for Bruce taking in the sidekicks he ultimately does.

#jason todd #batman #bruce wayne #nightwing #dick grayson #robin #dynamic duo #dc comics #dc #rambling #batman 1940 416

[roipecheur]

Babygirl, there are so many things wrong with you ♥

#batman 1940 #this is issue 416 #1. tells dick he can't be robin anymore after the joker shot him bc the job's too dangerous for a kid #2. didn't talk to dick before he left and hasn't talked to him in 18 months #3. dick found out that there was a new robin from the fucking newspaper what the fuck bruce #4. bruce with more layers than a fucking onion here #ok another thing that gets me is dick saying he was robin for six years #but in the issue where the joker shot him he was 19 #he was robin since he was 9 so it should be 10 years #but time isn't real and comics time doubly so #anyway I have no idea how dick hasn't killed him lmao

[captainshadowgirllostfan]

Gonna read this right now.

#Batman 1940 #Batman #416 #comics #dc comics #dc comics online #nightwing #dick grayson #robin #robin ii #Jason Todd #Bruce Wayne #Alfred Pennyworth

[vechter]

the trees witness everything, victoria chang // batman: dark victory (1999) #13 // robin: year one (2000) #1 // light, sleeping at last // jla (1997) #69 // batman (2016) #130 // light, sleeping at last // batman (2016) #54 // moony moonless sky, fatima aamer bilal // jla (1997) #73 // batman (1940) #416 // robin (1993) #13 // checkmate (2006) #14 // the two times i loved you the most in a car, dorothea grossman // batman: gotham knights (2000) #21 // outsiders (2003) #49 // robin 80th anniversary 100-page super spectacular (2020) // robin in a cage, george ralston wyllie // poetry, richard siken

bruce & dick + (mis)communication

#dc comics #dick grayson #bruce wayne #web weaving #robin #webweaving #nightwing #batman #batman and robin #dick & bruce: you'll never recover from that kind of devotion #today on things I have in common with bruce wayne we are both soooooo normal about dick grayson #bruce wayne the man that u are #also ending this with a robin in a cage is soooo fucked up of me #gotham is a cage and dick has always been a bird

[celaenaeiln]

Was Dick ever mean to Jason when they first met? Because I’ve seen a lot of fanon where it’s implied/shown that he was, but I haven’t seen anything to prove that it’s canon (and I’m happy you’re back even though you weren’t gone long I love your blog)

Aww thank you!!

Ugh I don't know where fanon keeps getting the idea but Dick was never mean to Jason as Robin.

Let's start with the erased version, otherwise known as pre-crisis.

Jason Todd was born to acrobatic parents and also performed in the circus. Here's the interesting bit: it wasn't Bruce who found out about them, it was Dick who was at the circus and cheered them.

Batman (1940) Issue #357

Where was Bruce? He was busy becoming squid food in Gotham.

Anyway Bruce escapes and meets up with Dick who is still Robin and helps him solve part of the crime. As he's discussing the case with Dick, Dick mentions that there may be a connection to Bruce's case and something Trina Todd said.

Yup! Dick becomes friends with Jason's mom <3

Batman (1940) Issue #358

Bruce doesn't trust her but Dick does and Bruce trusts Dick so he accepts.

So Dick goes to meet Trina and her husband but they've already left to sneak into the villain's lair and get caught by Killer Croc. So he chases after them. Barbara joins in as Batgirl but Batgirl and Robin are too late because Killer Croc has already fed Joe and Trina to crocodiles.

Batman's still fighting his own case while all this is happening.

Waldo the Clown takes Jason to the manor and while Jason's in the kitchen looking for food, he finds the door behind the grandfather clock open, goes inside, and finds the batcave.

He finds a trunk of Dick's old suits as Robin and that's where the iconic pre-crisis Jason Robin scene comes -

Detective Comics (1937) Issue #526

Which first of all Jason why are you wearing other people's clothes without their permission? But anyway Jason hears people coming and finds Batman's busy grabbing information with Selina and so he hides in the trunk of the Batmobile. Robin Dick and Batgirl solve the case on their end and find out there's a trap for Batman so they come in and save Batman and his allies. Jason sneaks out of the car and finds his parents are dead so he tries to kill Killer Croc but Dick and Barbara stop him.

Detective Comics (1937) Issue #526

Dick's just like "oh, you sweetheart."

Dick wants to adopt him but Bruce is like mine because they're both like "It's my fault his parents died, I should take responsibility."

Detective Comics (1937) Issue #526

Dick was really nice to Jason.

Batman (1940) Issue #529

Dick is Jason's idol. He and Dick have a great relationship, so much so that Dick actually passes on the Robin name and suit to Jason.

Batman (1940) Issue #529

I could make a meme out of the handshake scene with Bruce being one hand and Jason being the other and in the middle the hands meet is "idolizing Dick Grayson".

So Dick and Jason had a fantastic relationship.

And then some things happen where this Jason wasn't well-recieved by the audience because of the way writers handled the transition from Dick's robin to Jason's so DC realized that they need to make Jason into his own person with his own personality, looks, and story.

So they magic marker erased the previous timeline and now we have the actual Jason Todd that's actually relevant to every comic that comes after.

Yet in this current timeline too, Dick treated Jason sweetly.

Here Dick's first meeting with Jason, he actually saves Jason from the hands of drug dealers.

Batman (1940) Issue #416

He let go of his hiding spot to get the new Robin out of trouble.

Jason is not at all happy about this.

Batman (1940) Issue #416

And Dick's pissed off because he found out there's a new Robin through a newspaper and he just lost a drug deal he's been waiting on to bailout the new Robin.

So Dick storms off and Jason asks Bruce about Nightwing

Batman (1940) Issue #416

And I'm going to reiterate parts of this post for this part (people please please read this post because tumblr has an image limit and I've explained it in detail there but I can't here)

Dick had no idea Bruce passed on the Robin costume. He finds out through the newspaper because Bruce is pissed at Dick. Like he's so mad that when he told Dick to leave, Dick actually left.

You know how there's a saying about not being able to take back words of anger? Bruce is feeling that heavily. He already had suspicions that Dick wanted to leave but before Dick could tell him, he fired him so he wouldn't have to hear those words. But Bruce is super mad that Dick left anyway. So what does he do? He makes the first boy he sees Robin.

And Jason finds out Dick was Robin when he confronts Bruce why Nightwing knows Bruce's identity. And that gets Bruce more mad because he's now feeling guilty which is when Dick comes to confront Bruce.

After meeting Bruce, Dick talks about what he's been up to since he left and put Bruce in a good mood before he starts tearing into him.

Batman (1940) Issue #416

Bruce looks so wrecked. The guilt and sorrow is tantamount to his pain.

Then Dick asks Bruce why he choose someone new.

Batman (1940) Issue #416

So Bruce tells him. But Dick and Bruce's relationship go way deeper than just friends or family. They know each other. They revolve around each other so Dick calls him out, and out comes the truth

Batman (1940) Issue #416

But here's what it means in terms of Dick and Jason's relationship:

Instead of letting Jason become some sort of spite move, Dick becomes the bigger man and decides to turn Robin into a legacy.

Batman (1940) Issue #416

He passes it down like it was meant to be passed down. Because let's be honest here. The Robin name and costume is Dick's. If he wanted to, he could've taken it back, Bruce be damned. And that was one of Jason's fears.

It's Dick's approval of Jason and them catching the drug dealers together at the end that cements Jason as Robin. It's his acceptance and good will toward Jason that Bruce is grateful for.

Batman (1940) Issue #416

Dick also validates and praises Jason in the comics whenever they meet.

The New Teen Titans (1984) Issue #31

He's basically, "Don't worry about Bruce, if you get in trouble, I'll take care of it."

The only problem is they didn't meet a lot but when they did it was good times all around.

The third version of Dick and Jason's meeting.

In this version holy honking heck. First of all it's a flashback when Bruce fires Dick because he feels like he's too busy with other duties to be with Batman and then after a series of events in present time, it shows that Bruce literally kidnapped Jason and gagged and tied him to a chair. And Alfred's like WTH BRUCE?!

Even more things happen on both sides (curse you 30-image per post tumblr limit) and Bruce essentially makes Jason watch all the videos of Dick and sets Jason's gauntlet test to be a game of tag with Dick.

Dick is completely unaware of all this happening because he's just having fun busting up thugs and playing with Barbara, having no clue that Bruce and Jason are literally watching him livestream through his bike dash cam.

Nightwing (1996) Issue #105

Jason literally shows up while Dick's pondering on a rooftop and is like who're you? Oh wait you're him lol. Move over there's a new robin in town! And Dick's just like WHAT?! He such a little shit about it.

Dick's immediately like okay I'm upset at Bruce but I have to help this new kid out. There's no hesitation, no regret, no anger towards Jason at all. Just pure desire to see him succeed.

Not gonna lie, Jason's just awful towards Dick because he thinks that Dick is his test or something Dick's just like, "can you cool it for a sec?" They soon find out about a huge crime drug activity going on and Dick sorta mentors Jason through it while on the case. I'm not gonna include the panels but it's just Dick and Jason working together. It's fun to read and cute because Dick's protective of him and Jason's like a little bird following a bigger scarier one.

At the end the crime is solved, Jason and Alfred go home, and Dick calls Bruce to tell him this -

Nightwing (1996) Issue #106

Nightwing (1996) Issue #106

He was so, so nice to Jason. Actually it's impossible for anyone to treat Jason better than Dick treated him, not even Bruce was this nice to Jason.

In Nightwing (2016) Annual, there's another story of Dick and Jason's meeting. In this case Dick comes over after Alfred calls him and Jason's sulking in his room because Bruce grounded him. He pulls Jason away and they go on a Nightwing and Robin adventure where Dick talks to him, teaches him, and lifts his spirits.

Nightwing (2016) 2021 Annual

Dick being mean to Jason is pure fanon, it's so fanon that there isn't even a single comic panel that can be used in support of that horrible idea. He never ignored Jason. Dick makes it very, very clear that his problems are with Bruce won't interfere with his relationship with Jason. He treats Jason as an independent person with his own personality and genuinely looks after and cares for him in every retelling. The only thing is they didn't meet very often but when they did, Dick was such a good brother.

#dick grayson #nightwing #jason todd #red hood #robin jason todd #bruce wayne #batman #cl anon asks #cl asks #thanks for the ask!

[flashfuture]

(Batman 1940 #416)

Ever think about how Jason probably never grew into the Robin costume Dick gave him

#dc comics #jason todd #dick grayson #robin #nightwing

[redhoodinternaldialectical]

Too Dangerous for Kids

So, recently I had reason to go back and read Jason's post-crisis debut comic Batman (1940) #408 and it clicked really hard that basically the central theme of Jason becoming Robin was that Robin was too dangerous a job for kids. Before he becomes Robin, Dick got injured, badly, by the Joker, and Batman swore to never endanger another child like that, which is the reason Dick stops being Robin at all

Batman (1940) #416

And I'm friggin realizing now that the posing in Death of the Family is straight up a mirror to this scene of Dick having been shot?? I'm losing my mind???

Batman (1940) #408

Like, look at this in universe magazine shot with this talk on the radio compared to Bruce holding Jason and tell me this was not deliberate????

Batman (1940) #408 and Batman (1940) #428

And THIS TALK?????

Batman (1940) #408

I just... HMMMM, idk there's something very fascinating to me that the theme of 'this is too dangerous for kids' has been there in Jason since day zero.

It also makes me sympathize a lot with poor Dick who got fired "cause it's too dangerous for a kiddo out there", when he was no longer a child, and then WHAT DOES BRUCE HAVE WITH HIM NOT EVEN A YEAR LATER?!

Batman (1940) #416

He's devastated by the realization there's a new Robin, then harsh and critical of the new Robin because he's sure they're gonna screw up and get hurt

Batman (1940) #416

Not because he wants his old job back

Batman (1940) #416

Despite his misgiving about the mantel being passed on at all, at the end of it, he still gives Jason his respect and acceptance into the role

Teen Titans (2003) #29

And this has such fascinating parallels to Jason's reaction to finding out there's a new Robin after him!

Red Hood: The Lost Days #4

He is devastated by the realization there's a new Robin, then attempts to brutally dissuade the new Robin from keeping the mantel because he's sure they're gonna screw up and get killed

Teen Titans (2003) #29

Not because he wants his old job back

Teen Titans (2003) #29

Despite his misgiving about the mantel being passed on at all, at the end of it, Tim still has his respect, and perhaps even his acceptance into the role, although he was far too violent about it to actually properly give the role over like Dick did for him.

Teen Titans (2003) #29

Neither of them have a petty, jealous reaction of you replaced me, but instead have a tangled mess of "I was sloppy, I wasn't good enough, I got hurt, and now you put an even less prepared child in the line of fire?!" Jason is wildly more violent about it, but at the core I feel like the sentiments are the same, and it kinda makes sense because really the end of their times as Robin were very similar to each other, just Jason's was wildly more violent!

I can't help but wonder if maybe part of Jason's reasoning somewhere along the line was "Now I finally get why Dick was so harsh on me back then." And... honestly I don't think it is. Cause while it would make sense it just doesn't seem to be a parallel either of them is conscious of.

It's just this fascinating set of reflections neither one seems to see.

#jason todd #dick grayson #important robin research #damian's tomfoolery #I am losing my mind over this #UGHGHHGHHGHH #I would go on to talk about how Tim broke this cycle despite following its curves on surface inspection #but i am already late for doing shit lmao #dick greyson & jason todd

[lazaruspiss]

"It didn't matter to you that I didn't have any life other than the one we shared. You're really some piece of work, aren't you?" (Batman (1940) #416)

#nightwing #dick grayson #hes talking to bruce obvi #everyone should read 416 it makes me cry forever

[hopeworth]

batman (1940) #416 // natalie diaz, when my brother was an aztec

#dick grayson #bruce wayne #dick & bruce #dc #webweaving #web weaving #poetry #when my brother was an aztec #natalie diaz #web weave #batman #slapping this quote on EVERY single panel of the cowl if i am able to #my stuff

[sbd-laytall]

Daily reminder that Dick had issues with Bruce, but he never had a problem with Jason or treated him badly. Were they close? No. But Dick cared enough about him that he broke down crying when he found out that Jason had died.

Batman (1940) #416

#I swear this post sounds kind of condescending or some shit but I absolutely hate the fanon idea that Dick was shitty to Jason #because no the fuck he wasn't #Fanon Dick in general irks me because he 'is too complacent' 'was really awful to Jason' 'was really awful to Tim' #'has no sense of personal space' 'all impulsive thoughts no thinking whatsoever' 'womanizer/flirty guy' #like how do go from a complex multi-layered character into that #dick grayson #nightwing #jason todd #robin #batman comics #dc comics #comic series #my post

[nightmareinfloral]

Dick Grayson Reading Guide- Robin, Nightwing, & Batman

Robin:

Batman (1940) #192, 202-203, 227, 229-231, 234-236, 239, 240-242, 244-245, 248, 250, 252, 254, 259, 333, 337-339, 341-343

Detective Comics (1937) #38, 390-391, 394-395, 398-403, 445, 447, 450-451, 481-485

Teen Titans (1966)

Batman: Dark Victory

Batman Chronicles: The Gauntlet

Robin: Year One

Year One: Batman/Scarecrow

Batman: Year Three

Teen Titans: Year One (2008)

The New Teen Titans (1980)

Tales of the Teen Titans (1984) #41-44

Nightwing:

Nightwing: Year One

The New Teen Titans (1984)

Secret Origins (1986) #13, Annual 3

Batman (1940) #416

Nightwing: Old Friends, New Enemies

Nightwing (1996)

JLA/Titans: The Technis Imperative

Batman Plus Arsenal (1997)

Young Justice (1998) #7

Titans (1999)

Batman: Cataclysm

Batman: Aftershock

Batman: Gotham Knights (2000)

Outsiders (2003)

Batman: The Resurrection of Ra’s Al Ghul

Batman:

Batman: Prodigal

Batman R.I.P.

Batman and Robin (2009)

Batman: The Black Mirror

Batman: Streets of Gotham

Batman: Gates of Gotham

*Disclaimer: these are all my personal recommendations and by no means a complete guide, just the comics that I liked the most and that I felt captured Dick the best! They are mostly in chronological order but some may not be.

#reading guide #dick grayson #nightwing #batman #robin

[asongofstarkandtargaryen]

Batman (1940) issue #416 means a lot to me because not only Dick accepts Jason as the new robin but even goes as far as to give him his old robin suit:

And the issue ends with Bruce watching them from afar and smiling:

Adorable batfamily moments

#dick Grayson #jason todd #bruce wayne #batfamily #dick and jason

[nightwings-robin]

honestly really tired of seeing posts claiming that Dick hated Jason when Jason was Robin. like nO HE DIDN'T. they didn't always get along well but there was definitely no hatred between them. and to be quite honest, they barely even interacted.

one of the few times that they actually had a bad argument was when they first met in post-crisis continuity and that argument was only because Jason interfered with a drug-bust that Dick was planning in Batman (1940) #416:

Dick is pretty mad at Jason here but by the end of the issue, they make up and are on good terms. Dick even gives Jason his Robin costume:

this post gets long so I put the rest under the cut

the main reasons I have seen people claim that Dick hated Jason was because Jason caused Dick and Bruce to have a bad relationship and that Jason "stole" Robin from him.

Dick and Bruce did very much argue about Jason sometimes but Dick and Bruce had a strained relationship long before Jason showed up. a lot of arguments between them had to do with Dick leaving to lead the Teen Titans and him dropping out of college (yes Dick is canonically a college-dropout. I wish more people knew that). they even argued about Talia a lot, among other things. this was all YEARS before Jason was even introduced.

The New Teen Titans (1980) #1

Batman (1940) #330

(there are many other examples of Dick and Bruce arguing about college, Talia, the Titans and other things but this post is going to be a bit long so I'll just leave it at these two panels)

Dick and Talia have famously never really gotten along, even back before certain writers destroyed her character (looking at you Morrison). they disliked each other from the start which caused tension between Bruce and Dick.

I bring all this up because I have seen fans say that Dick hated Jason because Jason destroyed Dick's relationship with Bruce which! isn't true! Dick and Bruce have a deeply complicated relationship that has had many, many ups and downs. Jason is only one aspect of that complicated relationship.

Dick dropping out of college and Bruce meeting Talia both happened in the 70s. Jason wasn't even introduced until 1983, so no, he was not the cause of the rift between Bruce and Dick during this time, and as such Dick would have no reason to hate Jason over this. please stop blaming Jason for Bruce and Dick's rocky relationship!

now this isn't to say that Bruce and Dick never argued about Jason but that definitely is NOT what started the rift between Bruce and Dick.

there was that time in Tales of the Teen Titans #50 when Dick was feeling some type of way about Bruce adopting Jason but not adopting Dick:

and like I wouldn't even call this an argument! this seems like a healthy conversation. but there were times when Bruce and Dick were actually screaming at each other like in the aforementioned Batman (1940) #416

they also had a pretty bad argument after Jason died but I'll get to that one later. so Bruce and Dick did argue about Jason but that in no way means that Dick hated Jason.

now. what was Dick and Jason's relationship actually like? well there actually isn't a whole lot to go on. they had few, brief interactions while Jason was alive; and these interactions weren't always bad.

let's not forget this moment from The New Teen Titans (1984) #31 when Jason went on a mission with the Titans without Bruce's permission and Dick said if Bruce gave him grief to have him call Dick.

this is one of the few times they ever really even spoke to each other in post-crisis. they interacted a bit more in pre-crisis but even then it was only a few times and they mostly got along, both being circus performers. Dick even offered to adopt Jason in Detective Comics (1937) #526:

also, in pre-crisis continuity, Dick gave Jason permission to be Robin before Bruce did. Jason put on a Robin costume and Bruce got mad at him for stealing Dick's identity but Dick later said he didn't mind and even gave Jason his costume. then in post-crisis, Bruce let Jason use the Robin name and costume without consulting Dick but then Dick later gave his blessing as mentioned above in Batman #416. this post goes over that in greater detail.

have whatever head-canons and interpretations that you want but please just don't make it seem like Dick hating Jason for "stealing" Robin from him has much of a basis in canon. Dick definitely had conflicting feelings about not being Robin anymore (in pre-cisis he gave up being Robin of his own free will while in post-crisis Bruce fired him) but in both continuities Dick did very much eventually approve of Jason being Robin. if he hated Jason, would he have allowed Jason to use his former identity? I don't think so. sure there are complicated feelings there but I don't think it's hatred.

AND ANOTHER THING. if Dick really hated Jason then he wouldn't have been so upset when Jason died. just read The New Titans (1988) #55 and see how Dick reacts when he learns about Jason's death:

the sadness! the guilt! the anger! none of this says to me that Dick hated Jason. this is the reaction of someone who has just lost somebody that they care about. and then there is his confrontation with Bruce in the same issue:

(honestly kind of shitty of Bruce to bring up that Dick wasn't at Jason's funeral when Bruce was the one who didn't even tell Dick that Jason had died. seems a bit manipulative. "You weren't at the funeral. People asked about you." then bitch maybe you should have told him about the funeral. don't get mad at Dick for not going to a funeral for someone that he didn't even know was dead! like I know Bruce is grieving here but why is he being so irrational?? "oh I'm not going to tell you about Jason dying but I will be mad at you if you don't come to his funeral" get fucked.) (and yes I KNOW Dick was on another planet at the time so Bruce couldn't get into direct contact with him but even Dick said that there were no messages from Bruce at all anyway so how could he have known about the funeral??)

anyway, this post is long and I think I've made my point so I'll leave it at that.

I just hate that some fans believe that Dick and Jason actually flat out hated each other when Jason was Robin. and yeah they weren’t Super Best Friends or anything but they did generally get along the few times they even interacted. they had arguments but I definitely don't see any hatred between them.

I’ll never forgive the fanon that makes their early relationship out to be resentful. not every fan does this of course but I've seen it a few too many times.

(now maybe you can make the argument that Dick hated early Red Hood Jason. for example when he killed a bunch of people while impersonating Nightwing in that Brother's in Blood arc but I've never actually read that so I can't speak on it. or that time Jason beat the shit out of Tim on Titans Tower. or Battle for the Cowl... maybe Dick hated Jason then but this post is specifically about Jason when he was Robin.)

any thoughts??

#dick grayson #jason todd #bruce wayne #batman #robin #dc comics #the descriptions of the comic panel screenshots are in the ALT text #their relationship is fascinating to me

[danny-chase]

How many times has Dick been homeless/Alcoholic?

You're like the Wikipedia of the titans btw (compliment)

Thank you! It helps having friends who are just as obsessed with other characters on the team as you! So there's not really a short answer to this question, and it's going to depend on which timelines you're pulling from/consider canon and you're own interpretation of the scenes, image descriptions are in the alt text, i ordered these based on when the comics came out:

There's this time in NTT where no one's quite sure where he lives

The New Teen Titans #33

So this one is very open to interpretation, but for me it was weird that Kory didn't know where Dick is living, because in #29 Donna says he's working with the Titans, alone, with Bruce, and going to college. At this point to my knowledge, he doesn't have his own apartment (I'd need to double check with Batman/Detective Comics to be sure though). Why Kory didn't go to his college, I'm also not sure. But clearly the Titans still thought he was living at home but he's not. He does have a room in Titans tower, so I would say he's not technically homeless, but he kinda disappeared for a hot second. This scene takes place during the Adrian Chase arc and sometime after that and before The Judas Contract, he moves into his own apartment.

2. Dick's post-crisis departure from Bruce

Batman (1940) #416

Now what a lot of people get wrong about this era is that Bruce didn't kick Dick out - he fired Dick from Robin and as Dick describes it:

"For six years you trained me to be a crime fighter, then denied me that role. Of course, you assured me that it was for my own good. I lay there with a bandaged shoulder and my life in ruins. You smiled, kicked a great big hole in my life, then walked out of the room. I didn't see what option I had, other than to split. Alfred tried to talk me out of it. It was Alfred who forced money on me so I'd have something to live on. You couldn't even be bothered to say goodbye."

So while Bruce probably would have been okay with Dick moving back in after he dropped out of college, Dick didn't feel like he could come back home and he didn't have a permanent residence until he moved in with the Titans/rented his own apartment. This origin i think was retold by tom taylor but i'm not super paying attention to that run

3. Dick gets evicted, unclear living situation take 2

The New Titans #97

Basically at this point the tower is destroyed and they don't really show where Dick's living after getting evicted and his stuff burning up :/ so whether he's crashing on someone's couch or figured something else out, i don't know

4. Dick gets sent to juvenile detention for being homeless

Robin Annual (1993) #4

So technically he has a bed to sleep in, but post his parents dying, in this retelling of his origin (this one is by Chuck Dixon, who wrote a good chunk of his solo comic) he ends up sent to Gotham City's Youth Center, which is not really a home or an orphanage, it's more like a juvenile detention facility and some of the kids jump him like immediately after this panel. So, it's not exactly a safe place to be, but it's also not the street (although he can climb out and tries running away pretty quickly before being told to go back by Batman), he spent a month here before he moves to a permanent home with Bruce

5. Dick runs away

Robin: Year One #3

Again, he's not explicitly kicked out, but Bruce neglected him after he got injured in the Two Face incident to the point where he felt completely unwanted/unloved, was miserable and decided to leave. He joins a gang soon after this. This story is retold later in the Nightwing run, and has Dick as 12 when the two face part happens and 17 when he runs away for different reasons (it's kind of like - two different authors reference two different parts of the story, one of which is Marv Wolfman, and he changes a lot about it, but i'm not bothering to count the incident twice, and this was the first time the running away bit appeared in canon)

6. The Blockbuster arc

Nightwing (1996) #91

So this is the first time we literally see Dick sleeping on the streets. Basically the rundown is, his apartment got blown up, Haly's Circus was burnt down, and Blockbuster was killing people just for talking to him so yeah :(

7. Skaboom

Batman (1940) #649

So at this point, Dick was drifting and living with the mob/training Rose Wilson and didn't exactly have a stable home life, and then DC decided to drop a bomb on his city, so all of that blew up. He proceeded to go on a cruise with Bruce and Tim and um. yeah sure that fixes things i guess (the only point in this cruise that we see, to my knowledge, is Bruce ditching the two of them to go live in a cave, and Tim and Dick having some fun international adventures, though to be fair, i didn't read the batman comics at the time, and the recap was in Tim's robin solo). when he gets back, he finds an apartment

8. Ric

Nightwing (2016) #50

So during the Ric arc, Ric breaks into other people's homes to sleep, or sleeps in his cab. Points to Alfred for giving him money (again). I'm thinking this is where you're bringing in the problems with alcohol. This is the only arc that I know of where Dick/Ric drinks frequently (he has a bar tab, but full disclosure, I haven't actually read the whole arc, so i'm not sure the extent to which he drinks)

If i missed any feel free to add on

#i thought about adding spyral but he does have like - a base of operations (though as for a permanent home Bruce kind of. you know.) #dick grayson #momo don't look #asks #anon

[vechter]

nightwing (1996) #102 // south of the border, west of the sun, haruki murakami // action comics (1938) #613 // the teacher, marie howe // secret origins (1986) #13 // doggy style, maisie cowell // secret origins (1986) #13 // thumbs, lucy dacus // nightwing (1996) #102 // batman: dark victory (1999) #13 // the wee free men, terry pratchett // action comics (1938) #613 // superman/batman (2003) #13 // batman (1940) #636 // batman (1940) #441 // a dog jumping over a wall, feng li // things i never give myself permission to say, chelsea dingman // batman (1940) #408 // batman (1940) #438 // east, west, salman rushdie // batman (1940) #416 // infinite crisis (2005) #4 // ask polly: help, i'm the loneliest person in the world!

dick & bruce + leaving robin

#dc comics #dick grayson #bruce wayne #web weaving #webweaving #dcu #robin #nightwing #batman #batman and robin #thinking back to one year ago when i thought dick grayson was a passing hyperfixation god was i fucking wrong #they make me so sick #dick & bruce: you'll never recover from that kind of devotion