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chirpsythismorning · 9 hours

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The Vanishing of BLANK Wheeler

I wanted to make a list, from least likely to most likely, for which Wheeler I think is going to go missing.

But I also wanted to give a little disclaimer first, that even if these titles are real, they could still be fake, or could even possibly change given how much time we still have until s5 actually premieres.

For s2-3, the Duffers literally released official promo videos announcing episode titles for their upcoming season, with some of them changing when the season finally premiered.

Like in the case of s3 for example, they dropped a s3 episode promo video only a day after they completed filming. Meaning them titling 3x06 The Birthday, made absolutely no sense. They knew they didn't film anything birthday related for that episode. So they intentionally gave that one a fake name.

In the case of s4, that was the first time they promoted an upcoming season without giving fake titles, with the s4 promo announcing them following through with what we ended up with when s4 finally dropped.

I guess I sort of assumed s5 would follow in s4's footsteps, but from a leak standpoint, it might be smart to remember that fake titles are still a possiblity regardless. Especially in this case, where it's getting to the point in production where leaks are unavoidable. And so that might even explain why they play with this idea of fake episodes, which is because they can rest easy knowing leaks will mostly consist of half fake titles they planted there.

But for the sake of this post, lets humor the title for episode 2.

For starters, it's worth noting that the person who shared this leak originally said 'BLANK wheeler'. So as far as I know, they did not give any number of letters via underscores (_) to hint at who this Wheeler could possibly be. It's when ST news accounts caught wind of the leak and started rolling out posts, replacing BLANK with 5 underscores, that led a lot of fans to assume that the Wheeler had to have 5 letters in their name, which would have obviously ruled out Ted and Mike. But since all the Wheeler's are still on the table based on the original leak, they will all be included in this list.

5. Ted Wheeler

Believe it or not, there is something that I think actually warrants considering Ted as a possiblity.

There were some posts @stranger-chichka made a while back, comparing visual parallels between Stranger Things and Chernobyl, which could be hinting at this concept of Ted being in danger.

TBH though I think Ted being in danger or ending up dead is a possiblity regardless of him actually being the missing Wheeler.

Technically speaking, quite literally no one on the show is ruled out from being in danger at this point, so that's not saying much.

And considering the show is going to need to kill off some people next season and they are insistent on not killing any of their leads, supporting characters amongst the ranks have a high risk at being taken out. The emotional connection for Ted from the audience isn't as strong as other characters, but at least him being in close relation to a few main characters is something? I mean, he's funny I guess?

Quite frankly I don't think it's likely nor do I think it would actually make sense narratively for Ted to be the one to go missing out of all of them. I think it's a lot more likely they'd just kill him off, hence the Chernobyl parallels which imply he's gonna die. And so wasting time by having him go missing, only to kill him, just doesn't track. I think they'd just get that over with without dragging it out for very long, if anything.

Can you just imagine someone on the show shouting emotionally, It's Dad (Ted). He's gone.' Like, okay... And? I have a hard time imagining the characters being in serious turmoil over this, at least not enough for it to warrant like final season stakes amongst a bunch of other crazy shit happening. At best, the characters would be indifferently guilty for getting him roped into all this.

So yeah, I really don't see it happening.

4. Nancy Wheeler

I honestly feel like Nancy is even less likely to go missing than Ted, but the un-seriousness of an episode titled The Vanishing of Ted Wheeler is so astronomical, that I really had no choice but to put him last.

The reason I think Nancy is just very unlikely to go missing is because they technically already had her go missing as a cliffhanger between Vol 1 and 2 last season. It would just fall flat if they repeated something along those lines, with that same character, 3 episodes later. Vecna could have killed her and yet he didn't. His point was to send her a message, which was why he did what he did and then released her. The choice to target Nancy and taunt her about her family's safety in the first place, felt like their attempt at foreshadowing the danger that is to come for all of them, but one specifically. One of them that is not her. Which will make this moment back in s4 feel a lot more impactful upon rewatches.

So yeah, not feeling like Nancy is very likely.

3. Karen Wheeler

Karen is sort of a hard nut to crack all around. In the case that she is somehow connected to the Creels (Alice), anything is possible in terms of not only her being targeted, but again the entire family being at risk in some capacity. Without much to go off of outside of the obvious very haphazard timeline confusion, I feel like putting her somewhere in the middle. She was given a poster for s4. If she is Alice, then yeah it would make sense to target her. The stakes are also a lot stronger in comparison to Ted, because she was the parent in the family that actually came to Mike or Nancy and told them verbally that she wanted them to open up to her and is actually shown trying on several occasions. Whereas Ted is sort of just there when he's on screen. So the characters' distress would be a lot more dire and interesting to see unfold amongst everyone.

I also remember there being a leak in relation to Karen, Holly, Mike and Nancy all being at the hospital filming. And this was also like a day or so after ST dropped a video of Cara saying she was filming that day to hype up fans. So that leak did check out on the Karen front at least. Which puts her at the hospital at some point, potentially along with the rest of the Wheelers. Now that I'm thinking about it though, this could all fit with a Ted Wheeler death...

At this point, I'm sort of like indifferent to the possiblity, but it's still more likely than Ted and Nancy to me.

2. Holly Wheeler

It all goes back to s1, when Karen was visiting the Byers to console Joyce after Will went missing, when Holly sort of ventures off to Will's room, being guided by the lights, and sees the demogorgan in the wall.

I feel like people overlook this moment too, because it's kind of crazy that Holly has seen UD shit for herself. She was young enough that she could rule it out as just imagining things. And that could be partly the case even if she is skeptical.

There is something about Holly that makes her curious and sort of open to this world that most around her have no idea exists. And yet simultaneously some of the people closest to her do know about it and could easily clue her in when the time comes to do so, and because of that, I think she would probably be able to believe it all a lot faster than others.

Maybe this is a story where things need to happen and it just always ends up this way, but she has this tendency to be included in things that feel very important. Like in s4 with her playing with the lite-brite, and how that ended up being used to communicate with the others in the UD. There's this almost clairvoyance vibe about her. Her feeling the need to follow the Christmas lights to Will's room and her noticing and then fixating on the trees in s3.

Like I said, I don't know if it's something deeper, but it very well could be in the case she is connected to the Creels.

And while that is all somewhat compelling, at the same time it also feels very convoluted. Even if the Wheelers are Creels, I don't think that means the Wheelers would have powers, given that Henry got them when he was a child, meaning none of his family could have gotten them unless they too were taken in by the lab at some point, or were born with it.

Though I'm being full serious when I say the theories about Mike having time powers or maybe just manifestations from his emotions connected to the powers of others around him is one of my favorite theories of all time. I want it to happen. It would be cool. But that just opens the door to all of the Wheelers in my opinion, assuming his time powers came from being related to Henry. And if it was done that way, I feel like it would add way too much confusion to the story, where now all the Wheelers are gonna need to have powers, and then as a result would just takes away from the uniqueness that is already associated with Henry, El and potentially Will. One person potentially having powers without us knowing until the end aka Will, is enough honestly. Adding the Wheelers to the mix might be a bit much.

I'm also not totally convinced of the Wheeler's being Creels, and yet I also can't seem to want to rule it out entirely. But the prospects of Holly having powers or some sort of ability and just going through the same thing as Will when he was young and unaware of his powers, who is just now finding out the truth about his experiences... It just feels like serious whiplash honestly, when they haven't spent much of any time on Holly up to this point.

Like what are the stakes here exactly? What makes her disappearance and what that would look like compelling, on her front specifically? Because sure, I can see it being compelling watching the perspective of those around her reacting to this, what they would do to try to save her and all that, but what does that mean for her exactly? Are we going to see what she's doing? Are they going to hide it from us like they did with Will and then have to spend even more time uncovering it later on. And what does she even gain from being alone and taunted by Vecna presumably? What does the audience gain from witnessing that sort of event? There isn't a lot of story to explore there, outside of maybe making direct parallels to Will in s1? And then wouldn't that sort of take away from the importance of Will's role in it all just now being uncovered, if it all just repeats for Holly?

Which brings me to something that I see a lot of people using as strong evidence for why it has to be Holly, which is the fact that they recast her character.

What I think people are failing to consider is the fact that the twins who were cast to play Holly originally, were like 3-4 years old while filming s1. They weren't just kid actors, they were damn near baby actors. And while I know a big part of the reason why they gave Holly such few lines over the years was because the actors were aging way faster than the character they played, I think another factor could have been the fact that their acting experience is near nothing outside of Stranger Things, which is also pretty little on its own as well given that they have very few lines on the show.

It's not at all uncommon for child actors, let alone toddler actors to leave the industry once they start getting older. It could be for personal reasons, like wanting to explore other ventures, or it could be that they just don't perform as well with all the added expectations that come with acting as a character who is a kid with a lot of lines vs. a baby with 2 lines.

The girls got cast because at the time, they were able to perform as well as a 3 year old possibly could and would be expected to be in that role. But does that skill carry forth as they grew older? When now they have to deliver full sentences and carry conversations for scenes that are longer than 5 minutes? They've never really had to do that up to this point. Is it something that they feel comfortable with doing? Is their performance believable and is it something the writers feel confident about?

Honestly, I think they might have recast Holly, not because I think she is going to be targeted and focused on as this missing person they have to find, going through a near identical situation to 11 year old Will, but because they simply want her to be more apart of the story in general. And maybe because either the twins and/or the production didn't feel that they would be able to perform it in the way that they wanted it to be done.

And I mean, even if Holly isn't the one to go missing, one of the Wheelers is going to go missing based on this leak. If it was one of her parents, she would get a lot more scenes than she has in the past. If it was one of her siblings, again it would make sense for her to be more involved with the story. No matter what she is going to have a bigger role.

So no I don't think her being recast is as strong enough of proof as some might believe. If anything I think there is much stronger evidence that, like Karen, if they are related to the Creels, Holly is as fair game as any of them. The stakes could be high because she i such s a child. And her parents and Nancy and Mike worrying about her seems like something they would obviously do because she is so innocent and completely ill-equipped to endure something like that. But like I said, I just can't picture an focus like that on her, for her character, being very compelling given that Holly isn't really someone that needs like alone time with us witnessing it...

But there is one Wheeler left, and boy oh boy would he benefit from being alone.

1. Mike Wheeler

The most simple explanation for why it makes sense for it to be Mike, is that he genuinely benefits more than anyone when it comes to being alone with his thoughts, and with the audience watching. There's a lot of stuff dude has to work through in his own head, and since they haven't really let us have a moment alone with him that isn't under ten seconds since s3, an episode or two dedicated to making that a priority would make him coming back and things building up to the end, feel a lot more earned.

The audience needs to feel confident about how Mike feels about things. It can't be a guessing game for much longer when so many different factors are involved.

And while I think Mike may be the strongest possiblity in terms of the value it would add to the overall story is compelling enough to put him at number 1, the evidence supporting it happening is even stronger.

If we want to be crazy we can go back to the beginning. Plenty of fans have already speculated about how Mike is always late at the start of every season and how that might play into the beginning of season 5 again. I made a post about this recently and speculated it would happen one last time around the 15 minute mark. And maybe I was wrong... but maybe I was also right? Because if the second episode is called The Vanishing of Mike Wheeler, it's likely Mike's fate wouldn't be confirmed by the opening of 5x01, but in fact the closing scene of 5x01.

Throughout the show Mike plays a key role in leading the others, he's even referred to as 'the key' in s3 by Hopper. You know this show and their keys, they don't joke about that sort of thing. It's likely that Mike's story and what it is leading to is going to be central to how all of this ends.

Also in s3, there is one scene in particular that I think could be hinting at Mike being targeted, along with the s4 main poster with all of the characters. In the poster, we see El at the top, with Max and Mike as near equals on each side of her. Of course their roles are central and that's a fair layout on it's own arguably, but the equal-ness provided to Mike and Max feels very intentional. While she is slightly bigger than Mike in the frame, that could be a hint in regards to her being central now in s4, with Mike joining the mix alongside her in s5. Honestly, they could have made it so these two were beside other characters that also played a huge role in s4, and yet they chose those two to give a specific focus to. I think that is interesting (and probably intentional).

But if I'm being honest, there are so many moments in s4 specifically that hint at Mike being in danger, that I will not be able to include it all in detail in this post. So I'm going to link those below and then build off of some of it with some new details I've recovered that are worth re-contextualizing again with all of this in mind.

Hints regarding Mike and Will being targets of the town, but Mike specifically being focused on after the word 'missing' is said...

I'm gonna expand on this one because I think it's important to recognize the massive curtain in the background as this is all happening. And I vaguely reference this concept here as well which is worth checking out. But not is this whole concept of the curtain pretty blatant in this episode, this scene of the town all fleeing to hunt down hellfire club, is followed directly after, by this:

Notice how Mike is nearly always central in these moments? And how what follows feels eerily similar to what is about to go down at the end of s4 aka Suzie = Mike.

Now, this has already been talked about plenty so I won't go into detail, but... based on everything else happening surrounding this, this would apply to Mike in the sense that not only is he not in love with El, he's gay and in love with Will aka a boy. A BOY!

And then this mention of 'the terrible truth'. This word has been used like 3 times in the last few minutes. First intensely during Jason's speech about a terrible truth, with Ted and Karen being focused on with the Mike and Will extra in the background.

But what is even more crazy is that what follows sort of seals the deal for me that, this IS about Mike and it's foreshadowing what is about to come in s5.

5:02... 5x02!!!!

Also peep the watch and the letter from Dustin under it... I don't want to speculate but lettergate is looking extra relevant within all of this as well...

And to close off this point, lets show the shot that follows directly after this one.

Then later in the season, after Nancy is back from being taken by Vecna, here we have this long and emotional pause before she says Mike's name, last after her mom and Holly.

If they wrote and filmed this scene, knowing Mike would be the Wheeler missing early s5, it would make sense for them to list off the characters like this.

Mike peeking in the frame at this moment is not suspicious at all...

If it wasn't enough that Jason hyped up the whole town to see the Hellfire club as their enemy responsible for all of this, here we have a focus on Mike specifically being targeted by Jason.

The Duffer's statement about the show overall in the Piggyback script, and I gotta say it fits Mike a lot more than any of the other Wheelers.

Mike is a Paladin. And when they break an oath, they might spend an all-night vigil as a sign of penitence... aka everything is going to come to a head and Mike is going to be alone dealing with this shit for a bit, until he can come back ready to face it.

And I know it's controversial, but this post explains perfectly why Mike being central to this would make the show go full circle in a really compelling way.

Mike hasn't really unpacked...

Karen lookalike standing in front of the missing persons board. Could be any one of them but still, considering the costume of this extra looks closer to what Karen was wearing when she reunited and hugged Mike... I'm gonna put it more so with him.

Mike's guilt and shame regarding the past and what it has led them to could also play a big role and why him going missing would be worthwhile to explore. Part 1 / Part 2

Mike paralleling Yuri, who eventually reveals the truth (in his pocket) after stalling. If Mike parallels him all throughout the start of that moment, what does that mean for how it ends for Mike?

An antique funeral home fan behind Mike in the s4 character promo photos in the Creel attic, how Mike is seen sitting before Will sits beside him shortly after and it involving upside down imagery, Mike's first line in the show being used to later foreshadow his fate in early s5, and also bringing it back to Suzie's house which I already went into but it might be helpful to look at it again from this lens.

The Duffers would not pass up on the opportunity to parallel Mike with Finn's other character Richie in IT, which is literally based on a book that heavily inspired ST in the first place. And how all of that plays into the queer-coding for Mike going all the way back to s1.

The Duffers revealed after posting the funko-pop shotplanning pictures (2) that they were finished with planning for 5x01-5x02.... meaning this shot of Mike all by himself, is going to occur in one of those episodes...

We could still hypothesize Holly is the one to be taken, given that she doesn't have a funko and so they couldn't include her here regardless. But the fact that Nancy is with the other seems to imply to me that they are all likely working together to get Mike back, who is alone.

This one is a little more hard to pinpoint for sure, but it comes from a BTS Ross posted recently.

We are clearly in the Wheeler's house here. And if you zoom in, it looks like someone is standing (hiding?) behind a doorway/curtain. And the only person that seems to fit it imo is Mike... But why would he be hiding in his own house...?

It just makes me think about what is going on with Mike in early s5. What would be occurring that has him in this sort of situation? And it makes me wonder if him going missing has solely to do with him being taken and gone in one single moment, or if it could involve him avoiding his family and others potentially, with him being taken after that.

Lastly, I'm going to go into more choppy territory, stuff I know only a couple of people will actually consider. But it is pretty fucking fitting of what is about to go down so I can't not mention it.

In the Puzzle Tales' most recent Hellfire Campaign, this is the title...

Like the whole chapter is just a big joke on Mike about him being scared to be alone, which is painfully ironic if this is the direction the show is about to go for the next 2 upcoming episodes.

And then we have a song WSQK posted on Twitter back in January. I know people don't believe that this account is connected with anyone in the production, which is fair because I myself rarely believe leaks from anonymous accounts as it is. But I've been keeping up with it and it genuinely doesn't seem like a fan could come up with these songs.

The song I'm about to mention is the 7th song they posted, called Army Dreamers by Kate Bush. And you might fight it sounds a lot like the situation Mike might find himself in in early s5.

And though I'm sure I didn't cover everything, I feel like all the things I've mentioned and referenced from other posts are plenty to at least consider this as opposed to rejecting it all together.

At the end of the day I think there are some valid arguments for all of them to some extent. And quite frankly all of the Wheelers and most of the characters in the show will find themselves in danger in a way that is going to probably last longer than just one single moment the entire season. So even if it's just one of them, I don't think that rules out the others playing a bigger role in what is going down.

I just think narratively, there is one person that benefits from being on-screen and alone with their thoughts. And the other 4 being confronted with what that person discovers eventually will also make all of this a lot more worthwhile than any of the other options in my opinion.

#byler #stranger things #st5 theory #st5 speculation #mike wheeler #mike wheeler run #I think i'm going to just not tag a bunch like i usually do because jesus this was long and I think I got my point across #if you're still not convinced and think it's more likely to be one of the other wheelers that's fine #as long as it's not ted bc i can't take that episode title seriously i just can't #also if there are errors it’s bc I only edited this 50x instead of 100x like I usually do #I’ll come back later to check so sorry for what I imagine is a bunch of confusing parts 😭

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osbcrne · 6 hours

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Hannigram and Verger Family analysis

TW: MARGOT AND WILL'S STOMACH SCARS MENTIONED AND IMAGES (underneith the cut)

HOLY SHIT YALL IM BACK WITH ANOTHER REALIZATION

so i just realized that wills "c section esque" scar he got from hannibal in mizumono might actually look that way for a reason

it could be symbolic to a hysterectomy because hannibal took their child away, and had to give Will scar somehow. And i mean, will technichally is the mother, he killed abigail's father placing her in his custody- hannibal only helped with it. Just how the criminals in season 1 (angelmaker, georgia madchen, abel gideon, etc) and their crime scenes were DIRECTLY paralleled to the progression of wills encephalitis and the state of his mental well being, Margot getting a hysterectomy from mason basically directly parallels will getting abigail taken from him.

Also, Margot choosing to have sex with Will specifically, and the child coming into their lives and then almost immediately being taken away (BY HANNIBALS DOING) forshadows abigail coming back and then almost immediately after, her death. Will empathized with margot (WHO HE KNEW WAS GAY, or at least hannibal did, it was stated in the script but was cut from the final product) about the lack of a child, which is literally the only reason had sex with her (he thought about the stag man the whole time anyway...)

This one specific conversation in the episode Tome-Wan is very important. Will says to hannibal, "you're fostering codependency. isn't that what you did to abigail? got her to take a life so she would owe you hers?" That's exactly what hannibal is doing to margot- trying to get her to kill mason so she would owe herself to hannibal. it also connects abigail and margot in a way.

continuing the conversation, will says "i bond with abigail, you take her away. i bond with barely more than the idea of a child, you take it away... you don't want me to have anything in my life that's not you." Hannibal, knowing very well the consequences, told mason about margot's plans and had the child taken forcibly away from her.

Hannibal also directly took abigail away from will, by cutting her throat in front of him. both of these things ended with a scar, margot's from the hysterectomy, will's from hannibal's knife, but it looks oddly familiar to margot's. Also remember, right before wills and margot got together, the two of them compared scars. (MORE ANALYSIS UNDER THE CUT)

Also i know this is kind of a strange comparison considering mason and his intentions, but in the episode Naka-Choko, this exchange happens:

margot is unable to kill mason because despite all the horrible things he does to her, deep down she still loves him and can't bring herself to do it. who does this sound like to you? yep- Hannibal and Will. Now bviously hannibal and will's love is very different from the verger's, but it's still a parallel

i can't believe i didn't realize it before but there's a LOT LOT LOT of parallels between hannigram and the vergers. one of them being they all were with alana (minus mason) 😭

thank you to a post by this user on tiktok for helping me realize this (idk why it won't let me link)

anyway, happy c2e2!! take cool pics w/ mads and hugh! i'll be watching the live stream of the panel tomorrow!

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backgroundagent3 · 1 day

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for the character ask, daisy johnson!

Thank you so much for the ask! 💜 I love any excuse to talk about Daisy Johnson.

First impression: I'm trying to squeeze my brain here, but all I remember was trying not to like her at first because I knew se was a double agent for the Rising Tide. It goes without saying I failed miserably about three episodes in.

Impression now: She is my favourite character of all time.

Favorite moment: I really can't choose, but one that comes to mind was the final fight of season 5. I think it's a very underrated fight scene, because it's the end of the world, her dad is dying, she has been recently betrayed and tortured by her friend, and she still goes into battle BY HERSELF against Talbot, and if that wasn't bad enough, when she's about to die a horrible death she realises that the only way she can save the world is if she takes the serum and basically condemns the person she loves most to his death. It's so heartbreaking and poetic, but very cool to watch, and I just love so much it, idk.

Idea for a story: This is angsty but I would love to read something where the events of 5.14 are properly dealt with. May watches the security cameras and goes ballistic on Fitz, and Daisy gets time to grieve and heal. They get Coulson back and he's horrified, and Jemma is so conflicted but she's there for her best friend.

Unpopular opinion: Since apparently I can't stop thinking about season 5, here's some more. I think she actually did a good job of leading the team in season 5b. Especially if you consider that she's been recently tortured, her family doesn't seem to care, she has no experience, and hasn't gotten a good nights sleep in about 5 years. She might be tough, but hello? IT'S THE END OF THE WORLD?? You have to be at least a little bossy if you wanna make it through that. Also if you're gonna be a baby and call her a hard ass maybe you should have thought twice before joining SHIELD.

Favorite relationship: If it's romantic, then Sousa. I love them so so much, they're literally perfect and despite my obvious outrage at season 5, I will forever love the AoS writers for somehow pulling that off. As for platonic relationships, I'd say May. She's the perfect mother figure for her, and I love the parallels between them. I think Daisy has the best relationships in general, but this one is my favourite. Honourable mentions go to Coulson for being the most unhinged dad ever, and to Jemma for being the sweetest friend in the earlier seasons.

Favorite headcanon: before she goes off to space at the end of season 7, she rebuilds Afterlife with the help of Sousa and Kora. I've said this before, but I think they are actually the perfect team to do this. Kora has lived in Afterlife her whole life, she's seen Jiaying help people go through Terrigenesis, and she's been though it herself in a much healthier and safer environment than Daisy. Sousa is reasonable and calm, which are good qualities to have when you're helping someone who's terrified and potentially dangerous. He has experience leading people, which I think would make him a good mentor for the Inhumans. So Kora has the experience, Sousa has the qualities, and in my opinion, Daisy has a nice combination of the two. She has a different and much more horrifying experience of Terrigenesis that people who accidentally go though it can relate to, and she has spent years exploring and controlling her powers, so she knows what the deal is. And she's also a good leader, so where Sousa can help the Inhumans pre-Terrigenesis, she can train them after if that's what they want. Because that's another thing, SHIELD may be funding Afterlife, but they've learnt their lesson and they're not sticking their noses where they shouldn't. They accept new recruits and help train them, but if that's not what the Inhumans want, then SHIELD helps them get settled back into their normal lives. Anyways this got long but it's one of my favourite headcanons, so there you go.

Thank you so much for the ask! Sorry for rambling, but I have a lot to say about Daisy. 🌼💛

Character Asks.

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grey-lark · 1 year

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Not gonna lie, there is an non-insignificant part of me that thinks it would be hilarious to make Jackrabbit a Steve/Tommy/Carol fic at the last minute and just end with ‘Congrats, you unknowingly read over 200,000 of crack ship!’

#jackrabbit underneath #i mean I'm not going to but i still think about it #what can I say i really like those assholes #and i think it would be funny to suddenly commit to one of the least popular ships in this fandom lol #also season 4 kind of made me go 'you know I don't think Nancy really wants to do romantic relationships actually'#and the writers' attempts at making Stancy a thing again only made me double down on that being a bad idea for both of them #i'm still a fan of post S3 reconciliation Stoncy though #so like with many things we're just gonna ignore S4

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maya-matlin · 4 months

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very UO but if they couldn’t bring back Jake, they should have stuck Peyton and Julian together as endgame over Leyton! Julian and Peyton had already supposedly been in love, they both like cities (LA, NYC etc) and it makes sense they’d live there due to their careers, and both Peyton and Julian for a lot of their time on the series seemed ambivalent about starting a family. Also, Julian is smart and on the introverted side like Lucas but a little goofy like Jake - a combination of the traits Payron goes for! Meanwhile, we saw so clearly in season 5 that Brooke and Lucas both loved being back in one tree hill, they both seem to have jobs they can do anywhere, they both very much prioritize settling down and having a family, they were already unofficially co-parenting Angie, they still have that seemingly effortless and magical connection, they balance each other out perfectly…I could go on!

Honestly, I wouldn't have minded that one bit. First of all, Peyton deserved a million times better than Lucas by the time he finally got around to choosing her. She was lacking any sort of spine or self respect when she ran to that airport. As irritating as I found her character for large stretches of season 5, ultimately she wasn't in the greatest place and only imagined that her happiness could be attainable if she won Lucas back. Now to get back to what you were saying. I definitely think Peyton was better off and would have thrived most living away from Tree Hill in a bigger city where her dreams could really take off. I mean, the show really said that because Peyton wasn't exactly where she wanted to be at age 22 that this made her a failure and retroactively meant her decision not to rush down the aisle at age 19 had been a terrible, awful, shameful mistake. Seasons 6 and 7 Julian would have made a lot of sense as a partner for the ambitious Peyton who had faced so much trauma and pain in her hometown. STRONGLY agreed about your points re: Peyton and Julian being ambivalent and sometimes even negative about settling down in Tree Hill compared to Brooke and Lucas who genuinely loved it there and couldn't imagine raising their families elsewhere. I'm aware every aspect of this was unintentional considering the possibility of a Brucas endgame post season 3 was basically taboo, but in terms of compatibility Brooke/Lucas and Peyton/Julian made the most sense. If we couldn't have Jake back for Peyton, obviously. In the end, Peyton still left Tree Hill, something Lucas never wanted. And Julian settled for staying in Tree Hill for Brooke even though he'd rather be in LA. Relationships are all about compromise, but it's interesting how their situations sort of parallel. You should go on, because I love reading your thoughts! I genuinely think if not for Peyton's continued interest in Lucas and Lucas having an unfortunate history of making the same mistakes over and over again, Lucas would have eventually ended up with Brooke. Season 5 Brucas had such an ease around each other. Their goals lined up perfectly. The chemistry was still there. Their communication was really solid and both went out of their way to emotionally support the other. Maybe it's because the pressure was off considering neither was expressing their feelings, but you see them taking care of Angie and the way Lucas considered proposing to Brooke and instinctively know that they could have had it all. It's really depressing.

#Anonymous #I know it was all for the sake of the cliffhanger but I'll never be over Lucas desperately wanting to marry someone and fantasizing about #his potential marriage to Brooke #Peyton and Lindsey make sense #Lucas literally almost married Lindsey and Peyton spent the entirety of season 5 chasing Lucas down expressing remorse over rejecting #his marriage proposal #Brooke was never technically his love interest at any point #They hadn't dated since the first episode of season 4 and the last time Lucas tried to make something happen in the flashback set between #seasons 4 and 5 Brooke turned him down #But they were taking care of Angie together and he was this emotional support for Brooke because it's exactly where he wanted to be #And I mean the airport scene where he shows up after Brooke said she could say goodbye to Angie on her own #Lucas clearly at least at the back of his mind was thinking about Brooke as a romantic prospect even if it was unspoken #I'll die on this hill especially since most fans decry the idea that Lucas was ever legitimately in love with someone besides Peyton #The fantasy was kind of bullshit because out of all of Lucas's possible wives Brooke is the only one who in reality would want to #live in Tree Hill permanently but it's like he needed to convince himself Brooke was all wrong for him as did Mark Schwahn #Like sorry you accidentally wrote them as perfect for each other for two seasons and then later had to walk it back with poor writing #And felt Peyton should give up any sort of independence and free thinking to be right for Lucas #Ignore this because these tags are a mess

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no1ryomafan · 4 months

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Sometimes I wish I was into getter sooner because the curse of “being in a small fandom of a series that’s been around for decades” is there was always fans before you even if the difference is only by a couple years yet those people do eventually stop talking about it. Not leaving the fandom persay but they got different interests so they don’t feel inclined to stick to this one thing, they’d still talk about it if someone brought it up to them it’s just something that isn’t on their radar a lot until something new comes out. Which is why so many people came back when arc aired but either choose to stay or just left after it died down. I missed out on a lot even if it’s only because I’m younger and a lot of earlier fandom days would’ve been bound to have some doom posting about the mangas ending-there’s still people arguing arc anime didn’t technically “resolve it” bc some people are that salty how it turned out but I don’t wanna imagine how it was prior-and it sucks I’ll never get to know some of these people-

But I also not only realized I still have more than enough getter friends as is to make up for that, if I was exposed to this series in my early teens I think the results for how I would’ve turned out as a person would’ve been far more worse so it’s probably good it didn’t happen💀

#meg text #getter robo #for reference I only know wtf getter was because of my bf (who was just a friend at the time)#I specifically got dragged into around arc but didn’t watch arc first due to needing more context #and also my ass could not keep up with seasonal anime so even if my bf convinced me I’d be slow #so he started me with arma and I got honey trapped by fucking ryoma (my bf planned this too)#I probably saw getter stuff in passing without realizing it likely just people’s pfp with a character or the robot #but I have no idea how I would’ve discovered it otherwise unless something else got me down the mecha rabbit hole #which- seems unlikely bc I didn’t even know mecha was a GENRE until getter somehow #none of the mainstream animes that were mechas I knew were mechas and I only watched one ep two of them💀#I was likely gonna be stuck being into whatever if I didn’t get dragged like this and be clueless to mecha #but god if I discovered it if I was like- 13 or younger? I fear for that version of me #would be more traumatized would draw more crusty ryomas then I first did because I couldn’t anatomy back then #still can’t but at least I can make a body look like a body #probably would get more sad about it’s current state then I did with fucking mm #people would also probably think I’m older like how mm fans assumed I was bc I posted about the ds games G O D #yeah getting dragged in by 2021 was the best choice even if “fuck knows what we’re getting” is up in the air still

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unproduciblesmackdown · 1 year

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as "let's see if will roland's birthday prompts any billions production clues from posts castmates may make about it" continues to yield "no one's posting about it, while some castmates post about other people's birthdays," already having more thoughts abt [i'm sure he'll show up in at least one episode even if only to be written out] type things like:

a) would be insulting if winston is fired to serve a subplot about philip and taylor having some difficulty in finding their footing re: working together as coheads, like, we're good at anticassandraing things and have gone "lol what if philip & taylor disagreed abt quants in that philip preferred winston. which he feasibly could," so what if instead it's philip arguing that winston should be fired to streamline things or because everyone who's not taylor will want him gone b/c they dislike him, and in learning how to successfully work together, taylor's like well alright. like, don't pit these elements against each other the insult is instead just Anyone, higher ups or lower downs, wanting winston gone b/c they dislike him, so he's fired

b) winston getting bullied by anyone or everyone is seen as him distracting them &/or provoking it with his presence, so he's fired winston being friends w/tuk is seen as a bad influence of loserdom on the latter (or distraction, or annoying, or w/e) so he's fired some Problem that needs solving or otherwise some need to fire Some people that really doesn't have much to do with him gets him fired anyways. like 5x05 all over again, isn't it always. or even if he's particularly involved in some problem you know it'd be something other people could get away with just fine. see:

c) what's even "a problem" like that despite everyone being in a hostile workplace, winston is especially, and we're so graced with dollar bill back on the premises who has already harassed and threatened and assaulted him (not only limiting the lattermost to something like "did he hit you, and like, closed fist, and i mean pretty hard. well that's just what he's like, you're fine." or the way like sabotaging a toilet is just epic pranks and only a problem if something looks bad to theoretical investors and we should talk about what tmc people might be doing to deserve it) while rian has been holding down the fort bullying and using winston. perfectly in line with everything if this kind of thing prompting any hostility in turn is like, nobody blinks at the other stuff, wherein if anything everyone keeps trying to fix dollar bill's feelings for him and talk about how who he's being awful to needs to appease him asap, and rian simply Wanting to use winston as a chew toy is just taken in stride while separately people have already been motivated by theoretically looking out for her / supporting her in various ways as well. whereas if winston Acts like he regards her as a hostile party, which she is, rather than seeming to operate in good faith that they can have regular constructive basic respect interactions, which he does while those decent interactions seem to come through rarely and unreliably, then i'm sure he'd be seen as mean / starting shit / out of line / etc, especially when it seems him Disrespecting the Rules & Social Hierarchy that should disallow him from like, speaking unless it's to self-flagellate, means people see him as aggressive or whatever. basically the classic scenario like, kid's bullied at school, they're supposed to just ignore it or it's otherwise "not that bad" / stuff gotten away with, even if supposedly it's like well just tell an authority figure here, that won't/doesn't work, any resulting obvious tension/dislike between the kid and whoever is like "uh oh, a Both Sides problem" at best, same if there's a physical fight or something or else it's like well That was unacceptable and if it was initiated by Your reaction to all other kinds of terrible treatment for however long, you're the problem. not that i expect winston to throw a punch about it, but, figuratively / parallel to this scenario

d) winston is sick of his deluxe hostile environment, doesn't actually like whatever coheading changes, sick of rian and/or dollar bill specifically, and/or doesn't appreciate some other goings-on, like one that results in him even being threatened with firing, and gets to just quit as has regularly seemed like something he might want to do anyways since 4x11 and intermittently on

e) not really another Way to imagine they kick him out but was thinking how like, Is a reason we're shown that taylor and rian hugging in the middle of an office was seen by i guess winston alone gonna be further relevant at all and about him making anything of it, which, he really couldn't possibly be wrong about any inferences. but going :/ at the taylor and rian dynamic just as a spontaneous, contained event would be self-explanatory too. but had the thought of like, maybe it's all "well taylor's been here 5 seasons and is in a more prominent position than last season, throw a PR problem at them for the first time for real, just as a shakeup / something that throws them off" wherein like winston wouldn't even have to be there to be cited in something like yeah i was fired or quit or whatever else and my former boss is dating an employee i think. or seems to have a real personal preference for them if not personal somethingship. which is true lmfao like? even if winston ""wrongly"" assumes they're dating like "oh sorry these claims are ridiculous, i only proposed as much to this employee who i already was informally mentoring and do favor such that she was promoted offscreen after like half a season to be able to make trades and this only came up when her using that capacity to do some shit she could've been fired for had me like 'but i'll take the heat for it' b/c any feeling that i'd wanna fire you is worth working through as a personal problem, and that employee turned me down not only just b/c apparently dating through work is too much (but not hooking up through work) but because she's afraid of how much she could love me, and now we're further personal somethings or who even knows what's ever been going on and so who can say if we were supposed to have fully closed the door on dating or not, even." wherein like....someone then doing further research consulting with every named tmc employee, in this hypothetical (and ignoring any hypothetical new, named/dialogued hires) scenario all now Former employees except rian who clearly won't have been firedor quit at the start of season 7, b/c yknow god forbid lmao....like, oh i'm taylor's best friend so no comment except that when i'm mad at them i'll apparently say that i always thought they inhumanly don't have feelings and all, very helpful. then there's like, oh yeah i was taylor's employee and dated them until business misalignments lead to a less than ideal breakup, and then kind of an aftershock of that for fun i guess. and then yeah i was also taylor's employee and knew they were dating another employee and i disapproved if only b/c i told them it could look bad but then also one of the reasons leading up to my quitting was having difficulty getting in touch with them while the other employee lived with them at least part of the time and i didn't seem to be a fan of that bonus access re: discussing business getting in the way of the formal structure / chain of command or whatever at work as well which is part of what i was already there to file a complaint over, so....even just the "it does look bad / people do think you leverage status for access to sex through employees" like no but that's My boss though. but also just that yeah taylor has at least tried to date employees twice, and their personal preference does affect professional matters, though that's also just like, pick any place of work and any slice of it, may not be a meritocracy after all versus how much it matters that some people are popular and/or liked by the right people while others can be recognized as Good Employees on paper but be left where they are or antagonized by peers or higher ups b/c of "failing" at the popularity contest aspect. and this could just be some new Kind of problem for taylor, and/or their just having to question themself more. or else go "ugh leave it to winston" and shrug it off once whatever's smoothed over.

f) winston isn't fully written off but rather it's something zany like, the twist is dollar bill coming back (god forbid he didn't either) while mafee, who evidently sees taylor outside work despite it all, is like eh we'll get dinners sometimes too, and does not likewise return despite saying he's the one who'd consider it. winston, being fired, or having quit, or just being unhappy w/things enough to consider it, is like well you're kind of regular at me sometimes and can't yell at me abt loyalty to taylor if neither of us work for them and you have weird confusing ideas about how they should be loyal to you if anything, and i can do the work of 50 phds, and i know you don't know shit abt the math and quanting but if you just leave it up to me entirely, that's pretty much been my work experience thus far anyways. then he'd be filming on different sets, possibly more rarely, and also dan soder has been likewise elusive but is also on site on the two even vaguely or implicitly [s7 production] related pics will's turned up in.

g) idk billions feel free to prank us where once again between seasons we worry winston could be written off but then he isn't, but elusivity paired with suddenly now castmates w/no mention of him for [march 5th] and [we are doing any bday acknowledgments] overlaps that otherwise get posts, especially. weird even if he Was written out in ep one but okay then

#winston billions #maybe he'd feel petty after being disposed of; maybe someone's doing really specific investigative journalism lol....#although also the idea that lauren's known one ep return last season was like. will This be an unfriendly ex gf/employee using insider info #and if winston were to be fired or quit; no matter the specific reason behind that it's like. how would he have only the fondest memories #he's been here for taylor & i imagine it can be inferred he hopes his Skills being valued are a shot at also being valued as a person #but if it seems like he was only ever begrudgingly kept around & given that [useful tool] status while other employees got more personal &#preferential treatment; which like everyone save sara kinda but she at least got to have substantial & frequent enough exchanges w/taylor #while here's a quant peer he even likes & does keep trying to be amicable with but she also regards & treats him as usable & disposable #while taylor at least ignores & allows this while v much preferring & Would Be dating this employee like. probably could be pissed abt that #and just to go off the shits lol like oh Petty Ex Employee behavior But....add in tayston fwb history lmaooo Like. oof #with some end of s3 into s4 timeline especially like where maybe winston wants a personal somethingship w/them as well but instead the #whole fwbship (& any undiscussed / not directly acknowledged somethingship along with it) was dropped when taylor dated lauren #like yes add in nonzero petty ex something as well lol. or Wish i could be a petty ex but got burned by the implication that like #no taylor doesn't not date employees as a rule nor even seem to worry abt it much personally; On Paper especially re propositioning rian #but also combining [dated lauren] and [dated oscar] stats it's like yeah they Ought to consider winston a romantic candidate as well lol #he Does get [autistic character] different negative / diminishing treatment all round from all elements so like. grievances lol #and of course taylor could choose to be petty ex employer/something as well like great so we're fighting now #and if winston's sharing the other trivia he's not sharing His personal history w/them. and taylor could threaten to but isn't gonna share #that b/c it'd make them look worse too (i am aware of the gfy proximity at this point yes lmfao girl help) but Can throw it in his face #can go after knowing he had that personal somethingship with them; the closest gfy esque thing here would be if taylor was also a bit too #clueless like well that is just hypocritical of you to take issue w/it Or take advantage of it when it suits you....w/o realizing that #element of like yeah i'm jealous actually?? remember when you dumped me to date someone else when [why didn't you date Me]....#or be Aware like well you're jealous actually. and winston can be like Yeah? I Am? lmao. we both know why we're fighting....#impossible to tell if taylor didn't infer winston might like rian or else just ignored it but they could throw that at him too #i don't really imagine winston still Likes rian crushwise by the end of s6 for sure but. might also be annoyed they even get an affinity #like man don't worry their dynamic really isn't convincingly that good or enjoyable b/w them....missing out on what.#then the most gfy similar thing to do would be like don't take it out on me just b/c nobody would wanna date you #a move that could range from [merely laughably stock pettiness] to [surprisingly genuinely cutting] depending on specific execution ig #anyways whether he's still filming or not; if any cast members were to remember will exists & give us Any info w/acknowledgments we might #expect based on precedent. that it's Axe; Dollar Bill; and Rian who are most firmly established as [will be present] via ppl's posts. Great

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