#I still don’t understand why jc’s cultivation talent was that important

[sanduchengjiu]

one thing that always bothered me and confused me about mdzs is why Wei Wuxian and Jiang cheng were pitted against each other so strongly. Bc even if you take into account that people would assume wwx was a bastard of jfm, in the narrative its something that is common? Or at least in terms of the Jin, there were bastards flying all over the place but I don’t remember there ever being competition about who would be the sect leader, it was always Jzx until he died. So idk if I missed something or I’m misremembering but it honestly feels like most of the pressure came from the fragile relationship between the Jiang parents and less about what society thought. Also favoring Wei Wuxian is one thing but jfm never gave any implication that he was being favored as the next in line, as shitty as his favoritism was. It just makes me feel sad that both boys were under so much pressure for absolutely futile reasons at the end of the day. Like was jc’s cultivation that bad?? I don’t think so?? And even then if he was less talented than wwx it wouldn’t matter bc he’s still the heir. It would be insane if jfm just decided to break convention over talent bc of some sect motto. And I don’t remember there ever being a requirement to be an outstanding amazing cultivator to be sect leader. If that was the case then there would be no hereditary structure to succession, and jfm wouldn’t even be on the roster? Neither would jgs. There was never any importance on their ‘talents’ so wtf was the problem.

Also what was the timeline on Wei Wuxians conception bc he and Jiang cheng were born like a week apart at least at most one year and it seems like wwxs parents were not even at lotus pier since they left to wander together. I feel like that would clear a lot of things up tbh. bc I don’t think jfm capable of finding csr on the road and conceiving wwx and then coming home to yzy and conceiving jc, and csr wasn’t even a yunmeng jiang cultivator it was wcz?? So what was the overlap. Like did jfm get wcz pregnant or what?? Were they regular visitors to lotus pier? To me it read like jfm was a great friend and leader to wcz and admired csr but I read it a while ago so idk. It’s not helped by the fact that jfm doesn’t seem to favor yzy more than is necessary at least outright, and we all know she ain’t the most attentive either. So basically jc and wwx were brought into the world into a weird and fucked up long distance foursome situation and spent their entire youth suffering under the second hand feelings of their parents.

#rip chengxian they were doomed from the start #I still don’t understand why jc’s cultivation talent was that important #was there ever a mentioning of cultivation power being necessary #all I remember is people complimenting wwx for being cool and sometimes lwj #and that whole list of eligible bachelors thing #but like they never even gave jc an chance dawg 😭 #and nhs was not even a fighter but he was still sect leader #the pressure on jc to succeed just felt so fabricated #I think it was just there to create the rift between him and wwx #but it also sticks out like a sore thumb #since no one else was under similar pressure #also are we really gonna sit there and believe that in a patriarchal society it mattered that there was a bastard #that’s exactly why legitimate marriages were so important #yzy being a bitch about wwx would not even matter either #and why did she believe that wwx was a bastard in the first place? maybe there was a possibility but honestly feels super illogical on her #a dna test would’ve saved them #mdzs #jiang cheng #wei wuxian

[robininthelabyrinth]

I would really like to see your take on JC/JYL age flip also JC is the sickley one JYL is sect heir and how it changes them

Sometimes, Jiang Cheng wondered if his father would have loved him if he had been born healthy.

If maybe that would have been the thing that would have changed everything – the little difference that would have entitled him to the hugs that Wei Wuxian got, the warm smiles, the praise. The hand on the shoulder, the occasional “well done”…

He didn’t know.

He didn’t know if it was his weakness that his father so obviously despised him for, or if it was only his mother’s blood that ran true in him – his face like her face, his temperament the same as hers except without the power to back it up.

He didn’t know if he would’ve been a different person if he’d had a body that obeyed him properly – one that didn’t try to kill him when he tried to train the sword, that didn’t send him blue in the face and choking when he ran too far or too fast or when it was too cold or too wet. He didn’t even want to be talented, the way Wei Wuxian was; he would be content with having the opportunity to complete, rather than being left out of the race entirely. Surely through hard work and effort he could have kept neck-and-neck with Wei Wuxian in the race for his father’s affection, the race Wei Wuxian won so easily, instead of the way he was now.

He wondered, too, if perhaps his body had shaped who he was – if perhaps his prickliness, his bitterness, his anger, his tendency to scold instead of praise, his frowns and scowls instead of smiles were all from that base anger, the anger at his body for failing him when he needed it. The way he saw himself left behind by all his peers, watching them grow strong while he struggled and strained and broke himself trying his best only to become barely average.

Maybe if he’d been born normal, he wouldn’t have been like that. Maybe he would have smiled easily, the way Wei Wuxian did; maybe he would have been calm and patient, the way Jiang Yanli was. Maybe he would have understood the Jiang sect motto the way his father was always telling him he couldn’t.

Maybe his parents wouldn’t have fought so bitterly all the time if only his mother had produced a son his father could think was worthy of him.

He didn’t know.

He regretted it anyway.

But most of all, he regretted what his weakness meant to Jiang Yanli.

She’d never complained, of course. She assured him it wasn’t his fault – that he couldn’t control it, that it was merely the will of the Heavens. She told him she wasn’t angry at him.

He wouldn’t blame her if she was.

He was angry at himself.

At his weakness.

At what it had cost her.

When he was still a child, they’d all thought that his sickliness was merely an artifact of his childhood – that it would pass and fade, that he would outgrow his illness and become a man like any other, and as a result his parents and all his sect had treated him as the presumptive heir. He’d gotten tutors, training, extra lessons; he’d been asked to listen to meetings, to read over reports, to think over problems…

Jiang Yanli, in contrast, had been left alone to amuse herself.

It wasn’t a matter of power; she had a powerful golden core, a good basic talent that could be further strengthened with hard work. But the Jiang sect had one daughter and one son, and obviously that meant that the son would inherit and the daughter marry out – and so what did it matter what her cultivation was? There was no need to train her to be anything other than a good wife.

Jiang Yanli had liked that.

She’d been so gentle, Jiang Cheng remembered – generous, kind, happy. She liked cooking, sailing, playing with children, walking by the pier and conversing with the merchants and fishermen…

She couldn’t do that now.

She was the sect heir, now. Responsibility had fallen hard upon her shoulders, but she bore it well: the endless classes to take, the increased stress to increase her cultivation, the burden of the sect’s reputation, the lack of time to do as she pleased – all that and more, she accepted with the same smile as before.

She was still gentle, still generous, still kind.

And yet, as she grew older, stronger, more confident, she also grew – bitter.

Bitter like her mother.

Like Jiang Cheng.

And the reason was all him.

Him, for being weak. For being unworthy. For not being Wei Wuxian –

“You deserve better,” Jiang Yanli said, Jiang Cheng lying in bed with his head in her lap, chest slowly rising and falling – the aftermath of an attack.

“Than what?” he asked, a sad laugh gurgling in his throat. “Than to be born sick? Than to be a disappointment?”

“To be treated as less worthy than Wei Wuxian’s shadow,” she said fiercely.

Jiang Cheng bit his lips. “Don’t say that.”

“She’s right, though,” Wei Wuxian said. He was there as well, sitting on the floor, and Jiang Cheng didn’t know how to argue with him.

It wasn’t like he didn’t understand his father’s preference for Wei Wuxian. He even agreed with it. He adored Wei Wuxian, with his mischief and his brilliance, the way he would fight anyone and anything for Jiang Cheng’s sake; he always had the best ideas on how to waste time, how to play, how to joke around. He was arrogant and self-absorbed, bold and unrestrained, powerful and healthy and strong, everything Jiang Cheng wished he could be, and yet Wei Wuxian always allowed his useless can’t-breath, can’t-run, need-to-rest-again weak-bodied shidi to trail along behind him.

“Why don’t you call him A-Xian anymore?” he asked his sister, choosing to ignore Wei Wuxian.

“Too much intimacy between men and women is not good,” Jiang Yanli said, but she didn’t look at him, and Jiang Cheng might be weak but he wasn’t stupid.

“Does – does Father want you two to marry?” he asked hesitantly, looking between one and the other, neither of them looking at him. “But Mother already engaged you to Jin Zixuan.”

Presents had been exchanged, the engagement all but final – the Jin sect’s interest in the match, originally arranged as part of a promise between their mothers, who had been childhood friends, had gone up considerably ever since they realized that Jiang Yanli would be inheriting the Jiang sect. It was difficult but not impossible for two sect heirs to marry: they’d agreed that they’d need have two sons, one to inherit each sect, carry on each surname, and that the inheritance would devolve back to the original family lines should anything go wrong with that plan.

It was settled.

“Engagements can be broken,” Jiang Yanli said, and her eyes were a little red. “And – it might not be that. It’s just improper, now that I’m older…”

Jiang Cheng twisted to look at Wei Wuxian, who was nowhere near as good at eliding a direct question.

“Sect Leader Jin all but implied that we were planning on putting a green hat on his son’s head,” Wei Wuxian blurted out, characteristically blunt. “Just because I’m close to shijie, that we were planning for her to marry Jin Zixuan so that we’d get the Jin sect’s benefits, but that the children would be mine – that bastard.”

“A-Xian!” Jiang Yanli exclaimed.

“It’s true, though! He is! In spirit, if not in blood –”

“That’s not the problem –”

“Are you?” Jiang Cheng asked, and they both turned to look at him. “Going to marry?”

“No,” Wei Wuxian said immediately, eyes bugging out, even as Jiang Yanli furiously shook her head in similar denial. “Shijie’s – no!”

A marital sister was a perfectly reasonable match to make, even if they’d been raised together, but the disgusted expressions on both their faces at the very thought somehow pleased Jiang Cheng.

(He was a bitter, awful person sometimes. No, not sometimes – often. But they still loved him.)

“Okay,” he said, clearing his throat and looking away. “Well, it’s not important yet, is it? We’re going to go to the Cloud Recesses, where Jin Zixuan is, too. Maybe jiejie will like him and it’ll all be all right.”

“Yes,” Jiang Yanli said quickly. “That’s right. I mean, I haven’t met him, and I’ve been far too busy to think about any of that…this will be a good opportunity to see if we suit each other. If we do, good; if we don’t, we don’t, and I’ll insist on breaking the engagement to marry as my own wishes suit – and not to A-Xian. Never to A-Xian.”

Not even if their father thought he would be the perfect match.

“Madame Yu wouldn’t agree anyway,” Wei Wuxian said, nodding furiously.

“That’s true,” Jiang Cheng said, and relaxed a little. He already knew he wouldn’t have a bride – nor a husband, for that matter, he found that he wasn’t especially fussed about that in the rare times he let himself dream of what-could-be. Those dreams weren’t for him, though, not really; who would want a broken barely average cultivator like him, with no talents except maybe cooking the way Jiang Yanli had taught him and a temper as bad as it could be?

It was horrible and selfish of him, to want his most beloved people to stay with him instead of finding their happiness elsewhere – whether with each other, or with someone else – but he couldn’t help himself.

He didn’t have anything else. Not his parents’ respect and love, not cultivation or fighting power, not even his health – all he had was their love.

He shouldn’t hope for anything more than that.

(And yet, in the Cloud Recesses of all unexpected places – he found it.)

#mdzs #jiang cheng #jiang yanli #wei wuxian #my fic #my fics #letitdevour

[canary3d-obsessed]

Restless Rewatch: The Untamed, Episode 25 part two

(Masterpost) (Other Canary Stuff)

Warning! Spoilers for All 50 Episodes!

Jin Jerks Continued

Jin Furen is all judgy about Wei Wuxian, so it's hard to like her, since WWX is our protagonist and whatnot. But! Jin Furen is actually totally awesome. She adores Jiang Yanli and takes sides with her against her own son. She knows he likes Yanli and works her ass off to do all the courting for him, since he sucks at it, rather than picking a random wife for him and sticking him with her choice. She's always gentle with Yanli in her tone and body language. And Jin Zixuan had to get his good side from somebody.

Wei Wuxian politely tells Jin Furen that it's all over (again/still) between Jiang Yanli and Jin Zixuan, and cousin Jin Zixun rushes up to argue with him, saying he's being too proud and that he shouldn't talk to Jin Furen that way, since she is his senior. Wei Wuxian, still politely, explains the clan politics that underlie every one of these Zixuan-Yanli interactions. As a matter of clan pride, the Jiang Clan can't allow Yanli to be insulted.

Cousin Jin Zixun immediately goes all in on the clan rivalry, beefing with Wei Wuxian about how much prey he caught. Everybody forgets all about Yanli's situation while they talk about the hunt results instead.

The Jin cultivators--parroting what they heard from Jin Guangyao--say that Wei Wuxian has flute-walked 30 percent of the prey into nets by himself. Lan Wangji actually decides to react to something, saying "30 percent? and giving Wei Wuxian such a series of LOOKS, oh my god. 

This Wangxian moment is an important one, I think, because it shows where Lan Wangji's priorities are, and they're...wrong. He's continually telling Wei Wuxian "be good," in one way or another; trying to help him back to the correct way of being a cultivator.  Meanwhile the Lans are totally fine with the Jins being murderous shits who feel entitled to insult high-ranking ladies.

CJZX continues to snipe at Wei Wuxian and Lan Wangji continues to judge WWX for being unsportsmanlike.

(more after the cut!)

Wei Wuxian says that he's just showing his capability, and CJZX tries to tell him both that 1. he's practicing evil cultivation and 2. he's just playing the flute. WWX offers him Chenqing and says "show me your capability" which I think is cultivator speak for "fight me, bitch." 

Cousin Jin Zixun moves the goalposts, saying that Wei Wuxian broke the rules, and starts in with class-based dogwhistling, saying "it's understandable that you don't know the rules," and citing examples of Wei Wuxian’s previous bad manners at cultivation events. 

Things escalate and pretty soon Wei Wuxian is yelling at everybody, threatening to tell them why he doesn't carry his sword, (which would actually clear up SO much) and saying he's going to beat them all using necromancy whatever is just this side of necromancy. 

Cousin Jin Zixun tosses his birth status at him, and then it's ON. Scary music, shaking fist, Chenqing booting up...

Lan Wangji, who has been singularly unhelpful since CJZX started talking, suddenly forgets his judginess as he's swept into motion by his constant fear of whatever is going to happen next time Wei Wuxian loses his temper. 

He rushes to Wei Wuxian’s side, grabs his wrist, says his name, and wills him to chill the fuck out. Jiang Yanli joins him, grabbing Wei Wuxian's other arm, and Wei Wuxian manages to get control of himself.

Queen Yanli

Yanli has had it, and she has Wei Wuxian stand behind her while she goes to politely reduce Cousin Jin Zixun to a heap of smoldering cinders.

First she recaps CJZX's accusations against Wei Wuxian; says she doesn't know a lot about the hunt, and apologizes formally on her brother’s behalf. WWX says "Shijie!" but she shakes her head at him and he shuts up.  

CJZX laughs and tells her, in a tone designed to infuriate Wei Wuxian even further, that Wei Wuxian doesn’t rate her apologizing on his behalf, and says that their clans are like family; reinforcing WWX's outsider status. I don't think CJZX is taking orders from Jin Guangyao, because he's way too big of a snob for that, but he's definitely helping JGY to move his agenda forward.

Even Lan Wangji is having trouble staying cool during this exchange; he is focused on keeping Wei Wuxian in check but he’s also angry himself, judging from what his neck is doing here, anyway. *Stares at his neck for way too long*

Wei Wuxian is super upset about Jiang Yanli apologizing, and he’s unable to hold back tears, even with Lan Wangji using the power of extreme staring to help him. 

Jiang Yangli is nowhere near finished, though and she turns around and proceeds to tell everyone that they suck, that it's not Wei Wuxian's fault if he's more talented than everybody else, and that they are just making up rules because they are a bunch of losers. 

Clan Leader Yao has the nerve to say that they know the rules "in their hearts" which is just another class-based dogwhistle. 

Yanli defends Wei Wuxian's cultivation method to everybody, saying it's something he worked at and put effort into--that it's different, not wrong. She's literally the only person who defends his cultivation style, even though they all have benefited from it.

Then she gets right up in Cousin Jin Zixun's face and tells him that it's not ok for him to insult WWX by calling him the son of a servant, and she wants CJZX to apologize. (full gifset here) All of the Jins and Captain Blowhard Clan Leader Yao are SHOCKED at this idea. Jin Furen tries to talk Yanli down but Yanli politely nopes her away, so JFR tells CJZX to apologize.

He's saved from having to actually do it by the arrival of Jin Guangyao and Lan Xichen, who jump down off a box fly over to find out what's wrong.

Jin Furen yells at smiley, blinkey Jin Guangyao, telling him he should be able to figure out what's wrong, saying "aren't you good at judging the situation," i.e. aren't you a conniving little creep? She's bitchy but she's not wrong.

When the "30 percent" thing is explained again, Lan Xichen gives Wei Wuxian the same Lan Glare of Sportsmanship Disappointment that his brother did. 

Lan Xichen: It's fine for my boyfriend's obviously power-hungry family to insult my brother's war-hero best friend in a bid to reduce his social status, but him using magic powers in our magical creature hunt is super wrong.  

Jin Guangyao and Lan Xichen explain that they're going to open up more area for the hunt, but it's too late to make Cousin Jin Zixun happy. He takes his ball and goes home. 

The Breaking of the Fellowship

The remaining group stroll slowly through the woods, Jin Furen and Jiang Yanli together, while Wei Wuxian walks at a bit of a distance and Jin Zixuan follows right behind his mother. His mother offers to beat him to make Jiang Yanli feel better. See? Perfect Mother-in-Law material.

Jiang Yanli tries to leave again, and is stopped again. This time Jin Furen tries to convince her to come back to the stands to sit with her and Jin Zixuan, and not to go with Wei Wuxian. First she tries saying that it's not appropriate for her and Wei Wuxian to be alone together. Yanli shuts that right down, saying that Wei Wuxian is her didi. Then Jin Furen says that Wei Wuxian has "strong wicked energy" and that he may do something evil. Like fighting back when he is ambushed on his way to a party.

Jiang Yanli repeats that Wei Wuxian is her didi, and says that she'll never leave him. JFR keeps trying but Wei Wuxian steps up and takes Yanli by the wrist and goes to lead her away. Jin Zixuan finally, FINALLY admits that he likes Jiang Yanli. 

He is embarrassed, Jiang Yanli is delighted, and Lan Xichen is amused. 

Jin Zixuan runs away and Jiang Yanli agrees to go back to Jinlintai with Jin Furen. Wei Wuxian is super immature unhappy about it....

....but he accepts her decision, in a nearly wordless exchange that we’ll see echoes of much later, between him and Lan Wangji. (Exceptionally cruel gifset here)

Wei Wuxian formally bows to Jin Furen, asking her to take care of his sister. Because he recognizes this for the parting that it is.

Jiang Yanli isn't wrong to make this choice. She deserves to be happy, and married women in this environment can't live with their original family. But she told Wei Wuxian, over and over, that the three of them have to stick together, only to change course and leave him behind with no warning. It’s not even five minutes since she said "I will never leave him."  Wei Wuxian isn’t the only person making impossible promises in these parts.  

Jiang Cheng and some Jiang cultivators show up, and everyone, including Wei Wuxian, tells Jiang Cheng that he missed an important scene, but nobody will tell him what actually happened. 

Wei Wuxian says he's going into town, and he leaves Jiang Cheng behind just as abruptly as Jiang Yanli left him.

Jiang Cheng asks Lan Xichen what happened, and Lan Xichen says "there was an argument but it's mostly smoothed over now; also, Jin Zixuan says he likes your sister."  Ha ha ha ha! Of course he does not say that, he says "You should ask your sister at the banquet" and Jin Guangyao says it wouldn't be appropriate for them, as outsiders, to comment.

I would like to see Jiang Cheng respond to this by beating the crap out of them with Zidian for being a couple of coy bitches, but he just furrows his brow. 

JGY hangs back from the group for a second to tell JC that WWX is sooooo great, before they all head back to Jinlintai.

Insecurest Boi

As everyone is walking Jiang Cheng hears Captain Blowhard saying that Lotus Pier made a strong impression today, and that they'll be able to recruit a whole lot of disciples. The cultivators are of two opinions about whether having Wei Wuxian is a good thing for a clan. 

Then a Jin cultivator says he heard that the Yin tiger amulet is made of the missing piece of Yin iron. He says he overheard it from Jin Guangyao. He says even if it's not for certain, the timing fits. Jiang Cheng reacts to this as if he 100% believes it, because Jiang Cheng is a dumbass sometimes. 

He should just frickin’ ask Wei Wuxian about the amulet. Lan Wangji asked where he got it and Wei Wuxian told him, and Jiang Cheng, while they have their issues, is officially on WWX's side, so there’s no reason for WWX not to tell him.

The Jin cultivator goes on to say that the Jiang Clan ain't shit, that all their deeds belong to Wei Wuxian.  Jiang Cheng takes all of this on board totally unfiltered. Literally everything that any Jin cultivator other than MianMian says is propaganda coming from Jin Guangyao, but Jiang Cheng thinks they're friends and doesn't know how to recognize manipulation. 

Jiang Cheng is hearing the exact same criticism that Jiang Yanli heard, but he's not equipped to handle it, and instead of fighting back he gets angry at Wei Wuxian. Despite all his recent growth, he is still crushingly insecure, and this is hitting him right in his tenderest spot. Jiang Fengmian has a lot to answer for.

Instant Replacement Sister

Wei Wuxian is off working through his own feelings; he's wandering the street in Lanling with a bottle of wine in hand. Wen Qing, in her red Wen robe and her hooded cloak, is wandering the street in the opposite direction. They pass each other without seeing, in a moment that's excruciating to watch the first time. 

But then some Jin cultivators obligingly push her to the ground, and Wei Wuxian, with his beautiful heart of fucking gold, hears someone who needs help and turns around.

For a moment he smiles in recognition, before the smile clouds over. Wen Qing, for her part, looks horrified; perhaps it’s everything she’s going through, but perhaps she can see that he, in his own way, is struggling nearly as much as she is. Meeting with her will galvanize him and give him the life direction he desperately needs.

A Day Late and a Tael Short

Lan Wangji wants to solve Wei Wuxian's problem, but he lacks imagination, so his best idea is to hide him in Cloud Recesses. 

Lan Xichen points out that Wei Wuxian might not be on board with that. This conversation is short, but it has some layers, once you know about their parents' relationship. Lan Wangji frowns but doesn't have a second idea.

#the untamed #the untamed gifs #wangxian #jiang cheng #jiang yanli #clan leader yao #canary3d-original #my gifs #restless rewatch the untamed

[ouyangzizhensdad]

So one thing I am confused about. I see a lot of takes on how Wwx acted like a gay stereotype in the first few chapters. And this is pointed out as a mark of his homophobia (as in he's homophobic because he thinks that's how a gay person would act). But, from context of the book, it seems to me he's weaponizing what *society* will think a gay man would act like to get out of what he views as a dangerous situation? As in, to me he's deliberately playing up stereotypes... (1/2)

(2/2) to make people uncomfortable and leave him alone. This isn't to say he's not internalized some stuff. Working through those feelings is a major part of the book. But it feels like people seem to be missing the fact that he's using how people are uncomfortable with Mxy as a means to get out of what he sees as a tight situation. Rather like how we get a woman using 'lady problems' as an excuse to make men uncomfortable and leave her alone. Or am I completely of the mark?

Oh anon, dear anon, how did you know I’ve been meaning to write a post about this since I’ve first been introduced to these takes? Have you taken a trip to the dark recesses of my mind lately (or maybe spied on my drafts)? 

Before we get started, I do want to address the fact that the ExR translation, which is generally how international fans first access the novel, uses terms/ways of phrasing things about cut-sleeves that make it seem more connoted than what you can see in the original chinese, thereby colouring how we may perceive WWX’s opinions on cutsleeves (since he is the narrator). If you compare pumpkinpaix’s translation of chapter 2 to that of ExR’s, you may understand what I mean (I personally went and checked the original with my limited chinese skills and pumpkinpaix’s is the most faithful translation imo).

Compare and contrast: 

Pumpkinpaix’s translation: “Thank goodness, this body had not been born with a strange appearance, only strange tastes. Here was a grown man who not only wore a full face of rouge and powder, but wore it in such an ugly fashion!“

ExR scans’ translation: “Fortunately, the body wasn’t born this way—it was only one of the owner’s penchants. He was no-doubt a man, yet he was covered with makeup (not to mention, badly applied makeup). Ugh, how unbearable!“

And another: 

Pumpkinpaix’s translation: “Not only chased, but banished with great shame: for Mo Xuanyu was a cutsleeve who even dared to recklessly molest and harass his peers. With this public scandal, along with the mediocrity of his talent and the insignificance of his cultivation progress, there was no reason to let him stay in the family any longer.

To make matters worse, no one knew what kind of shock he’d suffered, but after he returned, he seemed to have gone completely mad. He had good days and bad—it was as if he had been scared witless. After reading to this point, Wei Wuxian furrowed his brow. Being just a cutsleeve was one thing, but a lunatic as well! No wonder his face was all covered in powder and rouge like an old hanged ghost, and no wonder no one found the bloody array surprising.”

ExR scans’ translation: “On top of that, he was driven back shamefully.Mo XuanYu was homosexual, and had enough nerve to harass the other disciples. The scandal was revealed to the public and, as he had few achievements in terms of cultivation, there were no reasons for him to stay in the clan.Like adding frost to snow, aside from the event itself, when Mo XuanYu returned, he often behaved in a crazy manner, almost as if his life was scared out of him.The story was almost too complex to be put into words. Wei WuXian’s eyebrows twitched.Not only a lunatic, a homosexual lunatic as well. That explained why there were enough rouge and powder on his face to make him look like a hanged ghost, and also why nobody was surprised at the large, bloody array on the ground.”

See how the latter translation makes it seem as if WWX were thinking that being a gay lunatic is worse than being a lunatic, and that him being a ‘gay lunatic’ explains his appearance; whereas, in the former, it appears to be more of a comment about how MXY was perceived by his family as a disgrace, and underlines that the fact he is a “lunatic” explains how ‘usual’ his appearance and the shack’s disarray were to his cousin and his lackeys.

But to address your actual point, I think saying that WWX weaponizes what society think of how a gay would act is still an oversimplification. WWX is in fact weaponizing the very specific nature of MXY’s reputation, which includes him being known to be:

a lunatic

a cutsleeve

a molester/harasser

The fact that people even suggest that this is how WWX views gay people is ludicrous to me because of the context in which it is presented in the novel. WWX is not trying to “pass” as MXY by attempting what he believes to be an authentic performance of being a gay man. WWX, from the get-go, acts in public in ways that are incompatible with what he knows of MXY. When he first gets out of the shack, he acts in ways he knows are contrary to how MXY would have acted. 

“Thinking to recover the face he’d [A-Tong] just lost, he jumped over and, like one would reprimand a dog, waved his hand and scolded, “Shoo, shoo! Go back! What did you come out for!”

Even towards a beggar or a fly, one wouldn’t be more unpleasant. These servants had very likely acted like this towards Mo Xuanyu in the past. After all, he never resisted, so they could be this unscrupulously reckless. Wei Wuxian, with a light kick, knocked A’Tong head over heels, laughing, “Now, who is it you think you’re insulting?”

Finished kicking, he followed the sound of the hubbub, walking towards the east.“ [Chapter 3 ]

Instead, WWX weaponizes MXY’s reputation (the trifecta of lunatic-cutsleeve-harasser) whenever he needs it to either 1) get the information he needs/test a theory, 2) manipulate people into certain actions 3) quickly get out of a sticky situation. Again, it is not meant to be an authentic representation of what he believes to be a gay man: it is a targeted attack with expected results. 

Let’s take for instance the East Hall Scene at Mo Mansion. WWX goes there, and slips into a lunatic persona which, from what we can infer by the Mo Family’s reaction, is not even a close performance of MXY’s “lunacy”. At this point, WWX is trying to test out if publicly humiliating the Mo Family will be enough to fulfill his part of the contract MXY forced upon him. It is the first time he brings up MXY’s being a cutsleeve, and he does so in the process of trying to cause disgrace by implying his cousin might not have had pure intentions towards him. The text makes it clear that he is only doing so to attack the Mo Family’s face, implying unspeakable designs upon MXY by his cousin. 

Unexpectedly, Wei Wuxian spoke again, “Speaking of, he not only shouldn’t have stolen my things, he really shouldn’t have gone to steal them in the middle of the night. Who doesn’t know, this son here likes men! He might not know shame, but I know not to tie my shoes in a melon patch!”

Madam Mo gasped in horror, shouting, “What are you saying in front of your village elders! How  can you have so little face; A’Yuan is your younger cousin!”

When it came to wild displays of atrocious behavior, Wei Wuxian was a master. In the past when he ran wild, he still had to mind appearances for he couldn’t let others accuse him of having no family upbringing, but now since he was a lunatic anyways, what face did he need! He could go straight to making a scene, acting on whatever pleased him. He straightened his neck and stated with righteous confidence, “He clearly knows he’s my younger cousin, and he still didn’t try to avoid arousing suspicion—exactly who has less face?! If you don’t want any, fine, but don’t spoil my innocence! I still want to find a good man!!!” [Chapter 3]

It is also important to remember MXY’s reputation as a molester/harrasser, which WWX leans into at certain points in the novel (for instance when he gets ‘caught’ trying to steal LWJ’s seal to exit the Cloud Recesses and pretends to have been spying on him bathing to try to get kicked out instead). I do not consider that WWX actually believes at face-value the accusations; like LWJ, he is wary of judging without having all the information, having himself suffered groundless accusations (and, surprise surprise, it turns out the accusations were fabricated by JGY! btw, for all the people out there who say MXTX is homophobic because she wrote a gay character who’s a molester...... i am begging you to get some reading comprehension, even store-bought is fine at this point). And if people think MXTX did not mean to emphasize the importance of that reputation, I ask them to please pay attention to what is said before WWZ implies JC is trying to flirt with him/flirts with LWJ later on in the novel (in front, as well, of many of the Juniors). Notice how we are getting the trifecta again?: 

Even after thinking it over multiple times, Jiang Cheng still couldn’t accept the fact [that Zidian had not worked]. He pointed at Wei Wuxian and scowled, “Who on Earth are you?”

Finally, a meddlesome bystander added a word to the conversation. He coughed, “Jiang-zongzhu, you might have not paid attention to these things and thus remained unaware. Mo Xuanyu was part the LanlingJin Sect’s… Ahem, he used to be a foreign disciple of the Jin Sect. But, because his spiritual powers were low and he didn’t work hard in his studies, and also had that… He harassed a peer and was thrown out of the LanlingJin Sect. I’ve also heard that he lost his marbles? In my opinion, he was probably bitter from being unable to cultivate using the correct path and ventured off onto the wrong one.”

Jiang Cheng asked, “That? What do you mean?” 

“That… As in that…” 

Someone couldn’t help but comment, “The cut-sleeve penchant!” 

Jiang Cheng’s eyebrows twitched. His eyes which stared at Wei Wuxian seemed more disgusted than before. [Chapter 9]

The text also makes it clear that WWX is drawing upon more than just “Eww gay!” when he’s weaponizing MXY’s reputation to try to get away from JC and LWJ. He’s also thinking about JC’ inferiority complex and LWJ’s (perceived) serious nature. 

“Then,” Jiang Cheng replied coldly, “why is Lan-er-gongzi going to such great lengths to protect an unimportant person such as him?”

Out of the blue, Wei Wuxian suppressed laughter could be heard.

“Jiang-zongzhu, umm, I’ll feel very troubled if you keep on bothering me like this.”

Jiang Cheng’s eyebrow twitched again. His instincts told him that this person would definitely not say anything pleasant next.

"Thank you for being so enthusiastic, but your thoughts are quite off. Even though I am attracted to men, I don’t like just any type of man, much less follow anyone who waves at me. I’m not interested in men like you.”

Wei Wuxian was purposely trying to disgust him. Jiang Cheng had always hated being defeated when compared with others, no matter how pointless the comparison was. If anyone said that he was not as good as someone else, he’d get angered and not think about anything else until he won against them. As expected, Jiang Cheng’s face darkened.

“Oh, really? Then, may I ask which type you’re interested in?

“Which type?” he replied, “Well, I am very much attracted to people like Hanguang-jun.” 

Lan Wangji could not tolerate this sort of frivolous and foolish joke at all. If he felt disgusted, he would definitely draw a line between them and keep his distance. Disgusting two people at once—this was killing two birds with one stone!” [Chapter 9]

I won’t go through all the examples and moments in the novel (even in forced-voluntary self-isolation it is too much to ask out of me), but I hope my point was illustrated well enough with just these! Thank you again for your ask, it forced me to finally write it all down!

#mdzs meta #mdzs #anti-mxtx discourse #wwx #mxy #lwj #Anonymous #long post

[paradife-loft]

Close reading all the Jin Guangyao scenes: episode 10

Episode 11 | Episode 22 | Episode 23

So, when I was talking to @fatalism-and-villainy​ the other day, I mentioned how while doing this third watch of The Untamed, I was feeling really quite tempted to make a semi-liveblogging project out of doing a close analysis of basically every episode where Meng Yao/Jin Guangyao has a substantial scene.... Their response was only to encourage me in this further obsessive descent, and well, here we are.

I’m starting with episode 10 where we are in this watch right now, rather than going back to episode 4, because while ep4 is utterly delightful, I don’t really feel like I have a lot to say about it that hasn’t already been hashed to death.

Meanwhile, episode 10... oh boy! So much going on here. This episode is most interesting to me because the main theme we see in a majority of Meng Yao’s scenes, is how wholeheartedly invested he is in advancing the cause and prominence of the Nie Sect that he serves. Particularly in light of how we see him later giving the same loyalty and effort to the Jin sect, it’s a really cool (and tragic, tbh) precursor that shows a lot about how much he’ll make a point of doing well by those who’ve elevated him in turn.

So he first shows up with Nie Huisang, when WWX/LWJ/JC are all discussing with Song Lan and Xiao Xingchen what they ought to do with Xue Yang. Noticing the latter two (who are established already as being well-known heroes throughout the cultivation world), he asks if they wouldn’t come along to Qinghe to figure out how best to punish Xue Yang, and also what the best course of action would be for dealing with the Wen sect. Xiao Xingchen and Song Lan rebuff this offer... because they understand, accurately, that what Meng Yao is suggesting/asking about is for them to establish a relationship tying them, however informally (for now), to the Qinghe Nie sect.

(^This, incidentally, is the face he makes when they say “yeahhh, but no thanks,” or specifically, “We give less value to blood heritage and more to like-mindedness. We don’t want to depend on any cultivation family.” This is the face of “oh, okay, tell me no in such direct terms, when I went to the trouble of phrasing my suggestion a bit more obliquely, thanks so much,” and also, “Wow, doesn’t that sound nice to be able to do :/”)

Then a few minutes later, we get this wonderful facial expression! ...which I don’t actually have a whole lot to say about, except that I take it for... curiosity, mostly, about someone who’s had such an outsize effect on the local area, what with murdering a handful of minor cultivation clans? Interest in what inter-clan strategic advantages could be gained in one way or another with Xue Yang as a bargaining chip, source of information, etc.? Possibly also interest in the sense of, this is also someone who came from nothing and has been able to get a lot of important people to pay attention to him (even if not for a good reason), depending on how much he’s heard about Xue Yang as a person? There’s a lot of possibilities this is opening up, and I think he’s basically curious to see what happens.

Again, we just have him being very good at working the angles to get an advantage to the Nie sect (compared to the Wen sect in this case). Jiang Cheng even comments on him being thorough and formidable! (And Huisang mentions that Nie Mingjue really admires him; and Wei Wuxian says it looks like Jin Guangshan doesn’t know how to recognise talent... anyway.)

Mmmm, yep, douchebags gonna douchebag.... Nothing terribly interesting here that hasn’t already been noted a zillion times, since the basic fundamentals of his character relate to how poorly others treat him for his birth. (It is noteworthy though, I think, how the condensed timeline & events for Meng Yao killing his superior and ruining his relationship with Nie Mingjue in the process compared to the extended version in the novel, alters the first bit of screen time we get here seeing what Nie Mingjue is actually like as a leader. In the novel, his men in the army have a bit of a nasty gossip problem, but the person who mistreats Meng Yao and takes credit for his ideas later is a part of the Jin clan; in the drama, various Nie sect disciples have a gossip problem that he berates them for, but even so he still is, at best, ignorant of how his men’s mistreatment of the person he promoted and thinks highly of has continued.)

Oh boy, here’s where it starts to get fun! This is Meng Yao’s face as Wen Chao has just threatened to do “housecleaning” of the Nie sect if they don’t hand over Xue Yang, and it’s looking as though Nie Mingjue won’t be able to contain the conflict in a single one-on-one duel with Wen Zhuliu. It’s curious - he has a smirky face looking over toward Huisang when NMJ initially throws Baxia out in front of Wen Chao, like he’s thinking clearly the offered duel would go their way. Was he expecting the duel to be between NMJ and Wen Chao, who he’d clearly clean the floor with, and Wen Zhuliu stepping up instead took him off-guard? - Because that’s when he looks down thinking very quickly for a couple moments, and then tells Huisang he’s going to go check on Xue Yang.

As @veliseraptor​ and @ameliarating​ and I hashed out as this scene continued: what makes the most sense here is that, seeing how things might be going downhill for the Nie sect very quickly if something isn’t done to get the Wen sect off their backs, Meng Yao makes the snap calculation that the best course of action to keep them from getting massacred would be to free Xue Yang to hand him over. He doesn’t really look happy as he heads away from the entrance here; he looks like someone making the unpleasant decision to let a known murderer avoid justice because it will be better for his immediate concern of preserving the sect and clan he serves. Mingjue is uncompromising, but Meng Yao will look for the most advantageous option he can see and go for it, even if it’s a bit shady and perhaps not what his sect leader would prefer. Nie Mingjue respects him and listens to him well when he explains, after all, so with so much at stake, taking this gamble is probably worth the risk.

Aaaand, then we get to the part where he quite deservedly stabs the army commander who’s been treating him like shit for the past while! It’s not terribly clear (especially at this point) the exact chain of events that occurred before NMJ showed up, but from the number of other bodies in the back of the scene, I do think it’s quite plausible that Xue Yang actually did kill most of the dead Nie disciples there, as that would be... a lot of people for someone with a weak cultivation base to off very quickly. And the commander himself - I take that as a highly relished stroke of opportunism, honestly. Meng Yao picks up a Wen sword to use to kill him because he is good at quick thinking to avoid self-incrimination, but I don’t think he’d been intending on multiple homicides when he initially went back to grab Xue Yang before Wen Chao ordered his men to attack everyone and all hell broke loose.

Oh, ow! NMJ is getting ready to attack him, as Meng Yao frantically tries to talk him down - and Meng Yao still instinctively jumps in front of a sword for his sect leader! Like, truly, honestly, I do believe he had great regard for and loyalty to Nie Mingjue at the very least up through the end of this episode. Whether or not this particular sword thrust could have been fatal to either of them, it still says quite a lot about how he values Chifeng-zun’s person more than his own, even as he’s quite possibly gearing up to kill Meng Yao for what he’s done. That is just... a real intense instinctive sense of obligation and value differential between the two of them that he has, here. Ouch, ouch.

When they resume in the throne room, I think there’s a lot that’s already been said and/or is obviously central, with the line about “fame for merit” and how much it matters to him being the big one. (Why should being recognised for your merit matter so much??? says the one who essentially always has been - lining up one of the central conflicts that continues between the two of them until the ends of their lives.) But I do think it’s pretty fun and telling how seamlessly (performance-wise) Meng Yao slips in the definite lie about the army commander freeing Xue Yang, amongst all the other (pretty certainly true) reasons to condemn him, and then claims it’s all true. I think it definitely speaks of... familiarity with being in a position where others won’t take your own actual reasons for doing something as a good enough justification, and so you develop an intuition of how to mix in motives that also target and appeal to the person you’re talking to as well, to avoid harsh punishment.

Also... hmmmm..... >>>

Hey look, I’m just saying there’s some interesting thematic comparisons going on in this show regarding moral worth and who a person considers to have enough ethical standing and goodness in them to judge them for their actions and have them accept it, okay?

Jin Guangyao and Wei Wuxian are amazing narrative foils and I am probably never going to get tired of saying it.

.

.

.

Bonus round!

(When you’ve just been stabbed but you’re still really worried about the attack on the Cloud Recesses that Wen Chao has just revealed, because of what it means could be happening to one incredibly wonderful person! Better go make sure he’s okay, right?? ~*~ XiYao feels intensify ~*~)

#holy fuck this was a lot more than I was intending on writing at least for a first post here :'D #BUT HE'S WORTH IT <3333 #jin guangyao #meng yao #the untamed #meta #op #long post for ts #no good things for the poor sad cultivators #CAN'T STOP WON'T STOP

[briapia95]

An analysis, many interpretations, and comments on the interactions between WWX and LWJ in Chapter 25: Malice —Part 3

I feel like this chapter [and the last couple of paragraphs from the previous chapter] is gold and all that happens between those two is so interesting and bittersweet to read. And it also gives me so many feelings because you can feel the yearning in-between the lines.

By this point, they’ve have reunited after LWJ went after the person running away from the man-eating castle and WWX has managed to run away from JC and transfers JL curse mark.

Just by the end of the previous chapter we are given this small piece: [consider that WWX is coming late to the meeting point]

[...] the white-robed figure stood at the end of the street, standing motionless with his head hung low.

Before Wei Wuxian made any sound, Lan Wangji looked up and saw him. After some hesitation, he walked over with a darkened expresion.

Wei Wuxian didn’t know why, but he involuntarily took a step backward.

He could almost see scarlet streaks of blood by the corners of Lan Wangji’s eyes. He had to admit... Lan Wangji’s face really did look quite scary.

So, it’s quite clear to me that LWJ was not angry but instead scared, and deeply scared as that. The novel has stated several times that WWX used to teased him so much and in such a high degree in the past because it was difficult to get a reaction out of LWJ. But now? Now it only took for WWX to take longer than it was expected to get such a reaction from LWJ.

And of course, the man is scared out of his life. The last time he left WWX behind in a hostile situation was also the last time he ever saw him alive, if it was any other character they would not have risked doing so again. But despite all of that, he chose to trust WWX’s judgment and go after NHS so as to not lose track of him while WWX took JL so safety, even when LWJ knew there was a high possibility that JC was around. [which turned out to be correct]

So now he sees WWX coming back to him and it’s such a relief that even in his stoicism WWX is able to gather that something was happening with LWJ [pity he misunderstood what emotions were going through LWJ at that moment]

Now to the actual chapter I was supposed to be talking about:

WWX, having being attacked with zidian and bearing the curse mark, staggers and almost fall if not for LWJ

[...] thightly gripped his wrist like what he did last time, back in Dafan Mountain.

Wangxian.mp3 playing in the distance.

So now we have two things that really made me laugh:

WWX being flustered because LWJ knelt in front of him to look at his wounds.

I love how even as WWX proclaims to have such a thick face, yet he still gets easily flustered by such small things.

And the famous “... I only left for a few [fucking] hours” phrase from LWJ.

I mean I’m pretty sure inside his head LWJ was screaming so many curses because yes. By this point, WWX has been with him for days and nothing has happened to the other man. Not even with the failed evocation at the Mingshi with NMJ arm. And now he has left WWX out of his sight for |this| short amount of time and look at what happened to him. LWJ is screaming and suffering internally. And WWX is downplaying the seriousness of his injuries. Please give the man a break WWX.

And just when WWX starts to walk towards the shop where NHS is located, we get this:

Lan Wangji stood behind him. He suddenly called out, “Wei Ying.”

Wei Wuxian’s figure paused. A second later, he pretended as if he didn’t hear the name, and answered, “What?”

Idk about you guys but if this is not a heavily charged moment idk what it would be. Because this is the first time LWJ directly calls WWX on his bluff. He’s literally offering him a hand. Tentatively he’s saying “I’m here, you don’t need to hide, you can rely on me”, but at the same time If WWX had chosen to ignore the call he could have easily done so because LWJ is not imposing. Yet WWX chose to tentatively reach back. And IDK, this part causes so many emotions in me, because, for all of what they both remember, their last interactions pre-WWX’s reviving were terrible hostile.

LWJ then states the obvious, 1) you transferred JL’s curse mark to yourself, and 2) you met JC.

And WWX delivers this harsh truth

[...] “As long as both of us are alive in this world, we’d meet for sure, sooner or later.”

Here WWX furthermore confirms his true identity but also I think he implies something quite sad. If he and JC are both alive they’ll keep meeting, they’ll keep hurting each other, and sooner or later one of them will end up dead. And LWJ is not stupid, he catches on quite fast, so he replies:

[...] “Do not go...”

And this little sentence is so many things in such a few little words at the same time. ‘Don’t go meet him, don’t leave me behind, let me protect you, you don’t need to die and leave again.’

And of course, WWX being who he is by this point of the novel, deflects. Because if he’s good at something it's to change the subject and joke around when he’s placed on a tight spot that involves opening-up to face harsh feelings.

[...] If I don’t go, how am I supposed to leave? Are you gonna carry me on you back or something?”

WWX said this because he knew it worked in the past, that LWJ has shot down similar requests in his first life. But, at LWJ’s lack of response, he knew his deflection didn’t really work as he planned to, maybe LWJ would leave the subject to rest but WWX would not be able to tease him into forgetting the conversation.

And LWJ totally does just that, he goes and tries to carry WWX, just like WWX did when they were teenagers, and now is WWX turn to be flustered again.

There’s a little part that stood out for me in this whole scene.

[...] Lan Wangji walked in front of him, as if he really was going to bend down, kneel, and carry Wei Wuxian on his back, despite his honorable status.

And is such a small throwaway line that almost goes unnoticed but it reflects one of the main obstacles WWX has to overcome. WWX does not think of him as an equal to LWJ. And how could he? First, he was the son of a servant, no matter how talented he was in contrast to the second Jade of gusu. Then he was reviled as the Yilling Patriarch, the scum of the cultivation world, in contrast to Hanguang-Jun, the light bringer. He was persecuted and killed and while LWJ was revered. It’s a sad life the one that WWX lived on his first life if you think about it. And WWX is totally aware of these differences in social status and the comparisons other people drew. He might be able to boast that in skill they're equals, but that's it. Outside that he was always regarded as the inferior, that's something I think plays a heavy hand in his belief that the only reason LWJ wanted to bring him back to gusu was to punish him.

As for LWJ’s part, we have this moment after WWX denies being carried

After a moment of silence, Lan Wangji responded, “But you have also carried me on your back before.”

Wei Wuxian, “Did such a thing ever happen? Why don’t I remember?”

Lan Wangji answered in an indifferent tone, “You never remember such things.”

First, we have a vulnerable moment when LWJ tries to reminisce a treasured memory and then goes to quietly exasperated with a dash of disappointment. Because as I stated before, I truly believe WWX did remember the time he offered to carry LWJ in his back, the phrasing is too deliberate to be a coincidence, and LWJ knows it too but also knows that indeed WWX tends to forget many things -read Wangxian.mp3 [the entire reason he figured who you were WWX omg]- so he also can't be sure if WWX is playing into the oblivious character he tries to pull or if he truly doesn't remember. So he doesn't press the matter further but also is not going to let WWX tease him into forgetting he's been hurt.

LWJ has evolved, he now actually can take WWX teasing and keep up with it too, that’s why he ends up carrying him bridal-stile. (To WWX further embarrassment). But being the tease we know WWX, he escalates his antics, starting to play with the front of LWJ clothes as he’s been carried -aka flirting, you are not fooling anyone here WWX- and LWJ just goes along with it. And, of course, he will! He waited 13 years for you WWX with no hope of ever seeing you again, he’s not gonna let this chance go to waste.

Then WWX decides to ask what’s been on his mind since Dafan Mountain, “how the [dolphin noises] did you know it was me? And even since the begging too!” And LWJ here chooses to answer him with a non-reply, the kind of when he's saying the truth but he knows the other person will not understand what's he's saying (his favorite form of communication).

[...] “You told me yourself”

I feel like mostly this is a way of defense LWJ uses when he's also avoiding telling people what he really wants to say, either because he does not care what the other interprets and/or is subtly insulting them -see his treatment of JC and JGY- but he will still be courteous when doing so or because he's afraid of the reaction the other person could have if he's being completely honest -WWX rejecting him if he links together that wangxian.mp3 = you've had feeling for me ever since then = I remembered I rejected you so I’ll reject you again. But also is a way of subtly letting WWX in, as if to say, ‘I know you rejected me but my feelings are the same’. And the moment WWX is unable to figure it out this happens:

It seemed as if something had sent ripples through Lan Wangji’s eyes. Yet, the slight waves faded immediately, and his eyes were a still pool of water again.

Oh LWJ you poor suffering fool, I don’t blame him since for all that he knows WWX rejected his feelings already. But also, this is why communication is important guys, non-replies are cool and everything but if LWJ had said something else, anything else that hinted at the reason he was able to recognize WWX, so much pining would have been spared. But alas.

This is getting longer than I expected but there are two more points I want to touch.

When they arrived in front of the door of the room where NHS is staying at and WWX ask LWJ to let him down so that he can open the door. It goes like this

Before he finished his words, Lan Wangji did something that was extremely impolite. It was possibly the first time in his whole life that he had ever done such a rude act.

Carrying Wei Wuxian, he kicked the door open.

And I really love this part.

I remember reading a while back a meta that said that in WWX’s first life LWJ had tried to be the bridge that connected WWX with the “righteous” path, that he was trying to bring him back to the “right and accepted” side, but in WWX’s second life LWJ pretty much says, ‘I’ll walk alongside you in any path you chose’.

And this paragraph is LWJ's character evolution in a nutshell. It was shown in little glimpses before like with the scene of WWX finding the secret stash of emperor’s smile at the Jingshi or the whip scars on LJW’s back. But nothing is so blatantly stated regarding this change in LWJ’s character previous this moment. The “I will stay with you and help you forge a path where we can both walk freely” is this small moment when LWJ prefers to keep WWX in his arms and just slam the door open than letting him on his feet to open the door because it's the proper thing to do that we know LWJ will always choose WWX and not try to find compromises as he did on WWX’s first life. Something that goes against everything he was taught about property probably. And he’s doing it without a single hesitation. If that’s not love and devotion I don’t know what it is.

And now, the last part I wanted to bring into attention; right after LWJ startles NHS when kicking the door open and walking with WWX on his arms:

Acting as if he didn’t see anything, Lan Wangji carried Wei Wuxian inside and put him in the bamboo mat.

LWJ just showing so much care for his beloved Yilling Patriarch. He will make sure that WWX is safe and comfy before continuing with this very serious investigation. All because on WWX’s last life, LWJ was not able to provide him this sort of affection and care he always wished for. But now he’ll make sure as hell that he’ll be able to bring comfort to his beloved, no matter the situation because he actually can do it and he sure is not going to be wasting this second chance.

And that’s it, I feel like this chapter is Wangxian in a nutshell. The chapter underlays the feelings, characterization, interactions, and arcs that will be explored through the rest of the book. And it’s why it gives me so many emotions while reading it.

Omg, this turned out so much longer than I thought. Thanks for coming to my Ted Talk I guess xD

[more rambles]

#mdzs #mo Dao zu shi #MDZS meta #lan wangji #wei wuxian #Lan Zhan #wei ying #well that was a lot #is it obvios that im going through the novel in a detailed way? #you should see the other annotations I've made #and I just wanted to review SL and XXC story omg #bria’s ramblings #Bria rambles about mdzs

[meny-sempai]

MO DAO ZU SHI IS A MASTERPIECE – part 02

Hey, guys! I hope you enjoyed the first post I made and I hope you had some laughs over my blind reactions for the first two episodes. Before we continue, I’ll just repeat this for the new readers:

I’m not a native English speaker so please bear with the mistakes I’m bound to make. I did read the novel, but only as far as the Exiled Rebels Scanlations translated it (thank you Rebels, you’re gods). I know a lot of spoilers, but I can’t say I know the whole story – If I start theorizing be aware that I’m just theorizing, I’m not actually telling the plot, but, just to be sure: SPOILERS ahead, I will use the facts I know for my analysis.

In this short series I’ll talk about the episodes, but I’ll also have long monologues about a certain topic.

POINT OF VIEW IN MO DAO ZU SHI – or, there are so many untold/told stories stuffed in one

As I mentioned, at the time of the airing of the third episode I started reading the novel and tried to catch up with the show only to realize that the novel and the animation took different approach in telling the story.

I have to say – there are a lot of things the show cut out of the novel, but there is also a lot the show did to expand and explain certain parts of the novel. Especially the parts I thought weren’t quite clear in the original text. Another obvious difference between the show and the novel is that, for the most part, in the novel we see things from Wei Wuxian’s perspective. In the show we are often offered many POVs, so in a way, we are experiencing the story as a “neutral” observer.

Seeing the story from one perspective is very interesting and it is something that we actually do in real life. We filter everything through ourselves – we are the center of all. This storytelling approach helps us take Wei Wuxian’s side and understand it more, but we also realize at the same time that the meaning of everything that ever happens depends on the point of view. I do believe one of the goals of the novel was to challenge the rule of the point of view – not everything takes one shape, what we know is never the whole “truth”, our deeds can never be universally correct or incorrect.

Let’s think drastically for a moment. I know we all hate the Wen dogs and think they deserve everything that happened to them. I don’t like them at all, don’t worry. I’m not justifying what they did, I’m just opening a discussion:

What if we look at the whole thing differently? What if the story was told from Wen Ruohan’s perspective? There might have been a reasonable reason why the Wen sect acted in the way they did. We know they were the leaders of the cultivation world because they were the largest and therefore the strongest of all, but how did they become so big and strong? Why did people choose to go to the Wens instead to some other clan? Why did the other clans let the Wens become their leaders? For how long were they on top?

We know Nie Mingjue wanted revenge for the death of his father who was killed by the Wen clan. We feel bad for him and want him to succeed because right from the start we see the Wen clan from “the good guys’” POV. What if there was a good reason why the Wens were in conflict with Nie Mingjue’s father (There might be some info in the novel about this. If there is then I either missed it or haven’t read it yet because it’s not yet translated)? We don’t know if they did, but it seems to me that none of the other sects cared enough about this incident to take action – not surprising considering how long they needed to assemble and start the Sunshot campaign. It doesn’t look like any of the clans like to play as a team and protect one another. Is it just because the Wen clan is too big to fight? How was it before Wen Ruohan? Are the Wens bad only during his rule? If so, why did Wen Rouhan turn this way?

Speaking of bad – we see a lot of bad Wens, but we see a lot of good ones too. I really like this because it just adds on an already vast world of grey in Mo Dao Zu Shi – there is no black and white (even our OTP – Wei Wuxian (black) and Lan WangJi (white) show their best qualities only when together (grey) – WOW that’s some cringe right there… moving on.)

Speaking of bad – Wen Chao… Oh boy, yeah, he’s a rotten one. But what about the other brother? The one we never got to see. The one whose head was chopped off by Nie Mingjue? The first child of Wen Rouhan, Wen Xu, died before we got to know him. What was he doing during the archery tournament? Why was Wen Chao representing the clan instead of the eldest son? Why don’t we see Wen Ruohan speak of his heir? There are so many ways to interpret this.

Maybe Wen Xu was, unlike his brother, a talented cultivator and was at odds with his father? If his father is “evil” what if he was trying to be “good”/was “good”? If not, perhaps, like Nie Huaisang, he didn’t want to be a classic cultivator. What if Wen Xu had anxiety like Wen Ning? Maybe the eldest son of Wen Rouhan was even worse at cultivation than Wen Chao. What if the heir was unable to perform his duties? What if he was slowly dying from some disease? What if something like this was the reason why Rouhan gave important tasks to Wen Chao? What if he was preparing him to be the heir instead of his brother? And what if Rouhan loved A Xu and didn’t want to have Wen Chao as an heir but had to? Wen Chao is a lousy choice for anything and Rouhan knows this – we’ve seen his reactions to his son’s boasting etc. The clan is already experiencing a low quality in cultivators and will definitely fall in Wen Chao’s hands, but what if Wen Chao is the only option? Showing power, pride and honor in order to scare off other sects, to stop them from rising against Wen sect after Rouhan steps down seems plausible and reasonable – a leader must protect his people and from his perspective Rouhan is doing just that. He’s doing it for the sake of peaceful future for his people.

Let’s be even more drastic – Wen Rouhan is responsible for Nie Mingjue’s father’s death, but he didn’t enslave the Nie sect (as far as we know) and he didn’t kill either of the heirs even though he knew they’ll seek vengeance. But when Nie Mingjue took his first steps towards revenge he didn’t kill Rouhan – he savagely killed his son, the future of the Wen clan, Wen Xu, who was probably a child just like he was when Rouhan wronged the Nie. Therefore – Wen Xu was innocent of the crime Nie Mingjue wanted revenge for and was still killed. 

And what if just like Jiang Fengmian, Rouhan also seemingly had a favorite in the family? What if Wen Chao was ignored and emotionally abused by his father his whole life? Those who bully are often bullied themselves, or they see the bullying as the only way to fix their complexes and release their pent up anger they have towards those who make them feel inferior. Wen Chao is untalented and not so bright – by his abilities he is a disgrace for the strongest clan. He is obviously afraid of his father and wants to please him. And he always fails – he failed at the archery tournament, he failed in the cave… He gave his all NOT to fail at Lotus Pier. He bullies Wen Ning because he was bullied in the same way for his flaws. He is violent and he gets even more violent when someone points out his flaws because he needs to vent and he can’t show his dissatisfaction to his main bully – his father.

Give us some more info about the Wen family dynamics and we could get a similar picture to the Jiangs. Fortunately, the Jiangs had certain character qualities and Wei Wuxian so they didn’t go full on dark side. How ironic. (I’ll talk about this particular irony in later posts.)

So… Did I change your opinion of Wen Chao? Eh, probably not. That wasn’t my intention, anyway. But tell me this, and be honest – How many of you didn’t like Jiang Cheng when he first appeared in ep 2? Ah! But JC is not evil, he didn’t kill people like Wen Chao did! Wen Chao destroyed Yunmeng Jiang sect and tortured Wei Wuxian and Jiang Cheng (he was whipped in the novel with the discipline whip). A sad past doesn’t justify your wrong-doings! And you’re right! But, let me ask you this – Jiang Cheng killed a lot of Wens, he never stopped hating them, he helped in destroying their clan. He hunted down everyone who tried the demonic cultivation and as far as we know he tortured those people to death. Isn’t this bad? Wei Wuxian literally and metaphorically went mad after the Burial Mounds and massacred the Wens. In the most horrible ways. Was his revenge justified? Two wrongs doesn’t make a right. If we were just dropped in the scene where Wei Wuxian kills Wen Chao not knowing anything about these people, we would probably think that this Wei Wuxian is a sadistic bastard. Who in their right mind makes someone eat their own flesh? It’s soooo over the top.

But most of you enjoyed seeing that scene (me, not so much, but I did enjoy what he did to that bitch Wang Lingjiao).

We kinda forgive/overlook what Wei Wuxian and Jiang Cheng did and still love them.

Jin Guangyao did a lot of shady shit too, but I don’t see him being passionately hated.

So, yes. I’m not saying that the Wens did nothing wrong. And I’m not saying that our heroes did nothing wrong, either. NO. I’m just saying that telling a story from a certain POV is powerful and Mo Dao Zu Shi does it in a way that challenges the “obvious goodness” even in the main cast. It does so especially in the animation where many scenes are not seen from Wei Wuxian’s eyes. This helps us understand why some people reacted in certain ways to what Wei Wuxian did/caused.

Mo Dao Zu Shi has such fine writing. The character animation and all the hints the creative team leaves to its viewers only add to the experience. One character says one thing, the other says the same thing but in a different way/tone, the third says nothing but there is something in the frame hinting that he has his own feelings towards what is being said and BAM – on the surface their opinions match, on the inside their POVs are in conflict. Mo Dao Zu Shi makes this exchange look easy to create, but it’s not.

As I said in the first post – everything matters in this show. Not one frame is wasted. And not a single character is purely good or evil.

…

… Ok.

Ok, ok.

Lan XiChen is probably the only purely good character in this freaking story. I am aware of some spoilers, but I still can’t say he has any “evil” in him. Gotta wait and see how the finale plays out.

Damn.

… He’s perfect. I mean… Just look at this guy.

No one has such a smi-

Goddamn it.

Ah… no, wait. He does have some “evil/anger” in him as a Ghost general… Hmm, ok, Wen Ning is debatable, but he is a cinnamon roll with the purest smi-

ALRIGHT. FINE. I was wrong!

But I’m not counting Lan Sizhui and the kids, ok? I’m not!

Ok! SO!

There are at least three purely good characters in this damn show.

AND HOW DO THEY END UP?

HMM???

Is this a comment on reality I’m seeing? What are you trying to say Mo Xiang Tong Xiu? Ha?

Don’t be purely good? Be good, but with a touch of Wei Wuxian just to spice it up? Ok, lesson learned.

Moving on!

EPISODE 03 - or, the true BAE appears

Greetings! Welcome to my harem! Take your clothes off and feel at home! 

I gotta admit, I did freak out when I saw JC for the first time, but Jin Zixuan… dayum, girl. This one is totally my type. Even now, I believe JC was made just for me, but that’s not why he ended up being my favorite character in this show. In the end I see Jiang Cheng as my precious son or a baby brother. But Zixuan… Naha, man, you’re no son of mine! Take it off, I said, take off those clothes and come here! JC, lend me your Zidian. I wanna make this one cry~

If only he wasn’t already spoken for. I don’t wanna piss off that lady. The sweet ones are always the worst.  

Jokes aside, I’ll talk about this guy some other time. I have a lot to say about his character.

I just think it’s interesting how both Jiang Cheng and Nie Mingjue have same threats in their repertoire. JC is only talk and no bite, but I can’t be 100% sure if Nie Mingjue is too. I believe he did love his little brother and was probably aggressive in order to protect him. Nie Mingjue had to deal with a lot at a very young age and he does have a bit of a temper. Not to mention the other spoilery thing about the Nie clan’s cultivation method. I can’t wait to find out more about the brothers’ relationship.

There are quite a few similarities between Jiang Cheng and Nie Mingjue. Funnily enough, Jiang Cheng and Nie Huaisang also have a lot in common.

As far as the first encounters go this one is quite memorable… and ends up being a lot like this jar of Emperor’s smile.

Also, this is a really clever way to cut from one scene to another without making it look like the scene was forcefully shoved in. It doesn’t break the flow. It expresses the emotion this encounter has left not only on Lan WangJi and Wei Wuxian, but also on Nie Huaisang who is listening to the story of it. Immediately, we know how he’ll react upon hearing it and we have an idea of how severely Wei Wuxian broke the rules and how great of an impact he made.

Even after watching it three times I still notice some new things. Jiang Cheng is so worried here for Wei Wuxian that it’s cute. The moment he realizes Wei Wuxian answered all of the questions correctly he sighs and relaxes. Damn… I knew he was overprotective from the start, but this is giving me cavities… Is having cavities good or bad, I wonder? The scene before he was all like: Lan WangJi is targeting you, you’re on your own, good luck (you dumb fuck). The moment no one’s looking...

And Wei Wuxian… he’s such a typical too smart for your own good. Gotta admire the dude.

This is just so funny. Wei Wuxian moved out of the way like a pro, JC is face palming, Lan WangJi and Jin Zixuan are surprised and shocked about what Wei Wuxian is saying. And the scene where Nie Huaisang is like: Don’t pick me! - That’s the most relatable shit I’ve ever seen. XD This is all an amusing way to show every student’s personality.

Not all of the Wens are assholes (and I’m not talking about the obvious ones like Wen Ning and his sister). The young one is not happy in letting the Waterborne Abyss go to the Gusu Lan territory, but the old guy doesn’t care and he is in charge. Also, the young master ordered it dead. Was it Wen Chao? Really? That guy? I’m not so certain. Something tells me Wen Xu is the young master they are talking about.

I talked in the last post how everything they show has a meaning. In most shows when people talk they add scenes that look like this one (butterflies flying, clouds moving etc), but they usually have no other purpose than to make the conversation more interesting to watch. Here, these scenes are important hints/foreshadowing. I’m not gonna talk here about the significance of such scenes. If you’re interested, visit DongHua Reviews on YouTube. He already said everything better than I ever could. He also does deep analysis so if you wanna find out more about Mo Dao Zu Shi or see if you missed something go visit his profile and watch the video reviews.

…

…?

Oh! Oh, no, I just love the backgrounds in this show. Moving on.

This is just so cute… and flirty no matter how you look at it. I’m in awe at how they managed to depict their personalities just by showing their hands.

That’s some great hand animation right there. Also, the music is so good here. At moments, it actually reminds me of Beauty and the Beast (when they play in snow).

So beautiful. And once again they used an interesting way to cut from Lan WangJi to Wei Wuxian by letting the paper fall in between them concealing one and revealing the other.

For some reason it was so refreshing for me when I realized Lan WangJi was the first to feel romantic feelings towards Wei Wuxian; to be aware of them and actively try to erase them until he gives up and let them bloom. The other boy was just being a brat, bugging someone who he found so different from himself and therefore interesting. He also wanted to make him his friend and to maybe “corrupt” him. Many later scenes suggest that Wei Wuxian also started having romantic feeling towards the younger Jade, but was completely unaware of them. He’s so freaking dense, I swear to god. It’s so funny and somehow very realistic.

Both of them (the others too) are acting like teens and dorks and that’s how it should be. Sure, they are talented cultivators and are smarter than most their age, but the show is aware of the fact that they are all around 15 years old. I was 15 ten years ago and I was a very different person back then. I remember my thought process and all the illogical shit I did so when I see these characters act like brats, when I see them make wrong decisions and conclusions I totally believe in what I see and I understand it all. Most shows don’t let their MCs act their age, they don’t let them make stupid mistakes, big AND small ones like laughing when you shouldn’t etc. They don’t let them act “dumb”, unreasonable and rash. When I watch Mo Dao Zu Shi and see Lan WangJi as an adult and Lan WangJi as a teen I believe in the change of his personality. I see why his reactions to same things are different. When I read the novel and see Wei Wuxian cursing himself for something he did when he was young I believe that he really is upset about it. I get why he now agrees with people who at that time told him he was annoying. Don’t get me wrong, you can never change from the core, but you do GROW UP, your point of view changes, the things that affected you don’t affect you anymore/affect you differently and you deal with them differently. Growing up is apparent in MDZS.

I find it so funny when Jin Ling attacks the statue goddess in ep2 and Wei Wuxian is like: What is that brat doing? Trying to die? My dear, Wei Ying, you would have done the exact same thing.

EPISODE 04 – or, the brotherhood is killing me softly

Jiang Cheng grumbling in his head: “So you ARE aware of the fact.”

But you see… knowing what happens in the future, this same sentence brings so much pain to my heart.

GHAAAAA OH MY GOD, SOMEBODY SAVE ME from blood loss! 0.0

Oh JC… Jiang Cheng literally pushed Wei Wuxian away into Lan Zhan’s boat (*cough* hands *cough*).

Also, Lan Zhan actually started a conversation with Wei Wuxian by his own accord (baby steps), but my favorite brat Wei Wuxian ruined the moment with Whatever line. He was sincere, but Lan Zhan is just… being a stuck-up. XD

SCREENSHOT! I’m a proud mom. Not to you Jin Zixuan, you know how I feel about you, babe.

Oh boy… I’ll leave my essay on Wei Wuxian and Jiang Cheng for some other time.

In the meantime – that surfing on swords scene was epic. Great animation, superb music. I’m amazed at how they managed all the water animation in this episode. There are so many fun battle scenes in this show and none of them are the same (except for the deliberate similarities important to the plot). I applause to that.

I just appreciate the directing of this scene. In the deep, the light reaches out to pull him out of the dark. From the “ribbon shape” it’s clear that it’s Lan Zhan who is coming to his rescue. Add the meaning of the Gusu Lan ribbon to it and the scene becomes deeply romantic in the purest way possible. Remember the scene from the novel when SPOILER Lan Zhan gets drunk and ties him up and the scene becomes romantic in the not so pure way. XD In any way – they are tied together by the ribbon of fate.

They are so good at handling the light.

I’m having episode 15 PTSD attack. They really did thought of everything, ha?

I’m sorry, I see those two together - I screenshot. It’s a reflex. 

I also adore how they both react in their own trademark way to those other two idiots’ flirting. XD Also, I just noticed it, but the sun is between them. That of course is just how the shoot should be composed to look good, but for me and my crazy ass it just means more material for my fanfiction (because, you see, the sun is the Wen clan and they stand between them – usually the thing in between keeps the couple separate which in a way it does here too, but in this particular case the whole tragedy started with the Wens and the tragedy is what brought the two together – in my head at least).

Well, that’s all for today. Once again, this is too long, but what can I do? Hope you like my rambling. See you next time!

#mo dao zu shi #grandmaster of demonic cultivation #wei wuxian #lan wangji #jiang cheng #lan xichen #jin zixuan #wen ning #nie huaisang #donghua #analysis