It has come to my attention that SOME OF YOU who read my last Byler post remain UNCONVINCED. So I'm gonna tack onto it this:
I'm older than fucking God and air, and I've been out and proud since 2007. Yes, I know what homophobia is, and yes, I know what queerbaiting is. I know about Supernatural and Teen Wolf and Sherlock and blahdyblahdyblah. No new ground is being covered here. I thought I made that clear in the original post, but, clearly, I did not.
I am aware of queerbaiting and homophobia, and I'm still wholeheartedly certain in Byler being canon anyway.
Okay, so there are three types of relationship I want to discuss when it comes to queerbaiting. They're all, like, "queer relationships that could have happened, but didn't".
First off, queer-coding. This isn't really a thing so much anymore, but it still crops up every once in a while. I'd argue it probably happens most with male-male relationships in family shows these days. First example that comes to mind is Mr. Smiley and Mr. Frowny from Steven Universe. You can't make a relationship canon because some shitty overhead bastard overhead said no, so you get as close as you can without compromising the show. Can't make someone gay? Well, now their comedy routine is a blatant allegory for a romantic relationship. Boom-shaka-laka. This is something I don't see being a problem with regards to Stranger Things, but I want it to be there as contrast, a demonstration of one of many things queerbaiting is not. However, one could argue that, thus far, Will Byers is, canonically, queer-coded. It's pretty fucking heavily implied in the show, and the creators have confirmed it, and you're gonna be able to see it if you're not FUCKING BLIND, but word of god is not technically canon which means that interviews don't technically make something canon, blahdyblahdyblahdyblah, technicalities, Robin has been explicitly stated in the text to be queer while Will has, thus far, not, outside of good ol' Show-Don't-Tell. Of course, anyone with two brain cells to rub together can tell that that's going to change by the end of Season 5, but, hey, for what it's worth, I'm throwing this out there.
Alrighty, Thingamajingama Number Two: "Oops, I accidentally made the greatest love story known to man." AKA, a genuine, honest-to-goodness mistake. Unfortunately, we do live in a heteronormative society. Sometimes people who don't think about being gay much write a friendship that's incredibly compelling and don't even consider the possibility that it could have been read as romantic. Something something Top Gun something. This is, again, not queerbaiting. This is Steddie, this is Ronance, this is Elmax, this is your favorite flavor of non-canon ship this week, this is not Byler. The creators know DAMN well what they're doing. They've talked about it. We know this. Nothing new here.
Which brings us to the topic of discussion here. Actual queerbaiting. This usually starts out as an "accidental greatest love story", and then reacts to fan response. And when I say "reacts", I mean like a goddamn chemical reaction. Like bleach and ammonia, bitch. It's noxious and it's gonna kick your fucking ass without mercy. This is when a creator is like, "Hey, let's get our queer audience invested, but we're not actually going to give them what they want because our straight audience isn't here for that/we personally think it's gross/we don't give enough of a shit to want to research a goddamn thing to write a real gay character," blah blah blah whatever excuse they want to come up with this time.
And when you think "queerbaiting", I want you to think "bullying". Because that's what it is. It's lucrative bullying, like beating us up and taking our lunch money, but it's bullying all the same. And it's a real goddamn thing, even if people misuse the word a lot, often when they mean one of the two above, sometimes when they mean "bury your gays", which is another homophobic thing entirely that I'm not going to get into here. Queerbaiting is the thing we're focused on, and it's real, and it's bullying. And here's the reason I want you to think of it as bullying:
They
Think
It's
Funny.
They are actively making fun of us.
That's why Dean had the "Cas, get out of my ass," line in Supernatural. It's why the "Do you like boys?" line happened in Teen Wolf. It's why "Lie with me, Watson," happened in the RDJ Sherlock Holmes movies. Because "It's just a joke, mate." "It was just a prank, bro." "You didn't really think it would happen, did you?" "You should see your face."
So here's probably the biggest reason I don't think it's specifically queerbaiting in this specific instance of Will Byers and Mike Wheeler.
Stranger Things has never, not once, made a gay joke. Ever.
Every single time queerness comes up, it's dead serious.
Lonnie calls Will a fag, and the show is not at all reluctant to show what a goddamn horrible person he is. And when Hopper latches onto that, it's not as "Hahah, is he gay, though?" It's because he's trying to determine a potential motive for Will's disappearance, and even if someone had interpreted it as a joke, Joyce immediately has a line that functions as snapping her fingers in front of the audience's face and yelling "FOCUS" when she says "He's MISSING." Basically outright saying "This isn't funny!"
Troy calls him a fairy, along with targeting Lucas and Dustin for their skin color and disability respectively, and Mike gets damn near murderous. Troy is portrayed as a goddamn monster and the show portrays it as justice when El makes him piss his pants and later breaks his arm.
Steve calls Jonathan "queer" as a slur and gets the shit beat out of him for it.
Billy's father is revealed to be homophobic and abusive in the same breath.
Mike says "It's not my fault you don't like girls!" and we're shown how devastated Will is and Mike immediately follows him to beg for forgiveness.
There is a joke in Robin's coming-out scene, but it's not at Robin's expense. It's at Steve's. Specifically for being heteronormative.
Jonathan has multiple scenes where he's trying so hard to tell Will that he's always going to love him as he is, whether he's gay or not, without pressuring him to come out before he's ready.
Even when there's a little bit of ribbing at Robin's expense, it's always because she's an awkward nerd who's nervous around pretty girls, just the same as Lucas and Dustin are teased when they both first develop crushes on Max, and even then, even then, it always comes as a package deal where they make fun of Steve's girl problems at the same time.
Stranger Things is an emphatically pro-gay show. It may not be the core point of the show the way it is in, say, Our Flag Means Death, but there is nothing less than respect for its queer characters. Its queer characters are always taken completely seriously. No one is making fun of us. They never have. That's why I have serious doubts that this is queerbaiting. It would come completely out of left field for the bullying to start in Stranger Things' final season.
So it's not at all likely to be queerbaiting because queerness is taken completely seriously. The creators have talked about Will's queerness, at least, so it's not an accident. And queer-coding would be silly to expect from this show when it's already on its final season. Like, what is Netflix gonna do? Cancel it? Not to mention all the explicit queerness that's in there already. And no one's gonna "What about the children?" a show that's had sex scenes in it since the first season.
There's no fakeout here. It's gonna happen. Breathe.
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I'm playing through Dragon Age 2 again and I just can't get over how... idk how to say it exactly, but the way you feel, in every moment of this game, how much Varric loves Hawke. It feels entwined with everything, it breathes through every part of the narrative, it blooms diegetigally through the integration of story and gameplay, makes you a co-conspirator in that love in a way maybe only a video game could.
It's in the way I don't think this story is a defense of Hawke only -- or even primarily -- directed at Cassandra, but at Hawke themselves. Beneath everything else going on there's the quiet, utterly unshakable refutation of Hawke's worst fears: Did you think you mattered, Hawke? Did you think anything you ever did mattered? . . . You're a failure, and your family died knowing it. Rising through the story as Varric tells it there's a fiercely tender voice saying: Yes, you did matter. In tragedy or in triumph, for better or for worse, in love or in hate, you always mattered. The ultimate tragedy of Hawke is always right there in the open before the story even starts letting you in on telling it; they couldn't fix anything. They couldn't stop the downward spiral Kirkwall was set on -- the real truth is that no one person ever could. And yet the point of DA2 is that it matters that they tried, and it matters that there were people who loved and were loved along the way, however badly it all failed in the end. Hawke is the Bioware protagonist who succeeds the least, and they're the character who matters the most, to me. (This is also why the Absolution reveal did not shake me in the least haha, my love for Hawke has nothing at all to do with whether they succeeded or failed at anything.)
What Varric is saying, in the only way he seems to be able to say the really real things -- through stories -- is so simple and so fundamental. You were here, and I loved you. There's the emotional heart of it, at the end of it all, that love and grief and recognition. It's so dizzyingly intimate. There's so much distancing, layers upon layers of obfuscation, to be able to say it. It drives me insane!!!! It makes me feel the same way that 'Poem' by Langston Hughes does:
I loved my friend.
He went away from me.
There's nothing more to say.
The poem ends,
Soft as it began,—
I loved my friend.
He loved his friend. They went away from him. What more is there to say. (Many, many, many things, when you're a compulsive liar and storyteller, but hey sometimes you have to deploy a whole armada of lies to tell one simple truth, I understand, I'm a writer too lol)
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What kind of dates would Gaz, Laswell, Valeria, and Alejandro take you on? (Assuming they had the time lmao)
I'm sick as hell but your blog gives me lots of lovely things to think about while I recover- have a wonderful day ❤️🙏
Hello! I hope you'll get better soon, being sick is just about the worst thing you can be, I was sick not too long ago as well! I'm glad to hear my blog can give you something nice to think about, that was my intention!
Dates with Gaz, Alejandro, Valeria and Laswell
Gaz: He’s a simple man, so he’d likely take you on rather simple dates. Something along the lines of going to the cinema, or maybe taking a walk in the park with him. It doesn’t need to be anything fancy for him, sometimes he just likes being able to spend time with you alone as well, so it’ll be an indoor date where you watch a movie and cuddle with each other on the couch. Gaz can be a rather touchy guy if you allow him to be, so he’ll likely nuzzle into you a bit as he holds you close. If it was up to him you’d be blankie burritoed until you couldn’t move and would be reliant on him to carry you to bed. However, he also loves watching movies. While he may not be the biggest fan of anime he’ll watch it with you if you absolutely insist on it. Loves, and I mean loves, discussing the movies you’ve watched together afterwards. From the soundtrack to the visuals, the story to its message, he loves spending time with you and telling you all his thoughts about the movie. Saying something sophisticated makes him feel smart, and you actually agreeing with him makes him feel good too. Even if you’re not as movie-literate as he might be, he can still appreciate you listening to everything he has to say about it. If you do listen to him then he’ll invite you to another bucket of popcorn, it’s all on him, even if you insist on paying for him instead. Gaz just loves winding down with the one he loves, so he doesn’t always need to have the most exciting dates. As long as he gets to spend time with you, even in complete silence as you both do what you want, he’s a happy man.
Alejandro: I can see his dates being a bit more exciting than Gaz’. Alejandro is a rather active man and loves some action, so he’d likely love something along the lines of going to an amusement park. His stomach can handle quite a lot, so even the rougher rides won’t be too much of an issue for him. He just hopes that you can take just as much as he can. However, if you like going to amusement parks then you’ve scored with him. It doesn’t only have to be the rollercoasters you’ll be riding, though, sometimes he just loves going to a haunted house with you as well. He’d love it if you’re a scaredy cat about this sort of stuff who clings onto him for safety and reassurance. He’ll laugh a bit about you being so absolutely adorable, and call you out on being a bit scared, but he won’t shoo you away for holding onto him. In fact, he’ll encourage it. Alejandro doesn’t scare easily, he thinks haunted houses to be quite funny, especially with you. Please do hold onto him, though, he loves feeling like the stronger, trusted person who’s with you until the end of it all. He wants nothing more than to be someone you can rely on, even if it’s just something stupid. He certainly also wouldn’t mind going to a tunnel of love with you. Since he doesn’t need to always be so serious with you, he likes goofing around and giving you a big old kiss when he can. His favorites are the rollercoasters, though. He’s loved those ever since he was a child and wants to share that joy with you. Just hearing you scream and laugh with joy makes his heart flutter. He enjoys looking at you as the rollercoasters get to the scary part, all the while you’re either pale or laughing. It warms his heart to spend such a wonderful day with you and no one else.
Valeria: Unlike Gaz and Alejandro, even on date nights she needs to show off just how powerful of a woman she is. Ergo she’ll take you on dates where you’ll be eating some fancy food. Don’t even think about paying yourself. Besides, chances are if you’re a normal worker, then you likely won’t be able to afford the food anyway. However, going to a restaurant every once in a while would be kind of boring in and of itself, so Valeria would like to couple something like that with something else. The Christmas market is in town? There’s a musical you’d like to see? You just wanna go stargaze? Valeria is down for it all. Although she’d need some convincing to go stargazing with you since being outside is a huge risk for her, being seen even more so with you. Other than that she’d amuse herself greatly upon watching a play. She never got to see any when she was a child, even if she had always wanted to see something along the lines of a good musical. And now that she can she won’t let anything at all take that away from her. You better be ready to hear about some new musical or opera in town that you’ll be visiting. An opera she’s always wanted to see would be Carmen, so if that one’s ever in town she’ll be taking some days off to watch it with you, doesn’t matter what she has to do. As long as she gets to be fancy with you and show off to you just how great of a partner she really is, she’s happy. Besides, would you really pass up the opportunity to see her in either a beautiful gown or a fancy suit? Whichever she wears entirely depends on how she’s feeling that evening and how dominant of a person you are.
Laswell: Like Valeria, she’d prefer something fancy. Laswell can afford it these days, so she, too, would take you to a fancy restaurant before going somewhere else. I guess it would entirely depend on what you’re into. If you’re really into astronomy then you’ll go to a planetarium, if you’re really into marine biology then she’ll be taking you to the biggest aquarium nearby. Laswell is flexible like that, but she does prefer something where she can learn a thing or two as well, so she’d love it if you were into going to museums. Doesn’t matter what kind, it’s hard to gross her out with anything, or even bore her with whatever it is you’re into. As long as there’s a museum or an exhibition nearby you can be certain you’ll be going there at some point. However, if she has a few days off, then Laswell isn’t above flying somewhere with you either. A vacation with her is also her ideal version of a date. Just you and her spending time with each other, in the city, in the mountains, at the beach. Doesn’t matter where, Laswell has seen enough in this world, but she never gets to see any of it with you, which is a real shame in her eyes. Besides, she knows a lot of languages as well, so it’s not like you’ll ever have to actively worry about not being understood wherever it is you’re going, she’s got you covered. Laswell loves getting to see all sights with you, so you can be certain she’ll take a few pictures with you as well. Whether you’re doing a goofy pose in front of the tower of Pisa, looking tiny in front of the Sphinx, or absolutely beaming as you regard a temple in Kyoto, Laswell will treasure all of these moments in her entirety for as long as she can. The pictures are just an added bonus.
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i have a lot of bones to pick this chapter and i will get to that but i'm still really pressed by how rachel depicts kronos apparently grieving having to kill hera in her vision
rachel does this really gross thing where at some point in the narrative, she'll have the male abuser depict some kind of sadness in regards to his female victim, but it is not remorse. it really reads like whitewashing the abuse itself because "can't you see how upset the abuser is that he has to do this :("
apollo got that really disgusting pov chapter talking about his perspective on persephone after raping her and that was bad enough, but then you also see kronos and his relationship with hera being sanitized or even shipped, when hera said verbatim that he abused her and she did not want to sleep with him, she had hoped she could just charm him. the narrative explicitly points out that kronos is a chronic abuser - he kills or severely injures rhea in a fit of rage after using all her powers, he frequently drives away any nymph or consort who approaches him, and he spends who knows how long mentally torturing hera.
there's another essay tucked into that but i just find it so fucking egregious that rachel wants to portray kronos as being upset he has to kill hera because of his own feelings for her, when the fact of the matter is he is choosing to kill her, just like he chose to kill rhea, and swallow his sons, and tear hera in half. depicting an abuser (a serial abuser, in this case) as being upset over an action he's choosing to do for his own benefit is ... a choice, and a disturbing one. why are we centering the abuser in a sympathetic light when he is still ultimately abusing someone???
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