Hestia, Hera and Our Boy Apollo
So three of the Olympians didn't appear in Hades, and boy do I have some opinions about it!
Hestia not appearing--except as one of the aspects of the Adamant Rail--makes sense for a couple of reasons. For one, tallies of the Olympians generally feature her OR Dionysus, but not both. It's one of those 'common knowledge' things that she stepped down to allow for Dionysus' ascension but that's not reflected anywhere in the mythology, to my knowledge. Plus, as Goddess of the Hearthfire, she might be a little ambivalent about helping someone specifically abandon their home and their responsibilities to their kin. Even if their home is actual, literal Hell and their kin kind of suck.
Hera also makes sense based on her characterization; I can imagine her being far too busy to devote any energy to some cthonic welp and his daddy issues. What I wanted (maybe a message from Hermes) is a throwaway line about how Hera would love to help you out, boss, but she's got a really full schedule tormenting this cow her husband had sex with and really can't find the time.
Zag: Er.
Hermes: Look boss in his defense it was a very sexy cow.
Zag: ... what's a cow?
Apollo, though? Look up at the top of this post. Look at the stories about him in the mythos. You wanna tell me that twinky trash heap of omnisexual drama-farming wouldn't be ALL OVER THIS!? The literal GOD of not ever knowing when he's not welcome?
Imagine the sniping, when he and Artemis have a double boon. Imagine the flirtation. Imagine Hades' reaction when you use a fully charged Apollo Call during the final boss fight.
Zag: APOLLO!
Apollo: HERE COMES THE SUN!
Hades: ...
Hades: ...
Hades: ...THIS BITCH?!
But REALLY, seriously, what I'd want most of all is: one, Apollo hardcore flirts with Zagreus, and two, literally everyone in the game roasts him about it.
Thanatos: Zagreus I don't want to tell you how to live your life but I've escorted four of his lovers to the underworld.
Zag: That's--
Thanatos: So far.
Zag: ...
Thanatos: This month.
Hermes: I dunno boss I think you should tell him you don't fancy him and then turn into a tree LAWL
Artemis: NO NO NO Ask him if he wants to play Frisbee :D!
[Artemis and Hermes exchange windmill high-fives]
So long story short, I'm very excited to see what this absolute garbage deity gets up to in Hades 2, and I hope Zag's little sister brings some idiot repellent (it may also function as pepper spray).
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kind of a hot take and maybe a bit offensive and blasphemous: confucianism was? is? kinda... off putting,, i find it weird that this guy existed in a point in time irl, and now we've come to think of him as a god figure?? he was real, and was probably a normal dude who got some different ideologies that people supported, and then now there's a religion. it's sus, not like muhammad from islam or moses from the bible, we have no tangible records that those people existed at all, or if they were of real people they dont have dates and times or documentation besides the scripture. perhaps this is something unique to china in the sense that their religions kind of have dates and that existence is not just confined to religious scripture if you know what i mean?? laozi, the founder of taoism, possibly exists in some accounts, and in others he is immortal, but its possible to think the guy existed.. idk sorry if this makes no sense to you.. i'm not even going to open the can of worms that is cultural minorities and their religions that i do not have the authority to even speak of knowledgeablely?? china is a melting pot of socio-cultural stuff i couldnt possibly understand without actually being there and i acknowledge that as an agonostic diaspora with one lone braincell that blasts rasputin all the time
actually wouldnt it be funny if elon musk started his own religion like confucius or whatever i think that would be funny i wouldnt call it a religion itd be a cult and an mlm simultaneously
This took a hot second to reply to because I went down oh so many an unnecessary side quest. But is it really a reply from me if I don't talk about something else instead?
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I am going to put this in the nicest most neutral way possible because a) I got nothing going on at this particular time, and
b) to your credit, I feel like you could hear yourself in your head sounding dumb as hell but just decided to hit snooze on those alarm bells and sent me this ask instead of turning to google first:
confucianism was? is? kinda… off putting,, i find it weird that this guy existed in a point in time irl, and now we've come to think of him as a god figure??
Confucius (Kongzi) did not start a religion. Confucianism is a school of philosophy first and foremost. He may be somewhat mythologised as a major historical figure, sure, but his primary influence is that of a philosopher and as the "father of Chinese ethics". He is revered as a great thinker, not a god. Comparable example: Socrates.
Confucianism is not a religion the way you might be thinking about it. There may be folk religion/religious practices that go into it, as Confucianism in Chinese society is heavily blended with aspects of folk religion, Buddhism, and Daoism, but Confucianism is not like Christianity where the namesake was/is deified by its followers.
In fact, fun fact, this was so much so the reality that was a point of criticism against Jesuit missionaries in the Ming Dynasty and perhaps a contributing factor (in addition to fundamental culturally-based world view differences) for why the Jesuits failed so hard at converting the Chinese masses to Catholicism/Christianity; they would try to explain Jesus in terms of Confucius teaching, and in turn, Confucius, which those who rejected the Jesuit teachings found incredulous.
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Side note time! when it comes to Confucius and what he said about religion/spirituality,he's often quoted as saying "敬鬼神而远之", "respect gods and demons/spirits from a distance", which, fun fact, Matteo Ricci (Jesuit missionary) uses in an argument to piggyback off the Chinese understanding of spirits to explain the Holy Spirit (i.e, the more important spirit to be worshipped who, unlike ancestor (spirit) worship, is the key to salvation) in his book "The True Meaning of the Lord of Heaven", written in Chinese. He points to the quote by Confucius as paradoxical because Confucius confirms the existence of spirits and encourages ancestor worship but also says to distance spirits, which, from Ricci's POV makes no sense if the point of ancestor worship is to curry favor with the spirits.
故仲尼曰:「敬鬼神而远之。」彼福禄、免罪非鬼神所能,由天主耳。而时人谄渎,欲自此得之,则非其得之之道也。夫「远之」意与「获罪乎天,无所祷」同,岂可以「远之」解「无之」而陷仲尼于无鬼神之惑哉?(source, 581)
So Confucius said: "Respect gods and demons/spirits from a distance". Happiness, position, and longevity and absolution [of sin] can only be handled by God. Yet contemporaries flatter [the spirits of ancestors] to obtain their [favor], but this is not the way to do it. This "from a distance" and "when you sin against Heaven, [there is] no one to pray [to]" are the same. How could "from a distance" and "there is no [gods and demons/spirits" trap Confucius in [the puzzle] that there are no gods or demons/spirits?
(^rough translation)
What I feel he takes out of context is that in the source of the idiom, Confucius is responding to a student who is asking him what the meaning of knowledge/wisdom/intelligence is. His full response is "务民之义 敬鬼神而远之 可谓知矣", "The meaning is to serve the people. Respect gods and demons/spirits from a distance—this could also be called wisdom". Confucianism generally holds that ancestor worship and similar rituals are necessary to society but that religious fanaticism and superstition should be discouraged. To Confucius, worship to spirits based on etiquette (which is respectful) are important to creating a stable and peaceful society. Devout belief/zealotry/fanaticism and indulgence in gods/demons/spirits/superstition is profane, so one should keep their distance and stick to rational respect for spirits (ritual). This is how Confucianism can actually be compatible with Christianity, although from Ricci's standpoint, he sees contradictions in Confucius because to him, ancestor worship to curry favor rather than worship to god IS the superstitious behavior and is blasphemous in the face of his god.
Fun food for thought aside, if you're wondering: Jesuits mostly got for milked for hundreds of years for their knowledge of things relating to science and math, which the Chinese considered as being part of knowledge that was once known but then lost in earlier dynasties due to political instability. Then ironically their favor began to decline when the Manchus instated the the Qing dynasty and in an effort to obtain more support from their Han subjects, adopted Confucianism philosophies more strictly.
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Basically, most of your vague questions here could probably be cleared up if you read up more on what Confucianism actually is and what its relationship to Chinese society is.
I can understand how this might be confusing if you are diaspora but grew up agnostic and only have the vague framework of, let's face it, Christianity in western society to base your understanding of religion off of, but I don't think it's thaaaaat unique to China for historical figures to be mythologised, either as the center of religions, folk religions, folk lore/legend, philosophies, or religious philosophies. Siddhartha Gautama and Jesus of Nazareth, for example. The Catholic saints. (Edit: also, Muhammad did exist historically and there's decent evidence to suggest that Laozi did as well, though these were not their birth names most likely).
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