evasive-anon
Adamant
Batfam 🦇 | Spooky Stuff 👻 | Poetry 💀Cass, Jay, and Steph appreciation.Any dpxdc content will be tagged for filtering.
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be gay do crime or smth
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Yeah, I wanna clarify Doug technically didn’t create Jason’s character but he was the only writer to significantly cover allJason during the pre-crisis comics and he even wrote the storyline with Nocturna where she becomes Jason’s mom. And he unhappy with the decision to kill Jason and felt the phone poll was inherently biased against Jason in its design. (People wanting him dead would be more likely to spend money to vote, children who enjoy robins having less money, etc.)
The actual pre-crisis creator was Gerry Conway who I feel obligated to name drop because he’s still fighting DC for co-creator credit. Since his original Jason was another circus kid like Dick the heads at DC argue his character was just derivative and did earn him creator credit.
Regardless, the point of my initial response was that Doug as a writer had a lot of time and care put into Jason in his work and it’s natural his comics would respond to his death with more emotion.
Hi, I would just like to talk to the writers of Batman (1940) #496 and ask why they would hurt me by having Bruce get sprayed with fear gas, have a vision of Jason's death, and then beat up The Joker while screaming nothing but "Jason Todd" at him over and over.
#adding to this because I felt guilty thinking about gerry later#doug moench#gerry conway#dc comics#comic writing
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Yeah, that comic was written by Doug Moench who was one of the creators of Jason Todd. I think he just took it personally.
Hi, I would just like to talk to the writers of Batman (1940) #496 and ask why they would hurt me by having Bruce get sprayed with fear gas, have a vision of Jason's death, and then beat up The Joker while screaming nothing but "Jason Todd" at him over and over.
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playing pool by Gabriel Picolo
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I don't have a tag but I probably should. Uh. . . I'll work on that and get back to you lmao.
So timeline for Under the Red Hood showing Jason was a minor was actually something I just dropped in a reblog of my lore dump on the Titans Tower incident with Jason & Tim that always comes up in fanfics. You can see it here: https://www.tumblr.com/evasive-anon/747238780794224640/mockerd3light-i-love-your-tags-but-im-actually?source=share
Nocturn & Jason lore drop was similarly just thrown into a stray reblog on another post: https://www.tumblr.com/evasive-anon/746608889055887360/the-batblog-batfamsucker-buckle-up-batlings?source=share
I know these topics deserve stand alone posts but I plan to make an infographic for the Red Hood timeline eventually and the Nocturna thing I just haven't decided how to frame a solo post yet. Maybe just a general goth mommy appreciation post idk.
question: why does jason's hair sometimes have a white streak and sometimes not? thru fanworks i'm more familiar with post lazarus white-streak-haired jason but i realised recently that it seems like this version of jason's hair isnt even the most common in the comics? in so many comics post resurrection his hair is just plain black
Ok so this all starts in the post-crisis comic continuity. So the first time the white streak was introduced it was actually grey streak and it was during Dick’s batman run by Grant Morrison in 2009.
The decision to have red hair was a reference to the original Jason Todd in the pre-crisis comics (so a different timeline than the one Morrison is writing in) who had strawberry blonde hair and was a an acrobat from the circus like Dick. The decision to have a gray streak? A reference to Clayface pretending to be Jason in the Hush storyline maybe since he has a white streak, maybe? Tbh idk why Clayface had a white streak while pretending to be Jason in that storyline either. This may be a rule of cool thing. There’s no other moment in canon where the Lazarus pit caused white hair. And even if it did Clayface/Hush was a plot BEFORE under the red hood. Jason was retconned into the story eventually but it was years later and the retconned version he just had black hair so idk.
In Jason comic runs like Red Hood and the Outlaws (new 52 and rebirth), Red Hood The Hill, and Red Hood Lost Days he is shown with just black hair so this is probably the most ‘canon’ hair color for him. Like if the story is specifically just about Jason they give him black hair usually.
Jason being best friends with a gargoyle and its Rocafort’s art- truly a top tier black hair panel. RHATO Vol. 2.
However, since that Morrison’s Batman and Robin released artists sometimes opt to give Jason the white hair streak and it’s not a question of canon so much as convenience. The content where we find Jason with the white streak is content with other bats, comics runs like Robins, Future State, some Nightwing comics, and multitude of storylines in the Batman comics.
The common thread? The stories have him involved with Bruce, Dick, and Tim - the other bats with black hair and blue eyes and I am SO appreciative of the white streak in those comics cause I cannot tell them apart. The fact that they made Damian look like Tim in the recent Batman and Robin Annual this year fills me with dread and fear for the future. We NEED that white streak in some content.
Batfamily photo where Jason has the white streak is from Batman Black & White #5.
TLDR, no one really knows WHY they did it to start with but artists like it in bat content because all the bat boys of their Duke and Damian look the fucking same. Also, any hair color you’ve heard of Jason having is probably canon somewhere in the comics but the generally accepted canon is black or black with a white streak but the latter usually contextualized within batfam heavy content.
I covered the general timeline of Jason’s hair colors in this post if you’re interested in more but this more about his natural hair color than the presence of the post death white/grey streak.
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twitch_clip
Gotham Knights has some banger easter eggs in their map design sometimes but the band poster for NUT MACHINE really takes the cake for me.
#honestly just so happy to know other people are still playing this game#am I a loser following the tag for a dead game? yes but idc#gotham knights#shitpost#tw catgirl vtuber
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Yeah, so I will clarify sometimes people will complain that fans/fanon made up the white streak but I’d say that’s objectively untrue because the hush comic did it first. Plus the explanation of the Lazarus pit causing it legit came from Morrison as well.
I do think fanon has embraced the white streak far more than canon has. Canon really just uses it as a way to make characters identity more clear or look cool whereas fanon truly views it as a major part of Jason’s characterization.
I personally like to headcanon a derivative of Morrison’s story for the streak. I just say Jason has poliosis and had it his whole life and had to dye his hair completely black to be Robin because it was too recognizable. I think it’s funnier option and also is a nice throwback to the light haired Jasons in the past.
If you wanna read another fun timeline rant I have multiple breakdowns made on Jason actually being underaged during Under the Red Hood in the original comics and another on his dynamic with his adopted mommy Nocturna in Pre-Crisis. Always hyped to share lore dumps.
question: why does jason's hair sometimes have a white streak and sometimes not? thru fanworks i'm more familiar with post lazarus white-streak-haired jason but i realised recently that it seems like this version of jason's hair isnt even the most common in the comics? in so many comics post resurrection his hair is just plain black
Ok so this all starts in the post-crisis comic continuity. So the first time the white streak was introduced it was actually grey streak and it was during Dick’s batman run by Grant Morrison in 2009.
The decision to have red hair was a reference to the original Jason Todd in the pre-crisis comics (so a different timeline than the one Morrison is writing in) who had strawberry blonde hair and was a an acrobat from the circus like Dick. The decision to have a gray streak? A reference to Clayface pretending to be Jason in the Hush storyline maybe since he has a white streak, maybe? Tbh idk why Clayface had a white streak while pretending to be Jason in that storyline either. This may be a rule of cool thing. There’s no other moment in canon where the Lazarus pit caused white hair. And even if it did Clayface/Hush was a plot BEFORE under the red hood. Jason was retconned into the story eventually but it was years later and the retconned version he just had black hair so idk.
In Jason comic runs like Red Hood and the Outlaws (new 52 and rebirth), Red Hood The Hill, and Red Hood Lost Days he is shown with just black hair so this is probably the most ‘canon’ hair color for him. Like if the story is specifically just about Jason they give him black hair usually.
Jason being best friends with a gargoyle and its Rocafort’s art- truly a top tier black hair panel. RHATO Vol. 2.
However, since that Morrison’s Batman and Robin released artists sometimes opt to give Jason the white hair streak and it’s not a question of canon so much as convenience. The content where we find Jason with the white streak is content with other bats, comics runs like Robins, Future State, some Nightwing comics, and multitude of storylines in the Batman comics.
The common thread? The stories have him involved with Bruce, Dick, and Tim - the other bats with black hair and blue eyes and I am SO appreciative of the white streak in those comics cause I cannot tell them apart. The fact that they made Damian look like Tim in the recent Batman and Robin Annual this year fills me with dread and fear for the future. We NEED that white streak in some content.
Batfamily photo where Jason has the white streak is from Batman Black & White #5.
TLDR, no one really knows WHY they did it to start with but artists like it in bat content because all the bat boys of their Duke and Damian look the fucking same. Also, any hair color you’ve heard of Jason having is probably canon somewhere in the comics but the generally accepted canon is black or black with a white streak but the latter usually contextualized within batfam heavy content.
I covered the general timeline of Jason’s hair colors in this post if you’re interested in more but this more about his natural hair color than the presence of the post death white/grey streak.
#I’d say sorry to spam lore at you but I am always looking for victims#jason todd#red hood#robin ii#dc rambles
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question: why does jason's hair sometimes have a white streak and sometimes not? thru fanworks i'm more familiar with post lazarus white-streak-haired jason but i realised recently that it seems like this version of jason's hair isnt even the most common in the comics? in so many comics post resurrection his hair is just plain black
Ok so this all starts in the post-crisis comic continuity. So the first time the white streak was introduced it was actually grey streak and it was during Dick’s batman run by Grant Morrison in 2009.
The decision to have red hair was a reference to the original Jason Todd in the pre-crisis comics (so a different timeline than the one Morrison is writing in) who had strawberry blonde hair and was a an acrobat from the circus like Dick. The decision to have a gray streak? A reference to Clayface pretending to be Jason in the Hush storyline maybe since he has a white streak, maybe? Tbh idk why Clayface had a white streak while pretending to be Jason in that storyline either. This may be a rule of cool thing. There’s no other moment in canon where the Lazarus pit caused white hair. And even if it did Clayface/Hush was a plot BEFORE under the red hood. Jason was retconned into the story eventually but it was years later and the retconned version he just had black hair so idk.
In Jason comic runs like Red Hood and the Outlaws (new 52 and rebirth), Red Hood The Hill, and Red Hood Lost Days he is shown with just black hair so this is probably the most ‘canon’ hair color for him. Like if the story is specifically just about Jason they give him black hair usually.
Jason being best friends with a gargoyle and its Rocafort’s art- truly a top tier black hair panel. RHATO Vol. 2.
However, since that Morrison’s Batman and Robin released artists sometimes opt to give Jason the white hair streak and it’s not a question of canon so much as convenience. The content where we find Jason with the white streak is content with other bats, comics runs like Robins, Future State, some Nightwing comics, and multitude of storylines in the Batman comics.
The common thread? The stories have him involved with Bruce, Dick, and Tim - the other bats with black hair and blue eyes and I am SO appreciative of the white streak in those comics cause I cannot tell them apart. The fact that they made Damian look like Tim in the recent Batman and Robin Annual this year fills me with dread and fear for the future. We NEED that white streak in some content.
Batfamily photo where Jason has the white streak is from Batman Black & White #5.
TLDR, no one really knows WHY they did it to start with but artists like it in bat content because all the bat boys of their Duke and Damian look the fucking same. Also, any hair color you’ve heard of Jason having is probably canon somewhere in the comics but the generally accepted canon is black or black with a white streak but the latter usually contextualized within batfam heavy content.
I covered the general timeline of Jason’s hair colors in this post if you’re interested in more but this more about his natural hair color than the presence of the post death white/grey streak.
#ask#jason todd#red hood#dc comic panels#batman#hope this answers your question kassadeen#the husk storyline was really a one off that didn’t impact jason in other comics until Morrison from what I can tell#also#shout out to the Reddit post I stumbled upon while looking for panels that was asking about the canon status of the white streak#using the comic edit pic I made of jason from the emo buddy short story#crazy to find your own edits in the wild out there
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City Lights
[prints]
#batman fanart#batfam#jason todd#tim drake#dick grayson#damian wayne#cassandra cain#babara gordon#kate kane#stephanie brown
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🦇🦊
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how does it to feel to have gone from an only child to a middle child in a large family
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@mockerd3light, I love your tags but I'm actually about to do a HEAVY lore drop showing their actual ages for this story and its smaller than you think.
This comic was written in Nov 2005 which means its the original ages for Jason (17/18) and Tim (16) as established in the comics at that time which means Jason was 18 at MOST during this point of the story. My opinion is he was 17 physically the entire storyline but 17/ 18 chronologically 'cause of the 6 months he spent dead.
Here is the timeline determining ages as best as I can tell:
Robin Vol. 2 #116 (July 23, 2003) - Tim's 16th birthday when Bruce gives him the gift of trauma and not being able to trust anyone.
Batman #617 (July 30, 2003) - #618 (August 27, 2003) - Husk storyline, Jason is 17 assuming this is less than 6 months before Batman #619 which seems very likely. (This is when Tim's throat was actually slit. Ok so technically this wasn’t even Jason at release but it was retconned later that Jason was there for part of this so we’re including it though this actually was retconned AFTER Titans Tower was written so really shouldn't be included in the writers intended optics either even though it was chronologically before within the universe.)
Batman #619 (September 24, 2003) - Start of Under the Red Hood, Jason is still 17.
Detective Comics #790 (Jan 7, 2004) - Bruce goes to Jason's grave for his 18th bday. (Using this as the baseline to show Jason was 17 prior to, this occurs during the UtRH storyline so Jason was back in Gotham for his 18th bday.)
Identity Crisis #5 (October 20, 2004) - tells us Tim is 16 years old.
Batman #633 (October 27. 2004) - Steph "dies" following torture at the hands of Black mask. Tim is confirmed to be 16 years old when this happens. I was shocked going back this happened DURING Jason's story arch and they STILL didn't work it in. I get he was a villain and fighting for Steph would have been good guy behavior but damn.
Batman #635 (December 29, 2004) - Jason has the scene with the dufflebag of heads. Jason is 18 chronologically, 17 physically.
Robin Vol. 2 #136 (March 23, 2005) - tells us Tim is still 16.
Teen Titans #29 (December 2005) - couldn't find exact date on this one. Jason is 18 chronologically, 17 physically. Tim is 16.
Batman #649 (January 25, 2006) - Under the Red Hood story ends, batarang incident, Bludhaven gets nuked. Jason is 18 going by his bday but if its been less than 6 months since issue 619 in the dc universe than arguably Jason is physically still 17 because of the time he spent dead, not even touching on the arrested development argument from the catatonic zombie period after his resurrection.
Batman Annual #25 (March 1, 2006) - establishes Jason was dead for 6 months, adds him to the husk storyline, and confirms Jason loves bread. (The last bit is very important.)
52 (July 2006 - July 2007) - this comic run had an issue come out every week for a year. This comic examines A FULL YEAR IN THE LIFE OF THE CHARACTERS. Tim turns 17 during this arch. That means definitely the Under the Red Hood story lasted much less than a year because Tim was 16 before and well after it started. This supports Jason being physically 17 for its entirety.
Jason was aged up in UtRH in retcons that occurred in Red Hood Lost Days (2010) and in the UtRH movie (2010). Both of these released nearly 5 years after the Titans Tower incident so those age changes were not intended to be their canon for Teen Titans #29.
Jason Attacking Tim at Titans Tower
Fanon vs Canon
We've all seen the versions in fanfiction but I'm not so sure everyone's seen the original so if you're one of those batfam fans who doesn't want to read the comics (regardless of reasons) but you are curious about how it actually went this is for you.
What I'm addressing:
What does Jason actually say to Tim during the attack?
Did Jason drug all the other Titans?
Did Jason really wear a Robin costume?
Did Jason slit Tim's throat or call him replacement?
Did Jason actually break Tim's bo staff?
Was Tim crying or scared?
Did Jason write a message on the wall in Tim's blood?
Did Jason's eyes glow green?/Did he follow pit rage mechanics?
Panels and details below. This is a LONG one.
What did Jason actually say to Tim during the attack?
Dialogue in fanfiction during the Titans Tower attack varies based on what kind of fic you're reading but usually its either 'time to clip Replacement's wings' if its staying a beatdown whump 'or oh no precious lil bby why is no one watching you' if its an accidental child acquisition. Not judging either option, but this ain't about them its about the real shit.
Look at these opening lines:
Hey, Tim. I was here first.You're the Red Hood. You've been cleaning up Gotham the easy way.
Easy? What do you know about easy, Tim? You had a father that looked after you. You went to a private school, right? You slept in a bed. I slept on the streets, I lived in the alleyways in Gotham. Trying to survive. Until Bruce took me in. I trained as hard as I could. I did whatever he asked. . . at least at first. But it didn't matter. They said I wasn't tough enough to be robin. But today, they say you are. Show me, Tim. Show me what you have that I didn't.
Jason really puts himself out there in all of his dialogue in this encounter, the struggle of having to fight for anything and everything he got in life, even the things that came to everyone else for free, and then being told he wasn't even good enough for the things he fought for.
There's a trope in fanfics that if Jason knew Tim stalked Batman and forced his way into being Robin that it would change how Jason felt about the situation but that's even addressed in this comic:
You were a kid, worried about how Batman was spiraling down into darkness. You spent weeks tracking the dark knight. Solving a mystery no one else could. You discovered who he was behind that mask. Millionaire Bruce Wayne. You were so pleased with yourself, I'm sure that you forgot who you were really dealing with. I know Bruce Wayne. And let me tell you, Tim if someone was trying to find out who Batman really was. If someone was stalking him for weeks. He'd know about it. You can't be that good.
I am.
He let you find him. And I bet he said the same thing to you as he did to me, didn't he? That you had a talent to make a difference in Gotham. That he needed someone he could trust in war on crime. That you were one of a kind. The light to his darkness. Robin, the Boy Wonder.
Tim saying 'I am' is really such a moment that doesn't come through in text because he is right that he really did do that but I also completely understand why Jason wouldn't believe it.
TBH my favorite part is how done Tim honestly sounds with Jason thoughout all his trauma dumping. Like imagine a grown man who used to work the same part time job as you breaking into your house, dressing up in your work uniform, ranting about how much the job ruined his life while he beats your ass??? God, and he probably had to write a fucking report about it after. RIP Timmy.
What do you want? Do you want to be Robin again? Is that it? You... want to take it away from me?
Why in the hell would I ever want that? Don't you get it? When I died no one cared! No one remembered me.
Are you completely insane? No one could forget you. I've spent my entire career wearing this mask under your shadow. I had to convince Batman to let me try this. All because he'll never stop blaming himself for what happened to you. You ask me, that's the only reason he hasn't taken you down. He's holding back. But me? No freakin' way.
That's the Robin I wanted to see. Still. You do realize the whole idea of training a teenager to fight against something he'll never eradicate is a mistake. It didn't even surprise anyone when I died. When I failed. I failed-- but I'm still beating you. Do you think you're that good now?! Do you really, Tim?
Yes.
Tim bashing Jason across the face as he says 'no freakin' way'? *chefs kiss*
Jason drugging the other Titans to knock them out?
Little bit true, Kory was actually just already away from the tower and BB and Cyborg were about to bounce because of the drama going on with Donna's return but Jason like super tazes them and then drugs Raven who he thought already went through enough shit without him knocking her out violently.
Note: Jason says in the text here that he never rolled with Cyborg or BB but like he actually did in some comics so?? The continuity is lie I guess idk.
Did he show up in Red Hood gear or a Robin costume?
Both tbh but he spent most of the time in the Robin costume but bro actually made a stripper rip away version of his Red Hood gear so he could dramatically reveal the Robin costume underneath. I can't believe no one ever includes that in their fics its so fucking funny.
Does he call Tim 'replacement' or slit his throat?
No, this came from a Batman comic with Hush not Teen Titans. That incident takes place in a graveyard not Titans Tower and he calls Tim pretender not replacement.
Does Jason break Tim's staff?
Tragically, no. The bo staff snap would have been iconic. Instead he just takes Tim's staff and beats Tim up with it and breaks stuff. BUT!! He uses it to bust a statue in the TITANS MEMORIAL ROOM which is a place in Titans Tower just for having statues of dead previous titans and Jason is rightfully pissed he didn't get one. Like Tim is correct in saying no one forgot him still but like I would be hurt too if all my friends made cool statues of friends that died and then just left my zombie ass out, like wtf.
Note: I am seriously losing my shit that I have never seen someone bring up the memorial room in a fanfic. That is so much angst material. 😭
Tim crying/ being scared?
Hell no. He's a fucking Robin you know he's being a sassy boy the whole time, even towards the end when he's about done he's still saying he's her and I love Tim for that.
Note: There are a few different times where Tim does a flippy Robin move and then Jason just fucking copies it like flexing that he can do it too, and its just so petty and stupid he's trying so hard to be better than an actual child. 💀I get why in the context of the situation but its still so ridiculous.
Message on the wall in Tim's blood?
TBH I really don't know for sure on this one?? Like its implied that he did but Tim isn't bleeding all that much throughout this beatdown and like we don't see Jason do it just the Titans reacting to seeing it after. It could be Tim's blood, it could be red paint, and it could even be that Jason packed an actual bucket of blood to bring with him to write a message with after he finished. TBH the world is your oyster on this one.
Note: If anyone can find another comic where this event was brought up where they actually clarify it was Tim's blood hmu and I'll update this but I couldn't find any.
Pit rage/ glowing green eyes?
Fanon only at this point in the comics. Jason is seems to be himself and even thinks Tim and his friends are pretty cool at the end, and he's just like reflecting on if he had good friends if he would have turned out better as he leaves.
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Ironically, I really don’t think red is a good hair color on him. I think the other 3 pass the vibe check.
I also consider pre-crisis Jason blonde but the writer called him a red head which I still don’t get cause that hair was yellow but whatever I guess. Blonde/strawberry blonde is cool with me. Full on ginger I just don’t like cause it makes me think of Morrison and I hated how he wrote Jason generally. I also just think the Bruce made Jason dye it black explanation is stupid.
#if he has black hair it needs the white streak or I can’t tell him or bruce apart in comics tbh#or him and dick apart#jason todd#red hood
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This whole sequence was hilarious, especially with how they synched the music with Danny's punches.
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SuperBat is a ship that like... I don't even actually ship, I just Concede that there is an energy between them that isn't heterosexual. I don't read fics of them or squeal about headcanons, it's more like
(Reading a comic) //Deep Sigh// "It's becoming increasingly obvious. I can deny it no longer. Those old men fuck raw and dirty on the floor of the Batcave."
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