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cripplecharacters · 1 day

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Hi! I have a myriad of minor chronic conditions and symptoms, but nothing that's actually been identifiable enough to be diagnosed by a doctor. That's a relevant piece of information, because there's a character who I'm writing with more severe/debilitating versions of some of my own symptoms, and I'm struggling with giving him any actual defined diagnoses because of it. The actual question here is: If I'm basing these symptoms off of things that are happening with my own body, and the character is not in a situation where he'd get a diagnoses in-universe, is there a reason I can't just leave it as a mystery?

I suppose the main reason I'm struggling with the question in the first place is that upping the severity of the symptoms in question means that, unlike myself, the character will be using mobility aids, which makes me feel like I should do more research on why he'd be using them. I have no idea why, once in a blue moon, my right leg just decides to refuse to hold my weight for 10-45 seconds, but I do know that if I know that if it happened more regularly/for longer periods of time I'd probably invest in a cane due to instability walking. I'll be posting this work in a space where people will be able to ask me questions about it directly and I can already feel the comments being typed lol. So, I feel like I should have an answer beyond just "His symptoms are based off my own and unfortunately I don't have a diagnoses", but like... do I actually or am I just getting in my head about this?

Hi,

It’s completely okay to have a character who doesn’t have a specific condition or diagnosis you can point to if you’re basing it off your own life experience.

The truth is that this happens all the time. I also don’t really know why my knee is awful and sometimes can’t hold my weight or is incredibly painful to bend, and I’ve been to doctors (who had suggestions but no specifics) and was prescribed physical therapy. I did the PT. It didn’t do much, but I tried it.

You clearly have an experience with your conditions and symptoms and just because you haven’t gotten a diagnosis doesn’t mean your disabling symptoms aren’t real. It also doesn’t necessarily mean you’ll never get a diagnosis, either.

I completely understand your hesitancy, though, because the truth is that some disabled characters are created with a vague idea and end up having some sort of Ambiguous Disorder that is just for plot reasons. That can be harmful and ignore the realities of real-life conditions and disabilities just for something to be more Appealing or Plot Relevant.

But it doesn’t look like that’s what you’re doing at all—you are in fact pretty well-researched, because you’re basing your character primarily in your lives experience and, in good faith, making them not exactly the same as your own.

“His symptoms are based on my own, and I don’t currently have a specific diagnosis” is a reasonable answer. It’s true, and it’s not dismissive or misleading in any way. You can also add “I did research on how A and B would make someone need/do X or Y,” as needed. Like specific mobility aid research, or potential conditions, or related symptoms.

Overall, you can feel confident in your creation of your character and that your depiction is reasonable, and it also might make you more comfortable to answer questions if you feel equipped to elaborate about the symptoms or the aids rather than about the diagnosis.

Hope this helps! :)

— Mod Sparrow

#howisa-raven-likeawritingdesk #mysterious disability #mobility disabilities #mod sparrow

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childofthewolvess · 7 hours

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My experience with spiritual psychosis as a practicing pagan and how to recognize the signs of a psychotic episode in contemporary witchcraft practices.

TRIGGER WARNINGS: mentions of S/H, schizophrenic behaviors, psychosis, religious manipulation.

Buckle up, because this is going to be one hell of a ride.

A DEFINITION OF SPIRITUAL PSYCHOSIS - "Religious-spiritual crises include distress associated with the weakening or loss of faith, turbulent conversions, and affective states associated with negative spirituality. The differential diagnosis in regard to psychosis is often challenging... Although the crisis and psychosis groups scored similarly on perplexity, self-disorder, depression, and anxiety, the disturbance of social contact and cognition was observed only in psychosis" (Kállai & Kéri, 2020: Religious-spiritual crisis or psychosis? The impact of basic symptoms in the differentiation of prepsychotic states).

To summarize the above definition, Kállai & Kéri (2020) differentiated spiritual crisis with spiritual psychosis through one particular symptom: social withdrawal and disturbance of cognitive functions. If you Google the word "spiritual psychosis", you'll get a wealth of articles and websites cautioning on symptoms that aren't entirely accurate to spiritual psychosis. It is important to consider that spirituality, especially witchcraft and paganism, have been demonized since Christianization and it is integral to recognize that these beliefs still exist today. This heavily impacts spiritual psychosis and its diagnosis, especially within pagan communities, as there are still individuals who want to convince others that if they are a pagan, they must be ""clinically insane"" (I say this, as someone federally disabled from clinical OCD, PTSD, and ASD). It is super important to realize that a lot of people will point the fingers at pagans very quickly to say "HEY! That person is insane because they are talking to a god!" when the same person goes back home to pray every night to God and ask them for forgiveness. This isn't meant as an attack on Christians, but rather to point out the hypocrisy that can occur when this topic arises in religious spaces.

I say this, as a medicated, healthy, and healing individual who practices deity worship, work, tarot, astrology, and spirit work! Not all paganism is "spiritual psychosis", but there are definitely facets and wings of spirituality/neopaganism (in particular) that can lead right down the path of the red pill and psychosis to the right-wing ideology (looking at you, Grimm).

To begin my story: my spiritual psychosis took place pre-COVID, around 2017-2018 timeframe.

I also want to note that this is my experience; this experience does not define everyone who has experienced spiritual psychosis, nor meant as a diagnostic tool. I am simply here to share my story and hopefully spread awareness in the pagan community to help others recognize the signs of potential psychosis and ultimately make our community safer, more inviting, and more healthy.

I also want to make this ABUNDANTLY CLEAR: you do not have to have preexisting mental/emotional disabilities to experience spiritual psychosis.

Anyone can experience spiritual psychosis, and that's what makes it so incredibly dangerous! The above belief is what ultimately led to my downfall and unfortunate experience with psychosis, almost causing to my own death. I am not an individual with any preexisting mood disorders; I do not experience mania symptoms or psychotic symptoms, and never have, outside of this experience. When I was going through spiritual psychosis, I told myself that "this must be real, because I don't have BPD or mania or schizophrenia!" In my head, I was "happy and healthy", and I continuously told myself that because I was happy, it couldn't have been psychosis. It's also important to mention that I was 15-16 years old when I experienced this, so I was already within a vulnerable population to religious manipulation due to being in a rough mental state and exploring who I was as a teenager.

Please do not try to diagnose me in the comments. I am monitored and medicated by a physician, psychiatrist, and therapist, and have been evaluated again and again for mood disorders since this experience. I have consistently, multiple times, failed the diagnostic measures for disorders consisting of psychotic episodes, mania, or bipolar-type disabilities. Trying to diagnose someone actively experiencing spiritual psychosis and slapping a label on them will only make the problem worse, I PROMISE. Same goes for individuals in recovery from psychosis.

On a similar note, if a loved one is going through spiritual psychosis, and needs help, simply telling them that it's "not real" or that they're in psychosis will probably not work; it didn't work on me, at least. What I needed was medical intervention, and this problem marinated in my head for over a year because of negligence and ignorance to the severity of my state. Telling someone with spiritual psychosis that they have spiritual psychosis WILL NOT WORK, I promise. Reach out to their doctor, a hotline, or a professional in a medical field if you suspect a friend or loved one is in a psychotic episode. Please, for me—don't try to play the savior, because they might think they are the savior.

That being said, I also will say that OCD can share a lot of similarities with BPD, and I've talked to a ton of fellow OCD-ers that have had spiritual psychosis experiences.

I will also mention that certain chemicals or medications can influence the onset of spiritual psychosis! At this time, I was struggling through a lot of menstrual issues, and was placed on a oral birth control (progesterone) that was notorious for causing delusion, with users of the hormone reporting that "they literally felt like they were going insane". I snapped out of my spiritual psychosis the second I went off the medication. This is not to blame pharmaceuticals or scream out to the void that medicine is bad (I am happily medicated and monitored by a doctor, psychiatrist, and therapist now!) but to emphasize that outside influences can, and will, encourage the onset of spiritual psychosis.

Here is a list of some of the events, symptoms (unique to me), and beliefs I held during my spiritual psychosis. I've bolded critical drivers of my episode.

I was a "Christian witch" at this time, and believed that I was a lightworker sent by God among a group of 20 or so individuals to "heal" others

I was socially withdrawn, without any true friends. I had one online friend at the time, who was also going through spiritual psychosis with me, making this problem much worse.

I was constantly compulsion-checking (OCD) for signs such as angel numbers, words, messages, to the point where I could not concentrate because of the desparate need for reassurance

I was obsessed with the concept of talking to and doing spellwork on real people in the astral to "heal them", and it gave me a sense that I was not alone; this was not consensual to these people, who I did know in real life, and I was convinced that was okay, because...

I believed in twin flame ideology, which I have consistently not only seen mentioned from other survivors of spiritual psychosis, but often encourages toxic relationships, abuse, and stalking.

I thought I was an earth angel who had a past life as an angel. This included delusions so severe that I thought I could "feel my wings" and that I "wasn't meant to be on earth" (this can slip so quickly into su*cidal ideation, and it did for me)

I created my own world in my head that I would meditate to enter, essentially, where I had an entire family of spirits taking care of me, including my "future kids" (I had internalized homophobia)

I could not sleep, function, and barely could eat. This is a defining, tell-tale sign of any form of psychosis: I was so obsessed with meditating and entering the astral realm, that I was completely dissociated from the real world. In a sense, I was not existing in the physical world, at all.

I could hear and see "spirits" who would tell me uncomfortable things. They would appear as voices in my head that I didn't want there, but believed I had to let be there if I wanted to continue on my path as a healer.

I had gone from a state of depression so badly that I was unable to function, to "happy and healthy" in my psychotic mania during this. If you find yourself quickly turning from a down to an up, be aware.

I thought I was pregnant with a spirit unconsensually. This one I will say with certainty (and love): guys, please, if you think you have a spirit child and you are the equivalent to the modern-day Virgin Mary, please walk yourself into the nearest ER.

I was obsessed with conservative, right-wing beliefs to the point where it was the only media I consumed. This was also in-part because I grew up on military bases, but most definitely worsened during my psychosis.

I believed I was more important than others to God, my life had more value.

I could go on, but I think these bullets sum up my experience pretty well.

How I recovered and realized my spiritual psychosis episode, and what that looked like.

This is where it can get extremely dangerous! I was lucky enough to have my driving factor as a medication, but that was not the sole influence.

I kid you not: I woke up one morning after switching meds, realized that it was literally all in my head, and entered the worst depressive episode I've ever had in my life, to this day. I was unable to sleep from paranoia, struggled eating, would refuse to talk to my parents, and was terrified of anything to even remotely do with religion. It got to the point where I was, quite literally, on my death bed. The only thing that saved me was going into therapy and establishing connections, getting diagnosed with OCD, and ultimately, aging and maturing.

The story of my recovery is a much, much longer road with unrelated events, so I won't go into that. But I will emphasize that this event almost caused me my life on a few occasions, and led to a multi-year journey to reexplore spirituality, morality, and religion. It took me years upon years to recover, and I believe that I did the right thing: if you ever have spiritual psychosis, take a step back for awhile and evaluate first what caused the psychosis, what your symptoms were, and identify your coping strategies and networks to avoid the situation reoccurring in the future.

Spiritual psychosis is dangerous, it's scary, and it's not talked enough in pagan communities. I think my end-all advice for this post would be just that above: be aware, be educated, and be monitored by a medical team. If you are ever hearing things you don't want to hear, thinking your gods are upset at you (they're not, I promise), experiencing mania or depressive symptoms, please please please speak to a medical professional or something you love and trust.

Today, I am an eclectic Hellenic/Norse pagan with spirit guides and gods who I have boundaries with. My healthy spiritual practice looks like being grounded in my body, in nature, my friends around me, my family, and most importantly, maintaining good mental health. It includes working a job I love, telling stories of nature to others (I'm a tour guide/naturalist), and writing. I go to therapy weekly, I'm medicated, and I actively take steps to heal and recognize how my psychosis impacted both my spirituality, religion, and path. Recovery is possible. You are never alone.

I'm more than happy to open conversation about this topic and answer any questions! Please also feel free to correct me on anything I said.

I'm hoping this helps someone who needs to hear it, spreads awareness, and most importantly, promotes healthy religious practice. I'd like to thank my deities (Loki and Aphrodite) for encouraging me to make this post and speak up about my experience <3 It's always wonderful to have a spiritual team that is truly on my side.

Blessed be, my friends! Stay happy and healthy!

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livingbrother · 2 days

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LO and it's portrayal of S/A

A rant by someone who just finished EP. 98 and is incredibly furious

Cw: Mentions of S/A, it's effects, too much swearing, ED mention, personal stuff that happened to yours truly, lots of other stuff too, just no idea what to tag it as

Don't read this if you're not mentally doing well, I don't want you getting hurt because of my post, I love you, feel better soon

Boy. Oh fucking boy. I just got through episode 98 of this shit show and, I'll just say, I am beyond furious. Livid, in fact.

For context, I am a survivor or sexual abuse and mental abuse, I have dealt with those who act sort of like Apollo, I was never raped, but I was molested as a child. I, as a survivor, feel nothing but rage at how Rachel portrayed Apollo being a rapist. The way he acts is incredibly unrealistic for an abuser, as somebody who dealt with two abusers with Narcissistic Personality Disorder (I'm not saying everyone who has NPD are villains, I'm just saying what I went through), I see what Rachel was trying, but oh so tragically failed, to do. He tried to control, manipulate, and gaslight Persephone. Only for none of it to work, that's not how ANY of it fucking works!

Where is the fucking control, other than just fucking raping her? I get he wants to take the power away from her and be the one to control her, but I've seen none of that! I get she has PTSD over it (I'LL GET TO THIS POINT AGAIN). I NEVER GOT THE SENSE THAT SHE WAS POWERLESS EXCEPT FOR THAT ONE SCENE. I HAVE NEVER SEEN HER QUESTION IF THAT WAS HIS INFLUENCE PICKING HER DRESSES, OR FUCKING EVEN HER FOOD! WHEN I WAS LIVING WITH ONE OF MY ABUSERS, SHE'D PICK OUT MY OUTFITS, ONE'S I HATED, AND I STILL CHOOSE SOME OF THOSE OUTFITS, TO THIS DAY! WHERE WAS HER LOSS OF CONTROL? SHE NEVER FELT ISOLATED, SHE NEVER FELT LIKE SHE WAS TRAPPED. YES. SHE WAS TRAPPED IN THAT ONE ROOM WITH HIM, BUT EVEN THEN! SHE HAD LEVERAGE OVER HIM WITH THE FUCKING LYRE. Ugh.

About her realizing she was raped, um. Excuse me? A lot of victims don't realize they were raped or abused until like, months or years later. I'm glad for the ones who instantly realized it, good for them. Given Persephone's personality and experience with the world, she wouldn't have known it was rape because she's not accustomed to dating and sexual culture. On top of that, she isn't really seen actually distressed when she remembers, oh, and lets not forget that she WAS FUCKING FINE WITH TOUCH AND PHYSICAL FLIRTING DAYS AFTER HER ASSAULT. Let me remind you that I have been through this thing myself, you do not just omg I was just assaulted! time to go let someone touch me! Nonono, you spend years jumping when people touch you, years of moving when someone tries to grab your shoulder, years of pushing someone's hand off your arm, years screaming when you get a hug. And then, maybe from flashbacks, maybe from googling things, you discover you were molested! And then it alllllll makes sense. I understand if she became hypersexual, cause same, but that usually doesn't set in until a good long while.

I also hate how Apollo is written, he should have stayed as a shitty ex boyfriend or whatever the fuck Rachel was gonna make him, he just comes across as a cartoonish villain than an abuser. The man just fucking rubs his hands together and fucking goes I'll get you next time my pretty! I fucking HATE his writing so goddamn much. I understand wanting to make him pushy, egotistical, and insecure, they're some of the hallmarks of the pushy nice guy she was going for. But when it comes to him being abusive, it's like watching a bad joke. Rapists don't usually, you know, CATCH FEELINGS FOR THEIR VICTIM (correct me if I'm wrong), unless it's to lure them back in to hurt them again. She made him so obviously evil it hurts, abusers don't usually act that way, they put on a pretty smile, act kind, and behind closed doors, act shitty. I respect 97-98 for getting that part right, but too many times, too many fucking times Rachel has gotten that wrong. I have dealt with this myself, my mother did this exact thing, she even put on the pretty smile for me so even I, somebody who knew he was being tormented, questioned whether or not I was being abused! We never see this with Persephone! We never see her getting gaslit with this, she never questions her reality! She knows everything that's going on for sure! I know what Rachel was aiming for, and she failed miserably!

God, on top of this, we never really get to see Persephone's PTSD unless the story fuckin says Apollo's here! She's never really fucking affected by her rape, we don't see her jump from touches, refuse sexual advanced from Hades, yeah, sure, we see her afraid of camera flashes, but that's about it!!!!!!!! She never really experiences the effects of s/a! I developed an ED and agoraphobia from my abuse! Where the fuck is that?! That would have been a lot more fucking interesting than the slop we fucking got!

I know I've missed some things, but I need to calm down before I pop a blood vessel. I might revisit this post when I'm less angry, I just needed to rant.

#lo critical #anti lore olympus #anti lo #rant post #rant #cw s/a #cw: ed #huge ass content warning

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revenantghost · 9 months

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I somehow managed to go into Trimax with no spoilers as to who Razlo was and MAN that was a good twist, hats off to you Nightow for making this fun little mystery

#TrigunBookclub #I know he shows up in this volume but #It's early in the week so I won't spoil it #Also I don't have the disorder myself but #Someone I care about very VERY much does #So I've done quite a lot of research to support that person as best I can #And have a bit of knowledge #And while it falls into some early tropes that is a bit tiring #Overall it's such wildly thoughtful rep for an action-based seinen???#I think about this example specifically when I talk about how much Nightow seems to know about trauma #Because like???#My dude must have HUNTED for information when this was being published to get this right #Even if he happened to have it like #It's not exactly the most realistic #But it's so much more thoughtful than MOST rep #Idk I just think Razlo's Neat #Especially given the era he was written and the obvious thought put into him #Between him and Elendira just #Man #MAN!!!!#Anyway

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crimeronan · 7 months

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the more loved i am and the more i love people on purpose, the more comfortable i get with who i am. i think this is a natural product of getting older as well, you kinda settle into your skin and figure out what you want and how to go after it. the funny part about doing this for me is that like.... i don't feel things like other people do. i just don't. i have a pathological need for attention and i don't form attachments the same way that others do and i break connections very easily and i don't feel guilty about stuff. i do recognize when i'm WRONG and i change my behavior and/or my viewpoints when they're harmful and i actively work to combat my most maladaptive bullshit, so sometimes it's like.

i dunno. the whole stereotype of the self-aggrandizing sociopath who thinks they're above everything is boring, but sometimes it feels like there's something to it. like i'll see sensationalized explanations of 'narcissism' and 'sociopathy' that are like "these people can just choose not to care about stuff," and i'm like....

....yeah??

So The Fuck Can You.

in fact, you do. CONSTANTLY. by telling yourself that the real life living breathing human being asking for change on the street is a scammer, or a predator, or unpleasant, or too sick, or too strung-out, or otherwise too Other and inhuman to help. you only reserve your so-called "intrinsic empathy" for people that you relate to, and you turn it off when it gets uncomfortable.

i know exactly where i'm spending my emotional energy and who i'm spending it on. when i don't spend my emotional energy on someone, it's not because they're an unperson to me. it's because i simply don't wanna put my emotional energy there.

you guys could learn a thing or two about doing this. like. i know why i am how i am. what the fuck is YOUR excuse????

#i had a Debilitating dissociative disorder when i was younger bc i'd partitioned off the defensive me with no empathy versus #the Good (TM) me who Cares #and the older i get the more i'm like. i don't actually need to overextend myself and pretend i feel things i dont to be a good person.#in fact i hurt a LOT of people by pretending to have more energy than i did and then letting them down when they depended upon me #i'm largely very friendly and open and excited and accommodating and that's not a LIE that really is my personality #but it's also a performance to a point. this is closer to what i sound like when i'm not trying to be likable.#idk what to tag this. low empathy people are literally fine actually.

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kasumingo · 5 months

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So tired of mfs going "everyone wants to be lgbt/neurodivergent now!! stop using our language!!"

it's as if the internet gave people ability to explore themselves and realize there is something going on, especially when they congregate together in groups that share those traits

It’s as if these words describe their experience and helps them in one way or another

#txt #worst thing is that on twitter dot com posts like above get thousands of likes #also idk about you but normalizing terms and symptoms made me safer in public/group settings #because i rarely get asked why i act like i do #or why do i do things i do #because it has been #wait for #normalized!#idgaf if a 'neurotypical' uses a term like 'going nonverbal'#i don't know everything about their lives #they might be undiagnosed neurodivergent themselves #it's a spectrum #but even if they were neurotypical that helps ME #as a neurodivergent #to be more relatable and understood among people #i no longer have to use NT language to make excuses for myself #if they understand what those symptoms are #and that people go through these things #also i strongly believe there are more neurodivergents in this world than people think #because ND is not just disorders #it's anything that alters your brain #it's mentall ilnesses #it's trauma #so people you'd consider NT DO go through symptoms that people born with disorders do #but sometimes it's temporary or not as intense #so shut your hell up about others maybe

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noa-de-cajou · 7 months

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Me : I'm adhd therefore I am disabled

My adhd : *Disables me*

Me :

#like I'll be unable to focus and beat myself up over it before remembering I literally have the “cannot focus” disorder #or i'll be tremendously tired and loath myself for being tired when being constantly burnt out is part of being adhd #“why can't I be like abled people” YOU ARE DISABLED DUMBASS #Me: doesn't clean my apartment because I'm too tired but also feeling guilty over it #Guess what you idiot #you are D I S A B L E D #IT MEANS YOU CAN'T DO THE STUFF BUT IT'S NOT BECAUSE YOU DON'T WANT TO DO THE STUFF #You can't. As if physically can't. From the verb and negation “can not”.#but noooo I just go like “why am I lazy”#imposter syndrome is real and also an adhd symptom #it all comes full circle baby #disability #adhd #audhd #disabled

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catkin-morgs-kookaburralover · 5 months

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dietitian warned me the other day i may need to go inpatient if this keeps getting worse and it hasn't left my mind ever since. partly because i don't see the reason. i am literally gaining weight. and also because a non-zero part of me wants to go back inpatient and i don't know why

#and also because self destructive impulse go brrrrrr #steadily lying more and more about being full again so that's fun #unfortuantely eating disorders are chronic and will only go into remission not go away entirely!!! so if i just die that will solve that #problem right :)#personal #tw suicide #tw ed #puddleglum hours #i don't want ot have to keep myself alive anymore!! i am so tired #i don't even have a diagnosed eating disorder lol #hilariously funny to me in a terrible way #diagnosed with Big Sad disorder (mdd) but not Can't Eat disorder which is what i originally went to get help with when i first reach out to #a doctor #you know how often i regret that? so so often #im just here like LET ME DIE when the two times in teh last two days i have been Left Alone With Knives i have Talked Myself Out of using #them #in part because im scared of trying and failing again #in part also because i don't want to scar my siblings yknow?? like a friend once said that sometimes you refrain from doing things for othe #people and not yourself and i think she was so right

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xxlovelynovaxx · 1 year

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Anti-recovery people: hey, it's okay to be unhealthy. That's not always something you can change and it's certainly not something you have to do. It's okay to exist as you are.

"Pro-recovery" people: OMG YOU'RE what's wrong with the mental health community, you BRAINWASHED me into thinking it wasn't okay for people to seek help if THEY wanted it, this is honestly TOXIC AF.

Anti-recovery people: but ... that's literally not what we said. Most people view recovery as this linear progression of milestones that often includes becoming more palatably neurotypical, which is ableist. What we're saying is that it's okay to recover if you want to, but that doesn't have to look like the mainstream abled version of recovery, and that it's okay to not do so at all. Some people also can't recover to those standards and we celebrate accepting your limitations.

"Pro-recovery" people: So it's OKAY to just harm your friends because of your mental illness? You support being a BAD person and not bothering to change? Also being unhealthy is bad and I'm going to assume because I recovered that everybody is capable of doing so, even if using different methods, and just choosing not to bother because of YOU people.

Anti-recovery people: What? No! Hurting other people is not okay! Do you actually think that these symptoms of a diagnosis are what causes someone to choose to harm other people? That's both super ableist and also a fundamental misunderstanding of what causes harmful, toxic, and abusive behaviors.

Anti-recovery people: In the few cases where someone is truly incapable of controlling a harmful behavior, where someone has extremely high support needs, we support them getting the adequate societal support to have someone help them through these behaviors without anyone getting hurt, but more importantly, without exacerbating their own distress that they are very clearly expressing.

Anti-recovery people: In most other cases, conflating the choices and actions of someone who is mentally ill with their diagnosis is super ableist, as is conflating "it's okay if you struggle to brush your teeth" with "it's okay to treat your friends and loved ones like shit with no consequences". I assume you're defining harm as "actively insulting, belitting, invalidating, physically or sexually assaulting you, though, and not just visibly having symptoms of a mental illness or talking about their struggles, right?*

"Pro-recovery"people: . . .

Anti-recovery people: We're saying that it's harmful to moralize health, for multiple reasons. There's that you are not capable of determining if a person is able to recover, for any given definition of recovery. There's that even if a person is able to, them being unhealthy is not actually harming you, and they have the right to make those choices even if you wouldn't make the same ones for yourself. There's the fact that recovery looks different for everybody, and for many, accepting that you can't "recover" to the expectations set by the mainstream IS recovery. ESPECIALLY given that many things that are called "unhealthy" are perfectly harmless and healthy aspects of neurodivergence that have been unnecessarily medicalized by our ableist society and psychiatric institutions.

"Pro-recovery" people: . . .

"Pro-recovery" people: YOU'RE the reason I wanted to kill myself for a decade and didn't bother to do anything about it! Personal responsibility, ever heard of it? Once I left your CULT I started doing yoga and now I'm BETTER and so everyone else can do that too!

Anti-recovery people: ... Do YOU know what personal responsibility is? All the "anti-recovery" in our names means is that we are against the idea that it's morally wrong to refuse to recover, whether that means refusing to conform to the mainstream ideal of recovery, a choice that you make to not pursue recovery, or an acceptance of your own inability to recover. We are not against choosing recovery as a personal decision if that's what you want - in fact, we support those people.

Anti-recovery people: Anyway, you don't know what led up to someone making this choice. Someone with long-term treatment-resistant suicidal depression is not wrong for not continuing to try meds that have not once worked, pursuing expensive TMS they may not be able to afford which is not covered by most insurance, continuing meds that have some effect but worse side effects than the depression itself, or psychotherapy that may have little to not effect, especially if they have at any point been subject to psychiatric neglect or abuse, which is more common than you're aware.

"Pro-recovery" people: See, I was toxic like you but unlearned all of that so now I'm no longer toxic. Btw I'm currently actively harassing disabled people because they're not 'working hard enough' or using 'better coping skills' and them being unhealthy is a personally harmful to me and everyone that ever interacts with them. What do you mean that's not okay just because the disability is a mental illness?? That's ableist!!1

Anti-recovery people: Okay, so, you haven't even bothered to deconstruct the moralization of healthiness and how that ties into ableism, I see. It's actively bigoted to expect someone to meet certain standards of health when they have a CHRONIC HEALTH ISSUE. This is no different than expecting someone with a chronic illness never to eat or drink anything unhealthy, to exercise regularly, have perfect sleep habits, and otherwise be a paragon of healthy choices or else it's "their fault" for just "not caring enough to put in the work to recover. Of course, you likely also do those things, in which case the comparison is lost on you, because ableists are so rarely ableist against only mentally or physically disabled people and not the other.**

Anti-recovery people: You also seem to believe that you're ontologically incapable of doing harm - you say that it's an "ongoing process" but then your actions show that you haven't bothered learning to listen when people say you're harming them and have just changed your targets to be people who have less societal power than you so they're less able to stand up for themselves and you're less obligated to listen to them. Are you just trying to find a justification for bullying people that others will accept?

"Pro-recovery" people: . . . STOP HARASSING ME!!1

Anti-recovery people: *Looks into camera like they're on the office*

*I have actually harmed others in the past in ways that were influenced by my mental illness. OCD, of all things, was the one that most directly impacted my actions, and I owned my mistakes. That being said, they were still my CHOICE. The mental illness played a role, but it didn't cause the harm I did. You know what wasn't my choice, though? My overreliance on my friends for essentially trauma-dumping and for getting my emotional needs met because I was actively being abused and the system was neither providing me ANY way out nor even adequate mental healthcare (as if that's possible when being ACTIVELY ABUSED WITH NOT EVEN A BROCHURE OFFERED ABOUT HOW TO ESCAPE ABUSE.) I was a drowning person clawing at them for survival, and it was neither of our faults that the system is primed to actively keep disabled people in abusive situations. So don't @ me.

**I would know, I am both multiple physically and multiply mentally disabled.

#ableism #sanism #anti recovery #please I am begging you to use one modicum of critical thought and do like thirty seconds of actual research #I put 'pro recovery' in quotes because these people have actively hindered my recovery for years #like no actually my being unhealthy is harming no one besides myself #and in some cases harm reduction means deciding that 'recovery' would currently be more harmful to me than the illness #like that's BASIC harm reduction #healthy not morally GOOD. unhealthy not morally BAD. you're not ENTITLED to anyone else's health #like some people aren't ABLE to be healthy Karen #even for those that put a lot of hard work into recovery. which if you say you did I believe you.#do you understand that not everybody is capable of putting in that work in ANY capacity?#Also I'll give three guesses as to which types of neurodivergence they are disproportionately saying acceptance of is bad #(I'll bet it's PDs schizospec conditions and dissociative disorders/PTSD/trauma in general)#(they all conflate that last one anyway)#don't @ me I have all three #'pro recovery' people just block me you've done enough direct and immediate harm to me already

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