I think the reason us helluva boss/hazbin hotel fans get so defensive about criticism is because a lot of the "critics" just hate vivzie and the shows themselves. It's come to the point that any criticism for this show feels like an angry mob. In any other fandom I'm fine with criticism, but the fact that "critics" have said that they can't wait for viv's downfall + even wished that she died has made me hostile towards it. Haters have taken over the critique part of the fandom and turned it into a cesspool of disgusting rage. That level of hate towards a creator is unfathomable. Why do they think this is okay?
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Gwen Stacy was 100 gazillion percent not dead before Peter’s web reached her??? What killed her while she fell? THE AIR????
and here begins one of the more hotly debated topics in spider-man comics canon - what killed gwen stacy?
(i could make a video essay about this)
goblin says that the shock of the fall alone is enough to kill her
and honestly, i don't think that sounds fake. like i mean, i've never been thrown off a bridge before but like, the shock of that could probably kill me. i don't think that's fake at all. i'd have a fucking heart attack mid-air. yeah.
but there is the pointed. snap.
so, really, regardless of whether gwen was already dead or not, the snap is a reality. if she was alive or dead, it doesn't matter, so if the shock of the fall didn't kill her, the snap would've.
i kind of don't know why norman would say she was dead before the webbing reached her. it seems more in norman's diabolical brand to double down and tell peter that his webbing IS what killed gwen. but i think maybe this is another case of the writers and artists not being on the same page - same as how it's described as the george washington bridge
but the artists didn't get the memo. that bitch is not the george washington bridge.
that bitch is the brooklyn bridge!!
headcanon that i guess in 616 the brooklyn bridge is called the george washington bridge. sure. why not.
i figure the gwen "snap!" thing is another instance of the writers and artists just being on distinctly different pages. there's this very funny workflow in comics where they kind of give the artist a rough outline of the plot and the final dialogue isn't actually written until the comic is pencilled so there's always, always miscommunications between the writers and artists. where the artist draws the brooklyn bridge but the writer thinks it would be fun if actually it was the george washington bridge after the fact because get it. norman loves money. but in the synopsis it didn't actually matter what bridge it was so the artist just drew whatever the fuck bridge!!
so. i think it's the same with the snap. in the synopsis it probably says "gwen dies in the fall" - artist interprets it as whiplash, and draws it so. writer has the idea that actually, it's the shock that kills her. synopsis says "dies in the fall" and it doesn't actually matter how. point is she dies! however the fuck!
i'm honestly so obsessed with the running gag in spider-man comics where you know the writers and artists are on different pages. in two separate rooms doing two separate things. rereading the comics is so funny when you know that weird workflow and you see a scene where the art is saying one thing and the words are saying another. almost like a 4kids dub.
that's why you get such great moments such as the panel that has caused the most outrage in my activity feed. the brown/blue pants debate.
HIS PANTS ARE BLUE!!
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wife here, I love you too <333 However, I am ever so slightly offended (not really) that the reason you'd assume that previous ask wasn't me is because of the lack of sources and not that it says "love you" without the "I" when my brain was permanently wired to do my absolute best to never ever ever do that to you after reading
Do you remember the way the girls
would call out “love you!”
conveniently leaving out the “I”
as if they didn’t want to commit
to their own declaration.
I agree that the “I” is a pretty heavy concept
and hope you won’t get uncomfortable
if I should go into some deeper stuff here. (Berman par. 19-20)
two years ago. I mean no offense to people who do that, especially since in other contexts I also say "love you". But when it comes to you I never want to be someone who doesn't commit to my own declarations. I love you. And that is a declaration that I am committed to, and want ownership of and responsibility for. And I feel a little weird about sending you this as a tumblr ask and not a text or something, but that seems antithetical to what I'm saying. Being slightly obnoxious by sending you my declarations of love publicly feels like the same sort of thing as making sure to say the "I". Like how you're required to have witnesses at a wedding.
I love you so much. I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I will never be over the fact that I get to say that. My love for you is a fact of the universe, so I might as well use all three words.
Works Cited (sorry, you asked for it)
Berman, David. “Self-Portrait at 28.” Poets.Org, Academy of American Poets, poets.org/poem/self-portrait-28.
No you’re so right actually, and bold of me to assume you’d send an ask that wasn’t a paragraph or two long. But anyway, I love you moreee I haven’t even read the poem but I find myself consciously adding the “I” whenever I type “love you”, cus you deserve for someone to say it with their whole chest… I love you <3
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I saw some people be like "gweeehhhhhhh Steddie shippers built that whole ship in their minds, it's fanon only, they had no chemistry in the show, they barely had any connection at all "
And it's actually really funny, because I humor them and think, "hmm, was it all in my mind all along?" and rewatch S4.
Then I feel soooooo validated upon rewatching. It actually gets even better and more obvious every time I see it.
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