#anti the ballad of songbirds and snakes

[sparksinthenight]

I’m thinking about The Hunger Games. It … it somehow manages to represent the world we live in and more specifically the Global North - Global South power dynamics and oppression systems in a truthful and insightful way that no other media does, and yet it completely mischaracterizes the power dynamics within the Global South and the class and race hierarchies that characterize the internal power structures in the Global South. The prequel also horrifically mischaracterizes immigration, the immigrant experience, and what immigrants are like. To the point where that book literally psychologically triggered me and I had to stop reading it because it was such terrible representation, dear gods.

So like, the thing is, there is not and never has been and never will be solidarity between the poor and the comfortable in the Global South. Yes, the North oppresses the South and the North exploits and profits from and metaphorically and often literally enslaves the South. But the well-off in the South do all of these things too. And from what I’ve seen and experienced in my personal life and what I’ve heard from other people who grew up in or live in the South, the well-off Southerners are probably worse than the North when it comes to oppressing and exploiting and profiting off of the poor people of the South. You can say that America is the Big Bad and everything bad happens because of it. But the fact of the matter is that without comfortable Southerners doing all the direct things required to keep the poor in line, the international and intranational hierarchies of the world would fall apart. Global Southern police officers and military members and government and businesspeople and employers and bosses and moneyed people are directly the reason the poor people in the Global South are being exploited, even if the North benefits from this all a whole lot too.

And … what the hell was the mountain scene in District Two? Those guys were peacekeepers. They were COPS. The poor people of the Global South don’t need to and should not feel any sense of solidarity with the COPS that keep them held down. And I’m not only saying this because I’m anti cop but because the people in that mountain benefitted from harming and oppressing the poor people, they benefitted from keeping the poor people from gaining power, and they benefitted from the system that kept the poor people poor. Those peacekeepers and peacekeeper-adjacent were not oppressed in any way, despite being from the Districts (aka Global South). They were the oppressors. You could argue that actually they were oppressed because their kids could be reaped. But two kids get reaped a year and there’s thousands of kids in the district. But even ignoring that fact, the point is that the mountain scene was meant to parallel real-world dynamics. And no real world cops are oppressed. Even ones in the Global South, or perhaps especially them to be honest.

And we need to talk about TBOSAS and the way it paints immigrants. Immigrants are not worse than non-immigrants, but they’re not better either. They are not would-be rebels full of empathy and compassion for the poor people they left behind. They are not brave heroes who will die for the Global South. I’m saying this from experience, I have moved in immigrant circles all my life. Immigrants are no better than anyone else in the Global North, they are only tied to their homelands in the most superficial and shallow ways possible, and they ally and align themselves with the Global North and against the Global South most of the time, just like most Global Northerners do. They’ll wear traditional clothes but those clothes will be made out of fabric the cost of which could feed a whole family back home for a month. Yes, there are immigrants who are the brave hero-martyr with undying loyalty that the book showcases. But those cases are really rare, they are really more of an anomaly than anything else. And I’m not saying this to say that immigrants are bad. I’m saying this to say that immigrants are far more part of and loyal to their adoptive countries, and cannot be expected to act differently from non-immigrants in any way that substantially matters.

I also think that Primrose is an example of all that is wrong with Collins’ understanding of the South. Prim looks like and can be said to symbolize the more affluent parts of the district. She resembles her mother who is from the more wealthy part of town while Katniss represents her father who is from the Seam. Now the moderate wealth of the Town does not hold a candle to the extravagance and excess of rich parts of the South. I’ve been there, I’ve seen it, there are penthouse vacation homes blocks away from shantytowns. Literally. But still, the Town in District Twelve represents what Collins thinks is the wealthy part of the South. (And in my opinion the Town is also very guilty for not sharing what they have and not helping the literal starving people of their district. If you saw someone with no food and you had money and you spent that money on a party dress instead of food for them then guess what? You’re completely fucking evil and going to hell. But anyways, back to the actual point.) Prim has the Town genes and Katniss had the Seam genes. And who is good and pure and innocent and must be protected? Prim. And who is able to withstand inhuman amounts of hardship and do child labour? Katniss. Who has to sacrifice her own innocence and goodness and childhood to protect the other one? Katniss. Whose life and safety is considered not quite as valuable? Katniss.

And Gale and Peeta. I couldn’t care less who Katniss got with. She can pick who she wants. But just like Prim and Katniss, Gale and Peeta represent the rich and poor sides of the South. Despite Peeta not being nearly as rich as the most rich people in the South actually are. He’s still richer. He still fits into the metaphor and symbolism. And who is more kind and reasonable and right? Peeta. Who is more good and pure? Peeta. Who is shown as not being able to see past their emotions and grudges? Gale. Who is seen as stubborn and overly violent? Gale.

There are ways in which The Hunger Games is revolutionary and amazing. But there are ways in which it feels like some kind of disguised psyop.

#the hunger games #thg #the ballad of songbirds and snakes #tbosas #suzanne collins #anti hunger games #anti thg #anti the ballad of songbirds and snakes #anti tbosas #global north #global south #capitalism #eat the rich #eat ALL the rich #ALL of them regardless of nationality or anything else #kill the rich #kill ALL the rich #katniss everdeen #thg katniss #primrose everdeen #prim #peeta mellark #thg peeta #gale hawthorne #thg gale #sejanus plinth #tbosas sejanus #symbolism #metaphor #analogy

[elainiisms]

personally, idc how hot young snow was or how "sad" his backstory was, none of that can EVER make me sympathise with a man who killed hundreds of children for amusement and sold the children he didn't kill into s*x trafficking.

#be fucking serious #also im aware not every victor was sold but adding that would make the sentence way to wordy #thg #tbosas #coriolanus snow #president snow #the hunger games #the ballad of songbirds and snakes #finnick odair #katniss everdeen #peeta mellark #johanna mason #anti coriolanus snow #elainposting

[lovl3igh]

if you simping for young coriolanus snow with excuse that he didn't yet do the things from hg (sex traffic the tributes, mass murder, sending children to fight to death, torturing peeta, johanna etc, turning people into avox slaves), you really should watch the movie again cause he was never a good person, not before katniss showed up, not through all his years as president, not before lucy gray. I know it's not the book and you can't read his TWISTED inner thoughts but tom blyth did really good job showing who coriolanus is

this is the man who prefers lucy gray in a cage bc he can control her better this way. he beat up billy taupe not to protect lucy gray but bc he's jealous, bc he can't stand that she "belongs" to anyone but him. he shamed lucy gray for implying in her song that she was selling herself for food (not mention he did the same with tigris, like if she didn't protect him for starving to death this way). he left her show (mind you, lucy gray was singing love song for him) bc his hunger for power and obsession were stronger than his "love". he decided to kill lucy gray just so he could come back to comfort of food and warm bed and she was his "obstacle"

he has nothing against hunger games and all his ideas to "help" tributes were to profit him personally. I mean HE was the reason why the idea of hunger games wasn't abondoned. he constantly uses plinth family, their money, food, while at the same time makes fun of them and even is a reason why sejanus died. i'm sorry, no, sejanus was MURDERED. snow killed, very violently, bobbin, starved boy, and he claimed that it made him feel powerful

and idc that not everything was in the movie, there was enough to show he's evil person. either you understand that already or go read the book

if you think his handsome and charismatic - I agree, that's the way coriolanus was portrayed. but excusing his actions bc of that? being handsome doesn't make him less of a villain. you're falling for the same trap that capitol citizens did

#lucy gray #lucy gray baird #the ballad of songbirds and snakes #tbosas #tom blyth #rachel zegler #the hunger games #anti coriolanus snow

[8ice8]

Why are there so many Coriolanus x reader one shots. Girlie that's a white boy. And a dictator??? And a murderer???? Get a grip??? Also Sejanus is right there!!! And Lucy Gray!!!

#the hunger games #coriolanus snow #anti snow #sejanus plinth #lucy gray baird #tbosas #the ballad of songbirds and snakes

[sylvies-chen]

I love the ballad of songbirds and snakes, don’t get me wrong. but the streets are comparing coriolanus snow to anakin skywalker and I just… somebody get me a gun! I need to buy a gun!

and listen, I totally get the idea behind it. they’re both young formerly promising men who spiralled downwards into violence and authoritarianism and, as a result, betrayed their best friends and the women they care for. on a basic level, they have some similarities. but again, it’s like… the most BASIC and SURFACE LEVEL comparison to make!

snow is not a fallen angel or tragic doomed hero. the entire point of the book + film was that he was always prone to thinking manipulatively, to being selfish, to being violent, to liking the system too much, to letting not just anger but genuine hatred inform his decisions. HE IS THE VILLAIN. and vader is a villain too— the most iconic villain of all time— but anakin is a whole other story, and coriolanus doesn’t hold a candle to anakin when you compare some deeper elements of their motivations.

first off, you only need to look at how they treat their ladies to understand what I’m saying. everyone loves the heartbreak of anakin and padme just as they love the heartbreak of lucy and snow, but that love for their tragic story seems to blind people to the absolute insanity that is snow’s thoughts about lucy. he lies to her, thinks she’s trying to kill him, her song doesn’t satisfy or please him, and in the books he even goes so far as to say she isn’t even that good looking??? anakin, on the other hand, delivers a minute-long monologue about how deeply in love he is with padme, how a single kiss from her haunts him, how he is willing to utterly devote himself to her and fulfil her every demand because there’s nothing else he can do. he expresses his love in a very immature way at times, but it is real and genuine. tbosas makes you question at times whether coriolanus really loves lucy, or whether just this idea of “taming” her seems appealing.

even their downward spirals are vastly different in nature. coriolanus snow becomes more paranoid in an attempt to maintain his image, in order to keep lucy under his spell. his ambitions are nuanced, not black and white by any means, but they are selfish. anakin’s spiral, though there’s no denying the horrific acts he commits, begins from a place of fear and love. he is so genuinely scared of losing his wife and his unborn children that he becomes susceptible to an outside force manipulating him towards the dark side. anakin also fulfils that element of the shakesperian tragic hero in that there’s this idea of potential that we see so present in him. he’s introduced as the one who would bring balance to the force, someone powerful beyond comprehension, a saviour of sorts. snow was never shown to have that level of promise. he was just a man who existed in a system and it is about him grappling with that system until eventually that disgusting fascist mindset takes over.

and lastly, of course, you can’t ever mention these two in tandem without remembering the fact that anakin did the right thing in the end! and coriolanus did not! luke fought to bring anakin back when vader had taken over for so many years, and in the end it paid off. anakin does the truly selfless thing in sacrificing himself to save luke. he lets love inform his decisions, as he once did before, only the fear is gone and so that love orients him towards good instead of darkness. anakin is a fallen angel, but he’s also a man who loved too much and didn’t know what to do with it. snow, comparatively, admits he isn’t above killing children and then laughs in the face of the masses he’s worked to oppress for over half a century right before his death.

anakin skywalker’s story is of the destruction and reconstruction of his good heart, of light, of balance, of love. it is cyclical, and it is tragic. coriolanus snow’s story is not. it is a story not of something sinister growing in an otherwise good heart, but a story of something sinister unravelling and revealing itself.

they are not the same.

#anakin skywalker #coriolanus snow #the ballad of songbirds and snakes #tbosas #star wars #star wars prequels #lucy gray baird #anidala #anti coriolanus snow #anti snowbaird

[thisdayhappensonce]

i truly disagree with and resent the idea that “everlark is what snowbaird could have been”. rachel zegler said it recently in an interview, and in my opinion it couldn’t be farther from the truth. describing coryo as “a kind eyed blond” is so inaccurate it’s laughable. even in the film tigris says about the hatred in coryo’s eyes. from even the beginning of the ballad of songbirds and snakes novel, we see how highly coryo deifies power. from the start, he keeps up his image as a charming but humble rich boy, regardless of the fact he’s starving and penniless, simply because its the best way for him to maintain control over others.

coryo only ever is kind to others when it is convenient for him - take sejanus for example. his parents gave him gifts and fed him and treated him with great respect (to the eventual point of leaving him their fortune when sejanus dies) simply because coryo pretended to care about their son to receive those effects.

with lucy, it was, to use her own words “written in the stars” that their relationship would end up in ruin, because ultimately coryo was never a person who valued love over power. i stand by the fact that while he may have cared for and loved her, the ultimate truth is that that love did not trump (in coriolanus’ values) the inheritance of power he believed he was owed generationally, from his father and every other snow before him. he would have done anything to get back to where he “belonged”, in the capitol. even had she not run from him, it would have happened a different way eventually.

SHJDJFN STOP PUTTING SNOW ON A PEDESTAL AND SAYING U CAN FIX HIM NO YOU CAN’T HE’S HORRIBLE!!!!!!!!!!! THE WORST!!!!!!

i don’t think any love of his would have led him to a redemption!!

#the ballad of songbirds and snakes #the ballad of songbirds and snakes spoilers #tbosas spoilers #tbosas #the hunger games #everlark #i hate coriolanus snow #lucy gray baird #coriolanus snow #anti snowbaird #i really hate snowbaird

[licorice-lips]

Okay, it really bothers me how many people, especially on TikTok, are willing to forget how bad Snow really is just because he's hot. I mean, I'm not one to be above Tom Blyth's "hotness", but guys, really? Have you learned nothing at all from what you just watched?! Are you that unable to understand the film's problematic?

I try not to judge because I know sometimes people just want to be silly and give themselves a break from the heaviness of it all, but ffs, stop romanticizing creepiness and abusive behavior. TBOSAS is NOT a dark romance, Snow is NOT hot, he's a fascist-minded, not-so-borderline misogynistic, completely narcissistic villain from the beginning. He may have loved Lucy Gray or not, but it doesn't really matter as much as how he did it, how he treated her - how he (maybe) killed her (y'all know that, if she died, it was a femicide, right? At the very least, it was an attempt).

And I hate when people say "It's not that deep, he's fictional, I'd never do that irl" because that may be true for you but pay attention to the content you're spreading, the message you're getting across to people more vulnerable than you, in a position of doubt about what's really acceptable or not. Children, teenagers who think they have enough judgment when they don't, women in abusive relationships trying to normalize what they're suffering, young people being brainwashed, or trained, or raised to be prejudiced, violent, and bigoted... they're all exposed to what you're posting and if collective well-being still doesn't sway you...

Noah Schnapp.

That's it. There's your real-world version of Coriolanus Snow age 17. A young man, who supports genocide, who supports a massacre of children because he thinks his people are the rightful owners of the place they are actually colonizing. Still think he's so hot?

He's not.

He's just another fascist.

And what breaks my heart the most is that there are so many characters in THG and even TBOSAS who are so pretty, even "hot" and are still kind and, at the very least, VICTIMS of that society. Case in point, obviously, Peeta, Finnick, and even Haymitch, if you prefer a dilf. But also, Treech and Reaper, both of them victims of the Capital, and kind in the case of Reaper, I'm not sure about Treech, but he's still just a scared boy trying to go back home. And they're both so beautiful (and hot, and both actors are of age, I checked lol) and should be a lot more crushed on instead of Snow. Hell, even Sejanus is hotter than Snow just because he's not a fascist.

That's how low you have to go to find Snow actually hot. And again, I get that Tom Blyth is hot, but learn to trace a limit. It's not cool, nor funny, to throw away every message and cautionary warning this story ever gives you just because the actor playing the villain is hot, it's actually you just proving the whole story's point: we can ignore anything for the show.

#sorry I'm just really upset #the hunger games #the ballad of songbirds and snakes #tbosas #thg #coriolanus snow #lucy gray baird #connor jessup #free palestine #suzanne collins #anti facist #political discourse #finnick odair #peeta melark #haymitch abernathy #lucy gray

[vasilissadragomir]

i do enjoy olivia rodrigo’s music and i think the new song is really nice, but i just wish they’d chosen a roma singer, or even an indigenous american singer, for the ABOSAS single. especially since they didn’t cast a roma actor (no shade to rachel) as lucy gray, it does feel like they’re minimizing the overt roma-coding of the covey, which is SUCH a massive layer to understanding the oppression of the capitol not just as an authoritarian regime, but as a colonizing entity of an indigenous and nomadic population

#abosas #a ballad of songbirds and snakes #ballad of songbirds and snakes #olivia rodrigo #rachel zegler #lucy gray baird #lucy gray #roma #romani #antiziganism #anti ziganism #thg #the hunger games

[megala-theia-praxidike]

#snowbaird #coriolanus snow #tbosas #the ballad of songbirds and snakes #lucy gray baird #lucy gray #coriolanus #coriolanus x lucy gray #Coriolanus snow x lucy gray baird #thg #the hunger games #to all antis out there

[rewrite-canon]

“[insert character] should have been evil!” let people be good and nice goddamn it.

#its so easy to just become evil and horrible and bad. remaining a good person is a testament to their strength #no i dont want another morally grey anti hero i just want a hero. thanks. #STOP TRYING TO EVILFY MY COMFORT POOKIES 😡 #clark kent #superman #<- yes this was about him but im gonna tag other characters ive heard this argument for #harry potter #izuku midoriya #alina starkov #mare barrow #percy jackson #nico di angelo #juliette ferrars #inej ghafa #jonathan joestar #frodo baggins #peeta mellark #lucy gray baird #bnha #my hero academia #pjo #heroes of olympus #shadow and bone #red queen #tbosas #the lord of the rings #the ballad of songbirds and snakes #the hunger games #jojos bizarre adventure #rewriting

[saintsdarlings]

His girl. His love. His Lucy Gray.

#mine #snowbaird #thgedit #tbosasedit #the ballad of songbirds and snakes #this came out after seeing tweets about oscar posters #i am inspired to open ps but alas i can't do what talented graphic designers can #anyway i miss them i am going to re-read some fics #this is a shippy graphics btw antis stay away #book: the ballad of songbirds and snakes #film: the ballad of songbirds and snakes

[riddlemefuckingthis]

Having Josh Andrés Rivera play Sejanus is such a move in BOSAS. The actor is from Puerto Rico which is part of the US but the people don’t have any rights to vote or do anything political there. It’s just part of it but the people aren’t viewed as an American even tho they would be viewed as American by law. Bur with Rivera playing Sejanus it makes it ten times even better because Sejanus is from district two but moved to the Capitol at such a young age. Snow doesn’t even view him as from the Capitol but Sejanus is from the Capitol because he fucking lives there! It’s just a cool move that they made in the movie.

#sejanus plinth #bosas #ballad of songbirds and snakes #hunger games #leftist #communist #anti capitalism

[snowangeldotmp3]

i do have to wonder if snow's capture and torture of peeta was more than just dangling something in front of katniss's face. ik we've had our talks of katniss being more like sejanus rather than lucy gray, and that peeta is more aligned with lucy gray in terms of personality. so i wonder if snow capturing peeta and torturing peeta is also him getting an inch of revenge on lucy gray all those years ago. he's able to control peeta in the way that he couldn't control lucy gray, and to him it's just the cherry on top to ruining katniss and her little rebellion.

#same with johanna too. she's a bit more vocal about being anti capitol (as we've seen) #posts that emily and ma have already kind of seen lol #idk it's just...it's floating around in my mind. #the hunger games #the ballad of songbirds and snakes #thg #tbosas #katniss everdeen #peeta mellark #lucy gray baird #idk....just thinking

[lovl3igh]

tom blyth did a phenomenal job with portraying snow as manipulative narcissistic psychopath he is and you show you don't give a fck with one "he's so pretty, he's forgiven" and then your excuses "we like tom, not snow" so what exactly you forgive tom cause I don't remember him selling finnick and torturing peeta

#character and actor are not the same #i don't remember #you forgiving snow played by donald #but the moment you see young pretty boy #you forget what's evil what's good #coriolanus snow is supposed to be handsome and charming #and we got it in tbosas #but him being handsome doesn't change his personality #don't forget that the next time you decide to say #that he is innocent or any shit like that #he isn't #tom blyth #the hunger games #tbosas #the ballad of songbirds and snakes #donald sutherland #anti coriolanus snow

[everdeensmellark]

snow allowing katniss to live following her defiance of the capitol is so much more interesting knowing his past with lucy gray. i'm curious if he assumed, because of his experiences, that katniss would run away, just like lucy gray had? and she would have, had it not been for gale's insistence that he stay and help the rebellion grow. idk just very interesting to me

#thg #the hunger games #katniss everdeen #tbosas #the ballad of songbirds and snakes #lucy gray baird #hunger games #suzanne collins #coriolanus snow #president snow #gale hawthorne anti #gale hawthorne #lucy gray #thg katniss #katniss and gale #katniss

[topperscumslut]

call me coriolanus snow the way i be fumbling two bad bitches at once

#coriolanus snow #tbosas #the ballad of songbirds and snakes #anti coriolanus snow #sejanus plinth #lucy gray baird #the hunger games #thg #tom blyth #rachel zegler #josh andres rivera